I'm starting to trust Kim...a little - Therapist Plays Disco Elysium: Part 5
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ม.ค. 2024
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Just wanted to say I appreciate that everyone has been able to have discussions here about complex issues while remaining civil and hugely informative. I will have the wrong takes sometimes about characters, storytelling, and mental health, and I'm okay with all of that. But I'm not okay with it when it causes people to feel misunderstood or hurt by it. I have a tendency to get caught up in trying to explain something like the intellectualizing graph, and overlooking the nuance of what I am saying to get there. It's an issue of mine and I'll work on it going forward. Thank you to everyone who shared a perspective on how they relate to these issues, I've learned a lot from them. I'll see you in the next one 💙
Honestly, i've stopped playing this game, because i prefer watching you playing and analyzing it. So don't worry, you're doing perfectly fine. Well, except for..you know..waiting for the next part is pretty hard to manage :D
@@imikoimo6685 I recommend toy you to have the first experience by yourself. But it's your choice.
I think a lot of Kim's stand-offish attitude comes from the fact that he came to work this morning expecting to meet a fellow professional cop who just wants to do their work and solve the murder, rather than a semi-deranged hungover amnesiac who alternates between asking probing personal questions and not understanding the basics of reality. He'd probably be more open in a clinical setting.
Bro become a annoying colleague that keep asking personal questions lol
"Cuno is the most important character in this game"
Please GOD let him get that one conceptualization check. If you know you know.
I know some of the comments have already disagreed with your take on Kim, so I'd like to instead just throw my own experience into the ring for you as I found I ended up identifying with Kim in a lot of ways regarding that topic. I'm a person that was born and raised in the Southwestern US, of Mexican descent but born in America. My parents were also of Mexican descent, born in America. My grandparents too. Their parents as well. As a matter of fact we have to go back several generations for you to find someone in my bloodline on either side that wasn't from the United States...but they were still from this same area, it's just that this part of the country was Mexico back then. We never moved, not in at least the 400 years I could find researching, the border just crossed us.
Despite that, my entire life I've been asked questions and told things very similarly to what you spoke about Kim. That I must feel a certain way because I don't connect with my Mexican culture, since I don't speak with an accent and have no real connection to Mexico in any way. My grandparents were all dead before I was born, my parents are both perfectly standard english speaking Americans that happen to have Mexican ancestry, so we have dark hair and dark eyes and hispanic names, and so because of that I am very, very aware that for some reason despite being here longer than most any white family in the nation with few exceptions I am not looked at as a "default" American - when people across the country or indeed across the world think of Americans, they don't think of people like me. I've been asked so many times throughout my life things about what I feel about my culture, my heritage. When I respond that my culture is American, maybe southwestern, they almost want to correct me like I made a mistake and didn't realize my culture is actually Mexican. If I tell them the history of my city, my state, the things my family did here, they still manage to redirect me to try and ask about my thoughts and feelings and connections to a country and a culture that my family hasn't been a part of in literally hundreds of years.
I take no umbrage with your thought process in how you approached Kim here - I get it, the assumption. He must be deflecting and denying because of some deep-seated regret or remorse about a lack of connection with his racial identity. But as someone that has lived that life all I can tell you is that all it does is make us feel like strangers in our own home - I am an American born of and raised in American culture much like Kim is Revacholiere born of and raised in Revachol culture, and the only one that seems to regret the loss or absence of any other culture for Kim and for myself are folks like you that, in good-natured attempts, assume we must be unwhole or broken without some extra connection to a culture that doesn't belong to us.
Just my own thoughts on it, really enjoying this playthrough.
This comment is incredibly insightful to me, thank you for sharing so much of your perspective on this. You're right that it is all too easy to suppose there is something emotionally conflicting about a story such as yours, or Kim's. In this case, my goal with the dialogue was simply to demonstrate the approach of exploring whether there is such a conflict, and seeing that there isn't one, find it sufficient to move on. I didn't realize though that the way it was pursued represents such a common misunderstanding that many live with daily. So, I appreciate perspectives like this that highlight that. It's easy to miss, though it really shouldn't be. My apologies 💙
@@eurobrady no apologies necessary! Just keep doing you and keep learning, and I'll do the same.
@@eurobradyJust piggybacking off this comment here to say I completely understand what you were saying here regarding Kim. I saw it as coming at an angle as a therapist. As you were saying, the whole point in therapy is to ask some of those tough questions. It’s almost like you have to be one of those racist people to provoke the emotions of the client, but in a safe space. I think a lot of people are just overly defensive because of that very reason, it provokes feelings in them that they may have felt in the past. Or they just care about Kim, which is a bit dumb since he’s a made up character but meh. They’re also talking from hindsight since they’ve played the game more.
I’ve been through therapy that had to get cut short because they moved away. But I felt like I struggled with getting into that ‘psychological work zone’. I’m way too good at intellectualising my feelings. My therapist was actually surprised by my understanding and language I used to describe my feelings, but at some point I could actually feel in the room I was making it harder for us both.
Anyways thanks for these streams, I’ve tried to watch some other playthrough but none are as good as this, seriously. I’m learning a lot whilst enjoying someone not rushing through the game and playing it in a ‘meta’ way.
Sorry, gotta disagree with your takes on Kim's cultural perception of himself. Chat said similar stuff, but the fact is the reason he gets so defensive isn't that he feels bad for not being connected to Seol, its that he's clearly been asked these things before with different meaning. Kim wants to be seen as Revacholiere, not Seolite, because Revachol is what he knows and loves. The prodding makes him uncomfortable because the detective is doing exactly what a racist would: refusing to see him as a fellow countryman and othering him for his ethnicity. Essentially, you asked an asian guy "what Are you".
Edit: I want to be clear though I'm still loving the playthrough and plan on watching it all. This is the Only time I've disagreed thus far, you're an analytical machine and a joy to watch.
Yeah. Brady's line of questioning would have unfortunately "overhit" because Kim probably would have closed himself off entirely from that conversation because Brady's follow-up questions would have come off as very racist.
Authority/Empathy Success in noticing that Kim was avoiding the line of questioning because it was uncomfortable, Perception/Logic failure in understanding why.
Backseating after the fact is still backseating, folks
@@Birthday888 Wondering and asking someone about their ethnicity out of genuine platonic curiosity is not racist. Hell, pushing the issue and asking them repeatedly when they're obviously not willing to talk about it also isn't racist. It'd be rude and all other fancy words you want to use for ''being a socially inept asshole'', but it wouldn't be racist.
@@yannrsa See, while the detective is not being racist and not everyone who does this is either, the fact is that it *can* have racist intent and is an incredibly exhausting question to hear over and over as a POC. Notice how noone asks or comments on where the detective is from: he's white to us, and in the game's universe, they just *assume* he's from Revachol. He isn't seen as out of place.
@@fox_e_crow3276 How is this backseating? I'm not telling him what to do or not do, I'm expressing I dont agree with something he has already done. He's not gonna change his whole play style over this lol
I personally saw Kim's comments on Seol and Revachol very differently. Kim hates racists like the Lorry Driver, and looks proud for shooting down your questions about Seol, specifically because he doesn't feel like he's a Seolite. He has no connection to it. He was born in Revachol. He grew up in Revachol. He lives and talks like a Revacholiere. He *IS* a Revacholiere.
His face may look like that of a Seolite, and his genes may be half-Seolite, but his mind and soul are Revacholiere. Seol is some far off place he doesn't care about (beyond wishing it would stop intruding in conversations with strangers), and he would rather people stop judging him as foreign or knowing foreign things.
Fair points, I'm going to get plenty of things wrong as I go, this is the first real conversation I had with Kim and there is still a lot to learn about him that neither I nor the character know yet. I'm missing a lot of context still.
The most underrated moment
18:12
Brady: “Cuno represents EVERYTHING. What am I doing if I’m not trying help him?”
Game: “the lieutenant is unaware of what’s happening in your head or why you’re touching it. He merely expect you to write down his notes on the man’s genitalia so you can move on”
What I like about Disco Elysium from a storytelling perspective is that even though The Detective has lost all memory with high enough skills (or even when they're low but you, the player, have luck) you get these hints of brilliance from him. The character is "stupid", yes, but somewhere down there is experience, knowledge and instincts of someone who can at a glance classify footprints frozen in the mud, or identify when someone is lying to him, or be familiar enough with the workings of his colleagues at precinct 41 to imagine how they go about checking a dead body.
Disco Elysium is a very hopeful game, I find.
It's not nearly as "on the nose" but the DE subplot of solving the mystery of yourself is a slightly more hopeful version of Planescape: Torment's "What can change the nature of a man. Perhaps nothing can." But you walk away from DE feeling like maybe that's okay. Optimal, even.
Disco Elysium is actually the most hopeful game I've ever experienced (maybe tied with Outer Wilds). You don't start out in a good place, and that's intentional. I think a lot of people don't really believe you can come back from rock bottom without seeing it happen.
I like how you make logical assessments of the characters, their internal mechanisms and how they interact with their environment, because of it.
But I know whenever you say „Maybe…“ at the start of a sentence in a very assertive manner, it’s gonna be some of the most batshit insane assumption I’ve heard of that character in my life.
Never change
lmaooo this got a good laugh out of me
I think we previously saw Kim's anxiety spike up in the conversation with the "Racist Lorrey Driver". Where the racist says "Welcome to Revachol" and Kim dresses him down about how Kim is as much, if not more Revachol than him.
That's because "Welcome to Revachol" is an in-universe equivalent of "Go back to your own country", which the lorry driver said unprovoked. The guy may as well have called Kim a slur, for all the social difference it makes.
With white checks, it's basically never a good idea to level up before trying them, because levelling up will unlock a failed check, so you can try, level up, and try again. If you level up before hand, you're just forfeiting that first attempt, which lowers your overall chance of passing the check. Sometimes a white check will hurt you if you fail, but you'll never know which checks do that until you try, so I wouldn't worry about it.
Even if they do ping you for a point of damage, that's typically worth the reroll.
Just don't forget to switch over to proper attire before doing skill checks.
Gotta seriously disagree with the thing with Kim. Kim doesn’t want any connection to Seol. He doesnt like Seol. If you talk with the lorry driver, he calls it a "xenophobic empire" or something along those lines. He says his ancestors got to Revachol a long time ago. He wants you to see him as a fellow Revacholian, not as a foreigner. Ultimately, as a minority it isn't difficult to be "othered" even when there's no ill intent. I can tell you from personal experiences.
Yeah, same experience here. It's important imo to note that noone questions the detective's ancestry, but suddenly because Kim looks different, there's a need to do it and even insist he wishes he was connected to it. It's not on purpose, but it's disrespectful.
So after rewatching the part in question, I can see that I didn't mention some things about why I would be asking him about his lack of connection to his heritage. As a therapist I don't ever steer the therapy based on my own interpretations about people, I only may press on subjects that I believe would be to the client's benefit to process them deeper. The reason I would ask Kim about his thoughts on his heritage wouldn't be because I assume he necessarily wants to be a part of it. It's clear that he rather identifies with Revachol, which is truly his culture because that is where he grew up. However, it bothers him greatly when people do other him and make assumptions about his heritage. There is raw emotion there that is worth confronting in a safe, therapeutic context. My line of questioning around this would hopefully have the effect of him learning to face those confrontations with more security going forward, because once we bring them to the surface, we can them process them. But they do need to be brought to the surface first, which sometimes requires a bit of provocation. Then, having addressed them in the psychological arena of counseling, where there is no judgement about what one feels, he may find more confidence in his feelings that way.
Evidently, my character asking those questions comes off a completely different way. Coming from him, it's another ignorant person assuming that he must not belong because he does not look like everyone else in Martinaise. I will try to make a better distinction in later episodes between the intention I would have for asking things like that as a therapist versus through my roleplay as the character 💙
@eurobrady for sure important to remember Kim isn't there for therapy, he's there for an inter-departmental pissing match, slightly different context 😂
This playthrough is so interesting. I think that the thing with Kim is that he *might* genuinely not be all that connected to his culture, nor care to be connected to it or interested in it, because his culture is not Seol, it is Revachol, in his eyes. Yet people keep failing to see this and *want* to see him as an outsider.
It's not that he feels alienated towards Seolite culture, he feels alienated from Revachol by being Seolite. Seol isn't his home - his home is Revachol and first and foremost he is Revacholiere above Seolite, but people are trying to convince him otherwise.
But this is just my reading of him.
Agreed completely.
His attitude actually reminds me deeply of an old friend I had. He was the most stereotypically Chinese LOOKING man you'd ever meet but his whole identity was deeply deeply British. He liked fish and chips, snarky banter and a few pints tok many down the pub. it really pissed him off when people didn't just treat him like the brit that he truly was at heart
I think this is shaping up to be the best playthrough of Disco Elysium I've seen. On par with WoolyVersus' playthrough. I genuinely can't wait for each new episode.
I'm sorry, but no. He doesn't even realize you can retry checks yet.
@@UlfMTG He did retry the check to get the tie. But overall, that's beside the point of the game. The gameplay mechanics are just a vehicle for the character and story elements, which he's fully engaged with.
@@UlfMTGI’d love to watch *your* first playthrough of Disco Elysium and criticize *you* for what you didn’t learn fast enough. Humble yourself and learn some manners.
I don't like the way he sees Kim. He seems to think that the esprit de corps line about Kim putting himself in harm way to save you, was a line said by Kim and he role plays his relationship with him based on that when it's a strong feeling. Harry's body is the one telling him he should trust Kim. So he should have trusted him.
@@JevjevjevjDo you have *any* idea how moronic you sound when you try to “educate” someone on the “point” of a game like this?
I'm glad you had a "children are the future" moment with Cuno, and I'm excited to see you deal with the bookstore lady and her child. There's a beautiful bit of dialogue in there that I think you'll appreciate.
Disco Elysium helped me understand myself in a lot of ways, so seeing someone who has professional experience and knowledge on the many things discussed in the game is not only entertaining but also pretty informative.
Thank you for playing this game and sharing your view on it with us!
17:24 Oh man, I think the Cuno arc is going to come to absolute no surprise to you since the game did a great job at telegraphing it for you, but I bet it still hits like a damn truck even knowing in advance where it's going
CUNO IS THE KEY TO ALL OF THIS
i feel like it's tough to judge Kim considering he's meant to spend 95% of the game with you, and you're not even at the end of day 1! other characters (ex. Racist Lorry Driver) are one note and easier to quickly understand what they're about. Loving the play through, can't wait for more content!
I'm so sad you failed that Perception check. It's one of the most important checks in the game imo
motorics in general are stats that don't do much except for the few moments of apotheosis that are required,
best stat in my opinion
eh, It is not so important. Like, yeah it shed a lot of light on case early, but it is not even close to be THE most important
Rare to send in the body for processing before even trying to find a fridge. This playthrough is going to be interesting.
Motorics skills aren't THAT important..... until all of a sudden, they are the MOST important. I'd say they are the most ''underrated'' skills in the game, because they're either slightly neat or literally standing between your life and death with close to no inbetween.
Your analysis is very interesting, but you need to keep in mind that Kim is not there for therapy. Kim is very clear in his intentions, he wants to catch the murder and your questions about his jacket or origins are just a waste of time in his mind.
Cuno’s gonna heal *you*, my man.
After his analysis of Kim, I am actually kind of hoping he ends up failing that one Authority check. You know the one.
THE EYEBROWSSS!!!
@@nubnooblet no, they mean THE cursed check
YES YES YES YES YES YES
Found your channel a couple days ago. This is one of the greatest playthrough i ever seen! Very interesting to watch your reasonings and explanations about some psychological things. That also gives more to know about the game and how deeply it well thought out. Thank you!
That track that plays when you talk to the corpse is one of my favorites in the game. So dark and melancholic.
You're playing the story I'm such a weird way. It's so cool the game will let you play however you want and it will take you along regardless.
1:00:54 this "Jamrock shuffle" part is too nice. such a creative way of subtly breaking the fourth wall 👌
I'm seriously loving this playthrough. One little thing to make it even better for me would be for you to read the detective lines when you click them. Sometimes I'm only listening to this and I have to go back to read.
I'm excited for the next episode
I think you might want to run around and explore a bit to collect items, particularly clothes and pay attention to what stats are boosted by those clothes.
Dont forget what you can retry white checks after you put one more point in skill what will do the check. Sometimes you can boost skills just for some special checks. Like you can try to open mystery BLUE box, for example. Dont be afraid to boost skills just for it, you will have a lot of new points with time. Dont put them all in your main skills, they can overcome you by shutting other skills down and you can miss a lot of details.
Moment with Kim`s eyebrow is one of my favorite little things in whole game. He is a regular detective, but when you ask him about his secrets he just move his brow and your are unable to speak. your high Authority is just destroyed by his hidden power of pushing people down. Kim is Authority in absolute when he wants to. So funny.
Just wanted to say what i LOVE your way to play this game. Best way to play this game what i saw. Sometimes chat distract you from important details but its okay.
Surely will watch every part. I even have little hope for another playthrough later with completely different character.
❤ Just love it.
I'd love to see you focus more on Cunoesse - not your character, but you analysing her. People tend to overlook her for Cuno, and she doesn't have nearly as much dialogue, but what she has is... a lot.
Hell yeah.
Btw, for white checks: if you fail them, you can gain the opportunity to retry them by placing a point into the relevant skill. If you fail again, placing 'another' point will allow you another attempt, essentially indefinitely, so long as you have the points and learning cap to spare.
Every time you go off about Cuno it brings a smile to my face.
this conversation about how having a crisis is better than intellectualizing all the time made me think a lot about my own behavior lol this whole gameplay had been amazing btw i'm really learning some interesting stuff and having fun at the same time. tysm for that!!!
This is definitely one of the more interesting playthrus of the game but I feel like you're ignoring some of the ground truths the game gives to you. In the "questioning Kim" segment it makes sense to interpret his defensiveness in that fashion if you're a therapist, but in the game you're not, you're his colleague (equal) and that line of questioning comes across as affirming the racial distance between you and Kim more than it does you trying to help him.
One more thing I wanted to note is that it seems purposeful that both Kim's parents are half-Seolite, instead of the usual half-Asian dynamic where one parent is fully Asian. At that point the cultural connection has been diluted to the point that I don't see why Kim would identify with his Seolite aspects in any meaningful way -- they're more just inconvenient signifiers for him that don't serve any purpose but to ostracize him from a full Revacholian status.
Great insight as always, love this series!
I love how you actually put yourself in the shoes of the character it makes the game feel so much more real !!!! I actually do enjoy you not trusting Kim off the bat, from a roleplaying perspective it makes sense that someone who literally does not remember anything or anyone in their lives (and is tremendously self-critical) wouldn't just trust somebody inmediately... I love how your character also pushes him away at times, pushing his buttons just to see if he will leave him 😭😭 it feels SO human thank you so much for this playthrough 🙏🙏 When's the next stream?
If he picked the physical archetype, he could have even the game signal him his distrust of other people because you lack empathy, volition and espirit decorps to actually see their real intentions. Also his electrochemistry would be unchained without volition.
Loving everything about this so far
The whole thing about listening to Volition taking a lot of energy out of a person (especially in the initial stages) had reminded me of a few lines from different songs. Specifically:
"Five years ago
I was broken enough to just shut the f**k up
I got sober by going to rehab
And not arguing so much for once"
and
"I took the needle out of my arm about
A year ago today
And every day since then I've been taking
The needle out of my brain"
Volition truly takes a lot of effort to follow. Just having it is not enough.
If you push the "murdered by seagulls" angle Kim loses his patience with you and swears, telling you to leave the box blank.
If you mess up with shooting the corpse down and shoot the body in the chest, you can have a fun interaction with Kim where you say "what about the injuries we've inflicted", and he goes "we?". Attempts to convince him that mutilating the body was a "team effort" do not land.
Cuno approves of Kim insisting that damage you inflicted on the body isn't mentioned in the report.
Really enjoyed the watch including the previous Episodes, so much to take with, really glad you're sharing your expertise in such fun way! Thank you!
This is becoming one of my favorite series and my favorite channel. It's so interesting to hear the point of view of a young therapist over extreme examples such as the ones presented in the game. So refreshing too. Good job and keep it going :)
What an insightful and refreshing gameplay :), I´ve played this game 3 times already, it´s one of my favorites, yet in your videos and this focus on relationships and mental health I´m learning so much about the game, the narrative and the way Zaum approaches character building, and also my own mental health ha. This is wild and I love it, thanks for doing it!
Found your channel a couple days ago -seriously enjoying this playthrough - thank you so much for making this.
The intellectualizing graph was something I actually brought up in my therapy session and it helped me overcome a GIANT obstacle that would probably be in the way for a long time.
Much appreciated, Brady!
That's actually so interesting to link theoretical material with the game. Currently in my first year of clinical training and I love this series.
You know for the current role play of detective cousteau as a washed up therapist desperately trying to prove his authority (anything we find out about him not withstanding.) Assuming shit about Kim that is just kinda wrong is very in-character. I say this as a good thing
also i love the way you talk about the game, makes me feel like a therapist CAN understand me
Oh, you are doing so well with Kim. :) It's a pleasure to watch--you are getting things about him that the game hasn't shown you yet, and that you may not even see in this playthrough.
ahhhahah I wait for these so patiently
The therapeutic work zone is an interesting thing - you can never be 100% sure whether you're going to underhit or overhit. However, as a therapist, you have the time to work with it. One thing I remember as an overhit was a psychiatrist (not even therapist) of my late wife. My late wife was a survivor of extreme child abuse (no details, to avoid triggers) that continued over years and you can imagine had a strong mental health impact. Her psychiatrist once asked her, during a regular 15-minute med checkup, to consider whether she had responsibility for the abuse. It was up to me, afterwards, to help peel her from the ceiling after that one.
Never level up a skill before trying white checks. Try the check, then level up and try again. You get two chances to succeed. Also you will get extra dialogue (occasionally hilarious) if you fail the first time.
There is a watershed moment between you and Kim within the main story, but I love the way at any stage of the investigation, you can create friction with far reaching implications. And the voices in your head already know when you are about to head down a rocky path. Such a labour of love in terms of just the dialogue system alone.
Good stuff man ! Thanks for this. New sub.
Great video!
Not retrying the white check with a level up was frustrating. :(
That explanation about the psychological work zone was very interesting! Kinda reminds of massaging, when you need to untangle a knot in a muscle. You have to prod and press down until it hurts to untangle it
I am now glad that none of the people I usually watch playing games played it, and that I am now watching it here.
This is fascinating!
"This game has such a way of painting a picture. Gorgeous"
Shivers: Hold my prose
cuno is pretty complex which is such a good choice to have for the first impression is hes throwing rocks at a body
I could watch 10000000 more episodes of this disco elysium playthrough.
I'm starting to not trust my therapist
Because they're trying to make you anxious?
@cleverman383 No haha because Brady's playthrough of this is genuinely unhinged.
Some of Kim's best stats are composure and authority. He doesn't see you as someone who CAN rile him up, should be able to, or has the right to try. He's probably right. Good luck.
Kim's weird little biases are so interesting. Some of them are a cop's defense mechanisms and some of them come from somewhere deeper than his job. People love Kim, and a lot of it is his being your rock when you're at your worst, but so much of it is that he's a BELIEVABLE rock, rather than some kind of holy savior.
More from the therapist. Nice!
Shivers: [Unkown - Success] At the entrance of a towering pinewood structure, a man with a white rectangle sowed on the back of his bright-coloured jacket stands waiting. Another man emerges from the building. They look at each other, and not a word is said.
It's colder outside than it was before.
I think while the analysis of Kim in this episode has been pointed out as being wrong, it's wrong in exactly the way Raphael Ambrosius Cousteau would get it wrong. He's not a proud racist like our lorry driving friend, he just knows that Lt. Kim doesn't look like the other people in Martinaise.
And because of that he assumes.
It's a very human flaw, and something a great many of us are also guilty of.
Yeah, and like it’s been pointed out many times already, this game tends to get in your head like that. It doesn’t just _say_ what you think, it controls it. You see the options and go “oh hey, this could be useful for understanding this part of someone” without necessarily considering the ramifications of that line of thinking, all because it manages to peak your curiosity. It points out the flaws in the both character and the player. It’s not the most comfortable experience, but damn is it impressive.
i remember on my first playthrough i hit the 3% chance on digging in the mouth and it was amazing. sad he bagged the body, but we all make our own experiences and playthroughs when it comes to games. interested to see where the story goes from here!
Keep up the amazing roleplay! Don't let the negative comments get to you!
That stuff about intellectualizing and the heightened anxiety state was pretty interesting. I would definitely consider myself an intellectualizer in that regard, and i wonder if learning about it will make me more resistant to being in the psychological work zone, or less resistant. Either way its cool to think about.
I would recommend listening to a fan track about Lieutenant's theme, but after some plot event, its comparable to an actual DE music, great track and definitely makes you feel like you know Kim for years. Awesome playthrough thought, i watch every episode, thanks a lot.
It's very funny, how often you allow your Detective to go with Electrochemistry's suggestions (which is basically your impulse choices "in the moment", the invasive thoughts, the "amma do it without thinking at all") and ignore Volition. I'm not saying it's the wrong way to play, but it is an interesting observation. Because when Volition chimes in, it's a CHOICE to ignore it. If you had Low Volition numbers, for instance, then it would make 100% sense from roleplaying perspective to go with Electrochemistry - there's no voice in your head telling you it's a bad idea, after all.
As disruptive as it might seem for roleplaying at times, that's sort of the reason I'm doing it! Even the most self aware, healthy individuals have to battle automatic and impulsive thoughts, many which we tend to act on over our more refined and helpful ones.
Ever make a plan to do a bunch of healthy, mentally taxing stuff like exercising, reading, cooking, etc, but then at the last moment just decide to get greasy takeout and be a couch potato? That's your electrochemistry! Listening to Volition, in real life, takes a lot of energy and mental fortitude. I want our guy to get there, but the way I see him, he's going to struggle for a while. We don't just automatically always do what's in our best interest just because the thought to do so is available to us.
@@eurobrady Don't I know that first hand. Yeah. Good point.
6:23 Volitiooooooon! Such a bro!
The cuno !
Brilliant analysis calling him the culmination of the society depicted in this game
33:00 I felt your pain there twitch chat 😂
Kim is 100% that guy who will claim to be okay unless his hair is actively on fire.
Remember to change your clothes for better chances during the skill checks.
Its so fun to see him completely miss the point about everyone, its ironically really in character lmfao
All part of the roleplay 🤭
I have to admit I cringed quite a bit at the constant presumption that Kim had a singular "culture" and that it was one he that he felt no particular connection to. But plenty of people have already discussed that in-depth with you.
This conversation made me think a bit about how I relate to my own cultural heritage. I'm American, half-white, half-Chinese. In my case, I had a first-generation parent, so my connection is much stronger to Chinese culture than Kim's is to Seolite. That said, I don't really have any strong feelings about it. I'm fascinated by both Chinese and American history and culture, and I'm glad to discuss what I know about either with anyone. And the same is true about cultures I have no specific family connections too.
I think in Kim's case, his race was the one thing keeping him from fitting in with other Revacholieres. Whereas I feel like an outsider for plenty of other reasons, so it wasn't that big of a deal for me.
After hearing from everyone today, I'm cringing at it too. I appreciate your perspective, everyone has a different experience of this but they are all helpful to learn from.
@@eurobrady This is a great series. I'm learning a lot and looking forward to the next episode. :)
I’m glad that most of the comments here are being polite on the subject of Kim’s view of his culture and why your interpretation of it was a bit off base. It is true that you are still missing context and there have only been a few moments that suggest the truth, so it’s not surprising that you didn’t immediately pick up on how he really feels. I think you have a tendency to fixate on one thing and that causes you to miss the broader context sometimes, but there is nothing wrong with just wanting to understand where a person is coming from (as long as you’re doing it in good faith, which you clearly were). This is just a touchy subject for some people is all 😅 and please don’t be afraid to be wrong in the future either, this game is literally made to adapt to that sort of thing. Keep doing what you’re doing 👍 and hope to see more Violet soon 💜
Yeah, I was too focused on trying to raise his anxiety to demonstrate the technique I was talking about, that I just wasn't thinking as much about the subject being used to do so. I appreciate the encouragement 💙 although the reaction has been very understanding, I'm very deeply critical of myself over stuff like this when I fuck up. Something else I need to keep working on 🥲
@@eurobrady oh don’t feel bad, nothing you said was offensive. If anything it was misguided, but that’s bound to happen at some point and no one ever understands all the characters of this crazy complex game perfectly the first time around. Nobody can be perfect, so please don’t feel like you have to be.
@@eurobrady Precisely. You were too focused on proving a point that you completely forgot you were doing it with an individual. You disregarded everything he said that didn't fit with the idea you had already formed of him. I trust you have good intentions as a therapist, but your read of him saying "I'm proud of being from here" being "I bet you actually feel bad for not being from there and you're just coping" is... gross.
Mmm, feel like thats some projection on your part of kims seoulite ancestry. Hes a revacholiere through and through, born and raised, it's all he knows, and the only thing seolite about him is his features. By pursuing that mode of questioning, youd be pigeonholing his identity the wrong way.
Maybe he does have some curiosity about his ancestral home,(from half of his family members sides), but the point that is more often made to him, and that he takes offense to, is that he is not revacholian. Its an otherizing attempt in his eyes and more likely to make him resent you than open up, assume youre just a racist, when thats not really the intention
Yep, I agree with this. I feel like POC might be more attuned to this, idk.
I'm commenting on these things in real time as I uncover them. I get that people disagree but remember that you may have completed the game already and know these things, so you may have sorted out what's clear and what is not about him already. I haven't yet, and in real life we also go through many iterations on our thoughts about why people are the way they are before we refine those ideas and become closer to them. I'll get there, I'm still at the beginning of the game.
@@eurobrady Eh, I understand this but I think it's pretty clear from this conversation saying it's a point of pride for him. It's just something visible minorities go through.
Fair enough, not trying to tell you not to explore @@eurobrady
Jamrock shuffle, baby!
"We have done a lot and also accomplished nothing." LOL. Welcome to Disco Elysium.
Watching how you use your training to strageticly provoke people gave me a lot to think about. I've got a parent who doesn't turn their training off and is no longer welcome to engage me in casual conversation. While they are responsible for their behavior, it's comforting to think they might have been trying to incite from a place of goodwill.
A lot of people said a lot of good things about the racism part. I wanted to add something that would maybe help you frame it. To me, racism isn't an attack on my cultural values - it is an attack on my *safety*. Racism says, you are lesser than me - a line has been crossed, one of the foundations of interaction is gone: that we see each other as equals. At that point, I don't know how far the perpetrator is willing to go in his hatred. And it also is a reminder of how many people want me gone from my home, and that I don't know how far those people are willing to go.
If someone I trust says "I think the tradition of tarof is stupid" I don't really care about that. It's a whole other situation than someone telling me that I should go back to my country. I hope this helps.
when you are playing,it's looks like you already knew what gonna happen.lol,l like people do some preperation.
that was a good pair of boots (sabatons), a shame, really.
Rping as an ex therapist is still contingent with canon behavior, the fact that tequila sunset is already a person, with a past he can't escape even if he tries, makes the "i used to be a therapist" just another of his attempts at escaping his past, while also explaining why he doesn't actually have any therapy skills to speak of, even if he's convinced he does.
I only put a few hours into this game before I got sidetracked a while back... I think, at this pace, I got a good couple of months to pick it back up before I hit spoilers. Nice.
YEAHHHHH!
Hey Brady. You probably have a huge list of shows recommended to you but do you by any chance have Welcome to NHK on there? Given the subject matter of that show I wouldn't be surprised if you do. It's a story about a shut in and the way it is delivered seems very realistic since original novel which anime is based on is also written by a shut-in.
It has a lot of stuff you could nerd out on. It can get heavy at times but there is a lot of comedy as well
Hey Brady. New to your channel and watching this amazing playthrough.
Can I ask what app do you use for the free hand notes? Thank you very much.
Sure! It's called Concepts.
I know the Kim issue has already been settled in a follow-up video, but I'd just like to add that Kim's racial identity should probably be viewed through a distinctly European lens. He is not a member of the American 'melting pot', and he is not failing to connect to his cultural roots because he is an ocean and a generation apart from his homeland; rather, his fellow Revacholians *expect* him to share that culture, and *deny* him the identity of a true Revacholiere that he desperately wants to belong to (the only identity he's ever known). He wants to fit in to a country that should belong to *him* just as much as it does to any white Revacholiere, but his compatriots don't see past his skin tone and eye shape and judge him on a surface level.
Exactly! There doesn't seem to be many Seolites in Revachol it seems, since we don't see any others in the game. But he's just a normal Revachol guy, or like... not even just normal but a true patriot of Revachol. Yet Kim takes all the Seolite-related and even racist comments in stride, and only speaks up when he feels something is truly malicious, even when he has the right to push back against any comment, even the innocent - but ignorant ones. He's so devoted to Revachol and his duty as a detective, he's such a good guy. No wonder he's so popular.
TBH I would imagine the only truly significant thing about him having Seolite heritage is the prejudice he's faced has made him even tougher and more able to deal with dark and upsetting things as a detective. That thought is just my own speculation though lol.
I think the big part of this bit of the playthrough not going over well with viewers is all the weird 'pushing' and assumptions and stuff, which, as you mentioned, he did address in a follow-up video. But it's definitely brutal seeing someone make such pointed assumptions about Kim who is just a normal dude trying to do his job for the city he loves.
MAXIMUM Velocity
I really enjoyed the part where you stopped and talked about what you're doing with regards to the "crisis" and "intellectualizing" thing.
It does make me kind of sad because i feel i have some mental health issues myself but i have intellectualized them so much that it seems almost clinical to me as to how i approach my mental health issues. I hope this statement of intellectualization being bad is not universal as it'd bode badly for me 😔
Regarding anxiety and intellectualizing, I feel like the emotion you're plotting vertically isn't the same as anxiety, or maybe I'm misunderstanding one or more definitions. I'm basing this off of me , I struggle with lots of anxiety but also intellectualize way too much. Is this a definition difference or can defense mechanisms interact with this in ways I'm not understanding?
In any case, great video, new to your content and loving it 💕
No you're on the right track, the vertical side of the chart could also be described as like any avoided psychological tension. I usually say anxiety because it's quicker to explain that way but you can certainly be both highly intellectualizing and have a lot of anxiety.
Praise be to the Algorithm
A bit late to the party, but mondial doesn't mean tomorrow, that would be "demain". "Mondial" would mean, depending on context "worldwide", it literally means "related to the entire world"
As much as I'm enjoying your perspective here I've got to voice a little disagreement regarding your approach to Kim. You say that if you had the freedom in the game (or if Kim was a patient of yours) you'd respond to his offhandedness regarding his Seolite ancestry by inquiring about how he feels about not having a connection to his culture, or his familial upbringing, or his cultural language. Well what if Kim feels nothing specific about it? What if, to Kim, his family ancestry in Seol truly doesn't mean anything to him? It seems to me that a key element of Kim's sense of self in Disco Elysium is that he is a Revacholian, not that he is half-Revacholian and half-Seolite. I got the feeling from him that he has no real connection to Seol and has no real interest in it and the fact that people keep bringing it up and that people keep assuming that he places some importance in it is something that annoys him.
You missed so much content by sending that body in the processing, game screamed at you.
That's okay I'm having fun in spite of myself
What the game "screams" at you is that succeeding at tasks is not important. Raphaël is neither intelligent nor perceptive. If he misses information in the autopsy because of those deficiencies and gets it later by means more suited to his character, that's even better than what you would have done in your own playthrough.
@@eurobrady Don't worry about "missing so much content" in the game, worst case scenario if you want to see what you "missed" you can have another playthrough and choose differently, or you can watch someone else play. This game absolutely does not have a "correct" way to play it.
@@hiten_style I mean even the corpse itself said there are ancient secrets down there, also.
Plus that talk about finding the fridge.
Then Inland Empire tells you that you can't shake the feeling that there are more secrets concealed in the flesh before you. The character is absolutely perceptive enough.
He even chooses the dialogue "Yes. There's something we're not seeing' and then just drops it all.
30:50 Math is not your strong point, I feel.. 2+2 is B.A.D. when you need 6+6. 🤭
Heya! I wanted to talk a bit about Kim's relationship to his heritage. Part of what I'm about to say is colored by my own experiences here, and I acknowledge the bias. Anyways:
Kim views his Seolite heritage as not something to *embrace*, but something to *overcome*. He does not want to be seen as "Seolite and proud", he wants to be seen as a true Revacholian, accepted by the city. You said something about defending his culture that he knows nothing about -- I don't think that's true! In the conversation with the racist lorry driver he says he came from a "backwards, isolationist" culture. That's the product of internalized racism, obviously, and probably comes from the fact that Seolites are a minority in Revachol -- growing up with a feeling of isolation, and hence, wanting acceptance.
Where my bias comes in: I don't think "embrace your heritage" is The Solution; in order to explain that I need to talk about my past. Unlike Kim, I grew up around other asian people. I grew up in a town with a significant east asian population (like 25% east asian). I knew quite a bit about my culture, I visited my grandparents a few times, I knew what the festivals and traditions were ... although, more accurately, I _knew of_ the festivals and traditions, but didn't get to participate in them -- my parents were very socially isolated, so we never celebrated any holiday, let alone Chiense ones. I experienced the _negative_ parts of being Chinese without any of the _good_ parts: the intense academic pressure, the facile obsession with wealth as an indication of success, the pressure to compete with your peers and succeed by any means necessary (including a hell of a lot of cheating). Was I outcast for being Chinese? No. Still didn't really like being Chinese though. This, too, is internalized racism; just of a different flavor.
Getting back to the point ... my therapist tried the usual "embrace your heritage" suggestion on me, but I pushed back against it. Longterm, my goal isn't to love being Chinese and be a true-blooded Chinese person ... no, my goal is to just stop hating a part of myself I can't change. That doesn't mean love, necessarily. Lukewarm acceptance works too. Just anything that isn't seething, wounded hatred. Sometimes you can't love, not right away, and neutrality is a good first step --or the only reachable step at the time. (There's a similar discussion around body positivity vs body neutrality -- saccharine positivity would be something like "your acne is beautiful go off queen", and neutrality would be more like "yeah i have acne it sucks but its whatever".) Kim and I grew up very different, but I think that's where his headspace would be at: not loving Seolite heritage, but not rejecting it either.