Tifo at its best. I'm now fully armed and ready to sound not like the simpleton I am but instead like an absolute Leeds expert and tactical master down the pub tonight.
@@micgreenson7308 Glory glory liverpooooooollllll, I support them bc when I was a lad they were the best team in the land. Some of us discuss football outside the big six matey 😮
I really like the use of game-state analysis in this video. That gave me a really clear picture about how Leeds deal with momentum, and momentum shifts, something I think is a really important context for understanding teams. Would be pleased to see more of that.
Interesting and informative analysis, yes, but completely lacking in actual team assessment, and so it is at best incomplete and therefore, largely useless. Just as are so many of the predictably droll comments in this section. The premise and title of the video itself are laughable. There's nothing wrong with Jesse Marsch at Leeds that some improved player performance can't fix, and the tactics have little to do with it. To that end, tactical analysis if you have played and/or coached it not that tough to do, and you can make it look really intelligent with the latest techie graphics and talking real fast. But without going up and down the squad and speaking to strengths and weaknesses of players, (ie, QUALITY) any analysis is hollow. For example, Give Marsch a real striker that scores goals and all of this is rendered nonsensical. A more contextualised analysis would have been to add in particular weaknesses and then look which player is mostly responsible in that part of the pitch and look at how a better player reacts to such and such tactical situation. The bottom line is if Leeds had a Guimares (38mil)playing the 10, or a Jesus (58mil) at striker, or Zinchenko (29mil) at LB they would be pushing for Europe while playing these tactics. Or, even more simply, if Bamford buried only a handful of his Prem-leading NINE missed big chances, the same: upper mid table pushing for Europe. The conclusion is that tweaks are needed in the system not because the system is flawed, but because the personnel are lacking to maximise its potential. And, yes, that better players are still needed, but that can't all happen in one window, like Forest bringing in 22 players---a disaster. So yes, fun video for the novice to understand the tactical system, but for arguing--much less proving---that Jesse Marsch isn't working at Leeds, well, the Liverpool match demonstrated what happens when players actually perform as a unit and as individuals. It takes time. And it takes talent---which Leeds need more of as they phase out the Championship players and continue to bring in upgrades. That's why it's called a "project." Love that away shirt. MOT
What a load of rubbish. You start out making it sound like Leeds is ONLY winning against miserable sides and you completely fail to mention (until 6:33 because well ... the truth) how Leeds FC has been winning and/or being a real threat against top sides. With just a few changed VAR calls or a few players converting some easy chances Leeds FC would comfortably be a mid table side (or higher). They are CREATING MANY chances. The system is working. Your analysis is naive and pretending to be tactical and informed. Just listen to the players. THEY CONTINUE TO BELIEVE. Not to mention Leeds has a game in hand AGAINST Nottingham Forest. If they took 3 points from this (as they are favoured) they'd be 11/12th in the Table and would you even be making this poorly thought out video? And your whole bit on "game state" is statistically irrelevant given the small numbers associated with your "states". Proper statistics anyone?
This is great. But maybe overanalyzed. Nobody can finish. Few defenders on Leeds roster can stop other teams from finishing. The team is lacking in talent in several key positions. That’s it. Marsch may be a fraud, or maybe he’s a decent Prem level manager, with a crap squad.
I think I know the answer to this one... in Marsch's last 3 jobs, he had an unlimited supply of Red Bull available to his team. Whereas at Leeds it's nothing but Yorkshire Gold or Leeds Pale... no wonder the team can't play with the same intensity...
I think the most effective and exciting part of our game under Bielsa was the attacking phase, more often using the wide areas, particularly the combination play between full back, winger and central midfielder.
@@aadesh7 I feel as though it's depressing on 2 levels - the first is the actual football and the second is that we know this is how Marsch wants us to play and therefore it isn't likely to get any better (which leads into the fact that the board knew how Marsch wanted to play before giving him the job and therefore they apparently want us to play this way too)
@@PeteSasqwax 100% .. its completely drab football. Nobody wants to hold possession and when they have possession they don’t know what to do with it. The forwards behave like pressing midfielders. Just aimlessly pressing. And lets not get started about the team selections. Why in the blue hell does Greenwood start ahead of proven talents like Geldhart!? It blows my mind. Its painful thinking about what it has come to since the high flying Bielsa days.
There's no denying we play pretty good against the top sides, i know Liverpool are in a slump and meslier had a sunrun but that's Chelsea arsenal and Liverpool we have absolutely bossed in a short window. ALAW
For me as a Leeds fan I think it just simply comes down to the tactics not working in the prem. From watching every game I can see that we do look good from an attacking point of view however our defence is not fit for this system. Our defenders are decent however they do not have the recovery pace for when we are cut open. I also think the system shuts down when we have attacked for so long that the oppositions defence becomes so congested to the point where we cant break through and score, this leads to us becoming predictable and wasting and turning over possession for the other team to counter attack.
Marsh is the ultimate prodigy of Raignick counter-pressing football. However this style have been neutralized and not as effective as it used to be. Nagelsmann moved away from it and Marsch’s own failure at RB Leizig also proved that.
It comes down to 3 things for me: lack of finishing, lack of recovery pace on defense, and lack of discipline/marking errors. The nature of Leeds press is that it relies on the entire team being dialed in and focused, not missing their triggers and it hasn't happened lately. The finishing hasn't been good for Leeds either. And the defense played an effective offside trap vs Chelsea which has disappeared lately, and they aren't quick enough to contain opposition forwards 1v1
@dau1024 You are entirely correct. Your post shows you are one of the few that really watches all of their matches. TifoIRL is awesome at examining tactical strategies, but lousy at criticizing the individual players. He could have said, "Leeds' center backs do not have the talent, ability or naus to defend direct long balls against elite EPL forwards, and Bamford is rusty and cannot score goals or penalty shots well at the moment. Leeds need to make big moves in the winter transfer window to improve these positions if they want to survive. Is the goalie really good enough in shot stopping and assertive enough to command the defense in front of him?" I guess he does not want to hurt feelings.
@@azaz8076 Agreed with all apart from Meslier, he's been great for us. Would change entire back four before thinking about his position, he has attribures to become a top keeper and is getting consistant game time at young age.
The two things Leeds simply had to do was massively strengthen their backline and sign a striker, they did neither. if don't address this is January they are getting relegated
Which player would you like us to buy who would have picked up Harvey Barnes and not left him entirely unmarked? The same happened against Brighton. John shows it in the video. Do yourself a favour and watch it. Who's good enough to sprint over to press on the left *and* get across and mark the guy on the right?
@@ardentspy Those types of attacks come from the fullbacks being so high in the counter-press. Drop the press back to the halfway line and pick up possession there. Also has the benefit of limiting those long diagonals into space.
15:02 This doesn't make sense. You already said earlier in the video that Leeds' attacking play falters when the opposition sits deep. Why would them sitting deep two goals up be different?
Ummm … the main thesis here is already total bullocks. Leeds fc has not lost to ANY of the teams in the bottom 7 positions. All this analysis and already the main points are irrelevant. Nice try!
This system is so uneasily undone with apparently no plan B. Add to that, our forwards - particularly Bamford - inability to score and this is a recipe for relegation.
Here after winning 2 since this video was made, and sitting mid table. Have Leeds made changes since your analysis? Would be cool to see the contrast and changes they’ve made. Thanks for the great content!
Bamford is a huge problem. 9 big chances missed, 0 goals. Almost entirely thanks to him Leeds have the 4th worst ratio of goals to big chances missed in the PL at 1.307, with Bamford contributing 9 of the 17 they've missed. If he'd even scored two of those 9 big chances missed, Leeds would shift from the 4th worst to 8th worst in that stat. after one season of impressive form he's gone back to the striker that at least in goalscoring terms looked out of depth in the championship.
Having watched Leeds versus Arsenal, I got the impression that they were the better team, but that this pretty much only was due to having an insane intensity, an intensity that - simply put - is no way near sustainable over several games, and which I there and then conjectured would result in that they’d struggle the next matchday. They lost their next game, against Leicester. I suspect that pressing teams have to reconfigure and become more controlling possession teams if they want to remain competitive at the upper ends of the table, because controlling games through intensity, pressing alone seems to just wear players down, gobbling up players through amassing injuries (assets for the club), and creating inevitable, steep dips in form.
Is this just observed or have you talked to the manager or attended training sessions; it would be good to hear what Jesse thinks of this summation. They looked doomed to me at the moment though
The Red Bull style is not a secret. Jesse would agree with this summation although he probably hasn't thought it through in this detail because he appears not to have a clue about football. But this is how Hassenhuetl likes to play as well and how Rangnick, who invented it, plays.
@@ardentspy Hassenhutl has moved away from the Red Bull style this season at Southampton and is playing a far less aggressive pressing, more possession based brand of football.
@@rafekatchadorian465 eh, kinda but not really. Bielsa has a very intense man to man press around the pitch and marsch has a more refined press usually with the front line dropping off and waiting for a pressing trigger before committing higher.
The big issue is the shambolic transfer windows by the board since we got promoted - people will point at we made signings but we needed a LB, CDM, CAM and at least a fairly able striker. This was not done and after last season this was utter failure and negligence by the board. There are some issues with tactics, subs and some of the existing players just don't have it - there is still a love in for our 'championship players' who in the light of day were pushed up majorly by Bielsa, this was not sustainable - hence we needed a major squad refresh.
Acknowledging the fact that Aaronson, Roca and Adams might not be the AM and CDM's you could've hoped for, I find it hard to believe that it could've been much better or that you could've recieved more backing in a post-covid window. And isn't Pascal Struijk one of your best performing players? You got a young talented squad, and the drop-down to championship might actually benefit them... And then I'll hope you'll be back the following year ;)
I would think that Aaronson, Roca and Adams are all upgrades to what you had there previously and they all have done well for what is their first season in the new league...but i agree that the "championship" players are the real problem here and its obvious that the squad quality is not there...you cant buy a whole new squad in a single window...i wish you persist with Marsch because the team is still playing/fighting more competitively than they did under Bielsa's last season
We bought 2 CDMs and a CAM in Aaronson but Sinisterra can also play there and they also happen to have been our best players this season. No striker and LB are big blunders but acting like we haven’t bolstered midfield is just wrong
@@godisdeadist Struijk is meant to be a CB but is having to cover LB because Firpo is awful. If we had a better LB with a CB pairing of Struijk and Koch our defence would be much better
xGD in a drawing state 12th. Fulham, -0.16 13th. Everton, -0.31 14th. Villa, -0.32 15th. Bournemouth, -0.35 16th. Liverpool, -0.35 17th. Leeds, -0.39 18th. Palace, -0.43 19th. Saints, -0.53 20th. Forest, -0.53 out of the bottom 9, you'd expect them all to be there except Liverpool what exactly do you expect from Leeds and Marsch, they're a bottom half team performing like one, he's just lost Raphinha & Phillips and hasn't had a third of a season yet
I remember in my FIFA 22 save for Leeds in my 2nd season now; didn't sell Phillips (Sold Raphinia) but one of my first transfer goals was obtaining proper fullbacks, a proper CDM (Onana from Lille) and a future replacement for Rodrigo (Octavian Popescu?). Also sold Cooper and traded Koch for Kristoffer Ajer from Brentford (not a bad deal imo as I like CBs with pace). Because the squad I inherited was just under-par to really compete. IRL it still is. Leeds have a team that isn't terrible but not great, injuries and lacking squad depth. Playing an LCB at LB isn't ideal. Harrison might end up joining Newcastle by next year. Bamford is talented but injury prone. Some great new players but probably not enough to avoid a relegation battle.
I still don't get why they even hired him in the first place. Coached the worst Salzburg team I've seen in the Bundesliga in many years and was a total disaster in Leipzig. Perfect example of failing upwards.
Just a thought.. With the "system coaches", could it be that people may disproportionately associate a team's failings to the players' ability? Whereby it is assumed that should the "system coach" be given access to "better" players, the system would work?
@@lukemclellan2141 It's an interesting question. Leeds currently have two sets of fans. One thinks Marsch is a clever tactician being let down because Leeds only spent a hundred mill on players and it just wasn't enough. Other sides with the same resources beat us and we were robbed because we didn't buy world-class defenders. The other has a clue about football and knows bad when they see it. You get it even in the comment section on this video, which is actually kind to Marsch, where John shows that it doesn't matter who the defenders are, we'd still give away the same goals against teams like Leicester, who simply had the simple good sense to cross the ball to the totally unmarked player in our box, and that totally unmarked player will always exist so the defence *has to* trap the opposition and hope they don't the ability to pass quickly. Which might work in Austria, where teams are pedestrian and awful, but in England, well, good luck.
they constantly show a good performance against big clubs, like they did against arsenal and chelsea. This represents that their tactical potential is very high.
Seems odd he mentioned the big chances they give up but not the big chances missed which they gotta be up there Bamford has like 10 big chances missed alone this season 😂
How come you and me and thousands of LUFC fans can see what's going wrong but the board and coaches can't or they are and can't afford or won't change things.
Love this. Really comes down to a team that wants to counter attack/create off turnovers. If turnovers don’t come or the other team just sits back and makes them break down a low block they can’t.
As an American gunner (release the hounds....) Leeds under Marsch remind me of Arsenal (or Brighton) of the last few seasons. Good at creating chances at both ends of the pitch, but lacking finishing. Jon's analysis is clearly much better than mine, but FWIW, the biggest issue does seem to be personnel: Raphina is gone and Bamford is a shadow of his 20/21 self. Thoroughly enjoyed the Game State deep dive, but I think all the conversations would be different if even 20% more of their (big only) chances were converted. They just can't score when they're in good positions. Anyway, as an American but also a fan of the style of play, I hope they give Marsch more time, if only because (unlike Villa) it's difficult to think of who could convert this squad into higher performers (unless Orta could somehow hypnotize Poch).
Jon, the TifoIRL presenter, forgot to mention solutions to make the system work. Specifically, upgrades at center back to players that can aggressively win and clear incoming direct long ball plays. Also, and obviously, a new center forward since Bamford is rusty, not converting chances or penalties, and is injury prone. Is the goalie really a good shot stopper or assertive enough to command the defense in front of him? Do the Leeds owners have good enough recruiting/scouting staff and the money to upgrade during the December transfer window?
The reason it's not working is that people like you pulled apart Bielsa and helped push the idea that he was no good. Who do you think you are with your tactics board? You stand there in your Leeds shirt, but you're an enemy within who was spreading poison against Bielsa last season. You wanna go working for the tabloids and stirring up trouble then go and do it for another club like Hay and Pope who are not Leeds fans.
rubbish clive. i am a fan for 50 yrs and i find his analysis is convincing. he has no agenda. and what he says makes sense. to avoid relegation last year something needed to change - that was obvious - i think the great man had done his work. shame we could not build on it
Absolute gold. Great analysis. Its so interesting to see different styles of play work or fail depending on the approach of the opposition. Will the 'philosophy' approach be over taken by teams flexible enough to adapt the perfect counter tactic to whomever they are playing?
He's out of his depth I'm sure if he did away with this crap playing narrow and trying to overrun opponents through the middle so we then get ripped apart on the Wings etc, we want to go Portuguese and get Jorge Jesus who's currently at the top of the Turkish league since 09 he's won Portuguese league 4 times in his first 6 seasons at Benfica his win rate was 75% then sporting 3 seasons 65% 2nd period of 3 seasons at Benfica 63% he's also won the league in Brazil with a win rate of 70% win the Saudi league with a win rate of 80% his first 6 seasons at Benfica he was Rodders manager if not Jesus Abel Ferreira his won Copa libertadores twice in the last 2 seasons after walking out at Poak Athens when he finished 2nd they are both winning Machines and play attacking football.
its not working because he cannot get his ideas across to the players and therefore they don't know what they are doing on the pitch. This is the reason their confidence is shot. Add to this Marsch's limited awareness and tactical flexibility is a recipe for relegation. the players must get tired of all the empty words of positivity that have clearly mounted to nothing
I feel like Newcastle have a somewhat similar problem but to a significantly lesser extent. They've got a similar pattern of getting good results against top teams and relatively underwhelming results against Bournemouth, Palace and Wolves. Albeit Newcastle seem to have the quality to a) not ship goals against the relatively weaker teams and b) get a breakthrough with a piece of individual skill like against Forrest.
We should’ve won the palace game if not for a mindblowing VAR decision, Wolves we just started slow in the first half + Wolves where actually playing decent football and had more possession
@@olliem99 yeah I don't disagree with us being unlucky early in the season in a couple games, and any draw is for sure going to hinge on a few key moments, but given the results against Spurs and Man City we potentially should be hammering a Palace or a Wolves to the point where one bad decision shouldn't matter. (A lot of teams have been inconsistent this season so I think that's part of it). And I think Howe (as compared to Marsch) is much better at only using counter-pressing when it's advantageous to Newcastle, though this is mostly due to Newcastle by having better players and more options than Leeds. But the limitations of counter-pressing that are highlighted are systemic and it's somewhat important for us as fans not to get frustrated if we don't look quite so 'on the front foot' against a mid or lower table team as we do against a City or a Spurs.
![[TH] FS vs BME - VCT Ascension Pacific - Lower Bracket Final](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/wnygqsR2Fig/mqdefault.jpg)
Tifo at its best. I'm now fully armed and ready to sound not like the simpleton I am but instead like an absolute Leeds expert and tactical master down the pub tonight.
Bit sad but each to their own
Did you see that ludicrous display last night?
@@hardy_har See the problem with Leeds is they always try to run it in
@@micgreenson7308 Glory glory liverpooooooollllll, I support them bc when I was a lad they were the best team in the land. Some of us discuss football outside the big six matey 😮
@@whittaboi ??
Good timing on this
this aged rather well
Then they beat Liverpool 🤣🤣🤣
Forest can beat Liverpool though. Doesn't mean anything
@@ian_r125 means they did something Man City can't
In summary Leeds need better players
Yes! The narrator forgot to mention solutions.
Specifically, upgrades at center back, center forward, and maybe goalie.
I really like the use of game-state analysis in this video. That gave me a really clear picture about how Leeds deal with momentum, and momentum shifts, something I think is a really important context for understanding teams. Would be pleased to see more of that.
Be interested to see the game states for each of the last two seasons too
@@liamcowling9906 maybe if you looked at multiple seasons you'd get enough data for this kind of analysis to actually mean something 🤣
Interesting and informative analysis, yes, but completely lacking in actual team assessment, and so it is at best incomplete and therefore, largely useless. Just as are so many of the predictably droll comments in this section.
The premise and title of the video itself are laughable. There's nothing wrong with Jesse Marsch at Leeds that some improved player performance can't fix, and the tactics have little to do with it.
To that end, tactical analysis if you have played and/or coached it not that tough to do, and you can make it look really intelligent with the latest techie graphics and talking real fast. But without going up and down the squad and speaking to strengths and weaknesses of players, (ie, QUALITY) any analysis is hollow.
For example, Give Marsch a real striker that scores goals and all of this is rendered nonsensical. A more contextualised analysis would have been to add in particular weaknesses and then look which player is mostly responsible in that part of the pitch and look at how a better player reacts to such and such tactical situation.
The bottom line is if Leeds had a Guimares (38mil)playing the 10, or a Jesus (58mil) at striker, or Zinchenko (29mil) at LB they would be pushing for Europe while playing these tactics. Or, even more simply, if Bamford buried only a handful of his Prem-leading NINE missed big chances, the same: upper mid table pushing for Europe.
The conclusion is that tweaks are needed in the system not because the system is flawed, but because the personnel are lacking to maximise its potential. And, yes, that better players are still needed, but that can't all happen in one window, like Forest bringing in 22 players---a disaster.
So yes, fun video for the novice to understand the tactical system, but for arguing--much less proving---that Jesse Marsch isn't working at Leeds, well, the Liverpool match demonstrated what happens when players actually perform as a unit and as individuals.
It takes time. And it takes talent---which Leeds need more of as they phase out the Championship players and continue to bring in upgrades. That's why it's called a "project."
Love that away shirt. MOT
What a load of rubbish. You start out making it sound like Leeds is ONLY winning against miserable sides and you completely fail to mention (until 6:33 because well ... the truth) how Leeds FC has been winning and/or being a real threat against top sides. With just a few changed VAR calls or a few players converting some easy chances Leeds FC would comfortably be a mid table side (or higher). They are CREATING MANY chances. The system is working. Your analysis is naive and pretending to be tactical and informed. Just listen to the players. THEY CONTINUE TO BELIEVE. Not to mention Leeds has a game in hand AGAINST Nottingham Forest. If they took 3 points from this (as they are favoured) they'd be 11/12th in the Table and would you even be making this poorly thought out video? And your whole bit on "game state" is statistically irrelevant given the small numbers associated with your "states". Proper statistics anyone?
Use this as an LOL button
This video is outdated a day later
This is great. But maybe overanalyzed. Nobody can finish. Few defenders on Leeds roster can stop other teams from finishing. The team is lacking in talent in several key positions. That’s it. Marsch may be a fraud, or maybe he’s a decent Prem level manager, with a crap squad.
Excellent video, Jon. Will you be doing another on how to solve our problems in the PL? Asking for Jesse Marsch
leeds players dont fit his system
Bamford can't finish in a prostitute
@@ektran4205 he has bought alot of those players
@@joeycullagh123 he only bought 5 players most of the roster are bielsa's players
Marsch and Leeds aren’t working? Tell that to Liverpool. 😎 MOT
This didn’t age well. 😂
Aged well mate
What does the pro-Liverpool Tifo say about Leeds now?
Delete
And then they won at Anfield so….. lol
Why Klopp and Liverpool isn't working when??? 😂
Eat your words pal 🤣
This aged well. 😂 the team doesn’t have good enough players overall. Simple enough
I think I know the answer to this one... in Marsch's last 3 jobs, he had an unlimited supply of Red Bull available to his team. Whereas at Leeds it's nothing but Yorkshire Gold or Leeds Pale... no wonder the team can't play with the same intensity...
Brenden Aaronson and Tyler Adams on red bull would probably explode
This did not age well
This aged well
well he did say that their style of play is kind of successful agaginst the big teams that they're not expected to take points from
Liverpool just got soccer’d
Didn’t age the best
I think the most effective and exciting part of our game under Bielsa was the attacking phase, more often using the wide areas, particularly the combination play between full back, winger and central midfielder.
This is a very good analysis. You have understood the problem better than the entire coaching staff at Leeds.
😂 upsettingly true
@@PeteSasqwaxyea man. Its depressing to watch Leeds at the moment.
@@aadesh7 I feel as though it's depressing on 2 levels - the first is the actual football and the second is that we know this is how Marsch wants us to play and therefore it isn't likely to get any better (which leads into the fact that the board knew how Marsch wanted to play before giving him the job and therefore they apparently want us to play this way too)
@@PeteSasqwax 100% .. its completely drab football. Nobody wants to hold possession and when they have possession they don’t know what to do with it. The forwards behave like pressing midfielders. Just aimlessly pressing. And lets not get started about the team selections. Why in the blue hell does Greenwood start ahead of proven talents like Geldhart!? It blows my mind. Its painful thinking about what it has come to since the high flying Bielsa days.
Its crazy that people really believe that
There's no denying we play pretty good against the top sides, i know Liverpool are in a slump and meslier had a sunrun but that's Chelsea arsenal and Liverpool we have absolutely bossed in a short window. ALAW
For me as a Leeds fan I think it just simply comes down to the tactics not working in the prem. From watching every game I can see that we do look good from an attacking point of view however our defence is not fit for this system. Our defenders are decent however they do not have the recovery pace for when we are cut open. I also think the system shuts down when we have attacked for so long that the oppositions defence becomes so congested to the point where we cant break through and score, this leads to us becoming predictable and wasting and turning over possession for the other team to counter attack.
Aged well
joke channel
So, losing quality and not replacing it has very little to do with it? Got it.
Marsh is the ultimate prodigy of Raignick counter-pressing football. However this style have been neutralized and not as effective as it used to be.
Nagelsmann moved away from it and Marsch’s own failure at RB Leizig also proved that.
Let's be honest, Marsch wasn't given nearly enough time to be able to rectify or move away from that style.
It comes down to 3 things for me: lack of finishing, lack of recovery pace on defense, and lack of discipline/marking errors. The nature of Leeds press is that it relies on the entire team being dialed in and focused, not missing their triggers and it hasn't happened lately. The finishing hasn't been good for Leeds either. And the defense played an effective offside trap vs Chelsea which has disappeared lately, and they aren't quick enough to contain opposition forwards 1v1
The missed chances have been abysmal this season. The forwards seem to choke everytime they have a chance to score.
@dau1024 You are entirely correct. Your post shows you are one of the few that really watches all of their matches.
TifoIRL is awesome at examining tactical strategies, but lousy at criticizing the individual players. He could have said, "Leeds' center backs do not have the talent, ability or naus to defend direct long balls against elite EPL forwards, and Bamford is rusty and cannot score goals or penalty shots well at the moment. Leeds need to make big moves in the winter transfer window to improve these positions if they want to survive. Is the goalie really good enough in shot stopping and assertive enough to command the defense in front of him?"
I guess he does not want to hurt feelings.
@@azaz8076 Agreed with all apart from Meslier, he's been great for us. Would change entire back four before thinking about his position, he has attribures to become a top keeper and is getting consistant game time at young age.
good timing on the video I think Jesse Marsch must have watched this 😂
Leeds watched this and decided to beat Liverpool
Lul
Still beat a team that won the league and the champions league in the last few years.
This aged well
@through liverpool are midtable
This aged well. Won the last two exciting games.
This aged very well
"They just beat Liverpool" ...Is there a worse flex than that
The two things Leeds simply had to do was massively strengthen their backline and sign a striker, they did neither. if don't address this is January they are getting relegated
Which player would you like us to buy who would have picked up Harvey Barnes and not left him entirely unmarked? The same happened against Brighton. John shows it in the video. Do yourself a favour and watch it. Who's good enough to sprint over to press on the left *and* get across and mark the guy on the right?
@@ardentspy Those types of attacks come from the fullbacks being so high in the counter-press. Drop the press back to the halfway line and pick up possession there. Also has the benefit of limiting those long diagonals into space.
@@marrked646 yep like it
15:02
This doesn't make sense. You already said earlier in the video that Leeds' attacking play falters when the opposition sits deep. Why would them sitting deep two goals up be different?
Ummm … the main thesis here is already total bullocks. Leeds fc has not lost to ANY of the teams in the bottom 7 positions. All this analysis and already the main points are irrelevant. Nice try!
Brilliant timing
This system is so uneasily undone with apparently no plan B. Add to that, our forwards - particularly Bamford - inability to score and this is a recipe for relegation.
I wonder how this would be different if made today 😂
Here after winning 2 since this video was made, and sitting mid table. Have Leeds made changes since your analysis? Would be cool to see the contrast and changes they’ve made. Thanks for the great content!
Sacked now
@@r3zaful Yeah, apparently only got worse. Lol
Bamford is a huge problem.
9 big chances missed, 0 goals.
Almost entirely thanks to him Leeds have the 4th worst ratio of goals to big chances missed in the PL at 1.307, with Bamford contributing 9 of the 17 they've missed.
If he'd even scored two of those 9 big chances missed, Leeds would shift from the 4th worst to 8th worst in that stat.
after one season of impressive form he's gone back to the striker that at least in goalscoring terms looked out of depth in the championship.
Having watched Leeds versus Arsenal, I got the impression that they were the better team, but that this pretty much only was due to having an insane intensity, an intensity that - simply put - is no way near sustainable over several games, and which I there and then conjectured would result in that they’d struggle the next matchday. They lost their next game, against Leicester. I suspect that pressing teams have to reconfigure and become more controlling possession teams if they want to remain competitive at the upper ends of the table, because controlling games through intensity, pressing alone seems to just wear players down, gobbling up players through amassing injuries (assets for the club), and creating inevitable, steep dips in form.
You mean we should play like we did under Bielsa?
Since this video Leeds have beaten Liverpool and Bournemouth
Liverpool smashed by leeds
Is this just observed or have you talked to the manager or attended training sessions; it would be good to hear what Jesse thinks of this summation. They looked doomed to me at the moment though
The Red Bull style is not a secret. Jesse would agree with this summation although he probably hasn't thought it through in this detail because he appears not to have a clue about football. But this is how Hassenhuetl likes to play as well and how Rangnick, who invented it, plays.
@@ardentspy didn't they also have a similar play style under Bielsa where they pressed very high?
@@ardentspy Hassenhutl has moved away from the Red Bull style this season at Southampton and is playing a far less aggressive pressing, more possession based brand of football.
@@areebsiddiqui758 Yes, but it's how he began with Southampton and it didn't work. He's attempted to fix it a bit this season.
@@rafekatchadorian465 eh, kinda but not really. Bielsa has a very intense man to man press around the pitch and marsch has a more refined press usually with the front line dropping off and waiting for a pressing trigger before committing higher.
Make a "why .... is crap" just before each liverpool game for their opponents 😂😂😂😂
You broke it down very well and it reaffirmed my belief it’s a stupid ethos & woeful system being played by half rate players
The big issue is the shambolic transfer windows by the board since we got promoted - people will point at we made signings but we needed a LB, CDM, CAM and at least a fairly able striker. This was not done and after last season this was utter failure and negligence by the board. There are some issues with tactics, subs and some of the existing players just don't have it - there is still a love in for our 'championship players' who in the light of day were pushed up majorly by Bielsa, this was not sustainable - hence we needed a major squad refresh.
Acknowledging the fact that Aaronson, Roca and Adams might not be the AM and CDM's you could've hoped for, I find it hard to believe that it could've been much better or that you could've recieved more backing in a post-covid window.
And isn't Pascal Struijk one of your best performing players?
You got a young talented squad, and the drop-down to championship might actually benefit them... And then I'll hope you'll be back the following year ;)
I would think that Aaronson, Roca and Adams are all upgrades to what you had there previously and they all have done well for what is their first season in the new league...but i agree that the "championship" players are the real problem here and its obvious that the squad quality is not there...you cant buy a whole new squad in a single window...i wish you persist with Marsch because the team is still playing/fighting more competitively than they did under Bielsa's last season
We bought 2 CDMs and a CAM in Aaronson but Sinisterra can also play there and they also happen to have been our best players this season.
No striker and LB are big blunders but acting like we haven’t bolstered midfield is just wrong
@@godisdeadist Struijk is meant to be a CB but is having to cover LB because Firpo is awful. If we had a better LB with a CB pairing of Struijk and Koch our defence would be much better
This aged well 🙈
That's not even Leeds' starting lineup holy cow. Aaronson is locked in at CAM, Sinisterra/Harrison line up accordingly
I would like to see more analysis focusing on the metrics of chances created. There is more to dig into there. Love the analysis!
Villa had a worse record under Gerrard
4 wins in 22 and 2 of those wins against Norwich and burnley last season who were both relegated
xGD in a drawing state
12th. Fulham, -0.16
13th. Everton, -0.31
14th. Villa, -0.32
15th. Bournemouth, -0.35
16th. Liverpool, -0.35
17th. Leeds, -0.39
18th. Palace, -0.43
19th. Saints, -0.53
20th. Forest, -0.53
out of the bottom 9, you'd expect them all to be there except Liverpool
what exactly do you expect from Leeds and Marsch, they're a bottom half team performing like one, he's just lost Raphinha & Phillips and hasn't had a third of a season yet
HUGE WIN!!!
I remember in my FIFA 22 save for Leeds in my 2nd season now; didn't sell Phillips (Sold Raphinia) but one of my first transfer goals was obtaining proper fullbacks, a proper CDM (Onana from Lille) and a future replacement for Rodrigo (Octavian Popescu?). Also sold Cooper and traded Koch for Kristoffer Ajer from Brentford (not a bad deal imo as I like CBs with pace). Because the squad I inherited was just under-par to really compete.
IRL it still is. Leeds have a team that isn't terrible but not great, injuries and lacking squad depth. Playing an LCB at LB isn't ideal. Harrison might end up joining Newcastle by next year. Bamford is talented but injury prone. Some great new players but probably not enough to avoid a relegation battle.
I still don't get why they even hired him in the first place. Coached the worst Salzburg team I've seen in the Bundesliga in many years and was a total disaster in Leipzig. Perfect example of failing upwards.
100% agree, as a chelsea fan i´m happy its leeds but still don´t understand how he got a job in the PL.
Tell me about it. Orta apparently wanted him. He's never been asked to explain why.
Just a thought.. With the "system coaches", could it be that people may disproportionately associate a team's failings to the players' ability? Whereby it is assumed that should the "system coach" be given access to "better" players, the system would work?
@@lukemclellan2141 It's an interesting question. Leeds currently have two sets of fans. One thinks Marsch is a clever tactician being let down because Leeds only spent a hundred mill on players and it just wasn't enough. Other sides with the same resources beat us and we were robbed because we didn't buy world-class defenders. The other has a clue about football and knows bad when they see it. You get it even in the comment section on this video, which is actually kind to Marsch, where John shows that it doesn't matter who the defenders are, we'd still give away the same goals against teams like Leicester, who simply had the simple good sense to cross the ball to the totally unmarked player in our box, and that totally unmarked player will always exist so the defence *has to* trap the opposition and hope they don't the ability to pass quickly. Which might work in Austria, where teams are pedestrian and awful, but in England, well, good luck.
One of the best data dives of XG I’ve seen!
Things are actually fine, not everything has to be a crisis
the fact that chelsea got destroyed by this team shows why tuchel's sacking was actually a good move.
It wasn't
It would have been if there were better options
He's just said that Leeds play really well against the big sides?
they constantly show a good performance against big clubs, like they did against arsenal and chelsea. This represents that their tactical potential is very high.
@@s._.ushitrash No it doesn't. Did you watch the video at all?
Exceptional analysis, thank you 🙏
Seems odd he mentioned the big chances they give up but not the big chances missed which they gotta be up there Bamford has like 10 big chances missed alone this season 😂
How come you and me and thousands of LUFC fans can see what's going wrong but the board and coaches can't or they are and can't afford or won't change things.
Arrogance
It might not be working but it's really fun for the neutral to watch. The last half of the Arsenal game was really good.
7 in 24 now;)
Love this. Really comes down to a team that wants to counter attack/create off turnovers.
If turnovers don’t come or the other team just sits back and makes them break down a low block they can’t.
Similar problem with Liverpool, too.
Yep. Good for beating the top teams, non functional against the lower ones.
Tedious ineptly formed opining ?
Wel thats quite a fast falldown since the vs chelsea win...
They don’t have a solid striker either
You'd imagine Marsh can solve breaking down low blocks. He managed the best team in Austria
But he’s managing the 18th best team in England, not a terrible Austrian league.
Looks like ur wrong again
Jesse is a live by the sword, die by the sword manager. He has a philosophy and won't deviate.
No he isn't. That was Bielsa. We're far more cautious under Marsch and that's the problem.
Bring back animated videos
As an American gunner (release the hounds....) Leeds under Marsch remind me of Arsenal (or Brighton) of the last few seasons. Good at creating chances at both ends of the pitch, but lacking finishing. Jon's analysis is clearly much better than mine, but FWIW, the biggest issue does seem to be personnel: Raphina is gone and Bamford is a shadow of his 20/21 self. Thoroughly enjoyed the Game State deep dive, but I think all the conversations would be different if even 20% more of their (big only) chances were converted. They just can't score when they're in good positions.
Anyway, as an American but also a fan of the style of play, I hope they give Marsch more time, if only because (unlike Villa) it's difficult to think of who could convert this squad into higher performers (unless Orta could somehow hypnotize Poch).
L Timing on the vid😹
Jon, the TifoIRL presenter, forgot to mention solutions to make the system work.
Specifically, upgrades at center back to players that can aggressively win and clear incoming direct long ball plays.
Also, and obviously, a new center forward since Bamford is rusty, not converting chances or penalties, and is injury prone.
Is the goalie really a good shot stopper or assertive enough to command the defense in front of him?
Do the Leeds owners have good enough recruiting/scouting staff and the money to upgrade during the December transfer window?
Great choice of music, it made everything feel very sexy which I imagine was the intended outcome.
Because he is american 😎
The reason it's not working is that people like you pulled apart Bielsa and helped push the idea that he was no good. Who do you think you are with your tactics board? You stand there in your Leeds shirt, but you're an enemy within who was spreading poison against Bielsa last season. You wanna go working for the tabloids and stirring up trouble then go and do it for another club like Hay and Pope who are not Leeds fans.
rubbish clive. i am a fan for 50 yrs and i find his analysis is convincing. he has no agenda. and what he says makes sense. to avoid relegation last year something needed to change - that was obvious - i think the great man had done his work. shame we could not build on it
@@baggers16444 the best lies are always based on truth that's why they're convincing. Wilko finished 17th then 5th the season after.
I guess commentetors curse in this lol
Perhaps if opposition teams switch to more direct approaches mid game then Jesse needs the team to drop deeper to mitigate this
you would think so but he does not seem to know how to react
Absolute gold. Great analysis. Its so interesting to see different styles of play work or fail depending on the approach of the opposition. Will the 'philosophy' approach be over taken by teams flexible enough to adapt the perfect counter tactic to whomever they are playing?
Oof
*rolls eyes* Here we go again, boring Jon Mackenzie with his "underlying numbers".
(Joking - we love it, really.)
He's out of his depth I'm sure if he did away with this crap playing narrow and trying to overrun opponents through the middle so we then get ripped apart on the Wings etc, we want to go Portuguese and get Jorge Jesus who's currently at the top of the Turkish league since 09 he's won Portuguese league 4 times in his first 6 seasons at Benfica his win rate was 75% then sporting 3 seasons 65% 2nd period of 3 seasons at Benfica 63% he's also won the league in Brazil with a win rate of 70% win the Saudi league with a win rate of 80% his first 6 seasons at Benfica he was Rodders manager if not Jesus Abel Ferreira his won Copa libertadores twice in the last 2 seasons after walking out at Poak Athens when he finished 2nd they are both winning Machines and play attacking football.
Jon - can you do a 'why are Leeds crap' video every week please 😂
I know it's close on paper but personally I'm betting on Not Leeds United
its not working because he cannot get his ideas across to the players and therefore they don't know what they are doing on the pitch. This is the reason their confidence is shot. Add to this Marsch's limited awareness and tactical flexibility is a recipe for relegation.
the players must get tired of all the empty words of positivity that have clearly mounted to nothing
I feel like Newcastle have a somewhat similar problem but to a significantly lesser extent.
They've got a similar pattern of getting good results against top teams and relatively underwhelming results against Bournemouth, Palace and Wolves. Albeit Newcastle seem to have the quality to a) not ship goals against the relatively weaker teams and b) get a breakthrough with a piece of individual skill like against Forrest.
We should’ve won the palace game if not for a mindblowing VAR decision, Wolves we just started slow in the first half + Wolves where actually playing decent football and had more possession
@@olliem99 yeah I don't disagree with us being unlucky early in the season in a couple games, and any draw is for sure going to hinge on a few key moments, but given the results against Spurs and Man City we potentially should be hammering a Palace or a Wolves to the point where one bad decision shouldn't matter. (A lot of teams have been inconsistent this season so I think that's part of it). And I think Howe (as compared to Marsch) is much better at only using counter-pressing when it's advantageous to Newcastle, though this is mostly due to Newcastle by having better players and more options than Leeds.
But the limitations of counter-pressing that are highlighted are systemic and it's somewhat important for us as fans not to get frustrated if we don't look quite so 'on the front foot' against a mid or lower table team as we do against a City or a Spurs.
I'm a Leeds fan and this is spot on. Well done.
This is great but leeds keep passing the ball to the opposition.
americans play soccer ,that alone is the reason for his failure
they can't defend to save their life