I would definitely get a potential purchase on a ramp, they can look great on the outside but be quite rusty in the rear arches and underbody, there isnt much protection.
As someone that has always bought cars with my own money i would be all over one of these. Reliable, practical and real world performance are amazing for the money. Grwat video. 👍
Absolutely brilliant car. I owned a 2011 Type R GT with standard LSD for nearly 12 years. Amazing engine. Never used a drop of oil and only needed brakes and tyres. Had it serviced at main dealers all its life. I regret trading it in.
I bought one new in 2009. Sold it in 2014 to get a Monaro. Although the Monaro appeared to be better looks-wise and on paper, with a 5.7litre V8 etc, it was a disappointment. The Monaro had the worst gearshift action compared to the Honda. The Honda had better steering, clutch, seats, more usable space with the hatchback. I sold the Monaro last year and bought another Type R with low miles (35,000), 2007 model. It drives like a new car. The engine is so smooth it almost feels like it is shut off when idling.
You don't need overcomplicated muti link this and that. Look at the Peugeot 205, 309 and 306. All had a super comfy ride and handled superbly. They only had mcpherson struts up front and torsion beam at the rear. Simple suspension but executed well.
Different philosophies! Michelin Pilot Sport tyres (at least modern ones) have soft sidewalls too, to add to the typical French comfort whereas Japanese Bridgestone Potenza tyres (like those that originally came standard on this Civic Type R) have rock hard sidewalls to provide dry handling with no regard to comfort!
A rear torsion beam never harmed the Fiesta ST's reputation. Plus it made the FN2 & FK2 an extremely practical car, which helps to persuade your other half when it came to buying one.
It's buzzwords innit, motoring jounalists fall for them every time. I recall Clarkson saying the C6 Corvette had the same suspension design as a horse and cart because they're both leaf springs lol. There can be two cars that both have the "same" suspension design, both with multink or torsion beam or whatever, but one is great and one is terrible depending exactly how they implemented the design.
I had one of these and it was possibly the best driving car ive owned. It wasn’t the fastest or best handling, but the steering was perfect, gear change, pedals were perfectly weighted and the engine was a peach. It was just a very rewarding car to drive on normal roads. Sadly rust, a noisy gearbox and savage fuel economy necessitated a change in the end.
@@DB-eh4yk I'm surprised by the fuel economy comment - what did you change it for? Obviously they're not designed to be economy cars but I think for what they are they're not bad ,30mpg on a long journey is easily done
I had the 2.2D in the EX trim, comfy leather seats, 4-door, big glass sunroof, the magic seats in the back, and 40mpg - 0-60 in 8.4 seconds, plenty quick enough. However, they were notorious for wearing out their clutch, which mine did. Oh the whole, for 130,000 miles, I loved that Civic, the ride got too much for me, though, it is on the harsh side.
We never got this body style in the USA, only the previous Swindon-built 7th generation (EP3), and that was only sold as a sporty-ish DOHC 3 door known as the Si. They’re fairly uncommon, the 7th generation is the unloved one here as it was the generation that lost the double wishbones in front. The hatch wouldn’t return to the USA until the 10th generation, which is also when we got the Civic Type R for the first time.
switched from the ol' trusty alfa 146 1.4 to a mk8 Civic 1.8 a little over a year ago. Had a fair share of issues (more than the alfa..), but all in all I'm enjoying the extra horsepower and fuel economy. I do miss the alfa sometimes though...
16.58 no they're not they would be the heated seat switches-rear window switches sit exactly where you woukd expect, behind the fronts on the door! cup holders are in the cubby next to handbrake
The design of this generation Civic was great, it’s aged so well despite the risky design. They look tiny on the roads now but there was loads of space inside and the dash layout was very logical as well as fun. What let them down for me was poor build quality - my Type S GT had every known common fault - the folding mirror motor failed, the roof blind failed, the temperature sensor failed, the wiper motors failed, the steering rack needed replacing, even the CD player gave up and the clutch developed an annoying squeak. It was only 2.5 - 5 years old when I owned it. I gave up when the brakes were seizing and new callipers didn’t fix. I’ve always thought ‘what if’ about a facelift Type R though and that engine sounds amazing
Had an FN2 Type R GT and was a love / hate relationship! Yes I too banged my knee! Also couldn't reach the seat belt with the door closed and had to get steering wheel JUST right to see the speedo 😂
Compromises aside, Toshiyuki Okumoto achieved perfection in this design...and I dare say he had a hand in the Accord Euro as well. I gather he is no longer with the company because ever since Honda has descended into mediocrity and bland vanilla. Such a loss.
I had a 2.2 CDTI one of these when they were fairly new and it was a torque monster. I never got on with it though despite it having decent handling. I do like the Type R version although the one being tested is a festival of chavness with its fake carbon wrap on the bonnet and Maxton Tupperware glued to it. Wouldn't mind one in pure physical form.
How does the S type compare for suspension comfort? I'd love to know. The bottom of the back seats fold up on the 5 door version of these adding an extra level of practicality, possible the same on the 3 door?
i remember calling this the spaceship because of its looks when it was new. The current Civic is yet again much bigger, but I find the high performance version of that has gone way too far overboard with the body kit and spoilers, similar to the overblown custom jobs you got from aftermarket tuners in the 1980s and 1990s.
How quirky, the Type R might be the only UK made Japanese car ever being factory imported into Australia that I can think of. Here in Au a Gen8 Type R sells on average for £7,000 GBP. Benefit of it being less popular is many are still unmolested.
All 8th and 9th-gen Civic hatches sold in Australia (or anywhere) were made in the UK! They're all Swindon buddies, lol. The Nissan Qashqai/Dualis was another UK-made Japanese car sold in Australia.
Merry Christmas Matt, thank you for all your great videos in 2024, wishing you and your family a very special New Year and bring on 2025 and more of your videos
Reminds me of when I went to Santa pod , you heard this loud thing coming down the drag strip , anticipating something going by quickly, and there it slowly went , a hundred miles and hr slower than you were anticipating l o l , glad I swerved them and bought faster cars
Ha Ha . . . here's me watching for the first few minutes thinking that car is a rattle trap . . . turns out you're the rattle trap . . . mic location + plastic jacket = maligned Civic 🤣😂 Magic wee machines, I would happily have one in my garage !! Happy New Year !!👍👍👍
Always liked this generation of Civic. Remember the episode on Top Gear well were Clarkson burned this car down. Can't imagine it rides so bad. Great review Matt!
Both EP3 and FN2 type R were all built in the UK, even the ones for Japanese market (they were sold new in Japan aswell) which are slightly more powerful due to more aggressive cams if I remember correctly, and all of them have the LSD as standard. I often laugh at the idea of us building the best ones for them, and then half of them ending up coming back here anyway because for the longest time it was just as cheap to bring the better car over (and almost guarantee'd rust free). 🤣
There is cup holders in the front of the car, they are within the slot that opens below the gear stick that is between the front two seats. Please in future check things like this, before commenting that there is no cup holders.
My dad had one of these, as well as the previous version. Preferred the looks of this version, but will agree that the earlier one was the better car. Both made lots of noise but were not really all that fast.
That's a slightly non-Concours example Matt! A bit of a contrast to the mint example in the Honda heritage collection. It's not too bad if looked at from the distance of the exterior filming though. 🙂 Is that a RenaultSport metal gearknob instead of a Honda one? The standard radio replaced with a double DIN fascia but a single DIN radio? Carbon-fibre effect bonnet? Those Rage 19" alloys are not good IMO, they take the ride from bad to abominable (I put 17" wheels on mine instead). Someone has turned the cluster dimmer down (the dial on the left of the rev counter), the speedo & rev counter is not supposed to be that dim (it defaults to dim after changing or disconnecting the battery for some reason)! Thanks for the review! The sort of front cupholders are under that sliding cover on the centre console. Re: how low the car is... It's quite low as standard, but there are lowering springs available to lower it another 15mm (which I don't know why you'd ever fit, but people do). I don't agree that Honda ought to have gone turbo on this car! Still being NA is what makes it special and fun. Perhaps it could have had the K24 for more torque (and slightly lower revs) though, the Civic Si got a K24 from 2012-2015. This example car could be the basis for a cheap 750 Motor Club racing car perhaps? Despite not being very fast, the FN2 is a popular choice for a club racing car because it is fairly reliable and there are a lot of parts available (750MC is great because they use a power-to-weight formula, which allow for all kinds of cars to enter and have a chance, by adjusting power output and ballast to fit into different classes -- would great to see more Rovers and MG Rovers out there!). 🙂
Had a 07 diesel bought 3 mobths old with 3k on clock & sold 6 years later with 125k. Could easily cope with weekly trips up M6/M74 or A1 to Edinburgh and return 55 to gallon. Great car but changed jobs so didnt need diesel car so pt ex against wifey's new (ish) Juke 😢
The ride on all Mk8's is abysmal. Like, properly abysmal. Smooths out a bit at speed, but around town, it's miserable. You can get in any other car, even a sports car or one on coilovers and drive down a road you thought was terrible and feel like you're in a limo. Gets completely insufferable.
I've always liked this model of Type R love the styling the futuristic exterior & interior, I couldn't care less if people think it's the worst Honda I'd still own one.
I had a ep3 and loved it. Unfortunately they become fairly affordable and bought by little chavy boy racers. I got fed up of teenagers trying to race me at the lights so I sold it. 😔
Wouldn't like to do much mileage on todays roads as would get expensive constantly replacing those wheels and tyres, as well as attempting to ease the shocks up one's spine.
Like the review on the 2009 civic type R please can you do a review on the Honda crv black edition 2.0 petrol and 2.2 diesel from 2014 to 2015 please so I know which one i should buy.
@@ScottWard-k6rDon’t let the mileage on these concern you particularly. With a good history, these engines are bombproof. Mine has 118k on the clock and still drives like a 60-70K car.
Nearly looked at one a few years ago, but it was black (not a fan of black cars) it had a high mileage and looked ragged from a inch within it's life, wheels kerbed....Do I think it's the worst? No the one after that when it became a five door IMO is the worst. Loved the Family guy clip..... An excellent Review Matt, guess who is away to look at Auto Trader 😂😂
"No the one after that when it became a five door IMO is the worst." I like that one! The 9th-gen Civic hatch as that is, is just a facelift of the 8th-gen. The basic bodyshell is the same shape (apart from no more 3-door offering). I like that it is still a VW Golf-sized car. After Honda put independent rear suspension back with the next Civic, Honda had to make the car a *lot* bigger overall to keep the same cavernous cargo volume that these 8th and 9th-generation Civics achieved thanks to their Honda Jazz rear end (they were basically a Honda Civic sedan front architecture with a widened Honda Jazz middle & rear architecture, including the beam suspension and fuel tank under the front seats to make more boot space).
Even though its still the "worst" performance wise I think a sizeable percentage of jeremy Clarkson fanboys are somewhat responsible for this perceived opinion that these aren't very good. They still seemed to sell a lot of them though! These were sold in Japan by the way, just were rare as the JDM Type R (fd2) performed better Worth spending a bit more to get a nice one (rust is an issue on the subframe), and later models got an LSD, which is worth going for.
"Worse" is all relative! The FD2 is the much better track day car but I love my FN2. I had a DC5 Type R with no sound insulation (almost none at all! all the clickly clacky injector noises come straight through the uninsulated firewall) and the (even) harder suspension, and I think the FD2 Type R that also has those track day attributes would be too tiring as everyday car! While the FN2's suspension may be "intolerable" compared to the likes of Focus ST and Golf GTI (I tamed mine wiht 17" wheels), it's still lightyears more comfortable than a FD2 Type R which basically has rock hard aftermarket racing suspension as standard! I also have the version with the LSD which helps a lot with driving dynamics. Regarding the rear beam -- I love the huge interior space that the Honda Jazz rear platform provides! Besides Clio RSs, Megane RSs and Fiestas STs are all beam rear suspension -- the rear suspension isn't that important on a front wheel drive, the rear just follows along (granted a beam rear does produce a choppier ride). I know these cars have a Max Power reputation (as do the Focus ST, Golf GTI, Megane RS etc too to be fair) and there a lot of rough & modified examples out there, but I was lucky to buy my car from a middle-aged couple: bog-standard, low mileage with full dealer service history! 😃 That's the kind of Golf GTI demographic Honda were chasing when they made the car (a little) softer, full of toys like cruise control, and more civilised compared to the EP3 and Japanese Type R models.
@@furiousdriving Some very small numbers of the standard hatch were also sold in Australia, but they aren't common either. It's kind of ironic that the FD2 Civic Type R sedan is the rare car in the UK, whereas Civic sedans are very common in Australia and it's always a guessing game if a sedan Civic Type R is real or is a regular Civic sedan with a bodykit on it! Sedan FD2 Civic Type Rs they only became allowed for import in Australia in 2020, after some changes to relax the import rules -- they are very common in New Zealand though, which has more relasxed import rules. Also: imports built after April 2021 are being made to comply with the same Austalian Design Rule 85 side impact protection regulation that official imports need to meet (even a lot of modern full size cars like the Lexus IS were withdrawn from sale due to not meeting this specific regulation and no interest in re-engineering the car for it, in light of low sedan sales), so that means no more Kei car imports built after that date. Only Kei cars built before then are now allowed.🥲 I love Kei cars, everytime I see one they brighten my day! Such a shame to restrict their import, we should be encouraging people into smaller, lighter cars IMO, and consider waiving some of the safety regulations IMO.
You can get towards 250 BHP NA (or 275 BHP NA with a K24 bottom end and K20 head) but it gets very expensive, as it is all incremental gains! But the K20 is never going to perform it's best in an FN2 as the FN2 is relatively heavy (1310-1340kg) -- you'll get the best out of a K20 swapped into an older, lighter double wishbone Honda Civic or Integra, or a Lotus Elise or (blasphemy?) MG TF? Is it blasphemous to replace a Rover K with a Honda K in an MG TF or MG F? 😮 Come to think of it, a swap into a Rover 400 or MG ZS (the proper one) could probably even use standard swap engine mounts made for older Honda Civics... I'm not sure if that is blasphemous either... TBH I like Honda, but it's kind of boring when everything has a K20 or K24 swapped into it -- it's kind of like the Chevy LS of inline-four engine swaps, yawn. Much better to keep that Rover K or Rover KV6 goodness!
@@TassieLorenzocan get more than those numbers but yes gets expensive. My mate is running 260hp NA with bolt ons and cams. K24 frank engines again with cams top 300+ without issue.
Very under estimated these cars owned mine 8 years now, set up right these are better on track the. Ep3s took mine to.nurburging and it was absolutely mint on there
The engine in that car has become a legend. And rightly so. I had the Type R before this one (EP3) and it was brilliant. But everything else about this car is worse than the last version, it was slower, rode worse and performed worse than the one before, as well as looking like a fat blob on the road. Rightly derided. Glad to see the back of them.
Had a 2.2 tdi which was great, went like stink but the clutch was slipping like a bastard at 150k miles, would've cost half of what the car was worth so got traded in. It seemed to eat front bulbs and the glass fog lamps got smashed easily. The doors filled up with water as well, needed to take out the rubber grommets in the bottom of the doors to release all the rain water.
Strange u should mention the clutch on the 2.2 diesel version because the type r one is much cheaper. There are well known companies supplying and fitting a new exedy oem clutch in these for less than £400. And mines been supercharged for 7 years on that clutch
@robertbransby yes im aware of that was just pointing out the type r is actually cheap to replace. In fact my mechanic friend races his fn2 type r and his clutch failed on track in the morning. Got it up on jack stands and replaced it there at the track in a couple hours and went racing again in the afternoon lol.
Mk7 won't die. I had one. Only sold it cos it's a right hand drive and I live in Europe. It was still running great at 117k miles when I sold it. Have a mk8 now.
@@danmoney9932The only advantages I can see of having a Type S over a Type R are the fuel economy and the road tax, but as you currently drive an ST220, I can see that these aren’t particularly big issues for you! The Type R is in the same tax category as the ST220 and has slightly better fuel economy, but has a lot more get up and go. You’ll get addicted to the sound and feel of that VTec switchover, I can guarantee it!
@@TigerT72 that's the original commenter with the ford st, I've got a 1.8 civic. It's dull but dependable transport, it's not slow but not fast, the economy is very good for a 1.8 petrol though I feel. It has v-tec but eco v-tec (think the opposite effect almost to the type r engine!)
@@danmoney9932Sorry, my mistake. I’m sure the Type S has its benefits depending on your needs and as it’s a Honda will be 100% reliable, but as a ‘hot hatch’ the Type R is definitely the one to have.
Curious, why have 4 of the same car in succession? Do they get written of in crashes? Not a criticism Craig I read comments like this a lot and I'm genuinely intrigued.
Hahaha I love the title of this video… both asks and answers the question… Yes the worst Type R they made….therefore an absolute bargain…still a pretty decent car at the prices they’re going for but a type R by badge only
I must try one of these , purely for the engine. However, a better bargain is a gen6 Celica. They are a great drive and have an independent rear end. Nissan also cheaped out on the p11. P10 had an independent rear and drove far better than its successor.
@@furiousdriving Cool Car Lovely In red Real honda TyPe-R No Turbo Cool Style Door handle but I StIll Do Prefer 2000 Era EP,3 Door handle , are you havIn 2001 Model On your Channel 1-Day ?
Perhaps it has such a poor reputation because although it's good, it followed a better car. Firm suspensions are lovely for track days but would become tiresome for normal driving.
You're changing gears wrong 😂You need to be hitting VTEC in about 4k revs and then the smiles really begin ,People thinking this is a chav car are completely wrong, I'm middle - aged and I've owned one for years and I love it. Couldn't replace it with anything else unless I had 30k to spend. That would be as much fun. and it's also the best type R for the money. I likes the ep3 but it's like a bread van compared to this was a spaceship with so many more extras. I've got the GT pack. Even the sat nav is good it has speech control, cruise control , dual climate control and a loads more extras, plus you get Honda reliability. What's more fun than that when you can rag it around a track and a b-road and it will still keep going day in day out with a massive boot.
@@furiousdriving First gear redlines at about 60kph/37mph, second gear redlines at about 90kph/55mph. I think you are thinking of forth gear! 🙂 Actually 4000rpm is only 80mph in 6th gear! 6th gear in this car (70 mph @ 3500rpm) is equal to about 4th gear in a normal car, and there are 2 extra gears in between. If you don't keep the revs up in this car and instead change at "normal" rpm, it basically doesn't go anywhere at all -- you'll have made four gear changes and still be going 20 mph! 😂
@@TassieLorenzoI agree. I’ve owned a 2007 FN2 for about 5 years now and it took a while to adjust my driving style from a non-VTec engine to this one. When your motoring instinct is telling you to change gear, the VTec engine is just clearing its throat and getting ready for action! If you don’t hold each gear into at least the mid VTec zone, you will drop out of that zone when you change up to the next gear. These engines are bomb-proof and will take being red lined all day. Just monitor the oil level regularly, as some of them may burn a bit of oil. Mine used to do that, but for some reason just stopped doing it one day and hasn’t used a drop since!
I hated this generation of Civic Type R when it launched, with a passion. ...but now... It actually looks pretty good compared to the horror shows we've seen from that camp since, AND it has what i call a real Honda engine. They can stick their turbo engine where the sun doesn't shine, for all i care. So yeah.. Times sure has changed.
To be fair, the 2.0 turbo is the same 2.0 engine -- just with the cylinder head airflow completely choked down to allow for fast turbo spool up (small ports & small valves = low inertia, high air velocity and fast spool up, the opposite goal of an NA engine). The 1.5 turbo engine is the Honda Jazz engine with a turbo on it, which is very marginal in terms of strength unfortunately.
You get used to not needing to look around a B-pillar at junctions! That's a nice bonus of a 2-door/3-door with long doors IMO, it depends how often you use the rear seat.
It takes a bit of a shift in thinking moving to a VTec engined car, but once you get used to it, the VTec switchover becomes addictive! These engines are practically bombproof and will take being red lined all day, provided that you monitor your oil level regularly.
Not really the worst but maybe the most "Marmite" of the type R's. Spaceship styling and you had to drive it like you stole it. Fun but not a great daily. Well, not for me anyway.
It was/is the worst Honda Type R!! It was grossly overweight (its torque to weight was woeful!!). Honda decided to go backwards with it, and bolt on a cheap and nasty torsen beam rear axle. And its biggest nail in the coffin, was that it wasn't made in Japan, like every other Honda Type R, it was built in Swindon UK. But.....if owning a "classic" car, a "classic performance car" is all about the engine only. Then this little Honda did have that in spades.
Torque to weight has no correlation to performance. Just do the maths, only power to weight appears. From Newtonian physics, Power = Force * velocity, Force = mass * acceleration, *therefore* acceleration = Force / mass = Power / ( velocity * mass) I.e., acceleration = Power / (velocity * mass), this is independent of torque.
@@TassieLorenzo Wrong Torque to weight is what all cars use 80/90 per cent, when daily driven. Trucks and trains are perfect examples. In a big rig Diesel peak torque occurs at 975rpm while peak horsepower occurs at 1800rpm. Torque gets you up the hill, horsepower gets you down the road. Power to weight, peak power to weight is only produced at (in ICE car) high revs and high gear ratios. Which is not regularly reached at slow road speeds in traffic.
@@Mexxx65 Not at all. High torque at low rpm, *really means* high power at low rpm. It's really that it produces 200hp at 975rpm which makes the truck useful, and why you wouldn't want an F1 engine in a semi-trailer even if it makes the same 450hp at 11,000rpm (before going on to 750hp at 18,000rpm) where the truck engine makes 450hp at 1800rpm. Obviously the 2.4L F1 engine will only make ~37hp at 975rpm (if it will even run that slowly at all, which obviously it won't!). That's the REAL problem. That the Mercedes Actros makes so much more torque than the Mercedes F1 engine (peak 2200 Nm v peak 295Nm) is mainly just because the former is a 12.8L engine where the latter is a 2.4L, what you REALLY care about for trucking (what actually accelerates the load, like the equation I gave where ONLY power-to-weight appears not torque-to-weight) is the amount of power being produced just off idle and at low rpms like 975rpm. Power is fundamental to the rate of air and fuel being moved through the engine (obviously the Actros moves more air and fuel at low rpm because the displacement is 5x as large and it is turbocharged to bring air in at far above ambient pressure), which gives the rate the engine produces power (energy over time) and thus does useful work. You will see for yourself that torque to weight is never, ever quoted as it is physically meaningless. If you try to model 1/4 mile or lap times, torque-to-weight doesn't appear in the equations at all. When people talk about torque and torque curves, they are really using it as a proxy to talk about power curves without realising.
Whether or not it was your intention, you did a superb job of exposing just how terrible this car is. Driving, viewing, and owning this car looks like a (literally) painful, stressful, and offensive experience in almost every way.
The cup holders are in the cubby. They were just pushed back.
I would definitely get a potential purchase on a ramp, they can look great on the outside but be quite rusty in the rear arches and underbody, there isnt much protection.
A key and a button is not as irritating as finding your car was stolen because it was keyless entry.
I had a Mk8 Civic for many years, never once did I hurt my knee.
As someone that has always bought cars with my own money i would be all over one of these. Reliable, practical and real world performance are amazing for the money. Grwat video. 👍
Absolutely brilliant car. I owned a 2011 Type R GT with standard LSD for nearly 12 years. Amazing engine. Never used a drop of oil and only needed brakes and tyres. Had it serviced at main dealers all its life. I regret trading it in.
I bought one new in 2009. Sold it in 2014 to get a Monaro. Although the Monaro appeared to be better looks-wise and on paper, with a 5.7litre V8 etc, it was a disappointment. The Monaro had the worst gearshift action compared to the Honda. The Honda had better steering, clutch, seats, more usable space with the hatchback. I sold the Monaro last year and bought another Type R with low miles (35,000), 2007 model. It drives like a new car. The engine is so smooth it almost feels like it is shut off when idling.
You don't need overcomplicated muti link this and that.
Look at the Peugeot 205, 309 and 306. All had a super comfy ride and handled superbly. They only had mcpherson struts up front and torsion beam at the rear.
Simple suspension but executed well.
Very true! KISS - Keep It Simple Stoopid works most of the time
Different philosophies! Michelin Pilot Sport tyres (at least modern ones) have soft sidewalls too, to add to the typical French comfort whereas Japanese Bridgestone Potenza tyres (like those that originally came standard on this Civic Type R) have rock hard sidewalls to provide dry handling with no regard to comfort!
A rear torsion beam never harmed the Fiesta ST's reputation. Plus it made the FN2 & FK2 an extremely practical car, which helps to persuade your other half when it came to buying one.
It's buzzwords innit, motoring jounalists fall for them every time. I recall Clarkson saying the C6 Corvette had the same suspension design as a horse and cart because they're both leaf springs lol. There can be two cars that both have the "same" suspension design, both with multink or torsion beam or whatever, but one is great and one is terrible depending exactly how they implemented the design.
Whatever the suspension type the Frenchies knew how to make it comfortable!!!
Matt, the centre blind in the arm rest will reveal a flexible cupholder system at the front.
Down the country lanes??? No it has to be ragged around a KFC car park throwing a few hand brake turns 😅
Yes while listening to the streets and smoking weed 😂
I had one of these and it was possibly the best driving car ive owned. It wasn’t the fastest or best handling, but the steering was perfect, gear change, pedals were perfectly weighted and the engine was a peach. It was just a very rewarding car to drive on normal roads. Sadly rust, a noisy gearbox and savage fuel economy necessitated a change in the end.
@@DB-eh4yk I'm surprised by the fuel economy comment - what did you change it for? Obviously they're not designed to be economy cars but I think for what they are they're not bad ,30mpg on a long journey is easily done
This era of Civic has no business still looking so modern
I had the 2.2D in the EX trim, comfy leather seats, 4-door, big glass sunroof, the magic seats in the back, and 40mpg - 0-60 in 8.4 seconds, plenty quick enough. However, they were notorious for wearing out their clutch, which mine did. Oh the whole, for 130,000 miles, I loved that Civic, the ride got too much for me, though, it is on the harsh side.
We never got this body style in the USA, only the previous Swindon-built 7th generation (EP3), and that was only sold as a sporty-ish DOHC 3 door known as the Si. They’re fairly uncommon, the 7th generation is the unloved one here as it was the generation that lost the double wishbones in front. The hatch wouldn’t return to the USA until the 10th generation, which is also when we got the Civic Type R for the first time.
The design still looks futuristic. We never received the FN2 hatch here in the U.S., but even the sedan/saloon was modern.
Had one of these for 10 years , never bashed my knee
The start button was a welcome feature in 2009
Nobody wanted the turbo engine that came after😁
switched from the ol' trusty alfa 146 1.4 to a mk8 Civic 1.8 a little over a year ago. Had a fair share of issues (more than the alfa..), but all in all I'm enjoying the extra horsepower and fuel economy. I do miss the alfa sometimes though...
16.58 no they're not they would be the heated seat switches-rear window switches sit exactly where you woukd expect, behind the fronts on the door!
cup holders are in the cubby next to handbrake
The design of this generation Civic was great, it’s aged so well despite the risky design. They look tiny on the roads now but there was loads of space inside and the dash layout was very logical as well as fun. What let them down for me was poor build quality - my Type S GT had every known common fault - the folding mirror motor failed, the roof blind failed, the temperature sensor failed, the wiper motors failed, the steering rack needed replacing, even the CD player gave up and the clutch developed an annoying squeak. It was only 2.5 - 5 years old when I owned it. I gave up when the brakes were seizing and new callipers didn’t fix. I’ve always thought ‘what if’ about a facelift Type R though and that engine sounds amazing
Had an FN2 Type R GT and was a love / hate relationship!
Yes I too banged my knee! Also couldn't reach the seat belt with the door closed and had to get steering wheel JUST right to see the speedo 😂
Compromises aside, Toshiyuki Okumoto achieved perfection in this design...and I dare say he had a hand in the Accord Euro as well. I gather he is no longer with the company because ever since Honda has descended into mediocrity and bland vanilla. Such a loss.
I had a 2.2 CDTI one of these when they were fairly new and it was a torque monster. I never got on with it though despite it having decent handling.
I do like the Type R version although the one being tested is a festival of chavness with its fake carbon wrap on the bonnet and Maxton Tupperware glued to it.
Wouldn't mind one in pure physical form.
I had one very harsh ride poor fuel consumption
Fantastic Engine & throttle response , decent handling
Reminds me of Clarksons review, he said the door handles look like you'd find on a fridge and there were so many beeps for everything
the only thing myself does not like about them is way the gears a seated, the back seats a the same as the honda jazz fold both ways
Had my mk8 3 years now....never once have i hurt my knee gettting in or out....
I have had my MK8 17 years from new and only hurt my knee twice.
Had mine 6.5 years and not once done it
I have. But I'm lanky with long legs and hurt my knee on many things
The styling has aged very well. Great cars for the money.
How does the S type compare for suspension comfort? I'd love to know. The bottom of the back seats fold up on the 5 door version of these adding an extra level of practicality, possible the same on the 3 door?
I brought one a few years ago and absolutely loved it !!! It really didn’t deserve to be hated in the way that it did
i remember calling this the spaceship because of its looks when it was new. The current Civic is yet again much bigger, but I find the high performance version of that has gone way too far overboard with the body kit and spoilers, similar to the overblown custom jobs you got from aftermarket tuners in the 1980s and 1990s.
How quirky, the Type R might be the only UK made Japanese car ever being factory imported into Australia that I can think of. Here in Au a Gen8 Type R sells on average for £7,000 GBP. Benefit of it being less popular is many are still unmolested.
Meanwhile flogged out EP3s are going for twice that. Then FD2's for 3x that 😁
All 8th and 9th-gen Civic hatches sold in Australia (or anywhere) were made in the UK! They're all Swindon buddies, lol. The Nissan Qashqai/Dualis was another UK-made Japanese car sold in Australia.
@@TassieLorenzo 👍
Merry Christmas Matt, thank you for all your great videos in 2024, wishing you and your family a very special New Year and bring on 2025 and more of your videos
Reminds me of when I went to Santa pod , you heard this loud thing coming down the drag strip , anticipating something going by quickly, and there it slowly went , a hundred miles and hr slower than you were anticipating l o l , glad I swerved them and bought faster cars
Ha Ha . . . here's me watching for the first few minutes thinking that car is a rattle trap . . . turns out you're the rattle trap . . . mic location + plastic jacket = maligned Civic 🤣😂 Magic wee machines, I would happily have one in my garage !! Happy New Year !!👍👍👍
Always liked this generation of Civic. Remember the episode on Top Gear well were Clarkson burned this car down. Can't imagine it rides so bad. Great review Matt!
Both EP3 and FN2 type R were all built in the UK, even the ones for Japanese market (they were sold new in Japan aswell) which are slightly more powerful due to more aggressive cams if I remember correctly, and all of them have the LSD as standard. I often laugh at the idea of us building the best ones for them, and then half of them ending up coming back here anyway because for the longest time it was just as cheap to bring the better car over (and almost guarantee'd rust free). 🤣
There is cup holders in the front of the car, they are within the slot that opens below the gear stick that is between the front two seats. Please in future check things like this, before commenting that there is no cup holders.
Yes very misinformed review 😮 I would go as far as to say it has the best cup holders in any car I've been in
Relax bro it’s only an old fn
@@lassydogpie5390 facts are facts bro
theres also a cuphold / bottle hold section in the fore end of both the door cards
My dad had one of these, as well as the previous version. Preferred the looks of this version, but will agree that the earlier one was the better car. Both made lots of noise but were not really all that fast.
That's a slightly non-Concours example Matt! A bit of a contrast to the mint example in the Honda heritage collection. It's not too bad if looked at from the distance of the exterior filming though. 🙂 Is that a RenaultSport metal gearknob instead of a Honda one? The standard radio replaced with a double DIN fascia but a single DIN radio? Carbon-fibre effect bonnet? Those Rage 19" alloys are not good IMO, they take the ride from bad to abominable (I put 17" wheels on mine instead). Someone has turned the cluster dimmer down (the dial on the left of the rev counter), the speedo & rev counter is not supposed to be that dim (it defaults to dim after changing or disconnecting the battery for some reason)! Thanks for the review!
The sort of front cupholders are under that sliding cover on the centre console.
Re: how low the car is... It's quite low as standard, but there are lowering springs available to lower it another 15mm (which I don't know why you'd ever fit, but people do).
I don't agree that Honda ought to have gone turbo on this car! Still being NA is what makes it special and fun. Perhaps it could have had the K24 for more torque (and slightly lower revs) though, the Civic Si got a K24 from 2012-2015.
This example car could be the basis for a cheap 750 Motor Club racing car perhaps? Despite not being very fast, the FN2 is a popular choice for a club racing car because it is fairly reliable and there are a lot of parts available (750MC is great because they use a power-to-weight formula, which allow for all kinds of cars to enter and have a chance, by adjusting power output and ballast to fit into different classes -- would great to see more Rovers and MG Rovers out there!).
🙂
Had a 07 diesel bought 3 mobths old with 3k on clock & sold 6 years later with 125k. Could easily cope with weekly trips up M6/M74 or A1 to Edinburgh and return 55 to gallon. Great car but changed jobs so didnt need diesel car so pt ex against wifey's new (ish) Juke 😢
The ride on all Mk8's is abysmal. Like, properly abysmal. Smooths out a bit at speed, but around town, it's miserable. You can get in any other car, even a sports car or one on coilovers and drive down a road you thought was terrible and feel like you're in a limo. Gets completely insufferable.
I've always liked this model of Type R love the styling the futuristic exterior & interior, I couldn't care less if people think it's the worst Honda I'd still own one.
FN2 Is A Good Little Fun Wagon,
Had Mine Since 2009 To Date
the stupid thing is having a start button wen u can turn the key to start engine ? great sports seats
its a a slow car designed to feel fast...hence the racy start button.
@5:10 It is actually my favorite Honda Civic, the space shuttle.
Those 19" rage alloys make the ride even worse than the standard 18"
I had a ep3 and loved it. Unfortunately they become fairly affordable and bought by little chavy boy racers. I got fed up of teenagers trying to race me at the lights so I sold it. 😔
Was that an engine warning light 1:35?
Clarkson said that the door handle were off a 1950s fridge door
The gear knob looks wrong, I thought they were a titanium jobby. It was on my lads FN like on his EP3.
Wouldn't like to do much mileage on todays roads as would get expensive constantly replacing those wheels and tyres, as well as attempting to ease the shocks up one's spine.
Like the review on the 2009 civic type R please can you do a review on the Honda crv black edition 2.0 petrol and 2.2 diesel from 2014 to 2015 please so I know which one i should buy.
Why is the engine management light on?
unknown, there are no actual faults
@furiousdriving okay so I didn't watch all the way through you say car is going up forsale could you please let me know the price and miles please?👍
@@ScottWard-k6rDon’t let the mileage on these concern you particularly. With a good history, these engines are bombproof. Mine has 118k on the clock and still drives like a 60-70K car.
Nearly looked at one a few years ago, but it was black (not a fan of black cars) it had a high mileage and looked ragged from a inch within it's life, wheels kerbed....Do I think it's the worst? No the one after that when it became a five door IMO is the worst.
Loved the Family guy clip.....
An excellent Review Matt, guess who is away to look at Auto Trader 😂😂
It had to be Family Guy after that wallop! Check out Dad Skillz Cars as hes selling this soon!
"No the one after that when it became a five door IMO is the worst." I like that one! The 9th-gen Civic hatch as that is, is just a facelift of the 8th-gen. The basic bodyshell is the same shape (apart from no more 3-door offering). I like that it is still a VW Golf-sized car.
After Honda put independent rear suspension back with the next Civic, Honda had to make the car a *lot* bigger overall to keep the same cavernous cargo volume that these 8th and 9th-generation Civics achieved thanks to their Honda Jazz rear end (they were basically a Honda Civic sedan front architecture with a widened Honda Jazz middle & rear architecture, including the beam suspension and fuel tank under the front seats to make more boot space).
Love these type Rs. Quirky looks are always good in my book. And the sound of that engine! Reminds me a little of the Abarth i owned. Wonderful growl!
From "nought to court" in not many seconds.
I can picture the "Beige Bomber" aka Mr Lloyd, driving one like a hooligan in a tweed jacket.
The dashboard is revolting, I agree with the suspension, the steering is nice.
I’ve had mine for 7 years now I still love it
Even though its still the "worst" performance wise I think a sizeable percentage of jeremy Clarkson fanboys are somewhat responsible for this perceived opinion that these aren't very good. They still seemed to sell a lot of them though!
These were sold in Japan by the way, just were rare as the JDM Type R (fd2) performed better
Worth spending a bit more to get a nice one (rust is an issue on the subframe), and later models got an LSD, which is worth going for.
Its a bit of a confusing history, but I think the standard version of this car wasnt sold outside Europe, but the Type R was
@@furiousdrivingyes sorry, you are right, only the FN2 (this one) in limited numbers
"Worse" is all relative! The FD2 is the much better track day car but I love my FN2. I had a DC5 Type R with no sound insulation (almost none at all! all the clickly clacky injector noises come straight through the uninsulated firewall) and the (even) harder suspension, and I think the FD2 Type R that also has those track day attributes would be too tiring as everyday car!
While the FN2's suspension may be "intolerable" compared to the likes of Focus ST and Golf GTI (I tamed mine wiht 17" wheels), it's still lightyears more comfortable than a FD2 Type R which basically has rock hard aftermarket racing suspension as standard!
I also have the version with the LSD which helps a lot with driving dynamics. Regarding the rear beam -- I love the huge interior space that the Honda Jazz rear platform provides! Besides Clio RSs, Megane RSs and Fiestas STs are all beam rear suspension -- the rear suspension isn't that important on a front wheel drive, the rear just follows along (granted a beam rear does produce a choppier ride).
I know these cars have a Max Power reputation (as do the Focus ST, Golf GTI, Megane RS etc too to be fair) and there a lot of rough & modified examples out there, but I was lucky to buy my car from a middle-aged couple: bog-standard, low mileage with full dealer service history! 😃
That's the kind of Golf GTI demographic Honda were chasing when they made the car (a little) softer, full of toys like cruise control, and more civilised compared to the EP3 and Japanese Type R models.
@@furiousdriving Some very small numbers of the standard hatch were also sold in Australia, but they aren't common either. It's kind of ironic that the FD2 Civic Type R sedan is the rare car in the UK, whereas Civic sedans are very common in Australia and it's always a guessing game if a sedan Civic Type R is real or is a regular Civic sedan with a bodykit on it!
Sedan FD2 Civic Type Rs they only became allowed for import in Australia in 2020, after some changes to relax the import rules -- they are very common in New Zealand though, which has more relasxed import rules.
Also: imports built after April 2021 are being made to comply with the same Austalian Design Rule 85 side impact protection regulation that official imports need to meet (even a lot of modern full size cars like the Lexus IS were withdrawn from sale due to not meeting this specific regulation and no interest in re-engineering the car for it, in light of low sedan sales), so that means no more Kei car imports built after that date. Only Kei cars built before then are now allowed.🥲
I love Kei cars, everytime I see one they brighten my day! Such a shame to restrict their import, we should be encouraging people into smaller, lighter cars IMO, and consider waiving some of the safety regulations IMO.
For at least one of your older viewers that noisey jacket was intolerable...
Tuning a very lightweight front wheel drive car to over 400 BHP would make it virtually undriveable. Great car in standard spec though.
You can get towards 250 BHP NA (or 275 BHP NA with a K24 bottom end and K20 head) but it gets very expensive, as it is all incremental gains! But the K20 is never going to perform it's best in an FN2 as the FN2 is relatively heavy (1310-1340kg) -- you'll get the best out of a K20 swapped into an older, lighter double wishbone Honda Civic or Integra, or a Lotus Elise or (blasphemy?) MG TF?
Is it blasphemous to replace a Rover K with a Honda K in an MG TF or MG F? 😮
Come to think of it, a swap into a Rover 400 or MG ZS (the proper one) could probably even use standard swap engine mounts made for older Honda Civics... I'm not sure if that is blasphemous either...
TBH I like Honda, but it's kind of boring when everything has a K20 or K24 swapped into it -- it's kind of like the Chevy LS of inline-four engine swaps, yawn. Much better to keep that Rover K or Rover KV6 goodness!
Mines been running 340hp for 7 years so far without issue
@@TassieLorenzocan get more than those numbers but yes gets expensive. My mate is running 260hp NA with bolt ons and cams. K24 frank engines again with cams top 300+ without issue.
I like the space-ship looks of this model Civic. So much better than the "random spoilers & dangles at random angles" of the new one.
That's the old one now! There's a newer, more plain Civic since 2022.
Another great video has always matt and family 👍
thanks!
It’s like the Sauber f1 car of type Rs. Amazing car but against its close rivals not so great. Love the content
Very under estimated these cars owned mine 8 years now, set up right these are better on track the. Ep3s took mine to.nurburging and it was absolutely mint on there
Get rid of the silly 19’s and it’ll ride way better
They were a factory option. Not aftermarket.
Bit of a shed this one. It's also running optional bigger wheels that don't help the ride
The engine in that car has become a legend. And rightly so. I had the Type R before this one (EP3) and it was brilliant. But everything else about this car is worse than the last version, it was slower, rode worse and performed worse than the one before, as well as looking like a fat blob on the road. Rightly derided. Glad to see the back of them.
Had a 2.2 tdi which was great, went like stink but the clutch was slipping like a bastard at 150k miles, would've cost half of what the car was worth so got traded in. It seemed to eat front bulbs and the glass fog lamps got smashed easily. The doors filled up with water as well, needed to take out the rubber grommets in the bottom of the doors to release all the rain water.
Strange u should mention the clutch on the 2.2 diesel version because the type r one is much cheaper. There are well known companies supplying and fitting a new exedy oem clutch in these for less than £400. And mines been supercharged for 7 years on that clutch
@paullewis7287 the 2.2 diesel is dual mass flywheel as well which adds to the cost
@robertbransby yes im aware of that was just pointing out the type r is actually cheap to replace. In fact my mechanic friend races his fn2 type r and his clutch failed on track in the morning. Got it up on jack stands and replaced it there at the track in a couple hours and went racing again in the afternoon lol.
@paullewis7287 that's cool, I loved my civic and had it for nearly 10 years. Hated the designs since
May think of a Mk8 Civic after my Mk7 dies...good idea?
any civic is a good idea
@@furiousdrivinglove my mk7 but have no garage so it is slowly dissolving 😢😢
Mk7 won't die. I had one. Only sold it cos it's a right hand drive and I live in Europe. It was still running great at 117k miles when I sold it. Have a mk8 now.
@andic6676 Cavity wax and lanolin oil!
I currently have a ford st220 im thinking off selling it and buying one of these or the type S
If you get a Type S you’ll always regret not getting a Type R.
@@TigerT72 Indeed it has the styling of the type r but the engine from the boggo 1.8 which is a good engine but very dull.
@@danmoney9932The only advantages I can see of having a Type S over a Type R are the fuel economy and the road tax, but as you currently drive an ST220, I can see that these aren’t particularly big issues for you! The Type R is in the same tax category as the ST220 and has slightly better fuel economy, but has a lot more get up and go. You’ll get addicted to the sound and feel of that VTec switchover, I can guarantee it!
@@TigerT72 that's the original commenter with the ford st, I've got a 1.8 civic. It's dull but dependable transport, it's not slow but not fast, the economy is very good for a 1.8 petrol though I feel. It has v-tec but eco v-tec (think the opposite effect almost to the type r engine!)
@@danmoney9932Sorry, my mistake.
I’m sure the Type S has its benefits depending on your needs and as it’s a Honda will be 100% reliable, but as a ‘hot hatch’ the Type R is definitely the one to have.
I've had 4 of these over the years and looking to get another, as a weekend toy. For the money, they're absolutely superb cars.
Curious, why have 4 of the same car in succession? Do they get written of in crashes? Not a criticism Craig I read comments like this a lot and I'm genuinely intrigued.
@@AnyoneSeenMikeHunthe fancied a change but kept going back.. and he’s doing it again.. can’t go wrong for 3k
@@lassydogpie5390 👍
Hahaha I love the title of this video… both asks and answers the question… Yes the worst Type R they made….therefore an absolute bargain…still a pretty decent car at the prices they’re going for but a type R by badge only
I must try one of these , purely for the engine. However, a better bargain is a gen6 Celica. They are a great drive and have an independent rear end.
Nissan also cheaped out on the p11. P10 had an independent rear and drove far better than its successor.
8,000 RPM Red Line Free Revving engine, Sharp Steering, Taut Suspension and excellent Sports Seats.
Ay this sounds like a terrible Type R Lad.
Had one. It was a brilliant car, and the styling is still holding up today. Matt, this or a very broken and dangerous diesel Citroën Berlingo?
this every day (over a good Berlingo as well!)
@furiousdriving
Haha, when will he learn. 😂
@@furiousdriving Cool Car Lovely
In red Real honda TyPe-R No Turbo Cool Style Door handle but I StIll Do Prefer 2000
Era EP,3 Door
handle , are you havIn 2001 Model
On your Channel 1-Day ?
@@furiousdriving is there such a thing as a good berlingo !
I've owned 2 of these and they were great value for money
Perhaps it has such a poor reputation because although it's good, it followed a better car. Firm suspensions are lovely for track days but would become tiresome for normal driving.
You're changing gears wrong 😂You need to be hitting VTEC in about 4k revs and then the smiles really begin ,People thinking this is a chav car are completely wrong, I'm middle - aged and I've owned one for years and I love it. Couldn't replace it with anything else unless I had 30k to spend. That would be as much fun. and it's also the best type R for the money. I likes the ep3 but it's like a bread van compared to this was a spaceship with so many more extras. I've got the GT pack. Even the sat nav is good it has speech control, cruise control , dual climate control and a loads more extras, plus you get Honda reliability. What's more fun than that when you can rag it around a track and a b-road and it will still keep going day in day out with a massive boot.
4000 in 2nd is about 90!
@@furiousdriving First gear redlines at about 60kph/37mph, second gear redlines at about 90kph/55mph. I think you are thinking of forth gear! 🙂 Actually 4000rpm is only 80mph in 6th gear! 6th gear in this car (70 mph @ 3500rpm) is equal to about 4th gear in a normal car, and there are 2 extra gears in between. If you don't keep the revs up in this car and instead change at "normal" rpm, it basically doesn't go anywhere at all -- you'll have made four gear changes and still be going 20 mph! 😂
@@TassieLorenzoI agree. I’ve owned a 2007 FN2 for about 5 years now and it took a while to adjust my driving style from a non-VTec engine to this one. When your motoring instinct is telling you to change gear, the VTec engine is just clearing its throat and getting ready for action! If you don’t hold each gear into at least the mid VTec zone, you will drop out of that zone when you change up to the next gear. These engines are bomb-proof and will take being red lined all day. Just monitor the oil level regularly, as some of them may burn a bit of oil. Mine used to do that, but for some reason just stopped doing it one day and hasn’t used a drop since!
The Honda Hooligan.
15:49 beep! beep!
hahaaa...im 6 foot...own an fn2 5 years and never hit my knee on that
But it isn't a JDM car!!! As you say, this was a Europe and international model and Japan had a different model.
Yes - A K20 will make 400+hp. The rub is how long will it last?
Some of them are going strong with in excess of 300,000 kilometres. Very reliable engines.
Some have ran 200k on 400bhp
I hated this generation of Civic Type R when it launched, with a passion. ...but now... It actually looks pretty good compared to the horror shows we've seen from that camp since, AND it has what i call a real Honda engine. They can stick their turbo engine where the sun doesn't shine, for all i care. So yeah.. Times sure has changed.
To be fair, the 2.0 turbo is the same 2.0 engine -- just with the cylinder head airflow completely choked down to allow for fast turbo spool up (small ports & small valves = low inertia, high air velocity and fast spool up, the opposite goal of an NA engine). The 1.5 turbo engine is the Honda Jazz engine with a turbo on it, which is very marginal in terms of strength unfortunately.
Nice car but the 5 door is a lot more practical and looks good too
more practical but 3 door hot hatches always look better I think, more coupe like
You get used to not needing to look around a B-pillar at junctions! That's a nice bonus of a 2-door/3-door with long doors IMO, it depends how often you use the rear seat.
Don't you put your furious mugs on the dashboard anymore!!?? :D
Love the vtec noise but doesn't suit my driving style
Don’t be lazy hit the limiter
It takes a bit of a shift in thinking moving to a VTec engined car, but once you get used to it, the VTec switchover becomes addictive! These engines are practically bombproof and will take being red lined all day, provided that you monitor your oil level regularly.
Neet little car. We didn’t get them in America however. We didn’t get the type R til 2019?? I think
By your command, Matt. 😁👍
I have to disagree with Clarksons qoute I think there nice the ep3 I think are starting to look to boxy and small
VTEC, it just kicked in
I'd be embarrassed to give my car to you with the interior as filthy as that.. Bleurgh!
Not really the worst but maybe the most "Marmite" of the type R's. Spaceship styling and you had to drive it like you stole it. Fun but not a great daily. Well, not for me anyway.
It was/is the worst Honda Type R!! It was grossly overweight (its torque to weight was woeful!!). Honda decided to go backwards with it, and bolt on a cheap and nasty torsen beam rear axle. And its biggest nail in the coffin, was that it wasn't made in Japan, like every other Honda Type R, it was built in Swindon UK.
But.....if owning a "classic" car, a "classic performance car" is all about the engine only. Then this little Honda did have that in spades.
Torque to weight has no correlation to performance. Just do the maths, only power to weight appears. From Newtonian physics, Power = Force * velocity, Force = mass * acceleration, *therefore* acceleration = Force / mass = Power / ( velocity * mass)
I.e., acceleration = Power / (velocity * mass), this is independent of torque.
@@TassieLorenzo Wrong Torque to weight is what all cars use 80/90 per cent, when daily driven.
Trucks and trains are perfect examples.
In a big rig Diesel peak torque occurs at 975rpm while peak horsepower occurs at 1800rpm. Torque gets you up the hill, horsepower gets you down the road.
Power to weight, peak power to weight is only produced at (in ICE car) high revs and high gear ratios. Which is not regularly reached at slow road speeds in traffic.
@@Mexxx65 Not at all. High torque at low rpm, *really means* high power at low rpm. It's really that it produces 200hp at 975rpm which makes the truck useful, and why you wouldn't want an F1 engine in a semi-trailer even if it makes the same 450hp at 11,000rpm (before going on to 750hp at 18,000rpm) where the truck engine makes 450hp at 1800rpm.
Obviously the 2.4L F1 engine will only make ~37hp at 975rpm (if it will even run that slowly at all, which obviously it won't!). That's the REAL problem.
That the Mercedes Actros makes so much more torque than the Mercedes F1 engine (peak 2200 Nm v peak 295Nm) is mainly just because the former is a 12.8L engine where the latter is a 2.4L, what you REALLY care about for trucking (what actually accelerates the load, like the equation I gave where ONLY power-to-weight appears not torque-to-weight) is the amount of power being produced just off idle and at low rpms like 975rpm.
Power is fundamental to the rate of air and fuel being moved through the engine (obviously the Actros moves more air and fuel at low rpm because the displacement is 5x as large and it is turbocharged to bring air in at far above ambient pressure), which gives the rate the engine produces power (energy over time) and thus does useful work.
You will see for yourself that torque to weight is never, ever quoted as it is physically meaningless. If you try to model 1/4 mile or lap times, torque-to-weight doesn't appear in the equations at all.
When people talk about torque and torque curves, they are really using it as a proxy to talk about power curves without realising.
@@TassieLorenzo You wrong I am right. End of. Study your physics all over again. Torque to weight is currently where EV cars dominate.
Heavier than the Ep3 with 1 more hp👎🏾
It seems very noisy.
They were never known for being particularly refined.
Whether or not it was your intention, you did a superb job of exposing just how terrible this car is. Driving, viewing, and owning this car looks like a (literally) painful, stressful, and offensive experience in almost every way.
Thanks for all the videos in 2024 👍👍👍
Thanks for watching!
What's that "someone shaking a bag of crisps" noise ?