Aussie here. There's a classic axe company down here called Keesteel, made by Keech Castings. The "castings" bit should be a giveaway - yes, these axes are cast, not forged. Because of this, weird, weird alloy they use is extremely odd to file. It's not soft, per se - the axes are hardened and tempered - but filing it...eh. Best I can describe it is like filing really hard cheese, or cold chocolate. Most files just sought of push it around - except Pferd. Pferd are the only ones I've found that will actually cut it. Maybe they are made in China, like a lot of other files are, but I'll bet that Pferd, being German, actually bothers with quality control and paying to make 'em properly.
Thanks for the video telling us what brand of files to buy. Most files suffer poor quality because there are so many other filling, grinding, or sanding options. Stationary sanders or grinders, stand-alone sanders or grinders can be used instead of files to finish metal or wood. Even a Dremel tool can be used to finish metal. Files have low volume of sales compared to the past because of all these options. For working wood quickly, a farrier (horse hoof) file/rasp is a hand tool to have. Dave Engels of Engels’ Coach shop turned me on to using a farrier file/rasp for woodworking. Can coarsely remove and shape wood quickly with one. Another tool that has suffered in quality over the years is the ignition wrench. Used to be able to go into any Sears and buy a decent set of combination ignition wrenches for $10 a set. The Sears sets were high quality and had smooth edges. Back in the 1970s, cars still had points so ignition wrenches were commonly used. The use of these wrenches plummeted with the rise of electronic ignition. Now the ignition wrenches are just stamped and crudely finished.
You're welcome! I picked up a couple farrier rasps a while back, before I even knew what they were. The only decent modern ignition wrench set I found was Elora. Made in Germany. They used to be available on Amazon, but I can't find them anymore.
@@ballinator I downloaded the Pferd catalog today - many interesting products. Somewhat buried -- the path is: Pferd main site - go to page bottom - Pferd Service - downloads - Pferd tool Manual
Pferd has always been the best files. Period. 🙂 I am 45 years old now, and have been using these as a toolmaker/machinist, since I was 15 years old. (Not the same files, obviously, files are wear parts)
An 80's file salesman told my mentor that the file card high carbon bristles will dull the file and keeps the file salesmen in business. I now only use the natural bristle or a piece of wood. Sometimes an awl or pick for small stuck bits. We need a hardness test on these metals.
I respectfully disagree. *IF* a company sold a 'good' quality file I 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘯𝘬 they could count on repeat sales. Do you buy more of the 'fake' files after they quit working? Because once I see the 'fake' file is useless I will *not* buy them again.
I picked up a few pferd off amazon, definitely not cheap. Also a precision grobet made in Italy for making teeth for small hole saws. All of them worth it, disposable junk is what's actually expensive
Another vote for Bahco here. As a machinist, files are wear items like tool bits, use them up and pass them on to a blacksmith for knives. A blacksmith video claimed that cheap modern files aren't even tool steel, just case-hardened.
I just got a set of 4" warding files with wooden handles in a nice tin, branded as Hase, which look identical to the Pferd 265K set you show on Amazon. Made in Germany, they seem OK but time will tell. By the way, Pferd is German for 'horse' and Hase is 'hare'.
Liogier in france still makes handmade files and rasps, and there are a few other european brands that make handmade tools locally. Narex from the Czech Republic and Stubai in Austria or Milani from Italy for example. They are better known for the woodworking products, but some of them have good metalworking tools as well. Just hold on to your wallet, as these things are not cheap.
I've been on the fence for picking up files to sharpen saws with. Some brands on my radar are, Grobet, Corradi, Bahco and Pferd. But finding suitable saw sharpening files is difficult today. I don't want to roll the dice and come up snake eyes. So that's stopped me from making a move. I have heard bad things about modern Nicholson files. I'm even willing to give some far eastern brands a shot if they're economical. The thought has crossed my mind to at least test them out.
The Grobet's have been recommended here in the comments a couple times already, so I may have to check them out. Looks like Corradi is made in Italy and Bahco is likely Sweeden.
@@ballinator I haven't used any of them myself. But in my research they are likely candidates. My lack of knowledge has kept me from purchasing anything as of yet. I've been suffering from analysis paralysis. I don't want to get the wrong thing. I was ready to go one time with Corradi but they were out of stock on the size I need.
I recently started using Bahco files,and I like them a lot...I think they are better than most,but they too don't quite have the lifespan,but otherwise they do cut very well,have a great assortment and don't cost much.Anyway,I always suggest Bahco to someone looking for a decent file at a good price..
@ocoro174 It's complicated. There's three different styles of "cuts" with 4 or 5 different coarseness ratings in each one. Also multiple file shapes and lengths. Short answer: If I could only have one file I'd get a 8" mill bastard cut. It's a good middle of the road file for most metalwork. For further reading Nicholson put out a book in the 1940's about all the different types of files and what they're used for: archive.org/details/NicholsonFilePhilosophy1943 Files are a huge rabbit hole to go down, and I haven't figured it all out myself either.
this may be helpful but the only file besides pferd that cut exceptionally well are Japanese brands. They only make jewelers files but I use them to adjust doors almost daily thr brand is tsubosan. They are made in Japan and are easily as good as my swiss watch files that cost 100s of dollars. You can go down the Japanese file market hole some as thin as .010 10tho and flexible. I have yet to get a made in Japan file that is really disappointing way better than new case hardened crap. I knee when mercer and simonds went to India it's all downhill from here. Tsubosan get a set for 25 to 30 on az you won't regret it!
When looking for quality japan and Germany are my first place I look. My veto backpack is half german(wera/wiha/knipex) 40% japan (annex vessel tsunoda marvel engineer knicks ect.) Then the rest klein or some other brands. The sad part other then nepros or knipex they are big box stores price equivalent. You don't have to spend more to get more if you look around.
Hello, Mr. Ballinator; "THANK YOU!", SIR! I, too, have been needing 'decent' quality files & mostly buying 'fake' files because that is all that is available. Have you tried Bahco? Where I live (mostly 'rural' south GA, 43mi north of FL) there isn't much 'choice'. I can buy Nicholson at the local hardware store, or online, or the 'Chinesium' files at Harbor Freight. (Don't buy 'files' at Harbor Freight, my experience is the 'file' will be 'cut' by the work, not the right way around.) So I 𝘙𝘌𝘈𝘓𝘓𝘠 appreciate your info RE; Pferd files. Have a GREAT day, Neighbor!
Yes! old files... Connect it up to 24 volt DC power you got a welding rod. They're like the metal Loctite you wish you had known about. If you know you know. 🎇👨🏻🏭💎🎇
I've made a lot of file handles but I've also acquired quite a few file handles over the years. I'm pretty set on handles. A good handle is pretty much essential for using a file properly.
True, they'll wear out at some point, Maybe I didn't use the best choice of words, but I suspect these will last as long as the vintage ones I've been collecting.
Acid will not sharpen a file. Logically it doesn't even make sense. Acid dissolves steel at the surface. A sharp apex on the teeth produces the cut. The apex of the teeth will dissolve first because there is so little material, ergo, duller file.
Hmm. Maybe it's just cleaning out the gunk in between the grooves. It's something an old-timer told me to do years ago. I've 'restored' several old files by dipping them 'till the rust dissolved. Did not consider it could be hurting them.
Just doing barely enough to dissolve the rust probably does help. As you say, it removes the gunk that gets in the way of a file cutting. This is especially true if you use a product like evaporust because it is not an acid and will not dissolve any actual steel, only the rust.
Not sure if being sarcastic or serious.. The Harbor Freight ones are what started me on my file journey. They're rusting out in my scrap metal pile now. Once I compared them to a vintage Delta brand file I found, I never looked back.
I have some nickelson file's that I have used for years. I'm glad to see that you mentioned using the file card also glad to see that you don't have the files stacked on each other. Looking forward to your next video. 👍👍🔧🔧🪛🪛😃😃
@@ballinator I just use cardboard with tape around them. I have made a wrap for files too now that I'm thinking about it. I made it out of some polyethylene woven sheet. Basically tarp material but it was kitty litter bags.
Aussie here. There's a classic axe company down here called Keesteel, made by Keech Castings. The "castings" bit should be a giveaway - yes, these axes are cast, not forged. Because of this, weird, weird alloy they use is extremely odd to file. It's not soft, per se - the axes are hardened and tempered - but filing it...eh. Best I can describe it is like filing really hard cheese, or cold chocolate. Most files just sought of push it around - except Pferd. Pferd are the only ones I've found that will actually cut it.
Maybe they are made in China, like a lot of other files are, but I'll bet that Pferd, being German, actually bothers with quality control and paying to make 'em properly.
Thanks for the video telling us what brand of files to buy.
Most files suffer poor quality because there are so many other filling, grinding, or sanding options. Stationary sanders or grinders, stand-alone sanders or grinders can be used instead of files to finish metal or wood. Even a Dremel tool can be used to finish metal. Files have low volume of sales compared to the past because of all these options.
For working wood quickly, a farrier (horse hoof) file/rasp is a hand tool to have. Dave Engels of Engels’ Coach shop turned me on to using a farrier file/rasp for woodworking. Can coarsely remove and shape wood quickly with one.
Another tool that has suffered in quality over the years is the ignition wrench. Used to be able to go into any Sears and buy a decent set of combination ignition wrenches for $10 a set. The Sears sets were high quality and had smooth edges. Back in the 1970s, cars still had points so ignition wrenches were commonly used. The use of these wrenches plummeted with the rise of electronic ignition. Now the ignition wrenches are just stamped and crudely finished.
You're welcome! I picked up a couple farrier rasps a while back, before I even knew what they were. The only decent modern ignition wrench set I found was Elora. Made in Germany. They used to be available on Amazon, but I can't find them anymore.
@@ballinator I downloaded the Pferd catalog today - many interesting products. Somewhat buried -- the path is:
Pferd main site - go to page bottom - Pferd Service - downloads - Pferd tool Manual
Finally, someone who knows how to use a file and what a file card is.
Thanks! There was a time when I didn't know, though.
That was a nice reminder to clean all my files.Thank you
You're welcome. Thanks for watching!
Pferd has always been the best files. Period. 🙂
I am 45 years old now, and have been using these as a toolmaker/machinist, since I was 15 years old.
(Not the same files, obviously, files are wear parts)
Thanks for the feedback. Yeah, they won't truly last forever.
An 80's file salesman told my mentor that the file card high carbon bristles will dull the file and keeps the file salesmen in business. I now only use the natural bristle or a piece of wood. Sometimes an awl or pick for small stuck bits.
We need a hardness test on these metals.
Interesting. Never heard that before.
I am with you. I buy them at estate/garage sales.
Thanks for the rec, as I’m currently in the market for some new good files
You're welcome!
No doubt the quality isn't the same. I've concluded if they built tools to last sales wouldn't be as high.
True.
Planned obsolescence😢😢
I respectfully disagree.
*IF* a company sold a 'good' quality file I 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘯𝘬 they could count on repeat sales.
Do you buy more of the 'fake' files after they quit working?
Because once I see the 'fake' file is useless I will *not* buy them again.
I picked up a few pferd off amazon, definitely not cheap. Also a precision grobet made in Italy for making teeth for small hole saws. All of them worth it, disposable junk is what's actually expensive
I haven't tried the Grobet's yet, but have heard good things about them. Thanks for watching!
Another vote for Bahco here.
As a machinist, files are wear items like tool bits, use them up and pass them on to a blacksmith for knives. A blacksmith video claimed that cheap modern files aren't even tool steel, just case-hardened.
Thanks! Just being case-hardened would explain why the cheap ones work the first few times you use them, and then completely wear out.
I just got a set of 4" warding files with wooden handles in a nice tin, branded as Hase, which look identical to the Pferd 265K set you show on Amazon. Made in Germany, they seem OK but time will tell. By the way, Pferd is German for 'horse' and Hase is 'hare'.
Interesting. Explains the horse on their logo.
Liogier in france still makes handmade files and rasps, and there are a few other european brands that make handmade tools locally. Narex from the Czech Republic and Stubai in Austria or Milani from Italy for example. They are better known for the woodworking products, but some of them have good metalworking tools as well. Just hold on to your wallet, as these things are not cheap.
Thanks for the info!
Vintage Grobet files are very good
Thanks! I'll keep an eye out for them.
The Swiss made grobet is the best but the new ones made in Italy aren’t bad for what we can get now
The "Pherd files" name sounds like a New Zealand South Island crime drama 😂
Simonds are very good quality if you can find them. I have several. Very good imo.
Thanks! I'll check them out.
I've been on the fence for picking up files to sharpen saws with. Some brands on my radar are, Grobet, Corradi, Bahco and Pferd. But finding suitable saw sharpening files is difficult today. I don't want to roll the dice and come up snake eyes. So that's stopped me from making a move. I have heard bad things about modern Nicholson files. I'm even willing to give some far eastern brands a shot if they're economical. The thought has crossed my mind to at least test them out.
The Grobet's have been recommended here in the comments a couple times already, so I may have to check them out. Looks like Corradi is made in Italy and Bahco is likely Sweeden.
@@ballinator I haven't used any of them myself. But in my research they are likely candidates. My lack of knowledge has kept me from purchasing anything as of yet. I've been suffering from analysis paralysis. I don't want to get the wrong thing. I was ready to go one time with Corradi but they were out of stock on the size I need.
I recently started using Bahco files,and I like them a lot...I think they are better than most,but they too don't quite have the lifespan,but otherwise they do cut very well,have a great assortment and don't cost much.Anyway,I always suggest Bahco to someone looking for a decent file at a good price..
Thanks! I'll keep an eye out for Bahco's too.
I use Bahco files too. Most decent files I find in local stores. Works well when new, but needs to be replaced after a few years.
what coarseness do you recommend? there are 3 variants 🤔
@ocoro174 It's complicated. There's three different styles of "cuts" with 4 or 5 different coarseness ratings in each one. Also multiple file shapes and lengths. Short answer: If I could only have one file I'd get a 8" mill bastard cut. It's a good middle of the road file for most metalwork. For further reading Nicholson put out a book in the 1940's about all the different types of files and what they're used for:
archive.org/details/NicholsonFilePhilosophy1943
Files are a huge rabbit hole to go down, and I haven't figured it all out myself either.
@@ballinator thanks 🥰
Snap-on sells a nice screw on comfort grip file handle
Wow, that looks really nice. $23 is a little expensive, but I may have to get one at some point.
this may be helpful but the only file besides pferd that cut exceptionally well are Japanese brands. They only make jewelers files but I use them to adjust doors almost daily thr brand is tsubosan. They are made in Japan and are easily as good as my swiss watch files that cost 100s of dollars. You can go down the Japanese file market hole some as thin as .010 10tho and flexible. I have yet to get a made in Japan file that is really disappointing way better than new case hardened crap. I knee when mercer and simonds went to India it's all downhill from here. Tsubosan get a set for 25 to 30 on az you won't regret it!
Thanks! I'll have to check out Tsubosan. I'm a big fan of Japanese tools.
When looking for quality japan and Germany are my first place I look. My veto backpack is half german(wera/wiha/knipex) 40% japan (annex vessel tsunoda marvel engineer knicks ect.) Then the rest klein or some other brands. The sad part other then nepros or knipex they are big box stores price equivalent. You don't have to spend more to get more if you look around.
Hence I *make* my own wood file handles, with copper pipe ferrules.
Very nice!
Hello, Mr. Ballinator;
"THANK YOU!", SIR!
I, too, have been needing 'decent' quality files & mostly buying 'fake' files because that is all that is available.
Have you tried Bahco?
Where I live (mostly 'rural' south GA, 43mi north of FL) there isn't much 'choice'.
I can buy Nicholson at the local hardware store, or online, or the 'Chinesium' files at Harbor Freight.
(Don't buy 'files' at Harbor Freight, my experience is the 'file' will be 'cut' by the work, not the right way around.)
So I 𝘙𝘌𝘈𝘓𝘓𝘠 appreciate your info RE; Pferd files.
Have a GREAT day, Neighbor!
Thanks! I haven't tried Bahco yet, but it's been recommended a few times in the comments, so I'll probably have to check one out at some point.
Corn cobs make decent file handles in a pinch.
Interesting. I'll have to try that out.
Good job love you From Dino Mares Fontana CA
Thanks!
@@ballinator Welcome
Yes! old files... Connect it up to 24 volt DC power you got a welding rod. They're like the metal Loctite you wish you had known about.
If you know you know. 🎇👨🏻🏭💎🎇
Interesting.
Handles-Lutz Tool Co.
Grobet Files-Otto Frei
Boggs Tool sharpens files-
I've made a lot of file handles but I've also acquired quite a few file handles over the years. I'm pretty set on handles. A good handle is pretty much essential for using a file properly.
I forgot about Lutz. I have a couple of their screw-on handles in my drawer.
@@ballinator Check out Boggs Tool Co. You can order new files pre-sharpened by Boggs-Remakable level of sharpness!
@@ballinator Check out Boggs Tool. You can order new files pre-sharpened by Boggs-Remakable level of sharpness!
@@horacerumpole6912 Interesting. I'll have to check them out.
its ironic that these days its looking better to make a file cutter and making them as required than it is to buy them...
files are not lifetime tools.
True, they'll wear out at some point, Maybe I didn't use the best choice of words, but I suspect these will last as long as the vintage ones I've been collecting.
How could anyone make a video about Pferd files and repeatedly spell it Pherd?
LOL. I fixed it. Thanks! Over 2K views before anyone noticed...
@@ballinator Pferd is German for horse.😀 Oh, and it is pronounced pfaird, both for the horse and the files. 😁
Acid will not sharpen a file. Logically it doesn't even make sense. Acid dissolves steel at the surface. A sharp apex on the teeth produces the cut. The apex of the teeth will dissolve first because there is so little material, ergo, duller file.
Hmm. Maybe it's just cleaning out the gunk in between the grooves. It's something an old-timer told me to do years ago. I've 'restored' several old files by dipping them 'till the rust dissolved. Did not consider it could be hurting them.
Just doing barely enough to dissolve the rust probably does help. As you say, it removes the gunk that gets in the way of a file cutting. This is especially true if you use a product like evaporust because it is not an acid and will not dissolve any actual steel, only the rust.
Harbor Freight has some nice ones
Not sure if being sarcastic or serious.. The Harbor Freight ones are what started me on my file journey. They're rusting out in my scrap metal pile now. Once I compared them to a vintage Delta brand file I found, I never looked back.
I have some nickelson file's that I have used for years. I'm glad to see that you mentioned using the file card also glad to see that you don't have the files stacked on each other. Looking forward to your next video. 👍👍🔧🔧🪛🪛😃😃
I keep files in holders I've made for them or I make cardboard sheaths to put files into.
Before I got them organized in drawers, I made sheaths out of wax paper wrapped in duct-tape to keep them from banging into each other.
@@ballinator I just use cardboard with tape around them. I have made a wrap for files too now that I'm thinking about it. I made it out of some polyethylene woven sheet. Basically tarp material but it was kitty litter bags.
Why dont you try the japanese file Tsubosan. bright 900 .yullbe surprised.
Oooh, those look nice. I'll have to track one down and check it out.