Cram coming into his own, Scott o-so-close, Aouita a new find and Ovett entering the twilight of a great career in this incredible first world 1500 title.Thanks for posting.
I think the 3 titles in 82 & 83 gave Cram tremendous confidence, and made it possible for him to blossom into the athlete he became in 85 & 86, when he was a better athlete than he'd been in 82/83. Without the injuries and illness, Coe & Ovett should have been at their peak in 82/83, when they'd have been around 25-27, an age when most milers reach their peak.
Cram was in his peak shape between 1982 and 1986: he won two European Champion- ships, at least two Commonwealth Championships, one World Champion- ship (this one), and one Olympic silver medal. Fortunately he achieved so much so early, because in 1987 his running career started to decline. As for Ovett, he still ran one great race: in the autumn of 1983, he broke the 1,500-metre world record. Scott was dubbed the "best runner-up," because he rarely, if ever, won a major international race.
I agree with you there. If you look at what he did to his knee that mad day in London it is a miracle that he ran at this level again. But the mastery was gone. He never recovered that audacious track manner that made him such a unique athlete in 1977-81. What a loss.
By this stage he was already suffering with swollen glands. He then got beaten in the euro final and was scratched by the British team doctor from the 1500m. At home the hospital diagnosed glandular fever. His season finished without having run any 1500/Miles. The symptoms he had experienced prior and during Athens returned during the winter and then again the following summer. It wasn't until a close doctor friend referred him to a specialist in Aug '83 that toxoplasmosis was diagnosed.
Hi Nick :) Yep. I read about the race on BBC, interesting to read that Cram got a hint from Brendan Foster about Aouita's tactics and he was ready to follow him when he went hard with 500 to go - Ovett was hopelessly boxed and lost 10 meters.
I keep coming back to this race - trying to understand what happened to Steve Ovett. Cram was badly placed after one and a half laps but he improved his position without having to go wide. Ovett was 5M adrift at the bell and boxed, expended valuable energy going wide and fighting through traffic - on the back straight he was free at last but Cram had already kicked for home and there was just no hope for Ovett to catch him. Still can't believe the master tactician allowed that to happen.
Can you imagine if there was a 4*800m relay at the Olympics... which country would have cleaned up in 1980, 84 and 88? I'm a retired 400m runner but watching this makes me want to come back as a veteran!
But you defeat your own argument - he wasn't badly affected by the illness in 1982 - hence the decent record in 1982. He just tightened up in the home straight in his most important race, that was not because of illness. 1983, yes, that year was badly disrupted by injury.
I have had many disagreements over the last 3 years with Deano and for some reason thought I was not a fan of Coe. Not so at all. I will summise if I may. Cram - best tactician 1982, 1983, 1985, 1986 (1500m). Ovett - most naturally talented. Coe - best overall 2 Olympic + World Records galore. Golds and 2 Silvers. (with the medals Ovett and Cram match him once not twice) . Grittiest - Elliott part time athlete who over acheived incrediblely in 87, 88 & 90 (Commonwealth)
I think with Cram is that he always had interruptions with injuries. I don't think these were any worse in '87, but the World Final was run in such a way that the pace got faster and faster with 800m gone. The penultimate lap was sub 54, and Cram then started his drive with more than a lap to go. He simply run out of steam entering the home straight, while Bile went on to cover the last 800m in 1:46.9!! Had the 3rd lap not been so fast, Cram may well have had enough to hold on.
As for Coe, it's a difficult one. On the face of it he was so quick over 400 (45.5 relay) & 800 that he shouldn't be a force over 5k. However, a 4 mile win over McLoud & Coghlan in 78 (when he'd been running 800s all season) & a 7.5km road race victory in 20:59(thats sub 28 min 10k pace) over Cova in 80, implies extraordinary endurance for a half miler. I'd say that in any of his peak seasons with decent pacing he could have run 7:35 for 3k & 13:10 - 13:15 for 5k, based on training for 8 & 15.
He was a shambles in LA because he had severe respiratory problems due to the smoggy atmosphere. He was taken to hospital after both the 800m and 1500m finals.
Do you have Cram's splits for the last 100 and 200 and 300 in this race? I think it was a similar time to coe's moscow 1500, probably cram was at his best here in 83, so would be interesting to compare.
Looking at this race again - it look to me a win of greater distinction than Coe's 2 Olympic golds. Crams last lap was about 51.5 in a 3.41 1500. Coe ran I think 52 secs in Moscow last lap in a 3.38. Have you compared any of the splits? Do you think Coe at his Moscow form could have beaten Cram in his 83 gold medal run?
The difference in the last 100 was even greater, 1.2 secs; Cram-13.3, Coe 12.1. So, we have Coe matching Cram over the last 800m off a pace over 3 secs faster. That automatically makes Coe's last 800 more impressive. More significantly, Cram was slowing down from 200 out, meaning he was at his maximum effort, whereas Coe was getting faster & faster from 200 out to the finish, meaning he had more left if needed.
@oldjoe5 Not the same year he wasn't. He was WR 1 at 800m in 88, despite only getting 3rd in the Olympics, and No 1 at 10k in 86, when he ran just once at that distance all year! The T&FN ranking system was always a bit biased towards those athletes who ran for fast times over a season rather than winning the medals at the big champs. Despite a phenomenal range (probably the greatest ever), he only won titles at 5000m.
I think you're right in that he wasn't quite at his absolute best that he'd been in '78-'80, but he was still good enough to have won this race, albeit narrowly. The reason he came 4th was because he chose this race to run his worst tactical race ever! It was as bad as Coe's 800 in Moscow. What's telling is the fact that he was the fastest man over the last 400m (51.9 compared to Cram's 52.2) & that while running wide on the penultimate bend. It was the LA smog which really ended his great days.
This has similar symptoms to glandular fever but is more dangerous and persistent. The specialist said he'd had it for some time and concluded it was highly likely he'd had it back in Athens '82. Regardless, his 82 season was severely truncated by first injury and then illness and his '83 season was a complete wash-out. Nothing to do with injury as you imply!
I meant to ask you - how do you explain Cram's unresponsive legs in the WC 87 final home straight? He'd been unbeatable in 86 and was looking good up until the 87 final.
No! Try doing some background reading. Pat Butcher's book is a good start. Coe was injured at the beginning of the '82 season and didn't run a race from June 5th to Aug 4th. He missed more than 6 weeks training at a vital stage of the season. Despite this he went on to beat everyone in 3 800 races on the circuit (which basically guaranteed his No1 ranking) in the space of 2 weeks. He was then forced by the BAAB to run in the 4x800 WR the week before the Europeans.
Moreover, some of the athletes involved were not under the same rigorous out of season testing due to their nationality, as those in Europe or the US. When someone like Geb throws in a 2nd 5000 under 13:00 during a 10k race, then something is not right. If you look at Moorcroft, he was certainly more endurance based than Coe or Ovett, running some great splits in longer distance road races. Having said that I'd say Ovett was as good in theory over 5k if he'd trained for it earlier in his career.
Yes, they were similar until you get to the last 100 & 200. What you have to remember though is that the Helsinki race was 3 sec slower in pace. This race should have been tailor made for Ovett, but he was out of contention when things hotted up at the bell, despite covering the last 300m faster than anyone else. Cram was better than this in '85 & '86 IMO. last 400m~ Cram 83- 52.1, Coe 80- 52.2 last 300m~ Cram-38.6, Coe- 38.7 last 200m~ Cram- 26.0, Coe- 25.0 last 100m~ Cram- 13.3, Coe- 12.1
You haven't looked at the splits carefully at all. There is no question that both Coe's Olympic victories were better than Cram's run in Helsinki! Cram's last 800 here was 1:48.5, just 0.1 faster than Coe's 1:48.6 in Moscow (in a race 3 secs faster). Cram's last 400 here was 52.1 not "about 51.5"! He goes through the bell in 2:49.5. Again, only 0.1 faster than Coe's Moscow run. Both Cram & Coe ran the last 300 in 38.6, but then Coe's last 200 was 25.0, 1.0 secs faster than Cram's 26.0.
deano27671 it’s not about lap times in finals. It’s about tactics and winning the race you’re in. Cram was recovering from injury in 84. Look at his last laps in the mile 85 and Commonwealth final 86. Coe was the ultimate runner against the clock but he wasn’t tactically the best.
Although the Commonwealth final was over 10 secs slower. Ovett would have been outside his comfort zone in a 13:10, in 86 at least. Ovett probably could have beaten Buckner in that European final without the illness, but he'd certainly have been capable of faster had he moved up to 5000 in 83/84.
But neither of which would have got him a then WR, which is perhaps why he didn't run them! With a change of emphasis to 5k training, then maybe he could have matched Moorcroft (7:30/13:00 ability), but to the detriment of his 800 speed. I wish he had not got injured in 87 otherwise we might have had an idea of what his potential was. At the end of the day I just don't think he liked running 5000m
Ovett really should have won this! He chose this race to run his worst tactical race ever! He ran a similar race to Coe's 1500m run in Stuttgart; wide on the bends and out of touch at the crucial moment. In both races Coe and Ovett were faster over the last lap.
I meant to ask you - if a world class but hardly the best miler like Moorcroft could run 13.00 for 5000M - what could Coe have achieved at this distance at his peak had he focused on it. The mind boggles. I don't believe in the legitimacy of the 5K and 10K wr - if you think 13.00 by Moorcroft was thought virtually on the limit of human endurance for 5K - how could anyone run 12.37 and 26.17.
The reason why Coe had 2 years of "mediocrity" is that he was ill with toxoplasmosis and it wasn't properly diagnosed for over a year! 82 & 83 should have been his best 2 years in terms of his age ~25-26. Cram run his best at those ages. For me, Coe never achieved his potential as much as the 2 Steves, yet still had a better record in terms of the Olympics & WR. Despite 2 seasons of mediocrity, he still managed to rank No.1 over 800 in 82 and break 3 WR's (4x800 in 82; indoor 8 & 1k in 83).
No, I don't believe that the 5 and 10k world records are legit, but that's my opinion and it's hard to prove. The fact that the WR's in middle and distance events progressed at a rate exponentially faster than the historical rate of progression in a short period of time (1993 -2004), during a period when EPO emerged, is enough for me. There was no way of detecting it up to late 2000, and thereafter the test was not reliable until 2006.
As much as Cram went out & ran great tactical races to win the 3 golds in 82 & 83, I do think he was blessed when Coe & Ovett were out injured (82) and when Coe was ill in 83 and Ovett just ran poorly. IMO, Cram wasn't as good at this time as a peak Coe or Ovett. Had they been there in 82, they'd have won the Commonwealth & European golds and this probably would have had a psychological effect on Cram, perhaps preventing him from winning gold in 83 and possibly forcing him up to 5000m.
Yes I agree - he was great at kicking on the last lap off a relatively slow pace. Still I think the Cram that beat Cruz over 800 in 1985 would have won this race. His downfall in this race thought - hos one and only predictable game plan.
If you can run a 12.1 at the end of a last lap in 52.2 in a 3:38, then it means he probably could have run a 51 flat all out if needed. Then his finish time would have been 3:37. As for LA in 84, surely you can see that a last 800 in 1:49.8, last 400 in 53.2, 200 in 25.7 & 100 in 12.7 is far more impressive than Cram's Helisinki splits off a pace 9 secs slower!? If you moved Cram from 83 & put him in the Moscow final, I don't think he'd have medaled. Cram was better in 85 & 86 than he was in 83.
Yes he would have won. He was the fastest of all the athletes over the last 400, 51.9, (compared to Cram's 52.1) and that was through traffic and running wide.
But he'd have to have been at his absolute best to have beaten Bile that day in the way it was run. I think Cram was losing it psychologically by this stage too. He wasn't as strong, IMO, when coming back from defeat, as say Coe. He'd been beaten by Coe in 86 & then unexpectedly beaten by Gonzales in the 1500 Europa Cup earlier in the 87 season. Despite running from the front, which was his strength, over the last lap & running 50.**, Gonzales stayed with him & kicked past him in home straight.
There are plenty of statistics that you could use to make a convincing case for Cram, Ovett or Coe as being the greatest of the three runners at their best. The truth is that Ovett's best was 1977-81, Cram's best was 1983-86. Coe's best was between 1979-86 but he had several years of mediocrity during that period. It's really hard to say who was the greatest of the three - they were all awesome at their very best.
southsea1984 great post. I think Ovett had the most explosive kick from 200m out, Coe was the best against the clock but he wasn’t great tactically against the best consistently. Cram for me was the best overall. He had great tactics in finals and could run the kick out of anyone from 400m out. In 85/86 he also developed enough explosive kick to beat the elite opponents from 100m to 200m out. Unfortunately injuries took their toll on him from 1987 onwards.
@ausgang For a start Coe isn't even in this race! As for Aouita, it was his first Championship race and he isn't the athlete here he was to become in the next 2 seasons. The only reason Scott beat Ovett here was because Ovett gave him such a big head start, as he was badly boxed with a lap to go. The year of this race, 83, constituted Scott's best. I'm afraid he didn't have the kick to beat Coe or Ovett at their peak, whatever the pace.
@mackapacka I'd certainly put him in the all time top 5 Milers already based on what he actually did. As far as pure middle distance runners (800 & 1500), I think only Coe and Snell can claim better credentials.
Lol! Yeah right! Thats why Coe was the 800m record holder & Ovett was 2.3 secs slower. And why in both finals in Moscow Coe covered the last 200m quicker than Ovett!
I know! I keep thinking that if I watch it enough times, the result will change. LOL. The same I feel about Coe's Moscow 800 or the 82 European 800. Wishful thinking! I guess Coe ran his worst tactical race in an Olympic final. This is just Ovett's worst ever. Perhaps it was over confidence, although I doubt it. Perhaps nerves just got to him!? Still ran the fastest last 400, 51.9.
Ovett ran like a goon. He was still the fastest guy over the last lap. Had he been on Cram's shoulder at the bell, I think the result would have been different!
Cram coming into his own, Scott o-so-close, Aouita a new find and Ovett entering the twilight of a great career in this incredible first world 1500 title.Thanks for posting.
I think the 3 titles in 82 & 83 gave Cram tremendous confidence, and made it possible for him to blossom into the athlete he became in 85 & 86, when he was a better athlete than he'd been in 82/83. Without the injuries and illness, Coe & Ovett should have been at their peak in 82/83, when they'd have been around 25-27, an age when most milers reach their peak.
Cram was in his peak shape between 1982
and 1986: he won two European Champion-
ships, at least two Commonwealth
Championships, one World Champion-
ship (this one), and one Olympic silver
medal. Fortunately he achieved so
much so early, because in 1987 his
running career started to decline.
As for Ovett, he still ran one great
race: in the autumn of 1983, he broke
the 1,500-metre world record. Scott
was dubbed the "best runner-up,"
because he rarely, if ever, won a major
international race.
I agree with you there. If you look at what he did to his knee that mad day in London it is a miracle that he ran at this level again. But the mastery was gone. He never recovered that audacious track manner that made him such a unique athlete in 1977-81. What a loss.
Stuart yet he still broke the 1500m world record after this race and lost to Cram at Crystal Palace
By this stage he was already suffering with swollen glands. He then got beaten in the euro final and was scratched by the British team doctor from the 1500m. At home the hospital diagnosed glandular fever. His season finished without having run any 1500/Miles. The symptoms he had experienced prior and during Athens returned during the winter and then again the following summer. It wasn't until a close doctor friend referred him to a specialist in Aug '83 that toxoplasmosis was diagnosed.
Hi Nick :) Yep. I read about the race on BBC, interesting to read that Cram got a hint from Brendan Foster about Aouita's tactics and he was ready to follow him when he went hard with 500 to go - Ovett was hopelessly boxed and lost 10 meters.
I keep coming back to this race - trying to understand what happened to Steve Ovett. Cram was badly placed after one and a half laps but he improved his position without having to go wide. Ovett was 5M adrift at the bell and boxed, expended valuable energy going wide and fighting through traffic - on the back straight he was free at last but Cram had already kicked for home and there was just no hope for Ovett to catch him. Still can't believe the master tactician allowed that to happen.
for me cram is in middle distance what "alexander popov" was in the pool. The perfect movements of his legs, is perfect to show children how to run.
Can you imagine if there was a 4*800m relay at the Olympics... which country would have cleaned up in 1980, 84 and 88?
I'm a retired 400m runner but watching this makes me want to come back as a veteran!
But you defeat your own argument - he wasn't badly affected by the illness in 1982 - hence the decent record in 1982. He just tightened up in the home straight in his most important race, that was not because of illness. 1983, yes, that year was badly disrupted by injury.
This Guy Knows what He's Talking about!, In 1985 He Set 3 World Records in 19 days!.
I have had many disagreements over the last 3 years with Deano and for some reason thought I was not a fan of Coe. Not so at all. I will summise if I may. Cram - best tactician 1982, 1983, 1985, 1986 (1500m). Ovett - most naturally talented. Coe - best overall 2 Olympic + World Records galore. Golds and 2 Silvers. (with the medals Ovett and Cram match him once not twice) . Grittiest - Elliott part time athlete who over acheived incrediblely in 87, 88 & 90 (Commonwealth)
the great pixel race of '83
I think with Cram is that he always had interruptions with injuries. I don't think these were any worse in '87, but the World Final was run in such a way that the pace got faster and faster with 800m gone. The penultimate lap was sub 54, and Cram then started his drive with more than a lap to go. He simply run out of steam entering the home straight, while Bile went on to cover the last 800m in 1:46.9!! Had the 3rd lap not been so fast, Cram may well have had enough to hold on.
As for Coe, it's a difficult one. On the face of it he was so quick over 400 (45.5 relay) & 800 that he shouldn't be a force over 5k. However, a 4 mile win over McLoud & Coghlan in 78 (when he'd been running 800s all season) & a 7.5km road race victory in 20:59(thats sub 28 min 10k pace) over Cova in 80, implies extraordinary endurance for a half miler. I'd say that in any of his peak seasons with decent pacing he could have run 7:35 for 3k & 13:10 - 13:15 for 5k, based on training for 8 & 15.
I always wanted to see Butcher's movie on Aouita "The Arabian Knight". Looks great, but hard to find.
He was a shambles in LA because he had severe respiratory problems due to the smoggy atmosphere. He was taken to hospital after both the 800m and 1500m finals.
Do you have Cram's splits for the last 100 and 200 and 300 in this race? I think it was a similar time to coe's moscow 1500, probably cram was at his best here in 83, so would be interesting to compare.
Looking at this race again - it look to me a win of greater distinction than Coe's 2 Olympic golds. Crams last lap was about 51.5 in a 3.41 1500. Coe ran I think 52 secs in Moscow last lap in a 3.38. Have you compared any of the splits? Do you think Coe at his Moscow form could have beaten Cram in his 83 gold medal run?
The difference in the last 100 was even greater, 1.2 secs; Cram-13.3, Coe 12.1. So, we have Coe matching Cram over the last 800m off a pace over 3 secs faster. That automatically makes Coe's last 800 more impressive. More significantly, Cram was slowing down from 200 out, meaning he was at his maximum effort, whereas Coe was getting faster & faster from 200 out to the finish, meaning he had more left if needed.
@oldjoe5 Not the same year he wasn't. He was WR 1 at 800m in 88, despite only getting 3rd in the Olympics, and No 1 at 10k in 86, when he ran just once at that distance all year! The T&FN ranking system was always a bit biased towards those athletes who ran for fast times over a season rather than winning the medals at the big champs. Despite a phenomenal range (probably the greatest ever), he only won titles at 5000m.
Fancy seeing you here Jamie! BBC Sport's Cram column brought you here by any chance?
30 years ago today. I feel old!
37 years ago
I think you're right in that he wasn't quite at his absolute best that he'd been in '78-'80, but he was still good enough to have won this race, albeit narrowly. The reason he came 4th was because he chose this race to run his worst tactical race ever! It was as bad as Coe's 800 in Moscow. What's telling is the fact that he was the fastest man over the last 400m (51.9 compared to Cram's 52.2) & that while running wide on the penultimate bend. It was the LA smog which really ended his great days.
This has similar symptoms to glandular fever but is more dangerous and persistent. The specialist said he'd had it for some time and concluded it was highly likely he'd had it back in Athens '82. Regardless, his 82 season was severely truncated by first injury and then illness and his '83 season was a complete wash-out. Nothing to do with injury as you imply!
Here's a thought - in 86 Ovett made easy work of Buckner and the latter was a 13.10 5000M man.
I meant to ask you - how do you explain Cram's unresponsive legs in the WC 87 final home straight? He'd been unbeatable in 86 and was looking good up until the 87 final.
No! Try doing some background reading. Pat Butcher's book is a good start. Coe was injured at the beginning of the '82 season and didn't run a race from June 5th to Aug 4th. He missed more than 6 weeks training at a vital stage of the season. Despite this he went on to beat everyone in 3 800 races on the circuit (which basically guaranteed his No1 ranking) in the space of 2 weeks. He was then forced by the BAAB to run in the 4x800 WR the week before the Europeans.
Moreover, some of the athletes involved were not under the same rigorous out of season testing due to their nationality, as those in Europe or the US. When someone like Geb throws in a 2nd 5000 under 13:00 during a 10k race, then something is not right.
If you look at Moorcroft, he was certainly more endurance based than Coe or Ovett, running some great splits in longer distance road races. Having said that I'd say Ovett was as good in theory over 5k if he'd trained for it earlier in his career.
Not very often you see Aouita outkicked. He perhaps went a little soon. Smart race by Cram and Scott though.
@mackapacka Fair points. Coe = the great time trialler, Ovett the great racer and Cram the great talent. Easy.
Yes, they were similar until you get to the last 100 & 200. What you have to remember though is that the Helsinki race was 3 sec slower in pace. This race should have been tailor made for Ovett, but he was out of contention when things hotted up at the bell, despite covering the last 300m faster than anyone else. Cram was better than this in '85 & '86 IMO.
last 400m~ Cram 83- 52.1, Coe 80- 52.2
last 300m~ Cram-38.6, Coe- 38.7
last 200m~ Cram- 26.0, Coe- 25.0
last 100m~ Cram- 13.3, Coe- 12.1
That was surely Ovett's last chance to win a major 1500M. I often wonder if he'd been well placed on the bend if he could have won it.
You haven't looked at the splits carefully at all. There is no question that both Coe's Olympic victories were better than Cram's run in Helsinki! Cram's last 800 here was 1:48.5, just 0.1 faster than Coe's 1:48.6 in Moscow (in a race 3 secs faster). Cram's last 400 here was 52.1 not "about 51.5"! He goes through the bell in 2:49.5. Again, only 0.1 faster than Coe's Moscow run. Both Cram & Coe ran the last 300 in 38.6, but then Coe's last 200 was 25.0, 1.0 secs faster than Cram's 26.0.
deano27671 it’s not about lap times in finals. It’s about tactics and winning the race you’re in. Cram was recovering from injury in 84. Look at his last laps in the mile 85 and Commonwealth final 86. Coe was the ultimate runner against the clock but he wasn’t tactically the best.
Although the Commonwealth final was over 10 secs slower. Ovett would have been outside his comfort zone in a 13:10, in 86 at least. Ovett probably could have beaten Buckner in that European final without the illness, but he'd certainly have been capable of faster had he moved up to 5000 in 83/84.
ur right and that's when he started having asthma attacks and big problems breathing
But neither of which would have got him a then WR, which is perhaps why he didn't run them! With a change of emphasis to 5k training, then maybe he could have matched Moorcroft (7:30/13:00 ability), but to the detriment of his 800 speed. I wish he had not got injured in 87 otherwise we might have had an idea of what his potential was. At the end of the day I just don't think he liked running 5000m
Ovett really should have won this! He chose this race to run his worst tactical race ever! He ran a similar race to Coe's 1500m run in Stuttgart; wide on the bends and out of touch at the crucial moment. In both races Coe and Ovett were faster over the last lap.
How Steve Cram never won an Olympic title is beyond me.
Eric George bad luck lack of confidence
I meant to ask you - if a world class but hardly the best miler like Moorcroft could run 13.00 for 5000M - what could Coe have achieved at this distance at his peak had he focused on it. The mind boggles. I don't believe in the legitimacy of the 5K and 10K wr - if you think 13.00 by Moorcroft was thought virtually on the limit of human endurance for 5K - how could anyone run 12.37 and 26.17.
The reason why Coe had 2 years of "mediocrity" is that he was ill with toxoplasmosis and it wasn't properly diagnosed for over a year! 82 & 83 should have been his best 2 years in terms of his age ~25-26. Cram run his best at those ages. For me, Coe never achieved his potential as much as the 2 Steves, yet still had a better record in terms of the Olympics & WR. Despite 2 seasons of mediocrity, he still managed to rank No.1 over 800 in 82 and break 3 WR's (4x800 in 82; indoor 8 & 1k in 83).
Wakey wakey Steve cram, time to get ya gorgeous lil arse to work 😚😚😚
Foster must have just come out of retirement at this point. Couldn't they have gave Cram a bigger flag on lap of honour?
No, I don't believe that the 5 and 10k world records are legit, but that's my opinion and it's hard to prove. The fact that the WR's in middle and distance events progressed at a rate exponentially faster than the historical rate of progression in a short period of time (1993 -2004), during a period when EPO emerged, is enough for me. There was no way of detecting it up to late 2000, and thereafter the test was not reliable until 2006.
As much as Cram went out & ran great tactical races to win the 3 golds in 82 & 83, I do think he was blessed when Coe & Ovett were out injured (82) and when Coe was ill in 83 and Ovett just ran poorly. IMO, Cram wasn't as good at this time as a peak Coe or Ovett. Had they been there in 82, they'd have won the Commonwealth & European golds and this probably would have had a psychological effect on Cram, perhaps preventing him from winning gold in 83 and possibly forcing him up to 5000m.
Yes I agree - he was great at kicking on the last lap off a relatively slow pace. Still I think the Cram that beat Cruz over 800 in 1985 would have won this race. His downfall in this race thought - hos one and only predictable game plan.
If you can run a 12.1 at the end of a last lap in 52.2 in a 3:38, then it means he probably could have run a 51 flat all out if needed. Then his finish time would have been 3:37.
As for LA in 84, surely you can see that a last 800 in 1:49.8, last 400 in 53.2, 200 in 25.7 & 100 in 12.7 is far more impressive than Cram's Helisinki splits off a pace 9 secs slower!? If you moved Cram from 83 & put him in the Moscow final, I don't think he'd have medaled. Cram was better in 85 & 86 than he was in 83.
Yes he would have won. He was the fastest of all the athletes over the last 400, 51.9, (compared to Cram's 52.1) and that was through traffic and running wide.
Why didn’t he beat him a few weeks later at Crystal Palace after breaking the 1500m world record?
But he'd have to have been at his absolute best to have beaten Bile that day in the way it was run. I think Cram was losing it psychologically by this stage too. He wasn't as strong, IMO, when coming back from defeat, as say Coe. He'd been beaten by Coe in 86 & then unexpectedly beaten by Gonzales in the 1500 Europa Cup earlier in the 87 season. Despite running from the front, which was his strength, over the last lap & running 50.**, Gonzales stayed with him & kicked past him in home straight.
There are plenty of statistics that you could use to make a convincing case for Cram, Ovett or Coe as being the greatest of the three runners at their best. The truth is that Ovett's best was 1977-81, Cram's best was 1983-86. Coe's best was between 1979-86 but he had several years of mediocrity during that period. It's really hard to say who was the greatest of the three - they were all awesome at their very best.
southsea1984 great post. I think Ovett had the most explosive kick from 200m out, Coe was the best against the clock but he wasn’t great tactically against the best consistently.
Cram for me was the best overall. He had great tactics in finals and could run the kick out of anyone from 400m out. In 85/86 he also developed enough explosive kick to beat the elite opponents from 100m to 200m out.
Unfortunately injuries took their toll on him from 1987 onwards.
@ausgang For a start Coe isn't even in this race! As for Aouita, it was his first Championship race and he isn't the athlete here he was to become in the next 2 seasons. The only reason Scott beat Ovett here was because Ovett gave him such a big head start, as he was badly boxed with a lap to go. The year of this race, 83, constituted Scott's best. I'm afraid he didn't have the kick to beat Coe or Ovett at their peak, whatever the pace.
Scott is easily the worst tactician choke artist in the history of the mile
That opinion is not supported by any statistics.
@mackapacka I'd certainly put him in the all time top 5 Milers already based on what he actually did. As far as pure middle distance runners (800 & 1500), I think only Coe and Snell can claim better credentials.
Lol!
Yeah right! Thats why Coe was the 800m record holder & Ovett was 2.3 secs slower. And why in both finals in Moscow Coe covered the last 200m quicker than Ovett!
young unexperienced Aouita could have won the race if he was a bit patient
I followed Ovett's career and this was the worst race he ever ran
I know! I keep thinking that if I watch it enough times, the result will change. LOL. The same I feel about Coe's Moscow 800 or the 82 European 800. Wishful thinking!
I guess Coe ran his worst tactical race in an Olympic final. This is just Ovett's worst ever. Perhaps it was over confidence, although I doubt it. Perhaps nerves just got to him!? Still ran the fastest last 400, 51.9.
Ovett ran like a goon. He was still the fastest guy over the last lap. Had he been on Cram's shoulder at the bell, I think the result would have been different!
deano27671 you say that but look at the mile at Crystal Palace a few weeks later after Ovett broke the 1500m world record.