RED Raven vs. Sony FS7 - Which is BETTER??
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ส.ค. 2024
- -JERSEY FILMMAKER EPISODE #48 - RED RAVEN VS. SONY FS7-
Putting the RED Raven and Sony FS7 head to head to see which camera produces better images!!
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EPISODE NOTES:
At 5:51 I mention I had lowered "both" camera's ISOs. I don't know why I said “both”. The FS7 has more internal ND than I have for my matte box that I had on the Raven. So I went with the appropriate ND on the FS7 and lowered the ISO on the Raven only, not a on the FS7.
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I own an FS7 and I was seriously hard pushed to see the difference. Your conclusion was spot on :-)
Very much agree :)
To add to my original comment. Only people like us will see these details. The other 99% will be watching the content. The FS7 is more than good enough to capture good content with the right people behind the the camera. Also, how many FS7's could you own, or extra glass, external recorder to record 12bit ProRes raw etc.
If you're buying into a RED setup, you'll need deep pockets.
The FS7 wins hands down as it also has XLR inputs, internal ND's, a very efficient XAVC-I CODEC, total self sufficient ERGONOMICS, more PRESET buttons, small BATTERIES, and is part of a coherent supported product line.
Great conclusion and I agree. They're so high end that the difference comes from lens, lighting and other variables rather than the camera itself.
>5 min mark just to get to the point 🤦🏻♂️
Le Ba Vu Don’t talk to him like that 🤩
Both cameras need to be overexposed. If you do that by a stop or three (controlling for highlights), the noise in the shadows will disappear. That will also allow you to kill the internal noise reduction in the FS which will give you a sharper image. All these $2k and up cameras look great today and cut together really well. What a great time to be doing cinematography!!!
Overexposing by 1-3 stop is recommended IF you are shooting S-Log. For all other picture profiles, expose "normally" and do not overexpose - protect the highlights.
As a beginner in this field of working I’m going to get the fs5. Looks like a great camera to learn the basic and the way around it. Can’t wait! Subbed!
Another great comparison. Very clear, yet creative - and that's a fine line. Beautiful work, thanks for making it and sharing.
Couldn't tell with the car but easily got the other two right. Thousands of dollars for cameras and I still have to deal with crappy 1080p video after TH-cam's compression.
Pevans yeah always a bummer and tough to present tests when they are going to get compressed anyway. But if you didn’t see it already, I just did a RED Weapon and Raven comparison and added links to download 4K and RAW files to look at for yourself ... th-cam.com/video/xPWLlqKr0fM/w-d-xo.html
Dude this video is great! and SPOT ON with the tests!! as perfect as it can be. any chance you do more Sony FS7 tests? like at a nighttime interior with lighting for a Film and a clown in the background? I can just stand there
Killed this video, Anthony. Loved the intro and think you did a great job putting the two cameras to the test objectively. I was able to pick out the cameras, but only because I knew what to look for between them. Would really love to see if you'd be able to get your hands on a C200 and compare the Raw workflow between that and the Reds you own. Keep it up!
Bobby Hicks, can you expand on your technique to distinguish the cameras ? tia
It was again educated guesses, but I was looking for color shifts and resolution in fine details like hair. Sony's typically have a stronger green channel, I notice, so trees look a little more vibrant, and details like hair are nicer with RED. In the dark test, I looked for skin tone - Sony is terrible with skin tone so the red saturation in Anthony's face kinda picked that for me. I'm sure that there were better examples to distinguish them, but TH-cam compresses everything so much that it doesn't really matter. This was just meant to be fun, showing how both cameras are workhorses.
i like the intro and this video really help me to choose which one! keep making a good content!
Great video! Were definitely looking at the red Raven for our next pickup!
Awesome point, it's about what's infront of the camera and lighting. Cheers
That was a great comparison. I was wrong on the first two, but I agree they are both pretty darn close. Thanks!
Great video! I loved the intro---very creative and I am inspired! I have the FS7 and have been slowly making friends with it for months. There i really an investment in time to learn its functions for both its ENG side as well as creative side. I am wondering if you were customizing the Paint setting Gammas when you shot with the FS7? I learned to use HG7 for low light situations/indoors and HG8 for outdoor shooting and uncontrolled light since it holds highlights better. Also wondering if you move the sensor area around to weigh where it should calculate the light source. There is not as much to do in post for me now that I apply these while I shoot. Had no idea that you really have to set this camera up before you use it and that you can't shoot with it right out the box!
Thanks my friend! There is quite a learning curve with this camera unfortunately, but in my opinion, worth it! I general use a customized HG7 setting. You are correct with the HG8 setting as well, but I don't switch back and forth that often. I have not toyed with moving the sensor area around to calculate the light source...tell me more!?!
Jersey Filmmaker I can’t take credit...I learned from Doug Jensen’s 6 Hour FS7 MasterClass online. That’s where I learned about the focus sensor setting which allows you to choose where the light source is calculated. Imagine you have subject sitting in a room with a window behind them where it is sunny outside. You can tell the Sensor to calculate the light for exposure based on the person’s face rather than the brightest part of the frame which would be the daylight outside. You can tell it to ignore whatever part of the frame you choose.
So you must be talking about an auto mode? Because I would generally use some scopes or waveforms or zebras or false color (on an external monitor of course) or something along those lines to expose, not let the camera decide for me. I've also watched his course (which is fantastic) but must have skipped that part once I heard auto lol. The only auto I'll use on this camera is an auto white balance if i'm run & gun and moving throughout different spaces or going back and forth indoors and outdoors. I always expose manually
So awesome intro! Love it! :D
It would be interesting to compare the FS7 to the Komodo.
starts at 4:58
Hey man, I think your content is awesome! Maybe even seeing a desk set up explained would be inspiring as well! Interested in how you utilize 2 iMacs and 3 keyboards...hahah
I get this question a lot, I'll put it on the list!
This chanel should have 1 000 000 subs
I‘m not a fan of video making, but this youtuber deserve much more subs, so I subscribed.
Loved the intro very creative.
which is better? in what regards? i work with red scarlet-dragon AND sony f5 regularly and these comparisons are just click bait for the consumer. you can compare DR and color spaces until you turn red, green and blue but at the end of the day it boils down to budget. The fs7 base package runs for under 7 grand where the raven brain is just under 9 grand. Though reds image quality is great, the ergonomics and cost of accessories is, well... you'll see what i mean. Do your homework everyone and then decide what suits your needs. BTW, you can tell the same story with both cameras.
I never said this was the end all be all to make a decision on which camera to use or buy, I was just simply comparing the visuals on each (to answer your question).
All the points you made are great...yes budget matters, yes ergonomics are different, yes of course you can tell the same story, and there are a million more things to think about...but I wasn't comparing those things in this video.
I know exactly what you mean about the cost of the two cameras and their accessories, I've purchased and own 3 REDs and 3 Sonys. So if I made a video called "FS7 vs. RED Raven - Which is better bang for your buck?" and only spoke about the camera's prices, would that be clickbait too?
I'm not sure why you seem so angry that I made a video comparing the two, in whichever way I've decided to compare them. It's very odd to me when people hate on someone for simply putting information out there. How you interpret and use the information, is up to you.
Being from the Camden area myself , I have to say you seem sensitive in you assertion to me "hating" on your review... not at all. Just pointing out that impressionable types often rely on comparison videos a little too much as they are never really on the level. The Chevy has more horses but the Ford has the suspension, that kinda thing. At the end of the day, one has to measure their budget to the story they wanna tell or vice versa... cheers!
Not that I want to defend the fs7, but comparing raw and slog3 isn't quite a fair match, since these are two completely different approaches to recording data.
The overall colors look wrong in the scene with the girl indoors and I think there might be some color shifting/bad white balance going on between your led and the daylight which causes the unnatural colors. These are not due to the fs7. The skin tones do not look natural to me, to cool greenish/yellow washed out. Also I think the footage looks underexposed by almost a stop. How did you attain exposure?
You’re the Ryan Gosling of filmmaking lol 🤩
Finally. Getting pretty bored of everyone pointlessly comparing "insert camera here" to a fucking iphone.
Excellent videos man. Keep it up and this channel will take off.
Thank you so much! It's great help! All the best,
Superb video! Awesome
In the shadows, the fs7 ‘s lack of detail could be a matter of exposure. Did you expose your highlights @ 107 IRE?
m audio bx-8 FTW!!! I had them, painted them white, now they look like storm troopers. I can't bring myself to do that to my 8240 genelecs though...
Great video. Just curious, what did you film your spoken presentation with? Thanks in advance!
Great Video Bro,i always wanted to get a red raven
Ok that intro gets a subscription!!! LOL great..
I was always right with what's the RED/FS7 and I always chose the better looking side for the RED - so for me the RED is the winner.
Great comparison video; the only thing that bugs me a little bit is the change in framing at every cut during your talking head. I think is better to switch between a wide shot and a close-up, instead of a wide shot and a less wider shot. Maybe less cuts the next time :)
Great video man
Is there any serious difference between a middle-range cinematics cameras like fs7, eva1, Ursa mini, eos c300 and the most super frikend expensive Red's and Arri's cameras, like monster and Arri Alexa?
Why for the car shot you used the high contrast HR4? Why not the low contrast HR4? Were you trying to match the two more closely? Because you would’ve gotten a lot more detail in the shadows/highlights
Chris Kennedy I wanted to use the same LUT throughout the all the shots so to see how the images reacted to it. I chose HR4 because I generally like higher contrast shots. So it was just a preference in look for me and consistency in the testing process.
Did you use s-logs ?
good video as always
I've found that grading hair on the FS7 is a nightmare. Fair hair ends up looking green especially when I increase the image contrast. Can anyone offer any advice on this?
As u mentioned at 5:51 what do you mean with "lowering the ISO" As far as i now you can't change the ISO at the FS7 when you shoot log in the CineEI mode. Do you mean you lowered the EI?
Portzir great point, idk why I said “both” ISO’s. The FS7 has more internal ND than I have for my matte box that I had on the Raven. So I went with the appropriate ND on the FS7 and only lowered the ISO on the Raven, not a on the FS7. I’ll make a note in the episode notes to correct it. Thank you
Came here for a camera comparison and found a morning routine...
Subbed!
Hi thanks very much for this great video.
I am looking into buying one of the 3 cameras (UMP, c200, fs7) but can't seem to make up my mind and I like them all but of course can buy and need only one.
My heart is with UMP and head with both Canon c200 and fs7 mark 1.
All these camcorders have their own unique qualities and selling points.
I think I would have settled with c200 mainly if they had more and better quality recording codecs internally and mainly dual cfast card slots for back up like UMP has. UMP also records to two ssd externally.
UMP is great but not exactly very good in very low light so it's not great for some type of event work I think but still it's not at all bad in low light. Most of the camcorders are not great in low light anyways.
Fs7 seems very good too but again I very much like UMP's cinematic looks and ergonomics and features and mainly it's price.
I need a good camcorder for events and for narrative films and I consider myself a total beginner and want to get a proper cinema camcorder.
Kindly please advice on which camera would you buy now in 2018 considering you dont have much experience with professional filming and have no lens etc but are ready to invest, learn and grow in the only industry you love.
Your kind advice will be highly appreciated.
Cheers.
You're research has done you well! Here's my opinion, and solely my opinion so you should do tests and decide for yourself...
I don't like BlackMagic's camera systems and workflow. Love the image!! But just don't enjoy working with the camera physically. So they come off my list immediately.
The c200 is amazing if you want to shoot RAW or 1080. I hate that it drops down to 8-bit in 4k. And the RAW files are a bit heavy. But again, an amazing image.
The FS7 is by far the best bang for your buck, but the hardest to work with when it comes to image and color. It can produce great images, but there is a little bit of a learning curve. You really need to have a good understanding of the camera.
Hope this helps...best of luck!!
Jersey Filmmaker
Thanks so much for your time and advice.
Kind regards ::))
👌
I love your desk. Why do you have the speakers up so high?
Mainly because my desk is height adjustable and I needed to keep them out of the way. They also don't fit on my desk, they look better up high and it pushes the sound nicely through the room when I'm jammin' out :P
Nice test and intro! Did recognize Sony color in the outside shot - has that "digital video" color in overexposed areas, that's the only problem I have when working with Sony footage (=
Actual video starts at 2:15
How do you put your imacs together to one computer of both
th-cam.com/video/d4uD4Ced8Yo/w-d-xo.html
In the exterior shot
What Lense did you use in Red Camera?
Canon L-Series 24-70mm f/2.8
so very different purposes for these two cameras.
Where is downloadable raw files?
I have fs5 sony camera, i don't know how can i use best quality video
PARA RECORDS External Recording using RAW Output and convert it in the recorder in ProRes up to UHD. Internal recording max 1080p 10bit. UHD internal doesn’t make sense in 8 bit. Hope that helps.
Why didn’t you record raw on the fs7 too?
earthbound because raw doesn’t record internally on the FS7. And I promise, almost nobody actually uses Sony raw files (at least on a regular basis), so that’s an unrealistic comparison.
Jersey Filmmaker hook up an external recorder and do this test the right way. There are plenty of people that shoot fs7 raw.
What camera was the review filmed with?
The intro was an A7Sii and my talking head was the FS5
I am suprised, why you didnt use also HDRX mode in Red raven, because it is one of big point , why people want to buy red cameras -big dynamic range in HDRX mode!, no Canon C200,300, no FS7,A7SI etc, even amira dont have it, or am I wrong?
To be quite honest, I've never shot anything in HDR. I've seen footage and don't love the look of it. Feels like a "painted" image, just looks fake in my eyes (that's subjective of course). But my point is that I sadly don't know much about it, and should invest the time to learn more. So to your comment though, I don't think this is the biggest reason people choose RED cameras. It's more so, in my opinion, because of the image quality, workability of their REDcode RAW, build modularity & the sensor/body upgradability. Again, just my opinion and thoughts, not factual/definitive comment
It is ok, it is your opinion,I respect it, but it is little like to have Turbo on car and dont use it or HDR on still cameras and dont use it ;-)and f.e. I did photos on Sony A6300 on seychelles , you have no chance to have on beaches like D Argent with rocks in shadow to have sky and shadows without that;-)! and hmm "painted image"- you can change it a lot in post and of course it is used in only in critical contrast scenes not all time, but simply in red cameras you have this possibility in others you havent!!! and I think that their proclamation of 16.5+DR is not of normal mode ,but exactly of HDRX mode, or do you know really any camera sensor, that has 16.5+ DR;-)?look on test of red helium or dragon on dxomark and you will see, and sony fs7 has on cinema5D web cca 12.5 usable DR, A7S series+A7RII 12DR (SONY brand proclamation is 15dr-SORRY no way!, I own A7RII and it has max. 12-13 DR in slog2 -cca almost like BMCC 2.5K I compared it), only arri amira on cinema5D had real 14 DR -it is one of the reason its popularity in film industry. And I think because it is simply technical limitation of nowadays sensors, red cameras like scarlet-w or raven has I read about 13 DR without HDRx as you saw on your comparing of raven and fs7 result od different DR make perfect sense...video of this car really has no 16.5+ DR :-)good light and thanks for your videos!
Excalibrr1 that all sounds pretty accurate to me, great info thank you! I will need to dive into HDR at some point. I’m sure I’ll talk about it in an episode when I do 👊🏼👍🏼
Really you will do video?It could be great!:-)
Excalibrr1 IF and when I study it more and learn it, I would do a video. That would be a while from now though because I don’t have any experience and I wouldn’t want to speak on anything I don’t know too much about
4:57 Thanks me Later
Sony
“Why you say you’re better than me?”
Ima use that😂
i really love your red t shirt，where i can buy it？？？please give me a website or a link
red.com ... In the Merch section
www.red.com/store/products/weapon-tshirt-w-logo
love you！！！
I think the test is incorrect.
You made a color correction of the material, and did not show the true color reproduction of the cameras in comparison. So it was test of colorist skill rather then the cameras.
Michael Weizenfeld early in the video I explain why I tested this way (at 3:25). I completely understand that you personally may want to see the true color reproduction for your needs, so I’m sorry for not delivering on that :/. But for my workflow and delivery, this is the type of test that works best for me, so that’s the way I went about it. To say that this test is incorrect, in my opinion, is incorrect 😏
HOWEVER, I love what you said because this does beg the question...is the camera more important or the colorist?!?!? 🤔
Jersey Filmmaker Heh, my opinion is: when you need a colorist, then something gone wrong in preproduction and production)
Bad camera, bad lighting, bad filters, bad makeup, bad costumes, wrong shooting time, etc. Good colorist can repair some of that, anyway it is something about "we'll fix it in post".
Well, I respectfully COMPLETELY disagree. You do realize that every single movie in Hollywood goes through a color correction and grade right? Does that mean things went wrong or they messed up in pre-production production? Absolutely not!! Color is a just another (and very important) part of telling a story. At the very simplest level, adding contrast or saturation to certain parts of the images to draw your attention to a specific detail adds great value to your story. If you think you only need a colorist to "fix it in post", then I'm assuming you haven't worked with one before. I think you will be blown away when you work with a good one.
Jersey Filmmaker I hope they make good material even better, and use these instruments for creative purposes. Probably they plan their decisions during the preproduction. Not for repair shitty colors of a bad camera) They mostly use Alexas which has the best color reproduction in the industry)
Even sony understand their issues implementing a new venice color science in a new cameras.
Did you get that Red t-shirt for $1200? Lucky!
😂🤣😂
I see a HUGE difference in the detail and sharpness of her coat at 5:21, the FS7 sucks compared to the raven :0
Bullshit no where near 15k huge.
you can have brushed before breakfast..
The difference is barely noticeable lol
What lenses were used?
Alex Justin Canon L series 24-105mm
Rent whatever one you need to. You can't afford to buy them anyway.
The beginning gave me anxiety.
Seinfeld.
Does anyone here agree that RED looks like Film and Sony looks like Handycam?
great info but please can everyone please stop using Casey Neistat style and do something ORIGINAL... THX