Designing Shadow Complex
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 ก.พ. 2025
- In this 2010 GDC session, ChAIR Entertainment Group creative director Donald Mustard discusses the design process for the 2009 indie hit Shadow Complex, one of the early successes on the Xbox Live Arcade.
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I love the way this Guy talks about the subject. Its such a treasure. This Guy is REAL . Thank You.
"Industry wont go forward by rehashing old concepts so we decided to make a sidescroller metroidvania"
Cracked me a bit :)
Yeah, "old abandoned genre", which just happened to be one of the most lucrative reasons to own a handheld console between the years 2001 and 2008 and beyond (Metroid Fusion & Zero Mission, Megaman Zero, bunch of Castlevanias, etc). :D But that said, I think I'll understand what the speaker tries to say, as when it came to "living room consoles", there just wasn't much happening on this traditional metroidvania front, before Shadow Complex hit the XBLA. So they probably thought, that they were super original. But it's good to remember, that many games in the same spirit were in development for consoles and PC or just about to be released (La-Mulana, Fez, Outland, VVVVVV, just to name a few), when SC was released. They just made it first.
Yeah, at that time it wasn't common. As a fan of the subgenre, I remember being frustrated that Shadow Complex wasn't being released on PS3, the only console I had.
They just didn't make it first, they made it also very good.
This was a great game and a really interesting talk. The illustrator and bsp prototyping is golden.
fuckin excellent talk, dissapointed the comments didn't acknowledge this.
oh shit 2010.... lmao wtf
I always wanted to play Shadow Complex, but never had much of a chance to. You bring up a point at 6:00 about why would anyone buy a 'shitty' version of a good game that already exists. I get what you're saying, I just feel like there is a niche for that, to an extent.
Imagine classic Doom, with its tile-based pixelly graphics, but with the polished mechanics and design philosphy of Metroid Prime, for example. Or the atmosphere of ES2 : Daggerfall.
Or an Isometric RPG game like Baldur's Gate, Diablo, or Fallout (I know, I know, cavalier oblique). It's pixelly, it's tile-based, it's nostalgic. And also, really hard to get into because of the insistence on outdated tabletop rulesets. But what if your character can become a military commander and the game starts feeling a bit like Age of Empires? Or Magicka? Or Farmville? Zelda? Skyrim?
In both cases, the idea is that what you lose in graphical fidelity, you gain back in mechanics, player agency, immersion, depth, etc.
Was this recorded in 200BC ?
Great game and inspiring talk!
Great audio LUL
Shame these guys went on to make shitty mobile games
Oh wow, remember when nobody was making metroidvanias. Yeah, me neither.
2010ish it was all waist high shooters.
What do you mean people don't want a cheap version of AAA titles, what do you mean people work hard to make them? What about all those 2d Dark Souls "inspired" games and metroidvanias (Shadow Complex have opened the market for them btw), what do you mean make original games? But what about cheap Monster Hunter clone? I'm gonna open 534th coffee shop that's good buisness everyone does that, can't fail! "A 2d Dark Souls game", yes!
Basically, what he meant(or what I thought he meant) is that a cheap version of an AAA title is like some guy who decides to open a burger restaurant, and sell an exact replica of a Big Mac for the same price. But, one lone guy is going to have more costly raw materials and lacks the support needed to match mcdonalds in terms of logistics. So, something is going to give when it comes to product quality, resulting in dissatisfied customers. So instead, one ought to focus on what unique niche isn't being covered. For example, the burger schmuck could sell venison burgers or kosher burgers, using his unique skills to focus on a market that mcdonalds can't hit.
Shadow complex opened the market for metroidvania? haha hell no! there are a LOT of metroidvania games out there, just a quick name is Cave Story, that game is like 5 years older than Shadow Complex (and more original too), oh that remind me, its so funny how they keep saying "you need to make something original" BUT shadow complex is pretty much a Metroid, but in 3D and with a hook. And yes, this game still is awesome and its a great achievement but come on!
Maybe you should watch the whole video? There were no games in that genre on Xbox 360, this genre was basically forgotten and no AAA dev would have touched it. The success of Shadow Complex in XBLA have indeed reanimated this genre.
I do like Shadow Complex so, I did watch the whole video, but what's the point of that? But, yes, you are right, AAA dev never touch this genre and that's still a fact even today (even Nintendo let this genre to die). Metroidvania always was a niche "genre" and only indies dev are making this types of games, even before shadow complex. Man, I didn't even knew the existence of this game until a few months back (on the Epic Games Launcher application that comes with unreal engine), and I fricking love metroidvanias, so I don't know if they really affect anything. Even today if you put "metroidvania" on steam, Shadow complex appears on the page 3 of the result.
It's a shame that instead of reviving other decommissioned genres like Chair did with Shadow Complex, indie devs choose to cash in on Shadow Complex success, as the result subpar matroidvanias are everywhere these days, if i could get a dollar every time i hear something like "Dark Souls inspired procedurally generated rogue-like 2D metroidvania".