Mam he is talking about ZEN meditation not vipassana, If you have done vipassana and you have given time to vipassana you will understand J Krishanmuri's teaching and vipassana is exactly same.
@@howdareyou5800maybe the ideas behind it. But as it is taught in church is just a joke compared to real "spirituality" a connection that goes beyond the rational, intellectual and thinking mind. A connection that goes beyond knowledge and making sense of it. It is achievable through religion but I think it's difficult if not even the priests have a connection to "god". Then it would be much better to look for a zen master or buddhist monk.
@@ABeautifulEarthForOurChildren beliefs, technics, rituals, practices... are all r same... That was not what J K talked about, he explicitly said that.
Vipassana literally means seeing things as it is....without any judgement or addition. In this definition itself it means observance by letting go all the meaning, stories and judgement.
Vipassana is exactly what JK preaches. JK is enlightened by default. Vipassana as taught by SN GOENKA ji is exactly the same, Observe without craving or aversion. Saakshi bhaav. Non judgemental and without any emotional disturbances. Vipassana gives the required tool to practice what JK preaches. Vipassana is meditation as was practiced by Gauthama , the Buddha. Re-introduced to India by SN Goenka ji . That's why, a ten day residential course ,maintaining absolute noble silence is to be undergone which becomes the tool for discovering self and go further into the world of meditation. Personally feel, everyone should do one ten-day course of Vipassana. After doing Vipassana, one can easily relate to JK and Ramana maharshi and brahmakumaris teachings .
Goenka himself is not an enlightened presence. His courses are a helpful way to start the spiritual path, but becomes a hindrance. Goenka talks about his own “self interest” in his 10 day discourses. It is obvious there is ego in his teachings. Also true Vipassana is not a body scan. I highly doubt Buddha was doing some technique when he finally sat under the tree before becoming enlightened. He had exhausted all techniques, and at that point, he likely was surrendering all techniques and sitting in what would today be called Zazen - just sitting and letting all things come up in his mind. Observe without control. Without control, without techniques, observation without control of attention is what Krishnamurti is talking about. Doing body scan or breath awareness techniques are all a form of control. They are good starters for beginners in meditation, but must be let go of for enlightenment. No one is carrying a technique with them into Nirvana.
@@chubbatheBOSS buddha achieved enlightenment doing anapanasati. there are many different ways to liberation for example one way is to concentrate on an object of meditation until you go through all 8 jhanas and then finally into a cessation or nirodha-samapatti which is where all perception is gone. after the cessation your brain reboots and wakes up and you can see the links of dependent origination. this is where enlightenment can happen. there are contractive techniques that use concentration to move toward enlightenment and there are expansive "techniques" that use open awareness to move toward enlightenment.
You said it gives a tool to practice. Observation means there is no tool or method or practice. So it's self contradictory. One who understands JK truly would get this simple conflict with all "methods" of meditation.
It seems JK is saying no craving and no aversion (like Vipassana) but welcoming and not suppressing feelings and thoughts, as long as they happen with presence, right?
oh yeah that's what he is saying. Now you can take a closer look and ask your self how you are doing with all these practices. It won't really matter and you might not be able to give an honest answer if you've never practiced .
Hes the english indian ashtavakara. ..not buddha ...although i would say all 3 of them are equivalent but. Ashtavakra gave rules and didnt talked bout mukti as he himslef said that one is free if he did thise rhings ...similary budha but he could define god ..whereas krishnamurti is more modern ashtavakra ❤❤❤...
I think he is saying what's your intent of doing anything, if there is an intent then you will again stuck in the loop. Fuck Even why we wanna understand this! To get out of this loop? Why we wanna get out of this loop? We are not happy in this loop. Really are we not happy in this loop?
I don’t believe Vipassana teaches you to control/suppress your feelings or emotions, that would be a gross mischaracterisation of Vipassana. Learning to observe thoughts/feelings without judgement and moving past them to concentrate on what you want is not the same as control or suppression.
SN Goenka is semi literate. He doesn't know philosophy, theology, psychology neuroscience. He superficially defines ego , self . These may be intellectual things .he is not enlightened. Jk is condems the body scan meditation that Goenka teaches or any such technique. You focus /concentrate/attention / on object. Instead of saying concentration ,you escape by saying awareness. But it's all the same .Here object is breath and sensation. They are in motion ,but you still focus/concentrate/attentive towards it .your mind wanders but you bring it back on the object . So you are making a conscious choice of attending , it is not choiceless. Now you put effort to concentrate , initially you put a lot of effort,but eventually you master the technique,then your effort level come down ,but still it's not effort less. You need to put minimum efforts Goenka technique helps initially like any other meditation but it's not the truth . The body scan technique was invented by ledi sayadaw . not the 2500 year old tradition taught by Buddha ..one can further read ' birth of insight by Erik Braun ' Now you don't react to sensation/ breath .you observe . You are training yourself to control not to react psychological.& Not to react on thoughts & not to react on sensation, psycosomatically. So you control . Jk , Ramana Maharshi, gangaji, nisargadutt maharaj , Buddha said the same thing you have to leave everything,that includes meditation techniques also . Truth is a pathless land . Freedom /Nirvana /moksha exist only if it a choice less, effortless and absence of control.
Correct… meditation work only in mental realm…. Truth is beyond mind. Vipassana purifies the mind but it won’t reveal truth… there’s object and subject. We focus on object in meditation but when we enquire to subject … truth starts to reveal . Our original state revealed
Hi, how does Vipassana purifies the mind . Never understood . Don't go by what Goenka group says . Think and tell us .what I believe the whole discussion on the purification process system is bogus .@@knowtheself77
@@filipedecastro4718 meditation is good , anxiety is reduced , lot of biometrics changes are recorded . But what Goenka claims Nirvana is not true . And this is invented by ledi saydaw not taught by Buddha .
Never compare SN Goenka with j Krishnamurti or Osho. Goenka stands nowhere in front of these enlightened ones. They are Everest of consciousness, and Goenka is a small hill somewhere, pretending to be on the same level. He is an ordinary preacher
Its not about the height brother, its either this side or that side, the person on this side has no capacity to judge the height of people that side Goenka ji no matter how big or small is amongst that side of people Even if he is a student hi self He is not of the stream of deluded people like most He is atleast the stream enterer of the other side
Mam he is talking about ZEN meditation not vipassana, If you have done vipassana and you have given time to vipassana you will understand J Krishanmuri's teaching and vipassana is exactly same.
That also applies to Islam and Christianity and even zatanism!
@@howdareyou5800maybe the ideas behind it. But as it is taught in church is just a joke compared to real "spirituality" a connection that goes beyond the rational, intellectual and thinking mind. A connection that goes beyond knowledge and making sense of it.
It is achievable through religion but I think it's difficult if not even the priests have a connection to "god". Then it would be much better to look for a zen master or buddhist monk.
@@howdareyou5800sorry for being a smartass
@@ABeautifulEarthForOurChildren beliefs, technics, rituals, practices... are all r same...
That was not what J K talked about, he explicitly said that.
Agree K’s basic teaching is noting what is appearing.
Vipassana literally means seeing things as it is....without any judgement or addition. In this definition itself it means observance by letting go all the meaning, stories and judgement.
Absolutely correct comment.
Vipassana is exactly what JK preaches. JK is enlightened by default. Vipassana as taught by SN GOENKA ji is exactly the same, Observe without craving or aversion. Saakshi bhaav. Non judgemental and without any emotional disturbances. Vipassana gives the required tool to practice what JK preaches. Vipassana is meditation as was practiced by Gauthama , the Buddha. Re-introduced to India by SN Goenka ji . That's why, a ten day residential course ,maintaining absolute noble silence is to be undergone which becomes the tool for discovering self and go further into the world of meditation. Personally feel, everyone should do one ten-day course of Vipassana.
After doing Vipassana, one can easily relate to JK and Ramana maharshi and brahmakumaris teachings .
Goenka himself is not an enlightened presence. His courses are a helpful way to start the spiritual path, but becomes a hindrance. Goenka talks about his own “self interest” in his 10 day discourses. It is obvious there is ego in his teachings. Also true Vipassana is not a body scan. I highly doubt Buddha was doing some technique when he finally sat under the tree before becoming enlightened. He had exhausted all techniques, and at that point, he likely was surrendering all techniques and sitting in what would today be called Zazen - just sitting and letting all things come up in his mind. Observe without control. Without control, without techniques, observation without control of attention is what Krishnamurti is talking about. Doing body scan or breath awareness techniques are all a form of control. They are good starters for beginners in meditation, but must be let go of for enlightenment. No one is carrying a technique with them into Nirvana.
@@chubbatheBOSS MUY BUENA TU EXPOSICIÓN 😍
@@chubbatheBOSS buddha achieved enlightenment doing anapanasati. there are many different ways to liberation for example one way is to concentrate on an object of meditation until you go through all 8 jhanas and then finally into a cessation or nirodha-samapatti which is where all perception is gone. after the cessation your brain reboots and wakes up and you can see the links of dependent origination. this is where enlightenment can happen. there are contractive techniques that use concentration to move toward enlightenment and there are expansive "techniques" that use open awareness to move toward enlightenment.
You said it gives a tool to practice. Observation means there is no tool or method or practice. So it's self contradictory. One who understands JK truly would get this simple conflict with all "methods" of meditation.
It seems JK is saying no craving and no aversion (like Vipassana) but welcoming and not suppressing feelings and thoughts, as long as they happen with presence, right?
3:35 in deeper layers sensory is in operation and one may not be conscious at all
Thanks again
By following a system, any system, you will not know dhyana. Just as he said, you will find the illusion you have been chasing.
Well that's a cool system 😄
6.05❤
He is saying what have you got my training the mind, practising such process?
oh yeah that's what he is saying. Now you can take a closer look and ask your self how you are doing with all these practices. It won't really matter and you might not be able to give an honest answer if you've never practiced .
Hes the english indian ashtavakara. ..not buddha ...although i would say all 3 of them are equivalent but. Ashtavakra gave rules and didnt talked bout mukti as he himslef said that one is free if he did thise rhings ...similary budha but he could define god ..whereas krishnamurti is more modern ashtavakra ❤❤❤...
I think he is saying what's your intent of doing anything, if there is an intent then you will again stuck in the loop.
Fuck Even why we wanna understand this!
To get out of this loop?
Why we wanna get out of this loop?
We are not happy in this loop.
Really are we not happy in this loop?
I don’t believe Vipassana teaches you to control/suppress your feelings or emotions, that would be a gross mischaracterisation of Vipassana.
Learning to observe thoughts/feelings without judgement and moving past them to concentrate on what you want is not the same as control or suppression.
SN Goenka is semi literate. He doesn't know philosophy, theology, psychology neuroscience. He superficially defines ego , self . These may be intellectual things .he is not enlightened.
Jk is condems the body scan meditation that Goenka teaches or any such technique. You focus /concentrate/attention / on object. Instead of saying concentration ,you escape by saying awareness. But it's all the same .Here object is breath and sensation. They are in motion ,but you still focus/concentrate/attentive towards it .your mind wanders but you bring it back on the object . So you are making a conscious choice of attending , it is not choiceless. Now you put effort to concentrate , initially you put a lot of effort,but eventually you master the technique,then your effort level come down ,but still it's not effort less. You need to put minimum efforts
Goenka technique helps initially like any other meditation but it's not the truth . The body scan technique was invented by ledi sayadaw . not the 2500 year old tradition taught by Buddha ..one can further read ' birth of insight by Erik Braun '
Now you don't react to sensation/ breath .you observe . You are training yourself to control not to react psychological.& Not to react on thoughts & not to react on sensation, psycosomatically. So you control .
Jk , Ramana Maharshi, gangaji, nisargadutt maharaj , Buddha said the same thing you have to leave everything,that includes meditation techniques also . Truth is a pathless land .
Freedom /Nirvana /moksha exist only if it a choice less, effortless and absence of control.
Oh my friend, you have hit the bulls eye. Thank you for mentioning this point
Correct… meditation work only in mental realm…. Truth is beyond mind. Vipassana purifies the mind but it won’t reveal truth… there’s object and subject. We focus on object in meditation but when we enquire to subject … truth starts to reveal . Our original state revealed
Hi, how does Vipassana purifies the mind . Never understood . Don't go by what Goenka group says . Think and tell us .what I believe the whole discussion on the purification process system is bogus .@@knowtheself77
JK meet Goankaji and said to him, what he was teaching is good
@@filipedecastro4718 meditation is good , anxiety is reduced , lot of biometrics changes are recorded . But what Goenka claims Nirvana is not true . And this is invented by ledi saydaw not taught by Buddha .
Never compare SN Goenka with j Krishnamurti or Osho. Goenka stands nowhere in front of these enlightened ones. They are Everest of consciousness, and Goenka is a small hill somewhere, pretending to be on the same level. He is an ordinary preacher
Have you done vipassana mediation?
Its not about the height brother, its either this side or that side, the person on this side has no capacity to judge the height of people that side
Goenka ji no matter how big or small is amongst that side of people
Even if he is a student hi self
He is not of the stream of deluded people like most
He is atleast the stream enterer of the other side
Yea u dont know their attainments but goenka is definitely past stream entry