Honestly WoC is my go to race when I just want to destroy the world basically…not all factions have to be super challenging, as long as they are fun to play which WoC is insanely fun to play. Only thing I would add is more dark fortresses in the center of the map
My favorite campaign so far was a 270 turn Archaon campaign. I conquered the entire right side of the map, and vassalized at least one of each faction. My Favorite army was a Slaanesh lord I named The Elf Fucker. Thanks to modding I built a full army around all 3 Elven factions, Malevolent tree kin front line, Sisters of Avelorn ranged, Har Ganeth Executioners and witch elf for anti infantry, with Heartseekers as Cav support. Shit was absolutely hilarious. The campaign came to an end with one of the major updates. I miss The Elf Fucker, he was great.
@@reinaldoantonio7271 For unlimited allied recruitment I use "Allied recruitment / merceneries cap per army remover," I would also recommend "Fixed Allied Outposts" so you don't have to rely for the AI to build the correct buildings to get the fun units.
The warband system looks fair because you need level 7 or above to upgrade chosens or Riders and usually if you are building a new warband it takes time to babysit the hell out of it before it can stand on it's own
I enjoy playing WoC, and they are not that strong when played by the AI. So I think it s nice to have an "easy" playable race I mean, we have soo many choices. Some need to be hard, some need to be easy. In my opinion. Belakor and Taurox are my favorite campaigns, that kinda says it all 😅
@@Wes1013 I don't know your skill level, but you may be in the small minority of players that are very good at the game. I assume you are on legendary with AI cheats to full? Game developers need to cater to the majority of players because catering to 5% of the high skill players won't last.
@@dotmadhack high skill players should be able to find a challenge at high difficulty. lower skill players can just lower the difficulty. everyone wins.
@@shmekelfreckles8157 I play on hard/hard. While true, it isn't legendary, but that is fun for me. Chaos is not a difficult faction by any stretch of the imagination.
@@meltingskeleton2082 any factions that must fight ordertide is not easy. It can go better or worse, sure, but as a rule of thumb it’s not gonna be a cakewalk. Fighting late game Kislev and dwarfs on legendary is soul-crushing.
WoC 1 weakness: Their armies are gone when destroyed. It takes them a while to get a really good army, and their starting units arent great. Add on to this: they are limited in how much they can recruit of a given unit. I like them, they were a great intro to the game.
Be'lakor's faction shouldn't even be Warriors of Chaos, but rather Demons of Chaos. His faction actually does have a DoC emblem, but it can only be used in multiplayer under normal circumstances.
yeah but demon's of chaos doesn't work because the mechanic is tied to the DP. Be'lakor makes much more sense in WoC because of that, he would be significantly weaker as a faction if he was in DoC. DoC is a boring faction, whose access to New DLC demons is the only reason it's not the worst in the game. Needs a complete rework, I'm mad that CA has completely abandoned that faction.
@@HomesliceMcB DP's mechanic is a faction-specific mechanic, not a racial one. If you've ever dabbled in modding, you'd see that all mechanics are actually interchangeable. Be'lakor can literally be race-shifted and function the exact same way. Lol. It makes more sense too, as he's the first demon prince, and has buffs for demonic units. There's also a mod out there that allows DoC to lorefully confederate everything beneath them in the hierarchy (which includes monogod factions). They're technically the highest on the ladder, being undivided demons.
@@BloodwyrmWildheart the tech tree is the demon princes skill tree…it would have to be changed, I’m not saying it’s difficult, it’s absolutely against the design. And if Be’lalor gets a similar mechanic that would be much weaker than what he has now. The design of demons of chaos is dogshit imo, Be’lalor would have to be a carbon copy essentially of the DP, as if he keeps his mechanics and skill free, he is way stronger than the DP. Be’lalor doesn’t even make sense for the build a bear, skill point tech tree. I prefer the WoC for Be’lalor, I like their faction specific mechanics. You have the ability to go full demons with him if you want. He would also lose the WoC units, which would suck, I like variety and choices. I don’t want to limit that for some arbitrary thematic reason. You understand?
Hmmmm. . . Vilitch with 19 sorverers of Tzeentch with the level 7 talent, which boosts barrier replenishment and give him more magic to spam. The only thing that absolutely DESTROYED me was Imrik. Everything else couldn't even poke through the barrier. I expect the Chorfs to be more dangerous if they happen to have enough blunderbusses.
He usually does that to Bretonnia in my games. In a recent SFO Kislev campaign, I kicked him out of Albion, whilst he somehow got Sword of Khaine whilst fighting besides Nkari. He proceeded to get 3 settlements on Ulthuan and Bretonnia, but his autoresolve, even with SoK, was still garbage and he couldnt stay alive against AI until I sailed down there.
The AI doesnt really know how to play or what to do with him because of his awkward start, ive noticed Noctilus sometimes suffers this same issue with his as well, but less so since his treasure hunts usually give him something to run off and do. In the hands of the player, Belakor is insanely broken. Its almost impossible to lose with him unless you really try@Grivehn
@@me3moo2 Im not refuting he is broken in player hands. But AI doesnt do great with Chaos in general, and youre right. Albion is a bad start without using portals. Belakor is in range of Naggarond (Alith Anar), Ulthuan, Bretonnia, the Empire and Norsca. And the AI can pick a fight with any one or all of them, which makes the AI absolutely ineffective until someone parks 3 armies on his doorstep and puts him out of his misery.
I’ve rarely seen that sometimes Belakor will instead invade Norsca and get 4 or so dark fortresses, and I’ve also seen him declare war on Sigvald and take two or three dark fortresses before leaving out with Sigvald but those games are very rare.
WoC level power is the reason why I would recommend them to a beginner, especially Archaon. Your only challenge is Boris and after dealing with him you are completely free to do whatever you want. Maybe you want to take your time and build up your forces? If that's so - go to the west and crush+vassalize Daniel with Epidemius and confederate Sigvald with Valkiya after which you can pretty much roleplay as a crisis faction and collapse on all continents. Or you can go take Kholek and plunder the whole of Cathay and deal with Grimgor. Or you can launch an early invasion into Kislev and the Empire. Archaon's campaign is very forgiving in terms of player decisions, because literally nobody can get to your main Dark Fortress and do something about you. Bel'akor at least may have to fight with a random crusade from Bretonnia, but Archaon doesn't have that issue. So aside from a bit tricky gifts mechanic, this is as beginner friendly as the campaign could get.
Its aways a rule of thumb to take archaeon out as early as possible if hes a threat to you as if you allow him to get strong he can be nearly unkillable.
Yo is not mods. They added Toad Dragon and dlc units like Change Bringers to gifted units. WoC are cool, not my favorite . Belakor it's always a tempting campaign start but i don't know if i would have fun playing it. Army building freedom is cool but I hate that chaos factions have to fight chaos for the first 60 turns before atacking empire , bretonnia. I'm interested in trying festus start position in RoC it looks cool in Belakor place near Vilitch.
i would love a beginners guide to warhammer, i want to get into this but i dont own a single game and dont know where to start, i like how you explain everything so if possible this would help me and others like me
The prologue of the third game will give you a pretty good introduction. After that, I wouldn't recommend the campaign - just go for immortal empires, and start with a faction with minimal faction and lord gimmicks, so you can get used to the game. After you beat that, try some other factions, and increased difficulties. Also, don't play on the Easy difficulty - it throws off the balance, and it's not a good way to get familiarized with the game.
Take a look at the beginners guides by Zerkovich or ItalianSpartacus. If you are going to buy something just get Warhammer 3 and if you do like it then add whatever DLC you want after that, also dont waste any time playing the realm of chaos campaign as it sucks just jump into playing immortal empires.
I enjoyed WoC in WH1 and WH2 more than WH3. I think the horde system was very lore-appropriate and made the campaign difficult enough, especially in the beginning. WoC are meant to go around and raiding, not to sit comfortably in their Dark Fortresses letting the weaklings doing their biddings. Too bad not many saw it that way.
I mean they actually do have dark fortresses in the lore, Sigvald in his book aptly named Sigvald spent over half the novel sitting around in his dark fortress called the Gilded Palace throwing a massive party for months on end before marching out to fight a khornate champion and his horde which marched out from a dark fortress known as the Tower of Skulls which was a massive fortress with a blood moat surrounding it. And one of the mightiest fortresses of the entire world, the doomkeep is a massive dark fortress in central Norsca.
@@jarlwilliam9932 True, and there should have been fortresses even in the horde mechanics. However, Chaos Warriors are invaders who march south to wreck havoc. At least, according to the lore, rules, and general battle style in the army books. I haven't read the novels.
@@matthewwebster3143Buy WH3 and play The Empire. Their playstyle is pretty much the same as the historical titles but with extra spice in form of magic. That's what I did :)
If you want boring underpowered mechanics you can always play ogre kingdom. Leave woc alone people like you that want everything nerfed until it's so dull it's unplayable are going to kill the game.
Honestly WoC is my go to race when I just want to destroy the world basically…not all factions have to be super challenging, as long as they are fun to play which WoC is insanely fun to play.
Only thing I would add is more dark fortresses in the center of the map
While i agree that not all should be hard, but certainly not all 7 (? forgot how many there are) WoC faction should be.
My favorite campaign so far was a 270 turn Archaon campaign. I conquered the entire right side of the map, and vassalized at least one of each faction. My Favorite army was a Slaanesh lord I named The Elf Fucker. Thanks to modding I built a full army around all 3 Elven factions, Malevolent tree kin front line, Sisters of Avelorn ranged, Har Ganeth Executioners and witch elf for anti infantry, with Heartseekers as Cav support. Shit was absolutely hilarious. The campaign came to an end with one of the major updates. I miss The Elf Fucker, he was great.
What mods do you use?
@@reinaldoantonio7271 For unlimited allied recruitment I use "Allied recruitment / merceneries cap per army remover," I would also recommend "Fixed Allied Outposts" so you don't have to rely for the AI to build the correct buildings to get the fun units.
The warband system looks fair because you need level 7 or above to upgrade chosens or Riders and usually if you are building a new warband it takes time to babysit the hell out of it before it can stand on it's own
I enjoy playing WoC, and they are not that strong when played by the AI. So I think it s nice to have an "easy" playable race
I mean, we have soo many choices. Some need to be hard, some need to be easy. In my opinion.
Belakor and Taurox are my favorite campaigns, that kinda says it all 😅
The most important question is, is it fun? I think the majority of players would say yes.
I would like to be able to play WoC and be challenged. Unfortunately that's not possible currently.
@@Wes1013 I don't know your skill level, but you may be in the small minority of players that are very good at the game. I assume you are on legendary with AI cheats to full? Game developers need to cater to the majority of players because catering to 5% of the high skill players won't last.
@@dotmadhack high skill players should be able to find a challenge at high difficulty. lower skill players can just lower the difficulty. everyone wins.
I kwit their kampainz because steamrolling from turn 1 gets boring
Yeah it's super fun, I play modded tho so anything unbalanced can be self-balanced
I personally feel Chaos went from being a faction that took thought and foresight to raid the world, Now it feels like an end turn win turn simulator.
Play on dufficulty higher thsn easy, maybe
@@shmekelfreckles8157 I play on hard/hard. While true, it isn't legendary, but that is fun for me.
Chaos is not a difficult faction by any stretch of the imagination.
@@meltingskeleton2082 any factions that must fight ordertide is not easy. It can go better or worse, sure, but as a rule of thumb it’s not gonna be a cakewalk. Fighting late game Kislev and dwarfs on legendary is soul-crushing.
WoC 1 weakness: Their armies are gone when destroyed. It takes them a while to get a really good army, and their starting units arent great. Add on to this: they are limited in how much they can recruit of a given unit.
I like them, they were a great intro to the game.
Be nice for them to increase the costs at higher difficulties as that would resolve problems without removing the fun.
Your outposts also boost Norsca income.
Be'lakor's faction shouldn't even be Warriors of Chaos, but rather Demons of Chaos.
His faction actually does have a DoC emblem, but it can only be used in multiplayer under normal circumstances.
yeah but demon's of chaos doesn't work because the mechanic is tied to the DP. Be'lakor makes much more sense in WoC because of that, he would be significantly weaker as a faction if he was in DoC. DoC is a boring faction, whose access to New DLC demons is the only reason it's not the worst in the game.
Needs a complete rework, I'm mad that CA has completely abandoned that faction.
@@HomesliceMcB DP's mechanic is a faction-specific mechanic, not a racial one. If you've ever dabbled in modding, you'd see that all mechanics are actually interchangeable.
Be'lakor can literally be race-shifted and function the exact same way. Lol. It makes more sense too, as he's the first demon prince, and has buffs for demonic units.
There's also a mod out there that allows DoC to lorefully confederate everything beneath them in the hierarchy (which includes monogod factions). They're technically the highest on the ladder, being undivided demons.
@@BloodwyrmWildheart the tech tree is the demon princes skill tree…it would have to be changed, I’m not saying it’s difficult, it’s absolutely against the design. And if Be’lalor gets a similar mechanic that would be much weaker than what he has now. The design of demons of chaos is dogshit imo, Be’lalor would have to be a carbon copy essentially of the DP, as if he keeps his mechanics and skill free, he is way stronger than the DP. Be’lalor doesn’t even make sense for the build a bear, skill point tech tree.
I prefer the WoC for Be’lalor, I like their faction specific mechanics. You have the ability to go full demons with him if you want. He would also lose the WoC units, which would suck, I like variety and choices. I don’t want to limit that for some arbitrary thematic reason.
You understand?
Hmmmm. . . Vilitch with 19 sorverers of Tzeentch with the level 7 talent, which boosts barrier replenishment and give him more magic to spam. The only thing that absolutely DESTROYED me was Imrik. Everything else couldn't even poke through the barrier. I expect the Chorfs to be more dangerous if they happen to have enough blunderbusses.
Belakor just stays on his island to get his ass handed to him every 20 turns when he tries to invade the Empire in most of my campaign...
He usually does that to Bretonnia in my games.
In a recent SFO Kislev campaign, I kicked him out of Albion, whilst he somehow got Sword of Khaine whilst fighting besides Nkari. He proceeded to get 3 settlements on Ulthuan and Bretonnia, but his autoresolve, even with SoK, was still garbage and he couldnt stay alive against AI until I sailed down there.
The AI doesnt really know how to play or what to do with him because of his awkward start, ive noticed Noctilus sometimes suffers this same issue with his as well, but less so since his treasure hunts usually give him something to run off and do. In the hands of the player, Belakor is insanely broken. Its almost impossible to lose with him unless you really try@Grivehn
@@me3moo2 Im not refuting he is broken in player hands.
But AI doesnt do great with Chaos in general, and youre right. Albion is a bad start without using portals.
Belakor is in range of Naggarond (Alith Anar), Ulthuan, Bretonnia, the Empire and Norsca. And the AI can pick a fight with any one or all of them, which makes the AI absolutely ineffective until someone parks 3 armies on his doorstep and puts him out of his misery.
I’ve rarely seen that sometimes Belakor will instead invade Norsca and get 4 or so dark fortresses, and I’ve also seen him declare war on Sigvald and take two or three dark fortresses before leaving out with Sigvald but those games are very rare.
WoC level power is the reason why I would recommend them to a beginner, especially Archaon. Your only challenge is Boris and after dealing with him you are completely free to do whatever you want. Maybe you want to take your time and build up your forces? If that's so - go to the west and crush+vassalize Daniel with Epidemius and confederate Sigvald with Valkiya after which you can pretty much roleplay as a crisis faction and collapse on all continents. Or you can go take Kholek and plunder the whole of Cathay and deal with Grimgor. Or you can launch an early invasion into Kislev and the Empire. Archaon's campaign is very forgiving in terms of player decisions, because literally nobody can get to your main Dark Fortress and do something about you. Bel'akor at least may have to fight with a random crusade from Bretonnia, but Archaon doesn't have that issue. So aside from a bit tricky gifts mechanic, this is as beginner friendly as the campaign could get.
Its aways a rule of thumb to take archaeon out as early as possible if hes a threat to you as if you allow him to get strong he can be nearly unkillable.
Yo is not mods. They added Toad Dragon and dlc units like Change Bringers to gifted units.
WoC are cool, not my favorite . Belakor it's always a tempting campaign start but i don't know if i would have fun playing it. Army building freedom is cool but I hate that chaos factions have to fight chaos for the first 60 turns before atacking empire , bretonnia.
I'm interested in trying festus start position in RoC it looks cool in Belakor place near Vilitch.
You make some interesting points, but Khorne cares not from whence the blood flows.
Almost newer play Caos, they are soooo OP not even funny to play. There should be some proper counter to them , otherwise what's the point to play.
If you play Sigvald and later he snow balls very quickly once u vassalize valkia
I think you meant to say 'Once you vassalize Malekith and Hellebron'. Heh.
@@Costin_Gaming nah they get anti points on the corruption so gotta garrison in there
i would love a beginners guide to warhammer, i want to get into this but i dont own a single game and dont know where to start, i like how you explain everything so if possible this would help me and others like me
It's pretty expensive, but if you are willing to put the money down, this game is absolutely VAST
The prologue of the third game will give you a pretty good introduction. After that, I wouldn't recommend the campaign - just go for immortal empires, and start with a faction with minimal faction and lord gimmicks, so you can get used to the game. After you beat that, try some other factions, and increased difficulties. Also, don't play on the Easy difficulty - it throws off the balance, and it's not a good way to get familiarized with the game.
Lots of those available! Zerkovich has some good playlist guides for them: www.youtube.com/@Zerkovich/videos
Take a look at the beginners guides by Zerkovich or ItalianSpartacus. If you are going to buy something just get Warhammer 3 and if you do like it then add whatever DLC you want after that, also dont waste any time playing the realm of chaos campaign as it sucks just jump into playing immortal empires.
If you want decent tutorials, watch Zerkovich. He’s got an entire playlist.
I enjoyed WoC in WH1 and WH2 more than WH3. I think the horde system was very lore-appropriate and made the campaign difficult enough, especially in the beginning. WoC are meant to go around and raiding, not to sit comfortably in their Dark Fortresses letting the weaklings doing their biddings. Too bad not many saw it that way.
I mean they actually do have dark fortresses in the lore, Sigvald in his book aptly named Sigvald spent over half the novel sitting around in his dark fortress called the Gilded Palace throwing a massive party for months on end before marching out to fight a khornate champion and his horde which marched out from a dark fortress known as the Tower of Skulls which was a massive fortress with a blood moat surrounding it.
And one of the mightiest fortresses of the entire world, the doomkeep is a massive dark fortress in central Norsca.
@@jarlwilliam9932 True, and there should have been fortresses even in the horde mechanics. However, Chaos Warriors are invaders who march south to wreck havoc. At least, according to the lore, rules, and general battle style in the army books. I haven't read the novels.
Because it’s end times.. the end times book.
Holy shit a none click bait Costin Video.
i should add im not a noob to total war ive been playing since OG shogun but the fantasy genre for warhammer i don't know where to start
It effectively plays the same. Just has the addition of some generals having magical spell access, which function like artillery.
@@Xenomorphine ahh okay, there seems to be a lot of different mechanics compared to historical titles and thats what id like to wrap my head around.
I just would take a faction that I like and start on normal difficulty than you are going to learn :) ( learning by doing)
@@michl8917 but what do i buy, i figure all the games and dlc at the same time to get the full experience, thats what im also curious about
@@matthewwebster3143Buy WH3 and play The Empire. Their playstyle is pretty much the same as the historical titles but with extra spice in form of magic. That's what I did :)
If you want boring underpowered mechanics you can always play ogre kingdom. Leave woc alone people like you that want everything nerfed until it's so dull it's unplayable are going to kill the game.
Kholek best waifu
Their power level is very lore accurate. Also, every woc campaign is crazy good fun.