Roofing in the Wilderness - Thatch - Townsends Wilderness Homestead
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ส.ค. 2022
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![How Thatch Roofs Work and Were Made in the Middle Ages [Medieval Professions: Thatcher]](/img/n.gif)
In ireland anyway this was collected in December to late January and dried until March/April, it has to be cut cleanly with a scythe or a sickle or it will rot quickly. It gets bundled and cut to useful lengths, it is held to the structure using scollops (normally hazel) and pushed into place with a legget or biddle. The pitch of the roof must allow for the rain to drain quickly and for snow to not stick, both could destroy the integrity of the roof. There is a channel in Ireland that has built a celtic round house and they go into detail about the process albeit from a modern perspective. just look up celtic round house and you should find it if interested.
What an awesome comment; I had never heard of a legget or a biddle before! There are many results for a search of "celtic round house" -- Do you know the name of the channel?
@@old_scaly I think the channel they are referencing is "Smooth Gefixt." It is a couple of guys that built a full roundhouse, they did an awesome job and used tools and skills from the time period. Love their work, I think they started building it a couple for years ago so they have over 25 videos about it!
Smooth Gefixt! Great build, super informative.
Very Very good to know. Thank you! I will keep on keeping on to make things work correctly.
Very different plant they're using for their roof though. The reeds they're using have an immensely longer use life than cat-tails do. Cat-tails don't last long and are fine for a temporary structure, or something that can be easily re-roofed, like this structure, bit are terrible for the sort of structure that Smooth Gefixt are making. And their thatch roof is much thicker as it's meant to be waterproof in the rain and to hold in heat. The one made in this video will likely leak a good bit in the rain (still better than being out in it), and is more meant for simple shade and cooling.
Thatching like that works great for providing shade, but you need a steep incline to keep the rain out.
Yep, that way it runs down really fast and doesn't soak into the thatch. They need a much sharper pitch to that roof for the water to run down fast enough. I got into watching videos about thatching one day and spent well over 4 hours doing nothing but was people thatch roofs, repair thatched roofs, talk about how steep the roof needs to be for the rain to drain properly, how really thick the thatch needs to be, How each bundle needs to be pretty large, and how very much each row of thatch needs to overlap the row under it. Well, I did those things interspersed with getting more coffee and getting rid of the coffee I had already drunk, if you get my drift.
Keep in mind they are experimenting and they might be working off an example they researched.
You need a slope to channel the rain fall to the ground so it doesn’t settle anywhere on the roof
Ah yes the couch thatchers, If only we all knew as much.
@@zachmyer9001 Snark all you wish. It doesn't make them wrong. When Townsends makes a video next spring to show us how much of that thatch rotted through, he will say the same thing: "We need a steeper pitch on this roof if we want the thatch to last." Perhaps you'll listen to it from him.
See how it goes. Certainly looks great for a first try! Typically, you'd expect a thatched roof to do better wtih a steeper pitch. It's really reliant on the water running freely away. On such a flat, pent roof, some clean bark, or shingles might do better. But all of those will be challenged by such a low pitch.
100% But I have never been to the American climate, its just rain, rain, then some more rain here in England
@@tbrowniscool usually, more constant rain will keep a natural type roof sealed more.
Depending on location here in the US, it may be more constant, or more intermittent. Typically, shingles or shakes will provide better protection here, especially in the north east.
In America it depends on where you live. Up North and Coastal regions are definitely wet.🌧 Where I
live in the Southwest. 🏜 Not so wet. 🌞
@@jameshaulenbeek5931 Just for an example when I had my little whippet puppy she did a pee on a doormat/small carpet. I didn't care so put out in the washing line thinking it will get soaked then dry.... It was out there for 3 months and never dried.. So trash of course. We have a strange climate 😂
It's a big place! And like the UK, there are different climate regions. Reflected in modern building regs, same as the UK. West coast Scotland has very different requirements for roofing than down in the English midlands, and that's a big change over only 300 or so miles. Anywhere that has those kinds of reeds, and lush deciduous forest is going to get plenty of heavy rain through the seasons!
I have a lot of thatched roofs near me in the UK and the cool thing is the patterns they inlay and they often have hares and other animals made out of hay on the top.
The animals on the thatching are traditionally the "signature" of the thatcher. It was done to show who laid the thatch to any passerby and advertise the quality and standard of his work to prospective clients.
That's so cool
@@jcorbett9620 much like a maker's mark stamped in the underside of metal wares? Interesting!
Ryan looking like an absolute boss with that pipe. Doesn't matter the job, big man gets it done in style.
Ahhh Ivy! She has really grown up... great to see her.
Some years ago, looking for craft materials that would fit under our nonexistent budget, my wife and I found stands of cattails on private land where the owner allowed us to cut some for use. Sweetie learned how to plait cattail reeds and leaves into just about every shape. Using them for roof thatching honestly never crossed my mind, but it makes sense.
I'm pretty sure that a thatched roof wants as steep a roof pitch as you can put it on.
Cooking history, building history and living it. Livin the dream....
Thatching usually has a pretty steep pitch, often 45° or more.
We would call that a 12/12 pitch. 12 inches of rise for every , 12 inch of run
One way to control all those ends dangling into the shelter would be to somewhat loosely weave large mats out of cattails and place those on the purlins first. Then put the thatch atop that, and tie down through the matting to the purlins. It provides a nicer looking ceiling, & reduces the risk of random bits of thatching from falling onto your workspace. The drawback is that it does take more time & materials.
That explains why, when I was watching them thatch in the Green River series, they first put down a layer of heather, I think it was. As a woody plant, it has a lot more firmness, so it would not sag down as much or let smaller bits through.
All thatched roofs have some material as an underlayment, whether it be ferns, hay or reeds. It gives the thatch something to lay on and the thatcher a material to attached the thatch to other than the roofing beams. This is a great experiment and I hope it goes well!
I have seen a few pictures of thatched log cabins in Nebraska. The Stur Museum in Grand Island have an excellent picture of one from the 1860s.
Really I'd like to see a video like this finished out with a water test. Either when it is raining or, if available, with a hose to see how well it works. My suspicion is that with it being so flat the water will filter through more than run off but I'd love to see it tested.
I too hope Townsend gives an update (posts comment or does another video).
That looks great, side note, you can eat bulrush roots, roasted on an open fire then peeled, it's thought they were a staple and important food source in England.
Native Americans used bullrush roots pretty much like we use potatoes today. The roots were a significant source of carbohydrates for them, especially for those who lived in wetter lower country.
@@bunnyslippers191 That's interesting, i wonder if the early settlers eat them, you'd think so as they were used in the UK.
Unfortunately bullrushes (aka Cattails) are superb absorbers of toxic metals so you need to be careful of where you source those plants these days
Next time it rains, try to capture some footage from underneath the thatching. Let it know how it works!
whoever films/edits the videos does such a great job 🙌
For sure!
Editing on this channel has always been superb. I couldnt agree more
Between this and Primitive Technology, I have knowledge at my fingertips to go and make my own wood and fired clay house out in the woods somewhere.
This, liziqi ( and the like), townsend, English heritage are how i learned a lot
The real key to building a clay house is long overhangs on the roof. Keeps it from washing away. You can do the same with modern houses and not have to use gutters, which is a nice look if done right.
Now you need Steve1989 to teach you to eat 100 year old food.
@@MrClarkisgod Yes, they have the roof slope to low
You'd probably enjoy Mr. Chickadee Similar early style construction content with a little more focus on woodworking and house framing.
Your videos are not only educational and entertaining they are just down right food for my soul. Thank you so so much for all that y’all bring us.
for thatch to work effectively i think you need more of an incline on the roof. i live in the south of england. in the country around you will find many thatched houses. the minimum pitch of the roof on those houses is 45 degrees.
I agree. Alex Langlands, Peter Ginn, and Ruth Goodman have done a number of series for the BBC about life of the lower to middling sort in the early 15th c, early 17th c and the late 19th c. These are on TH-cam. See, for example, Tudor Monastery Farm, Tales From the Green Valley, and Edwardian Farm.They worked with thatching experts. A steep roof pitch was essential; otherwise the thatch would rot.
I don't think they're too much worried about rot as they are about a roof to accomplish a task under. It looks like the roof might have taken maybe 8 hours to put up. If it rots in a year or two they can do it again. Modern thatching is much more painstaking and expensive. This little gazebo leans more toward the "git 'er done" side of things.
@@bobcostas9716 it is not rot that concerns me but the ability of the roof to shed water. with so low a pitch i don't think that will shed water very effectively, consequently it will leak.
Lots of thatch in some part of England to this day. I lived in a 500 year old stone cottage with a thatched roof in Wiltshire.
Native Americans were also known to use this method in some cases. And in some cases people did what is called double threshing where you lay down the first layer and then added another layer on that. You can also after you had it biult over time as it gets holes repair those holes very easily by patching it. LoL. Some people also used the threshing and fined weaved it then took clay and other things and sealed it... basically making a clay roof. There used to be a building (a very old barn) on my family's farm that had a roof like this, and to seal it they'd repair any holes, then use clay and something else...I don't know what it was probably pine tar or something LoL. It unfortunately was destroyed during a storm when a pecan limb crushed it, but it was basically falling apart by then.
Waiting for the first rain test, or atleast a garden hose test.
When I was in the Boy Scouts in the 60's we did something similar for many Trips to the same Lake and left our tents at home.. We also ate the Hearts and Roots of the Cattail... Nice to see it being taught again...
Important note about "whether they did that here": Thatching was the standard roofing material for Native American longhouses, which were commonly used throughout the western portion of the great eastern forest of North America.
Seems like it was the same deal down here along the Gulf Coast. I've seen models of ancient Creek/Muskogee houses that were thatched.
I think he meant specifically on if colonial settlers had used it at all. Most likely they did at first based on observation and advice from native neighbors until more supplies and skilled roofers came to the colonies. So you would be correct, that Native American tribes and cultures would have used it for centuries before settlers came, and as for the settlers themselves, most likely they did.
The great things about experimental archaeology are that you are 1) doing something in which you are interested and 2) learning something. Given that, each experiment is a success as you did something in which you were interested and you will always learn something!
Thatching is high art among traditional professional thatchers. Always wondered how it would be if one attempted this as a novice.
Think it is the shrinkage after drying that may cause most of your woes...
The pitch will cause most of the woes. The shrink will just exacerbate them.
Gosh I love these videos and the soft music that doesn't drown out the sounds of the birds
After a day like today, I sure needed this calming music.
Half way through The Bark Covered House as Dearborn is where my wife's family is from and still very near to us today. So great to read about the history of that area. Been a great read so far. Tbanks Townsends for the great info and history. Love all the work you have been doing on the homestead. Curious how long it took to process the cattail bundles and do the roofing.
Another thing to be concerned about when building a threshing structure is wind-driven rain that blows in sideways. One way to curtail most of that rain yet still allow most of the wind to pass through is to make wattle-woven side walls. It'd be a little darker inside, but the weave could be adjusted for that.
I love love love that you brought youngsters out for this project! What wonderful memories you made. :)
Shh.. TH-cam might notice. Then they will demonetize the video.
One of those youngsters is his daughter!
Man, cattails are such a fantastic resource. Did you know they're edible, too? The roots are starchy and quite nice roasted in the coals of a fire. And of course the seed pod fluff makes great tinder to catch a spark!
Knew about the seed puffs being good tinder but never knew about the roots being edible. Learn stuff everyday.
@@rw0dyxer012 it's sometimes called "Russian asparagus". very early spring, the new roots - peeled - are best steamed. very tender. I've eaten them. btw cattail fluff mixed with a bit of white flour makes incredible "buckwheat" pancakes. Experience.
Cattails are one of the best plants to have around when it comes to wild food. There is something edible you can get from them basically any time of the year. The legendary Survivorman talks about them extensively in both the original Survivorman series and his new Wild Harvest series. Just look up the Survivorman channel on here.
@@internetcatfish les stroud is amazing and I learned this from him as well amazing things you can learn from people who study our world haha
We just harvested our test plot of Winter Rye ( successful too here in NE VT ). ,much of the straw is 5’ in length. We love that you use what you have…. Such a good example from which we all can learn. It looks great!
You guys are awesome! I don’t ever finish a video before liking it!
In Florida I seen them make long mats with them being lashed, They roll it like bed rolls but much larger.
These rolls are hoisted onto the roof and rolled out. The next over lapped until the top that is capped. They use palm leaves or frowns.
They use these on mainly outside tiki bars or shelters for picnics. I seen a large group of men working on one before.
It is very slick how easy they roll it out. The material is dry so the lashing stay tight.
Love what you do 👍😊💕
Minimum 45 degrees with rushes and combed wheat reed otherwise it just a sunshade. Love seeing the group effort excelling in action giving us a taste of that which will very soon be all our futures. Superb and thankyou.
6-12 inches thick thatching? I think the thickest thatching I've seen on a building, here in Denmark, was about 18-24 inches thick.
Thatched rooves are still a thing in some areas here. Mostly because of the age of the buildings, while still being lived in, they are required to be repaired to the standards of when they were built.
There's a small town on the southern part of the island of Amager, called Dragør, that has a permanent ban on fireworks, due to the fire hazard.
Great point and I listed that above in my comment Annelise as Demark still has a thatching code even today...!!!
Netherlands have quite a few historical houses/buildings with thatch roofing too, some have it for esthetics but most are old buildings that have that rule too, to keep it in the same look as it was to preserve the historical value.
In Australia the early British settlers cut lengths of bark from gum trees about 6ft in length and the full diameter of the tree, these were flattened and used for roofing of the wattle and daub huts. It is in my families lore that a well made bark could last ten years. I have seen these in use in my youth and they were surprisingly water proof. They were held in place by placing saplings laid across the top side to weight them down. They may also have had wooden pegs used but I have no first hand knowledge of that.
My grandpa used to build buildings like this but he used bark as shingles. He grew up in rural northern Canada in a shack his dad built out of his own hands.
We called it a barn then. We call it a warehouse now, very useful.
There was an episode of Baltic Coasts somewhere in the Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia region. There was an island where people have thatched their roofs continuously since always. The episode showcased how to do it. If you're interested in learning how to thatch, watching this episode might give some good insights.
It will be interesting to see how long the cattails last. I've tried using cattails in various projects and had some issues. Even if it's a year, being free you could replace it every summer if need be.
With this shallow angle it won't last long is my guess, it will stay damp after rain and snow, thus rot fast. Would be better to get a more permanent solution like shingles or use tree bark to cover it.
@@pr0faker I was thinking the pitch needed to be steeper too... Well it was free and can be replaced easily.
@@MynewTennesseeHome it is interesting to see how it holds up either way indeed.
Buys them enough time in the shade to make some wood shingles. Lol.
You are indeed an awesome group of very talented people. Thank you!
Will you show us that cattail patch next year? I’m curious to see how quickly they regenerate after being clear-cut like that. The projects have been really interesting lately!
Down here in Florida they were using saw palmetto palms. They learned it from the natives. What we call tiki huts are actually called chickee and they originate in Florida.
Love this channel. It's so wholesome. Great episode.
I think you'd save a bit of cordage by tying the bundles with a continuous strand. That way you don't have 2-3 foot lengths cut for each bundle with the unused length dangling.
Didn't know roof thatching was that much hard work, mad respect to the people born before my grandfather was
Thatch roofs are still quite common in south America, africa, asia, and Pacific islands. When there is no Owens Corning for shingles and no steel mill to make sheet metal the poor just gotta use what they can get.
Tank you, Mr Townsend. I have been down the last few weeks, and I needed this remembrance of a simpler life.
THESE PERIOD HOMESTEADING VIDEOS ARE THE GREATEST! Tks guys!
Thank you Townsends for bringing such a calming and consistent content every time. This just feels so refreshing and soothing after dealing with all the hectic things in life.
This is just the subject I've been dwelling on for my woodsie shed plan...out here there's a real shortage of cattails I think I'd have to go with goldenrod and ragweed and tie with vines or queen Ann's lace since here in the southern tier of NY state that stuffs everywhere...
That roof will leak like a screen door in a submarine! Not nearly enough pitch. But, I'm willing to wait and see....
I think it needs a much sharper pitch and to be thicker, but all of my thatching experience is a few lean tos in Scouts, where we mostly used branches with lots of twigs, videos of thatching roofs in England and mainland Europe, and some reading-with photos to help explain the process.
I lived in a 500 year old stone cottage with a thatched roof in England. The roof was about two feet thick at about 45 degree pitch. The reeds were packed very tightly and it was completely waterproof in the English rain.
Our Chickee hut, thatched using Sabal palm fronds by the local Seminole Tribe, held up beautifully during Hurricane Irma. The restrooms made using modern construction blew to the ground, as did many other buildings in the area. I taught many children from the Seminole and Miccosukee Tribes, in the 1970s, who lived in open chickees using smoke from campfires to ward off mosquitoes. Chickee huts are not just for poolside cocktails but can be found throughout the south Florida area being used as shelter.
Huh. Here in the tropics we'd use somewhat broader leaves/grasses that can be partly folded and then sewn at right-angles to a stick. Then that stick and the leaves sewn to it can be put on the roof much like a roof tile. More prep work up front, maybe, but much less work when it comes to actually lifting the stuff onto the roof and arranging it there.
Every video uploaded to this channel is a treat.
5habk you for the great content!
And your touch with actual history study is the cherry on top
Instead of cutting the cattails just above the waterline you should try to pull them out of the water with the root still attached. The root is eateble. It's the same as potatoes. Very rich on starch. Cooking time is about the same as small potatoes. But you wil see it when you stick a fork inside. Maybe this is something to try on one of the cooking episodes.
Love the show. Greetings from the Netherlands.
My grandmother house was made of dabble and mud with a thatch roof in Hungary. Always needed to be kept up
Great example of a field expedient. Many of the commenters have suggested much better ways of doing the job, but if a man only has a few days or a week to build a shelter or die from exposure he does what he can to get by, and builds something better in the next spring and summer.
i remember learning shelters in Scouts. Most of them, though, were to protect from wind and cold - stick and branch frames, debris coverings. sheets of discarded plastic, some duct taped together were the BEST. For about eight years a friend and I used our old boy scouts shelter for fishing expeditions on the weekends. dry warm, we could stand up in it, two candles kept it fairly warm in fall and even winter.
"to cross the thrash hold" literally a plank in the doorway to stop the grain from rolling out.
"separating the chaff from the wheat" what you use a flail for.
thrashing barns are easy to recognize for thay have 2 doors oppositie one other (so the wind can blow thru)
Nice video. That's a lot of work (again). I am always amazed by how much Ivy has grown. Time goes by so fast.
Looking good. Now to test it against rain.
Looking good!
Not sure if you're aware, though you probably are, but cat tails are edible - the young shoots can be peeled and prepared like asparagus, and the rhizomes are an excellent source of starch.
I absolutely adore this channel. Thank you for all of the great work you guys do
It's so REWARDING to see this homestead develop over time. I've only been watching a year or so, it must be even heartier for long time viewers. Nice to see the children helping out and learning that faster and easier is not always better. Wish I had that kind of experience growing up!
Definitely need a much steeper pitch on that roof for the thatching to work.
Beautifully shot and edited as always! I did a lot of pausing and rewinding to check out some of the scenes. Now I have to play it again straight through, especially after having read the comments from the professional thatcher and others. I see it as enjoyable and encouraging community education. Also, it was heartening to see the youngsters involved! I'm guessing the boys are Ryan's.
I like the drone shots.
Fulfilling project, indeed!
Looks great, too...
I notice after every experiment, and the thatch looks lovely btw, there are hundreds of knowledgeable people contributing suggestions, warnings, and advice from all over the world. I wonder if Townsends could send out questionnaires before they begin an experiment to get the community perspective? Or post a video of what you're planning and get the community involved in the comment section. Love seeing the experiments, love the history, have been a loyal customer for twenty years. My son found your channel after growing up on your products. Unfortunately, I've also noticed that Townsends is one of those channels where the creators are not involved in the comments, so this is falling on deaf ears.
I can't tell if you are making the statement with sarcasm or love. Either is appropriate.
I think I agree. But I also suspect that the experiments could *easily* be overwhelmed by having too many suggestions.
Also, these guys have so many pots on the proverbial fires, it's likely incredibly difficult for them to be more interactive
You all done a very good job! I have learned something new. I have seen old panting with this thatching,a work of art.I like every thing that you all cover.Verry, interesting,and informative, entertaining.Kep the good video s coming! David Back.
That is one beautiful Barred Rock lady you've got there! She needs a name.
"We even learned how to use real thatch." "well, that'ch terrific!"
Looks great! Looking forward to seeing it thru the seasons over the next year.
I always enjoy seeing the homestead videos. Thanks for all you do!
I love catching up with these videos I belong to several prepping and survival groups and I’m oven forwarding these videos to my close knit friends on there and other videos like it.
What a great experience and experiment with the cattails 🌟Great job on all the bldgs,oven, so far 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
This kind of video is really fascinating. The cooking vids are cool too but these just seem more involved since they require more people and physical labor. I love it!
Great video! Loved the references to thatch roofs used in the past 🌞
Fascinating as always, sir. Thanks and please continue.
One of your best videos, great stuff.
A fine job of roofing your small working area!! Good for you.
Great job everyone! Looks real good and authentic!
I absolutely love these videos! Keep doing this wonderful work
Hi John and crew. Wonderful video. Actually I enjoy a lot of your videos and appreciate all of your efforts in researching and making history come alive.
Our pioneer ancestors used whatever was to hand for their needs. Remember, many of them would have seen some Indian "huts" in their journeys and thatch was definitely something that most eastern tribes used.
Look up the chikee and long houses. Back 30 years ago, I knew a Creek man who was born and raised in a chikee. He lived in a traditional Creek family compound until he went into the hospital for overnight, only to come home to find the local government had torn everything down. Don't worry, he built back and won the lawsuit.
Anyway, one concern I have is the placement of your logs on top of the thatch. These are going to act as dams and cause leaks.
If/ you use small diameter king limbs or poles (several canes bundled is great for this) from the high to low, then you can put those saplings back on top in the high low runners to hold down your thatch.
Also, when you add to this next year, don't cut your cattails before lashing on. Then cut the overhang of the low end. It adds to the thickness, and any leaks will run down the long leaves and leave you a larger area that's dry-ish.
Looking forward to your updates and future adventures.
PS my ancestors had a deerskin on a frame above a fire under the thatched roof. It got smoked and the roof didn't catch on fire. A win win, right? 👋
Thanks for sharing!
I am enjoying this series. You make it interesting with just enough video explanation. Thank you.
Always excellent viewing material. This build reminded me of one of my favorite books, Robinson Crusoe. Keep up the great work. I eagerly look forward to your next video.
Just wanted to drop in and say I love your channel and your style. These are some of my favorite videos on youtube and I've really enjoyed following the progress at the homestead!
This channel delivers so much.
This made me think of the character Heath ledger played in A Knights Tale. - his dad was a thatcher. This was such an interesting video to watch and understand more clearly what kind of job his dad did in that show
Looks like a lot of work! Good job, everyone!
Very interesting post , learned a lot on a subject l knew nothing about , thank you.
The sheer volume of thatching material is impressive. The amount of time and labor to cover this structure, while still doing the daily chores, could have been a limiting factor. Thank you and your whole team for this video. Be well and at peace.
I love this channel more than I can tell you!
I know from my own research that thatching was practiced in the Northeast through at least the mid 19c. on certain buildings. Hay barracks were a Dutch invention used on farms in the New York and New Jersey, and I'm told they could still be seen on farms in Northwest NJ into the 1960s. These structures had movable rooves that were lifted or lowered with the volume of hay. A roof of straw or reeds is shown in paintings of these structures, probably preferred because a roof of oak or cedar shingles would have been too heavy to adjust. "Haying Time" by William Ranney (1856) is one example. William Sydney Mount's famous painting of Cider Making shows a thatched hay barrack and thatched cider press in 1840s Long Island, so it seems to have been used throughout the farm.
Great job..!
Held my interest all the way to the end.
Awesome video!
You're always a great inspiration!Thank you for the great job you share with your audience ! We're trying to do something close (but definitely smaller) focused on early Langobard period (late VI-early VII century) in Friuli (north-east of Italy).