Scots Irish and the Ethnic Cleansing of James VI
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 มิ.ย. 2024
- Scots Irish, Ulster Scots, British, Irish, Ulster plantations. Scottish history tour guide, Bruce Fummey, discusses the effects most noted in the north of Ireland, but which were part the process of ethnic cleansing by James VI that started in Scotland.
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Scotland History Tours is here for people who want to learn about Scottish history and get ideas for Scottish history tours. I try to make videos which tell you tales from Scotland's past and give you information about key dates in Scottish history and historical places to visit in Scotland. Not all videos are tales from Scotland's history, some of them are about men from Scotland's past or women from Scotland's past. Basically the people who made Scotland. From April 2020 onward I've tried to give ideas for historic days out in Scotland. Essentially these are days out in Scotland for adults who are interested in historical places to visit in Scotland.
As a Scottish history tour guide people ask: Help me plan a Scottish holiday, or help me plan a Scottish vacation if your from the US. So I've tried to give a bit of history, but some places of interest in Scotland as well.
More on the ethnic cleansing of James VI at th-cam.com/video/rZxRgP451sg/w-d-xo.html
👑King James was a Direct Descendant of 👑 King Dawid aka 👑 King David and The Real Ancient Children of Yisrael are all Black Afrikan Tribes all 12 Tribes of Abraham, Isaac and Yakov/Jacob/Yisrael....Black people and we The Afrikan Diaspora are their Modern-day Bloodline DNA 🧬 Descendants. We are The Real Modern-day Children of Yisrael. 🕎
Didn't the name Scotland come from the tribe that originated in northern Ireland and migrated across the North Channel in the post-Roman era?
how ignorant can you get! The people of east Ukraine have always spoken Russian and it was Ukrainian government that made speaking Russian illegal, that banned eastern Ukrainians from speaking Russian, that sent Nazis to bomb them continuously since 2014, eastern Ukrainians happen to be fully human like you are Mr Woke!
Victoria Nuland on phone talking about how she was going to overthrow government east Ukrainians voted for, put head of Nazis in position of power makes it much easier when you ban their language and make their politicians and political parties illegal - th-cam.com/video/L2XNN0Yt6D8/w-d-xo.html
BBC never removed any of this because idiots like you never look before crossing the road, 2014 Neo Nazi threat in Ukraine th-cam.com/video/5SBo0akeDMY/w-d-xo.html
"Ireland/Eire, Ulster, Northern Ireland " you cried, from beginning to end I generally loved this latest video Bruce, couldn't help but smile . To tap it all you were able to give the best situational explanation of the Nortnern Irish border question due to Brexit. Better than any political hacks or politicians. The ripples of decisions implemented 400years ago still affecting us all today. History matters.
Excellent points! "Can't we all just get along?" Apparently not.
I'm not trying to be a smart hole but it's Éire not Eire. Eire in Irish means encumbered
@@dubhainoceanntabhail5262 Who cares? Nobody!
@@mac2626 no need to be nasty Son.
@@mac2626 you do or you wouldn't have passed a comment
I'm not a fan of judging historical figures by today's standards, but James VI is easily one of the people I detest the most in modern British history. His actions brought so much suffering to Scotland, Ireland, and England, even long after his death
Listen ‘Spud’, he unified our countries & turned us into a race of people who created the biggest, most powerful, Empire the world has ever known. The people of the United Kingdom created the modern Western world. We still have a huge influence, even today.
Our wee islands are the centre of this Planet.
Couldn’t agree more!
Cromwell comes close, along with the so called Good Queen Bess,
@@Gary-bz1rf Speaking from experience as a Scot I find it a bit galling that many of my fellow countrymen like to blame the entire British Empire on the English, as if our own countrymen took no part in it. Personally I blame the Scottish elite just as much as the English elite, and on the whole I'd say they had a toxic co-dependant relationship that's left us with so many negative legacies
@@darrynmurphy2038 Totally agree mate, Scots were at the forefront of the British Empire. Just look at how influential Scots were in North America, India, Australia, NZ etc etc etc......
We Jocks played a huge part, good & bad!! It’s our United Kingdom & our British Empire.
Scottish, British & Proud 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧
"when you get there it'll still be raining" 🤣😂. Great story Bruce. Thoroughly enjoyed the lesson this glorious morning. Well conceived and well delivered. Good morning from America!
Thanks 👍
It's still bloody raining.
Minnesota today with winds at 50 mph. Whee.🖖📚🐈⬛🫖🦉
Many of my ancestors where Scots-Irish. Thanks for explaining exactly what that means. And yes they became hillbillies in the the Blue Ridge Mountains of Tennessee.
Many people don't really appreciate the contribution of the hill folk to the Union cause in the Civil War. Most of the men were first conscripted into the Confederate Army, but soon got tired that. Many of them deserted to go North across the Mason Dixon line to volunteer for the Union Army. In fact, the Army roles list some 200,000 men from the mountain areas that did this. But history didn't carry down all that well because after the Civil War, the government in Washington decided to declare that any Union soldier who had first fought for the Confederacy would not be eligible for a pension, and this created quite a problem for the Republican Party at the time. The notion was not well appreciated, to say the least. But it is not unreasonable to think that perhaps up to half of the men on the Sherman's March to the sea were actually from the hill country or other parts of the Confederate states, including a Union Cavalry Brigade from Alabama and a Union division from Georgia. That sad truth was that when Georgia voted on secession, the state chose to not secede, but then Governor Brown alleged the results were inaccurate and took the votes into his office to personally do the recount. I think you know the rest of the story, as the saying goes.
@@thomasjamison2050 there's oh so much more to that. You need only to look at reconstruction to see how those Scotts and Irish were treated post war. Irish immigrants were drafted as soon as they got off the boat. Wealthy people of English decent could pay 200$ to avoid the draft. In essence this led to alot of Davison between the north and south post war , as many of these Irish and Scotts settled in southern states afterwards. If you ever wondered where the music came from now you know . One of the biggest misconceptions is that all Scotts and all Irish were from northern Ireland . This is incredibly flawed in ways that could take pages to fully illustrate but can be summed up as, famine doesn't occur in just 1 corner of the country , it's common sense . Exports from Scotland came by many other means as well. The first of my family in America was a Scottish sailor. And there were many other ties between Scotland and the southern states as well. What I do find interesting is how in Scotland and Ireland the people gradually became more like the English . But in the mtns in America they managed to maintain a huge part of their original culture. Music, dance , and even some language. Everybody knows at this point that whiskey was brought to America by these people . What many fail to understand is the massive distrust for government these people have. First they leave the British isles because of famine due to English landlords fking everything up , then off to America where they fight someone else's war , then they say fk it I'm going to go hide in the damn woods from you @$$ holes. Then comes the whiskey rebellion , and the miners strike. After that many are ran off their own lands by the federal gov. The term hillbilly comes from a place of ignorance and stupidity. Those in the north having a somewhat higher self opinion than was justified. A deliberate campaign to marginalize those they would exploit but could not control. Yea there's alot to that , and what's more is the amount of that same culture that was passed on to black people in America. That'll surprise you. Many words and phrases that are unique to the south that started in the British isles.
@@correctpolitically4784 Southern history has its sore points. One in particular relates to literacy, the rate of which in the south, and particularly in the hill country, was far behind that of the rest of the country. After the Civil War the Freedman's Bureau discovered that less than one in ten southerners could sign their name with anything other than an 'X'. Even in the 1930's, illiteracy in the region was at 50%. The southern accent, and ebonics, has a very strong connection to 16th and 17th century English accents. It was said of the governor or Georgia during the Civil war, one Governor Brown, that his English was much closer to that of Chaucer than anything else.
And watch out for the racist history crap about the Civil War. Yes, Irish immigrants were drafted, but after the one major riot, the State of New York paid the $300 dollars per man for anyone that didn't want to be drafted. 99% of the Union soldiers were volunteers, whereas every single southern soldier was conscripted, either to get them to join or to force them to stay in against their will. And the cost of getting out of the southern draft was $500 and no state came forward to pay for it for anyone. There was, however, a very, very strong anti war movement in the south, but it was all done quietly on the side. In 1863 it was noted Hal Cobb that more able bodied southern men had draft deferments of one form or another than the number of men in the southern army. This only got worse as the war dragged on after that point. The majority of southerners actually saw a lost cause for what it was back then. Only later with racist revisionist history did the national story telling change. The people of the south actually won the war by quietly supporting the Union and refusing to fight in the war.
@@thomasjamison2050 what's more they gained representation in Congress as well though little good it did during reconstruction . Many valid points.
@@correctpolitically4784 Did they? Not so sure. Just ask the KKK.
The irony of the situation is that the "Scoti" from which Scotland is derived, who an Irish tribe who themselves are believed to have colonised Scotland giving us the modern name.
I'm a Hillbilly from the Ohio River Valley. My ancestors are Hays from the Leelands, by way of Ulster, Farquharsons from Braemar, and Maloney's from Clare. Most came to Virginia and North Carolina indentured for some sort of resistance. This video was profound. Thank you.
I also live in the Ohio river valley, many a few of my forebears were the Arthurs from Cullybackey.
A lot of Scots Irish from the Ohio River Valley including my own.
@Josette Hansen-Robles Josette would the be Byrne. I'm a research assistant to the Irish Genie and we have no Byrne's as a surname. Only Byrne. Bernie Walsh is professional gemologist and not expensive. My dad's mum was a Kelly Byrne. Like Bruce highly intelligent and very funny.
@@stevepenney2073 really, i have a lot of ancestors from ross county ohio or addams co or meigs co that i think are scots irish
as a Scots Irish in nc hope you're keeping well. rough climate right now.
Thanks once again Bruce for tackling a difficult situation,with wit and humor.
One does One's best Michael😎
Great explanation of an astoundingly complicated era of history, Bruce. You have the gift of making it comprehensible in a very human way. Much appreciated. ATB.
Imagine being way down on the list for the allocation of land during the plantation, coming from Ayrshire or Somerset, settled spitting distance from the ppl who were pushed off land. Night time comes and you hear a pack of wolves howling, a sound that hasn't been heard in Scotland or England for 100s of years...you would feel very alone
oooft
IIRC wolves lasted slightly longer in Scotland than in Ireland, though only in the far north. Planters from southern and western Scotland probably hadn't heard that howl before.
As an American who's got both Scottish and Irish roots, I'd like to thank you for being so objective about the topic and putting the due consideration in for both sides.
Happy to chip in
Another great video there. I love how you humanise and contextualise these events. History at school was always useless at portraying these things happened to people as complex as you and I. You do a fantastic job of it.
I grew up in England to an Irish speaking father and with its decline mourn that my dad has no one to speak to in his mother tongue besides my broken Irish. Videos like this, always put on that tear jerk of thought.
Go raibh maith agat.
'S e do bheatha
This series is a great source of history! As a man with 42% Scot genetic heritage and a maternal descendant of James II, III and IV, his knowledge of the history and his great presentation helps me better understand my heritage!
@Rapman Me too! Just 20% but directly descended from James IV and Margaret Drummond. We are bastards, but we are royal bastards. 😉
Your series of videos regarding the ethnic cleansing of the Gaels and the origins of the Irish Green vs the Irish Orangemen resonates in me to my very fiber. I'm the Great Grandson of an Orangeman from Fivemiletown, County Tyrone. He emigrated to the US in the 1860s and settled in an extended colony of Methodists centered around Johnstown NY in the Adirondack Mountains of northern New York State. His daughter Elizabeth, my maternal Grandmother, was very proud of her Orange roots. Her eldest daughter, Virginia, was my mother. When she came bouncing into her mother's home and grandly announced that she was going to marry a fellow who happened to be a Catholic (egads, a PAPIST!), I could only imagine the screaming and gnashing o' teeth that attended this announcement. There are many more parts to this story, I guarantee. In any event, when my Orange Methodist mother died at the age of 39 (I was 7 at the time), my Papist father got an exemption from the local Catholic Bishop to have my mother's funeral in a Catholic church, and for her remains to buried in a Catholic cemetery. My grandmother wore her Ulster-father's Orange Sash to her daughter's funeral. So, as the song goes, My Mother She was Orange and My Father He Was Green (or a Papist, at any rate). I have the blood of "The Troubles" flowing through my veins... I was raised as a Catholic and stayed a Catholic until the Nuns beat the faith outta me by fourth grade. So, yeah, your stories about James VI, the Ulster Plantation Scheme et al really pull at my ancestral heartstrings, and I don't know who I should be mad at! 🙃
English Anglicans not Irish Protestants of any denomination
This was tremendous. I learned so much I didn't know. I laughed unexpectedly (the jokes were absolutely excellent here) and you posited so many questions that need an answer that's just not forthcoming at the moment.
I always think you've reached "peak excellence" - and then you produce something that ties together so much of history with this insouciant "Yeah, I can do better".
I'm a bit in awe of you , man.
😘
Bruce for the BBC! Why they persist with that bawbag archaeologist, Oliver, i'll never know
I'm a proud hillbilly from the mountains of Virginia and Tennessee and I appreciate you, Bruce explaining how my my mom's family got to Virginia
My dad was highland born and raised. He said that all he heard when growing up was the English language. When he walked into a room of adults they would be speaking gaelic! Then stop. The reason he was not exposed to gaelic normally was to allow him to fully immerse in the language of money,opportunity and modern times. Contrast the attitude to hebrew or Welsh and the attitude to their language was completely different. I prefer to talk bollocks and just have a good laugh.....I accept that people have all the same biological parts as me and have been loved as a wee baby, just like me. I struggle to accept WHY we are so tribal on this big rock we share. I squirm in pain at Scottish sectarianism being brought up in Glasgow and simply enjoy others who can laugh at themselves and spin a good tale.....hence my deep love of this channel. Yes, I'm drinking hot tea with my lorne sausage and tunnocks tea cake. Bliss.
When I venture over to Antrim to watch the Northwest 200 motorcycle road races.....the locals I meet are funny, friendly, engaging and love motorbikes. It's good to see people as they really are.
I know what you mean. I do find sectarianism pretty horrible. In York shall we take the piss out of our next door neighbours in Lancashire but we don’t generally going around murdering them. Partly because like The rest of the island chain, we are all related.
The fact that Bruce is able to in many ways take apart the narratives of nationalists by pointing out that there were more than one villain in each piece. There’s black and white and there’s a shed load of grey in between. Especially when you look at the time of Robert the Bruce and the number of people who had Estates on both sides of English and Scottish border. Whose political loyalties and thus their vassals More applicable to which ever side suited the Leigh Lord best of the time.
Going forward I can see Gaelic becoming a second language in both Scotland and Northern Ireland. I don’t have a problem with it myself because we are already doing it with Welsh anyway so what is the issue. The language of Ulster Scots I don’t think will really get to fly because really in comparison nobody speaks it.
To put it in perspective, you can request information from the UK Government in English and Welsh while in Ireland you can put in a benefit claim in both English and Gaelic. If people want it that’s absolutely fine have at it. It’s just a question of who is prepared to pick up the bill to cover it. The English taxpayers will turn around and go we’re not paying for that. But then again you get the same problem when for instance London gets a shed load of cash for the transport system and a granny in West Wales gets her local bus service in the small village she lives in cancelled.
Scott, I speak a wee bit of the Gaelic, but it’s a pigeon language, dead in the water!! Only about 2% of the population of Scotland can speak barely a few words. But there’s several versions of this pigeon language. Skye Gaelic differs greatly from Lewis Gaelic etc etc.
The SNP morons try to ram it down our throats & spend countless Tax Payers’ money on it, what a pile of shite!!
@scott Murray the sectarianism isn't Scottish. I don't see it here on the east coast
@fibre washer Sorry mate, but this was a really stupid comment on several levels
People are crazy tribal all over, people are people. :D
Thanks for the great info. Both my husband and I have a heritage of Scots ancestors landing in Northern Ireland for a generation then off to America. Apparently they didn't like that experiment and decided to try another.
Same here! I can’t even trace my ancestry in Scotland (though it’s the largest portion of my DNA) but I read that my 8th great grandfather was born in Ulster then married his first wife somewhere in Scotland and left to America from Ulster around 1800. This certainly pieces some of the puzzle together.
Funnily enough, after WWII, my 2nd great grandfather received a letter from a relative in Ulster and they were quite loyalist from his writing. A lot of stuff about “the unruly southern Irish” and how “we’ve always been utmost loyal to the crown” though now I would have to ask why we left Scotland? Though I doubt I would receive a realistic or unbiased answer.
Interesting video as usual Bruce. Being Irish the subject matter is closer to my heart than your usual videos.
Very easy to go down rabbit holes on this topic. We can't change the past, but we can aim to make a better future in Northern Ireland, Ireland and both Britain and Ireland as a whole.
Aptly surmised Sir. Appropriate moniker too. Forward is the only way, but no harm taking lessons from the past, but we must all learn and listen.
I’m of 🇮🇪 let’s forgive and have friendship.
If you're FROM Ireland, why do you say You're of Ireland? It's incorrect English that I can't imagine anyone who is ACTUALLY from Ireland like I AM would actually say, but internet is full of surprises so maybe you really are an Irish person who writes English like a Latin language speaker.
And now at risk of going down one of those rabbit holes that I wanted to avoid. I'd be willing to forgive and forget etc etc, problem is a large minority of British people either don't realise there's anything that Britain as a country did anything majorly wrong historically in Ireland to be forgiven for, some simply couldn't care less, and others think they were just being a bit naughty over in Ireland back in the day, nothing to be seen here etc. Anyway!!!
In answer to Bruce's question 400 years is more than long enough IMO long enough for the British planters/migrants in Ulster to be part of the fabric of the land, and those who are more descended from the original Gaelic Irish also are equally as entitled to try to hold on to their culture. I would even say WE Irish and I include myself in this have done nowhere near enough to revive our language.
@@dazza9859 as soon as they end partition 🇮🇪
TL/DR my reply above. Dazza is almost definitely not Irish.
Damn, Bruce. This was an incredible video, even beyond your usual high level of excellence. You're always educating (and entertaining), but this one really left me thinking as well. This Yank thanks you.
Brilliant
The earl of Inishowen you referred to was Cahir O'Docharaigh who rebelled against the crown in 1604 and sacked Derry. He was my ancestor.
This is the first time I've encountered anyone outside of America use the term Scots Irish but as someone who grew up in Appalachia (where an enormous amount of Scots Irish people settled (alongside Scots and Irish of less complicated origins) and carried the culture of that political exile with them the designation is one I hear often. Even so, a lot of people even those of Scots Irish, Scottish, and Irish descent remain confused by this period of history and how and why it shaped identity so strongly back then and why that identity remained once immigration to America happened. Turns out that in America many readily adopted the term Scots Irish to avoid the stigma of being Irish, especially prior to the American Revolution when it was very important to show loyalty to the crown and then once again when it served as a useful identity for those wanting to rebel against the crown.
In Appalachia this gets complicated by people being of both Scottish and Irish ancestry declaring themselves Scots Irish when what they mean is that they share both heritages rather than that they descend from Ulster Scots and of course many really do descend from Ulster Scots but there were strong waves of Irish and Scottish immigration to Appalachia that are separate from that combined identity. To look at it from a different point of view of the current problems it poses in the UK and Ireland and with Northern Ireland itself it amazes me how this one action by James shaped the world so much and still does 400 years on and on both sides of the Atlantic. To answer the question of when do you give up and accept change? Well, if Appalachia holds any answer it's that you never do. While some the political aspects are resolved by a different national identity, the cultural identity and many quirks of it remain unchanged from the 1600s. So much of who we are and what we do was shaped by the heritage immigrants brought with them. Take the Appalachian murder ballad Knoxville Girl. It's traceable to an Irish ballad which is traceable to an English ballad which traces to a murder in 1683. Even our accents and particular speech patterns are traceable to this time frame and the force of these three nations and identities.
At any rate, thank you for a wonderful fun video on a complex topic. I look forward to learning more from you.
Fantastic as ever. As an Irishman from Tyrone this issue never goes away, but the insight that this video provides is excellent and makes those with even the most entrenched views think again. Keep'em coming.
Many thanks Declan
"If it makes you want to cry , sing or cross an ocean, it's probably Irish." Amen!!!!
Yet again you created another great video. Many thanks 👏👏👏👏👏👏An answer to your question , Never accept defeat. Over a hundred years ago , my country Ireland was divided and an artificial border was created . Hopefully soon in the next ten years or so my country , Ireland will be United again. 🇮🇪☘
I'm Irish, and it's possible that at some point in the next decade or two I might be asked to vote on reunification. My answer to your question about when is it right to give up and accept change (which is no better or worse anyone else's) is that it's never wrong to give up (i.e. no one should ever feel they have the right to judge you for "giving up"), but it's not wrong to keep fighting either. We each have to judge the merits of either option ourselves.
Iam half Irish half English I understand your point of view sir but your completely controlled and will be replaced by people who the EU chose to move to your wonderful country
@@87mrreynolds I don't think you and I have the same definition of what a people even consist of.
@@Whelknarge really wow is there really any need to be so hateful towards me for making this comment personally Iam married to Mexican women and live permanently in nezahualcoyotl among the wonderful hard. Working and decent people of Mexico poorer district I wouldn’t make a comment on here that I would be happy to discuss with face to face I seen the people who will and are moving to your country in great numbers we see if you have the same opinion when your young woman and daughter wife’s can’t walk the street in safety because yo me this point is the most important part of a decent country but obviously you are far more wise
@@87mrreynolds The EU aren't choosing to move people to my country and I don't understand why you would think that they are, and I also don't know what you mean by my future children being unable to walk down the street in safety. Ireland has been growing in ethnic diversity for my entire lifetime and it is now the most prosperous and safest it has ever been. I remember what the bad parts of town in Dublin looked like in the 90's - there is no poverty anywhere in the country (or possibly anywhere in Europe) that is as bad as what some parts of Dublin were like then, and that was already an improvement on what it was like decades before.
Of course there are circumstances when you should give up, and circumstances when you should fight on. It's not simply how you feel. There are genuine questions of what's better for the wider community, and there are situations where that judgement is far from subjective.
Thoughtful, challenging, and droll, all wrapped up in one reminder to check the damned pulse! Thank You.
And here I am, with no intention of being ashamed of my ancestors.
I'll be ashamed of them for you.
@@jackdubz4247 Well I'm sure you've had plenty of practice with your own.
I would be
@@simonmc78 No, because if you'd been bred of good stock you'd have a sense of pride and a backbone.
My great grandparents were from Ulster(Donegal and Derry). They came here because of partition. My first American ancestor was an orangeman from Belfast. So I’m confused whether to throw a petrol bomb on the 12th or march through my living room. My branch of the family was later disowned for marrying a Catholic who emigrated during the famine.
Welcome fellow Ulsterman. I think if you looked into it a little more you would find that partition was not the cause of your great grandparents emigration. Much more likely it was the poverty in Donegal caused by the creation of the Irish Free State, which forced many to cross the border into more prosperous Northern Ireland to escape. Londonderry had a particularly large influx from Donegal and there was likely a great shortage of jobs and housing, making a 2nd emigration more attractive. As regards the 12th July celebrations, you should treat our national day as the festival it is, learn to love the rat-ta-ta-tat of the lambegs.
@@asanulsterman1025 the Famine and the Irish Free State, were two different time frames, 70 years of a difference! Your Culture, beating drums of hate, burning Irish Tricolours, which is supposed to signify the orange for the Prods, green for Catholics, white for peace, not that you wouldn't know that! Then the burning of pallets, bonfires, some culture, you need to get a life! Brendan Bonner, is an Irish name too! Packie Bonner goalkeeper for the ROI, from Donegal!
@@joebyrne3159 Now you have gotten your obligatory bigoted rant out of the way please tell me how/why you to bring the Famine into this discussion?
@Dan Beech
Yeah but I’m Catholic so I prefer to stay with people who don’t hate me for my ethnicity and nominal religion.
@@joebyrne3159
Yeah I’m mostly Irish ancestry. Just very distant Ulster Scots due to my branch of the family getting disowned in the 19th century. Not to mention he blames the free state for the poverty of post independence free state when it was due to the British colonization of the island and genocides and attempted genocides on Ireland. The nation was kept intentionally poor and had de facto religious apartheid within living memory of independence. I wrote my dissertation on the troubles and have presented at academic conferences on Irish history as an undergraduate. If there’s one thing I’m near an expert in its Irish history. The siege museum has several errors but I’m not surprised from a museum funded by a hate group. Remember unionists are on the side that had un ironically worn klan regalia and simps for the confederacy. I’m also aware of my probable distant cousin Packie lol. He’s why I say my favorite soccer team is Celtic.
I am of mixed Irish (Ulster) and Scottish (Aberdonian) ancestry, although I grew up in England. I now live in the Philippines, having lived in China, Laos, Vietnam and Hong Kong. my mother is a Catholic and my father is a Protestant and I was educated in England and Scotland. Living in the Philippines pretty much pushes me towards Catholicism, although I don't bother myself with religion. I appreciate your videos.
Same heritage, Ulster and Scottish from Aberdeen
This guy is so good at curating important snippets national history and making them accessible and engaging. Is it too early to call him a national treasure?
If the venerable Bede is to be believed, the Scots were an Irish clan. If so, this was no invasion, merely deportation back to the original homeland. As a member of a family claiming Pictish and Norman descent. that seems an admirable idea.
Love the short series.
Okay, please tell me a story!
Thank you very much Bruce.
Have a great weekend too.
❤✌🇺🇸
😘
As an Aussie I really get this... what happened to our indigenous was appalling...
Same with aborigines
Please do not associate Irish people of the 17th century to neolithic people of Australia.
I actually was supposed to speak at a conference in college on this topic. But it got canceled because of Covid. I argued that it was where the origins of American Indian policy lay. I lived in Ireland for a time and it’s truly a second home to me. Great job doing this topic justice man!
Many thanks
Great video, detailing the complexity of the historical and current situation. after hearing Sinn Fein are ahead in the polls ive decided to try and find out as much knowlege of the histroy of Ireland as possible. Being scottish these troubles have been part of my country and effected us all living here. Your section in this vid about empirial/invading forces, in my opinion was spot on. thanks you again for the vid. Hopefully more people can learn the real histroy and maybe even hundreds of year of oppression can be outdone by a democratic vote. Sounds like peaceful progress to me.
Let's hope so
Great as always. I love the way you link the past and present, both bringing the past to life and helping to explain the way historical decisions and action impacts us today. We shouldn't really be surprised or shocked by the conflict in Ukraine as most weeks your videos detail some invasion or war and from a historical perspective its always been the same. Big powerful countries always find reasons and excuses to try to invade and subjugate others, and terrorising and murder the civilian population has regularly been a part of that. We kid ourselves if we think that the whole World is somehow different now.
True
Didn't the Norman's, Knights Templar Bankers, the Church of Rome/Babylon and Globalist Corporations and so called Charitable Philanthropic Think Tank Lobbyist Foundations and Technocrats, .. get to Rule over the Irish, English, Scottish, Welsh, British, Picts and everyone else across the world anyway?
Very interesting video, especially of something as complicated as the Plantation of Ulster. You did a very good job presenting a difficult subject and posed an interesting question! I think you could perhaps have mentioned that a number of Gaelic Irish lords got lands in the plantation (or had the lands they held granted to them). In addition, there is also the role of the 1st and 2nd Earls of Antrim to be considered (both called Randal MacDonald). The 2nd Earl (and later Marquis) played an important role in the 1640s wars - and he was also a grandson of Hugh O'Neill. Thanks for this and your other videos, they are always very good.
Not difficult subject English and Scottish Protestants steal Irish Roman Catholic land complain when Irish Roman Catholics took revenge in 1641 nothing difficult about it
Ask somebody who is native Hawaiian, every time I see the Hawaiian flag here the national anthem of Hawai’i or go to any hula competition I feel some sadness anger for what was lost, but I also feel pride and honor. I ice think that sorrow and loss don’t have time limits on one eyed people or nation ever heals from the injustice and damage that they go through.
😮💨
An interesting point I would make is that it was the Presbyterians and other protestants who in Northern Ireland voted to leave the EU. That vote would match Northern Ireland demographic patchwork. King James's aim of creating a British people was very successful, at least in Northern Ireland.
That's not a success anyone should be boasting about.
It wasn’t successful it was a cluster fuck and has been for 400 years.
And past attempts to bring these people together have been sabotaged by those who benefit from this island’s and specifically Northern Ireland’s disunity
@@jackdubz4247 Bet you would like that group of British people to just disappear, a modern day massacre, mass deportation or just run them into the sea?
I adore this Scotsman!🥰💚☘️
Why wouldn't you he accent is charming and makes Irish history bad parts sound less anti British
😂😂😂 Bruce, I love your sense of humour and your videos. Family histories are even complicated.
My father's family was from county cork. Eventually emigrating (potato famine) to America. We have an existing letter from an uncle many times removed, he was based in a military fort where they would be fighting native Americans. His letter states that he has seen no natives but the buffalo hunting was very good. One of his family marries a native woman later on.
My mother's family is related to a sea captain who became shipwrecked in India where he married a native woman.
Thanks Bruce for that greatly edifying ( as usual) tale of Henry VI/ Henry I. The turmoil continues to this day. I particularly love the independent way you propose the quandary of; " when is the right time to accept defeat." Would that there was more unity on that prickly question around the world today.
Thank you for this. My ancestors came over in 1630 and settled in Windsor, CT. That line became fairly large in the USA. They were Puritans. This helps me understand my ancestors. Part of my line was U.S. Grant who came a Civil War General and President. Family history has always been an interest of mine. PArt of my mother's family came from Northern Ireland and settled in Canada.
It's great to know where you come from, and I don't just mean geography. There's one distinction that confuses me regarding the C17th. The established church in England was, naturally enough, the Church of England (C of E). The Puritans wanted to purify the C of E, to lose all the gowns, saints, insense, etc and return to the bible. The people who wanted to go further and have nothing to do with the C of E, were called Separatists. And curiously, after the civil war of 1640s, the country was run by Oliver Cromwell who was from the same religious group as the Pilgrim Fathers.
Ulster Scots people need more recognition. These were the pioneers who won the American west.
The first man to walk on the moon, Neil Armstrong, was also of Ulster Scots descent.
"These were the pioneers who won the American west" That was basically every immigrant.
If you know anything about American history you should know that manifest destiny occurred after independence, and the scots Irish were not anymore involved in that then say the Irish or German's were.
@@MrSchizoid405 Not all experiences were equal, the Ulster Scots up and left in large numbers long before independence happened and it was likely them that cleared the way for the waves of mass immigration that happened after independence. The new world in many ways stopped the total plantation of Ireland being completed.
@@MrSchizoid405 I think he’s more meaning the first European people to truly settle and explore the frontier were the Ulsterscots. German and Irish came later when most of the horrible deeds and conquest was done.
They also gave us the KKK. Well done, Ulster Scots. Still winning I see.
@@NorthSon "I think he’s more meaning the first European people to truly settle and explore the frontier were the Ulsterscots"
Except they weren't the English settlers made up the absolute bulk of the first and early settlers in James town and beyond the frontiers. And this is ignoring the Spanish conquistadors who were there 100 years before British settlers. The term Cowboy originates from them.
"German and Irish came later when most of the horrible deeds and conquest was done."
No it really wasn't like that, you should look into American history most of the atrocities and land over 70% of the us was acquired through conquest, mostly in conflict with the native American's and Mexico, after independence the term that is used is "Manifest destiny" this is the era you're thinking of with the wild west.
His statement "These were the pioneers who won the American west" is just false.
Thank you for another excellent video that exemplifies William Faulkner’s famous quote - “The past is never dead. It’s not even past.” About the question concerning when it’s time to give up - I think there’s a fundamental difference between voluntarily modifying one’s culture to accommodate newcomers while being accepted as an equal and the all too often situation in which a conqueror deems the local population to be lesser, more backward or not fully human and decides to “civilize” them by eradicating their culture and traditions. My own country’s history regarding the Native American population and the African peoples who were enslaved to provide cheap labor provides evidence of the evil consequences that ensue.
On a lighter note, I share your rootedness to you home. Outside of vacations and summer educational opportunities, I’ve never lived more than ten miles from by birthplace and never outside of the coterminous City and County of Philadelphia.
You will of course know that Wm Penn sailed out of Cork Harbour having ran into trouble for not being Anglican( Episcopalian)
@@diarmuidbuckley6638 Actually that is something I didn’t know. Thanks for expanding my knowledge!
My ancestors were from Ulster and County Down. For the longest time I didn't understand the conflict because I thought it was Protestant and Catholic and it really has nothing to do with it. 😳 Everything to do with this crazy British king doing what crazy British Kings do inflicting pain in the murdering other people. Just my point of view. Once I understood the real ethnic cleansing reason behind it then he understood the conflict. ❤️
This is SO INTERESTING. All your videos on similar topics are very engrossing, & well-presented. You make better sense of it than many historical texts I've read. Great job! Now I know a little better the situation my Scotch-Irish Alabaman ancestors fled.
I'm delighted
My mother was Irish, from Cavan; when we visited in 2003 the local historian told us that he reckoned that her family was among the first to be settled, in 1609 or so. They came from Ayrshire we reckon, since the name is common there , and the nearest town was settled by a William Baillie who came from Ayrshire. He was an " undertaker" who undertook to bring others over, most likely including my forebears.So that means that even tho' my mother was Irish, ultimately she was of Scottish stock, as was my father, whose family stayed in Scotland.
And that town now is called bailibouragh 15km from my town ,,, bailys Castle House was burnt by the irish republican army the 20s
My mother, God bless her soul, is Irish. I have a friend from work who said his family came from Ireland. Turns out it was Ulster. Turns out they were Scotch Irish. I mean it's bad enough I was raised catholic and he Mormon but to find out he was also Scotch Irish by descent made me angry and I didn't even know why 🤣 I mean I know why but it was weird that I just wanted to box his ears for no other reason than his ancestors were bootlickers of a king that never was mine
You are a real treasure to me as an American with fairly recent (1838) Scottish set of ancestors. It was such a wonderful thing to find my Great Great grandparent’s house, even though it had been turned into a sheep shed, with a grand new house built ext to it. Glasgow! Any stories about Lanarkshire?
th-cam.com/video/VqbXzDtaV7M/w-d-xo.html
Thankyou!! This episode ties into what I've been watching today on English history throughout the 500ADs with Viking invasions very interesting! Do we keep fighting? When do we give in? 🤔
Have you done an episode on Queen Scota? I'm just getting into it! Oh and by the way My Hoodie came!! And I love it!! I got the grey one with 'Let me tell you a story' on the front! Ok carry on..😁☕️🍪
Yay to the hoodie. I've mentioned Scota a couple of times in origin type stuff
The Scota story is completely fake!
Excellent as ever Bruce ! Just read The Highland Clearances bY John Prebble and Capitalism and Slavery by Eric Williams the overlaps between them and the story of the six counties are chilling !
Yes especially when one conziders that Trevelyan's next gig after the Famine was the Highland Clearances
For centuries in Ireland, there had been the tradition of alternating inheritance of the High Kingship of Ireland between the northern and southern branches of the Ui Neill. Even Brian Boru was widely called an usurper. Ulster always had had nominal ties to Scotland, as Dal Riata had largely founded by settlers from the north of Ireland. Much Respect, and I look forward to your uploads. You always pick lovely backgrounds
Aye folk like a bit of scenery
@Dan Beech You are quite right, but I figured Dal Riata was the best known of these migrations, which continued for a long time. Consider for example the clann Deisi, who famously migrated to Wales
The original inhabitants of Ulster are named in the annals as Cruthin. The Picts.
So ties between Ulster and Britain predate Dal Riada by ages.
@Dan Beech
Pict was the roman name for the ancient britons living outside of imperial rule.
Cruthin was the gaelic name for the Picts. And they are recorded as the primary inhabitants of Northern Ireland.
@@kevinstachovak8842 the "gaels/scotti" colonising scotland is a mythical tale.
I’m a 5th generation Anglo Australian and I except anyone from any ethnic background as a Australian. As it’s one world with only one race of people and it’s called the human race. The problem with north Ireland is people categorise themselves into groups will divide a nation. There are Russians that have moved and lived in the Ukraine for years that call themselves Ukrainian that are fighting against the country were they was born. Its a funny world why can’t we all just get along and let each other just be
I thought that would a good idea but after reading and watching various videos,I’am hearing that the trouble was actually being stirred up by ex soviet Russians and Russia’s secret security service the F S B,that’s what caused the deaths in Odessa,they were clashing with the Ukrainian far right,that was the cause of the conflict in the separatist regions,their are Russian speaking Ukrainians who oppose Russia.
I enjoy watching your video's and (Don't get a big head) Your style of presentation is excellent. When it comes to British history it is often much more complicated than can be talked about in a 13 minute video.
Again thank you for another interesting video.
All the best from sunny Thailand.
My family came from Cavan county during the worst year of the famine, in 1847. I can't imagine how difficult it must have been during those really bad years. My mom got the Catholic herald newspaper, and during the 70s we were always apprised of the troubles in Northern ireland.
Hi Bruce,
I was curious if you've done any videos on the boarder reivers, specifically the 12 reiver families that were exiled to Ulster Plantation?
Thank you for all the great content.
Yes I have
After 2+ years of watching your informative and fun videos here, this one got me to head over to Patreon to show proper appreciation beyond a "like"
You're a star Brian
Bruce you're a gentleman and a scholar, thank you for your indepth and entertaining content.
You're welcome
Another incredibly informative and thoughtful video. Loving the channel
Much appreciated!
Ive a bias being from Ireland so I'd love to see more coverage of the struggle the north is facing and the history involving it. with so many ties to Scotland and England, there's a LOT to unpack. Northern Ireland has had a rather mournful, troubled past, pardon the puns...
That's my hot button, all of the things you listed are of interest again, due to the bias of being Irish. There's a disparity I've noticed in the history being taught to those in different places in the British isles in mainstream schooling. From primary school to the end of secondary school there was little covered on northern Irish history or politics. People in the south weren't taught about the border wall that still exists in Belfast and gets locked at night to prevent potential 'sectarian' violence, there's regular protests that become riots over different cultures between the unionist populace who side with identifying as British and the nationalistic populace who'll seek to unite Ireland as 1 country. Bonfires that have literally burned people's homes, in the name of 'My giant pallet tower cock is bigger than the estate over'. For context if you're the chad that read this far, the 12th of July or rather the night of the 11th, giant structures, one even reaching 133ft at its max are built by unionist neighbourhoods in a cultural celebration, look it up, please get back to me on your reaction, watch the videos, it's...something.
Tl;DR loves the video, like more coverage of Irish history and in particular the relationship between the north, South and britain.
If you're still reading, dive for a bit on northern Irish history, it's a trip if you've not learned about it before
Actually, forgive my glibness, but it all sounds very American- US. It seems like peoples, cultures, and events occurring simultaneously, mashed together displacer/displaced, indigenous/migrant, colonizer/colonized, entrepreneur/market, owner/worker, and more. The result has been unique and prosperous, but also oppressive and bloody.
Discovering some of the similarities/differences of these two colonial ventures here, I definitely want to find out more details, especially since my own family has history in Ireland and Scotland.....
My great great grandpa came to Canada in 1830,settled in Ontario. He married an Iroquois woman,so he was chastised by many around him for being Irish, and having a native wife. Their son,my great grandpa,helped build the railroad across this nation,as a track layer and Hunter. I’m pretty damn proud of my heritage. Also had two family members die in steerage on the Titanic, found their names in the ship’s passenger logs when exhibit came to my city.
Another occasion when I remember that James VI was known in his own time as "The wisest fool in Christendom."
Another thought provoking video tackled with humour and sensitivity thanks again Bruce
Glad you enjoyed it
Only a couple of minutes in this fella had me cracking up laughing. I think I was expecting a po-faced David Starkey type.
I then spent five minutes translating the Scots Gaelic on his T-Shirt. ‘I hope it is a good day’. It was annoying me because I could see the similarities to Irish. But could not get it all. Google Translate to the rescue.
Anyway this man gets a like from me for the introduction alone!
Why is Mr Bruce not on TV...know one explains The history of Scotland and Ireland so WELL ☘️💚👌
Maybe because he asks too many difficult questions. Can you really see the BBC airing this video for instance?
Ah thanks Lynne
@@richardhallyburton why not things may change fingers crossed
@@ScotlandHistoryTours I mean it ive learnt a lot at 60 if only youd been around in my younger days your and exceptional historian U don't know why you haven't been snapped up ..For the children as they say knowledge is power
If only the violent minority in N. Ireland as a whole (both sides) could engage in discussion like you.
We can't do more than hope.
Since I watch your videos on TH-cam on my TV, I forget to comment. So this refers to all I’ve seen so far: they are great. Not only do I learn but I see places to add to my next trip. Since you’re no traveler, maybe we can meet for a pint when I get to Perth. I’ll let you know when I’m heading there! Keep the videos coming, Pal.
Some people will never stop fighting foreign occupation, the Irish have a song which contains the lyrics “for 800 years we’ve fought you without fear, and we’ll fight you for 800 more”
Oh we're not saxon we're not English we're not British. We're Irish and we're proud to be. So fuck your union Jack we want out country back. We want to see old Ireland free once more
Yeah that’s why they happily fought for an English King(and lost) against King Billy
And the atatude & sentiment contained within that song is the problem.
Old James VI sounds like a right barrels of laughs.
😁
Love the channel, Bruce. Keep up the good work.
Just discovered your channel and I got to say your work is fantastic. I'm binging your videos on a quiet bank holliday work shift.
Welcome aboard!
I guess I come from those:"Hillbillies In America' . My Gradfather grew corn in Vriginia, He felt it was easier to sell it in "Liquid Form' What i'd give to sample his 'brand'. 😀
Another informative and entertaining video! My father's side of the family traces its roots back to County Antrim and County Derry with 8% from Scotland. It looks like my ancestors took part in a wee bit of nonpartisan "negotiations".
It's county Londonderry.
It was never known as county Derry.
Prior to 1613, when Derry became Londonderry, the county was known as county Coleraine.
@@geordiewishart1683 , that's what Ancestry DNA called it.
As a hillbilly Melungeon Scots-Irish Irish Catholic Etc. ‘Merican, I find your presentations aggravatingly enlightening.
I'm glad
Yet another thought provoking video. Well done sir!
Thank you kindly!
You had me laughing. Great channel my friend. I've been educating a south African about British history because his education system basically said English bad. British diamond thieves. Apparently the Queen is looking after a huge diamond in her crown and they want it back. She's only minding it for them.
If you mean the Koh-I-Noor diamond, it's from India.
@@liampaterson3424 not sure which diamond mate but what ever it is they want it back 🤣🤣
Not to mention the concentration camps installed by the english during the Boer War.
@@billmcintosh3555 arrh they were just early butlins camps
@@billmcintosh3555 Installed by the British.
it makes me sad Gaelic was basically violently abolished. taking someone native tongue is worse than taking their literal tongue.
😪
As an Irishman who cannot express myself in my native tongue, I wholeheartedly agree with your comment, I feel like there is a part of myself missing, a yearning for true expression
Conversely though it's why I think Ireland has produced many great writers, dramatists, poets, lyricists because we have a unique way of making the language work for us, for trying to express something that we (literally) don't have the words for.
I like that he asks questions to make you think
Bruce , you're an honest man - working to be an honest historian. We shouldn't let our familial or cultural leanings colour our understanding of History. Emotional imagination and empathy for all peoples . I wish I had a History teacher like you . Honest man . Slainte .
You would have hated me when I was teaching physics😂
@@ScotlandHistoryTours Hahahaha, nice one.
This is one of your most balanced videos. You've expressed a clear bias many times before and although some is still present, at least it is couched in open questions this time, which I appreciated. Encouragement to debate is extremely healthy. We can't end up getting all polarised and entrenched like American news causes.
Find me someone with no bias and I'll show you a shit game of lawn bowls
@@ScotlandHistoryTours oh I agree with you. It's fair impossible to remove yourself from the centre of your own universe. I more mean to shine a light on your intellectual perogative as an educator, not that English bashing isn't fun, I write this from Aberdeen, however...
No, that's it. :0)
A'reyt Bruce. Interesting question at the end. My girlfriend's Irish Catholic ancestors went out into what was their empire too under the Union. They returned home, but to England. She is half Irish, but her family from the south have not lived there for a century. Funny old world. Now they are Yorkshire Catholics. Guy Fawkes was one by the way. Not all British changed to Protestant.
What's the difference between an Irish person and an Irish Catholic? Don't you think it's a little racey to be singling out someone's religion, and nationality?
Yorkshire Catholics now? You're at it son 🤣
@@vegvisirphotography5632 I only commented after the video had raised the settlers as being Protestant and British. My point was that this was not the whole picture and I tried to show this using how people I knew self identified, not to label anyone.
P.S. some friends from the city I grew up in attended the Catholic school called "Yorkshire Martyrs" if an example was needed.
@@alansmithee8831 Scotland is full of Irish Catholic settlers,even got the biggest football team!
@@Sandwich13455 True, but the family I spoke of were more likely to support Rangers - Berwick Rangers. Their having worked for the empire might not have gone down well in their original home town in 1920s.
@@alansmithee8831 loads of Irish Catholics fought against the central/axis powers in both world wars for Britain.
Bruce another brilliant video and I appreciate your content on Irish-Scottish history.
As someone that does earnestly aspire to unification on the island and a lover of history, might I suggest a really interesting topic for you. It is messy and gruesome and challenges the modern entities of the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland. And even the supposed loyalties of those of both groups, native and settler.
The 1798 rebellion was led by the United Irishmen. An organisation that was led by mostly Protestants and of those mostly Scottish Dissenters in Ulster.
Alongside the Huguenot descendant Theobald Wolfe Tone, Anglican James Napper Tandy there were Presbyterians Henry Joy McCracken, James Orr; Ulster-Scots’ answer to Robert Burns, Samuel Neilson; editor of the Northern Star (which was in a twist destroyed in a raid by the Monaghan Militia (South Ulster) a unit primarily made up of Catholics who tried to show their loyalty after some of their unit had publicly announced they were United Irishmen.
I could go on with the list of men that were part of the Rebellion, but basically it was inspired by the US and French Revolutions and sought to rise above the sectarian hatred that had kept emancipation of Catholics a pipe dream until 40 years later.
However it’s failure and noble aims are overshadowed by what is widely seen as a pretty sectarian event, where upon seeing a rather indiscriminate massacre at nearby New Ross in the aftermath of its capture by the British Army, Militia and Yeomanry, rebels rounded up suspected “loyalists” mostly men women and children of Protestant faith, between 100-200 people that had been taken prisoner during the Rebellion were murdered in a barn by setting it alight and killing those that attempted to escape.
Though again such was the complication of the time, some 20 of the people massacred were actually Catholic and 3 of the 17 guards of the people were Protestant, with one even admitting to attacking those fleeing with his pike.
Another interesting strand I found from another history lover recently was that eastern English speaking rebels attacked western Irish speaking rebels simply because they couldn’t understand one another and the Irish speaking rebels were suspected loyalists ironically
Yes, this is well-known in Ireland as the not-so-religious revolutionaries all worked together: Benjamin Franklin stayed at Hillsborough Castle, Thomas Paine - another Founding Father of the USA, author of 'The Rights of Man' was admitted to the United Irishmen. Burke who was MP and the darling of the Tories supported the Americans but not the French. (Maybe) The reason the British 'subsumed' the Irisg Parliament was in order to curb the Revolutionary zeal ? Napper Tandy btw was listed by Napoleon in the Treaty of Amiens as a person who ought to be released before signing the Treaty.
I'm from Wales, done an ancestry DNA turns out only 20% welsh, 50% Irish (Derry) and 30% Scottish. I knew had family in Derry but the scottish was a surprise, now I know why. great vid.
a brilliant presentation ,i am from county armagh ,left in the mid 1970s ,emigrated to new zealand ,lived there for 42 years ,similar things happened there in nz (aotearoa) ...............kia kaha ,keep up the great work
Many Ulster Irish like the McDonnells & MacSweeneys were actually just earlier Scottish settlers.
Yeah they formed from mercenaries Irish taoisigh would employ from Scotland in their inter clan conflicts. And you can even plot the geographic concentration of those surnames to specific events. McSweeney and McDonnell are surnames concentrated in north west Ulster and south west Munster.
Because the dominate McCarthy tuath in Munster was challenged by a resurgence of the O’Brien tuath, and the McCarthy Mór felt he no longer could trust his own subordinates, who might transfer to supporting the O’Briens, so purchased the mercenary services of the McSweeneys and McDonnells to boost his numbers, in exchange for giving them land in Cork. Where the surnames are now among the most common in Cork.
Scottish chieftains would do the same. Often most worried about being usurped from within by cousins or brothers, so would surround themselves with hired Irish mercenaries. Who would settle in Scotland.
@@cianoc8211 The Gallowglass, but if you go back even further the Brigantes sent thousands to fight inter tribal wars in Ireland before the Roman's!
@@paulrimmer2853 I’ve seen that name ‘Brigantes’ before, on a Roman map of Ireland showing all their names for our different tribes. Brigantes were the name for the tribe in the south east (Wexford area)…and the name was also in coastal bits of Britain and France where you could easily sail to Ireland.
All interesting stuff.
Well, here is my theory:
After the Norman invasion, the people in the North of England had to suffer The Harrying of the North. 75% of the population were murdered or had fled, never to return. Whole villages and towns were laid waste; crops destroyed; animals slaughtered; wells poisoned; every man, woman and child was put to the sword.
Slightly less than 400 years down the line, Henry V (Norman invader stock) was said to have defeated the French at Agincourt. He was seen as 'English'. Henry IV, his father, was the first king to speak English as his first language. So, their rule was accepted. It could be viewed as the dead people of the north can't protest any more and the people of the south, meekly accepting their subservience, but really, the Normans assimilated. They made alliances with the English nobility, many of whom were left in positions of power. There was inclusion and reciprocity, culminating in that assimilation.
The Ottoman Empire treated the Greeks in the same way the Normans treated the north of England. The Turks held Greece for 400 years and never got the Greeks to accept their overlordship. There was constant rebellion and an eventual overthrow of the Turks.
The difference, to my mind, is that The Greeks and Turks (Persians) had a long history of conflict; they had a different religion; the Turks tried to impose a new structural order, which denied people the same rights. They restricted any advancement of Greek control; remained aloof - in conqueror mode - and never assimilated at all.
The Romans behaved like The Normans - ruthless, but willing to include the local population in governance, respect their religion and assimilate, to a large extent. (Although, the Normans and English had the same religion).
In Ireland, the Scots and English behaved like the Turks and therefore, were never accepted.
That is my theory, for what it is worth.
A chunk of my heritage is Connaught Irish. with apparently some historic West Scotland and Orcadian in my veins too. I have got a lot of Irish cousin DNA matches.
But when I traced one of my English ancestry lines back to this period I discovered that a paternal ancestors, fought in the Nine Years war; was knighted at the battle of Arklow and led the cavalry troops that captured the Spanish commander at Kinsale.
And on a note regarding other things Scottish pertaining, his grandson, kid brother of my a 8x something great-grandmother actually drafted and steered through the Treaty of Union between Scotland and England. I l half believe he might have been part motivated by a desire to give the Scots a lousy deal; there by revenging the suffering caused to Cornwall, many years earlier, by having to pay taxes for Henry VIIs war in Scotland 1490s which sparked rebellion in the South-West. As they say revenge is a dish best served cold. Just another whacko conspiracy theory no doubt.
Anyway love your content.
The turks aren't Persian. Not back then or now.
@@lucabrasi8420 I know, that is why I put it in brackets, but the Persian Empire covered Turkey and so the enmity between Turkey and Greece can be dated as far back as the Persian Empire.
"At what point is it right to accept defeat?" Many defeats were accepted by the Irish over the centuries; and treaties, truces, and agreements were made with the English. The treaties were broken, promises reneged on, civil rights and justice denied, discrimination rampant, and corruption in the establishment was rife. The oppressive undemocratic regime was sustained through military force. The settlers from Britain excluded the Irish from rights granted to themselves.
Writers related first-hand accounts of the oppressive conditions in Ireland and the hostility this created in the people:
"Consequences have flowed from these oppressions which ought long ago to have put a stop to them.
it is manifest that the gentlemen of Ireland never thought of a radical cure from overlooking the real cause of the disease, which in fact lay in themselves, and not in the wretches they doomed to the gallows.
Let them change their own conduct entirely, and the poor will not long riot. Treat them like men who ought to be as free as yourselves.
Put an end to that system of religious persecution which for seventy years has divided the kingdom against itself, in these two circumstances lie the cure of insurrection." - Arthur Young
"Religious bitterness is carried very far in this neighbourhood; and this may be mainly ascribed to the recent institution of an Orange lodge. If government will apply such remedial measures as the state of Ireland requires, and will present a firm front to all improper demands, there will be no occasion for Orange lodges. The results of this ill-judged zeal are strikingly displayed at Gorey.
There is a Protestant and a Catholic Inn - known by these names; the Protestant and the Catholic coach, owned by, driven by, and supported by, persons of different persuasions; and the very children playing, or squabbling in the street are divided into sects.
These are miserable doings, for which the institutors of the Orange lodge have to answer." - Henry David Inglis
"the Catholic population, excluded from public employments, liberal professions, prohibited from becoming proprietors, incapable through poverty of engaging in commerce or manufacture, even if it had not been prevented by the political condition of the country, having absolutely no career open but that of farming -
a population which, abandoned to itself, has no light to guide its efforts, finds no sympathy to assuage its passions, and is reduced to look to its rude instincts for the means of safety and protection.
When you have reached this point, you may be well assured that all rigorous means to restore peace and order will be useless.
All your rigorous measures to restore peace and order will be abortive, because the order you design to make supreme is actual discord; because the peace you wish to establish is violence and oppression.
This violence, this oppression, this disorder, have produced a state of war; and this social war is not between the honest man and the malefactor, between the labourer and the idler, between the industrious man and the robber, - it is between the rich and the poor, between the master and the slave, between the proprietor and the cultivator; and this war has arisen because the selfishness of the rich has been carried to an excess which necessarily drove the poor to revolt.
Now say what are the means to escape from this vicious circle? Here is an aristocracy that, either by its faults or its vices, has allowed such a mass of evil to accumulate in the country entrusted to its care, that the wretches on whom the burden presses, shake it off from sheer inability to sustain it longer.
There is on longer a social state: it is war - it is anarchy." - Gustave de Beaumont
Thanks for your video on the Scots-Irish.
I'm an Australian. My great grandfather, Nixon Fife emigrated from Enniskillen, Northern Ireland and it always baffled me as our surname is most definitely Scottish.
Lots of us Enniskillen born
@@joprocter4573 Planters
@@maskellmaolseachlainn6347 no such thing
@@joprocter4573 Highly likely. How else?
Brilliant video, Bruce! Seumas VI (hope he’s wailing in his grave at that one) couldn’t wait to p*** off the London, and leave the country of his birth. Same as all those Gaelic chiefs whose accents are far from native.
In Eire, these days there are those who frown on the speaking of Irish, and think Eire should be “progressive”. We have people in Scotland who rail against Gaelic in schools or bilingual road signs.
Divide and conquer- the opposite of Chick’s apparent intentions, but EXACTLY what he wanted to achieve.
He was, and still is, a CU Next Tuesday.
Those that frown on the Irish language are usually from an Ulster Scot heritage. Eire lol ffs
@@cathaloconnell536 from the mouths of friends in the Republic. Don’t shoot the messenger. The loyalists in the north are akin to those over here, but it doesn’t hide the fact that the Irish people I worked with in Dublin and Cork mostly told me: “..we learned Irish at school, but I don’t remember most of it…”
@@EKcyclist think that’s more an indictment of our education system than a genuine lack of interest.
They make it compulsory and dull and you mainly read and write and seldom speak Irish.
I hated the subject in school but I rue the fact I can’t speak what is the native tongue of my ancestors
@@beaglaoich4418 ah that makes perfect sense- thanks for that perspective 👍.
Fascinating video once again Bruce. I’m a Borderer and the more I call myself that, the more I’m confused as to what that means. The Borderers / Reivers / Scots Irish fought each other for decades and some were moved to Northern Ireland to establish another fight between Northern and Southern Ireland. They then went America to become the HillBillies of the Appalachians. HillBillies meaning William of Orange people who were mountains people. It seems that the traits of these people included the liking for a good fight. The famous feud of the Hatfields and the McCoys was conducted largely by Borderers.
Daniel Boon, and his Borderers went on to move East over the mountains to further explore America. Davy Crockett and Jim Bowie, both Scots Irish or Borderers heard about a shitfight going on down at the Alamo and headed off there. 80% of the men at the Alamo were Scots Irish. An annual ceremony at the Alamo includes a Scottish knees up. I don’t know what all this proves other than fighting tends to have people move around the world a lot. Myself, I moved to Australia to get away from it all. Except that a large percentage of the Borderers / Reivers became Bush Rangers, including Ned Kelly. Ah well, ye kanny win. 😂😂👍
Well, James VI certainly tried ethnic cleansing with Clan Gregor in 1603 when he proscribed the MacGregor name, the proscription was lifted by Charles II in 1663, the MacGregor name was proscribed again in 1688 by William III. The persecution of Clan Gregor was finally abolished by George III in 1774.
I made a video about that
Nova Scotia in Canada is New Scotland. At the end. under all those layers that separate the Scottish and Irish both are Celtic in origin.
Excellent question. How long can invaders be resisted. A question that nobody can answer
I'll be honest I didn't think they could, but I thought it was a question worth asking
@@ScotlandHistoryTours I can remember an argument about slavery I was in. I really didn't have a side but I asked should the Normandy French pay reparations for the invasion of England? The answer I was given was absolutely not. I was told that it happened too long ago. Well how much time? Who decides? My closing statement was nobody has a guilt free past. Historically everyone has blood on their hands. Right now all anyone can do is try not to get blood on theirs.
Scotland: 'Our historical relationship with our larger neighbour is very problematic and marked by invasion, exploitation, extreme violence and extremely murky and complicated politics involving many forms of cultural and religious bigotry.'
Ireland: 'Hold my beer.'
My ancestors that came from Ireland were Scottish only a few generations before. Married Scottish girls even then.
I really admire what you do. It's like a mission from God to show us our past. The good and bad. Thank you✌
Wow. You pushed many of my buttons. As a descendant of Shugg Montgomery, with maternal Ukrainian Grandparents, living on unceded territory of the Anishinabe in Canada, and my best friend being a recent emigrant from Ireland, (who speaks fluent Irish), I really enjoyed this episode. Ireland, I am proud to say, will accept 500,000 Ukrainian refugees. The parallel between the Irish "famine" and the Ukrainian famine imposed by Stalin is tragic, as is the madman Putin and those who emulate him....
My Scots-Irish gr gr gr grandfather left Ulster (County Antrim) in the middle of the 18th century as a religious dissenter (we were Quakers), looking for freedom. With the brutal state crackdown on our FREEDOM CONVOY in Canada (read Senator Sharon Keogan's recent comments in the Oireachtas Eireann), a ruling party coalition intent on stifling free speech, and a Prime Minister who gets his kicks making fun of people of colour by dressing up in blackface, there is a silent exodus of Canadians. My mate from work is preparing to return to Ireland. It things get worse in Canada, it may be time to re-trace my ancestor's footsteps to Scotland or Ireland. Bruce I really enjoy your videos.
"I am proud to say, will accept 500,000 Ukrainian refugees" That's nothing to be proud of, they're letting those refuges because the corrupt government is being bribed, in a country that doesn't have the infrastructure to take them in.
And of course, the to-ing and fro-ing of people/language/culture/theology between Scotland, the north of Ireland and the north of England went back waaaay further anyway... With a whole lot of different power relations (though fewer contentious remains).
Wonderful telling of a complex history... Wish we'd had this at school.
It may be good to remember that England is the Central and Southern tip, Cymru is now the Mid-Western part of Britain and Scotland inhabited by the Scoti/Irish is still and always will be the Northern tip of Britain.
Many Scots-Irish here in Appalachia. Not being welcome, by even the home country still is a trait among these people. They are weary of outsiders and are very clannish, good, bad, or indifferent, it's interesting none the less.
“ Hahaha Whatta story, Mark” - The Room - 2003
Good job, my man. Big fan