I’m a Zulu speaking guy from Johannesburg South Africa and I respect and appreciate the role Indians have played in the development of South Africa and our democracy. This country would not be the same without them. I think we Africans have a lot to learn from them. Blessings and love ❤️
Thank you my South African brother. I'm a South African Indian who has studied your amazing culture and your history as a Zulu is my passion. This view is highly generalized and whilst to an extent true doesn't quite reflect our daily reality where we get along.
I was born and brought up in KZN. Son of the 1860 indentured labourers brought to South to plant sugar cane. Believe you me bro it wasn't easy on these farms. We had a two room house with no electricity, no water and the closest town and school was 15 kms away.We had to survive on rations which was mealie meal, mealie rice, samp, beans and split peas, only meat was our own chickens. Water had to be collected from a well, you had two bathe in the open and do your natural things in the bushes.. So it wasn't easy but we went beyond that for one reason only, we made education our number one priority. I live in Cape Town today and enjoy the benefits of my hard work. To add to that Zulus were my best friend's while growing up in KZN.
My Grandfather came to Natal in 1893, he was Nine years old ; he worked for the DBP. Durban Borough Police. He passed on 27th, January, 1937. I will be 84 next year.
Full credit to south africans of Indian origin vith indentured labourers and passengers who developed through self funded schools suxh as the Hindu Tamil school and Anjuman in Durban. We experienced discrimnation, abuse and apartheid but we have progressed and uplifted ourseves through education . We are now doctors, teachers, chartered accountants, IT, engineers etc with great community spirit.
I once had a conversation with a well known Indian politician back in 2000. It was over whether he had any animosity over his family being indentured from India and his reply was. No matter the inhumane act of ripping one away from ones country and family, if his family had not been ,"kidnapped" they would still be the lower caste in India. Whereas here in 🇿🇦 the Indian folk have flourished and will be a force in 🇿🇦. The past cannot be changed, but the future can be plotted. What a man he was and still is. Turning a lemon into lemonade.
To us Indians culture and tradition has taught us to be humble. We lived through tough times it's makes us stronger and hard work hasn't killed anyone but made us go getters. Above all education was and is most important .Indians built schools in their own properties that's why today we have youngsters who have done well.Indians brought only a few clothes but carried scriptures that they read under trees until they built temples. Now we have schools to teach mother tongue languages so that it's alive. Cape Town. South Africa
It’s typical that products of colonialism equate India with caste; it permits you to justify your crimes against those people by saying “it’s better than if we left them there”. The greater irony is the current Prime Minister of India is from a “backward” caste while the current President is a “Tribal Dalit” caste. So much for “casteist India”, eh? Indian “caste” is actually a lot more complicated than how outsiders who wish to oversimplify everything portray.
@vp922 those where his words, not my words, you racist. Stop your hatred. Grow up, get a job and get a life. I happen to be a 9th generation Khoi/European mix, so who is the colonizer
@@vp922 As a South African woman of Indian heritage I feel blessed to have been born in South Africa. Indian women are by and large, educated, independent, and not subject to arranged or forced marriages, can live alone, get divorced without issue, and basically have the same rights and social status as men. Living as a woman in India? Nah -I’ll pass. Subject to tribal councils form of justice? Nope. Judged for being single, childless or unmarried? Nope. Getting harassed with no recourse? Nope. Being a minority in a minority, I’m proud to say that Indian women in South Africa pack a punch far above their weight, which I doubt could happened in India.
The Indian diaspora in South Africa is ( or was) the largest outside India for a long time. Sowell’s research is in the main excellent. Key to their success? No victim mentality, hard work, sense of community upliftment ( education all important, community built schools, places of worship ). I am South African of Indian ancestry.
My grandmother remembers when she was a child, Indians were pretty much the exclusive retailers of fruits and vegetables to most people. They would visit neighbourhoods with horse/donkey-drawn carts to sell their wares.
Dr.Sowell, firstly your pronounciations of South African words are very good and secoundly, you are, as always, not bias, but historical correct. From a white Afrikaner fan of yours.
Yet despite all of this they are absolutely killing it here in Durban these days. More power to my fellow industrious South Africans. I have grown up with and known many KZN Indians and I have never heard a shred of victim mentality from them or any reference whatsoever to the oppression they faced in the past in contrast black people in SA can’t shut up about the past even the ones born after apartheid can sometimes be the most vehement about the injustice they face today yet the only actual oppression is now legally towards whites and in particular white males!
People should learn a lesson from these indentured labourers. They were worse off than slaves. Unlike slaves , indentured labourers had to pay back what they earned. But you never hear of them complaining or asking for reparations. Instead they bettered their lives. The Indians actually built SA and are the people keeping it from falling apart.
Slaves literally never gain freedom and have no control over their families futures. Their children don't even belong to them. Neither does their income. Stop it with that stupid revisionist history nonsense!
I had a Indian friend who moved here from then Zimbabwe. He still had family there. They would send him Zimbabwean money just to show how bad inflation had gotten since it was worthless. He said there was a large population of Indian people there. He left before the total collapse and ousting of "white" farmers that lead to crop failures and economic collapse.
@@dean_l33it is a failed state, it just has good PR where if you don’t look close enough, it can seem like all is normal. I remember as a kid South Africa was seen with optimism and hope, it’s sad how it’s descended into madness from then on
Mr Sowell is living History book - and his legacy will continue into the future in the form of his books, interviews and videos like this one. Sadly, the American education system is not tapping such a great national treasure - History, Anthropology and Economics. An amazing amount of information I was unaware of packed into a 10 minute video. Most have no idea the role Indian immigrants play in the history of South Africa.
I find it extraordinary that the Indians actually were oppressed but it is the blacks that cry victim. While blacks are still today complaining, Indians are quietly building businesses and increasing their wealth.
I think it is wrong to speak about Whites during that time of SA (before republic) as the Boer Afrikaaners and the Anglos were still very much at odds with each other. He described the intra-Indian differences well. A more detailed look is always appreciated
I mostly agree with your video content, but you’ve overlooked a critical point. The concept of South Africa as a unified entity only came into existence in 1910. When you talk about South Africa before that, you’re essentially referring to Natal, a British colony. Indians were largely confined to Natal, with none in the Orange Free State and only a handful in the Transvaal even after 1910. This context is crucial for understanding the historical dynamics you’re discussing.
My grandfather and his cousin arrived in South Africa in 1890. Both of them were sent to the timber plantation to work in the timber mill in the Greytown area. My grandfather died in an accident in the Timber Mill, my dad was about 7 years old and his brother was 5 years old. Both of them were raised by my grandfather's cousin.
I am white and living in KZN. I have spent the last 25 years taking in vulnerable children of all races into my home. I'm proud to say that one of my ancestors was a lawyer and fought for rights for the Indian indentured labourers, specifically in the area of their marriages.
I wish Mr Sowell would do a documentary on the genocide against the KHOI-SAN people by the central African Bantu . This genocide occurred in three provinces , KZN , the Eastern Cape and Lesotho in South Africa .
Most KhoiSan joined the Nguni peoples in their farming lifestyle. Particularly integrated into AbaseMbo (who would later become Mpondos, Hlubis and Xhosas) and on the other side Sotho peoples particularly adopting San culture, even drwsing the same attire.
@kusaselihlengubane8984 and the zulu ? No it was all round equal to genocide . If the KHOI-SAN had remained as an independent people with their own original identity ......but ☹️
@@kusaselihlengubane8984that intergration was not voluntry. The Nguni took aBathwa women as sex slaves and servants. After killing off the men of course.
@Gerrardboss-v2g They integrated into Zulu culture, language and religion. Just like some of the Europeans who settled deep in KZN integrated into Zulu culture and so on. Just like all the migrants who move in here learn isiZulu and it's culture so they can integrate. No genociding needed. The only time we Zulus had to do some conquering and subjugation was during the time of the empire from Shaka to Cetshwayo.
Thank you for this illuminating video. Maybe Thomas Sowell has already explained this, so please forgive me if this question has already been addressed. What features about Indian culture allow Indian immigrants to surpass the indigenous people of the countries they immigrate to, both educationally and economically, despite Indians being subject to some of the same repression or discrimination? It seems to be a common pattern, regardless of what country Indians immigrate to. They start off among the poorest of people, and quickly ascend, within a generation or two, to having the highest per capita income and exceling in the academic sector. Is there a video where Thomas Sowell describes this phenomenon more broadly?
high iq indians immigrate to the country once the lower castes have built a community there. They then use their resources from back home to set up commerce. Not all indians are successful overseas, its a few from many and they are the high IQ ones that arrived later with resources
I think for a lot of us Indians it’s simply down to experiencing such struggle that you never want to experience again, it gives them that drive they have to take whatever and find a way to make it work.
@ no problem. I would say it’s part of it, but also because Indian and Asian families in general are famously very strict and want their kids to be at the top, nothing less, this mindset likely makes them work harder than people who were born there. I wonder how this will change as India is getting richer.
@@SafwaanMohammad-s7vBad times make strong men, good times make weak men. I think we've seen this cycle before in different parts of the world. India may potentially go down this route as life gets easier and better for them in their country.
I find it incredibly interesting that people only practice selective history. If it wasn't for the Anglo boere war, there would be no south africa to save, it would have stayed a British colony for a very long time. Just like the American civil war, whites died by the thousands to protect the land. But yeah even if we are mixed race, if you look white in south africa, you are automatically considered bad. So they leave taking their skills with them and that's why our infrastructure is failing, that's why we have NO innovation, and we have eskom. So thank you for doing exactly the opposite of what Mandela wanted.
On a serious note... what u think he meant by what he said is that some never first settled in Natal and then migrated to the Transvaal...,but landed and soonest possible after disembarcation made their way directly North West to the Transvaal
3.18. Passenger Indians were not poor by western standards. Most were from pprominent families in India esp Surat and had the financial means to travel to India and back with their families.please read the books on indentured labourers and passenger indians by Goolam Vahed ans Ashwin Desai. In fact Mahatma Gandhi had a good living in South africa by acting on behalf of his SA indian clients.
Imagine your home country being so underdeveloped that you would rather choose land in the country that used you as an indentured servant then return to your country.
No they were brought because we were taxed off so much by the British that people had to sell their lands and become labourers. And before the British there were Mughals (Muslims invaders). Churchill brought famine to India because he diverted the food to WW2 soldiers from India.
You cannot take casteism out of Indians completely. It's one of the most enduring social norms of the South Asian Hindu; so potent that even Christians and Muslims of South Asia have developed internal caste divisions within their respective communities, though Christianity and Islam are not supposed to have any caste concept. All over the Indian diaspora, working-class Indians have largely been associated with lower caste or peasant caste origins, while merchants and professionals have been mostly from the upper castes. And they have seldom mingled, even while living under a common external threat.
So, Indians were brought in as indentured servants, but later stayed and caused tensions with both blacks and whites. Is this South Africa or the United States?
Truth be told, it was the very whites that caused tensions between the Indians and blacks because whites could not handle the competition from Indian traders. Even today, whites in SA are more insecure about Indians than blacks. Now mostly due to our education levels and qualifications.
Whites were running the country through the apartheid government but were insecure about the growth of the Indians. They paused the tensions between the Indians and blacks and acted as mediators as a cover up!
Nah, i got nothing do with India , except this past....i have the skin tone n curry. I dont associate with this word indian. That's an apartheid label.
Funfact : The healthy males were willing to trade their rationed food for books.....that's their attitude towards education....JAI SARASWATI MATA KI JAI !
The British wanted slaves to work in their sugar cane farms, the natives Zulus refused and the colonizers went to get slaves from India, and During Apartheid when native black South Africans demanded better wages and working conditions, the Dutch settlers went to African countries to get cheap labour migrants, whites in South Africa are still behind the immigration crisis in the country post 1994, they want ethnic replacement and have NGOs all over the country to fight for immigrants rights over black South Africans who suffered Apartheid economic oppression and segregation under European settlers, and African immigrants have realised they are a weapon in the hands of our former colonizers and oppressors they are playing along and even voting for them.
According to SA history, the blacks were very lazy. The British found the Indians to be very hardworking. As India was a British colony, Britain shipped many Indians to SA.
I would say Israel is a successful settler colony, probably one of the only To a failed settler colonies list, you could add: French Algeria (which somewhat did work, but not to the extent France wanted), Italian Libya, German Namibia, British Kenya, General Plan Ost, Western Armenia & Mitteleuropa
Israel is a beacon of sanity amidst terror promoting countries and the South African rugby team is proof of how South Africa changed and the challenge is to put down your weapons and send 22 of your best and after the match you'll know why we respect New Zealand more than any superpower.
@@evacuationdurgence768being in one of the biggest continents along with the most ethnic diversity and yet nobody settles in a fertile region for thousands of years until Europeans come along? No way xD
Those that are darker are descendants from africa that moved to india (south india tamils) and mixed with the Indians there hence the skin color and some even have mild kinks in their hair. This is based on epigenetics
Excellent info. It just goes to show how human beings of all backgrounds seem to find a way to oppress and marginalize each other. The only cure to that imo is Jesus Christ. In Him we truly can love our neighbors and do what's right through the power of the Holy Spirit. In Him we gain freedom from our flesh that constantly insnares us to do harm to others and ourselves. Because without him becoming our Lord and Savior, we end up repeating all of this. Even in these modern times the world is still doing it. Nothing is new under the sun and we just keep repeating the wrongs of the past to this day.
Interesting that you should say that. The NG Church in South Africa leveraged Christianity for oppression and racial segregation. Us “mud people” were considered “hewers of wood and drawers of water” to justify a purposefully basic level of education. Christian missionaries nicely blend in the joys of colonialism and negation of indigenous peoples culture and heritage to fulfill their own mental indoctrination. One of the worst things in my opinion, is to steal and erase a sense of pride in indigenous culture, which is what makes Christianity so lethal to a sense of indigenous community. Ask native people globally -these broken communities are really enjoying what Christian missionaries did for them.
This video clip is over 50 yrs old ,and lndians speak only one language...English,the caste system was abolished in the 1970'sby lndians .Gujarati lndians treated other lndians like dirt for over 90 yrs .Today the Gujarat population is very tiny almost non existent.
One comment was that apartheid is responsible for the word indian so where is the apartheid people that labeled a country India and its the English people of the early forming south africa that start calling you indians and co..... long before apartheid started so stop blaming apartheid.
I’m a Zulu speaking guy from Johannesburg South Africa and I respect and appreciate the role Indians have played in the development of South Africa and our democracy. This country would not be the same without them. I think we Africans have a lot to learn from them. Blessings and love ❤️
Thank you my South African brother. I'm a South African Indian who has studied your amazing culture and your history as a Zulu is my passion. This view is highly generalized and whilst to an extent true doesn't quite reflect our daily reality where we get along.
Agree. Everyone can learn from everyone
Yebo
Kunjalo
So much to learn from them bro
I was born and brought up in KZN. Son of the 1860 indentured labourers brought to South to plant sugar cane. Believe you me bro it wasn't easy on these farms. We had a two room house with no electricity, no water and the closest town and school was 15 kms away.We had to survive on rations which was mealie meal, mealie rice, samp, beans and split peas, only meat was our own chickens. Water had to be collected from a well, you had two bathe in the open and do your natural things in the bushes.. So it wasn't easy but we went beyond that for one reason only, we made education our number one priority. I live in Cape Town today and enjoy the benefits of my hard work. To add to that Zulus were my best friend's while growing up in KZN.
My Grandfather came to Natal in 1893, he was Nine years old ; he worked for the DBP. Durban Borough Police. He passed on 27th, January, 1937. I will be 84 next year.
You are our lost generations
Full credit to south africans of Indian origin vith indentured labourers and passengers who developed through self funded schools suxh as the Hindu Tamil school and Anjuman in Durban. We experienced discrimnation, abuse and apartheid but we have progressed and uplifted ourseves through education . We are now doctors, teachers, chartered accountants, IT, engineers etc with great community spirit.
I once had a conversation with a well known Indian politician back in 2000. It was over whether he had any animosity over his family being indentured from India and his reply was. No matter the inhumane act of ripping one away from ones country and family, if his family had not been ,"kidnapped" they would still be the lower caste in India. Whereas here in 🇿🇦 the Indian folk have flourished and will be a force in 🇿🇦. The past cannot be changed, but the future can be plotted. What a man he was and still is. Turning a lemon into lemonade.
To us Indians culture and tradition has taught us to be humble. We lived through tough times it's makes us stronger and hard work hasn't killed anyone but made us go getters. Above all education was and is most important .Indians built schools in their own properties that's why today we have youngsters who have done well.Indians brought only a few clothes but carried scriptures that they read under trees until they built temples. Now we have schools to teach mother tongue languages so that it's alive.
Cape Town. South Africa
It’s typical that products of colonialism equate India with caste; it permits you to justify your crimes against those people by saying “it’s better than if we left them there”.
The greater irony is the current Prime Minister of India is from a “backward” caste while the current President is a “Tribal Dalit” caste. So much for “casteist India”, eh? Indian “caste” is actually a lot more complicated than how outsiders who wish to oversimplify everything portray.
@vp922 those where his words, not my words, you racist. Stop your hatred. Grow up, get a job and get a life. I happen to be a 9th generation Khoi/European mix, so who is the colonizer
@@vp922 As a South African woman of Indian heritage I feel blessed to have been born in South Africa. Indian women are by and large, educated, independent, and not subject to arranged or forced marriages, can live alone, get divorced without issue, and basically have the same rights and social status as men. Living as a woman in India? Nah -I’ll pass. Subject to tribal councils form of justice? Nope. Judged for being single, childless or unmarried? Nope. Getting harassed with no recourse? Nope. Being a minority in a minority, I’m proud to say that Indian women in South Africa pack a punch far above their weight, which I doubt could happened in India.
Yep.... The caste system in India.. was a very severe firm of racism... Not sure how prevalent the caste system is in India today...
The Indian diaspora in South Africa is ( or was) the largest outside India for a long time. Sowell’s research is in the main excellent. Key to their success? No victim mentality, hard work, sense of community upliftment ( education all important, community built schools, places of worship ).
I am South African of Indian ancestry.
That and preferential treatment by the apartheid government.😂😂
Nope, when they got money they didn't spend it all on KFC and alcohol@@BlurryFace-zz2ro
Great example of a peckiou
@@BlurryFace-zz2roEven more preference from the cANCer government.
Look at BBBEE , Indians have been the biggest benefactors.
@@BlurryFace-zz2rounreal cope
My grandmother remembers when she was a child, Indians were pretty much the exclusive retailers of fruits and vegetables to most people. They would visit neighbourhoods with horse/donkey-drawn carts to sell their wares.
Dr.Sowell, firstly your pronounciations of South African words are very good and secoundly, you are, as always, not bias, but historical correct.
From a white Afrikaner fan of yours.
I'm so glad God created Thomas Sowell to be a great Historian who seems the true facts 🙏❤️! And we celebrate the same birthdate ❤.
Ameen
See...diversity has always been a strength.
My great grandfather came from Mauritius and was a Indian slave who ended remaining in South Africa and married a black woman that's where I came from
Incredible how hard work made them excell só much
Insightful. Fascinating statistics. Thank you! Big fan from South Africa.
Hey Majozi! Also love your content
@ Thank you very much. Up and forward with markets and personal responsibility!
@@majozishowA fellow Saffer who is also a Thomas Sowell? I will check your content out too!
An excellent, accurate, and unbiased presentation ! Much appreciated !
God Bless Thomas Sowell
Yet despite all of this they are absolutely killing it here in Durban these days. More power to my fellow industrious South Africans. I have grown up with and known many KZN Indians and I have never heard a shred of victim mentality from them or any reference whatsoever to the oppression they faced in the past in contrast black people in SA can’t shut up about the past even the ones born after apartheid can sometimes be the most vehement about the injustice they face today yet the only actual oppression is now legally towards whites and in particular white males!
Oh no
@@Sivuyilemtshambelayou can say that again🤦🏾♀️
People should learn a lesson from these indentured labourers. They were worse off than slaves. Unlike slaves , indentured labourers had to pay back what they earned.
But you never hear of them complaining or asking for reparations. Instead they bettered their lives. The Indians actually built SA and are the people keeping it from falling apart.
Spot on. And they jealous of our success
Slaves literally never gain freedom and have no control over their families futures. Their children don't even belong to them. Neither does their income. Stop it with that stupid revisionist history nonsense!
Rubbish
@@biko8229 truth hurts
@@Ash_Hole-f7p LOL what truth? It seems you don't know how the working class was created here in SA.
I had a Indian friend who moved here from then Zimbabwe. He still had family there. They would send him Zimbabwean money just to show how bad inflation had gotten since it was worthless. He said there was a large population of Indian people there. He left before the total collapse and ousting of "white" farmers that lead to crop failures and economic collapse.
Don't understand how South Africa isn't qualified as a failed state yet
@@dean_l33 It will be soon by 2035
Where is ‘here?’
@@dean_l33it is a failed state, it just has good PR where if you don’t look close enough, it can seem like all is normal. I remember as a kid South Africa was seen with optimism and hope, it’s sad how it’s descended into madness from then on
@@mtkoslowski US, specially Florida.
Mr Sowell is living History book - and his legacy will continue into the future in the form of his books, interviews and videos like this one. Sadly, the American education system is not tapping such a great national treasure - History, Anthropology and Economics.
An amazing amount of information I was unaware of packed into a 10 minute video. Most have no idea the role Indian immigrants play in the history of South Africa.
Our education system is based on making people just follow directions, is it any wonder then why they don’t teach this stuff?
I find it extraordinary that the Indians actually were oppressed but it is the blacks that cry victim. While blacks are still today complaining, Indians are quietly building businesses and increasing their wealth.
I think it is wrong to speak about Whites during that time of SA (before republic) as the Boer Afrikaaners and the Anglos were still very much at odds with each other. He described the intra-Indian differences well. A more detailed look is always appreciated
In these matters, Sowell lacks his usual insight, I'm afraid.
Excellent job. Mr Thomas Sowell
I mostly agree with your video content, but you’ve overlooked a critical point. The concept of South Africa as a unified entity only came into existence in 1910. When you talk about South Africa before that, you’re essentially referring to Natal, a British colony. Indians were largely confined to Natal, with none in the Orange Free State and only a handful in the Transvaal even after 1910. This context is crucial for understanding the historical dynamics you’re discussing.
I can only agree with you. Sowell is way out of his depths on this one, sadly.
Very good...salient point
My grandfather and his cousin arrived in South Africa in 1890. Both of them were sent to the timber plantation to work in the timber mill in the Greytown area. My grandfather died in an accident in the Timber Mill, my dad was about 7 years old and his brother was 5 years old. Both of them were raised by my grandfather's cousin.
I am white and living in KZN. I have spent the last 25 years taking in vulnerable children of all races into my home. I'm proud to say that one of my ancestors was a lawyer and fought for rights for the Indian indentured labourers, specifically in the area of their marriages.
I wish Mr Sowell would do a documentary on the genocide against the KHOI-SAN people by the central African Bantu .
This genocide occurred in three provinces , KZN , the Eastern Cape and Lesotho in South Africa .
Most KhoiSan joined the Nguni peoples in their farming lifestyle. Particularly integrated into AbaseMbo (who would later become Mpondos, Hlubis and Xhosas) and on the other side Sotho peoples particularly adopting San culture, even drwsing the same attire.
@kusaselihlengubane8984 and the zulu ?
No it was all round equal to genocide .
If the KHOI-SAN had remained as an independent people with their own original identity ......but ☹️
@kusaselihlengubane8984:not joined in “peace”like a football club,the females were kidnapped,violated,men massacred
@@kusaselihlengubane8984that intergration was not voluntry.
The Nguni took aBathwa women as sex slaves and servants. After killing off the men of course.
@Gerrardboss-v2g They integrated into Zulu culture, language and religion. Just like some of the Europeans who settled deep in KZN integrated into Zulu culture and so on. Just like all the migrants who move in here learn isiZulu and it's culture so they can integrate. No genociding needed. The only time we Zulus had to do some conquering and subjugation was during the time of the empire from Shaka to Cetshwayo.
Great informative video watching from cape town south Africa
thanks !!
They have been vulnerable but many have been very successful rising well in the corporate ranks
Thank you for this illuminating video. Maybe Thomas Sowell has already explained this, so please forgive me if this question has already been addressed. What features about Indian culture allow Indian immigrants to surpass the indigenous people of the countries they immigrate to, both educationally and economically, despite Indians being subject to some of the same repression or discrimination? It seems to be a common pattern, regardless of what country Indians immigrate to. They start off among the poorest of people, and quickly ascend, within a generation or two, to having the highest per capita income and exceling in the academic sector. Is there a video where Thomas Sowell describes this phenomenon more broadly?
high iq indians immigrate to the country once the lower castes have built a community there. They then use their resources from back home to set up commerce.
Not all indians are successful overseas, its a few from many and they are the high IQ ones that arrived later with resources
I think for a lot of us Indians it’s simply down to experiencing such struggle that you never want to experience again, it gives them that drive they have to take whatever and find a way to make it work.
@@SafwaanMohammad-s7v Thanks. That is certainly a possibility.
@ no problem. I would say it’s part of it, but also because Indian and Asian families in general are famously very strict and want their kids to be at the top, nothing less, this mindset likely makes them work harder than people who were born there. I wonder how this will change as India is getting richer.
@@SafwaanMohammad-s7vBad times make strong men, good times make weak men. I think we've seen this cycle before in different parts of the world. India may potentially go down this route as life gets easier and better for them in their country.
I understand that next to India South Africa has the largest Indian settlement.
I find it incredibly interesting that people only practice selective history. If it wasn't for the Anglo boere war, there would be no south africa to save, it would have stayed a British colony for a very long time. Just like the American civil war, whites died by the thousands to protect the land. But yeah even if we are mixed race, if you look white in south africa, you are automatically considered bad. So they leave taking their skills with them and that's why our infrastructure is failing, that's why we have NO innovation, and we have eskom. So thank you for doing exactly the opposite of what Mandela wanted.
Did he say that some Indians sailed directly to the Transvaal? I did not know that was possible.
lol you know it’s not
😮hahaha 😂I also heard that, ....right....apparently Sowell says it is, O' well....😂😂
On a serious note... what u think he meant by what he said is that some never first settled in Natal and then migrated to the Transvaal...,but landed and soonest possible after disembarcation made their way directly North West to the Transvaal
If you really go deep into history, our ancestors arrived around 1820 and not 1860.
Whose ancestors?
Not to mention the living conditions in their home country for working class Indians was generally much worse than South Africa.
3.18. Passenger Indians were not poor by western standards. Most were from pprominent families in India esp Surat and had the financial means to travel to India and back with their families.please read the books on indentured labourers and passenger indians by Goolam Vahed ans Ashwin Desai. In fact Mahatma Gandhi had a good living in South africa by acting on behalf of his SA indian clients.
Imagine your home country being so underdeveloped that you would rather choose land in the country that used you as an indentured servant then return to your country.
Idk ask the Irish.
No they were brought because we were taxed off so much by the British that people had to sell their lands and become labourers. And before the British there were Mughals (Muslims invaders). Churchill brought famine to India because he diverted the food to WW2 soldiers from India.
Same country today, still as ignorant as they come.
@@jdamsel8212Ireland is right next to the UK, and has become incredibly rich, not a good analogy there mate
@@SafwaanMohammad-s7v Except hes talking about the irish that stayed in the states, or is history not your thing?
SHARED WITH OTHER SOUTH AFRICANS 👍🇿🇦🇬🇧
Now I know where the phrase “how much you got?” Comes from. See 5:08.
@5:00
Learnt an African language
You cannot take casteism out of Indians completely. It's one of the most enduring social norms of the South Asian Hindu; so potent that even Christians and Muslims of South Asia have developed internal caste divisions within their respective communities, though Christianity and Islam are not supposed to have any caste concept. All over the Indian diaspora, working-class Indians have largely been associated with lower caste or peasant caste origins, while merchants and professionals have been mostly from the upper castes. And they have seldom mingled, even while living under a common external threat.
3rd, 26 December 2024
So, Indians were brought in as indentured servants, but later stayed and caused tensions with both blacks and whites. Is this South Africa or the United States?
Truth be told, it was the very whites that caused tensions between the Indians and blacks because whites could not handle the competition from Indian traders. Even today, whites in SA are more insecure about Indians than blacks. Now mostly due to our education levels and qualifications.
Whites were running the country through the apartheid government but were insecure about the growth of the Indians. They paused the tensions between the Indians and blacks and acted as mediators as a cover up!
We still here, not the past.😂
Nah, i got nothing do with India , except this past....i have the skin tone n curry.
I dont associate with this word indian. That's an apartheid label.
Funfact : The healthy males were willing to trade their rationed food for books.....that's their attitude towards education....JAI SARASWATI MATA KI JAI !
Who else saw the Ghandi movie? 🍿 The
The British wanted slaves to work in their sugar cane farms, the natives Zulus refused and the colonizers went to get slaves from India, and During Apartheid when native black South Africans demanded better wages and working conditions, the Dutch settlers went to African countries to get cheap labour migrants, whites in South Africa are still behind the immigration crisis in the country post 1994, they want ethnic replacement and have NGOs all over the country to fight for immigrants rights over black South Africans who suffered Apartheid economic oppression and segregation under European settlers, and African immigrants have realised they are a weapon in the hands of our former colonizers and oppressors they are playing along and even voting for them.
According to SA history, the blacks were very lazy. The British found the Indians to be very hardworking. As India was a British colony, Britain shipped many Indians to SA.
As the blacks were very lazy, Indians were brought from India to work on the sugar cane farms.
@jonpoint-t9i yet we're still slaves
Can you so a video about failed settler colonies like apartheid South Africa and Israel
I would say Israel is a successful settler colony, probably one of the only
To a failed settler colonies list, you could add: French Algeria (which somewhat did work, but not to the extent France wanted), Italian Libya, German Namibia, British Kenya, General Plan Ost, Western Armenia & Mitteleuropa
Aah failed State of Israel with $58,000 Per Capita Income
Israel is a beacon of sanity amidst terror promoting countries and the South African rugby team is proof of how South Africa changed and the challenge is to put down your weapons and send 22 of your best and after the match you'll know why we respect New Zealand more than any superpower.
South Africa is not a failed settler colony yet.
@ your kidding. South Africa has devolved into a dictatorship at this point, all ending apartheid did was undo one tyranny and create a new one
South Africa has no natives, it wasnt inhabited continuously until Europeans.
That’s not true. There were the Strandloopers, Hottentots and Bushmen.
Yes, maybe 5 or 6 of them were there @@mtkoslowski
Khoisan existed in relative abundance but were hunter gatherers so population density wasn't high
Zulus? Xhosa? A ton of other groups somehow didn’t exist? Your being ridiculous
@@evacuationdurgence768being in one of the biggest continents along with the most ethnic diversity and yet nobody settles in a fertile region for thousands of years until Europeans come along? No way xD
Why did they call themselves Indians? Sometimes, i see them darker than myself and still call themselves Indians and who give them the names.
They are outcasts in India
What has skin colour to do with your nationality and ethnicity?
Those that are darker are descendants from africa that moved to india (south india tamils) and mixed with the Indians there hence the skin color and some even have mild kinks in their hair. This is based on epigenetics
Don't be stupid now. They came from India that's why they are Indians! Don't know how dark you are and whats the correlation with skin colour?
@@chronosmagasaurus2813The dark skin is due to them integrating with the blacks.
Excellent info. It just goes to show how human beings of all backgrounds seem to find a way to oppress and marginalize each other. The only cure to that imo is Jesus Christ. In Him we truly can love our neighbors and do what's right through the power of the Holy Spirit. In Him we gain freedom from our flesh that constantly insnares us to do harm to others and ourselves. Because without him becoming our Lord and Savior, we end up repeating all of this. Even in these modern times the world is still doing it. Nothing is new under the sun and we just keep repeating the wrongs of the past to this day.
Interesting that you should say that. The NG Church in South Africa leveraged Christianity for oppression and racial segregation. Us “mud people” were considered “hewers of wood and drawers of water” to justify a purposefully basic level of education. Christian missionaries nicely blend in the joys of colonialism and negation of indigenous peoples culture and heritage to fulfill their own mental indoctrination. One of the worst things in my opinion, is to steal and erase a sense of pride in indigenous culture, which is what makes Christianity so lethal to a sense of indigenous community. Ask native people globally -these broken communities are really enjoying what Christian missionaries did for them.
I spoke to a couple of South Africa women.
They wanted to married to indians outside SA to get out of the horrifying criminal capital of the world.
Native peoples learn learn
This video clip is over 50 yrs old ,and lndians speak only one language...English,the caste system was abolished in the 1970'sby lndians .Gujarati lndians treated other lndians like dirt for over 90 yrs .Today the Gujarat population is very tiny almost non existent.
Yes, very true. However caste got replaced by classism which is more or less a rebranding
@@chronosmagasaurus2813You seem to be stuck in a colonial mindset and reluctant to move on!!
One comment was that apartheid is responsible for the word indian so where is the apartheid people that labeled a country India and its the English people of the early forming south africa that start calling you indians and co..... long before apartheid started so stop blaming apartheid.
Apartheid started when the group area act was formed.
It was further excerzarbated by the Afrikaaners when they gained control of South Africa.