ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ส.ค. 2022
- Why should the Western Cape secede from South Africa? Spectacular full live debate with audience participation about Cape Independence | Cape Town 23 June 2022.
PANEL MEMBERS
• Phil Craig | Cape Independence Advocacy Group
• Benedicta Van Minnen | Democratic Alliance
• Dr Corne Mulder | Freedomfront Plus
• Vytjie Mentor | ActionSA
• Ebrahim Rasool | ANC
PRODUCTION TEAM
Donald Brown | WorldView Host
/ worldviewalternate
The PET ZOO Film Crew | Film & Production
/ thepetzoofilmcrew
STOCK FOOTAGE & MUSIC
www.pexels.com
www.pixabay.com
www.bensound.com
www.groundup.org.za
The PET ZOO Film Crew
#CapeIndependence #CapeTown #SouthAfrica
Why the hell is this debate being allowed in the first place this should be seen as a declaration of of war . Come on my south african people grow a backbone.
For real! Imagine that!
Cause civilized people gather to debate ideas not going about burning and destroying things to get what they want. They debate, and vote. Saves your time, resources and human life.
@simanaken8400 yeah sure ,the same kind of civilised people who sat down to debate at the Berlin conference , the same kind who sat down to introduce apartheid , the same kind who sat down to invade Iraq , the same kind who sat down to invade Afghanistan , the same kind who sat down to destabilise Africa , the same kind of people who sat down and ordered the killing of Gaddafi , the same kind who are supporting the massacre of the Palestine people . Yeah I know those kind of civilised people.
@simanaken8400 yeah I know those kind of civilised people . The kind who sat down at the Berlin conference , the same who sat down to introduce apartheid , the same kind who invaded Iraq and Afghanistan. The same who continue to destabilise Africa. Yeah I know those kind of civilised people who like to sit down and debate the destruction of others
@simanaken8400 yeah I know those kind of civilised people , they are the same who sat down to introduce apartheid
Europeans should go look for land in Europe to call for succession
Absolutely!
All land settlers should go back to their home lands and find land to call their owe.
20 million comrades to be deported from Europe now ,,,,,
Lack of reasoning capacity will makes you think every debate is about the race.
@@user-pn8nf7fq1s homelands were created by Europeans remember?
Who are Cape people that they're talking about? Does it include the poor of poorest ? These settlers need to be checked immediately.....
I don't agree with this plan....but I must correct you. We are not settlers! We are South Africans!
@edithmiller3114 point of correction, your ancestors were not indigenous Africans. Hence, you are perceived as settlers......
@@paulnbarros1400 You are correct, of course. But...we do not think of ourselves as settlers.
@edithmiller3114 Unfortunately, it's not about thoughts, but heritage........
@@edithmiller3114
You don't think yourselves as settlers...but your behavior leaves so much to be desired. You act like you rule this country and you practise apartheid in that province.
Should've invited the EFF to the debate just for the black radical voice
Europe is free
Why ask for freedom in Africa ?
congo is free why dont you go there
@@lightningRatPackapartheid nonsensical history that Africans came from Congo and found whites in South AFRICA. Good stuff
@@studioorigami7463 blacks are nonsensical and entailed to believe that they own everything because they are black.
common talking point for racist lazy blacks.
Imagine Chinese people telling the US that they want to scede every China town and become independent 🤔
All the Chinese in America will of course be deported to China
The Muslims has done this decades ago. They are now in your Parliament, Palistinian scarf and all. They already anexed your country. Forget aĺl this political dreams. The nightmare is around the corner.
😂😂😂
29May is only one day then you will see
We will vote the ANC with our big numbers
So y'all got an MI6 agent/spy in your panel and that agent/spy is the leader of the western cape succession movement🧐🧐🧐
Not to mention the CIA has infiltrated the DA
British, you have Britain, Boers, you have Netherlands or Holland, French, you have France waiting for its Sons and Daughters. Western Cape is part and parcel of South Africa
We have European Dutch/German Settlers discuss what must happened with our Indegenous SongQuas KhoiSan land....That will never happen
I hope not!!
I wonder why such a debate should even be existing
We don't need apartheid government again we live in the western cape
Craig, an MI6 agent, advocating for secession of WC, in SA.
The last time I checked, you arrived, with a ship from Holland, you didn't come with land, you left your land in Holland.
Deep! ❤
Your ancestors hadn't even arrived in 1652. Those that were there were busy slaughtering the xhoisan.Go back to school. Even better Google it.
@@johnlouw6449yeah African history told to you by Europeans. Very credible
@@BermudaCircle88 😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😅😇😅😅
And the last time I checked, he was the guy that created what YOU have today. Maybe you right, maybe he should go back to Holland and take his tar roads, dams, electricity, clothes, cell phones, buildings etc and leave mud huts behind. Oops, sorry I missed out the wheel....
Fokof back to Netherland
Usual tactics, divide and conquer. Once divided, grow your military and take over by force. Same old game the world over. Don't let them divide non of Africa. United we stand,divided we fall.😠😠
VF should send the representative of the DA a box of wine - she just gave them a huge boost in membership...
Can British black people in UK do that ? do you think native white British people would allow it ? or black people in Netherlands can they do the same , i doubt the answer i no. so Africans will always be undermined .
😂never
Those opposing Cape independence come across as very lacklustre, almost tired. Corne and Phil exactly the opposite. Cape independence - let's goooo!
The actual people who will decide this matter are not in ZAR. Consider the fate of secession movements over the past 2 decades, Canada, Yemen, Syria, Sudan, Nigeria, Congo, Spain. We can derive 2 conclusions from this, keep talking and do nothing, or do something with disastrous consequences for both sides. Balkanization is not in the interest of the greater neo liberal rules based world order. Mark my words. Keep talking. When you stop, it will be a disaster for all of you.
@@motionenergy808 With shocking historical president, you are correct. It is however, important to keep talking so that the facts that are simply disregarded, can keep coming up.
One of the first speakers points out how almost 50% of the Cape population is dependent on government social security, funded by the rest of the country. That alone is a powder keg.
No and no again. Listen to people you don't agree with and you'll find many pitfalls with the plan.
Hallo Joe. You are so right. They are in a flat spin. Ou Fytjie speaks after Rasool. Rasool thinks he knows everything, and talks derogatively about the people supporting exit. They know exactly what they are going to lose. Mark my words, when cessasion comes about, they will be in the Cape. They are all arrogant and want to force themselves down our throats.
then its war
@@kingtutsirai994 😂
Interesting, I ve never seen colonialism being discussed so openly on a round table. The last time it happened was in Berlin Conference in 1884. It will fail dismally
The audacity!
This is why there needs to be a united continent of Africa
This is Africa point blank
Really poor performance by those representing ActionSA 😢
Dr Mulder on fire, as usual 🔥
Phil dropping truth bombs 💣
Dr. Mulder on fire?
He has decided that now is the time?
I say that it suited him to be blind all the time, because it suited him.
He aslo had something to chew on until now, the parliament.
Phil dropping bombs alright... without base. He shouldn't just say things, back up with evidence and stats instead of allowing people to move blindly.
Apartheid beneficiaries...
First the Cape exit, then follow Gauteng.
Then follow KZN.
The provinces that remain in current SA are unsustainable on their own. They can be incorporated into Zimbabwe, Botswana, Swaziland, Lesotho and Mozambique.
Good riddance of the ANC and it's free loading cadres!
stick together and vote the anc out
"..... It means go and speak to Black people, not against and do not be perceived to be against. Go and speak to them and say, there is an alternative. But if you do not have the language, if you do not have the attitude, if you do not have the humility and you do not have the ability to speak that language... you will forever remain a depressed and a despairing minority." - Ebrahim Rasool
Powerful!!
Now imagine listening to/or taking serious a British citizen called Phil Graig whose SA citizenship is younger than our Democracy... Of course he was sent here to further fragment us and further divide us to serve her majesty's interests, it is not a joke.
Yes! The ANC has to be voted out, but this country does not need division and the West Cape is not going anywhere!! Whether Britain likes it or not... The Cape is Azanian land!!
Everything Vytjie said about Independent Cape could be said about Namibia. It was South West Africa and part of South Africa. We had the same language and culture.
Vytjie didn't seem to prepare properly for this debate. She clearly doesn't understand how secession works.
100%
Can't compare the two way to different
@@joedonner9476 at least ActionSA has ejected her, they would do well to try not recycle former ANC Cadres, though they don't seem to have learnt their lesson and have now just done that again with their Mpumalanga provincial chairperson.
South West Africa was never part of South Africa. SWA was mandated by the League of Nations to the care of SA.
Go do the research if you want to know more.
Ignorance is no excuse when making public statements in this internet age.
Poor Nelson you spent all those years in jail for nothing
KEEP DREAMING 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
The DA woman is sober minded too
Under normal circumstances I wouldn’t ever support the DA but their representative on this agenda is speaking sense.
There should be no debate of separation of South African expetially by White's
Agree. We need to get ANC out of gvt
It will be nice if we keep the Western Cape as the Mother City of South Africa. I say vote out the existing government and save the whole South Africa. Without the Western Cape the rest of the country has no roots ... we’ve come thus far together, I believe that we can succeed and conquer together, ons vir Jou Suid Afrika
That thought is very dangerous. It shouldn't be given the breathing space.
So nice to listen to this debate cos it shows different perspectives and issues that we can reflect on and problems that would need to be addressed in order for all to transition smoothly. I’m all for changing to a new system of governance.
There's no such thing as eastern, western cape....ridiculous. Return to South African Court bc there are people are in violation of the Peace & Reconcilliation Agreement. Criminals are reasserting power but are currently in violation of South African Law. Areest Them. The Court MUST Act!!!
Shame on this opportunists who have enjoyed African hospitality
You want a passport to visit Gauteng, or Bloemfontein? No more Currie Cup?
What happens to those families from Western Cape working in Gauteng, and vice versa?
A majority of voters in the Western Cape cannot deprive the rest of South African citizens their rights within all of South Africa, including the Western Cape.
Please re-look the stats Ebrahim. Using stats SA I got to a position that the Western Cape contributes 17% to the national revenue, but only receives 3.6 % of the national expenditure for their effort.
This Boar is talking nonsense because I am from Cape Town and I have a family and my daughter still in Eastern Cape in Port Elizabeth my twins boys was born in Johannesburg so seceded from South Africa will be a Big problems
Forget you will never divide South Africa
We south Africans must get rid of the DA we don't need racist government we live in the western cape but wil never vote for apartheid DA
With an independent Cape, you could create conditions in which your biggest industry was the international retirement industry. (Conditions to truly make that work would be reduced crime, for starters.) Think about it: When it's Summer in the Cape, it's Winter in the Northern Hemisphere. It's a perfect time for someone with a "Cape Retirement Plan" to fly South, and just skip the Winter.
(It would even be a Green industry. "Swallows" leaving their Winter behind would not be heating their Northern homes. And then come the Cape Winter, you might have a big migration back to the Northern Summer.)
In climate terms, of course, this kind of thing is notionally possible for the whole of South Africa, but there's an impediment called the ANC in the way, just like there's an ANC standing in the way of most things. At a minimum, you need control of your own immigration laws to make something like that feasible.
Both my parents lived to see a new SA free of Apartheid. I want to live to see a free Western Cape, free of the ANC and reversed Apartheid.
Both your parents if from the British or dutch needs to Leave south Africa because that's not your country ,or land. Tired of you vipers. Enough is enough.
No Africa has come to realization that it is time to become only African live in Africa. I repeat Africa is moving toward independent Africa just like African in the white country. Africa is where we as African should has rights.
Typical ANC : 40 % of people in the WC dependent on SASSA grants - so they must remain under the yoke of the ANC ? !! It is exactly because of this ANC mismanagement that the WC should get rid of the ANC and go it alone.
We do not want the corrupt ANC... in the western cape.
All the people can live here, no problem.
ANC should start relocating blacks to the Cape
Just so they can be repatriated later on.
Typical Clever idea .
Very informative debate. It is great to see a adult conversation with no screaming and or dancing. THANK YOU.
If EFF and ANC were in the room, debate was not even gonna finish and concluded. So I think you and I now know who are the real problems in South Africa
While we figure things out, you can find the new channel of WorldView here, where we are currently uploading old videos:
th-cam.com/users/WorldViewAlternate
Please pin 📌
Break up SA with four countries on pre 1994 provincial borders?
They want to bring back apartheid flag🤣🤣🤣🤣
😂It's already happening
fantastic production guys. Keep up the good work
Thanks!
Go to Europe nonsense.
Boolshet
I am sad as an African to see South Africa fail under Africans for 28 years.
Get an education. Stop depending on the news for your information.
We need people with integrity, morals, values and God fear!
Yeah we need Apartheid beneficiaries
Non of the bastards talking here have these values
First we must reckonise the Khoisan people of this land, before we think of making the Western Cape independence. Khoisan must first have their say. Just a reminder, Malay is an immigrant to this country just like the the others. Khoi is Christian, and Malay has disrepected us long enough in our own country. Everyone must keep quiet and get the first people of the land to decide how things must be done. Malay is an incomer, and it's time for the incomer to be reminded of it.. This is why Malay thinks nothing of giving Khoi land to the ANC. Malay must take a back seat and shut up.Khoisan stand up for your land. Malay helped the ANC to destroy Khoisan land because it's not theirs, they did enough damages to our land.
Xhosa people are also Khoison , what now?
As if the opinion of professional politicians (who have been living off our tax money for decades) matters....
Why not ask the ordinary tax payer ?
They did very little for 25 years. Now they have a lot to say. Agree with you. The FF+ had an opportunity in the beginning and did nothing. Insured they get their gravy and live like kings.
True
Whites and Blacks should come together to run one direction to improve South Africa,the days of selfish in south Africa is gone.
Corne you rock ! Independence is the only way to go
OHM, for independent government. 👍👍👍
In someone else's land? Go to Europe and seek Independence, not in Africa. Thieves
Mr, Rasool, you claimed 4 hospitals and 5 universities within a 25 km range in Cape Town? Who build it? The CANCer? No sir, you got no claim to fame!!!!!
I agree 💯% with you 👌
It was the Nazi Party
I can't believe that every New Political Party in the Western Cape does not raise the unequal Laws and policies in the Fisheries Industry.
We are busy semigrating from Gauteng to Western Cape - Garden route, we have a choice between immigration and taking our tax money out of SA altogether or semigrating to Western Cape in support of Western cape becoming independent from Corupt, criminal ANC government. We intend on opening a business in Western Cape and creating jobs for young adults in Western cape. Fully and excitedly in support of this movement. This is the solution. Nobody trusts nor will ever trust criminal ANC again. This movement is not a racial movement, Western cape is filled with people of all races. I myself am in a mixed race relationship, so it's not a racial thing it's a criminal thing. We choose to remove ourselves from a criminal government that is completely useless.
2%:Parties want t rule. Some remarks makes me worry .Colonists wants divide our country. What shocks me most was the reference to Afrucan culture as alien.
The Cape, if granted independence, would be like a seed landing in fertile soil, growing big and strong sharing it’s fruits with the rest of South Africa.
@@motionenergy808 you sir have absolutely no idea what Cape Independence is about. I suggest you do a little research before making a complete ass of yourself.
it actually would not, it would be a disastrous state that breeds all sort of racists and narcissists. especially those who refuse to integrate
@@mikestephen7097 Mike, you got it wrong mate.
Mike are you from Cpt?
With the Help and technology of countries like America & Israel WC will be Unstoppable! Israel can help with the large fencing and special sensors for borders control against the EFF types that would want to destroy the WC because it would be the only first World nation and a “Switzerland” of Africa. The American People will give millions in donations and the American government will give even more and provide a sense of security because they are only a few minutes away by jet or Drone and 2 hours away with airborne if they were to break in and start being violent on a large scale. Just until the new country is totally able to defend it’s self.
Capexit your basis for secession is weak. Corruption cannot be a rationale. The Nats were also corrupt and the word secession never existed. Please raise the level of such an important debate
I believe when the cape becomes independent we will prove to the rest of SA that we can be a rainbow nation that work together to prosper the Western Cape. I really believe we can shine a light on how to succeed and perhaps other areas will follow.
Cape Towns rainbow nation utopia failed when Cape Town failed to deliver on a 19 year promise of land preceedobg to 94 and after capturing the NP and using the NP as DP officials of Cape Town to label white South Africans as the apartheid protagonists after we disbanded apartheid in the 70s under John Vortster! Isn't it Helen Zille with the ANC's Cyril Rhamaposa that put the lie and failed referendum on the back burner? Didn't Cape Town remove South Africa religious freedoms in 96 when your DA removed christianity from schools in the rest of the country? We going to burn the woke whites of Cape Town into the ground if you think your DA or Cape Town corporates will reinstate capitalism and lead over white SA!
Cape Town will be the first to fall if you think you going to ceceed and leave white South Africans homeless and under the DA... Every South African outside of Cape Town will revolt including blacks, Cape Town is the sole reason not the ANC why white SA is a quarter of its size it was in 94'
How much more damage do you secular liberal degenerates want to create. White South Africa will rather die before we bend the knee to Cape Town who our taxes fund! You a paltry minority and stand zero chance when whites March you out this country before we turn on illegals you keep importing. Best you tell your precious little DA troglodytes that land is paramount to any reconciliation... Corporate SA will not survive white South Africans not partaking and again the liberals will not rule over whites. You've had 50 years and noone has changed there minds regarding liberals. Please do try screw white SA over, we have decades of hatred and need little motivation to invade and decimate western cape! Keep it up
Under who's rule? Who owns majority of the land😑???😂😂😂 Who Will be a slave and who will be the master...
Only rainbow is in the sky where it belongs
Under who's land? European seeking yo own a country in Africa. You guys got balls. Go back to Europe and form another country
We don't need this,what we need is provide more employment,the crime rate in Cape Town is high.The whole of South Africa needs change when it comes to governments.
Never new the D.A. was for unity till now they should be louder about that instead of trying to discredit other parties.
The ANC and Ramaphosa has decided to establish an Iron and Steel company to combat joblessness. Where by the workers wives will go home to Iron while their husbands will go out to Steel.... Whooooha...
I salute you Mr Abrahim Rasool.
Mr rasool and miss mentor are sober in their debate on this one....
Nice work Donald, hopefully there may be more debates like this. I find the DA representatives remarks somewhat disparaging, I'm quite sure there will be a Western Cape provincial coalition in 2024, they need to be wary of dismissing this topic and how it may affect their electoral support, considering the number of 'current' DA voters who support a secession movement or at the least having a referendum on the topic.
Thanks! There will be another one the 18th of August.
First Clea those foreigners Yoh they are making sa a mass look at wyneberg bellvell selling drugs in front of the police da must act fast
I am appalled by this nonsense! Is there a government in South Africa?
Wheres the CCC?
You can't have a debate without the CCC...
What's that?
Don't know if I understood wrongly but it sounds like the DA is blaming people who participated in voting for the current mess in SA ? So participation makes you guilty because you support the system and therefore have to accept the results ? So called opposition parties have played ping-pong with peoples emotions for far too long. That carrot in front of the nose looks like biltong stick by now. Each time the disappointment becomes twice as difficult to overcome....
This is a very good discussion on Western Cape independence. Gives a collection of well thought through possitions on the issue and presented in a balanced way. MUCH BETTER than the debate on the same issue that Sizwe Mpofu-Walsh did on the SABC.
They talk about educating the voters to vote ANC out. I have bad news for you, no propaganda will convince us to not vote for the ANC. I had some thoughts of not voting for the ANC in 2024 elections but you have just convinced me to vote for them both on provincial and National. So ANC here comes my vote and those of more that half of the SA voting public.
Tried lowering the background sound is distracting
For the first time l have had a privileged private view to the soul and mind of apartheid sympathizers. The exit project is afrikaaner driven.
Mr Ibrahim Rasoul, you are profound!!!
Its easy to poop on the idea of a referendum, but the last referendum held in South Africa has undoubtedly had the biggest positive change South Africa has ever seen.
What does the VF want to do with the rest of its voters in the rest of the countries?
Thanks to Ebrahim Rasool he buggered up the WC to such an extent that they kicked the ANC out. Thanks ER you did the WC a moer of a favour
Dankie Izak....🤗🤗🤗🤗
Who is this man talking about independence, so now the colonizer want their own country … corruption is everywhere and africa will not be separated regardless of what you and your friends thinks…. Nonsense
Colonizer? I go back 7 generations . Can you go back 3?
Unbelievable!!
Fantastic. Please do more
Go seperet fisland from holand
Need to grow provinces around wc, noordkaap,noordwes,as retirement heavens,make way of doing wc admin further,add more prosperity more north and northwest,orange river water could run or pumped south,for farming and humans
The rainbow dream is not dead, and its worth fighting for. South africa is not complete without the other provinces. Ppl in other provinces are also counting on us, to help them out of the clutches of corruption.
Only way forward is to make each province and independent state
Other home land independent is what you think, just forget .not in Africa and South Africa. There no nuwe state that is going to be formed here.your dividing thoughts will never ever work in South Africa
if war is what you want, then war is what you'll get. Cape Independence our ass'. We have families there. And theres no way in hell i will be needing a passport to go to Cape Town just to visit family. Just cos you have no place to call home on this continent, dont ever for one second think you'll be wondering around creating a little Europe HERE. OVER OUR DEAD BODIES
The EFF and the ANC must get rid of the DA
The question is, why did you come to South Africa?
We need to have a chance to ask questions and i think it is very important so that people will be part and parcel of this movement from the beginning.
free the cape
They have some nerve asking to succeed from some thing that dont belong to them
If the CapeExit (out of SA) were to eventually happen, which won't, they would eventually want to exit also from the continent. We cant have Europe on African soil!
Good argument by actionSA
Good argument for a white boy like you but it won't happen in Africa 🤣
This kind of divisiveness helps the ANC because the ANC relies on emotions to get votes. The ANC is going to say see what they want, and people vote them on emotion.
In this case maybe batswana need smbody to put thmslf together n build again a Tswana nation like bophothatswana .
This is not about governance, I see Racial divide and white monopoly capital playing out.
You have been brainwashed by Bell Pottinger propaganda, paid for by the Guptas.
Change your 'tongue'...
I’m an outsider, but even I can see through it.
Amen! Change the SYSTEM! PEOPLE MUST HAVE DIRECT ELECTIONS! We don't need POLITICAL PARTIES, WE THE PEOPLE want to elect our leaders!
Excellent debate. Such a skandaal that TH-cam took Worldview’s own channel off. So thanks to you guys for airing this useful debate. I ❤️ NEWS YOU CAN USE😊
You can find our new channel here:
th-cam.com/users/WorldViewAlternate
Why do they have this debate a new party is take over the western cape how can foreigners deside for the citizens of the country
ActionSA is appalling in their understanding of democracy, holy cow! They seem to think that the majority of the WC should be held prisoner by the majority of the country, OUTSIDE the province. WTF????
Mr Rasool u do not represent me... being a so called coulerd.. U representing your own intrest... we should have Kayton on that pannel