We need to talk about this video...
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ก.ย. 2024
- A few months back I made a video ranting about the current state of learning how to code and I wanted to clear things up a little.
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Dorian, thank you for meeting with me yesterday. I was never expecting a follow up video although I think this is a video that may give some other people clarification. I've been watching your videos for a while, and I have to say I have learned a lot from them. I was fearful of AI even before you made that video. Your videos have taught me a lot about how pursuing my passions are not always going to be smooth sailing and I might end out in jobs I don't love in the process, but it's all worth it to continue learning. I was hitting a wall recently, and I felt that pursing what I wanted was a waste of time and that everyone else would be telling me the same thing like "Why are you learning that, when you can just let the AI do it for you?" I love your sincerity and I enjoy hearing your rants as well. You keep it real, but your not all negative either. It was really worth meeting with you, and I figure if there was anyone that could help keep me motivated when I was losing the drive, it would be Dorian. Keep doing what you're doing and I hope you enjoy your travels!!!
It was great meeting with you as well! Glad I was able to help you out!
if ai won't take all the jobs but leave some... isn't it logical to assume the remaining ones will only be covered by the absolute top tier? how are you supposed to compete with that in the future as an absolute beginner?
The shady bootcamp businesses popped out in large numbers and you were rightfully pointing out those types of bad apples. I've been in such a fraudsterish bootcamp and wish I had some experienced people warning me of such businesses.
Many of the problems that occur in making software happen because the business people can't communicate what they want effectively. So, if they can't explain what they want to a human how the hell is an AI going to understand them any better?
So..... am I screwed
Feels good to see you take accountability but at the same time give value to the rookies. Your channel Rocks 💯👍
im learning to code, as a side hobby right now and eventually will get an associates or a BS in CS. job markets always ebb and flow, but what worries me is i see more and more entry level programming jobs offer $15-20 (or less some times) an hour with college req's and unrealistic entry level "skills" to even Qualify for the job. its like a lot of these companies hire a recruiter or have someone they put in charge of hiring that has no idea what they are asking for. they simply are told "we have this budget for hiring, if you can get us under a certain marker you get a bonus, have at the hiring process bud" the Greed these companies have for profit margins is discouraging to say the least...
Yeah this is the elephant in the room
This is just basic supply and demand in action. If they do find people willing to work for $15-20 an hour even with a college degree, the market has enough supply that people are desperate enough to take these offers. The reality right now is that people would rather get $15-20 an hour than to be unemployed. Once the market rebounds and more demand is there, the hourly rates will pick up again and developers will laugh at offers like these
@@chainwild5272 have you heard of the hb1 work visa recruits that the american dev has to train so the company can fire him and hire the hb1 visa to pay 20k less a year? Good example of something that superceeds supply and demand. The markets are not just organically responding to sypply and demand, this isnt organic free market capitalism. We are being pinched on purpose.
@plumbing1 that is just a shame. I hope they are surviving and get better offers after they pad the resume
You are always direct, and you say many truths, that's why I like your videos. I think I posted on that "negative" video that coding is a skill and is always valuable to have more skills. One more note here is that "coding" is a bit of an involved skill, it's not like learning how to ride a bicycle, you pretty much have to learn it all the time, and the boundaries and directions that you can take are enormous. Of course being able make money off your skills is nice and rewarding, but it is sometimes impossible. It all boils down to whether you like something or you don't. Even if it only remains a hobby for you, it may bring you a lot of positive emotions, and it may still be valuable to you in many ways.
As far as AI is concerned, I am a little on the back benches here, I am only remotely exploring it yet, but here's my feeling about it. You know the president has many advisors, but he's the one who takes all decisions and bares the responsibility for that. AI can be just that, it can be an advisor, but we'll always need a human to make the decisions. And I've also seen many times money being spent on things that are not working or are just not being used. I believe that the people who have to take responsibility for that are the "non-technical" managers. Do they need someone to drive their car or to operate their smart TV or smart hub or whatever. This is not a matter of being "technical" or "non-technical" this is a matter of keeping up with everyday life and you can't escape from responsibility by just saying: I am "non-technical". You either have to make the right choices or you have to leave.
yes, about time. While i do nothing and don't even try to study more coding in my free time i finally won lottery to see video come into existence when I try to just scroll through youtube without purpose
😂😂 most of us not have a purpose yet
Youre doing great job on this, the problem is that people see programming as a magic elixir that lands you a job after 6 months, but the reality its that the market has shifted and now you need some grinding of 2 years instead of just a 6 month bootcamp, but there's still place for new people you just need to have passion and devotion to do it, if you want easy solutions programming its maybe not for you
Tbh, i'm thinking about just becoming a vagabond
@@sheldonhollis5258vanlife
@@sheldonhollis5258I feel ya. I'm tired of jumping through so many hoops for some bullshit career. I need to do something though... it's different when you have kids.
I would say that if market won't change completely the grind might be even longer than the 2 years you mentioned. In my opinion that time will be 2-3 years, and only some of the people learning will be able to land the job. Up until we get to the state of the industry of 2019-2020, the grind will be crazy, And nobody guarantee that the market will be as good as then.
@@HCforLife1 so..... what are melinneals and gen z supposed to do
I'm completely jaded about the job market. For now, living with my parents while trying to build a side hustle... It'll be interesting to see what happens, since the number of devs is rising quickly.
33 years old here and i lost my job and back with my dad and not aure what i want to do. Very lost here but i need to build a side hustle.
I'm a just becoming a vagabond
Dorian, it is to your channel where I was rushing to when I started learning how to code last year, this is my 11th month and will be hitting one year mark of learning in Feb 20.
I already have my portfolio (WordPress) and also working on a React one as it's my core toolkit for UI tooling. I did an unpaid internship between May and August last year and I'm in the process of securing another one at the same company in May this year after finishing my Actuarial Science degree in April. Hopefully, I'll be able to land an entry level role before the year ends as I build more side projects.
However, in as much as you are a controversial tech content creator, try as much as possible to stay authentic for the sake of your audience. Many people really looking up to you as their mentor.
In the eighties I learned BASIC on my OSI Superboard and the Apple ][ at school. Later 6502 Assembler
In my first job I had a go at Fortran and still like it.
Toyed around with Python
This year it will be about Processing and P5.js, at least that's the plan
I'm not a developer nor will be.
But it has been very good for my mental development.
So if you wanna have a go at learning how to program, do it. It's fun
You forgot to mention your experience with app development on iPhone, with iOS/Swift.
People need to accept the idea that there is no guarantee that they will get a very nice paying job in a couple of months after they build a TODO app.
A todo app shouldn’t be the basis of one’s portfolio, but it’s not a bad way to learn code
Haha heck I'm about to build an online chess game and Im still struggling to get an internship.
a little naive as a seasoned youtuber to not think that negativity goes viral so much faster than positivity. I subscribed bc of the realness but I have noticed a increased of negative videos you’re creating but i’m not mad at it, it’s really bracing me for the reality of this pursuit.
My question is - What if it reaches a point when it starts to replace jobs.
The fear among the general public is what if what I am learning becomes redundant and obsolete. Then I have to start again.
Additionally, if some jobs are filled by AI and as a result more jobs are not created because of productivity gains. What happens then??
Please give your insights on this.
Do you have a subscription to chatgpt? They just opened up custom gpts. Some of them can walk you through the process of building a complex coding project like a full stack application step by step and always be there to help you with any questions you have about any step. This is how it will be done in the future. You won't be learning new frameworks like the days of old. You'll have your ai tell you what needs to be done, step by step after it's chosen the best framework for you. These things will very soon be more proficient than even the best coders could ever hope to be. They are already better than the majority. Then once agi hits, the ai won't need you at all, and complex coding projects will be generated easier than an image today.
Get land and go back to farming not everyone can get a job in IT
better pick a trade skill
It's not if but when. AI will most certainly replace jobs, that's for sure. However, programming will not die, and before AI truly "kills" the programming sector I do believe it's going to generate more jobs because of the absolute trash it will insert into corporate codebases. But we're not there yet, the moment AI kills programming, almost every other job is at risk too.
@@brawlgammer4424 honestly with the absolute state of the job market already as is, is it even worth pursuing it when youre not even passionate about it, other than being able to live a comfy life of course
Umm, I get what you want to say and maybe the little guilt that you feel from the 2 months old video, but I want to be honest the video from 2 months ago is more honest then this one lol you said what is in my mind in this video about how coding now is fu*ed up because it is, I am in this industry from 9 years and I want away out of it as soon as I can, it is not what it used to be for the effort that you put in it and the fact that we are always learning a lot with new technology ever day even the framework that you used it breaks with every major release for no reason, we are learning non sense not something useful really plus yes AI and low code is Here, it is just the beginning, man we are building new gov software with Microsoft power apps and dynamics they don't want Java Spring or node.js as it costs more and companies are now used to the subscription system for AWS, Azure cloud, etc, and international coders moving to work with cheaper salary or even offshore is growing, the whole thing is saturated and it is just the beginning, if you want to code because you love it go for it but just know that you are a blue collar worker not more or less and you are on the low side of it even. Thanks.
Yeah I wager the guilt he feels actually is a side effect of the "pushing positivity" culture.
One thing I know for sure is that in the next 5 years people will get paid a lot less to write code unless they are coding really complicated systems for cars and other machines. Thanks god I'm just learning this to ship some apps that will be subscription based are interesting to me, that's why I decided to learn GO instead of some other mainstream language/backend tech like PHP, C#, or Java. I'm going to study Chemistry in University, but I wholeheartedly wish all the best to everyone in this field.
So...... im screwed
@@sheldonhollis5258 why?
If you're just getting started after learning HTML, CSS, AND JS, you can learn maybe to play around with ChatGPTT, midjourney, etc. You could dedicate 20 days to that or even less. Then you build something, create some good projects or something and get a job. You can get a job as an HTML email developer or content editor or just working with those 3 languages. Then I would focus heavily on C#, Python or GO, because those are likely to dominate the AI development in the next years, JAVA And Swift are also a safe bet. C# is microsoft language and they closed deal with Walmart, Sony, and other big names for AI collaboration in the years to come so any development is going to be with C#; Python right now is the number one choice for AI bc it has more tools for the job and better tools; GO is mentioned more and more as an alternative, bc GO is just awesome; and Swift is Apple's language, so they mostly just develop their products with their own tools and they intend to lead the AI field as well. And Java is powered by Oracle, so JAVA will have its place as always. I wouldn't focus in languages like Rust or some other shiny language hyped by content creators.
So you can still get a job and continue learning, you're only screwed if your plan was maintaining a job for 10 or more years without learning anything more.
@@enriquesneffels3053 I won't make good money coding
I just gave up coding. I was honest with myself and realized that I'm not willing to spend most of my free time building my own software projects and staying up-to-date with the latest technologies. Only pursue coding if you really like it, and see yourself building software projects in your free time for fun.
Its about passion and survival.
If I don't do it, my future is misery and pain.
If I do it, my future is joy, wealth and pride.
I dont need 500k USD a year.
I just need to live with dignity...pay my bills and eat dinner out once a week, withiut having to suffer humiliation day after day and work 10 hours a day for 1 USD a days work.
I don't believe in failure when thse subject is learning how to code bro.
I'm already doing it, and soon I will be employed.
I appreciate your transparency and honesty with the original video. Regardless I’m still starting my bootcamp in March. I’m already miserable in my career as we speak so what do I really have to lose? Not putting my interest on the back burner anymore.
what about non programming jobs if youre not passionate about it? im still trying to find a skill i would like that would make a decent living
I honestly saw your original video and I started to lose interest in coding. I kept studying but not as much as I did because it sincerely felt like a huge waste of time, and I was hugely demotivated. Now is time to retake it more seriously.
Great video Dorian! I think something overlooked is also the fact that the end goal seems to always be in a “hard” software developer or engineering role.
There’s a ton of different positions which you can leverage coding skills, particularly within data analytics. Recently I’ve been us in Python a lot for data cleaning and my job relies on zero software development skills. Yet, the field is interesting and I can also leverage what I’ve learned in software development - the best of both worlds!
Having worked with these things I bet you’re spot on, cutting costs is never as straight forward as someone who doesn’t understand the product wants you to think, especially with Ai
Brother thank you so much for the positivity I always love your message
Sounds like this is a perfect time to learn or get a degree! When its hard people leave and more opportunities come!
Is there going to be a "We need to talk about..." of THIS Video! And then the thumbnail also shows this videos thumbnail - which also shows the thumbnail of the original video? KEEP THE CHAIN GOING!
I wasn't planning on it until you just gave me that idea!!
Thanks for this vid man. Been coding since 2022, still going. 🔥
you make me feel like giving up
@plumbing1which means theres gonna be a lot more people forced into the trades bringing plumbing bids down..
@plumbing1so...... I'm screwed
@plumbing1 I might just become a vagabond
You are one of the best channels in the YT tech world amd my personal favorite.
As with all career choices - you have to stay honest to yourself and reality. As a CS masters student I can tell that coding professionals will still be needed in the industry - the random indian guy who writes bad code won‘t.
20 years ago "off shore" developers were supposed to take all our jobs. Didn't happen. Many companies employ offshore developers and those devs are awesome, but instead of replacing US teams they powerfully augmented those teams so that we could do bigger things together. I suspect AI will - when it is mature enough which it is not - augment onshore and offshore capabilities so we can work on much bigger things. You Dorian may be too young to remember those times (I'm in my 50s) but it was a massive fear that India for example would take all the US software engineering jobs away. It turned out to be the exact opposite, engineers here got to work with great engineers from over there and the market for developers just kept growing and the projects kept growing and got so much more sophisticated. Like I said AI isn't there yet, in fact at this point in terms of code it's barely better than old "RAD" tools - and also plagiarizes people's work. When it matures it is going to be an amazing asset, not a replacement.
Beautiful advice❤ Agree with you, it's a lot of work, I keep going!
Dorian, I don't know which direction you want to go with your videos, but, if you are willing to create videos that can sort of guide wannabe software developers in this caotic time of ours, I feel that they would be much appreciated. On TH-cam and generally in the internet there are not many honest or rational voices as yours. Overly pessimistic videos and journalistic articles (A.I. will take all jobs) or overly acritical about A.I. (earn 100.000 $ with A.I.) make so that the panorama of information about sofware development is a mess. Guys like you, maybe some good university professors (I make a name, Charles Severance, author of some of the most popular software development courses online and amazing man) and maybe some decent people in the business of software development could help with understanding what is really going on and how to adapt to the next years. In any case thanks for giving a honest point of view with your videos!
Real vid, Dorian 🤝
In the last video I was like “yes! Thanks for taking out the competition” lol.
Improve your life = a job that can pay the bills to raise a family
back in 2014, i got a software engineering job as a jr dev 2 months after graduating college... it's really easy if you got the skills and determination, but right now there's a surplus of programmers with no college degree, experience and skills.. that's gonna be a hard pass for companies...
Yeah..... try that I'm 2024
@@sheldonhollis5258 even if i did, i have 9 yeas of experience now.
Working on cars isn’t perfect but theres a lot of corporate slime that isn’t there in many ways
What really pushed me away from coding was hearing all these Tech companies firing like 10k employees and things like that. But i know that can change but i dont think it will for a long time. Inflation today vs back in 2019 is drastically different. And so is greed. Lets hope for the best tho cuz times right now are real tough.
It's tough all over for everybody and we have to understand the situations of the market, for better or for worse. As far as AI, we should all learn how to use it to our advantage. It's going to be a grind but I haven't met a single person that says that it wasn't worth it.
As someone who just started learning how to code last week I’m really scared and don’t know what to do
Where are you learning? I'm doing Odin and Freecodecamp
@@Seekingtruth-mx3ur I got a udemy course on html & css and will then move on to a web dev course that will include both front end and backend
*Faith restored!*
The last video bummed me out but I didn't quit like some punk bitch. I just said "oh well if ai takes over at least i'll understand wtf its doing."
Not gonna lie i felt the same way too after watching it. Think i will pick back up on it.
Damn Johnny Sins is a coder now.
4:07 I get the same feeling from when "dreamweaver" was DA-Thang to know and would make less jobs.
Did you get a tap on the shoulder by someone?
Do we need to huddle around you & smack a fish (like Wayne Brady on the Chappelle Show)?
Blink four times, real fast, if they're still around you. Lol.
Seriously, thanks for the videos. I'm working toward a tech degree, right now. Your videos help counter balance the pixie dust my school and other folks are tinkerbell spanking over my head.
Take care, everyone.
Thanks for this Dorian
It's the toughest time ever for a junior developer, it's at least doubled the time it will take to get given an opportunity to be a junior dev. Things will get better though.
2-3 years minimum for most people
Please don't say that@@HCforLife1
On the same premise I quit a drawing course one year ago when I saw DallE-2, I got so discouraged by everything that I just ditched it, I regret it now a lot, I could have made it far in term of skills
Now, we’re talking.
This man are just trying to help us by being so informative! It's not Dorian's fault that you guys are too weak to listen other people's opinion..
How about information systems than computer science? Isn't it worth it? I am learning information systems in college so i get a remote job. Any advice? Iam a new student...
Thanks, but I get enough realism in the real world! (Just kidding, just subscribed)
That video make me depressed
working in a field to develop tech and then getting scared of the developed tech is a funny things haha
Almost like people dont really have an end goal in sight..
Lets just build a digital panopticon! What should we do with it? Lets put people we dont agree with in it!
job market is crazy here in tokyo, if you know Japanese you can get a job with 0 experience, even if you never learned programming they will teach you.
Is there much racism in tokyo?
Isn't complicated if you follow the holy trinity
Wait, this guy's a programmer now too? Leave us some jobs!
There is one thing about AI, before you even noticed you started using english rather than code to communicate with it. You have been pushed out of coding and into what office guys do. You have become moved from the driving seat to the passenger seat. That's ok for some, but english is not a coding language for programming computers babe ...
You just said, that you forget that when you voice your opinion and upload it, that other people watch this stuff......... WTF? You have 248K followers, OF COURSE people are watching this, but you FORGET about that fact? You're a youtuber. You post things for other people to watch and you forget about that fact? That makes no sense at all.
If you forget that you are speaking for your audience, then… are you just trying to apologize for the truth that you with your experience see? Or are you now trying to lie to us saying that we should continue the learning even if there is no future job for us?
@plumbing1Stop that heavy spamming of non-sense. Especially, if you habe no idea what you are talking about.
@@tybaltmercutio you are coping because you cannot accept the truth
@@kani-liciousyupp bunch of positivity junkies in the coding world. Welcome to reality.
@@kani-licious Oh man, you are just very bitter and still have not the slightest what you are talking about. I recommend you to go out and talk to real people instead of buying into the AI hype and doing free marketing for OpenAI.
Or maybe consider asking them for money to spam your non-sense AI marketing hype but don’t do it for free.
@@tybaltmercutio
>post implies nothing about ai and such, in fact is actually against it because of said inevitability.
>being blind about the current state of post-capitalist society this much
oh yes the next thing you will tell me is that we should all escape this rat race thats making us unhappy at once and that everyone should live off grid making dollarinos with their fancy digital nomad lifestyles so they can live happily ever after right???
People who are aren’t using AI are going to get left behind. Keep yelling at the clouds old man.
You're going to be old one day too then some young snob will say the same thing about you.
The fact of the matter is coding and swe is dieing. Ai will take it over, no matter what anyone says.
Time to learn how to build and maintain the AI, then.
Someone will always have to run the AI who understands coding, though. But, the amount of people needed will be way less. But, that's going to be a problem across the board for white collar jobs. It's pretty funny how everyone said AI and robots would be replacing blue collar jobs first, but the truth turned out to be just the opposite. We will all be working grunt jobs soon enough. I wonder who's going to buy all the expensive products when everyone is broke and most are working manual labor / service industry jobs. The 1% can ignore 3rd world countries' poverty and still profit, but it's going to be a bit harder if everyone is broke.
@plumbing1 it should be concerning because plumber and electrician are some of the best trade jobs to get into. If everyone is competing for the same jobs, it won't be good.
Ok, I get what you want to say and maybe the little guilt that you feel from the 2 months old video, but I want to be honest the video from 2 months ago is more honest then this one lol you said what is in my mind in this video about how coding now is fu*ed up because it is, I am in this industry from 9 years and I want away out of it as soon as I can, it is not what it used to be for the effort that you put in it and the fact that we are always learning a lot with new technology ever day even the framework that you used it breaks with every major release for no reason, we are learning non sense not something useful really plus yes AI and low code is Here, it is just the beginning, man we are building new gov software with Microsoft power apps and dynamics they don't want Java Spring or node.js as it costs more and companies are now used to the subscription system for AWS, Azure cloud, etc, and international coders moving to work with cheaper salary or even offshore is growing, the whole thing is saturated and it is just the beginning, if you want to code because you love it go for it but just know that you are a blue collar worker not more or less and you are on the low side of it even. Thanks.
@@AtacamaHumanoid It's always been a race to the bottom. That's the natural endgame. If you don't have a chair when the music ends, you're screwed. And no, there are not enough chairs to go around. That's the point of the game we are stuck in.
Why are you trying to discourage us
first
Hey Pete thanks for watching!
I'll say if A.i took over your job, buddy that's because it was time for you to upgrade.
I can’t wait for your comment to age like milk. 🥛 Give it two years tops from now and it’ll easily take your job seeing as how you still use the word “buddy” unironically in 2024. I can almost hear the keys on your flip phone you keep in your khaki cargo pants.
@@Modioman69
Let me guess a fast food worker who is angry at my comment 😁😂.
@@oesso I control more market capital from shares I hold than you have IQ points, it’s adorable watching G.E.D owners try to make insults. Your initial comment is a big cope with all that projecting you’re still doing.
It's over for coding in 2024 let's be real. Who knows where the market is headed this year.
I'm thinking about becoming a vagabond
bruh you need a coach in communications, i took nothing you said in that video seriously because if you're good at what you do, it won't matter the market, you'll always be hirable, so the idea is to just focus on getting into what you really are passionate about, and having a serious goal behind it. I can't believe you're a coach (lmao)
also "I noticed how many views I got on that video" so I'll make a follow up video, k el oh el