As a builder in Australia, usually the pre fab frames are aweful. The stacking of the frames in the wrong order is a huge waste of time. If you have a proper set up with a mitre saw bench and have a dedicated cutter, it's fast to cut, assemble where it goes and stand up. By the time we find the correct wall, in the stack, and carry it over, our frame that we've built would of been already up and onto the next. Much better quality of the frame as well, and it saves a lot of time not having to straighten the frame much. Cost wise, cheaper to build yourself, no time delay in waiting for pre fab.
I agree to a point. When they're awful, it takes a lot of effort to fix them. But, if you got to the second part of the video, you'll see the LVL frames we got on a different job. They were mint! All stood, plumbed and braced, plus the firewall, in just over a day. And, beeing LVL, the straightening will be easy as.
cernunnoskali, as a licensed 1st fix carpenter here in Adelaide for 20 years. I totally agree with you that pre-fab wall frames sound good but in reality, they are a total waste of time. The ones you need first are always on the bottom, the quality and workmanship is poor, common studs in the wall frames are always bowed, & there are always mistakes. Every builder I know would never go for pre-fab wall frames. If you want a job done properly do it yourself.
Yeah, I’ve seen them around and used to install them in some jobs at prenail. I never understood why they make the wider than a stud though. For example,when you’ve got a double stud, for example, with an opening on each side, you can only fit one hi and dry underneath, which defeats the the purpose if the extra width is for strength.
I have probably built a few hundred in my life , Some companies are better at translating pre-fabs , Others are a nightmare.. Learned a lot . Especially speed , But .If the frame gets complex. Never seen it work out . I worked for America's #1 best-selling residential architect for sales " Donald Gardner Architect AIA " and he brought out a pre-fab manufacturer to analyze my build . Don was showing off . I told the manufacturer that I had extensive experience in pre-fab . " But you're telling me you can pre-fab this ?" .. To which he quickly responded " No .. Oh Hell No " , But they were going to pre-fab the much easier designs . Fair enough. I was told by Don to come out and watch them build a house in a day . Just happened that I had to go to the lumber supplier . They had a popcorn machine and got my entire crew popcorn . Went to watch from the curb .Ate popcorn and drank lemonade. I ended up getting paid to make repairs. When you got an undulating slab finished by the blind man with depressed sections , stem walls , multiple foundational elevations and you need a laser guided total station for layout The architect was tripping on LSD.. I have yet see someone dare . For one plane stock homes Yes .. For something like The Biltmore . At this stage in the tech , CAD and robotic assembly . Not Yet .
Even with all the tools available now, they still make basic mistakes. In my frame and truss days, detailers would constantly make mistakes and I was paid to go fix them. It baffles me that sometimes that they keep their jobs.
@@nakedapprentice I agree there . I have ran into many in my life that thought they walked on water and mistakes are out of the question. Pertaining to fixes and getting paid for it . There was a company here " Circle Trim " . They'd mill circular trim to whatever was needed . Interior/exterior trim to whatever profile was needed in the field " Never trust what the manufacturer on any curvature specs out " .. But they's fail 50% of the time and slow down a job . I saw an opportunity and offered them a deal . That if I can cut the mistake factor down , That in return we'd share in the profit differential and I'd take a lesser portion . They refused.. So they persisted in mistakes and we had to figure it into our bids . That they'll get 1/2 wrong . Oh well . Tried to help for the betterment of the whole
All for speed but your apprentices won't know what how to cut there house out when they go out on there own and and don't want to use prenailed frames . When I started my appenticeship I was cutting everything out . Good way to learn plumb , level , and straight is what I was taught . Keep up the good work we call dwangs ( nogs )on the main Island lol
Yeah, it is faster, but your right to say there is a whole skill set missing. But, with the regular stuff ups and the odd renovation, they do pick up the ability to frame in situ, just not really good at it. Mind you, if half the building stories from the US are right, even framers there don’t know how to frame 😂
Id definitely rather build them myself. No wait, no mistakes, no frustrations. Timber stack arrives and i can get straight into it. Do your plates, mark everything out, cut all ur components, get a bump fire nail gun and nail everything together. One guy can do this, where as all the fuckery of standing frames takes at least two. I also worked in prenail, you honestly couldn’t pay me to stand their shit, cant put my name on that rubbish.
Sheath? Do you mean ply bracing? We don't sheath most of our houses, only specifically areas as specified by the engineer. Some of our internal linings are also bracing elements. Personally, I like the idea of ply bracing on all external walls, but I don't make the rules.
@@nakedapprentice I mean the plywood that goes on the outside of the walls for exterior walls. I just started doing framing in U.S and I guess thats how we do it? Then we put paper like tyvek on the outside. So where you live what goes on the outside of exterior walls?
We don't ply the whole building, but it is wrapped with a paper/plastic breathable but waterproof barrier. That's the blue stuff in some of my earlier videos, although that's just one brand of many.
As a builder in Australia, usually the pre fab frames are aweful. The stacking of the frames in the wrong order is a huge waste of time. If you have a proper set up with a mitre saw bench and have a dedicated cutter, it's fast to cut, assemble where it goes and stand up. By the time we find the correct wall, in the stack, and carry it over, our frame that we've built would of been already up and onto the next. Much better quality of the frame as well, and it saves a lot of time not having to straighten the frame much. Cost wise, cheaper to build yourself, no time delay in waiting for pre fab.
I agree to a point. When they're awful, it takes a lot of effort to fix them. But, if you got to the second part of the video, you'll see the LVL frames we got on a different job. They were mint! All stood, plumbed and braced, plus the firewall, in just over a day. And, beeing LVL, the straightening will be easy as.
cernunnoskali, as a licensed 1st fix carpenter here in Adelaide for 20 years. I totally agree with you that pre-fab wall frames sound good but in reality, they are a total waste of time. The ones you need first are always on the bottom, the quality and workmanship is poor, common studs in the wall frames are always bowed, & there are always mistakes.
Every builder I know would never go for pre-fab wall frames. If you want a job done properly do it yourself.
Great video mate! Really well explained!
Cheers mate, much appreciated.
The hi and dry packers instead of DPC allow the bottom plate to stay dry. I’ve only used them a few times on built in place frames.
Yeah, I’ve seen them around and used to install them in some jobs at prenail. I never understood why they make the wider than a stud though. For example,when you’ve got a double stud, for example, with an opening on each side, you can only fit one hi and dry underneath, which defeats the the purpose if the extra width is for strength.
I have probably built a few hundred in my life , Some companies are better at translating pre-fabs , Others are a nightmare.. Learned a lot . Especially speed , But .If the frame gets complex. Never seen it work out . I worked for America's #1 best-selling residential architect for sales " Donald Gardner Architect AIA " and he brought out a pre-fab manufacturer to analyze my build . Don was showing off . I told the manufacturer that I had extensive experience in pre-fab . " But you're telling me you can pre-fab this ?" .. To which he quickly responded " No .. Oh Hell No " , But they were going to pre-fab the much easier designs . Fair enough. I was told by Don to come out and watch them build a house in a day . Just happened that I had to go to the lumber supplier . They had a popcorn machine and got my entire crew popcorn . Went to watch from the curb .Ate popcorn and drank lemonade. I ended up getting paid to make repairs. When you got an undulating slab finished by the blind man with depressed sections , stem walls , multiple foundational elevations and you need a laser guided total station for layout The architect was tripping on LSD.. I have yet see someone dare . For one plane stock homes Yes .. For something like The Biltmore . At this stage in the tech , CAD and robotic assembly . Not Yet .
Even with all the tools available now, they still make basic mistakes. In my frame and truss days, detailers would constantly make mistakes and I was paid to go fix them. It baffles me that sometimes that they keep their jobs.
@@nakedapprentice I agree there . I have ran into many in my life that thought they walked on water and mistakes are out of the question. Pertaining to fixes and getting paid for it . There was a company here " Circle Trim " . They'd mill circular trim to whatever was needed . Interior/exterior trim to whatever profile was needed in the field " Never trust what the manufacturer on any curvature specs out " .. But they's fail 50% of the time and slow down a job . I saw an opportunity and offered them a deal . That if I can cut the mistake factor down , That in return we'd share in the profit differential and I'd take a lesser portion . They refused.. So they persisted in mistakes and we had to figure it into our bids . That they'll get 1/2 wrong . Oh well . Tried to help for the betterment of the whole
Love it
Thanks :)
All for speed but your apprentices won't know what how to cut there house out when they go out on there own and and don't want to use prenailed frames . When I started my appenticeship I was cutting everything out . Good way to learn plumb , level , and straight is what I was taught . Keep up the good work we call dwangs ( nogs )on the main Island lol
Yeah, it is faster, but your right to say there is a whole skill set missing. But, with the regular stuff ups and the odd renovation, they do pick up the ability to frame in situ, just not really good at it. Mind you, if half the building stories from the US are right, even framers there don’t know how to frame 😂
Id definitely rather build them myself. No wait, no mistakes, no frustrations. Timber stack arrives and i can get straight into it. Do your plates, mark everything out, cut all ur components, get a bump fire nail gun and nail everything together. One guy can do this, where as all the fuckery of standing frames takes at least two. I also worked in prenail, you honestly couldn’t pay me to stand their shit, cant put my name on that rubbish.
Does the factory not sheath them?
Sheath? Do you mean ply bracing? We don't sheath most of our houses, only specifically areas as specified by the engineer. Some of our internal linings are also bracing elements. Personally, I like the idea of ply bracing on all external walls, but I don't make the rules.
@@nakedapprentice I mean the plywood that goes on the outside of the walls for exterior walls. I just started doing framing in U.S and I guess thats how we do it? Then we put paper like tyvek on the outside. So where you live what goes on the outside of exterior walls?
We don't ply the whole building, but it is wrapped with a paper/plastic breathable but waterproof barrier. That's the blue stuff in some of my earlier videos, although that's just one brand of many.
sounds like carters frame, we had the same issue
Nah, not this time. They were from some small company I’d never heard of. But, I agree, Carters are consistently bad.