Don't get me wrong, the top hill climb riders are super strong, but there are many world tour riders who would beat them easily. For example, Victor Campenaerts does 2 min intervals at 670w (almost 10 w/kg) in training. Everything that is longer than 1 or maybe 2 minutes is extremely strongly correlated with FTP.
"Easily"...doubtful. What separates World Tour is they can do around 600 watts for 3 minutes at the end of a 100+ mile race/stage. Just because they can do that doesn't mean they can do much more fresh.
@derekvanhoose6815 I don't disagree. Our disagreement probably only stems from my use of "easily". With that I just mean that for many world tour riders this would not be a PR effort, but for sure such an effort hurts like hell, even for Pogi.
@@joeskipper91 Yeah, he talked about them in a video on his channel. 3x 2min: 1st @ 670w, 2nd @ 630w, 3rd @ 600w (he was about 68kg that time normally.)(th-cam.com/video/NYvrxt6xXLw/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=VictorCampenaerts)
Joe! Thanks for tuning in. I used to race against you way back at Hog Hill - it's great to see you absolutely smashing the triathlon scene nowadays 🙌 ^Owen
Pogacar did 7w/kg for 40 minutes on Plateau de Beille in the third week of the tour. I think you would be stunned how easy he would beat the other guy.
I would love to see Marc Cavendish in a hilllclimb. He is superstrong but carrys more heavy muscles than those who are climboptimized. He is able to put out extreme power after beeing a lot exhausted.
@@StopTheRot That and technique (and of course power and fastness), he looks like the best at aeroposition when sprinting standing, which dont help the most in climbs.
A good comparison maybe with Ed Laverack who does more longer climbs. On Sa Colabra 10.27km Tom Pidcock has KOM 25:32 with Ed at 26:45 (very similar power). But Illi Gardner is the QOM at 31:09 - on published Strava so there could be a number that are not public. Ed has said that he is not doing the Hill Climb Champs in 2025, but he did win it in 2019? - maybe he is the only other person to have beaten Andrew Feather in recent years?
I knew a uk pro that was 63kg and could put out 518 for 5 mins; 840 for 1 minute; 425 for 20 minutes. He’d easily have been able to do 600+ watts for 3 minutes, at 63kg. He didn’t get any higher than 6th GC in Langkawi and about 40th in Brabantse Pijl. People like Pogacar are utterly insane. As you implied, NO CHANCE!
Yeah, there would be a fair few riders who would beat Harry, but there are a surprising number who wouldn't. People seem to think that being in the WorldTour instantly makes a rider better at every single aspect of riding, but that's not really the case - hence where this fun little conversation came from. ^Owen
@monument_hq absolutely. What would be interesting is to give both the same goal for 6weeks. Which is a fresh short uphill TT. Be interesting to see how many he'd beat then. The world tour lads would have to eat Harry's diet though. Let's keep this fair!!
A good indicator of the difference between world tour riders and the UK's best domestic hill climbers is the Monsal Head hill climb organised each year by Sheffrec CC. The course record of 1 minute 14 seconds was set back in 1981 (!!) by Malcolm Elliot, a British world tour sprinter (or whatever the equivalent was back then for the top tier of continental racing). Being such a short climb, it favours absolute rather than relative power, and Malcolm would certainly not be considered a climber. Same for Chris Boardman, definitely not a 'climber' in the pro peloton, but still as you note a National Hill Climb Champion. Harry Mac, Andrew Feather, Tom Bell, Ed Laverack (all National Hill Climb champions) et al are all phenomenal athletes, but I think they'd be the first to admit that they'd be no match for today's world tour galacticos like Pogacar and Vingegaard on any climb.
The subject is wasted conversation......and to ask it means these guys just don't realize how good Pogocar is, its another level lads....
We made it pretty clear that Pogacar would smoke anyone up any length of climb in the UK
So you need to change the title of the link...@@FullBeansCyclingCompany
Don't get me wrong, the top hill climb riders are super strong, but there are many world tour riders who would beat them easily. For example, Victor Campenaerts does 2 min intervals at 670w (almost 10 w/kg) in training. Everything that is longer than 1 or maybe 2 minutes is extremely strongly correlated with FTP.
"Easily"...doubtful. What separates World Tour is they can do around 600 watts for 3 minutes at the end of a 100+ mile race/stage. Just because they can do that doesn't mean they can do much more fresh.
@derekvanhoose6815 I don't disagree. Our disagreement probably only stems from my use of "easily". With that I just mean that for many world tour riders this would not be a PR effort, but for sure such an effort hurts like hell, even for Pogi.
Does he really do intervals at that high a power output?
@@joeskipper91 Yeah, he talked about them in a video on his channel. 3x 2min: 1st @ 670w, 2nd @ 630w, 3rd @ 600w (he was about 68kg that time normally.)(th-cam.com/video/NYvrxt6xXLw/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=VictorCampenaerts)
Joe! Thanks for tuning in. I used to race against you way back at Hog Hill - it's great to see you absolutely smashing the triathlon scene nowadays 🙌 ^Owen
Pogacar did 7w/kg for 40 minutes on Plateau de Beille in the third week of the tour. I think you would be stunned how easy he would beat the other guy.
I would love to see Marc Cavendish in a hilllclimb. He is superstrong but carrys more heavy muscles than those who are climboptimized. He is able to put out extreme power after beeing a lot exhausted.
His numbers have always been poor. I think his main strength is probably recovery from efforts.
@@StopTheRot That and technique (and of course power and fastness), he looks like the best at aeroposition when sprinting standing, which dont help the most in climbs.
A good comparison maybe with Ed Laverack who does more longer climbs. On Sa Colabra 10.27km Tom Pidcock has KOM 25:32 with Ed at 26:45 (very similar power). But Illi Gardner is the QOM at 31:09 - on published Strava so there could be a number that are not public. Ed has said that he is not doing the Hill Climb Champs in 2025, but he did win it in 2019? - maybe he is the only other person to have beaten Andrew Feather in recent years?
World tour guys would cook them. MvDP did 560w for almost 6 min. Safe to say he could hit 100w more for 2 min
Good memory… CB “As a senior he won four consecutive hill climb championships (from 1988 to 1991)”
I knew a uk pro that was 63kg and could put out 518 for 5 mins; 840 for 1 minute; 425 for 20 minutes. He’d easily have been able to do 600+ watts for 3 minutes, at 63kg. He didn’t get any higher than 6th GC in Langkawi and about 40th in Brabantse Pijl. People like Pogacar are utterly insane. As you implied, NO CHANCE!
I dunno lads, I'd say at world tour level there'd be 70kg guys that'd annihilate that guy!?
Yeah, there would be a fair few riders who would beat Harry, but there are a surprising number who wouldn't. People seem to think that being in the WorldTour instantly makes a rider better at every single aspect of riding, but that's not really the case - hence where this fun little conversation came from. ^Owen
@monument_hq absolutely. What would be interesting is to give both the same goal for 6weeks. Which is a fresh short uphill TT. Be interesting to see how many he'd beat then. The world tour lads would have to eat Harry's diet though. Let's keep this fair!!
@@colmsheahan6991 I love the sound of this! Though I fear Harry's diet is his secret weapon 😆😆
Great content guys 😊....u've earned a new supporter😊.... cheers from Piran(Slovenia)👏🙏🐐🌈👍✌️👽🔥💪🇸🇮🇬🇧
Thanks very much for watching! 🙏
A good indicator of the difference between world tour riders and the UK's best domestic hill climbers is the Monsal Head hill climb organised each year by Sheffrec CC. The course record of 1 minute 14 seconds was set back in 1981 (!!) by Malcolm Elliot, a British world tour sprinter (or whatever the equivalent was back then for the top tier of continental racing). Being such a short climb, it favours absolute rather than relative power, and Malcolm would certainly not be considered a climber. Same for Chris Boardman, definitely not a 'climber' in the pro peloton, but still as you note a National Hill Climb Champion. Harry Mac, Andrew Feather, Tom Bell, Ed Laverack (all National Hill Climb champions) et al are all phenomenal athletes, but I think they'd be the first to admit that they'd be no match for today's world tour galacticos like Pogacar and Vingegaard on any climb.
Pog can do this at the end of a 250km race 😅
Harry Mac the goat 🎉
100% 👑
Is this a joke😂. Harry Mas.😂
Was a super short course though! Feather or Ed need longer course. Harry still brilliant though well deserved win
True! Harry definitely has that short duration power that comes through on the crit scene as well.
Are you guys serious ?? LOOOL !!!!!!