Sephiroth is so powerful he came back to re-write the first game. Edit: Thank you for the likes! so happy FFVII has gained new fans to this beloved story and now we get see it unfold in a new way. love this community!
yet the game play out at 98 percent of the same things happened i call that a crapy re-write on his part. everyone keep saying it as aeirth death but holy is what stopped him not aeirth's death( just made it longer for the party to finally get his plan and get to him) but if she did not die then it is over right there cause she was calling holy when she died. making it lose-lose for him.
@@donaldcurry1020 Holy didn't stop Meteor, though. It made it come to a crawl, but then Meteor was winning their wrestling contest. You can see this in the original FF7 ending, because you see the red of Meteor poke through Holy's shield, showing that Meteor is winning. That's when the Lifestream bubbles up from all over the planet and flows to Midgar in order to stop Meteor. What it SEEMS LIKE Sephiroth was saying was that he realized in the ORIGINAL timeline, he dies. Through whatever series of events, he dies. He died at the end of FF7, and came back in Advent Children, to be defeated again, saying "I...will never be a memory." It's almost like from that point, he traveled back in time to try and change the past so that he wouldn't die this time in the future. And, for whatever reason, he needs Cloud to be alive. It kind of reminds me of the Avengers Endgame movie where Dr Strange says that he looked at some massive number of millions of timelines to see how they could win, and that they only actually win in 1 of them. And...that involved traveling back in time and changing the past as well.
There are actually a lot more examples of Aerith seeming to know what's coming. At the start of Chapter 8, she seems to know he identifies as a mercenary before he has a chance to say so, and she plays it off that she simply guessed he was a mercenary, based on the sword. And at the end of Chapter 8, when discussing her past with Cloud, she openly mentions Zack's name. That didn't happen in the original. As she says this, Cloud's PTSD kicks in and he gets one of his headaches, preventing him from really perceiving what she's said. Yet, when he comes to, she's pointedly looking at him, as if gauging his reaction to hearing Zack's name. There's also the scene in Chapter 8 where she references that the flowers have something to say, and soon they'll say it, but there's one thing left that needs to happen if the people will be able to hear them. Based on her look of resolve and her clenched fist, I think she's referencing her impending death. In Chapter 10, as they're trying to leave the sewers, Tifa and Aerith have an exchange regarding the plate. Tifa says something to the effect of "I hope we make it in time" or "It can't be true," or something like that. And Aerith responds by looking away, and kind of half-heartedly trying to reassure her. It seems obvious she has something she wants to say, but isn't sharing, and Tifa even comments on it in the moment. Then there is her apparently guessing that Marlene is a child and is at Seventh Heaven, despite the fact that she'd only heard Marlene's name once before. And then when she meets Marlene, she somehow knows that Barrett is Marlene's father, despite having never met Barrett or Marlene at this point. And while you could argue that having heard Marlene's name was enough to guess that she was a child Tifa cared about, that doesn't explain how she knew about Marlene's relationship to Barrett. There's also her apparent new ability to impart knowledge through touch. She clearly did this when hugging Marlene in Seventh Heaven. There was a moment when she seemed to share information with Marlene which calmed her down, followed by Aerith putting a finger to her lips as if to say "This is our secret." And she did something similar later with Red XIII (Nanaki), when she first calmed him, and then successfully identified that he is in fact a child of his species. How could she know that, having never met or seen one? This is a great big wall-o-text, and I haven't even covered all of the examples. Point is, Aerith is definitely aware of how events are *supposed* to play out. Now, here's where I think it gets interesting, right? I think that not only is she aware of how things are supposed to go -- I think she's actively trying to make sure that that's how they go. I don't think she's trying to break with the timeline. I think she's trying to ensure the timeline plays out properly. I think Sephiroth is the one trying to break the timeline, possibly by ensuring that Aerith doesn't die. If Aerith doesn't die, she won't be able to enter and therefore manipulate the Lifestream to fend off Meteor long enough to let Holy do its job. Perhaps Sephiroth is trying to manipulate Cloud into saving her. But if that's the case, then Aerith might deliberately sacrifice herself in an effort to ensure that Sephiroth still loses.
Joseph Breen all of this blew my mind to read and I felt the same way while playing the game. Aerith wasn’t being too subtle imho about knowing things that she shouldn’t, it was simply a matter of all the other characters not being able to understand. Us as viewers who have “hopefully played the original” know where she’s coming from, which is super cool. One major telling scene is definitely when Aerith is embracing Marlene in the bar and Marlene “senses” through touch what Aerith has “been through?” and Aerith is all “shhhh little one, spoilers” that gave me chills. I can’t wait till the next instalment!
@@alainbourassa1998 Right? Like, I know a lot of people are being kinda cynical about the changes and the new direction, and yeah, I know Nomura has a reputation for some pretty dense/convoluted storytelling, but at this point, I am 100% onboard for whatever comes next.
I think you're giving them too much credit, unfortunately. These are the guys that made KH a mindblown aka fuckfest of a story and destroyed (to some) Final Fantasy and created and repeat the XIII.
Clouds and Sephis first encounter in the Remake: Cloud: "I killed you with my own-" Sephiroth: "Oh you need not remind me. It was the crowning moment of our time together. But that was then and this is now..." Cloud talks about the events in Crisis Core but Sephiroth talks about the original timeline.
More importantly, the fact that Cloud can consciously recall that at ALL already means FF7R's timeline was drastically different from the start. This is probably where Cloud's terrified "GASP" comes from. In the original game, Cloud isn't made aware of this until him and Tifa are in the lifestream at basically the very end.
I think a good amount of Cloud’s memory is still tainted/mixed and screwed up. Because he still believes he actually made it to being Soldier First Class, I think they changed it a bit in the Remake pertaining to the Cloud-Sephiroth situation. In the original Cloud from the being always thought Sephiroth was dead, he just didn’t remember that he played apart in Sephiroth’s disappearance. Due to the Jenova cells and Sephiroth cells Hojo put into Cloud. With the Remake I feel as they decided to go a different route, and Cloud being aware that he had something to do with what happened to Sephiroth years ago. I do think the Remake is going to continue down the road or Cloud not knowing that there was someone in his life named Zack, until it is a crucial part of the story in the Remake. I can’t wait to see where things go in the Remake.
Ahh that’s such a good point! :3 The only question I have though, is that in the original FF7 if I remember correctly, Cloud’s memories are all scrambled, believing to fill the roles that Zack did when that was obviously not the case. There are brief flashbacks in the Remake where Cloud recalls Tifa sobbing over her dead father and Sephiroth talking with the frozen Jenova, which were things that only Zack observed from his own perspective, meaning Cloud was not there to see it and remember it. Yet, Zack was not the one who killed Sephiroth (at least not in Crisis Core) - Cloud did. He even states, “I killed you with my own...” implying that Cloud knows he’s the one that finished Seph off. It’s a bit confusing to me, what does he remember accurately and what does he not? 🤔
@@PrismaticPichu but he was there though wasn't he? I thought he was a lesser ranked soldier accompanying Tifa, Sephiroth, and Zack. He sees it all happen but somehow mixes his own memories with Zack's, from what I remember from the original
Honestly I am just still stunned that we're finally having actual playable characters with the same level if not better details than the CG Animations from Advent Children. It's pretty crazy. Even if it's a 15-year difference, the leap in in-game rendered graphics achievement still amazes me.
@@maverickdarkrath4780 They don't have the same mothers or fathers. Sephiroth's mother was Lucrecia, and his father was either Hojo or Vincent, and he had Jenova genetic material - Jenova was not a Cetra/Ancient, she was a a traveler from another planet that, like Lavos in Chrono Trigger, traveled world to world, destroying and absorbing energy. Aerith was a half-Cetra/half-normal Human. Her mother was Ifalna, who was the last living pure blooded Cetra (we don't know who her parents were or what happened to them). Her father was Professor/Doctor Gast, who lead the Jenova project before leaving Shinra for a dislike of their methods. He was also the person that had Hojo's job before Hojo, effectively, and Hojo fully embraced the Shinra way and changed the course (which included experimenting on the in-the-womb Sephiroth...) Sephiroth only THOUGHT, initially, that he was a Cetra, because Shinra believed Jenova was one (she wasn't, she was just in a 2,000 year old geologic layer, so they assumed she must have been one since she was from that era, though she clearly doesn't have the body of one). Since he was reading the books and research notes, Sephiroth simply believed that to be correct, only finding out after his "death" that it wasn't true.
I think everyone has forgotten that we see Aerith and Zack together at the end of Advent Children too. They both still have to end up dead to follow suite.
i saw someone say that “remake” is not saying it’s a remake of the original game, but part of the title, telling you what it’s about, just like advent children or crisis core or whatever. it’s called remake because they’re remaking destiny. i like that.
Few years late. I think it’s called remake because it will be the closest entry to the original. The watchers of fate are the fans demanding a 1:1 copy of the original and now that they have been defeated the game can experience a rebirth into something new and familiar.
@@SilenceDogood153Don't feel bad, my guy. I literally just beat this game for the first time just a few days ago thanks to Playstation plus. Been scouring TH-cam for reviews and analyses for FFVII Remake since then so I'm constantly jumping into years old comment threads lol. I'm so glad I played it when I did because my wait for the next game is mere weeks instead of several years lol. And now I get to be part of the hype train for Rebirth as well.
The best part about this new ending is that it suggests that we played right into Sephiroth's hands. He opened the portal knowing that we would follow him through it. He wanted us to eliminate the Whispers, which were working to stop him from altering the timeline. That is why Sephiroth did not confront us until we had destroyed the Whisper Harbinger for him. And now that he was free to alter the timeline without interference from the Whispers, he acted to remove the last thing that might stop him from carrying out his plans; US. If Sephiroth is going to enact his plan to summon Meteor with the knowledge of how he was defeated on the original timeline, it seems likely that he will be more proactive in his attempts to kill us before we realize the totality of his plan.
I don't know but, Sephiroth is definitely powerful enough to defeat the whispers. Why would he need Cloud and company to do it for him? I'm not saying this to appear clever, what I'm saying is, it certainly looks like he's been trying to guide Cloud up until that point and he never attacks, only after defeating the whispers, which is weird. If that's what they're going for I just hope the reason for all of that is convincing and plausible.
@@FlyteDanny it seems like sephiroth wasnt in possesion of his full power and maybe that could explain why he did not defeat the whispers himself (like he is in some sort of regenerative state still)
@@FlyteDanny I would imagine that there is something about time traveling that prevents someone from interacting with the harbinger of whispers, or a harbinger of whispers from outside the traveler's timeline. He might have needed people from the new timeline to kill the harbinger for some reason like that.
When cloud was falling upside down after fighting the big whispers I was waiting for him to say, I've been having these weird dreams lately, like, is any of this for real... Or not
@@tatecheddar Well, not really because the OG does not take place "at the edge of creation". We have no clue what that means or where it is. The Arrival and battle was in parts shot for shot in-camera though but while it is right to say it is a recreation it would also be important to add that the scene has a vastly different purpose and difference from the OG. Sadly I didn't get to use ascension/omnislash on Sephirot there but at least I used it in the battle before.
There is also the fact that the “to be continued” sign that we knew was coming said ‘the UKNOWN Journey will continue”. Kinda play s into this theory a fair bit
Almost like the creators saw what happened with star wars fans and went "see that's the kind of insanity we're up against.....so let's make them the reason why the story veers left out of nowhere."
You say that Aerith is spearheading changing destiny, and that her saying "We can change this, we can set it right" meant that she wasn't happy with how FF7 went... here's an alternative theory to that. Sephiroth very clearly isn't happy with how FF7 went, and he's very clearly trying to get Cloud to defeat destiny. He keeps showing Cloud frightening moments, he even shows the whole party the Meteor making a mess out of Midgar in the Shinra HQ, so it's clear he wants to subtly convince them that the future is bleak and terrible, when in fact the party saves the future in the final hour. Therefore, it's quite likely that Sephiroth is the one that instigated all of this, and Aerith is only following suit to try to ensure that Sephiroth doesn't win. The Whispers follow both, as well as anyone who interacts with them in a meaningful way, to keep the timeline on track. For most of the game, the effects of this is clear. Aerith begs Cloud for help, which changes Cloud's path and suddenly allows him to see Whispers. Avalanche decides to keep Cloud out of the 2nd bombing mission, so they attack and hurt Jessie to force Barret to take Cloud in. They protect Aerith from falling at the church. They slow down Cloud, Tifa and Aerith so they can't make it to the Sector 7 Pillar on time. They influence Biggs, Wedge and Jessie to get them killed (though they seem to have somehow failed with Biggs and Wedge). Avalanche nearly successfully stops the Sector 7 plate from falling, so they intervene and allow Rude to confirm the sequence. There's a butterfly effect going on from the moment Cloud and Aerith meet, and when Sephiroth first shows up, and everyone who is directly affected is able to see the Whispers. This brings up a question on why RUFUS of all people can see them, when even none of the Turks can, but it mostly fits. By the end of the game, the Whispers are out in huge numbers, clearly showing that the butterfly effect is so great that even they are having a great deal of difficulty correcting the course. So, Aerith decides in that moment that their best chance is to beat Sephiroth at his own game. Disrupt fate, then do everything in your power to ensure that even then, Sephiroth still does not win. This also adds on to the fact that she's frightened at that moment. If she planned this from the start, she would have had time to prepare herself for this, but she's clearly and visibly shaken by the thought. Further proof that she didn't initially plan on changing fate? When she tells Cloud not to fall in love with her, because it wouldn't be real. Not only does this mean she knows what's supposed to happen, but it also means she also believes destiny will be maintained, as though she's trying to ensure nothing changes. If she knew destiny would be broken, and that the future would be a blank slate, then there would be no reason to believe that Cloud's love would be a result of preordained fate, nothing more. TLDR; Sephiroth is the one who wanted to kill fate, Aerith wanted to preserve it, but it was too far gone by the end of the game so she decided to go along with it and beat Sephiroth at his own game.
If Sephiroth really would kill Fate then what would he change? His only intention is to destroy the world with Meteor. But if this is really the Truth then he dont have to kill Aerith. Because if the Fan Theory is really correct then only through her Death she is capable to summon Holy and stop the meteor because her Soul is returning to the Lifestream.....if she dont die she cant stop the Meteor so Sephiroth would win and changes the Fate. If that is correct then the whole "7 seconds" Theory wouldnt make any Sense because Sephiroth has no Reason to kill Aerith.
I just love the potential for what this all means, I've said it already but I absolutely love the original FF7 game, I've literally bought practically every "version" of the game and played through it enough times. I REALLY cant wait to see where this story goes, I just hope it doesn't turn out like what from what I heard, FF15 was supposed to end quite a bit differently with the final dlc's, but because they cut those "dlc" short we never got to fully see what was the planned eventual full story in the game. At least I am being optimistic about FF7 remake after literally playing through the game and im only basically one achievement away at 100% the game right now. Heres hoping the newer games are just as good if not even better than the original :)
I take the title "remake" as literal not just a part of the title. I think it means that we are going to remake the outcome of the world we love into something all of us wanted.
All of us wanted? I mean, I'm all for whatever SE decides to do with the next part(s), but there are still quite a lot of people who want a straight re-telling of the original story.
@@MinerDiner It certainly isn't what I want, the original already had a great story. If I wanted to play something with an entirely different story...well, I'd play something else. This was supposed to be an update of the original game and everything that made it special, not something else entirely. You can still remake something and add to it while keeping the overall structure the same, like the Resident Evil 1 and 2 remakes did.
As a hardcore fan who has played this game multiple times, Im so thrilled with the new direction its going in. Love it! Cant wait to see where they take it next
Same here i mentioned above even if they stuck to the exact same original i would of been happy either way but this spin of us in another timeline of the game was genius.
Im 34 and so jaw dropped by the game as well . i was well satisfied and hope the next part rings through just as well . soo many years and im reliving old memories and loving it 😊
The remake was jaw dropping, but that’s only because they did so well sticking to the original. The changes they made were the worst parts. I don’t have faith in them doing a good job, the story is going to be a convoluted time line mess, where no body dies. 🤦🏻♂️
@Tyler Robbins bullshit bet you didnt even try playing it. This game was awesome af. Battle system was badass. Story a lil confusing around the end was still good. Makes me sad I gotta wait a few yrs for pt 2.
I'm honestly loving the prospect of Sephiroth becoming more formidable than he already is by knowing his and the world's fate. I wonder how far will he be able to go by manipulating the characters. And what our party will do this time. Aerith already seems to be kind of on the same page as Sephiroth. So maybe she'll warn them or something.
@@CheknoEternity Fans will have learnt already that the remake does not follow the original story. I personally like the changes. Plus, I don't believe that seeing Sephiroth more often in the game is a bad thing. I'd say it's a treat actually. And finally, the writers will not handle the game poorly. They care about the audience's reaction.
I feel like one of the few people who played it in 1997 who loved the ending and the idea that I'm going on a whole new adventure, that I don't know what's going to happen next.
I know, right? All these naysayers, but I'm one of the most hardcore FF7 fans out there, and I'm actually really interested in this and find it compelling. I don't have a PS4, so had to watch a playthrough, and as I started seeing this wasn't going to be just a simple remake with updated graphics and all that, I got even more interested. It's got the music and characters to be familiar, and yet it's got a new adventure and I can't be sure how it will play out, who will live and who will die, etc. It's like a brand new story in a world that I've loved. Like the chapter heading in Chrono Cross when you first travel to the other dimension "Arni Village - Nothing has changed but everything!" ...and perhaps BECAUSE of the fact it hits those nostalgia beats, it has drawn me in in a way that no game has in probably a decade, if not longer (other than, perhaps, Shadowbringers 5.0 experience in FFXIV - there were legit places where I was looking for a save point before logging off, only to remember I was playing an MMO, not a single player RPG. XD) Made me feel like a teenager again. To me, that's a pretty amazing feat, and I'm shocked how many people are entitled, wanna-be-offended by everything, brat "purists" insisting that it's "garbage". Even if you don't like its story compared to the original, it's hardly "garbage". And I loved the original and am hoping to death they do away with the "timed exclusive" nonsense so I can buy and play Part 2 from day 1!! I want to see where the future goes!
The game is the better sequel we all wanted since AC was kind of a disappointment there is a lot of double meanings in this game and hidden lore that you have to go back and listen and analyze during multiple playthroughs with having context of your first playthrough
@@HamiltonNgo-A24 Thing is.. I actually picked up on a ton of it immediately. All of my building theories were proven true at the end. Guess thats one reason I wasnt shocked and confused by the ending like everyone that was angry at it.
At first I thought he was talking about how long it'd take cloud to pre-maturely ejaculate and I thought seph was gonna start blowing him HARDCORE Now that'd be a controversial move by Square LOL
The final take in the scene with the sword being stuck in the ground, is almost like game's starting screen, so basically it's a hint I guess. You could literally connect the fact they are on an edge of creation (that's all we got for you guys in this release) and from that point you can either continue (old plot) or start a new game (follow different path, "carefull now" - it's not yet defined how we will move forward). I don't believe they invested time to render this particular take just for the sake of it. It is definitely full of symbolism.
One really interesting thing I saw recently is that if you look at the nebula at the edge of creation during that exact scene, its shape resembles the Forgotten City
OMG, I didn't even notice that! It also ties in with the gorgeously remixed forgotten city BGM. I absolutely adore this game and it's beautifully-confusing story. I can't wait for "Rebirth"!
To me a big clue was when Red-13 says "A glimpse of tomorrow if we fail here today". Meaning if they failed and not change history the original ending would happen.
This to me is the biggest red herring that people are basing most of their saving Aerith theories off of. And how ironic it comes from Red! Red XIII just sees a glimpse of his future running towards a ruined and overgrown midgar. He only has the context of his current situation to make sense of that vision. So naturally he would assume, oh if we fail here today, midgar must get totalled. He has no idea that it is actually a vision of their success fighting an even greater threat (remember at this point, nobody knows about summoning meteor or what the craic is with Jenova etc) My longstanding theory on this game has been, since the projects announcement, outside of midgar we wont get an overworld, we'll just go form town to town to cave to dungeon to mountain via cutscene or small areas in between. So of course, to achieve this the story elements outside of Midgar will need a bit of a rework, quite a bit actually. Especially since they'vealready done a lot of the post-midgar reveals before we even leave Midgar this time. Square have yet to show how they'll handle traversal of Gaia outside of Midgar, and they've been very quiet on that front. Because they know the news will cause massive backlash online, a lot of people won't be happy with how they'll approach it. This to me is what this whispers subplot has been preparing fans for. Not for major plot changes, the story beats will most likely play out the same way in some shape or form, slightly altered perhaps. But things like, going to fort condor etc will probably get axed entirely. Or the hunt for Huge Materia, I'd say most of that will now be delegated to the background, performed by Avalanche HQ and we'll probably just do Cids journey to space because that is the most plot heavy moment in huge materia hunt thats relevant to character development. The whispers from a meta-narrative perspective were the fans voices within the writers heads. The fear that no matter what they did or how they executed the game post-midgar, a larger amount of people will be pissed compared to those who are pleased. They put those fears to rest while making this game and are not going to let it worry them going forward and that we, the fans, need to get used to that idea before we ruin the experience for ourselves by expecting something with a huge overworld and fully controllable airships in a full 3d spherical planet. That's just not something Square do any more and probably wont be returning for FF7 Remake (i've been hoping for the last 5-6 years ill be wrong about this but it doesnt seem likely). So there will be large narrative changes to compliment how the characters will be getting from plot point to plot point, town to town, etc. Doing the first episode completely in Midgar was a great way to cover up the fact the game wouldn't have this stuff going forward due to its boxed in linear nature, because until you actually left Midgar, you were sure the whole game would take place there (if you were a ten year old kid in 1997 playing their first jrpg, you definitely werent expecting a huge world to explore)
Idk if you all realized all of the visions or cutscences of the future(a glimpse of tomorrow) is actually all from the movie advent children. Aerith death ( cloud carrying aerith in the water, aerith praying for meteor, red13 running in the desert, cloud charging at sephiroth. So if the future was and is based from advent children, then cloud still has regrets that he couldnt save her(in the movie n ff7), meaning aerith deaths could have been prevented( which cloud believed in the movie"which is 2 years in the future after saving the world") but cloud failed and let her die . which was why my assumption is that cloud does have 7 sec to save her (if the future cloud from advent says he could have tried to save her). I believe he literally was in front of her because cloud himself tried to kill aerith( being controlled by genova cells from sephiroth) but when he resisted sephiroth will or the genova cells sephiroth just jumped down n stabbed her. So im just gunna make that assumption is that he could have saved her within that 7 second time. funny how when cloud was fighting sephiroth at the end of the movie it looked like whisperers where following sephiroth everywhere as well. Then sgain not sure what SE has in for us but i cant wait for part 2
doesn't that literally means the original ending is considered the 'failed' version? sound like a bit of a disrespect towards to the outcome in original if you ask me.
WanOne it was confirmed in an interview that all humanity is dead at the end of FF7 original. So it was a bad end for humanity. Just not the planet and the rest of the species on it.
One part in the singularity that got me was: when you start defeating the apparition of fate, they shoot 'memories of the future' for you to witness, and I think it was Red XIII saying "these are images to show us what will happen if we fail today." Yet, we know those are the events that already happened and transpired. So, did we just essentially change that already too? Such a cliffhanger.
FFS stop saying this is Nomura's doing. He is the Director, the writer is literally the same writer of the original. The writer said in interviews he was altering aspects of the original
@@ArdenVT People are not interested in knowing who the author generally is. All they want to know is: Who's the person responsible for letting this mess slide? The answer is obviously the director.
There's a difference between "altering aspects of the original" and just writing a different story with the same characters and setting...that's called fan fiction, in most cases.
You all need to understand why they are saying this: directors have final say. Writers are low on the totem pole. He wouldn't have written this naturally. This is a very Nomura move. Every game of his has this sort of ridiculousness in it. It /is/ Nomura.
@@AlexanderTP90 I seriously doubt THIS writer for THIS project is "low on the totem pole". FF7 is one of Square's most legendary projects. FF7:R is an absolutely huge project, with the potential to please and/or alienate tens of millions of people. ...I'm pretty sure the writer isn't just some low level dude that no one listens to or cares about.
He mentions that there is this possible implication that OG FF7 ending was like "a bad ending" of sorts. When you get the memory from Red XIII and it shows him running with his cubs like it was at the end of FF7 they ask him what that was and his response is along the lines of "that is what happens if we fail". I don't recall it exactly but that stood out to me. Back then we stopped Meteor and years later it was shown that Midgar was covered in overgrowth as if the planet was returning to its natural order and so you'd think that was a win, right? Well, not according to Red.
Destiny was showing them what they would be destroying both Good and bad. But you need to keep in mind if they wanted to just defeat sephiroth they wouldn't fight destiny. But they want to destroy sephiroth permanently, which isn't destined to happen. In canon, while they defeat sephiroth, destiny wants sephiroth to exist long enough to do what he did in the og game, the side effects of him summoning meteor and dying. All the mako reactors were destroyed making the world go back to normal sources of power, the creation of a new world government that would protect the planet, the emergence of vincent valentine who would also save all life on earth during dirge of Cerberus. Destiny wants sephiroth to not win, but at the same time sephiroth must destroy enough to force changes that betters the world but not necessarily life on it. Both parties want a complete win, while destiny is a compromise. Sephiroth gets immortality but never true godhood. The gang can always stop sephiroth, but not until he has left scars that the world can never truly heal from, just adapt.
Remember also the scene after that where Cloud wakes up and sees both Aerith and Zack entering the light through the door? This could have been a moment of re-looping through the timeline due to perhaps one thing: Aerith and Sephiroth are literal gods, destined to be reincarnated over and over again... until now.
Very unlikely. Imagine the outrage that'll come after if they choose to do that. I think Aerith will definitely still die, but they'll narrate it in a different way. Maybe she'll sacrifice herself to stop Sephiroth and save the planet. That Aerith scene was so empowering that it'll be so ridiculous to not tap into that classic emotional connection once again.
She doesn't actually know who she is though, and her being in the trainyard would mean she's dead, so it still points to Aerith being concious of her previous timeline knowing who Marlene is
Zach Aerith doesn’t know the specifics of her previous lives. Only that she has connections with Cloud and crew, the planet is in danger, and that her life ends abruptly at some point in her journey. Sephiroth on the other hand read the script and is making edits lol.
@@mangasaint Aerith knows enough to know Marlene needs to be saved from 7th Heaven, because Marlene was kept with Elmyra during most of their journey in the previous time
@@Noplayster13 Most people seem to stumble around Clouds background, Hojo says to him in front of everyone "you were never in Soldier" and not a single person questioned Cloud, ever
You know, despite it being labeled as a remake and not a split timeline sequel, and despite the fact that it's $60 purchase for an 1/8th of the story of the original. Have fun wasting your money?
@@ATthemusician I was fully aware of how its being made and quite frankly? I'd much rather have an incredible experience over multiple installments than a rushed, shoddy mess in one game. I am having lots of fun with it and I'm excited for the next part. Enjoy being miserable.
Except that DOFP was made because X-Men was backed into a corner. That movie was made to give a second chance to do things they fucked up. Lol ff7 wasn't broken.
@@ryanclark6887 Bro... Dirge of Cerberus broke FFVII so bad lol that Square-Enix never wanted to touch the series after that garbage lol. They had to do this
It is but with the clever twist of the villain changing the timeline and not the heroes. Seph is definitely a meta character that sees the timeline from a higher level
I disagree with the 7 Seconds until the end meaning, in the game during a save screen it mentions that Meteor was stopped with 7 seconds left so I think it is more likely a more literal reference to having stopped what was deemed inevitable or something of that like. Also as for the party thinking that the ending of the original was a "bad" ending and wanting to change things for the better they do have a point. Yes they stopped meteor however the final scene from the original game "500 years Later" shows the jungle covered ruined Midgar. This led to much speculation about the fate of humanity in this world at the time but in more recent years on of the games creators confirmed that mankind has become extinct in those 500 years, probably been killed off by the planet itself or something (Reference to WEAPON attacking enemies of the planet, not once did WEAPON attack Sephiroth, it only went for humanity). Aerith and the party are not only wanting to defeat Sephiroth and stop meteor but also prevent the extinction of mankind itself
Thats how i saw it. Red may have survived, but thats all we see. Meteor still came crashing down, it was just partially stopped. They have lots of room to work with on the OG ending
if humanity doesnt survive those 500 years, its not because of meteor. otherwise explain advent children, which clearly takes place after 7. as does dirge of cerberus, which takes place after ac. the city of edge is where they fight seph in ac, and that same city is a ghost town in dirge because of the plot in doc. humanity still exists though in both. WEAPONs, WEAPON attacks junon, diamond weapon attacks midgar, shinra tower specifically, ultimate weapon attacks where cloud is recovering from mako poisoning and later various places around the world. emerald weapon apparently took down gelnika and otherwise was chilling unto you poked it with a submarine. ruby, ruby seems to have just been enjoying making sand castles on himself, left his head out of it, and only started fighting at all because you rammed him in the head with an airship and interrupted his vacation. the weapons seem to mainly not like shinra. one does wonder why they didnt really do much if anything toward sephiroth. some of them were way more powerful than him.
My first thoughts after learning what the whispers were. Yep, these are the FF7 nostalgia purist who can't handle even the slightest of change in their lives trying to make sure the timeline isn't changed.
Well for good reason, the only bad parts of the FF7 remake were the parts they added or changed, not a good sign for the rest of the remake. Which is shaping up to be a convoluted time line disaster.
I am interested, but with the things they’ve done to Kingdom Hearts storyline I am definitely concerned. It can get out of their control really quickly.
"7 seconds til the end" Is the last seconds before the impact of meteor. Read the Chapter 18 map description. The Turning Point. "In the world beyond, Sephiroth shows a vision of the planet seven seconds before its demise."
Hmmm I thought it was when he stabs Aerith. Takes him 7 seconds to fall down and stab her, there's so many different things it could mean. I have no idea where Nomura is taking this.
@@2un7zu yeah but this is nomura we're talking about. My favourite character was dead and miraculously is alive now. It's gonna be interesting to see where it all goes in the end.
It has nothing to do with Meteor. Why would Sephiroth ask for Cloud's help stopping his own plan? Meteor was never supposed to destroy the planet, only hurt it so that Sephiroth could absorb a lot of lifestream and become godlike. There's a new, unknown threat to the planet that Sephiroth has become aware of here.
This game was absolutely amazing and it blew everything I expected out of the water. Yet wasn’t so different that it ruined the nostalgia for me. They did this game perfectly
I know right? To me They made it more interesting to play. Beat it this morning and going again to do what I missed. I thought the appearance by Zack was awesome and he lived. The Whisper fight at end were challenging.
Ending was the best part, and I played the original when it first came out. I absolutely love the divergence they have made and now I can expect anything! This game is GOTY
This game, for me, is perfect. I also have a feeling that in the next game we will have an opportunity to make specific choices that will allow us to stick to the original fate or deviate from it so fans can play it exactly as they remember it if they wanted.
In the original Sephiroth didn't kill Aerith it was Jenova in disguise as Sephiroth. As the original body of Sephiroth was incased in Materia after he fell into the reactors core. This isn't known until Cloud betrays everyone (due to being controlled by Jenova and the Jenova cells in his body) and hand's the black materia to the original Sephiroth which causes him to mutate into the godly monster that he becomes.
That though is still a bit murky and iirc dependent on localization. Some argue that Jenova was pulling the string all along and even Sephiroth at the end was just a vessel being piloted by Jenova. Others say that Sephiroth's will is the dominant and that he pilots the Jenova fragments to carry out his plan. The former means Sephiroth was never the villain and Jenova did everything (and would imply, by this theory, that it's Jenova in the guise of Sephiroth again, not Sephiroth); the latter means Sephiroth overtook Jenova's mantle as the calamity to the point of domineering her to carry out his will (meaning, even if committed by Jenova, Aerith's death was still committed by Sephiroth).
I think a lot of people may be overlooking an interesting fact. With Zack alive in that timeline, Cloud wouldn't have to take up their mantle, maybe it's Cloud who dies and we get to play Zack from then on.
Thank you. Someone else who actually knows the original word for word. The fans know this game better than the developers I swear. How can people read a poster artwork as "aerith was meant to live" is beyond me.
I’d say another thing that might not have been paid attention to in the remake is how Tifa thinks she sees Marlene in the train graveyard. Cloud wasn’t really paying attention but Aerith who can seemingly see or sense the ghosts could have just been paying attention to Tifa off screen. Thus her knowing Tifa wanted her to go for Marlene without this just being some her having memories from an alternate timeline thing. Aerith just pays attention.
Brandonmaru TV Yeah but it’s not just that Aerith makes a lot of comments that show she knows what is going, even telling sephiroth “you aren’t right”. Aerith is observant but it’s also apparent that she is aware of what’s happening and knows how events are “supposed to go”
It will probably be a choice. Which has many benefits than negatives. 1.) Because now building her character won't be wasted and people won't neglect playing her in the next parts 2.) The hardcore aerith fans that want her to live or want cloud to get with aerith can be satisfied 3.) It adds high replayability value, one where she dies and one where she live this having different endings, cutscenes and events. I'm of course going with her dying if this is the case, then 2nd run let her live.
@@bungifish2227 i agree, and I hope the next parts will be full of choices like KOTOR, ME, etc. That way all sides win, and there will be a crap ton of replay value.
@@bungifish2227 i dont think you will have a choice. Aerith is such a big Charakter and her entire Death has so many Impact on the Game that the Choice of let her live or let her die would create 2 completely different Games. I mean it would be so cool of that is possible but when you look at Games with such choises like the Games from Quantic Dreams you can see the big impact of theese "Butterfly Effects". I dont think it would work with such a hardcore Storydriven Game like Final Fantasy where the Charakters have such a big Role in the entire Game. Mabe it is possible to save her at her old dying Place but i think she will die anyway.
@@bungifish2227 it can't be a choice, a choice would imply that ff7 would have multiple endings instead of 1 true ending, and I don't think square wants that, nor the fans.
Aerith also heavily foreshadows her death several times and drew attention to the materia she carries with her. Almost like a “hey cloud, wink wink nudge nudge” To me that just reinforced the fact that she is either the consciousness from the original. When she told cloud that he can’t fall in love with her, that sounds like her trying to protect him and his feelings just in case she fails to change fate.
She tells him to not fall in love with her because it won't be real, she knows Cloud is not himself. Because she is Cetra, and the planet tells her things. Also Aerith, even in the original was aware she needs to die in order to save the planet, so she leaves the party so nobody can stop her. Also that Aerith scene is a friggin dream sequence, so it might as well be Zack telling Cloud to not fall for Aerith, because the voice inside Clouds head has allways been Zack.
She told Cloud not to fall in her has nothing to do with that, more like it has to do with Zack because he never came back and she's waiting for years.
Aerith in the opening video looks around in the lane like "What? Is that repeating?" Like she has the consciousness of the original game. And you can see it in all the scenes with her in the game, is like she knows everything and wants to enjoy every moment (like she say in the dream sequence). This is why whispers attack her in they're first appearance, when Cloud meet her for the first time!
I theorized that the heartless were attacking Aerith to keep her there until cloud arrived. Because Sephiroth made cloud walk into that alley for that conversation, those few minutes were enough time for Aerith to have completely missed meeting him. After all, it's not like she was waiting specifically for him. Just coincidence
One of the memories was red running. That was the ending of the original game and red said “that is what will happen if we fail here”(to kill the main boss)
@@cn8299 Except you can hear children laughing and playing. I'm guessing that Sephiroth kept Zack alive in order to have a weak Cloud (in another timeline) that will join him. Don't know what Cloud changed in his 7 seconds (Aerith could be too obvious). But then hell maybe Cloud kept Zack alive and Sephiroth changed something completely different.
The 7 seconds Sephiroth is referring to isn't about Aerith. Its about the 7 seconds before meteor strikes Midgar/Gaia. If you go to Chapter Selection -> Chapter 18, it literally says that verbatim. So what this means, I'm not sure. There is a cutscene in the game where Meteor is about to strike Midgar and Barrett and Tifa are both laying unconscious on the ground. Does this play to it? Does Cloud have to choose between them? This implies Meteor will actually be about to strike Midgar or will, so will this happen, or is it a false vision Sephiroth projects to Cloud? We will find out in time.
@@Boogie7910 That vision is of the future where humans are wiped out. And this happens even though they defeated Sephiorth at the end. That is why its called the dark timeline. This game wont have the same outcome.
Wait a minute. When we first see aerith she’s being attacked by whispers in front of the theatre. Could it be because the whispers knew she was aerith from the prime reality trying to change events?
James Mountney it is the same Aerith. Consider it like X-Men: Days of Future Past when Kat sends Wolverine’s future conscious to a past Wolverine in the 1970s. Aerith and Sephiroth are a future consciousness possessing their former selves in the main story timeline. Future Aerith is merged with the life stream energy which probably allows her to go back in time.
James Mountney if that’s not the case then it’s more like the movie Groundhog Day. They are stuck in a time loop as it was theorized for FFXV and yet probably true. The last DLC for FFXV that got cancelled was going to be the true canon ending. Ardyn was not the true antagonist but the god Bahamut. Square can still take that idea of changing antagonist from Sephiroth to just being like a Seymour/Sin/Jecht were the from FFX. The true antagonist could be the god that sends the whispers. Which can be Genesis/Minerava. FInal Fantasy is all about changing fate/the course of destiny. So a little timely whimey stuff won’t hurt it.
"obviously sephiroth DOES have to die eventually" oh? how about sephiroth wins, meteor lands, and this franchise goes out with a real bang jk i love ff7
I would love for this to be a legit possibility. Like, if the player tries too hard to save everyone, Meteor goes unchallenged or something. Really, really hoping for some multiple ending, choices-matter type of deal.
@@ElProf I love the prospect of Sephiroth being an even cooler villain than he already is! Him ruling over different timelines and manipulating the characters. Has anybody thought of the chance that Sephiroth would get tired of dying or losing in every timeline and he eventually gives up his evil plans?
@@pinelopiliraki3660 in crisis core, its made pretty clear even when hes going through this whole im going to destroy the planet plan, he still thinks hes the good guy. and he is trying to keep all promises he made. while it seems unlikely, having a option to redeem sephiroth and it even possible, not just plot im being the real good guy and giving him the last chance and he just would never accept it that is common in so many stories, and due to how stubborn people can be real world on opposing views, would never take, would be nice to see for a change. that being a possible ending but not garaunteed and quite unlikely even, i would definitely like to see that.
After beating it I had 2 feelings: 1)I was confused about how to feel at the *possibility* of the original’s biggest moment being re-written. 2)I really wanted to play the next installment. During the course of the game I wasn’t sure if the hints at Aerith being aware of what was coming were serious, or just winks to players of the original. Now that it seems she really was aware, I’m scared/intrigued by how things may play out in future installments. Aerith’s words before hopping into the portal ring true. Square is taking a big gamble, I just hope they are able to make it pay off.
@@jodkmp well that is an even better reason to hope it doesn't get too convoluted then. Convoluted * Convoluted makes it ConConVoVoLuLuTedTed :S i am super exited to see where it goes though. And even if the next parts does end up being lack luster, then we still have the original
There is definately something genius preparing. can't wait to see how it turns out eventually! Also, I might be the only one thinking this, but I'd love to see the ending where Sephiroth is somehow redeemed. If you know FF7"s lore well enough, or played Crisis Core, you know that Hojo is the one responsible for Sephiroth's insanity. Seph was broken from the very start (grew up in a lab, treated like a weapon from early age), but at the same time he truly cared for his SOLDIER friends and was a nice guy overall. Jenova cells inside him took over his mind when he discovered the truth and he became almost fully posessed by her after his physical death in NIbelheim reactor. Oh man, in Crisis Core, he said that would abandon Shinra after Nibelheim's job.... His story is actually really sad, and I hope that eventually he'll become free of Jenova, in a bitter-sweet kind of way - lets say, before death in Cloud's arms after a grand battle or smth. Just like Kadaj did in AC. Kinds sucks seeing game blaming him for everything when he's no less victim to Hojo cruelness than Cloud, Vincent or anybody else in the game. But I guess Im asking for too much. Q__Q
glad im not the only one who would like this as at least possible. maybe not make it a for sure ending. maybe our choises could matter this time around. ff8 was big on that the very next game after 7. yeah seph seemed to still think of himself as a good guy at the end of crisis core even right after nibelheim. made a point of trying to keep his promises he made to those he had thought of as friends. we will see what is in store for him this time around.
Right, my only gripe is the original ending is not bad. The world gets saved minus aerith and saving her will totally invalidate her sacrifice. I hope they tread carefully because if they save everyone and make death and sacrifice meaningless it’ll bite them in the ass. The way I can see the way out of this is if jenova is a vicious cycle that happens every 2000 years that they need to break the cycle a la crono trigger
@@lexsteele779 You know they might, well if they did change it, will focus on what she was doing before Sephiroth showed up, or in this case, if he did not show up, see what she was about to complete before Cloud and friends got there.
This makes sense! I was thinking that they were fighting their future selves. Like how one has a Sword (Cloud), one has like a gun (Barret) and one fights with its fist (Tifa). But The remnants you mention, I think they also have these weapons too. And they do summon Bahamut, which was a weird part in the fight but makes sense because they summon it in the movie.
Mr. & Mrs. Madness the ost of the fight is called harbinger advent. And ther whispers use the same attacks as the advent children as well as having only one attack spell that corresponds to their canonical elements from the movie.
donald curry the game never says that ever. It only states that they are from the future and that they fight to protect the future that created them. Also if they were mirrors of the player characters then there would need to be one for red and aerith as they are participants in the battle as well. Also the whispers are never described as actual ghosts or spirits of real people. The voices that aerith talks about are due to the lifestream as a whole being the collective voice of all life that has ever and will ever exist. It’s essentially the planets voice. And it’s in pain due to sephiroth meddling.
I actually have a decent theory I got from an acquaintance but tweaked... It’s cause Rufus called the Turks to pick him up via helicopter (changing time) rather than confronting cloud and party in an elevator (which leads to their capture and the trail of blood scene.) Think about it. Tseng can’t see it because he wasn’t involved in helicopter scene.
i said the same thing to my wife. the word re make its either make a new, make again or, re telling or a start over i knew while playing that the whispers were imminently hanging around those with known death so that being said, it spoiled me that its happening all over and someone else knows. Aerith and Sephiroth are trying to remain alive and Aerith will want to save this other Zack. but what about a parallel dimension. a flash sideways like in LOST, FRINGE or Endgame?
Yh it actually makes me excited. As long as we have a choice to make sure the game plays out how it was in the original then I don't mind. If not then it's fine if the major events stay the same or builds from the original plot (since we don't know what's to come it would be more exciting but concerning at the same time).
@@bungifish2227 They are never going to give you the option to play the game correctly. This is already altered too much. Nomura will just do whatever he wants and it will be a total mess.
Yourson Isold if I could enter gifs into the chat, I’d put the little girl throwing a temper tantrum in response to you Different does not mean it’s going to be a mess.. stop being a grumpy old man and keep an open mind you douche
@@milehighmadness1469 Wow. You gotta attack me like that over a difference in opinion and have the gall to call _me_ a douche? The guy I replied to believed there might be an option to play the game as it was supposed to go. This is factually impossible already, so I just corrected him. Everything Nomura touches becomes a mess, no exception. Whether you like the mess or not is up to you, but it won't be anywhere near as good as the original FFVII plot. It's derivative by definition.
You know Nomura worked on the original, right? He designed all the characters, helped with the script, etc. Not to mention, do you have any idea how many times the original's script changed during development? Even the original's script is derivative by that point. Not to mention with how bad the localization is, If you played the original in English, the Remake is actually more authentic.
(John 11:25-26) "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?" Repent and turn to Christ Jesus before it is too late. For after this comes the JUDGMENT. Christ died for your sins and rose on the third day, showing that anyone who trusts in him for salvation, will have everlasting life. (John 3:16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
This is a really awesome theory. Sephiroth said, “Careful now... that which lies ahead does not yet exist.” And he also said, “Let us defy destiny... together.” Sephiroth wants to change to future with the help of Cloud, but why Cloud? Shouldn’t he want to kill Cloud to stop destiny? Maybe he knows the Lifestream will force Cloud back to life to protect the timeline.
Agreed. I just wish they put out part 2 right now while everyone actually has time to put another 100 hours into a game. But please take your time to tweak it to perfection
@@icemanff23 Took 5 years from announcement to release of part 1. Nomura said this would come out much quicker, so lats say half of that 5 years means it will be out in 7.5 years.
@@Afameca think about KH3.... how long did the fans had to wait for that to come out. Ps2 was Kh2. Kh3 skipped a generation and went to ps4. Nomura has a tendency to milk a franchise. So not only will we be getting ff7 remake. But think about the other alternatives Before crisis, crisis core, dirge of cerb. Just all possible avenues they would explore to get as much money out from this sole series while at the same time im sure other directors are gonna be bringing out FF16 and so forth. I know they wont skip a generation but just be open to the idea that we may not see the end till i guess when the decade is over. Hence wont it be good if ps6 release title would be the Final chapter of ff7? That would make everyone jump on to get a ps6. Fk im giving too much info to Sony and SE 🤣
I'm not big FF gamer but when I was a kid I've watched FF7 advent children (I LOVE that movie) many times and fall in love in Cloud, Tifa and Sephiroth. I've read the plot of the games Crisis core and FF7. So the making changes in FF7R is like walking on thin ice there and I hope it won't get super complicated.
I beat the game three days ago. I’m still trying to decide how I feel about the ending. Edit: 2 years later I’ve decided I’m open to see where they choose to go moving forward. But I maintain that “exploring new paths” was unnecessary. FF7 is already a high quality (and slightly convoluted) story; a faithful recreation with updated graphics would’ve been MORE then enough to bring in new audiences and please long time fans. But the writers have started the tight-rope, time will tell if they can walk it!
I did the exact same was 50/50 on it think the game should play out the same only difference make saving Aerith like Mass effect based on your decisions helps save her or kill her.
Up until the end I enjoyed everything about the remake except the whispers (and maybe the cut floor with all the bloodstains, but Barret getting to give President Shinra a talking to is almost a fair trade). When I saw them turn into the final boss I was pissed, but then I realized what they meant by destiny, and it turned these "plot convenience ghost" into a brilliant narrative device that's actively fighting against the changes made by the remake and that's just fricking cool. They intentionally wrote them like a cheap Deus ex machina from lesser RPGs so we didn't fully notice their true intentions until the end, that every time they intervened it was to stop a major change from the original narrative. Mechanically it's like we get to kill the annoying guide telling us what to do, narratively we get to kill a tired jrpg fate trope that keeps a story stagnant, and in a meta sense we kill the creative restrictions on the writers whose duty is to recapture the magic of the original while delivering something new and worthwhile. If you're worried about the trajectory for the next installments going off the wall, just member they can't keep this theme of comparing the small differences between these two (maybe three) universes without still encountering the big key moments from the original, and join me in hoping that what this really means is that they're giving more choices and options than the original gave us at those key moments. If you're slightly pissed that this seems revisionist then the endings got you covered to, cause now that we know this is a separate universe, that means both the remake and the original exist side by side in the canon. In a sense they were going to change things any way, and now they've given people who didnt want to see there favorite moments changed a get out of jail free card. The issue in me saying this is we won't really know til part 2 comes out, but part 1 was so smart about how they set this twist up, so good at the stuff that didn't change, and so creative with the stuff they expanded, that I have a ton of faith... or optimism, very blind optimism.
Interesting take on the boundless terrifying freedom bit. I took it as how it basically was in the original as "this is where the open world will begin"
"The unknow journey will continue" they're literally telling you that To me is just waiting to see the aerith moment unfolds, the rest will ressemble the original with changes like this part 1 But that moment will be crucial.
@@santus07 You forget FFXV. After the failure of XIII they learned they need to have a world map. They wouldn't take that from VII, as that would completely wreck fan reception and they know that well. Of course, VII also limited your movement, and you had to upgrade your transportation bit by bit to get more of the world accessible to you, so it isn't going to be "suddenly, a whole map" like Breath of the Wild or Skyrim.
I’ve read that the death of Aeris symbolized the death of the writer’s mother, as an acknowledgement of the permanence of death with regard to beautiful and beloved people whose memories are both cherished and forever limited. Thought that was as beautiful as it is heartbreaking, which is why I have no patience for the whole ‘save aerith’ thing
And that's why this is an alternate timeline. The original still exists. Go play that and leave us more open to change with the new game. We don't need that kind of negativity going forward. Just possibility.
@@grandpagohan1 If you wanted change then it shouldn't have been called Final Fantasy VII, and you do NOT get to tell people not to be negative about a negative change. Pull your head out of your ass, kid.
(John 11:25-26) "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?" Repent and turn to Christ Jesus before it is too late. For after this comes the JUDGMENT. Christ died for your sins and rose on the third day, showing that anyone who trusts in him for salvation, will have everlasting life. (John 3:16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
This has been the most informative and interesting discussion on the ending I've seen yet. Personally, I'm thinking they are not just making another story but multiple stories, or routes if you will. This is Japan we're talking about, the world capital for Visual Novels where multiple endings is the norm. This would be right in their backyard (and mine too actually). I think the Alt. reality/Time travel stuff kind of works a lot better or at least kind of makes sense with this style of storytelling. A lot of VN's have something like Fate or time travel or alternate reality, etc. to help explain why their are multiple routes in the story. It's not like Infinity Wars where time travel is solely there as an excuse to save everyone. Well maybe you get that in the True Route but usually a route like that is made difficult to achieve and something you have to earn. Often that means going through the other routes before you get there. Most routes at least someone dies and you still feel it, even if they live in another route. Like you said, it seems that they are implying that the OG wasn't a good end. That lends itself to their being multiple routes in the next game. The fact that you can already change the story so much in this game even though you have the whispers from keeping you from changing anything major also lends to this theory. Every time we are seeing a whisper we are getting asked the question "what if?". Like what if Barret dies or what if Aerith falls off a ledge and is taken by the Turks and never runs the rooftops with Cloud and goes with him to Wall Market. In the next game, their won't be any whispers to protect us from that, so every decision is meaningful as the rest of the game can drastically change and take you on a completely different route.
I dig this. Everyone can be happy even the purists. You can already time travel in a sense with the Chapter Selection and change a bit of the story like the Chaptee 14 Resolution.
I've been saying this to fans who hated the ending. I'm actually surprised that more fans have not even considered the possibility that we will have multiple routes and alt. endings.
@@eseielplays2761 I like the idea, but hate the implementation (Anti-Retcon ghosts are dumb). and while i would not say i am a purist as i love so much of the new stuff in the remake, some things cannot change or it really effects the overall narrative of the game, like a certain someone dying to pull off a certain thing that in the end saves the planet. their death HAS TO HAPPEN or that thing doesn't work, and if that thing doesn't work than nothing breaks sephdogs control of the life stream and he is immortal.
@@ShadowAraun I'm sure SE will do something like a consequence of saving someone from death if they are gonna pull a branching story. Even go as far as shoving into fans who wants to save aerith that if she lives, you get a bad ending or some sort
Maybe, Aerith (like Sephiroth) come from the future (Marlene react to ghost and Aerith, she knows about zack memories) where she know Sephiroth is still alive in the lifestream and still harm the planet and people (Advent Children + On the way to a smile) cause Sephiroth will never be part of the lifestream cause StrongWill + JenovaCell. She wants to alter the past, she thinks she can ultimately save the planet in saving sephiroth (poor girl) in doing so = new timeline with Zack alive. I think it's gonna end with the death of Cloud And Sephiroth cause Zack is now alive and the world will need balance. ULTIMATELY, i also think Sephiroth plan on it, Sephiroth is now the serpent and Cloud is Jesus, metaphysical place in the end represent the inner fight of cloud against the image he have of Sephiroth, this is what Sephiroth has used in Advent Children to be reborn, the memories of the people who fight him cause he forget how was his physical form (On the way to a smile facts) - (have you miss the Christian cross on his Soldier belt ?). Sephiroth evolve from the OG and Advent Children, he understands that what he wants is not to do like Jenova and run across space for eternity using the planet like a vessel, he wants TRUE eternity, but he need Cloud for that, he need his Strenght, the strenght of the Crowning moment like he said, he need,his eternel will to fight him for protect the people he love (Tifa indeed, the girl who gave him the strenght to defeat the strongest being in this world with the Masamune over his body, Barret faded like Aerith, Cloud take the sword bare hand and kill sephiroth in one move.) Cause maybe God needs the Devil, but the Devil just doesn't exist without God. [Totally personnal opinion, I'm not even religious, I just love Carl Gustav Jung stuff and i'm french, for context =) ] The seven is symbolical, seven planet, seven perfection degree, its ultimately linked to the Kabbal, where Sephiroth is from... Seven is the number need to achieve complete cycle and achieve a positive renewal. Sephiroth is using the fate ghost, Aerith is attacked by them, SHE wants to change destiny, that time Aerith launch the game, not Sephiroth, guess who is gonna take advantage of the situation, this time, Sephiroth wins.
@WhatCulture_Gaming Something I didn't see you explore the idea of when you were wondering who is going to die, or who is 'supposed' to die if we save Aerith, yet feels strangely obvious to me is: if there is any character who isn't 'supposed' to be there in the way they are, it's CLOUD. He's in many ways a representation of the player, but he is also a type of 'replacement' or 'destiny filler' for Zack Fair. So if the true happy ending was actually that Zack lives, then perhaps Aerith can have her happy ending, and Cloud is not an anomaly anymore, but regular old Cloud, - who, through a different timeline -, enabled the happy timeline to happen by sacrificing his original game destiny so that Zack and Aerith and co. can have their lives play out as they should and defeat Sephiroth before he can summon Meteor etc. I think one of the coolest aspects of the original game is that you are essentially playing a 'normal' character who, through tragedy, determination and experimentation became the avatar of true heroism and was able to stop Sephiroth (twice). But it feels like it all happens at the expense of Zack, as you fill his shoes. It seems like a possibility we will see Cloud be the "death" happen (whether in identity and role or physically in a timeline), as he is the manifestation of the anomaly timeline that is the original game... either way it feels like there is a distinct possibility we wills till be sad a the end of remake, lol.
Aerith also knows that Could's a merc without him telling her. He said she knows it because of the sword but she sounded like she just made that up. She also sounded like she knew they will not stop the plate from falling based on the actions during some cutscenes
I’m guessing the theme of 7 seconds is going to pop up in multiple places But I would say you’re more wrong than Scott is. 7 seconds for the meteor? The phrase “world ends” doesn’t necessarily mean the world ending literally.
@@nickalso813 The original seven second Aerith scene is absoltely a coincidence. It's explicitly stated in the chapter 18 description that Sephiroth showed Cloud a vision of the planet seven seconds before its demise. The Sephiroth dropping thing is fan reaching by people who didn't see that chapter description. Even thinking about him dropping for seven literal seconds is laughable, just because that scene was edited that way lol
Aerith also doesnt seem "fully" aware of the original timeline, it seems like maybe its hazy & indistinct somewhere in her mind, like a dream, and in several cases it seems like something REMINDS her of it, like she'll suddenly be like "oh, right" like thinking, now i remember, this is supposed to happen. I think thats supposed to be the juxtaposition of Sephiroth being fully immersed in the lifestream, apparently now also destiny and the 'original' fated timeline, and Aerith being separate from it, for now at least, as if perhaps she's remembering knowledge she gained after her own death, when she became part of the lifestream, or from being able to communicate with the planet but not getting the full story or context.
Yeah she does seem confused at times. She also mentions, at the shinra HQ in her room, that it's like she is in a maze, and is loosing part of her self every time they touch her. Which sounds like she has the information, but it's hidden away. And loosing part of her self sounds like the destiny things trying to correct the timeline by making her forget
Now, I feel like this could be a really powerful tool to use to recreate the emotion of Aerith's death. Give you this faint idea that you CAN save her, then tear it away with a sudden realisation that this 1 event in FFVII history is inevitable.
they are trying to weave all the lore from the game, cc, etc. into one, and I'm not that excited about it. It feels like Kingdom Hearts, nobody has any clue what is going on with the story because its so over-written. Having to go into lore well outside the game just to understand it isn't very good story telling imo.
Something I noticed is that Aerith and Sephiroth seem to have pretty solid intuition about the course of destiny and the likelihood of certain future events, while Cloud has these confusing flashes that he struggles to decipher, as though their meaning is on the tip of his tongue, but be lacks some important context. If I remember correctly, these three characters are the only ones to have entered the lifestream; Aerith and Sephiroth when they die, and Cloud when he falls into it and becomes a comatose, brain fried vegetable for a while. Perhaps the time looping or predestination visions they all have are tied to that. Aerith and Sephiroth have a clearer picture, because their spirits had fully merged with the livestream, while Cloud has mysterious intuitions because he was immersed in it without merging.
Cloud had been plagued by strange memories in the original game. Now he also is, but there might be a completely new layer of reasoning behind it. Interesting.
@@PirateSimp Not really. Tifa fell into the lifestream but was in it for a little while, no more than an hour at most, Cloud was into the lifestream for at least a week, perhaps more if you take into account that several days past from the events on the Northern Crater and when Tifa wakes up. So, if we accept this theory, then Tifa wouldn't know anything about this nor would she gain any visions because she hasn't been exposed to a significant amount of lifestream in any time during her life, while Cloud was altered from Hojo's experiments, was bathed in Mako and injected with Jenova cells and fell into the lifestream and survived for several days at least. The only difference is that Cloud is alive while Aerith became the consciousness of the lifestream after her death and Sephiroth is, well, Sephiroth.
They never showed he's alive, they just didn't show his death cause its a massive spoiler and happens later when he's walking with Cloud (in the OG, not CC). They wouldn't show us his death yet, we're not even supposed to know who he is. I took it as a tease for the upcoming chapters (who is this guy??!! I gotta play the next one to figure it out!!!). This Zack Is Alive thing is getting outta hand.
Pretty sure we'll be able to save Aerith in this version, because of that whole destiny setup. But I kind of wish we can't and the game stays bold in that aspect. Because her returning to the planet and being part of the lifestream is too important to the plot.
On that “maybe Tifa’s gonna die instead” comment: by far the moment in the game that made my heart skip a beat was when Sephiroth stabbed Barret. My jaw dropped. I was tingling. Of course, that effect was immediately cheapened when he was brought right back to life.
When Aerith reencouters Cloud at the church (Chp 8 I guess), Reno shows up and asks "and who is this" she then says "my body guard" then CLoud is clearly taken aback when she explains "it's a merc thing", his face is totally like "how do you know I'm working as a merc?", up to that point they had only bumped into each other in chp 2... Just something worth mentioning, another hint of evidence to go with that "theory"
One thing people actually forgot is that the death of zack portrayed in the OG is exactly the scene where zack drags cloud to that cliff in the rain. By the time CC was out the hardcore og ff7 fans weren't happy how they stretched out zacks final battle. You could speculate that they just linked both endings from cc an og ff7 through the arbiters of fate letting him survive the big shinra army battle but being severly wounded and dragging cloud along just to get shot on that hill we see at the end.
:o oh noe my hopes and dreams for zack and aerith to be reunited just died :(' but you have a point.he may still get shot somewhere before the start of the events of ff7... Then we all think aerith can be saved this time, just to be given the same scenario. That would cause us great pain all over again hahaha.
@@markitosibi525 i think its good if they stick to the main events and just alter the way they happen because every story wirh an timetravel scenario or alternate timeline boogaloo nullifies each and every story impact. Someone dies...well just let us alter everything and make the deaths meaningless. Aerith and Zack reached us because they were meaningfull to the characters and to the players. I just hope they dont screw this up:D
This.... this is what I have been trying to tell anyone who will listen. Zack always killed the first wave only to get ambushed by a smaller force with a helicopter. Just because he is walking away doesn’t mean he lived... remember it was JUST starting to rain at the end. He dies in the rain. On top of all that, cloud has the buster sword.... sorry people, but Zack is still dead.
@@HomeDefender30 Cloud having the Buster Sword doesn't mean much because of the dog (as the video said). Zack could still die there or maybe inside Midgar this time, but the dog is in the scene (that is curiously called "Zack's Victory") to show us that we are seeing another reality/timeline, therefore he can survive and keep the Buster Sword while the Cloud of our reality/timeline still has his fair share of PTSD
I absolutely love this because I'm excited that I have no clue what's gonna happen. While a 1:1 remake would have been neat and fun, we already know the twists. Pop culture has been steeped in FFVII lore for 23 years now. Even people who haven't played the game know some things about it. Breaking the canon to free up the future installments is fucking brilliant! Oh, the possibilities! I just hope they don't waste that potential.
grandpagohan1 That’s what I’ve been saying, the Whispers are an allegory for fans that don’t want change, i love the Original but it’s a lot of fun being able to theorize about a different story with the same characters I grew up playing
I'd be excited... if I could delete FF10-2, 12, 13, 13-2, 13-3, 15 and KH3 from my brain. Long ongoing track of underwhelming games and the end of this was too kingdom hearts-y to me... I'm not against change if they make it justice, but I feel my worries with how this game will turn out if they go crazy changing its story while looking at that long list of failures is more than justified. Certainly do hope they prove me wrong and show they still have it in them to make a truly captivating story... but first someone needs to take the multiverse/time theory book away from Nomura and beat him up with it. That mumbo jumbo didn't work on 13, didn't work on 15, didn't work with KH... why in the hell are they letting him go with that a fourth time? x_x
What I hope is that they keep the same towns, characters, etc. in part 2. Something like Aerith’s death you can have a direct influence, you can ether try to save Aerith or let destiny take it’s course. Her death/ not death would be ending of part 2 and your save file is carried over to part 3 to influence how the final part of the story plays out. Really excited to see where they go next!
Jake Wilkinson Great idea, don’t let the player have too much control as to still keep the story relatively the same, just with influence over certain events
Personally, I loved the ending of this game and am looking forward to seeing and experiencing how the rest of the story plays out. Do I think Aerith will live in the whole story? No, but I wouldn't mind being surprised on this particular element.
Indeed! This is how the ending of Mass Effect should have played out.... where your choices **cough** actually mattered! 🤣 When given the option to save everyone in FF7R, would you? Hell yes!
Jaime Hard to say. If the party is given enough insight into her death through visions, the only reason I can see why the writers would go that route is to provide players with another *possible* outcome. Or they could just be teasing us. But I don’t think that’s the case as it would divert precious man hours away from game development and the core story. They must of included this extra layer to the story because square Enix has big plans. Or it’s possible they’re making it up as they go. Who knows?
not me given that nomura’s writing has improved a lot, kingdom hearts 3’s problem was the huge amount of story that it had to cover from 12 games but the writing itself was MUCH better than what he usually delivers. sure, ff7 is a very convoluted story (whether we like it or not) but i truly think nomura can handle this
@@SktMew no? As far as I know, Nomura's only job was to design the characters back then in ff7 original. In ff7 remake, Nomura's the Designer AND director.
I think the story will be similar, we’re going to have to stop the reunion, and meteor, and Sephiroth. But how we get there is different, Aerith is aware of the timelines because she’s an Ancient, Jenova allows Sephiroth to do the same
I dont think Aerith is aware anymore. Maybe in this present timeline she is but as she hesitates to let cloud go in the portal knowing that that decision changes hers as well because she says on the other side is terrible freedom and if they win the fight on the other side they will all be changing their fates meaning her fate can now be changed and she doesn't know how it will go only in the previous timeline.
Landon Funk they also talked about how their fates were never written in stone, and Sephiroth stopped the fight saying “not yet” so he knows something as well, we’ll see what happens, but that’s going to be my guess
I think the game's headed toward 2 stories. Remaster basically of the original, Cloud & Co headed to stop Jenova/Sephiroth from ramming a Meteor into the planet and eating its juicy lifestream. B Plot of timeline nonsense where original not-Jenova-influenced Sephiroth from part 1's ending, Zack, and who knows what else (Rufus, Genesis, who knows) become a bigger focus pulling the crew along to deal with whatever threat to creation or something. B Plot will only be a larger focus toward the end, and FF7R's full finale will focus on it, but for the bulk of the main story from the original, it will just show up for a while like it did at the end of part 1.
"I love how meta it is" that's exactly why I love it and why I love other, similarly "convoluted" stories, whether it be movie, game or book. I has layers, it can defy expectations, it doesn't have to confirm to set standards. I think that's amazing.
In other words, and to keep the story short, thinking about this logically deep and wide enough; I'm glad that the story and canon didn't change - almost at all. Here's my theory: Reason why I stand in awe is due the pure talent at play here. Developers extended nearly everything of Midgar segment from the original, to such extent that even at times the game's events boost the hope for change being actually viable (deviating fate) while the developers keep the actual key moments hidden; which to me, if I'm correct, will determine everything to still end the same way. Everyone are merely taking a flowing road that's gonna be longer at times when it should be shorter and shorter at times when it should be longer et cetera. This feeling is given thorough the Whispers (this is how truly important they are) and how their actions can be taken as wobbly at times, but this means that everyone are merely on borrowed time at best. The triumphs against them are merely delaying fate, changing the road and relocating stops. Whispers seem to follow the logic of importance and their own existence takes the highest priority. When you think about it from this angle, every single detail makes sense quickly. Questions left are what made them, how long is the delay gonna be and thus how dramatically is the fate bolstered to enter the scene, but also what happens to those seemingly defeated ones. Then again the scenes where we see some things being changed could well be hopeful thoughts everyone thinks in their minds while the truth of reality still hurts the same as always. Every question revolves around Whispers and understanding them is the key to the locks of every variable in this game (probably excluding some combat and minigame related questions). Game is brilliant no matter what angle we look at it. Some bit of more polishing would make this excellent piece an even greater experience. 💯❤
Now everything makes sense... POSSIBLE SPOILERS AHEAD. READ FURTHER AT YOUR OWN DISCRETION. Whispers are the manifestation of players' worries and now Whispers unintentionally make the story deviate a bit. For example, first I thought that Jenova evoked Whispers in the first place by getting her closest Sephiroth clone to the scene where Aerith and Cloud would meet, but how did she know where and when to send him. Well, the answer is not that she evoked Whispers at all, but merely intercepted their signal of presence and that's why she knew where to get an agent into (not when). After all, story-wise, they are from the lifestream so she can follow them to an extent. Simple reasonable answer is that we evoked them instead. She merely got interested in the sudden presence of these mysterious entities (lifestream anomalies) and got one of her clones involved in the process, accidentally getting images from her future failing plan by allowing the clone to touch Aerith's shoulder. Aerith got the vision the moment our desperate arbiters of fate tried to make sure she and Cloud would meet (even though that was going to happen). She later on learns what they are and how everything needs to end up, while Jenova tries to intervene, due to the indisputable information, with her clones whenever she can; in an effort to really change the future into her benefit. So now the old players have a new mission alongside the old story in the Remake. To make sure everyone who truly needs to die - will do so eventually, and those who mustn't - won't die before their time or so. New players have it easier coz they don't need to understand it all; plus, when they think they do, the simple reason they go with would be to lump 'em all up as Cloud's hallucinations and mass illusions until they discover the real ordeal. It's quite elaborate way to make the old story feel new and not have it only as a mere face lift.
It was more like Cloud's mind was there rather than his body. Just like the final 1 on 1 battle in ff7 that you cant lose. It was a mental battle not a phsycal battle.
In the description of the final chapter, it says the "seven seconds til the end" is a reference to the meteor and the end of the world essentially. Also, the 3 whisper bosses you fight are oddly similar to the advent children in the weapons they use and the fact they summon Bahamut Maximillian Dood has a great theory on all that.
I'm pretty sure you're right. In the french translation, Sephiroth even says "Seven seconds until the Apocalypse". It reminds me of when the German translation of FFXV openly linked the Meteor to the Starscourge, and it pretty much ended up being true. You never know the infos these guys get when they have to localize the game.
(John 11:25-26) "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?" Repent and turn to Christ Jesus before it is too late. For after this comes the JUDGMENT. Christ died for your sins and rose on the third day, showing that anyone who trusts in him for salvation, will have everlasting life. (John 3:16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
The theme that plays during the edge of creation is a rendition of one of themes from forgotten city. It's called "can you hear the cry of the planet" and the remake theme is called "7 seconds until the end" I missed the reference at first too. But it does seem to be reference to aeriths death. Don't take my word for it Listen to both themes. It's a great theme..
This explanation and "theory" is brilliant and makes so much sense. Almost the entire game I was thinking what are these whispers doing. I would absolutely love to be placed in the timeline where Zack is alive and playable.
Does Anyone realize that there are multiple different Sephiroth in the game? - "Watashi" Sephiroth (The insane Sephiroth) - some part of the game - "Ore" Sephiroth (The good and kind Sephiroth before he was going insane in Nibelheim) - appear at the edge of creation After you play the game in English, play again in Japanese.
I think he may be referring to the Japanese text denoting different versions of sephiroth. “Orenshi=goodwill,” for example. So it’s just a literal translation. I don’t know for sure as I haven’t played it in Japanese yet.
@@kingvarien Final Fantasy VII - Crisis Core portrays Seph as a duty driven Soldier that clearly does his job for the good, he even has some lighthearted emotions here and there. So he isn't all about doom and gloom.
Agree with your conclusions. Would love to see: 1. Video on every whisper interaction (what they are trying to do in each scene) 2. Video on who is seeing the whispers (was Aerith the only one at first and then because she touched Cloud he can too?) 3. Analyzing Sephiroths dialogue.
in advent children, sephiroth didn’t come back because someone “thought of him”. literally the whole story is about them trying to get a piece of jenova so he can be resurrected through her.
Although Sephiroth mentions he will never be a memory. And in the novel he even says that as long as Cloud remembers him, his being will always manifest from the lifestream. Something like that, I don't remember the exact line.
Robert Pena it is also connected to time travel in kingdom hearts. That’s what happened with maleficent in kh2 and explained in khux. We all now Nomura is a crazy genius so idk what to expect from ff7 part 2....
Something I haven't heard anyone talk about it the implication that this new party has 2 Sephiroths to deal with. One from the OG timeline and the one that's native to this new timeline. Sephiroth never seems like much of a "team player" so it'll be interesting to see how they resolve that clash of egos to either team up or fight each other.
thinking the same thing, that and the fact that there's another "version" of cloud... Sephiroth has always had a hold on him, so i'm wondering if that plays a factor
Just think about how stupid it would be if Aerith doesn’t die. “Hey Aerith, where are you going?” “I’ll be back in a minute, I’m gonna get this really powerful materia that will stop anything Sephiroth is planning.” Later: “Hey did you get it?” “Yep, no problem at all. Pretty easy actually. I went ahead and used Holy while I was there. Sephiroth is dead now.” “............ok. Let’s go home I guess.”
FrancoUnAmericano someone had a theory of Biggs losing his memory after waking up and becoming the “new” Cid. I really don’t like that idea and don’t really think that will be the case anyways. But I think Biggs will get with Wedge and build up Avalanche even more to where they are pretty much an army to get back at Shinra and bust them out for killing everyone in sector 7. Or they could both be the pilots of Highwind whenever you get to that point instead of just random crew members running the airship.
But Holy failed. It's Aerith from the lifestream that saved everyone. So by thinking that Sephiroth wants to change destiny to survive...would that not mean that HE wants her to live and THEY will have to decide if she needs to die or not?
I just finished my first run with VII Remake.. oh my.. loved it. 80+ hours, and still need to replay to obtain everything. But that ending totally changes the aspect of what the original created. Now to explore a new timeline. Cannot wait
Sephiroth is so powerful he came back to re-write the first game.
Edit: Thank you for the likes! so happy FFVII has gained new fans to this beloved story and now we get see it unfold in a new way. love this community!
yet the game play out at 98 percent of the same things happened i call that a crapy re-write on his part. everyone keep saying it as aeirth death but holy is what stopped him not aeirth's death( just made it longer for the party to finally get his plan and get to him) but if she did not die then it is over right there cause she was calling holy when she died. making it lose-lose for him.
I think this too, and Aeris is also powerfull, so she came after him!!
@@soniccinos *aerith
@@DaReeceyboy I'm a old school FFVII player, even though it was a typo, for me I'll always call her Aeris!
@@donaldcurry1020 Holy didn't stop Meteor, though. It made it come to a crawl, but then Meteor was winning their wrestling contest. You can see this in the original FF7 ending, because you see the red of Meteor poke through Holy's shield, showing that Meteor is winning.
That's when the Lifestream bubbles up from all over the planet and flows to Midgar in order to stop Meteor.
What it SEEMS LIKE Sephiroth was saying was that he realized in the ORIGINAL timeline, he dies. Through whatever series of events, he dies. He died at the end of FF7, and came back in Advent Children, to be defeated again, saying "I...will never be a memory."
It's almost like from that point, he traveled back in time to try and change the past so that he wouldn't die this time in the future. And, for whatever reason, he needs Cloud to be alive.
It kind of reminds me of the Avengers Endgame movie where Dr Strange says that he looked at some massive number of millions of timelines to see how they could win, and that they only actually win in 1 of them. And...that involved traveling back in time and changing the past as well.
There are actually a lot more examples of Aerith seeming to know what's coming. At the start of Chapter 8, she seems to know he identifies as a mercenary before he has a chance to say so, and she plays it off that she simply guessed he was a mercenary, based on the sword. And at the end of Chapter 8, when discussing her past with Cloud, she openly mentions Zack's name. That didn't happen in the original. As she says this, Cloud's PTSD kicks in and he gets one of his headaches, preventing him from really perceiving what she's said. Yet, when he comes to, she's pointedly looking at him, as if gauging his reaction to hearing Zack's name. There's also the scene in Chapter 8 where she references that the flowers have something to say, and soon they'll say it, but there's one thing left that needs to happen if the people will be able to hear them. Based on her look of resolve and her clenched fist, I think she's referencing her impending death. In Chapter 10, as they're trying to leave the sewers, Tifa and Aerith have an exchange regarding the plate. Tifa says something to the effect of "I hope we make it in time" or "It can't be true," or something like that. And Aerith responds by looking away, and kind of half-heartedly trying to reassure her. It seems obvious she has something she wants to say, but isn't sharing, and Tifa even comments on it in the moment. Then there is her apparently guessing that Marlene is a child and is at Seventh Heaven, despite the fact that she'd only heard Marlene's name once before. And then when she meets Marlene, she somehow knows that Barrett is Marlene's father, despite having never met Barrett or Marlene at this point. And while you could argue that having heard Marlene's name was enough to guess that she was a child Tifa cared about, that doesn't explain how she knew about Marlene's relationship to Barrett. There's also her apparent new ability to impart knowledge through touch. She clearly did this when hugging Marlene in Seventh Heaven. There was a moment when she seemed to share information with Marlene which calmed her down, followed by Aerith putting a finger to her lips as if to say "This is our secret." And she did something similar later with Red XIII (Nanaki), when she first calmed him, and then successfully identified that he is in fact a child of his species. How could she know that, having never met or seen one?
This is a great big wall-o-text, and I haven't even covered all of the examples. Point is, Aerith is definitely aware of how events are *supposed* to play out. Now, here's where I think it gets interesting, right? I think that not only is she aware of how things are supposed to go -- I think she's actively trying to make sure that that's how they go. I don't think she's trying to break with the timeline. I think she's trying to ensure the timeline plays out properly. I think Sephiroth is the one trying to break the timeline, possibly by ensuring that Aerith doesn't die. If Aerith doesn't die, she won't be able to enter and therefore manipulate the Lifestream to fend off Meteor long enough to let Holy do its job. Perhaps Sephiroth is trying to manipulate Cloud into saving her. But if that's the case, then Aerith might deliberately sacrifice herself in an effort to ensure that Sephiroth still loses.
Joseph Breen all of this blew my mind to read and I felt the same way while playing the game. Aerith wasn’t being too subtle imho about knowing things that she shouldn’t, it was simply a matter of all the other characters not being able to understand. Us as viewers who have “hopefully played the original” know where she’s coming from, which is super cool. One major telling scene is definitely when Aerith is embracing Marlene in the bar and Marlene “senses” through touch what Aerith has “been through?” and Aerith is all “shhhh little one, spoilers” that gave me chills. I can’t wait till the next instalment!
@@alainbourassa1998 Right? Like, I know a lot of people are being kinda cynical about the changes and the new direction, and yeah, I know Nomura has a reputation for some pretty dense/convoluted storytelling, but at this point, I am 100% onboard for whatever comes next.
I think you're giving them too much credit, unfortunately. These are the guys that made KH a mindblown aka fuckfest of a story and destroyed (to some) Final Fantasy and created and repeat the XIII.
@@PeteOnTheBeat ??? 13 was okay. What are you saying??
Let’s not mention the fact Aerith wasn’t surprised one bit in finding out Cloud is Avalache
Clouds and Sephis first encounter in the Remake:
Cloud: "I killed you with my own-"
Sephiroth: "Oh you need not remind me. It was the crowning moment of our time together. But that was then and this is now..."
Cloud talks about the events in Crisis Core but Sephiroth talks about the original timeline.
More importantly, the fact that Cloud can consciously recall that at ALL already means FF7R's timeline was drastically different from the start. This is probably where Cloud's terrified "GASP" comes from.
In the original game, Cloud isn't made aware of this until him and Tifa are in the lifestream at basically the very end.
@@RemiusTheAwesome Yeah in the original he couldn't remember it at all like he was supressing it due to how Traumatic it was.
I think a good amount of Cloud’s memory is still tainted/mixed and screwed up. Because he still believes he actually made it to being Soldier First Class, I think they changed it a bit in the Remake pertaining to the Cloud-Sephiroth situation. In the original Cloud from the being always thought Sephiroth was dead, he just didn’t remember that he played apart in Sephiroth’s disappearance. Due to the Jenova cells and Sephiroth cells Hojo put into Cloud. With the Remake I feel as they decided to go a different route, and Cloud being aware that he had something to do with what happened to Sephiroth years ago. I do think the Remake is going to continue down the road or Cloud not knowing that there was someone in his life named Zack, until it is a crucial part of the story in the Remake. I can’t wait to see where things go in the Remake.
Ahh that’s such a good point! :3 The only question I have though, is that in the original FF7 if I remember correctly, Cloud’s memories are all scrambled, believing to fill the roles that Zack did when that was obviously not the case. There are brief flashbacks in the Remake where Cloud recalls Tifa sobbing over her dead father and Sephiroth talking with the frozen Jenova, which were things that only Zack observed from his own perspective, meaning Cloud was not there to see it and remember it. Yet, Zack was not the one who killed Sephiroth (at least not in Crisis Core) - Cloud did. He even states, “I killed you with my own...” implying that Cloud knows he’s the one that finished Seph off. It’s a bit confusing to me, what does he remember accurately and what does he not? 🤔
@@PrismaticPichu but he was there though wasn't he? I thought he was a lesser ranked soldier accompanying Tifa, Sephiroth, and Zack. He sees it all happen but somehow mixes his own memories with Zack's, from what I remember from the original
Honestly I am just still stunned that we're finally having actual playable characters with the same level if not better details than the CG Animations from Advent Children. It's pretty crazy. Even if it's a 15-year difference, the leap in in-game rendered graphics achievement still amazes me.
Great point. And it's been visually clear
that’s literally all i’ve wanted since i saw Seph vs. Genesis
The final battles (Spirit and Sephiroth) had such a great and fluid Advent feel. Top marks
Just wait until we see the ps5 sequels! It'll be beyond modern animated movies
Who
Sephiroth realises that killing Aerith was the reason why she could stop him through the Lifestream that's why he wants Cloud to save her
yet she died or not it was holy that stopped him, so if she was alive he still lose cause she was calling holy.
@@donaldcurry1020 Holy failed in the original, it was only the final lifestream push from Aerith that saved the planet
Also she's technically his half sister
@@maverickdarkrath4780 how? They have different mothers and fathers
@@maverickdarkrath4780 They don't have the same mothers or fathers.
Sephiroth's mother was Lucrecia, and his father was either Hojo or Vincent, and he had Jenova genetic material - Jenova was not a Cetra/Ancient, she was a a traveler from another planet that, like Lavos in Chrono Trigger, traveled world to world, destroying and absorbing energy.
Aerith was a half-Cetra/half-normal Human. Her mother was Ifalna, who was the last living pure blooded Cetra (we don't know who her parents were or what happened to them). Her father was Professor/Doctor Gast, who lead the Jenova project before leaving Shinra for a dislike of their methods. He was also the person that had Hojo's job before Hojo, effectively, and Hojo fully embraced the Shinra way and changed the course (which included experimenting on the in-the-womb Sephiroth...)
Sephiroth only THOUGHT, initially, that he was a Cetra, because Shinra believed Jenova was one (she wasn't, she was just in a 2,000 year old geologic layer, so they assumed she must have been one since she was from that era, though she clearly doesn't have the body of one). Since he was reading the books and research notes, Sephiroth simply believed that to be correct, only finding out after his "death" that it wasn't true.
They're going to feed us all this "You can save Aerith bs" just to make it hurt more when sephiroth makes you kill her yourself.
It won't be Sephiroth that makes you do it. It'll be Aerith that asks you to be the one who has to do it.
Imagine a bloody Aerith asking Cloud to kill her, when she survives getting impaled.
I think everyone has forgotten that we see Aerith and Zack together at the end of Advent Children too. They both still have to end up dead to follow suite.
That'd be fuggin evil
CJCMartinez this remake has nothing to do with AC anymore because it’s another timeline and not the original one...if you get what i mean
So where is the timeline where Jessie is still alive and i go to her house that night to eat her "Pizza"?
kay oss
Then what!!!!
Gav and win A. Then I go to Tifa’s house for “tacos”, then go to Aeriths house for some “apple pie”.
kay oss
Exactly what I was thinking
kay oss 😂😂😂
HAHAHAHA I'M LOOKING FOWARD FOR THIS TIMELINE AS WELL🤣
i saw someone say that “remake” is not saying it’s a remake of the original game, but part of the title, telling you what it’s about, just like advent children or crisis core or whatever. it’s called remake because they’re remaking destiny. i like that.
It is clever. Deceptive tho. There will always be purists tho.
It's so fucking meta and I love it
This is good.. But ill still see it as a reboot xD
Few years late. I think it’s called remake because it will be the closest entry to the original. The watchers of fate are the fans demanding a 1:1 copy of the original and now that they have been defeated the game can experience a rebirth into something new and familiar.
@@SilenceDogood153Don't feel bad, my guy. I literally just beat this game for the first time just a few days ago thanks to Playstation plus. Been scouring TH-cam for reviews and analyses for FFVII Remake since then so I'm constantly jumping into years old comment threads lol.
I'm so glad I played it when I did because my wait for the next game is mere weeks instead of several years lol. And now I get to be part of the hype train for Rebirth as well.
The best part about this new ending is that it suggests that we played right into Sephiroth's hands. He opened the portal knowing that we would follow him through it. He wanted us to eliminate the Whispers, which were working to stop him from altering the timeline. That is why Sephiroth did not confront us until we had destroyed the Whisper Harbinger for him. And now that he was free to alter the timeline without interference from the Whispers, he acted to remove the last thing that might stop him from carrying out his plans; US.
If Sephiroth is going to enact his plan to summon Meteor with the knowledge of how he was defeated on the original timeline, it seems likely that he will be more proactive in his attempts to kill us before we realize the totality of his plan.
I don't know but, Sephiroth is definitely powerful enough to defeat the whispers. Why would he need Cloud and company to do it for him? I'm not saying this to appear clever, what I'm saying is, it certainly looks like he's been trying to guide Cloud up until that point and he never attacks, only after defeating the whispers, which is weird. If that's what they're going for I just hope the reason for all of that is convincing and plausible.
@@FlyteDanny Sephiroth was playing with us at the end. He's enjoying himself
@@FlyteDanny maybe..... Since we are alive in the end the whispers couldnt kill us maybe? So they had to hold back or something 😅
@@FlyteDanny it seems like sephiroth wasnt in possesion of his full power and maybe that could explain why he did not defeat the whispers himself (like he is in some sort of regenerative state still)
@@FlyteDanny I would imagine that there is something about time traveling that prevents someone from interacting with the harbinger of whispers, or a harbinger of whispers from outside the traveler's timeline. He might have needed people from the new timeline to kill the harbinger for some reason like that.
When cloud was falling upside down after fighting the big whispers I was waiting for him to say, I've been having these weird dreams lately, like, is any of this for real... Or not
Except that was a recreation of the same scene from the end of the original after the boss battle with Safer Sephiroth.
Than the music Simple and Clean played in the background ♪
Lmao
So you havent played the orignal have you?
@@tatecheddar Well, not really because the OG does not take place "at the edge of creation". We have no clue what that means or where it is. The Arrival and battle was in parts shot for shot in-camera though but while it is right to say it is a recreation it would also be important to add that the scene has a vastly different purpose and difference from the OG. Sadly I didn't get to use ascension/omnislash on Sephirot there but at least I used it in the battle before.
There is also the fact that the “to be continued” sign that we knew was coming said ‘the UKNOWN Journey will continue”. Kinda play s into this theory a fair bit
Zack fair
The whispers are the embodiment if OG fans inside the game.
Almost like the creators saw what happened with star wars fans and went "see that's the kind of insanity we're up against.....so let's make them the reason why the story veers left out of nowhere."
Red XIII did say “is it our destiny to change destiny?”
You say that Aerith is spearheading changing destiny, and that her saying "We can change this, we can set it right" meant that she wasn't happy with how FF7 went... here's an alternative theory to that. Sephiroth very clearly isn't happy with how FF7 went, and he's very clearly trying to get Cloud to defeat destiny. He keeps showing Cloud frightening moments, he even shows the whole party the Meteor making a mess out of Midgar in the Shinra HQ, so it's clear he wants to subtly convince them that the future is bleak and terrible, when in fact the party saves the future in the final hour. Therefore, it's quite likely that Sephiroth is the one that instigated all of this, and Aerith is only following suit to try to ensure that Sephiroth doesn't win.
The Whispers follow both, as well as anyone who interacts with them in a meaningful way, to keep the timeline on track. For most of the game, the effects of this is clear. Aerith begs Cloud for help, which changes Cloud's path and suddenly allows him to see Whispers. Avalanche decides to keep Cloud out of the 2nd bombing mission, so they attack and hurt Jessie to force Barret to take Cloud in. They protect Aerith from falling at the church. They slow down Cloud, Tifa and Aerith so they can't make it to the Sector 7 Pillar on time. They influence Biggs, Wedge and Jessie to get them killed (though they seem to have somehow failed with Biggs and Wedge). Avalanche nearly successfully stops the Sector 7 plate from falling, so they intervene and allow Rude to confirm the sequence. There's a butterfly effect going on from the moment Cloud and Aerith meet, and when Sephiroth first shows up, and everyone who is directly affected is able to see the Whispers. This brings up a question on why RUFUS of all people can see them, when even none of the Turks can, but it mostly fits.
By the end of the game, the Whispers are out in huge numbers, clearly showing that the butterfly effect is so great that even they are having a great deal of difficulty correcting the course. So, Aerith decides in that moment that their best chance is to beat Sephiroth at his own game. Disrupt fate, then do everything in your power to ensure that even then, Sephiroth still does not win. This also adds on to the fact that she's frightened at that moment. If she planned this from the start, she would have had time to prepare herself for this, but she's clearly and visibly shaken by the thought. Further proof that she didn't initially plan on changing fate? When she tells Cloud not to fall in love with her, because it wouldn't be real. Not only does this mean she knows what's supposed to happen, but it also means she also believes destiny will be maintained, as though she's trying to ensure nothing changes. If she knew destiny would be broken, and that the future would be a blank slate, then there would be no reason to believe that Cloud's love would be a result of preordained fate, nothing more.
TLDR; Sephiroth is the one who wanted to kill fate, Aerith wanted to preserve it, but it was too far gone by the end of the game so she decided to go along with it and beat Sephiroth at his own game.
I agree so far
I can dig it.
I also agree but they hinted that Jessie is still alive and that Wedge was killed off at Shinra.
If Sephiroth really would kill Fate then what would he change? His only intention is to destroy the world with Meteor.
But if this is really the Truth then he dont have to kill Aerith.
Because if the Fan Theory is really correct then only through her Death she is capable to summon Holy and stop the meteor because her Soul is returning to the Lifestream.....if she dont die she cant stop the Meteor so Sephiroth would win and changes the Fate.
If that is correct then the whole "7 seconds" Theory wouldnt make any Sense because Sephiroth has no Reason to kill Aerith.
I just love the potential for what this all means, I've said it already but I absolutely love the original FF7 game, I've literally bought practically every "version" of the game and played through it enough times. I REALLY cant wait to see where this story goes, I just hope it doesn't turn out like what from what I heard, FF15 was supposed to end quite a bit differently with the final dlc's, but because they cut those "dlc" short we never got to fully see what was the planned eventual full story in the game. At least I am being optimistic about FF7 remake after literally playing through the game and im only basically one achievement away at 100% the game right now. Heres hoping the newer games are just as good if not even better than the original :)
I take the title "remake" as literal not just a part of the title. I think it means that we are going to remake the outcome of the world we love into something all of us wanted.
This is quite an astute statement
All of us wanted? I mean, I'm all for whatever SE decides to do with the next part(s), but there are still quite a lot of people who want a straight re-telling of the original story.
@@MinerDiner It certainly isn't what I want, the original already had a great story. If I wanted to play something with an entirely different story...well, I'd play something else. This was supposed to be an update of the original game and everything that made it special, not something else entirely. You can still remake something and add to it while keeping the overall structure the same, like the Resident Evil 1 and 2 remakes did.
Oh wow. T hat's deceptive and I like it.
Nomura you mad man! You have to be stopped!!
As a hardcore fan who has played this game multiple times, Im so thrilled with the new direction its going in.
Love it! Cant wait to see where they take it next
Same here i mentioned above even if they stuck to the exact same original i would of been happy either way but this spin of us in another timeline of the game was genius.
Im 34 and so jaw dropped by the game as well . i was well satisfied and hope the next part rings through just as well . soo many years and im reliving old memories and loving it 😊
👏👏👏
I fear that they will not be able to sustain this business model tho and will destroy the game and never finish it
The remake was jaw dropping, but that’s only because they did so well sticking to the original. The changes they made were the worst parts. I don’t have faith in them doing a good job, the story is going to be a convoluted time line mess, where no body dies. 🤦🏻♂️
Whatever theory or how you feel about the direction can we all just agree what a beautiful game this is?
Except for a bunch of textures.
@Tyler Robbins bullshit bet you didnt even try playing it. This game was awesome af. Battle system was badass. Story a lil confusing around the end was still good. Makes me sad I gotta wait a few yrs for pt 2.
It is for the most part. Which makes the not so beautiful parts (looking at you, textureless slums) look extra jarring
I'm honestly loving the prospect of Sephiroth becoming more formidable than he already is by knowing his and the world's fate. I wonder how far will he be able to go by manipulating the characters. And what our party will do this time. Aerith already seems to be kind of on the same page as Sephiroth. So maybe she'll warn them or something.
@@CheknoEternity Fans will have learnt already that the remake does not follow the original story. I personally like the changes. Plus, I don't believe that seeing Sephiroth more often in the game is a bad thing. I'd say it's a treat actually. And finally, the writers will not handle the game poorly. They care about the audience's reaction.
I feel like one of the few people who played it in 1997 who loved the ending and the idea that I'm going on a whole new adventure, that I don't know what's going to happen next.
I know, right?
All these naysayers, but I'm one of the most hardcore FF7 fans out there, and I'm actually really interested in this and find it compelling. I don't have a PS4, so had to watch a playthrough, and as I started seeing this wasn't going to be just a simple remake with updated graphics and all that, I got even more interested. It's got the music and characters to be familiar, and yet it's got a new adventure and I can't be sure how it will play out, who will live and who will die, etc. It's like a brand new story in a world that I've loved.
Like the chapter heading in Chrono Cross when you first travel to the other dimension "Arni Village - Nothing has changed but everything!"
...and perhaps BECAUSE of the fact it hits those nostalgia beats, it has drawn me in in a way that no game has in probably a decade, if not longer (other than, perhaps, Shadowbringers 5.0 experience in FFXIV - there were legit places where I was looking for a save point before logging off, only to remember I was playing an MMO, not a single player RPG. XD) Made me feel like a teenager again.
To me, that's a pretty amazing feat, and I'm shocked how many people are entitled, wanna-be-offended by everything, brat "purists" insisting that it's "garbage".
Even if you don't like its story compared to the original, it's hardly "garbage".
And I loved the original and am hoping to death they do away with the "timed exclusive" nonsense so I can buy and play Part 2 from day 1!! I want to see where the future goes!
The game is the better sequel we all wanted since AC was kind of a disappointment there is a lot of double meanings in this game and hidden lore that you have to go back and listen and analyze during multiple playthroughs with having context of your first playthrough
@@HamiltonNgo-A24 Thing is.. I actually picked up on a ton of it immediately. All of my building theories were proven true at the end. Guess thats one reason I wasnt shocked and confused by the ending like everyone that was angry at it.
I feel the exact same way
Same
Sephiroth: i will give you 7 seconds
Cloud: so its gonna be called
Final Fantasy 7?
Lol, I laughed too hard at this!
_Cloud and Sephiroth looking into a microwave_
Sepiroth: Seven seconds til' the end
At first I thought he was talking about how long it'd take cloud to pre-maturely ejaculate and I thought seph was gonna start blowing him HARDCORE
Now that'd be a controversial move by Square LOL
@@MinerDiner Lmao
The final take in the scene with the sword being stuck in the ground, is almost like game's starting screen, so basically it's a hint I guess. You could literally connect the fact they are on an edge of creation (that's all we got for you guys in this release) and from that point you can either continue (old plot) or start a new game (follow different path, "carefull now" - it's not yet defined how we will move forward). I don't believe they invested time to render this particular take just for the sake of it. It is definitely full of symbolism.
One really interesting thing I saw recently is that if you look at the nebula at the edge of creation during that exact scene, its shape resembles the Forgotten City
OMG, I didn't even notice that! It also ties in with the gorgeously remixed forgotten city BGM. I absolutely adore this game and it's beautifully-confusing story. I can't wait for "Rebirth"!
My god - I loved how concise and easy to follow this was. Normally I never watch these editorial type videos but Scott- I’m a new fan now
yet lots of plot holes is everything he said.
The whispers are like the hardcore fans trying to make sure the story stay the same as it was. Literally Nomura-ed~
As far a Nomura game, i give it a 4/10. Not enough talk about "Heart" and "Darkness"
The Arbiter of Fate is the personification of every fan boy (me). They literally made me kill my own expectations.
Lmao, this is so true!
Nomura= Fanboy Slayer
@@isamuddin1 just stop playing the remake and get the og you idiots
To me a big clue was when Red-13 says "A glimpse of tomorrow if we fail here today". Meaning if they failed and not change history the original ending would happen.
This to me is the biggest red herring that people are basing most of their saving Aerith theories off of. And how ironic it comes from Red!
Red XIII just sees a glimpse of his future running towards a ruined and overgrown midgar. He only has the context of his current situation to make sense of that vision. So naturally he would assume, oh if we fail here today, midgar must get totalled. He has no idea that it is actually a vision of their success fighting an even greater threat (remember at this point, nobody knows about summoning meteor or what the craic is with Jenova etc)
My longstanding theory on this game has been, since the projects announcement, outside of midgar we wont get an overworld, we'll just go form town to town to cave to dungeon to mountain via cutscene or small areas in between. So of course, to achieve this the story elements outside of Midgar will need a bit of a rework, quite a bit actually. Especially since they'vealready done a lot of the post-midgar reveals before we even leave Midgar this time.
Square have yet to show how they'll handle traversal of Gaia outside of Midgar, and they've been very quiet on that front. Because they know the news will cause massive backlash online, a lot of people won't be happy with how they'll approach it.
This to me is what this whispers subplot has been preparing fans for. Not for major plot changes, the story beats will most likely play out the same way in some shape or form, slightly altered perhaps. But things like, going to fort condor etc will probably get axed entirely. Or the hunt for Huge Materia, I'd say most of that will now be delegated to the background, performed by Avalanche HQ and we'll probably just do Cids journey to space because that is the most plot heavy moment in huge materia hunt thats relevant to character development.
The whispers from a meta-narrative perspective were the fans voices within the writers heads. The fear that no matter what they did or how they executed the game post-midgar, a larger amount of people will be pissed compared to those who are pleased. They put those fears to rest while making this game and are not going to let it worry them going forward and that we, the fans, need to get used to that idea before we ruin the experience for ourselves by expecting something with a huge overworld and fully controllable airships in a full 3d spherical planet. That's just not something Square do any more and probably wont be returning for FF7 Remake (i've been hoping for the last 5-6 years ill be wrong about this but it doesnt seem likely). So there will be large narrative changes to compliment how the characters will be getting from plot point to plot point, town to town, etc.
Doing the first episode completely in Midgar was a great way to cover up the fact the game wouldn't have this stuff going forward due to its boxed in linear nature, because until you actually left Midgar, you were sure the whole game would take place there (if you were a ten year old kid in 1997 playing their first jrpg, you definitely werent expecting a huge world to explore)
Idk if you all realized all of the visions or cutscences of the future(a glimpse of tomorrow) is actually all from the movie advent children. Aerith death ( cloud carrying aerith in the water, aerith praying for meteor, red13 running in the desert, cloud charging at sephiroth. So if the future was and is based from advent children, then cloud still has regrets that he couldnt save her(in the movie n ff7), meaning aerith deaths could have been prevented( which cloud believed in the movie"which is 2 years in the future after saving the world") but cloud failed and let her die . which was why my assumption is that cloud does have 7 sec to save her (if the future cloud from advent says he could have tried to save her). I believe he literally was in front of her because cloud himself tried to kill aerith( being controlled by genova cells from sephiroth) but when he resisted sephiroth will or the genova cells sephiroth just jumped down n stabbed her. So im just gunna make that assumption is that he could have saved her within that 7 second time. funny how when cloud was fighting sephiroth at the end of the movie it looked like whisperers where following sephiroth everywhere as well. Then sgain not sure what SE has in for us but i cant wait for part 2
doesn't that literally means the original ending is considered the 'failed' version? sound like a bit of a disrespect towards to the outcome in original if you ask me.
@@Todd-_-Umptious stfu
WanOne it was confirmed in an interview that all humanity is dead at the end of FF7 original. So it was a bad end for humanity. Just not the planet and the rest of the species on it.
One part in the singularity that got me was: when you start defeating the apparition of fate, they shoot 'memories of the future' for you to witness, and I think it was Red XIII saying "these are images to show us what will happen if we fail today." Yet, we know those are the events that already happened and transpired. So, did we just essentially change that already too? Such a cliffhanger.
i'd like to see what will eventually become or happ en to crazy proffessor Hojo
Tjey are saying that the future is uncertain.
It was all done as a way to give the player many surprises in the future games
Sethiroth: That's what you get for that ridiculous dance routine you pulled at the wall market.
Sephiroth*
Fabulous* :P
HAHAHAHAHA
what makes that so funny is you know he was watching cloud the whole game XD
😂😂
FFS stop saying this is Nomura's doing. He is the Director, the writer is literally the same writer of the original. The writer said in interviews he was altering aspects of the original
KiwiBarb people need to see this comment.
@@ArdenVT People are not interested in knowing who the author generally is. All they want to know is: Who's the person responsible for letting this mess slide? The answer is obviously the director.
There's a difference between "altering aspects of the original" and just writing a different story with the same characters and setting...that's called fan fiction, in most cases.
You all need to understand why they are saying this: directors have final say. Writers are low on the totem pole. He wouldn't have written this naturally. This is a very Nomura move. Every game of his has this sort of ridiculousness in it. It /is/ Nomura.
@@AlexanderTP90 I seriously doubt THIS writer for THIS project is "low on the totem pole".
FF7 is one of Square's most legendary projects. FF7:R is an absolutely huge project, with the potential to please and/or alienate tens of millions of people.
...I'm pretty sure the writer isn't just some low level dude that no one listens to or cares about.
He mentions that there is this possible implication that OG FF7 ending was like "a bad ending" of sorts. When you get the memory from Red XIII and it shows him running with his cubs like it was at the end of FF7 they ask him what that was and his response is along the lines of "that is what happens if we fail". I don't recall it exactly but that stood out to me. Back then we stopped Meteor and years later it was shown that Midgar was covered in overgrowth as if the planet was returning to its natural order and so you'd think that was a win, right? Well, not according to Red.
In the cannon of FF7 as a stand-alone, that ending is interpreted as the planet cleansing itself of all human race. AC retconned this.
Brandon Lundy apparently they all died in the OG Advent children took that ending away
@@Google5dancingisraelis How does the OG Advent Children take that ending away when it is literally the first scene of Advent Children?
@@ZoloTheLegend was just gonna say lol
Destiny was showing them what they would be destroying both Good and bad. But you need to keep in mind if they wanted to just defeat sephiroth they wouldn't fight destiny. But they want to destroy sephiroth permanently, which isn't destined to happen. In canon, while they defeat sephiroth, destiny wants sephiroth to exist long enough to do what he did in the og game, the side effects of him summoning meteor and dying. All the mako reactors were destroyed making the world go back to normal sources of power, the creation of a new world government that would protect the planet, the emergence of vincent valentine who would also save all life on earth during dirge of Cerberus. Destiny wants sephiroth to not win, but at the same time sephiroth must destroy enough to force changes that betters the world but not necessarily life on it. Both parties want a complete win, while destiny is a compromise. Sephiroth gets immortality but never true godhood. The gang can always stop sephiroth, but not until he has left scars that the world can never truly heal from, just adapt.
Nomura literally made a FFVII Fix it fanfic himself 😔👏
No it might be his revenge to his game FFversusXIII
@@shaminabalamo525 OH YOU'RE RIGHT
@@cookieartsy4507 what if nomura really compromise the continuation of 7 so he gonna punish square for cancelling his masterpiece and making it as 15
Makes me remember Sephiroth's line on Advent Children, he said "I will never be a memory"
i say it to this very day.
Remember also the scene after that where Cloud wakes up and sees both Aerith and Zack entering the light through the door? This could have been a moment of re-looping through the timeline due to perhaps one thing: Aerith and Sephiroth are literal gods, destined to be reincarnated over and over again... until now.
The three brothers in advent children are the 3 whispers you fight at the end of the game
@@Jiggle_physics19 that wouldn't make sense because they're modeled after Tifa, Barret, and Cloud. One has a gun, one has a sword, and one uses fists.
@@ojaya15966 yeah
Now I’m scared they’re going to kill Tifa instead 😭
Same here. But they probably won't
Imagine thinking they won't just use this to revive Aerith lol
I would think tetsuya Nomura would not do anything to shorten his life span ☠
It wouldn't really make sense in context to the story. Aerith was killed because she was an ancient
Very unlikely. Imagine the outrage that'll come after if they choose to do that. I think Aerith will definitely still die, but they'll narrate it in a different way. Maybe she'll sacrifice herself to stop Sephiroth and save the planet. That Aerith scene was so empowering that it'll be so ridiculous to not tap into that classic emotional connection once again.
8:31 Aerith does know about Marlene, Tifa spoke about her in the Train Graveyard and how they have to get to her
She doesn't actually know who she is though, and her being in the trainyard would mean she's dead, so it still points to Aerith being concious of her previous timeline knowing who Marlene is
Zach Aerith doesn’t know the specifics of her previous lives. Only that she has connections with Cloud and crew, the planet is in danger, and that her life ends abruptly at some point in her journey. Sephiroth on the other hand read the script and is making edits lol.
@@mangasaint Aerith knows enough to know Marlene needs to be saved from 7th Heaven, because Marlene was kept with Elmyra during most of their journey in the previous time
Zach She seems to know people but with limits. She knew that Cloud was a mercenary, but didn’t know if Cloud knew Zack.
@@Noplayster13 Most people seem to stumble around Clouds background, Hojo says to him in front of everyone "you were never in Soldier" and not a single person questioned Cloud, ever
The first time Cloud gets the 'static headache' in the game is when Barret first mentions Stamp...
I hadn't considered it, but secretly making this a sequel as well as a remake is actually genius.
Ziddy I KNOW RIGHT!!
You know, despite it being labeled as a remake and not a split timeline sequel, and despite the fact that it's $60 purchase for an 1/8th of the story of the original. Have fun wasting your money?
@@ATthemusician 30+ hours of gameplay is a waste of money only to purist morons like you. So yeah, he is having fun unlike you
@@ATthemusician I was fully aware of how its being made and quite frankly? I'd much rather have an incredible experience over multiple installments than a rushed, shoddy mess in one game. I am having lots of fun with it and I'm excited for the next part. Enjoy being miserable.
@@ATthemusician remake is different from a remaster...
To be succinct, it's FF7: Days of Future's Past. I am A-OK with that.
Except that DOFP was made because X-Men was backed into a corner. That movie was made to give a second chance to do things they fucked up. Lol ff7 wasn't broken.
@@ryanclark6887 Bro... Dirge of Cerberus broke FFVII so bad lol that Square-Enix never wanted to touch the series after that garbage lol. They had to do this
Ryan Clark You do realize DOFP was a comic years before it was a movie right?
It is but with the clever twist of the villain changing the timeline and not the heroes. Seph is definitely a meta character that sees the timeline from a higher level
I disagree with the 7 Seconds until the end meaning, in the game during a save screen it mentions that Meteor was stopped with 7 seconds left so I think it is more likely a more literal reference to having stopped what was deemed inevitable or something of that like.
Also as for the party thinking that the ending of the original was a "bad" ending and wanting to change things for the better they do have a point. Yes they stopped meteor however the final scene from the original game "500 years Later" shows the jungle covered ruined Midgar. This led to much speculation about the fate of humanity in this world at the time but in more recent years on of the games creators confirmed that mankind has become extinct in those 500 years, probably been killed off by the planet itself or something (Reference to WEAPON attacking enemies of the planet, not once did WEAPON attack Sephiroth, it only went for humanity). Aerith and the party are not only wanting to defeat Sephiroth and stop meteor but also prevent the extinction of mankind itself
Thats how i saw it. Red may have survived, but thats all we see. Meteor still came crashing down, it was just partially stopped. They have lots of room to work with on the OG ending
The game itself refers that 7 seconds really does mean the end of the world in chapter select.
if humanity doesnt survive those 500 years, its not because of meteor. otherwise explain advent children, which clearly takes place after 7. as does dirge of cerberus, which takes place after ac. the city of edge is where they fight seph in ac, and that same city is a ghost town in dirge because of the plot in doc. humanity still exists though in both. WEAPONs, WEAPON attacks junon, diamond weapon attacks midgar, shinra tower specifically, ultimate weapon attacks where cloud is recovering from mako poisoning and later various places around the world. emerald weapon apparently took down gelnika and otherwise was chilling unto you poked it with a submarine. ruby, ruby seems to have just been enjoying making sand castles on himself, left his head out of it, and only started fighting at all because you rammed him in the head with an airship and interrupted his vacation. the weapons seem to mainly not like shinra. one does wonder why they didnt really do much if anything toward sephiroth. some of them were way more powerful than him.
Personally I think it’s Aeriths death because the music in that scene is the music from the Ancient’s city
@@xXxnytakasaxXx exactly. The game says the 7 seconds before the worlds demise.
My first thoughts after learning what the whispers were. Yep, these are the FF7 nostalgia purist who can't handle even the slightest of change in their lives trying to make sure the timeline isn't changed.
hahaha makes sense 😆
I'm not a purist, yet if a game is a remake of something. It's a remake. Not a reboot.
Well for good reason, the only bad parts of the FF7 remake were the parts they added or changed, not a good sign for the rest of the remake. Which is shaping up to be a convoluted time line disaster.
I am interested, but with the things they’ve done to Kingdom Hearts storyline I am definitely concerned. It can get out of their control really quickly.
"7 seconds til the end" Is the last seconds before the impact of meteor. Read the Chapter 18 map description. The Turning Point. "In the world beyond, Sephiroth shows a vision of the planet seven seconds before its demise."
Hmmm I thought it was when he stabs Aerith. Takes him 7 seconds to fall down and stab her, there's so many different things it could mean. I have no idea where Nomura is taking this.
@@ViolentNoctis Well, the quote I posted was from the game, so. There is no reason to theorize, really. :)
@@2un7zu yeah but this is nomura we're talking about. My favourite character was dead and miraculously is alive now. It's gonna be interesting to see where it all goes in the end.
It has nothing to do with Meteor. Why would Sephiroth ask for Cloud's help stopping his own plan? Meteor was never supposed to destroy the planet, only hurt it so that Sephiroth could absorb a lot of lifestream and become godlike. There's a new, unknown threat to the planet that Sephiroth has become aware of here.
@@CaptainFalcoyd Well, it's what it says in-game. /shrug
This game was absolutely amazing and it blew everything I expected out of the water. Yet wasn’t so different that it ruined the nostalgia for me. They did this game perfectly
I know right? To me They made it more interesting to play. Beat it this morning and going again to do what I missed. I thought the appearance by Zack was awesome and he lived. The Whisper fight at end were challenging.
Too much padding. Better in some areas than the original but too much filler
Was great until the ending. And that dude on the motorcycle was kind of weird lol
Ending was the best part, and I played the original when it first came out. I absolutely love the divergence they have made and now I can expect anything! This game is GOTY
100% agree with you.... it was everything and more from what I expected... they couldn’t have redone this game a better way!!
This game, for me, is perfect. I also have a feeling that in the next game we will have an opportunity to make specific choices that will allow us to stick to the original fate or deviate from it so fans can play it exactly as they remember it if they wanted.
That would be amazing, but I don't think that will happen, it will make the game way too vast size wise
@@charian2467 yeah def
I would get behind this 100% cause than it would make it worth replaying it again to see the differences.
yess i was thinking the same
Yes like Witcher 3 has multiple endings, maybe Final Fantasy remake can do the same thing
In the original Sephiroth didn't kill Aerith it was Jenova in disguise as Sephiroth. As the original body of Sephiroth was incased in Materia after he fell into the reactors core. This isn't known until Cloud betrays everyone (due to being controlled by Jenova and the Jenova cells in his body) and hand's the black materia to the original Sephiroth which causes him to mutate into the godly monster that he becomes.
That though is still a bit murky and iirc dependent on localization.
Some argue that Jenova was pulling the string all along and even Sephiroth at the end was just a vessel being piloted by Jenova. Others say that Sephiroth's will is the dominant and that he pilots the Jenova fragments to carry out his plan. The former means Sephiroth was never the villain and Jenova did everything (and would imply, by this theory, that it's Jenova in the guise of Sephiroth again, not Sephiroth); the latter means Sephiroth overtook Jenova's mantle as the calamity to the point of domineering her to carry out his will (meaning, even if committed by Jenova, Aerith's death was still committed by Sephiroth).
I think a lot of people may be overlooking an interesting fact. With Zack alive in that timeline, Cloud wouldn't have to take up their mantle, maybe it's Cloud who dies and we get to play Zack from then on.
Interesting idea, but they would never ever get rid of the super-iconic main character that is Cloud.
No thanks, Zack sucks.
Nah they wont kill cloud unlese its like a super sacrifice
But Zack is in his own timeline so we wont meet with the current heroes going foward.
I think that would break my heart more than losing Aerith. I love Cloud!
Aerith actually sees the Highwind as they sneak through Junon. She talks about it in the ShinRa cargo ship.
Exactly
Thank you. Someone else who actually knows the original word for word. The fans know this game better than the developers I swear. How can people read a poster artwork as "aerith was meant to live" is beyond me.
I’d say another thing that might not have been paid attention to in the remake is how Tifa thinks she sees Marlene in the train graveyard. Cloud wasn’t really paying attention but Aerith who can seemingly see or sense the ghosts could have just been paying attention to Tifa off screen. Thus her knowing Tifa wanted her to go for Marlene without this just being some her having memories from an alternate timeline thing. Aerith just pays attention.
Yh, Cloud promises to take her on it one day or something.
Brandonmaru TV Yeah but it’s not just that Aerith makes a lot of comments that show she knows what is going, even telling sephiroth “you aren’t right”. Aerith is observant but it’s also apparent that she is aware of what’s happening and knows how events are “supposed to go”
I believe Aerith will still die, just not when you expect her to.
Maybe by choice?
It will probably be a choice. Which has many benefits than negatives.
1.) Because now building her character won't be wasted and people won't neglect playing her in the next parts
2.) The hardcore aerith fans that want her to live or want cloud to get with aerith can be satisfied
3.) It adds high replayability value, one where she dies and one where she live this having different endings, cutscenes and events.
I'm of course going with her dying if this is the case, then 2nd run let her live.
@@bungifish2227 i agree, and I hope the next parts will be full of choices like KOTOR, ME, etc. That way all sides win, and there will be a crap ton of replay value.
@@bungifish2227 i dont think you will have a choice. Aerith is such a big Charakter and her entire Death has so many Impact on the Game that the Choice of let her live or let her die would create 2 completely different Games. I mean it would be so cool of that is possible but when you look at Games with such choises like the Games from Quantic Dreams you can see the big impact of theese "Butterfly Effects". I dont think it would work with such a hardcore Storydriven Game like Final Fantasy where the Charakters have such a big Role in the entire Game.
Mabe it is possible to save her at her old dying Place but i think she will die anyway.
@@bungifish2227 it can't be a choice, a choice would imply that ff7 would have multiple endings instead of 1 true ending, and I don't think square wants that, nor the fans.
So far the best description I’ve heard up to this point. Covered everything I was confused about. Fantastic job!
Aerith also heavily foreshadows her death several times and drew attention to the materia she carries with her. Almost like a “hey cloud, wink wink nudge nudge”
To me that just reinforced the fact that she is either the consciousness from the original.
When she told cloud that he can’t fall in love with her, that sounds like her trying to protect him and his feelings just in case she fails to change fate.
But she mentions that materia in the original game and how it does "nothing"
She tells him to not fall in love with her because it won't be real, she knows Cloud is not himself. Because she is Cetra, and the planet tells her things.
Also Aerith, even in the original was aware she needs to die in order to save the planet, so she leaves the party so nobody can stop her. Also that Aerith scene is a friggin dream sequence, so it might as well be Zack telling Cloud to not fall for Aerith, because the voice inside Clouds head has allways been Zack.
@@tehSunBro ??? No, that voice is Cloud's original persona.
She told Cloud not to fall in her has nothing to do with that, more like it has to do with Zack because he never came back and she's waiting for years.
@@tehSunBro I have always interpreted the voice in Cloud's head as Sephiroth/Jenova influencing him.
Aerith in the opening video looks around in the lane like "What? Is that repeating?" Like she has the consciousness of the original game. And you can see it in all the scenes with her in the game, is like she knows everything and wants to enjoy every moment (like she say in the dream sequence). This is why whispers attack her in they're first appearance, when Cloud meet her for the first time!
I theorized that the heartless were attacking Aerith to keep her there until cloud arrived. Because Sephiroth made cloud walk into that alley for that conversation, those few minutes were enough time for Aerith to have completely missed meeting him. After all, it's not like she was waiting specifically for him. Just coincidence
So you also didn't notice Sephiroth's theme playing in that scene ;)
That is why she is looking around, She can sense that something is wrong
Shes looking for Sephiroth because she can sense him. Shes fearful in the opening scene.
One of the memories was red running. That was the ending of the original game and red said “that is what will happen if we fail here”(to kill the main boss)
Why wouldn't he want to fail then? Seems like a good thing to run with his kids and it turned out ok.
@@Boogie7910 Don't quote me but I believe it's implied that in that vision which takes place 500 years later, no humans are still alive.
@@cn8299 Except you can hear children laughing and playing. I'm guessing that Sephiroth kept Zack alive in order to have a weak Cloud (in another timeline) that will join him. Don't know what Cloud changed in his 7 seconds (Aerith could be too obvious). But then hell maybe Cloud kept Zack alive and Sephiroth changed something completely different.
The 7 seconds Sephiroth is referring to isn't about Aerith. Its about the 7 seconds before meteor strikes Midgar/Gaia. If you go to Chapter Selection -> Chapter 18, it literally says that verbatim. So what this means, I'm not sure. There is a cutscene in the game where Meteor is about to strike Midgar and Barrett and Tifa are both laying unconscious on the ground. Does this play to it? Does Cloud have to choose between them? This implies Meteor will actually be about to strike Midgar or will, so will this happen, or is it a false vision Sephiroth projects to Cloud? We will find out in time.
@@Boogie7910 That vision is of the future where humans are wiped out. And this happens even though they defeated Sephiorth at the end. That is why its called the dark timeline. This game wont have the same outcome.
Wait a minute. When we first see aerith she’s being attacked by whispers in front of the theatre. Could it be because the whispers knew she was aerith from the prime reality trying to change events?
you hit the nail in the head. im pretty sure this is exactly it
So what happened to the Aerith from this timeline?
James Mountney it is the same Aerith. Consider it like X-Men: Days of Future Past when Kat sends Wolverine’s future conscious to a past Wolverine in the 1970s. Aerith and Sephiroth are a future consciousness possessing their former selves in the main story timeline. Future Aerith is merged with the life stream energy which probably allows her to go back in time.
@@JDP8888 , nice theory but a bit of a stretch. Time travel through the lifestream into your same body, idk feels out of place in ff7.
James Mountney if that’s not the case then it’s more like the movie Groundhog Day. They are stuck in a time loop as it was theorized for FFXV and yet probably true. The last DLC for FFXV that got cancelled was going to be the true canon ending. Ardyn was not the true antagonist but the god Bahamut. Square can still take that idea of changing antagonist from Sephiroth to just being like a Seymour/Sin/Jecht were the from FFX. The true antagonist could be the god that sends the whispers. Which can be Genesis/Minerava. FInal Fantasy is all about changing fate/the course of destiny. So a little timely whimey stuff won’t hurt it.
"obviously sephiroth DOES have to die eventually"
oh?
how about sephiroth wins, meteor lands, and this franchise goes out with a real bang
jk i love ff7
Yes that will happen in ep 6, then ep 7 will be where you will see the good ending. Chaching!
I would love for this to be a legit possibility. Like, if the player tries too hard to save everyone, Meteor goes unchallenged or something. Really, really hoping for some multiple ending, choices-matter type of deal.
@@ElProf I love the prospect of Sephiroth being an even cooler villain than he already is! Him ruling over different timelines and manipulating the characters. Has anybody thought of the chance that Sephiroth would get tired of dying or losing in every timeline and he eventually gives up his evil plans?
@@pinelopiliraki3660 in crisis core, its made pretty clear even when hes going through this whole im going to destroy the planet plan, he still thinks hes the good guy. and he is trying to keep all promises he made. while it seems unlikely, having a option to redeem sephiroth and it even possible, not just plot im being the real good guy and giving him the last chance and he just would never accept it that is common in so many stories, and due to how stubborn people can be real world on opposing views, would never take, would be nice to see for a change. that being a possible ending but not garaunteed and quite unlikely even, i would definitely like to see that.
actually, I like that. very reminiscent of Kefka. ooh... post-meteor world.
After beating it I had 2 feelings:
1)I was confused about how to feel at the *possibility* of the original’s biggest moment being re-written.
2)I really wanted to play the next installment.
During the course of the game I wasn’t sure if the hints at Aerith being aware of what was coming were serious, or just winks to players of the original. Now that it seems she really was aware, I’m scared/intrigued by how things may play out in future installments. Aerith’s words before hopping into the portal ring true. Square is taking a big gamble, I just hope they are able to make it pay off.
I like the twist and where the story is going. But I hope that it doesn't get too much convoluted like Kingdom Hearts
FF7 was convoluted already as it was. We just introduced timelines and fate into the remake. I think it's a bit late for that.
@@jodkmp no it wasn't
@@krusenator123 yes it was
@@jodkmp well that is an even better reason to hope it doesn't get too convoluted then. Convoluted * Convoluted makes it ConConVoVoLuLuTedTed :S
i am super exited to see where it goes though. And even if the next parts does end up being lack luster, then we still have the original
There is definately something genius preparing. can't wait to see how it turns out eventually!
Also, I might be the only one thinking this, but I'd love to see the ending where Sephiroth is somehow redeemed. If you know FF7"s lore well enough, or played Crisis Core, you know that Hojo is the one responsible for Sephiroth's insanity. Seph was broken from the very start (grew up in a lab, treated like a weapon from early age), but at the same time he truly cared for his SOLDIER friends and was a nice guy overall. Jenova cells inside him took over his mind when he discovered the truth and he became almost fully posessed by her after his physical death in NIbelheim reactor. Oh man, in Crisis Core, he said that would abandon Shinra after Nibelheim's job....
His story is actually really sad, and I hope that eventually he'll become free of Jenova, in a bitter-sweet kind of way - lets say, before death in Cloud's arms after a grand battle or smth. Just like Kadaj did in AC.
Kinds sucks seeing game blaming him for everything when he's no less victim to Hojo cruelness than Cloud, Vincent or anybody else in the game.
But I guess Im asking for too much. Q__Q
glad im not the only one who would like this as at least possible. maybe not make it a for sure ending. maybe our choises could matter this time around. ff8 was big on that the very next game after 7. yeah seph seemed to still think of himself as a good guy at the end of crisis core even right after nibelheim. made a point of trying to keep his promises he made to those he had thought of as friends. we will see what is in store for him this time around.
@Tien Most Powerful Earthling Of All Time Shinhan who hurt u bro
Red: A glimpse of tomorrow if we fail here today.
And all I was thinking was: AINT that the secret ending about 500 years later? So???
Right, my only gripe is the original ending is not bad. The world gets saved minus aerith and saving her will totally invalidate her sacrifice. I hope they tread carefully because if they save everyone and make death and sacrifice meaningless it’ll bite them in the ass. The way I can see the way out of this is if jenova is a vicious cycle that happens every 2000 years that they need to break the cycle a la crono trigger
@@lexsteele779 who knows what they might do. Perhaps they might create it differently and have it different than the original?
Lex Steele Just think of this iteration as another timeline. That original timeline isn’t going to go away Bc of this new one
@@lexsteele779 You know they might, well if they did change it, will focus on what she was doing before Sephiroth showed up, or in this case, if he did not show up, see what she was about to complete before Cloud and friends got there.
The three whispers actually refer to the three Sephiroth remnants from Advent Children. The hint is them summoning Bahamut ;)
This makes sense! I was thinking that they were fighting their future selves. Like how one has a Sword (Cloud), one has like a gun (Barret) and one fights with its fist (Tifa). But The remnants you mention, I think they also have these weapons too. And they do summon Bahamut, which was a weird part in the fight but makes sense because they summon it in the movie.
Mr. & Mrs. Madness the ost of the fight is called harbinger advent. And ther whispers use the same attacks as the advent children as well as having only one attack spell that corresponds to their canonical elements from the movie.
And their weopens
and yet the game tells you it people from the life stream that can move on, and changed into tifa, cloud and barret( basicly mirror match)
donald curry the game never says that ever. It only states that they are from the future and that they fight to protect the future that created them. Also if they were mirrors of the player characters then there would need to be one for red and aerith as they are participants in the battle as well. Also the whispers are never described as actual ghosts or spirits of real people. The voices that aerith talks about are due to the lifestream as a whole being the collective voice of all life that has ever and will ever exist. It’s essentially the planets voice. And it’s in pain due to sephiroth meddling.
Don't forget that Rufus is also aware that something's up. Tsung can't see the whispers but Rufus can.
cause he entered in contact with Cloud, that entered in contact with Aerith
@@AlyssonCorreiaX7 So have Reno and Rude, but they don't see them either.
I actually have a decent theory I got from an acquaintance but tweaked...
It’s cause Rufus called the Turks to pick him up via helicopter (changing time) rather than confronting cloud and party in an elevator (which leads to their capture and the trail of blood scene.)
Think about it.
Tseng can’t see it because he wasn’t involved in helicopter scene.
@@AlyssonCorreiaX7 no if that was the case then rude and reno must have seen them too but they didn't and they came into direct contact with Aerith.
Because Rufus is gonna be a party members in the next part.
Great video, well explained :)
Great video, well explained :)
@@80cry61 great video, well explained :)
Wow, this takes the title of the game, Final Fantasy 7 remake, to a whole new level. Focus on the word "remake".
Don't you mean "ReMind"
i said the same thing to my wife. the word re make its either make a new, make again or, re telling or a start over
i knew while playing that the whispers were imminently hanging around those with known death so that being said, it spoiled me that its happening all over and someone else knows. Aerith and Sephiroth are trying to remain alive and Aerith will want to save this other Zack.
but what about a parallel dimension. a flash sideways like in LOST, FRINGE or Endgame?
You've actually made me feel better about the ending. Thank you.
Yh it actually makes me excited. As long as we have a choice to make sure the game plays out how it was in the original then I don't mind. If not then it's fine if the major events stay the same or builds from the original plot (since we don't know what's to come it would be more exciting but concerning at the same time).
@@bungifish2227 They are never going to give you the option to play the game correctly. This is already altered too much. Nomura will just do whatever he wants and it will be a total mess.
Yourson Isold if I could enter gifs into the chat, I’d put the little girl throwing a temper tantrum in response to you
Different does not mean it’s going to be a mess.. stop being a grumpy old man and keep an open mind you douche
@@milehighmadness1469 Wow. You gotta attack me like that over a difference in opinion and have the gall to call _me_ a douche?
The guy I replied to believed there might be an option to play the game as it was supposed to go. This is factually impossible already, so I just corrected him.
Everything Nomura touches becomes a mess, no exception. Whether you like the mess or not is up to you, but it won't be anywhere near as good as the original FFVII plot. It's derivative by definition.
You know Nomura worked on the original, right? He designed all the characters, helped with the script, etc.
Not to mention, do you have any idea how many times the original's script changed during development?
Even the original's script is derivative by that point.
Not to mention with how bad the localization is, If you played the original in English, the Remake is actually more authentic.
Aerith saw Marlene in the train graveyard so knew that Tifa wanted to get back to her
Tifa saw Marlene. We don't know if Aerith saw what Tifa did or not.
grandpagohan1 true, heard Tifa call out her name at least
(John 11:25-26) "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"
Repent and turn to Christ Jesus before it is too late. For after this comes the JUDGMENT. Christ died for your sins and rose on the third day, showing that anyone who trusts in him for salvation, will have everlasting life.
(John 3:16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
@@charlie4christ536 ....... what
@@ginorincon9183 just a Bible basher, plz ignore, will go away eventually
This is a really awesome theory. Sephiroth said, “Careful now... that which lies ahead does not yet exist.” And he also said, “Let us defy destiny... together.” Sephiroth wants to change to future with the help of Cloud, but why Cloud? Shouldn’t he want to kill Cloud to stop destiny? Maybe he knows the Lifestream will force Cloud back to life to protect the timeline.
I think it’s to do with the Jenova cells in him, and the whole brother reunion thing
Best remake ever can't wait for the rest to come out
Like i told my brother. 10yrs minimum. Ps4 to ps5 and maybe finishing on ps6... its gonna be a fricken huge project.
@@icemanff23 woah ps6? Idk about that but regardless that would be sick
Agreed. I just wish they put out part 2 right now while everyone actually has time to put another 100 hours into a game. But please take your time to tweak it to perfection
@@icemanff23 Took 5 years from announcement to release of part 1. Nomura said this would come out much quicker, so lats say half of that 5 years means it will be out in 7.5 years.
@@Afameca think about KH3.... how long did the fans had to wait for that to come out. Ps2 was Kh2. Kh3 skipped a generation and went to ps4. Nomura has a tendency to milk a franchise. So not only will we be getting ff7 remake. But think about the other alternatives Before crisis, crisis core, dirge of cerb. Just all possible avenues they would explore to get as much money out from this sole series while at the same time im sure other directors are gonna be bringing out FF16 and so forth. I know they wont skip a generation but just be open to the idea that we may not see the end till i guess when the decade is over. Hence wont it be good if ps6 release title would be the Final chapter of ff7? That would make everyone jump on to get a ps6. Fk im giving too much info to Sony and SE 🤣
I'm not big FF gamer but when I was a kid I've watched FF7 advent children (I LOVE that movie) many times and fall in love in Cloud, Tifa and Sephiroth. I've read the plot of the games Crisis core and FF7. So the making changes in FF7R is like walking on thin ice there and I hope it won't get super complicated.
I beat the game three days ago. I’m still trying to decide how I feel about the ending.
Edit: 2 years later I’ve decided I’m open to see where they choose to go moving forward. But I maintain that “exploring new paths” was unnecessary. FF7 is already a high quality (and slightly convoluted) story; a faithful recreation with updated graphics would’ve been MORE then enough to bring in new audiences and please long time fans. But the writers have started the tight-rope, time will tell if they can walk it!
Just love and hate it I guess😂
I did the exact same was 50/50 on it think the game should play out the same only difference make saving Aerith like Mass effect based on your decisions helps save her or kill her.
I was honestly just happy to see Zack survive
Up until the end I enjoyed everything about the remake except the whispers (and maybe the cut floor with all the bloodstains, but Barret getting to give President Shinra a talking to is almost a fair trade). When I saw them turn into the final boss I was pissed, but then I realized what they meant by destiny, and it turned these "plot convenience ghost" into a brilliant narrative device that's actively fighting against the changes made by the remake and that's just fricking cool. They intentionally wrote them like a cheap Deus ex machina from lesser RPGs so we didn't fully notice their true intentions until the end, that every time they intervened it was to stop a major change from the original narrative. Mechanically it's like we get to kill the annoying guide telling us what to do, narratively we get to kill a tired jrpg fate trope that keeps a story stagnant, and in a meta sense we kill the creative restrictions on the writers whose duty is to recapture the magic of the original while delivering something new and worthwhile. If you're worried about the trajectory for the next installments going off the wall, just member they can't keep this theme of comparing the small differences between these two (maybe three) universes without still encountering the big key moments from the original, and join me in hoping that what this really means is that they're giving more choices and options than the original gave us at those key moments. If you're slightly pissed that this seems revisionist then the endings got you covered to, cause now that we know this is a separate universe, that means both the remake and the original exist side by side in the canon. In a sense they were going to change things any way, and now they've given people who didnt want to see there favorite moments changed a get out of jail free card. The issue in me saying this is we won't really know til part 2 comes out, but part 1 was so smart about how they set this twist up, so good at the stuff that didn't change, and so creative with the stuff they expanded, that I have a ton of faith... or optimism, very blind optimism.
@@jgfirstclass With Zack surviving, it changes everything and cheapens his death. Boooooooooo
Advent Children is still cannon. Just an alternate universe cannon. Love that movie way too much for it to just be tossed in the trash.
Interesting take on the boundless terrifying freedom bit. I took it as how it basically was in the original as "this is where the open world will begin"
imagine that being the developer's inside joke to "dammit, we gotta work on a world map now...", that'd be great XD
"The unknow journey will continue" they're literally telling you that
To me is just waiting to see the aerith moment unfolds, the rest will ressemble the original with changes like this part 1
But that moment will be crucial.
@@nuram666 even if places aren't connected they still can do a linear map, like ff x or xiii, so don't get your hopes up yet hahaha
me too, still do
@@santus07 You forget FFXV. After the failure of XIII they learned they need to have a world map. They wouldn't take that from VII, as that would completely wreck fan reception and they know that well. Of course, VII also limited your movement, and you had to upgrade your transportation bit by bit to get more of the world accessible to you, so it isn't going to be "suddenly, a whole map" like Breath of the Wild or Skyrim.
I’ve read that the death of Aeris symbolized the death of the writer’s mother, as an acknowledgement of the permanence of death with regard to beautiful and beloved people whose memories are both cherished and forever limited. Thought that was as beautiful as it is heartbreaking, which is why I have no patience for the whole ‘save aerith’ thing
And that's why this is an alternate timeline. The original still exists. Go play that and leave us more open to change with the new game. We don't need that kind of negativity going forward. Just possibility.
@@grandpagohan1 If you wanted change then it shouldn't have been called Final Fantasy VII, and you do NOT get to tell people not to be negative about a negative change. Pull your head out of your ass, kid.
@@palladiamorsdeus remake
@@alifefresh Biggest word play scam in Square Enix history. Should have been Final Fantasy 7 Rise of the Advent kingdom of hearts.
(John 11:25-26) "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"
Repent and turn to Christ Jesus before it is too late. For after this comes the JUDGMENT. Christ died for your sins and rose on the third day, showing that anyone who trusts in him for salvation, will have everlasting life.
(John 3:16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
This has been the most informative and interesting discussion on the ending I've seen yet. Personally, I'm thinking they are not just making another story but multiple stories, or routes if you will. This is Japan we're talking about, the world capital for Visual Novels where multiple endings is the norm. This would be right in their backyard (and mine too actually).
I think the Alt. reality/Time travel stuff kind of works a lot better or at least kind of makes sense with this style of storytelling. A lot of VN's have something like Fate or time travel or alternate reality, etc. to help explain why their are multiple routes in the story. It's not like Infinity Wars where time travel is solely there as an excuse to save everyone. Well maybe you get that in the True Route but usually a route like that is made difficult to achieve and something you have to earn. Often that means going through the other routes before you get there. Most routes at least someone dies and you still feel it, even if they live in another route.
Like you said, it seems that they are implying that the OG wasn't a good end. That lends itself to their being multiple routes in the next game. The fact that you can already change the story so much in this game even though you have the whispers from keeping you from changing anything major also lends to this theory. Every time we are seeing a whisper we are getting asked the question "what if?". Like what if Barret dies or what if Aerith falls off a ledge and is taken by the Turks and never runs the rooftops with Cloud and goes with him to Wall Market. In the next game, their won't be any whispers to protect us from that, so every decision is meaningful as the rest of the game can drastically change and take you on a completely different route.
I dig this. Everyone can be happy even the purists. You can already time travel in a sense with the Chapter Selection and change a bit of the story like the Chaptee 14 Resolution.
I've been saying this to fans who hated the ending. I'm actually surprised that more fans have not even considered the possibility that we will have multiple routes and alt. endings.
@@eseielplays2761 I like the idea, but hate the implementation (Anti-Retcon ghosts are dumb). and while i would not say i am a purist as i love so much of the new stuff in the remake, some things cannot change or it really effects the overall narrative of the game, like a certain someone dying to pull off a certain thing that in the end saves the planet. their death HAS TO HAPPEN or that thing doesn't work, and if that thing doesn't work than nothing breaks sephdogs control of the life stream and he is immortal.
@@ShadowAraun I'm sure SE will do something like a consequence of saving someone from death if they are gonna pull a branching story. Even go as far as shoving into fans who wants to save aerith that if she lives, you get a bad ending or some sort
Maybe, Aerith (like Sephiroth) come from the future (Marlene react to ghost and Aerith, she knows about zack memories) where she know Sephiroth is still alive in the lifestream and still harm the planet and people (Advent Children + On the way to a smile) cause Sephiroth will never be part of the lifestream cause StrongWill + JenovaCell.
She wants to alter the past, she thinks she can ultimately save the planet in saving sephiroth (poor girl) in doing so = new timeline with Zack alive.
I think it's gonna end with the death of Cloud And Sephiroth cause Zack is now alive and the world will need balance.
ULTIMATELY, i also think Sephiroth plan on it, Sephiroth is now the serpent and Cloud is Jesus, metaphysical place in the end represent the inner fight of cloud against the image he have of Sephiroth, this is what Sephiroth has used in Advent Children to be reborn, the memories of the people who fight him cause he forget how was his physical form (On the way to a smile facts) - (have you miss the Christian cross on his Soldier belt ?).
Sephiroth evolve from the OG and Advent Children, he understands that what he wants is not to do like Jenova and run across space for eternity using the planet like a vessel, he wants TRUE eternity, but he need Cloud for that, he need his Strenght, the strenght of the Crowning moment like he said, he need,his eternel will to fight him for protect the people he love (Tifa indeed, the girl who gave him the strenght to defeat the strongest being in this world with the Masamune over his body, Barret faded like Aerith, Cloud take the sword bare hand and kill sephiroth in one move.)
Cause maybe God needs the Devil, but the Devil just doesn't exist without God.
[Totally personnal opinion, I'm not even religious, I just love Carl Gustav Jung stuff and i'm french, for context =) ]
The seven is symbolical, seven planet, seven perfection degree, its ultimately linked to the Kabbal, where Sephiroth is from...
Seven is the number need to achieve complete cycle and achieve a positive renewal.
Sephiroth is using the fate ghost, Aerith is attacked by them, SHE wants to change destiny, that time Aerith launch the game, not Sephiroth, guess who is gonna take advantage of the situation, this time, Sephiroth wins.
@WhatCulture_Gaming Something I didn't see you explore the idea of when you were wondering who is going to die, or who is 'supposed' to die if we save Aerith, yet feels strangely obvious to me is: if there is any character who isn't 'supposed' to be there in the way they are, it's CLOUD. He's in many ways a representation of the player, but he is also a type of 'replacement' or 'destiny filler' for Zack Fair. So if the true happy ending was actually that Zack lives, then perhaps Aerith can have her happy ending, and Cloud is not an anomaly anymore, but regular old Cloud, - who, through a different timeline -, enabled the happy timeline to happen by sacrificing his original game destiny so that Zack and Aerith and co. can have their lives play out as they should and defeat Sephiroth before he can summon Meteor etc. I think one of the coolest aspects of the original game is that you are essentially playing a 'normal' character who, through tragedy, determination and experimentation became the avatar of true heroism and was able to stop Sephiroth (twice). But it feels like it all happens at the expense of Zack, as you fill his shoes. It seems like a possibility we will see Cloud be the "death" happen (whether in identity and role or physically in a timeline), as he is the manifestation of the anomaly timeline that is the original game... either way it feels like there is a distinct possibility we wills till be sad a the end of remake, lol.
Aerith also knows that Could's a merc without him telling her. He said she knows it because of the sword but she sounded like she just made that up.
She also sounded like she knew they will not stop the plate from falling based on the actions during some cutscenes
Also her first words to Tifa sounded like an old friend reuniting. Only after Tifa is confused does Aerith introduce herself
Dont forget clouds buster sword is actually zack's. A.k.a aeriths first boyfriend
The game literally tells you the 7 seconds is referring to meteor. Its 7 seconds before the world ends.
And it also took 7 seconds for Sephiroth to fall down and kill Aerith in the original game
And because it’s FF7 😛
I’m guessing the theme of 7 seconds is going to pop up in multiple places
But I would say you’re more wrong than Scott is. 7 seconds for the meteor? The phrase “world ends” doesn’t necessarily mean the world ending literally.
Square has been very cryptic in this game.
@@nickalso813 The original seven second Aerith scene is absoltely a coincidence. It's explicitly stated in the chapter 18 description that Sephiroth showed Cloud a vision of the planet seven seconds before its demise. The Sephiroth dropping thing is fan reaching by people who didn't see that chapter description. Even thinking about him dropping for seven literal seconds is laughable, just because that scene was edited that way lol
Aerith also doesnt seem "fully" aware of the original timeline, it seems like maybe its hazy & indistinct somewhere in her mind, like a dream, and in several cases it seems like something REMINDS her of it, like she'll suddenly be like "oh, right" like thinking, now i remember, this is supposed to happen.
I think thats supposed to be the juxtaposition of Sephiroth being fully immersed in the lifestream, apparently now also destiny and the 'original' fated timeline, and Aerith being separate from it, for now at least, as if perhaps she's remembering knowledge she gained after her own death, when she became part of the lifestream, or from being able to communicate with the planet but not getting the full story or context.
Yeah she does seem confused at times. She also mentions, at the shinra HQ in her room, that it's like she is in a maze, and is loosing part of her self every time they touch her. Which sounds like she has the information, but it's hidden away. And loosing part of her self sounds like the destiny things trying to correct the timeline by making her forget
Now, I feel like this could be a really powerful tool to use to recreate the emotion of Aerith's death. Give you this faint idea that you CAN save her, then tear it away with a sudden realisation that this 1 event in FFVII history is inevitable.
I feel like just because something is crazy and convoluted doesn’t mean it’s good or for the best. But I’m giving it a chance
doesnt mean its bad either... FF7 def isnt.
they are trying to weave all the lore from the game, cc, etc. into one, and I'm not that excited about it. It feels like Kingdom Hearts, nobody has any clue what is going on with the story because its so over-written. Having to go into lore well outside the game just to understand it isn't very good story telling imo.
@@Gee-xb7rt I wouldn't worry too much about it yet, it's literally just Midgar. If it's this bad in Part 2, then yeah..
Spooky z I mean I think the game is a masterpiece but...Cmon the whispers were kinda bad
Something I noticed is that Aerith and Sephiroth seem to have pretty solid intuition about the course of destiny and the likelihood of certain future events, while Cloud has these confusing flashes that he struggles to decipher, as though their meaning is on the tip of his tongue, but be lacks some important context.
If I remember correctly, these three characters are the only ones to have entered the lifestream; Aerith and Sephiroth when they die, and Cloud when he falls into it and becomes a comatose, brain fried vegetable for a while. Perhaps the time looping or predestination visions they all have are tied to that. Aerith and Sephiroth have a clearer picture, because their spirits had fully merged with the livestream, while Cloud has mysterious intuitions because he was immersed in it without merging.
Now that is a theory i can get behind
Didn’t Tifa also go into the lifestream
Cloud had been plagued by strange memories in the original game. Now he also is, but there might be a completely new layer of reasoning behind it. Interesting.
@@PirateSimp Not really. Tifa fell into the lifestream but was in it for a little while, no more than an hour at most, Cloud was into the lifestream for at least a week, perhaps more if you take into account that several days past from the events on the Northern Crater and when Tifa wakes up.
So, if we accept this theory, then Tifa wouldn't know anything about this nor would she gain any visions because she hasn't been exposed to a significant amount of lifestream in any time during her life, while Cloud was altered from Hojo's experiments, was bathed in Mako and injected with Jenova cells and fell into the lifestream and survived for several days at least. The only difference is that Cloud is alive while Aerith became the consciousness of the lifestream after her death and Sephiroth is, well, Sephiroth.
Listen man.....Seeing Zack alive tore me apart i played that fight it hurts
They never showed he's alive, they just didn't show his death cause its a massive spoiler and happens later when he's walking with Cloud (in the OG, not CC). They wouldn't show us his death yet, we're not even supposed to know who he is. I took it as a tease for the upcoming chapters (who is this guy??!! I gotta play the next one to figure it out!!!). This Zack Is Alive thing is getting outta hand.
@@domx7zero157 Finally someone who actually knows
@@domx7zero157 Zack is alive in a different timeline. That's what the ending implies.
Pretty sure we'll be able to save Aerith in this version, because of that whole destiny setup. But I kind of wish we can't and the game stays bold in that aspect. Because her returning to the planet and being part of the lifestream is too important to the plot.
oh, i just watched someone else playing it, and a stats screen at the end said, "chapter 14 endings seen: 1 of 3"...
On that “maybe Tifa’s gonna die instead” comment: by far the moment in the game that made my heart skip a beat was when Sephiroth stabbed Barret. My jaw dropped. I was tingling. Of course, that effect was immediately cheapened when he was brought right back to life.
Sephiroth was flexing and really it was to give you a warning that once you kill the whispers, anything can happen haha
Like every one else.
Barret wasn’t brought back to life, his death was “prevented” by the Whisper.
The way Barrett was saying bye to Marlene didn't help.
Right?? my mouth dropped for a good 5 minutes.
This is making me want a Chrono trigger remake now
houipdude YES
I think chrono cross more better to remake
That head stab on the hell house was clearly reminiscent of Chronotrigger.
Keep chrono trigger, retcon chrono cross and then make a proper third game
@@brandonrys9903 chrono cross is easier to remade since the lore is not that huge
When Aerith reencouters Cloud at the church (Chp 8 I guess), Reno shows up and asks "and who is this" she then says "my body guard" then CLoud is clearly taken aback when she explains "it's a merc thing", his face is totally like "how do you know I'm working as a merc?", up to that point they had only bumped into each other in chp 2... Just something worth mentioning, another hint of evidence to go with that "theory"
He does walk around with a massive sword tho..
One thing people actually forgot is that the death of zack portrayed in the OG is exactly the scene where zack drags cloud to that cliff in the rain. By the time CC was out the hardcore og ff7 fans weren't happy how they stretched out zacks final battle. You could speculate that they just linked both endings from cc an og ff7 through the arbiters of fate letting him survive the big shinra army battle but being severly wounded and dragging cloud along just to get shot on that hill we see at the end.
:o oh noe my hopes and dreams for zack and aerith to be reunited just died :(' but you have a point.he may still get shot somewhere before the start of the events of ff7...
Then we all think aerith can be saved this time, just to be given the same scenario. That would cause us great pain all over again hahaha.
@@markitosibi525 i think its good if they stick to the main events and just alter the way they happen because every story wirh an timetravel scenario or alternate timeline boogaloo nullifies each and every story impact. Someone dies...well just let us alter everything and make the deaths meaningless. Aerith and Zack reached us because they were meaningfull to the characters and to the players. I just hope they dont screw this up:D
This.... this is what I have been trying to tell anyone who will listen. Zack always killed the first wave only to get ambushed by a smaller force with a helicopter. Just because he is walking away doesn’t mean he lived... remember it was JUST starting to rain at the end. He dies in the rain.
On top of all that, cloud has the buster sword.... sorry people, but Zack is still dead.
Damn
@@HomeDefender30 Cloud having the Buster Sword doesn't mean much because of the dog (as the video said). Zack could still die there or maybe inside Midgar this time, but the dog is in the scene (that is curiously called "Zack's Victory") to show us that we are seeing another reality/timeline, therefore he can survive and keep the Buster Sword while the Cloud of our reality/timeline still has his fair share of PTSD
*Yeah, it's big brain time.*
I absolutely love this because I'm excited that I have no clue what's gonna happen. While a 1:1 remake would have been neat and fun, we already know the twists. Pop culture has been steeped in FFVII lore for 23 years now. Even people who haven't played the game know some things about it. Breaking the canon to free up the future installments is fucking brilliant! Oh, the possibilities! I just hope they don't waste that potential.
grandpagohan1 That’s what I’ve been saying, the Whispers are an allegory for fans that don’t want change, i love the Original but it’s a lot of fun being able to theorize about a different story with the same characters I grew up playing
I'd be excited... if I could delete FF10-2, 12, 13, 13-2, 13-3, 15 and KH3 from my brain. Long ongoing track of underwhelming games and the end of this was too kingdom hearts-y to me... I'm not against change if they make it justice, but I feel my worries with how this game will turn out if they go crazy changing its story while looking at that long list of failures is more than justified. Certainly do hope they prove me wrong and show they still have it in them to make a truly captivating story... but first someone needs to take the multiverse/time theory book away from Nomura and beat him up with it. That mumbo jumbo didn't work on 13, didn't work on 15, didn't work with KH... why in the hell are they letting him go with that a fourth time? x_x
What I hope is that they keep the same towns, characters, etc. in part 2. Something like Aerith’s death you can have a direct influence, you can ether try to save Aerith or let destiny take it’s course. Her death/ not death would be ending of part 2 and your save file is carried over to part 3 to influence how the final part of the story plays out. Really excited to see where they go next!
Jake Wilkinson Great idea, don’t let the player have too much control as to still keep the story relatively the same, just with influence over certain events
I can get behind this idea and explanation.
Personally, I loved the ending of this game and am looking forward to seeing and experiencing how the rest of the story plays out. Do I think Aerith will live in the whole story? No, but I wouldn't mind being surprised on this particular element.
Indeed! This is how the ending of Mass Effect should have played out.... where your choices **cough** actually mattered! 🤣 When given the option to save everyone in FF7R, would you? Hell yes!
@@sloggnznorgin6285 do you think based on your choices in ff7 remake, that aerith will survive? I have a feeling they might do that, idk.
Jaime Hard to say. If the party is given enough insight into her death through visions, the only reason I can see why the writers would go that route is to provide players with another *possible* outcome. Or they could just be teasing us. But I don’t think that’s the case as it would divert precious man hours away from game development and the core story. They must of included this extra layer to the story because square Enix has big plans. Or it’s possible they’re making it up as they go. Who knows?
Worried about this going too KH and making absolutely no sense by the "final" chapter.
not me given that nomura’s writing has improved a lot, kingdom hearts 3’s problem was the huge amount of story that it had to cover from 12 games but the writing itself was MUCH better than what he usually delivers. sure, ff7 is a very convoluted story (whether we like it or not) but i truly think nomura can handle this
It’s a tightrope situation. If they pull it off it’ll be EPIC. But one bad move and the game will be a jumbled mess.
except Nomura is not directing/writing the Remake. he has the same role he had in the production of Original FF7
@@SktMew no? As far as I know, Nomura's only job was to design the characters back then in ff7 original. In ff7 remake, Nomura's the Designer AND director.
I think the story will be similar, we’re going to have to stop the reunion, and meteor, and Sephiroth. But how we get there is different, Aerith is aware of the timelines because she’s an Ancient, Jenova allows Sephiroth to do the same
Yep.
I dont think Aerith is aware anymore. Maybe in this present timeline she is but as she hesitates to let cloud go in the portal knowing that that decision changes hers as well because she says on the other side is terrible freedom and if they win the fight on the other side they will all be changing their fates meaning her fate can now be changed and she doesn't know how it will go only in the previous timeline.
Landon Funk they also talked about how their fates were never written in stone, and Sephiroth stopped the fight saying “not yet” so he knows something as well, we’ll see what happens, but that’s going to be my guess
I think the game's headed toward 2 stories. Remaster basically of the original, Cloud & Co headed to stop Jenova/Sephiroth from ramming a Meteor into the planet and eating its juicy lifestream.
B Plot of timeline nonsense where original not-Jenova-influenced Sephiroth from part 1's ending, Zack, and who knows what else (Rufus, Genesis, who knows) become a bigger focus pulling the crew along to deal with whatever threat to creation or something.
B Plot will only be a larger focus toward the end, and FF7R's full finale will focus on it, but for the bulk of the main story from the original, it will just show up for a while like it did at the end of part 1.
actually sephiroth is half of ancient too ... maybe aerith half ancient too ... they never mention his dad tho ...
"I love how meta it is" that's exactly why I love it and why I love other, similarly "convoluted" stories, whether it be movie, game or book. I has layers, it can defy expectations, it doesn't have to confirm to set standards. I think that's amazing.
In other words, and to keep the story short, thinking about this logically deep and wide enough; I'm glad that the story and canon didn't change - almost at all. Here's my theory:
Reason why I stand in awe is due the pure talent at play here. Developers extended nearly everything of Midgar segment from the original, to such extent that even at times the game's events boost the hope for change being actually viable (deviating fate) while the developers keep the actual key moments hidden; which to me, if I'm correct, will determine everything to still end the same way. Everyone are merely taking a flowing road that's gonna be longer at times when it should be shorter and shorter at times when it should be longer et cetera. This feeling is given thorough the Whispers (this is how truly important they are) and how their actions can be taken as wobbly at times, but this means that everyone are merely on borrowed time at best. The triumphs against them are merely delaying fate, changing the road and relocating stops. Whispers seem to follow the logic of importance and their own existence takes the highest priority. When you think about it from this angle, every single detail makes sense quickly. Questions left are what made them, how long is the delay gonna be and thus how dramatically is the fate bolstered to enter the scene, but also what happens to those seemingly defeated ones. Then again the scenes where we see some things being changed could well be hopeful thoughts everyone thinks in their minds while the truth of reality still hurts the same as always. Every question revolves around Whispers and understanding them is the key to the locks of every variable in this game (probably excluding some combat and minigame related questions).
Game is brilliant no matter what angle we look at it. Some bit of more polishing would make this excellent piece an even greater experience. 💯❤
Now everything makes sense...
POSSIBLE SPOILERS AHEAD. READ FURTHER AT YOUR OWN DISCRETION.
Whispers are the manifestation of players' worries and now Whispers unintentionally make the story deviate a bit. For example, first I thought that Jenova evoked Whispers in the first place by getting her closest Sephiroth clone to the scene where Aerith and Cloud would meet, but how did she know where and when to send him. Well, the answer is not that she evoked Whispers at all, but merely intercepted their signal of presence and that's why she knew where to get an agent into (not when). After all, story-wise, they are from the lifestream so she can follow them to an extent. Simple reasonable answer is that we evoked them instead. She merely got interested in the sudden presence of these mysterious entities (lifestream anomalies) and got one of her clones involved in the process, accidentally getting images from her future failing plan by allowing the clone to touch Aerith's shoulder. Aerith got the vision the moment our desperate arbiters of fate tried to make sure she and Cloud would meet (even though that was going to happen). She later on learns what they are and how everything needs to end up, while Jenova tries to intervene, due to the indisputable information, with her clones whenever she can; in an effort to really change the future into her benefit.
So now the old players have a new mission alongside the old story in the Remake. To make sure everyone who truly needs to die - will do so eventually, and those who mustn't - won't die before their time or so. New players have it easier coz they don't need to understand it all; plus, when they think they do, the simple reason they go with would be to lump 'em all up as Cloud's hallucinations and mass illusions until they discover the real ordeal. It's quite elaborate way to make the old story feel new and not have it only as a mere face lift.
HOW DID CLOUD GET BACK FROM THE EDGE OF CREATION!!!!!
I think aerith and serpiroth are time jumpers
It was more like Cloud's mind was there rather than his body. Just like the final 1 on 1 battle in ff7 that you cant lose. It was a mental battle not a phsycal battle.
In the description of the final chapter, it says the "seven seconds til the end" is a reference to the meteor and the end of the world essentially. Also, the 3 whisper bosses you fight are oddly similar to the advent children in the weapons they use and the fact they summon Bahamut Maximillian Dood has a great theory on all that.
I'm pretty sure you're right. In the french translation, Sephiroth even says "Seven seconds until the Apocalypse". It reminds me of when the German translation of FFXV openly linked the Meteor to the Starscourge, and it pretty much ended up being true. You never know the infos these guys get when they have to localize the game.
Link please?
Yeah people are getting it all wrong when the game spells it out for you.
(John 11:25-26) "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"
Repent and turn to Christ Jesus before it is too late. For after this comes the JUDGMENT. Christ died for your sins and rose on the third day, showing that anyone who trusts in him for salvation, will have everlasting life.
(John 3:16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
The theme that plays during the edge of creation is a rendition of one of themes from forgotten city. It's called "can you hear the cry of the planet" and the remake theme is called "7 seconds until the end" I missed the reference at first too. But it does seem to be reference to aeriths death. Don't take my word for it Listen to both themes. It's a great theme..
This explanation and "theory" is brilliant and makes so much sense. Almost the entire game I was thinking what are these whispers doing. I would absolutely love to be placed in the timeline where Zack is alive and playable.
Does Anyone realize that there are multiple different Sephiroth in the game?
- "Watashi" Sephiroth (The insane Sephiroth) - some part of the game
- "Ore" Sephiroth (The good and kind Sephiroth before he was going insane in Nibelheim) - appear at the edge of creation
After you play the game in English, play again in Japanese.
Sephiroth was never really good and kind. He wasn't exactly evil, but he wasn't a kind hearted person wanting to save the world
I think he may be referring to the Japanese text denoting different versions of sephiroth. “Orenshi=goodwill,” for example. So it’s just a literal translation. I don’t know for sure as I haven’t played it in Japanese yet.
@@kingvarien Final Fantasy VII - Crisis Core portrays Seph as a duty driven Soldier that clearly does his job for the good, he even has some lighthearted emotions here and there. So he isn't all about doom and gloom.
Agree with your conclusions. Would love to see:
1. Video on every whisper interaction (what they are trying to do in each scene)
2. Video on who is seeing the whispers (was Aerith the only one at first and then because she touched Cloud he can too?)
3. Analyzing Sephiroths dialogue.
in advent children, sephiroth didn’t come back because someone “thought of him”. literally the whole story is about them trying to get a piece of jenova so he can be resurrected through her.
Although Sephiroth mentions he will never be a memory. And in the novel he even says that as long as Cloud remembers him, his being will always manifest from the lifestream. Something like that, I don't remember the exact line.
"I will never be a memory", so far I am into the fate defying story and it does make me want to see how it turns out
Kingdom hearts has also played with the idea that characters arent really dead as long as other charcters remeber them
Robert Pena it is also connected to time travel in kingdom hearts. That’s what happened with maleficent in kh2 and explained in khux. We all now Nomura is a crazy genius so idk what to expect from ff7 part 2....
KH was a convoluted mess of a story. If this gets the full KH treatment I am very worried.
God i hope nomura doesn’t use some of his techniques from kingdom hearts. He sucks at character deaths and ending a series.
musicwelikemang amen to that.
Something I haven't heard anyone talk about it the implication that this new party has 2 Sephiroths to deal with. One from the OG timeline and the one that's native to this new timeline. Sephiroth never seems like much of a "team player" so it'll be interesting to see how they resolve that clash of egos to either team up or fight each other.
thinking the same thing, that and the fact that there's another "version" of cloud... Sephiroth has always had a hold on him, so i'm wondering if that plays a factor
The Aerith from chapter 14 could be the original Aerith who is within the lifestream who once again meets and talks with cloud.
Just think about how stupid it would be if Aerith doesn’t die.
“Hey Aerith, where are you going?”
“I’ll be back in a minute, I’m gonna get this really powerful materia that will stop anything Sephiroth is planning.”
Later: “Hey did you get it?”
“Yep, no problem at all. Pretty easy actually. I went ahead and used Holy while I was there. Sephiroth is dead now.”
“............ok. Let’s go home I guess.”
Just think how stupid it is to assume that would be the same.
Biggs will save her and die, Aerith will die at a later point.
FrancoUnAmericano someone had a theory of Biggs losing his memory after waking up and becoming the “new” Cid. I really don’t like that idea and don’t really think that will be the case anyways. But I think Biggs will get with Wedge and build up Avalanche even more to where they are pretty much an army to get back at Shinra and bust them out for killing everyone in sector 7. Or they could both be the pilots of Highwind whenever you get to that point instead of just random crew members running the airship.
But Holy failed. It's Aerith from the lifestream that saved everyone. So by thinking that Sephiroth wants to change destiny to survive...would that not mean that HE wants her to live and THEY will have to decide if she needs to die or not?
Kitase, Sakaguchi & Narita: “...and then Sephiroth dies....”
Sephiroth: [smirks, sharply glances at Nomura] “Hold my masamune”
I just finished my first run with VII Remake.. oh my.. loved it. 80+ hours, and still need to replay to obtain everything. But that ending totally changes the aspect of what the original created. Now to explore a new timeline. Cannot wait