Cases like these, where the workers are basically shouting for higher ups to shut it down and fix mistakes, but get ignored, are sooo frustrating and sad
I always say, the guys working on the floor are 50% concerned and 50% complaining. NEVER ignore the concerned. Good leaders don't but bad managers can't tell the difference.
Note that the workers were setting up the rebar and should have know that it was incorrect as well as those poring the concrete that there was incomplete fill. All hail the union ( it's not my job ) worker !!
Browad county 1600sq ft built-in 78' currently 5g's a year for coverage. Car insurance is about 150 per vehicle approximately every month. Life insurance is a dream
I'm from Florida and surprisingly there's no "Florida premium" lol but hurricanes and floods certainly make it more expensive. The fact that America's elderly go there to die really dosemt help either.
Just imagine millions of half blind half befuddled humans a deaths door hurtling around the state at 60 mph in steel cages. Fatal car accidents are more common in Florida.
My parents are trying to move out of their condo in Florida. They found out that the HOA board has been incredibly inept at maintaining the buildings over the years and now the HOA fees are skyrocketing to pay for all the repairs that must be done immediately. My parents are mad about that jump in fees but I'm more concerned about the fact that the roof was supposed to be replaced several years ago.
@@stevewhite3424 Because asking for an independent audit of the HOA's books can get someone evicted, or even far, far worse. Never try to make a thief be honest. They'll hate you until one of you dies.
The fact that these things consistently happen with basically a slap on the wrist is so disgusting. People complained, rich people shrugged, poor people die and the cycle continues.
Florida suffers from stupid government, one in bed with industry and detrimental to public safety. The current givernor is a complete republican hack devoid of ethics
@@Geoff69420 Yep, this. If you recklessly operate a car and hit and kill someone you are very likely to get prison time. But if you recklessly manage a building project and dozens or hundreds of people die it is very rare that there would be any time in prison. Legal for a price is pretty dang accurate.
My friends and I were heading to the beach and Ron Jon's surf shop and stopped at a traffic light near the condo. We saw this happen while were stopped. It was horrifying to watch.
We could see the dust plume from Merrit Island. There was also a traffic accident when a crane with a police escort that was responding to the collapse collided with a car at 520 & state road 3 resulting in a fatality.
Hey John, though I've only been a South Floridian since 1991, after the Surfside collapse last year, it became clear how most of these condos were cheaply made since the 70s because of kickbacks, mafia involvement, etc. It seems like a couple of times a month since Surfside, we get news alerts about condo buildings in the area getting emergency evacuations of its tenants due to the building structures determined to be unsafe by engineers while the building is being reassessed by the state...and most of these evaluations are the 50-year reassessment type. If the building needs to have a 50-year reassessment these days, it's time to shut things down, help tenants find alternate (and newer) places to live at and demolish the building, because any building made from the 70s weren't built the same as newer buildings are built these days with updated safety measures and rules in place..
Not necessarily true. Quality builders back then were still putting up quality structures with plenty of redundancy, even for today standards. There were bad Builders then just like there are now. It's just now, the regulations are tight enough that the bad builders cannot cut corners large enough to compromise building safety
@@SteveWillNotDoIt1984 : One of my grandfathers was a concrete foreman. Some of the general contractors he worked for would pull up rebar in slab foundations after the inspector had left. This was illegal even then.
Agreed. Nothing lasts forever, and so there’s a design life built into everything. (This isn’t so-called “planned obsolescence”, which is a myth, it’s basically the amount of time that the engineer can guarantee the structure will resist degradation/corrosion/water infiltration enough to still meet its original specifications). Once you hit 50 years, you’re getting up there. You’d think it would just make more sense to tear down the old 1970s era building and build a newer, nicer, more energy efficient building instead. It’s what we do in the shipping world. But apparently condo associations never got the memo.
Concrete is fickle stuff, so easy to make mistakes and even easier to cut corners. When you understand how important it is to get it right, you are nothing short of evil for not doing so. I have seen new buildings, that sold off the plans, have exposed reinforcing clearly visible in the carpark, which of course is the sub structure holding everything else up. In Sydney, Australia where I live, there is a building called the Opal Tower that was evacuated on Christmas day, as were many other nearby buildings, due to fear of a collapse. It didn't but might make a good story on this line of poor quality construction.
In Pakistan, there is a general purpose design for concrete plazas which is used in 99% of buildings everywhere, it has ensured that at least the structure by design remains sound. I don't know the technical term but buildings are made with reinforced concrete beam boxes, concrete slabs for floors and brick walls, though within unit walls can be of anything. Though collapses still happen frequently in one city; Karachi, due to lax controls and shoddy materials. Frequency is about once every month...
@@angelachouinard4581 It certainly is scary for a big city. A lot of them are going up as they are going down... Two have gone down this month alone... OTOH, I am living in a apartment tower with shoddy floor plan and overextended floors in Islamabad. The floor beam goes through the middle of the room, haha... A hallmark copy paste structural plan and then the architect shoe horned the apartments wherever he could... Still it has remained sound with frequent earthquakes.
@@brazensmusings2738 My father traveled to Pakistan quite often and even took my mother with him once. She loved it. So I have a soft spot for Pakistan and I'm sorry to hear that's happing. Stay safe, please.
Love the new Balls Rating. May I submit that you also add one of your foreman caricatures with increasingly distressed body language for each level of severity, such as 1. shrugging with hands out to sides, palms up, 2. side view of hiding bowed head behind clipboard in shame, 3. holding onto hardhat with both hands, knees bent braced to run, 4. running with hardhat and clipboard flying off behind, and 5. standing with skull for a face and hardhat on fire.
Just wanted to compliment the level of detail presented in the video as you went along through the video. I work with engineering concrete and the description of the design, the visual defects that formed, and the construction methods really helped the storytelling for me. Great job including without getting into the weeds. As an aside I’m kind of shocked the engineer, when brought in to look at what was unfolding, didn’t start screaming ‘shut it down!’ The cracking and deflection described in the slabs was alarming and was a huge red flag that things were fundamentally wrong with either the design or materials. And considering the potential liability that licensed engineers hold… but I guess if that happened it wouldn’t be the subject of your video today.
That's because yelling 'shut it down' was not in the budget, in order to change the budget and add 'yelling' to the project, a proposal had to be sent first in triplicate to architect, builder and government, and after a few weeks for a committee to gather and study the problem, then an adjustment to the budget may be considered, of course if it falls on holiday there will be delays too. 😵😵😵
maybe it was one case of completion bias. Seeing the structure almost fully erect made them think about the troubles of getting it redone from scratch and they just wanted to press forward and hope for the best because collapses always "happens to others". Or maybe, given the flawed design, they were just plain incompetent
If a building starts deforming while it's still being built, clearly there is something very wrong and the entire thing should be demolished and rebuilt from scratch. I can't comprehend how anyone could possible sleep at night allowing such a project to continue while people are standing on it all day.
Honestly it doesn't even take an engineer to see how bad these problems were. Even unskilled workers on site should be able to tell that there's something wrong when the half-built building is cracking and crumbling. I find it just as shocking that the workers pointing out the defects were willing to keep working in what was clearly a deathtrap.
There was an accident similar to this in Gwangju, South Korea back in January 2022. The high-rise was rushed, it had sub-standard concrete and had not enough time and structural support it needed to harden. It happened almost exactly the same way as the accident of this video, about 30 stories higher up in the air. The only difference is, that the company responsible didn't get bankrupt, let alone suffer severe legal consequences. It somehow manages to be a worse dumpster fire than the same accident 4 decades ago.
Ya that engineer didnt understand what was going on, you cant just add more steel in later placements without addessing the current issue. That would already imply negligence in your sealed design.
For some stuff you arguably could have gotten away with wrapping columns in steel sheets, but it doesn't take too long before you've built an even stronger building to hold up your new building, at greatly increased cost...
@@absalomdraconis Yeah. As a naval architect, I don’t understand why our land-bound cousins are so opposed to just making the building out of steel in the first place. It’s strong, cheap, and it bends instead of cracking and crumbling. They literally have to use steel anyway because concrete can’t handle the tensile loads. So why not do away with all the stupid heavy concrete and just use the steel for everything?
@@michaelimbesi2314 Steel structures can collapse too. As a humble draughtsman of steel framed buildings, we needed engineers for a reason. I like structures that show early warning signs, and people not ignoring them. Like prefering a cable stayed bridge over a chain link, so you notice cables fraying instead of a sudden collapse. I like common sense, not adding fake reinforments merely for esthetics like in the case of the FIU pedestrian bridge. I prefer gradual improvements with huge safety margins over fashion statements. Building codes enforced without cutting corners. We see buildings being spiced up with heavy cladding and AC units, instead of giving these aging buildings the proper attention. I want Isambard Kingdom Brunel back. Agreed, steel structures like the old twin towers would take away a lot of these concerns. But the thing is, a steel framed building still needs concrete to cover the floors: You can´t put a carpet directly on a corrugated steel plate. And I guess you need some kind of cheap and stirdy material to cover the sewers and water lines mounted against your columns. Enter concrete. So before you know it, your floor plates and trusses are getting replaced by rebar, and your vertical columns become composite too. All structural steel hidden from inspection, although I can´t help thinking concrete slows the collapse compared to a joint snapping. And the crumbly nature of concrete benefits in providing an early warning sign. Sky scapers are steel framed, because they flex like your ships. Let´s hope it stays that way.
@@michaelimbesi2314 this is how I feel when people insist on carbon fiber when fiberglass is basically 95% the same and it's not even a weight-critical application. Carbon fiber costs like 15x more, though. And modern biaxial fiberglass is insanely strong. It ain't the days of chop gun go brrrr and woven roving anymore.
i'm not even an engineer or involved in construction, but when i heard the pooling water and cracks in the concrete, i was like "uh oh, that's not good!!!". also, love the new scale.
The new scale is great, looking forward to finding out which disaster will be the first 'oh balls' - even though these things are horrible, it's great to learn about them, and sometimes you just gotta laugh the pain away.
@@cynthiatolman326 I'd say that the big Texas City oil refinery explosion (the one he hasn't covered yet!) would rate as a Dumpster Fire. There was definitely a whole lot of fire involved...
I remember this collapse. The design was weak, the construction standards and materials used were poor, and still they would have been okay if they had not removed all the supporting poles on the lower floors and then poured the roof. After this event contractors left supporting poles in place until the entire building was completed.
I mean I'm not exactly sure it would be ok with holes in pouring and reinforcement visible, but yeah, you're absolutely right that keeping those supports would have lowered the chance of catastrophe:)
They would ONLY have been "okay" if you consider it okay to leave a substandard building with less than code-requirements in the walls, remaining supports, and structure... Sure, the COMPANIES involved wouldn't have been caught up in the catastrophe, but a building structure at roughly 75% of the structure required by law would've been "completed" for the consumers and market... What if YOUR parents had taken up a condo' in that place before the inevitable happened??? ;o)
Literally EVERY time I see or hear the phrase “Balls, or Oh Balls” on this channel I laugh out loud uncontrollably. Especially when it’s a dialogue bubble and the person depicted is staring a major disaster in the face and ultimately says “oh balls” in reaction. Too funny, so I love the “Balls” scale.
@11:38 -- Off topic, but I've lived in Virginia Beach almost all my life and I'd never heard of those two hero kids in that adjacent news story... So I did some research and it is fascinating stuff!!
This makes me worry for a few of my friends who live in Florida... It is very sad when the execs ignore the workers' warnings that the shit is about to hit the fan, and they just stick their heads in the sand so the problem can kick them in the ass once they can't get their head out of the ground. Side note: I like how you always used "Balls" as an expression that things went wrong, like instead of "Oh shit" or "oh crap" or "FUCK!" they just say "Balls", that new disaster scale being called the Balls scale is really fitting.
I shouldn't be surprised it was allowed to pass with the thinner floors, but ... Statutory lesson in listening and paying attention to your workers and foreman, not just giving lip service. Kudos to the other workers who brought the heavy equipment to help with the rescue efforts.
I'm sitting here thinking about being a construction worker on that job in the days before the collapse and asking myself if I'd have had the smarts and self-preservation to walk away. I hope so.
It's not like that. A perfectly intelligent person can die because their boss decides to cut corners on concrete costs by making slabs too thin. These workers aren't qualified in concrete building because they aren't making decisions like that, they're just doing what the qualified person tells them to do. They have no idea that they're doing anything wrong and that's why this is so scary. They didn't understand what was going on because they're supposed to be able to trust their qualified bosses.
that's also what happened at that pedestrian bridge collapse in Florida. the workers saw the cracking and reported it. engineers said it was fine. turned out (once again) it wasn't. I know John has done a video on it.
@@nadapenny8592 You don't need to be an expert in concrete or architecture to know that a building under construction is not supposed to have deformed floor slabs or honeycomb cracks all over it.
@@nadapenny8592 It's not especially difficult to self-educate about principles like "Creep" or "Honeycombing" or "Spider-web" crack patterns. "Deflection" and "Deformation" are similarly simple to learn, notice, and point out... It actually comes down to asking yourself if YOU would let your mom move into the place you're working at, just knowing what you know... and then a general "err on the side of caution". You may walk off a few jobs a little premature, but you can DEFINITELY decrease your chances of attaching your name and pouring your efforts into something forever branded "A Death Trap". ;o)
That moment when you can’t sleep and you’re here within the first few minutes of uploading… Been to Cocoa Beach a few times as a kid but never knew or heard anything about this, today I learned!
Six miles to the west, on Merritt Island, there was an additional death directly related to the Harbor Cay collapse: A crane responding to the emergency was following a police escort eastbound on State Road #520. At the intersection of State Road #3, an elderly woman waited for the State Patrol vehicle to clear the intersection, but pulled in front of the crane. The crane operator tried to avoid a collision, but ended up rolling onto the driver's side on top of the car, killing the woman. The crane operator received minor injuries.
@ Louis Becker: Yes, have been under police escort several times, and have had a few near misses from vehicles pulling out in front of me. When you are moving an 8 metre / 26 foot wide house over the road... You do get some idiots on the road! We were moving a house back in c1985, and this day, was front escort. Police car behind me, house behind the police car. Sturt Highway, 2 lanes, near Greenock. Car with boat on trailer goes flying past me. On the CB radio - live one coming! Driver of the car and boat seen the police car, hit the brakes in emergency mode. Boat luanched off trailer, skidding over the road, stopping about 3 inches from going through the front of the police car! About 1 hour later.... We laugh about it now, but, it was a scary experience at the time!
I was trained and worked in heavy civil engineering in the UK. In that period there were different forms ofproject contract . But most were of the Architectural format, Where a consultant structural engineer is hired to monitor and amend the planned format of the building. In a"cast on site" RC structure like this. The structural plan would have required local planning approval of the RC structural design drawings before construction even starts. As the structure progresses the local planning office would inspect major elements before they were cast. (The structural consultant should always do this anyway) . In short this project should never have got passed the drawings before it was amended. The concrete mix is certified And Checked by regular testing of concrete blocks cast AT THE TIME! These cubes are then crushed in a press to see if the 7 day and 21 day strength performs as specified. In the above project, just allowing 7 days between floors seems insufficient, even if they staggered the process. Also the foundations problems associated with conditions in Florida can be yet another nasty situation. In the UK we often see columns and beams cast on site, with precast floor elements produced-off site and lowered into place by a crane. Then bonded into the structure with reinforcement and grouting. Another form very common in America is a steel frame (clad in concrete) with Pre cast concrete floors. In the project you describe - with cracking seen on the underside of beams and floors at least by the 2nd floor. All work would have been stopped (by the structural consultant, the architect or just the planning officer) until the source of the problem was corrected. It should NEVER have reached the 3rd floor, let alone the roof! I would strongly expect that local corruption played a major part in this failure. Because so many people (with the clear responsibility to stop it) simply didn't say ANYTHING, or request concrete testing result before the work proceeded. Big envelopes full of dirty cash probably changed hands on this job. I did work for a structural consultant in Reinforced Concrete. They would have been horrified at the drawings stage. We have codes of practice and regular materials testing to prevint this kind of "BUILT IN" DISASTER!
In Florida they just don't have our UK mindset about safety. Though there are some very good safety agencies in the US at federal level, and they do some great investigations where they don't pull punches, they don't have as much legislation backing them up as ours do here, and some states just don't believe in regulation- Florida being one of the worst if various collapses are anything to go by. I've had more input and more inspections from Building Control changing a 12 foot square flat roof to a pitched roof on a single storey extension than they seem to get on major builds- it seems they self-certificate a lot of the time, and we all know what that means. Not that Grenfell leaves us with much to boast about. The problem we have now is that 12+ years of a very right-wing anti-safety, pro-developer-profit government has undermined a lot of our regulations and inspections.
@@alisonwilson9749 yup. On top of it all is a general denial of coastal erosion because God forbid anything is connected to climate change. "Woke" is a four letter dirty word and if the governor gets any real chance of moving to the white house, I'll have to consider leaving the country, not just the state.
Yes this is what happens often times when corners are cut and the government and other organizations look the other way. It's all about the money and human lives are secondary at best.
I've lived in Florida my whole life and I've stayed in quite a few condos over on the gulf side(west) and every time, except once, they always looked like they were built very well and in great shape. That one time though was pretty bad, it had a major crack right when you walked in at the bottom of the floor all the way up the wall to the roof. There were a couple more in the living room that did the same, from the bottom baseboard all the way up to the roof. Just the whole foundation was pretty sketchy
This showed up in a related video suggestion after watching a video on "The Expanse" no more than 6 minutes after you posted it. I would say you have some good reach.
@@Dallas_K Why would you assume I want anything to do with Al Gore? Florida is world-reknowned for inbred, racist idiocy. All kinds of people cheer for its demise, not just people who voted for the most boring man on the planet.
Give it a couple of decades. Practically the whole state is basically at sea level. GOPher voters in Florida will reap what they sow (as someone who voted GOP for 20 years before I started seeing through the lies stacked on lies that form every bit of rightwing ideology)
Thank you John. I didn’t realise that the ACI were such an aggressive agency. You’d assumed that they were mild mannered engineers but apparently they are extremely vociferous! 😀
Having grown up in the town next to Cocoa, I can say for sure that "nothing had failed so far" is how everything is done, at least in Central Florida x'D
Things are always built by the lowest bidder. My father was one of the designers of the US military's HUMVEE. He had a lot of practical complaints about the designs survivability and practicality, but nobody listened. Keep in mind, that this way during its original creation as a replacement for the Jeep... Not a combat vehicle but a behind the lines support vehicle. Being a former toolmaker with an engineering background, I've seen so much shady behavior in industry that I personally view most industrial structures as death traps. The people that build these things only care about profit, safety is a myth at best to them.
My father was a project manager for the US Army CECOM in electronics and communications systems. Getting the politically-connected outside contractors to meet the project performance standards was a constant and demoralizing challenge.
@@wallacegrommet9343 that was how my father felt as well and that is why he stepped down. I'm certainly not belittling your father by any means, the fact he was in the industry demands respect.
I like your new scale of rating the disasters. Much more simplified. Doesn't take a rocket scientist degree to realize this video is a number 4 (outright negligence) appreciate you going thru all the research to make this video. Stay warm and dry if you can in your part of the UK.
For what its worth, the new scale gets a Florida Woman seal of approval, John. It's evocative of how Floridians view hurricane ratings. 1-2, eh whatever. 3, maybe we should buy more than beer. 4-5 oh we're probably screwed.
Haha! You sound like my BFF talking about hurricanes! She grew up in Puerto Rico, then moved to south Florida for a good few years, and her hurricane stories blow my Canadian mind. Like the one where she, her brother, and their cousin underestimated a storm, and ended up outrunning a hurricane on the Interstate in their Honda Civic... 🤷♀ Of course, when she moved up north here, she had to learn about winter! 😉
Thank you for bringing this outright negligence to my attention and many others attention. Found the information that you provided very interesting. May I suggest that you take a look at other buildings throughout the state of Florida such as Daytona Beach condos like the Hawaiian Inn and the Holiday Inn and a 20 story condominium building all within the same area. That were highly affected by Coastal erosion due to Hurricane Ian and Dorian. You can see very similar construction to this building that was shown in this negligence episode. Only there it's even worse some of the buildings are actually supported by what appear to be telephone pole like support beams that are not really set in any order and are literally rotting away. Some of the buildings you can even see slanting and the erosion continues to eat at the base of the buildings now that many of the buildings have already lost their seawalls being knocked down by Coastal surge tide effect some of the walls that constructed the sea walls are not even more than 4 in thick. The awful concrete design along with the coastal erosion destroyed the buildings sea walls that were also poorly constructed. Work has already been done to try to save the buildings but I would love for you or a show like yours too review their structural integrity and show the blatant defects not only from the damage suffered from the hurricane title surge but from the way many of the buildings were built to begin with. Concrete laid so thin and improperly that you can actually see the rebar popping through literally rusting a corroding right through the concrete. Cracks that resemble a severely cracked broken egg. Rickety Sharing and shearing the weight of the upper floors. One of the buildings the buildings up to 22 floors. Other buildings are 10 stories to five stories. No structural i-beams in many of the buildings no structural headers it almost all the buildings very poor structural integrity concrete. As if the concrete was mixed with beach sand literally flaking away. Again like a brittle broken cracked egg. I would love to see your take on all of it. Daytona is also famous for balconies literally collapsing even without storms. And is notorious for horrible building standards.
Two more YT channel names who did deep dives into the Champlain Towers collapse: Jeff Ostroff Building Integrity Ostroff went deep into the blueprints and engineering inspections along with incidental videos before the collapse taken by visitors.
@@mommachupacabra Building Integrity is the more technical of the two in terms of explanations for those learning about structural engineering, but yes, they're both interesting.
Get and Keep a wrought-iron screen door for your house (both front AND rear), and be DAMN wary of anything "condo"... Otherwise, Florida can be a pretty amazing place to enjoy! ;o)
This is why I ignore my coworkers and even supervisors when they claim I am pestering them when I report damaged equipment or questionable infrastructure at my job. They claim "Oh it's been like that since [insert months, years, etc here] and nothing has happened yet!" I reply: "It's the yet the worries me. I don't want it to happen at all. And there is a fine line between 'Its fine' and "Oh shit'."
This week my schedule has been very unusual, and until you popped up I'm drinking my coffee, scrolling, and thinking it's Friday, lol. Thanks for reminding me it's Saturday, and thank you for your content. Hope the sun pops out soon.
Small correction. The bar chairs DO make sure that the rebar is in the right location but the consequence of it being in the wrong location is NOT really extra bending but more a dramatic loss of strength or durability. It also sounds like the bars ended up all bunched up which would mean that the liquid concrete couldn't get into all of the gaps around the rebar. Reinforced concrete is designed so that the steel and concrete work together to support the load and if there are air gaps around the concrete this can dramatically reduce the strength.
John, you should check out the L'Ambiance Plaza collapse in Bridgeport CT in the 1980's. Cause was a faulty "amazing" new building method called "lift slab construction." At least a 3, maybe a 4 on your new scale.
@@angelachouinard4581 liftslab was the new cool thing everyone was doing in Bridgeport at the time. And there was a lot of building abs renewal going on at that time.
@@stephenbritton9297 I grew up in CT so all the fall down go boom stuff there interests me, like the Hartford civic center. But I didn't know liftslab was the rage in Bridgeport.
Cute as the "Balls Scale" is I think a variation of the IAEA Nuclear incident scale (ie 1-7, how far outside the local area do effects spread) would be better for these presentations. Terrible as this collapse is it didn't really have much national or international affect, while the crash of the BOAC Comets changed air travel going forward (letting US companies surpass the brits in jet travel, and introducing new understanding of metal fatigue/window design).
I worked construction in Florida (Miami Beach) in the early 80's when this happened. I was hired with absolutely no concrete experience as a laborer, but my main job was translating English to Spanish for the other workers most of whom couldn't get to the bathroom if they had to do it in English. No surprise to me that buildings are so shoddy. No doubt the Traffficante family had something to do with it as well.
Why is it that anything that resembles Traficant or Trafficante seems to have mafia ties between the Youngstown, OH politician and the Tampa crime family?
There are new houses going up at the end of my street, here in Red Alabama. I want to vandalize the big roadside sign advertising them with “Homes built by cheerful, underpaid, Mexican immigrants with the least expensive materials the contractors could find”. I walked through them on weekends. The moisture barrier for the outside walls is so thin, you could nearly see through it. Two have already sold, unfinished.
If I remember correctly didn't this building company or engineer previously have a building they made collapse because they didn't follow the state requirements? I might be wrong but I thought I heard that somewhere...
If you ever get to any more Australian construction examples I’d recommend for the adaption of 1. She’ll be alright 2. Oh for ****s sake. 3.Oh! That One! 4. Get A Lawyer 5. Harold Holt. For those that that don’t know, Harold Holt was a PM who got himself drowned/eaten by shark/ kidnapped by submarine after swimming.
I was thinking this would be the more recent collapse. I don't even recall ever hearing about this one (I'll grant I think I was in kindergarten and only recall Mt St Helens and the attempts on Reagan and the Pope around that time), but you'd think they'd learn. Nope. Welcome to Florida. I like the rating system.
Apparently. they're expecting the Port Royale building to fall down soon as well, as it developed a crack through the entirety of one of its basement support beams, leading it to be evacuated a couple of weeks ago. :/
It would be helpful to know the floor spans involved...11" or even 8" is a very thick reinforced concrete slab... most apartment floor slabs here are typically they are 4 to 6" here... for 12-15' spans... are you referring to structural slab depth or overall slab depth?
Florida is not an easy place to build. the ground is not exactly favorable... ... so any mistake is gonna be a bit aggravated by the lack of a solid base below it.and it's a wee bit humid so water infiltration is a thing.
@@PlainlyDifficult Also if you’re on the topic of building collapses during construction, the New Orleans Hard rock Cafe collapse is interesting and happened recently.
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Omgggg crazy!! My family is from Cocoa Beach!! My mom grew up there and my gramma lived there for decades lolol so cool to hear my neighborhood being talked about
Typical northern developer who comes to Florida and hires the cheapest contractor whose under qualified and incompetent. The owner/developer was Towne Realty of Milwaukee was the developer of Xanadu and about 10 other properties. They hired bottom barrel rednecks instead of the qualified local builders.
After watching several of your videos, I'm determined to never step foot in a building, or drive over a bridge, made of "structural" concrete. It's like they say, steel is real.
Considering a score of 4 is for gross negligence, as in this case, I'm guessing a score of 5 would require malicious intent in addition to gross negligence?
The best thing about Plainly Difficult is that, if you're playing them for the first time while you're also doing things around the house, you stand a better than passing chance of walking in on a perfectly normal, even droll voiceover, but matched to a cartoon of a logo with a speech bubble that says "LICK MY CONCRETE BALLS."
I immediately thought “oh this happened before and it wasn’t Miami?” And then I was like “omg it’s Cocoa Beach where we went on that cruise one time.” I’m getting afraid to stay in any condo in Florida.
A friend of mine was stationed near Cocoa Beach in the mid 80s. He said he could watch the space shuttle launch from his backyard. I saw the Challenger blow up on live TV. I went to work and that was all anybody was talking about. It was on every radio station, all day. Then Reagan went on TV and talked about it. This building collapse is kind of a vague memory. I was too busy getting high in 1981. I know it was on the news. They shouldn't build con-damn-miniums on sand.
Will you re-rate your older videos into "Balls Scale"? I think some of your previous videos, particularly some of your nuclear ones, shouldn't be re-rated - for instance, the Chernobyl RBMK #4 disaster exceeds Balls Scale level 5 "dumpster fire" by such a significant margin, your haz mat men would call their shop steward if you rerated it down to 5. On the other hand, the Vajont Dam disaster definitely would fit at a 5 rating on the Balls Scale, with Ibrox Stairway 13 rating at 4 (mayyybe 3?) on the Balls Scale, and the I-40 bridge collapse definitely a 2 on the Balls Scale.
Well, the conclusion wasn't what I was expecting, but, still absolutely NOT surprising. When I heard you say, "8 inch floors, but State Law called for 11 inches," what I was really expecting was, "So they just poured the floor slabs 3 inches thicker." Paying no attention to the additional load on the uprights. I've seen this.
![[UNCUT] “บอสณวัฒน์” ลากไส้!! ใครหนุนหลัง "แม่ตั๊ก ป๋าเบียร์" I คนดังนั่งเคลียร์ I 30 ก.ย. 67](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/QlD7mU2KKRk/mqdefault.jpg)
Have any other disasters you'd like me to cover? Let me know!!
This weeks outro Song: th-cam.com/video/9HgQ8qJSuVY/w-d-xo.html
Cave creek Disaster in New Zealand! happy to help with pronunciation ;)
can you kame a video on the collapse of the hotel new world in singapore in 1986?
Grenfell Tower fire.
It seems exactly the sort of thing that would benefit from your clear explanations.
Lac Megantic train crash and fire.
New Orleans Hard Rock Cafe collapse during construction is an interesting one
Cases like these, where the workers are basically shouting for higher ups to shut it down and fix mistakes, but get ignored, are sooo frustrating and sad
Did any workers quit?
I always say, the guys working on the floor are 50% concerned and 50% complaining. NEVER ignore the concerned. Good leaders don't but bad managers can't tell the difference.
Note that the workers were setting up the rebar and should have know that it was incorrect as well as those poring the concrete that there was incomplete fill. All hail the union ( it's not my job ) worker !!
Just what I was thinking.
@@GilmerJohn Florida man detected
Between the sinkholes and condos, life insurance premiums have got to be astronomical in Florida.
Very likely
dont forget the hurricanes alligators venomous snakes and other fun things
Browad county 1600sq ft built-in 78' currently 5g's a year for coverage. Car insurance is about 150 per vehicle approximately every month. Life insurance is a dream
I'm from Florida and surprisingly there's no "Florida premium" lol but hurricanes and floods certainly make it more expensive. The fact that America's elderly go there to die really dosemt help either.
Just imagine millions of half blind half befuddled humans a deaths door hurtling around the state at 60 mph in steel cages. Fatal car accidents are more common in Florida.
My parents are trying to move out of their condo in Florida. They found out that the HOA board has been incredibly inept at maintaining the buildings over the years and now the HOA fees are skyrocketing to pay for all the repairs that must be done immediately. My parents are mad about that jump in fees but I'm more concerned about the fact that the roof was supposed to be replaced several years ago.
Gee, I wonder where all the money for maintenance went? 🤷♂🤷♂
@@TimeSurfer206 HOA managers are like televangelists. I have never heard of one that was poor or 'just getting by' financially.
Gee I wonder why they didn't pay any more attention to what the HOA was up to?
@@stevewhite3424 Because asking for an independent audit of the HOA's books can get someone evicted, or even far, far worse.
Never try to make a thief be honest. They'll hate you until one of you dies.
All I can say is they have been lucky. Mother Nature usually sends a hurricane to insure roof replacement.
The fact that these things consistently happen with basically a slap on the wrist is so disgusting. People complained, rich people shrugged, poor people die and the cycle continues.
Florida suffers from stupid government, one in bed with industry and detrimental to public safety. The current givernor is a complete republican hack devoid of ethics
Watch the video, greedo
@@samsonsoturian6013 you mean the video where no one faced any real consequences for the deaths of many?
Punishable by a fine (or out-of-court settlement) = Legal for a price
@@Geoff69420 Yep, this. If you recklessly operate a car and hit and kill someone you are very likely to get prison time. But if you recklessly manage a building project and dozens or hundreds of people die it is very rare that there would be any time in prison.
Legal for a price is pretty dang accurate.
"Jeez, look at all the cracks in the concrete!"
"Don't worry, it will go away when we keep adding floors."
I'm glad we've learned from disasters like this, and Florida hasn't seen a condo collapse since... oh. :(
Florida also hasn't seen a concrete structure collapse like that since...oh.
I am again confirmed in my belief, that Florida is simply too dangerous to ever visit.
@@dfuher968 yeah giant sinkholes, alligators, insects, flooding, hurricanes and poor concrete constructions XD
😂😂
What are you champlaining about?
My friends and I were heading to the beach and Ron Jon's surf shop and stopped at a traffic light near the condo. We saw this happen while were stopped. It was horrifying to watch.
We could see the dust plume from Merrit Island.
There was also a traffic accident when a crane with a police escort that was responding to the collapse collided with a car at 520 & state road 3 resulting in a fatality.
@@louisbecker5941 Hey Brother Lou!
Hey John, though I've only been a South Floridian since 1991, after the Surfside collapse last year, it became clear how most of these condos were cheaply made since the 70s because of kickbacks, mafia involvement, etc.
It seems like a couple of times a month since Surfside, we get news alerts about condo buildings in the area getting emergency evacuations of its tenants due to the building structures determined to be unsafe by engineers while the building is being reassessed by the state...and most of these evaluations are the 50-year reassessment type.
If the building needs to have a 50-year reassessment these days, it's time to shut things down, help tenants find alternate (and newer) places to live at and demolish the building, because any building made from the 70s weren't built the same as newer buildings are built these days with updated safety measures and rules in place..
Yup, hearing about these evacuations on the news. Recent one just down the street from the Surfside. Terrifying.
Not necessarily true. Quality builders back then were still putting up quality structures with plenty of redundancy, even for today standards. There were bad Builders then just like there are now. It's just now, the regulations are tight enough that the bad builders cannot cut corners large enough to compromise building safety
@@SteveWillNotDoIt1984 : One of my grandfathers was a concrete foreman. Some of the general contractors he worked for would pull up rebar in slab foundations after the inspector had left. This was illegal even then.
Agreed. Nothing lasts forever, and so there’s a design life built into everything. (This isn’t so-called “planned obsolescence”, which is a myth, it’s basically the amount of time that the engineer can guarantee the structure will resist degradation/corrosion/water infiltration enough to still meet its original specifications). Once you hit 50 years, you’re getting up there. You’d think it would just make more sense to tear down the old 1970s era building and build a newer, nicer, more energy efficient building instead. It’s what we do in the shipping world. But apparently condo associations never got the memo.
@@absalomdraconis I would be very curious to know how he pulled up the rebar and what made it so profitable to spend the labor and energy doing so
“For what seems to be a state tradition” had me laughing violently
me too!
LMFAO!! I replayed that part several times. 😂
"on a scale of Roman concrete to Florida concrete..."
Concrete is fickle stuff, so easy to make mistakes and even easier to cut corners. When you understand how important it is to get it right, you are nothing short of evil for not doing so. I have seen new buildings, that sold off the plans, have exposed reinforcing clearly visible in the carpark, which of course is the sub structure holding everything else up.
In Sydney, Australia where I live, there is a building called the Opal Tower that was evacuated on Christmas day, as were many other nearby buildings, due to fear of a collapse. It didn't but might make a good story on this line of poor quality construction.
In Pakistan, there is a general purpose design for concrete plazas which is used in 99% of buildings everywhere, it has ensured that at least the structure by design remains sound. I don't know the technical term but buildings are made with reinforced concrete beam boxes, concrete slabs for floors and brick walls, though within unit walls can be of anything.
Though collapses still happen frequently in one city; Karachi, due to lax controls and shoddy materials. Frequency is about once every month...
@@brazensmusings2738 Karachi is a big city. Once a month sounds scary.
@@angelachouinard4581 It certainly is scary for a big city. A lot of them are going up as they are going down... Two have gone down this month alone...
OTOH, I am living in a apartment tower with shoddy floor plan and overextended floors in Islamabad. The floor beam goes through the middle of the room, haha... A hallmark copy paste structural plan and then the architect shoe horned the apartments wherever he could... Still it has remained sound with frequent earthquakes.
@@brazensmusings2738 My father traveled to Pakistan quite often and even took my mother with him once. She loved it. So I have a soft spot for Pakistan and I'm sorry to hear that's happing. Stay safe, please.
The original engineers for this project didn't understand, that was the problem.
Love the new Balls Rating. May I submit that you also add one of your foreman caricatures with increasingly distressed body language for each level of severity, such as 1. shrugging with hands out to sides, palms up, 2. side view of hiding bowed head behind clipboard in shame, 3. holding onto hardhat with both hands, knees bent braced to run, 4. running with hardhat and clipboard flying off behind, and 5. standing with skull for a face and hardhat on fire.
Vivid visuals, Would love to see it.
Love it
Have my upvote, please.
😂😂
🥇👏❤️❤️😳❤️👏👏👏🥇
Just wanted to compliment the level of detail presented in the video as you went along through the video. I work with engineering concrete and the description of the design, the visual defects that formed, and the construction methods really helped the storytelling for me. Great job including without getting into the weeds.
As an aside I’m kind of shocked the engineer, when brought in to look at what was unfolding, didn’t start screaming ‘shut it down!’ The cracking and deflection described in the slabs was alarming and was a huge red flag that things were fundamentally wrong with either the design or materials. And considering the potential liability that licensed engineers hold… but I guess if that happened it wouldn’t be the subject of your video today.
That's because yelling 'shut it down' was not in the budget, in order to change the budget and add 'yelling' to the project, a proposal had to be sent first in triplicate to architect, builder and government, and after a few weeks for a committee to gather and study the problem, then an adjustment to the budget may be considered, of course if it falls on holiday there will be delays too. 😵😵😵
maybe it was one case of completion bias.
Seeing the structure almost fully erect made them think about the troubles of getting it redone from scratch and they just wanted to press forward and hope for the best because collapses always "happens to others".
Or maybe, given the flawed design, they were just plain incompetent
My dad was a civil engineer. He would say, " I'd never have signed off on this". He didn't care who got mad from it.
If a building starts deforming while it's still being built, clearly there is something very wrong and the entire thing should be demolished and rebuilt from scratch. I can't comprehend how anyone could possible sleep at night allowing such a project to continue while people are standing on it all day.
Honestly it doesn't even take an engineer to see how bad these problems were. Even unskilled workers on site should be able to tell that there's something wrong when the half-built building is cracking and crumbling. I find it just as shocking that the workers pointing out the defects were willing to keep working in what was clearly a deathtrap.
There was an accident similar to this in Gwangju, South Korea back in January 2022. The high-rise was rushed, it had sub-standard concrete and had not enough time and structural support it needed to harden. It happened almost exactly the same way as the accident of this video, about 30 stories higher up in the air. The only difference is, that the company responsible didn't get bankrupt, let alone suffer severe legal consequences. It somehow manages to be a worse dumpster fire than the same accident 4 decades ago.
Ya that engineer didnt understand what was going on, you cant just add more steel in later placements without addessing the current issue. That would already imply negligence in your sealed design.
I'm not even a professional building engineer and I know that's stupid.
For some stuff you arguably could have gotten away with wrapping columns in steel sheets, but it doesn't take too long before you've built an even stronger building to hold up your new building, at greatly increased cost...
@@absalomdraconis Yeah. As a naval architect, I don’t understand why our land-bound cousins are so opposed to just making the building out of steel in the first place. It’s strong, cheap, and it bends instead of cracking and crumbling. They literally have to use steel anyway because concrete can’t handle the tensile loads. So why not do away with all the stupid heavy concrete and just use the steel for everything?
@@michaelimbesi2314 Steel structures can collapse too. As a humble draughtsman of steel framed buildings, we needed engineers for a reason.
I like structures that show early warning signs, and people not ignoring them. Like prefering a cable stayed bridge over a chain link, so you notice cables fraying instead of a sudden collapse.
I like common sense, not adding fake reinforments merely for esthetics like in the case of the FIU pedestrian bridge.
I prefer gradual improvements with huge safety margins over fashion statements. Building codes enforced without cutting corners. We see buildings being spiced up with heavy cladding and AC units, instead of giving these aging buildings the proper attention.
I want Isambard Kingdom Brunel back.
Agreed, steel structures like the old twin towers would take away a lot of these concerns. But the thing is, a steel framed building still needs concrete to cover the floors: You can´t put a carpet directly on a corrugated steel plate. And I guess you need some kind of cheap and stirdy material to cover the sewers and water lines mounted against your columns. Enter concrete.
So before you know it, your floor plates and trusses are getting replaced by rebar, and your vertical columns become composite too.
All structural steel hidden from inspection, although I can´t help thinking concrete slows the collapse compared to a joint snapping. And the crumbly nature of concrete benefits in providing an early warning sign.
Sky scapers are steel framed, because they flex like your ships. Let´s hope it stays that way.
@@michaelimbesi2314 this is how I feel when people insist on carbon fiber when fiberglass is basically 95% the same and it's not even a weight-critical application. Carbon fiber costs like 15x more, though. And modern biaxial fiberglass is insanely strong.
It ain't the days of chop gun go brrrr and woven roving anymore.
i'm not even an engineer or involved in construction, but when i heard the pooling water and cracks in the concrete, i was like "uh oh, that's not good!!!".
also, love the new scale.
The new scale is great, looking forward to finding out which disaster will be the first 'oh balls' - even though these things are horrible, it's great to learn about them, and sometimes you just gotta laugh the pain away.
I'm waiting on a dumpster fire rating myself, lol. That sounded awful didn't it? I hope everyone here will understand.
@@cynthiatolman326 I'd say that the big Texas City oil refinery explosion (the one he hasn't covered yet!) would rate as a Dumpster Fire. There was definitely a whole lot of fire involved...
Comedy = tragedy + time
Surely a complete and sudden building collapse, causing deaths, is a dumpster fire! How much worse can it get?
@@VanillaMacaron551 Chernobyl
I remember this collapse. The design was weak, the construction standards and materials used were poor, and still they would have been okay if they had not removed all the supporting poles on the lower floors and then poured the roof. After this event contractors left supporting poles in place until the entire building was completed.
I mean I'm not exactly sure it would be ok with holes in pouring and reinforcement visible, but yeah, you're absolutely right that keeping those supports would have lowered the chance of catastrophe:)
They would ONLY have been "okay" if you consider it okay to leave a substandard building with less than code-requirements in the walls, remaining supports, and structure... Sure, the COMPANIES involved wouldn't have been caught up in the catastrophe, but a building structure at roughly 75% of the structure required by law would've been "completed" for the consumers and market...
What if YOUR parents had taken up a condo' in that place before the inevitable happened??? ;o)
Better safe than sorry
Literally EVERY time I see or hear the phrase “Balls, or Oh Balls” on this channel I laugh out loud uncontrollably. Especially when it’s a dialogue bubble and the person depicted is staring a major disaster in the face and ultimately says “oh balls” in reaction. Too funny, so I love the “Balls” scale.
@11:38 -- Off topic, but I've lived in Virginia Beach almost all my life and I'd never heard of those two hero kids in that adjacent news story...
So I did some research and it is fascinating stuff!!
This makes me worry for a few of my friends who live in Florida... It is very sad when the execs ignore the workers' warnings that the shit is about to hit the fan, and they just stick their heads in the sand so the problem can kick them in the ass once they can't get their head out of the ground.
Side note: I like how you always used "Balls" as an expression that things went wrong, like instead of "Oh shit" or "oh crap" or "FUCK!" they just say "Balls", that new disaster scale being called the Balls scale is really fitting.
I shouldn't be surprised it was allowed to pass with the thinner floors, but ... Statutory lesson in listening and paying attention to your workers and foreman, not just giving lip service. Kudos to the other workers who brought the heavy equipment to help with the rescue efforts.
I'm sitting here thinking about being a construction worker on that job in the days before the collapse and asking myself if I'd have had the smarts and self-preservation to walk away. I hope so.
It's not like that. A perfectly intelligent person can die because their boss decides to cut corners on concrete costs by making slabs too thin. These workers aren't qualified in concrete building because they aren't making decisions like that, they're just doing what the qualified person tells them to do. They have no idea that they're doing anything wrong and that's why this is so scary. They didn't understand what was going on because they're supposed to be able to trust their qualified bosses.
that's also what happened at that pedestrian bridge collapse in Florida. the workers saw the cracking and reported it. engineers said it was fine. turned out (once again) it wasn't. I know John has done a video on it.
@@nadapenny8592 You don't need to be an expert in concrete or architecture to know that a building under construction is not supposed to have deformed floor slabs or honeycomb cracks all over it.
I've quit a job because of lack of quality control. Didn't want anything to do with it.
@@nadapenny8592 It's not especially difficult to self-educate about principles like "Creep" or "Honeycombing" or "Spider-web" crack patterns. "Deflection" and "Deformation" are similarly simple to learn, notice, and point out...
It actually comes down to asking yourself if YOU would let your mom move into the place you're working at, just knowing what you know... and then a general "err on the side of caution". You may walk off a few jobs a little premature, but you can DEFINITELY decrease your chances of attaching your name and pouring your efforts into something forever branded "A Death Trap". ;o)
That moment when you can’t sleep and you’re here within the first few minutes of uploading… Been to Cocoa Beach a few times as a kid but never knew or heard anything about this, today I learned!
Thank you for watching
Six miles to the west, on Merritt Island, there was an additional death directly related to the Harbor Cay collapse:
A crane responding to the emergency was following a police escort eastbound on State Road #520. At the intersection of State Road #3, an elderly woman waited for the State Patrol vehicle to clear the intersection, but pulled in front of the crane. The crane operator tried to avoid a collision, but ended up rolling onto the driver's side on top of the car, killing the woman. The crane operator received minor injuries.
Florida Man! Drive that vegetable truck! haha
@ Louis Becker: Yes, have been under police escort several times, and have had a few near misses from vehicles pulling out in front of me. When you are moving an 8 metre / 26 foot wide house over the road... You do get some idiots on the road!
We were moving a house back in c1985, and this day, was front escort. Police car behind me, house behind the police car. Sturt Highway, 2 lanes, near Greenock. Car with boat on trailer goes flying past me. On the CB radio - live one coming! Driver of the car and boat seen the police car, hit the brakes in emergency mode. Boat luanched off trailer, skidding over the road, stopping about 3 inches from going through the front of the police car! About 1 hour later.... We laugh about it now, but, it was a scary experience at the time!
I was trained and worked in heavy civil engineering in the UK. In that period there were different forms ofproject contract . But most were of the Architectural format, Where a consultant structural engineer is hired to monitor and amend the planned format of the building. In a"cast on site" RC structure like this. The structural plan would have required local planning approval of the RC structural design drawings before construction even starts. As the structure progresses the local planning office would inspect major elements before they were cast. (The structural consultant should always do this anyway) . In short this project should never have got passed the drawings before it was amended.
The concrete mix is certified And Checked by regular testing of concrete blocks cast AT THE TIME! These cubes are then crushed in a press to see if the 7 day and 21 day strength performs as specified. In the above project, just allowing 7 days between floors seems insufficient, even if they staggered the process. Also the foundations problems associated with conditions in Florida can be yet another nasty situation. In the UK we often see columns and beams cast on site, with precast floor elements produced-off site and lowered into place by a crane. Then bonded into the structure with reinforcement and grouting. Another form very common in America is a steel frame (clad in concrete) with Pre cast concrete floors.
In the project you describe - with cracking seen on the underside of beams and floors at least by the 2nd floor. All work would have been stopped (by the structural consultant, the architect or just the planning officer) until the source of the problem was corrected. It should NEVER have reached the 3rd floor, let alone the roof! I would strongly expect that local corruption played a major part in this failure. Because so many people (with the clear responsibility to stop it) simply didn't say ANYTHING, or request concrete testing result before the work proceeded. Big envelopes full of dirty cash probably changed hands on this job. I did work for a structural consultant in Reinforced Concrete. They would have been horrified at the drawings stage. We have codes of practice and regular materials testing to prevint this kind of "BUILT IN" DISASTER!
So do you think the UK has its s*** together now after all the tower block collapses and fires since the sixties?
As a professional concrete engineer, could a jet plane take down the twin towers?
@@RealDixonPeter way beyond my knowledge.
In Florida they just don't have our UK mindset about safety. Though there are some very good safety agencies in the US at federal level, and they do some great investigations where they don't pull punches, they don't have as much legislation backing them up as ours do here, and some states just don't believe in regulation- Florida being one of the worst if various collapses are anything to go by. I've had more input and more inspections from Building Control changing a 12 foot square flat roof to a pitched roof on a single storey extension than they seem to get on major builds- it seems they self-certificate a lot of the time, and we all know what that means. Not that Grenfell leaves us with much to boast about. The problem we have now is that 12+ years of a very right-wing anti-safety, pro-developer-profit government has undermined a lot of our regulations and inspections.
@@alisonwilson9749 yup. On top of it all is a general denial of coastal erosion because God forbid anything is connected to climate change. "Woke" is a four letter dirty word and if the governor gets any real chance of moving to the white house, I'll have to consider leaving the country, not just the state.
Yes this is what happens often times when corners are cut and the government and other organizations look the other way. It's all about the money and human lives are secondary at best.
Anyone think the 'Balls Rating' system will last?
I hope so!
I've lived in Florida my whole life and I've stayed in quite a few condos over on the gulf side(west) and every time, except once, they always looked like they were built very well and in great shape. That one time though was pretty bad, it had a major crack right when you walked in at the bottom of the floor all the way up the wall to the roof. There were a couple more in the living room that did the same, from the bottom baseboard all the way up to the roof. Just the whole foundation was pretty sketchy
*three months later* The other other other OTHER Florida condo collapse.
XD
This showed up in a related video suggestion after watching a video on "The Expanse" no more than 6 minutes after you posted it.
I would say you have some good reach.
At this point, I'm surprised Florida itself hasn't collapsed.
The silver lining to melting ice caps is no more Florida. Shhh, don't tell them until it's already underwater.
@@johnladuke6475 Go kiss Al Gore's bottom.
@@Dallas_K Why would you assume I want anything to do with Al Gore? Florida is world-reknowned for inbred, racist idiocy. All kinds of people cheer for its demise, not just people who voted for the most boring man on the planet.
🤣
Give it a couple of decades. Practically the whole state is basically at sea level. GOPher voters in Florida will reap what they sow (as someone who voted GOP for 20 years before I started seeing through the lies stacked on lies that form every bit of rightwing ideology)
Thank you John. I didn’t realise that the ACI were such an aggressive agency. You’d assumed that they were mild mannered engineers but apparently they are extremely vociferous! 😀
Alright no sleep for snother 30 minutes
:D
Having grown up in the town next to Cocoa, I can say for sure that "nothing had failed so far" is how everything is done, at least in Central Florida x'D
Things are always built by the lowest bidder. My father was one of the designers of the US military's HUMVEE. He had a lot of practical complaints about the designs survivability and practicality, but nobody listened. Keep in mind, that this way during its original creation as a replacement for the Jeep... Not a combat vehicle but a behind the lines support vehicle. Being a former toolmaker with an engineering background, I've seen so much shady behavior in industry that I personally view most industrial structures as death traps. The people that build these things only care about profit, safety is a myth at best to them.
My father was a project manager for the US Army CECOM in electronics and communications systems. Getting the politically-connected outside contractors to meet the project performance standards was a constant and demoralizing challenge.
They sure aren't always the lowest bidder
@@samsonsoturian6013 having served in the Marines post ex facto and having been a civilian medic for many years, I will politely argue with you.
@@wallacegrommet9343 that was how my father felt as well and that is why he stepped down. I'm certainly not belittling your father by any means, the fact he was in the industry demands respect.
@@medicmule that doesn't mean anything. Most officers don't even know a damn thing about requisition contracts.
"To what seems to be a state tradition"
Savage😂😂
I like your new scale of rating the disasters. Much more simplified. Doesn't take a rocket scientist degree to realize this video is a number 4 (outright negligence) appreciate you going thru all the research to make this video. Stay warm and dry if you can in your part of the UK.
For what its worth, the new scale gets a Florida Woman seal of approval, John. It's evocative of how Floridians view hurricane ratings. 1-2, eh whatever. 3, maybe we should buy more than beer. 4-5 oh we're probably screwed.
Haha! You sound like my BFF talking about hurricanes! She grew up in Puerto Rico, then moved to south Florida for a good few years, and her hurricane stories blow my Canadian mind. Like the one where she, her brother, and their cousin underestimated a storm, and ended up outrunning a hurricane on the Interstate in their Honda Civic... 🤷♀
Of course, when she moved up north here, she had to learn about winter! 😉
Thank you for bringing this outright negligence to my attention and many others attention. Found the information that you provided very interesting. May I suggest that you take a look at other buildings throughout the state of Florida such as Daytona Beach condos like the Hawaiian Inn and the Holiday Inn and a 20 story condominium building all within the same area. That were highly affected by Coastal erosion due to Hurricane Ian and Dorian. You can see very similar construction to this building that was shown in this negligence episode. Only there it's even worse some of the buildings are actually supported by what appear to be telephone pole like support beams that are not really set in any order and are literally rotting away. Some of the buildings you can even see slanting and the erosion continues to eat at the base of the buildings now that many of the buildings have already lost their seawalls being knocked down by Coastal surge tide effect some of the walls that constructed the sea walls are not even more than 4 in thick. The awful concrete design along with the coastal erosion destroyed the buildings sea walls that were also poorly constructed. Work has already been done to try to save the buildings but I would love for you or a show like yours too review their structural integrity and show the blatant defects not only from the damage suffered from the hurricane title surge but from the way many of the buildings were built to begin with. Concrete laid so thin and improperly that you can actually see the rebar popping through literally rusting a corroding right through the concrete. Cracks that resemble a severely cracked broken egg. Rickety Sharing and shearing the weight of the upper floors. One of the buildings the buildings up to 22 floors. Other buildings are 10 stories to five stories. No structural i-beams in many of the buildings no structural headers it almost all the buildings very poor structural integrity concrete. As if the concrete was mixed with beach sand literally flaking away. Again like a brittle broken cracked egg. I would love to see your take on all of it. Daytona is also famous for balconies literally collapsing even without storms. And is notorious for horrible building standards.
Between stories like this and Surfside, I would never live in a Florida multi-level condominium.
As a former (born and raised) Floridiot, it's safe to say you should just never live in Florida. 😂
That's like never going outside in the rain because some people were struck by lightning
After watching all the @practicalengineering and related videos about how and why Surfside collapsed, this is almost tragically obvious.
Sadly so!
Two more YT channel names who did deep dives into the Champlain Towers collapse:
Jeff Ostroff
Building Integrity
Ostroff went deep into the blueprints and engineering inspections along with incidental videos before the collapse taken by visitors.
@@mommachupacabraI second Jeff, He's been all over the collapse.
@@mommachupacabra Building Integrity is the more technical of the two in terms of explanations for those learning about structural engineering, but yes, they're both interesting.
Thank you John. These stories of utter negligence make my skin crawl and my blood boil!
I love the new rating scale! I also really enjoy the weather updates😂 please never stop doing them.
I recently moved to Florida its exciting to see an episode about something in my home state although it is unfortunately tragic.
Get and Keep a wrought-iron screen door for your house (both front AND rear), and be DAMN wary of anything "condo"... Otherwise, Florida can be a pretty amazing place to enjoy! ;o)
This is why I ignore my coworkers and even supervisors when they claim I am pestering them when I report damaged equipment or questionable infrastructure at my job.
They claim "Oh it's been like that since [insert months, years, etc here] and nothing has happened yet!"
I reply: "It's the yet the worries me. I don't want it to happen at all. And there is a fine line between 'Its fine' and "Oh shit'."
Nothing ever goes wrong, right up until it does.
@@jasoncoates1835 And then it's too late
a condo collapse in florida? it would never happen today!
Lol your new disaster scale had me cracking up
Thank you!
This week my schedule has been very unusual, and until you popped up I'm drinking my coffee, scrolling, and thinking it's Friday, lol. Thanks for reminding me it's Saturday, and thank you for your content. Hope the sun pops out soon.
Just realized you are closing in on a million! High quality content will result in much subscribing.
people really can and will cut any corners just to save money. regardless of the potential collateral
Yea pretty standard it seems
Small correction. The bar chairs DO make sure that the rebar is in the right location but the consequence of it being in the wrong location is NOT really extra bending but more a dramatic loss of strength or durability. It also sounds like the bars ended up all bunched up which would mean that the liquid concrete couldn't get into all of the gaps around the rebar. Reinforced concrete is designed so that the steel and concrete work together to support the load and if there are air gaps around the concrete this can dramatically reduce the strength.
John, you should check out the L'Ambiance Plaza collapse in Bridgeport CT in the 1980's. Cause was a faulty "amazing" new building method called "lift slab construction." At least a 3, maybe a 4 on your new scale.
I remember that one. Also the Pigeonhole parking garage in Cleveland was a lift slab collapse.
@@angelachouinard4581 liftslab was the new cool thing everyone was doing in Bridgeport at the time. And there was a lot of building abs renewal going on at that time.
@@stephenbritton9297 I grew up in CT so all the fall down go boom stuff there interests me, like the Hartford civic center. But I didn't know liftslab was the rage in Bridgeport.
@@angelachouinard4581 I remember seeing a lot of it, as a kid walking around the city with my dad.
@@stephenbritton9297 I was living elsewhere by then, didn't see it.
I say florida has 2 traditional disasters-sinkholes and collapses. florida is on top of an aquifer which they also use for their water needs.
Cute as the "Balls Scale" is I think a variation of the IAEA Nuclear incident scale (ie 1-7, how far outside the local area do effects spread) would be better for these presentations. Terrible as this collapse is it didn't really have much national or international affect, while the crash of the BOAC Comets changed air travel going forward (letting US companies surpass the brits in jet travel, and introducing new understanding of metal fatigue/window design).
Well, if you're going to do Floridian condo collapses, then you have to do the Surfside condo collapse that happened last year!
He did title the thumbnail "The Other Florida condo collapse". Not to mention, I believe the investigation is still ongoing.
@@Emigdiosback I wrote this comment before playing the video so that was my mistake.
You'd think the Land of Sinkholes And Hurricanes would have stringent building codes 🤔
I worked construction in Florida (Miami Beach) in the early 80's when this happened. I was hired with absolutely no concrete experience as a laborer, but my main job was translating English to Spanish for the other workers most of whom couldn't get to the bathroom if they had to do it in English. No surprise to me that buildings are so shoddy. No doubt the Traffficante family had something to do with it as well.
@@Eibarwoman -- That is indeed the family. Great bunch of guys...in case they're listening
Why is it that anything that resembles Traficant or Trafficante seems to have mafia ties between the Youngstown, OH politician and the Tampa crime family?
@@Eibarwoman -- No clue
There are new houses going up at the end of my street, here in Red Alabama. I want to vandalize the big roadside sign advertising them with “Homes built by cheerful, underpaid, Mexican immigrants with the least expensive materials the contractors could find”. I walked through them on weekends. The moisture barrier for the outside walls is so thin, you could nearly see through it. Two have already sold, unfinished.
@@samarnadra in Australia they only speak Chinese. If you Google building issues in Sydney, we’re looking at a similar issue.
If I remember correctly didn't this building company or engineer previously have a building they made collapse because they didn't follow the state requirements? I might be wrong but I thought I heard that somewhere...
"Leave the problems in place on the lower floors, and we'll *try* to do it better as we continue!"
If you ever get to any more Australian construction examples I’d recommend for the adaption of
1. She’ll be alright
2. Oh for ****s sake.
3.Oh! That One!
4. Get A Lawyer
5. Harold Holt.
For those that that don’t know, Harold Holt was a PM who got himself drowned/eaten by shark/ kidnapped by submarine after swimming.
Blimey that’s crazy
Florida Man Land!
:D
Did you ever review the Hyatt Regency building collapse in Kansa City in 1981? THAT was a dumpster fire inside of a dumpster fire.
I worked for Univel in Cocoa Beach in the early 80s. It was a company known to take shortcuts.
I was thinking this would be the more recent collapse. I don't even recall ever hearing about this one (I'll grant I think I was in kindergarten and only recall Mt St Helens and the attempts on Reagan and the Pope around that time), but you'd think they'd learn. Nope.
Welcome to Florida.
I like the rating system.
I think the new disaster scale is great! The most terrifying imo is 'another day at the office'
Another building in Miami Beach 20 blocks from the Champlain Towers was recently evacuated because of noticeable cracks and flooding.
Another excellent episode Sir, dumpster fire and all!!!🙏😢⚖️🤔😵💫
Apparently. they're expecting the Port Royale building to fall down soon as well, as it developed a crack through the entirety of one of its basement support beams, leading it to be evacuated a couple of weeks ago. :/
Wont be the last time a condo collapses in florida. Seems to be a thing in florida.
It would be helpful to know the floor spans involved...11" or even 8" is a very thick reinforced concrete slab... most apartment floor slabs here are typically they are 4 to 6" here... for 12-15' spans... are you referring to structural slab depth or overall slab depth?
I often think of Florida as a giant sandbar, waiting for the right storm to come wash it away.
Yes, I've lived in Florida.
Kind of like the Isle of Sheppey Here in the UK
Hey! I've heard of that place!
😉😁
A matter of time only...
Where the hell was the building inspector?? He should have shut down the construction when the first cracks were seen in the first/second floor pours.
Extremely well done, much appreciated.
Have you done anything on the history of the Wheeling suspension bridge?
Thank you and thank you for the suggestion
A little bit harsh for saying this is a Florida thing. NYC has building collapses about every 3-5 years and no one notices.
Do the Hard Rock hotel collapse in New Orleans of 2019
Thank you for the suggestion
Florida is not an easy place to build. the ground is not exactly favorable... ... so any mistake is gonna be a bit aggravated by the lack of a solid base below it.and it's a wee bit humid so water infiltration is a thing.
Did they not require core samples in the 80’s damn.. Great video as always!!
Thank you!
@@PlainlyDifficult Also if you’re on the topic of building collapses during construction, the New Orleans Hard rock Cafe collapse is interesting and happened recently.
I’ll subscribe because i came across this channel by chance, I’m into engineering and I live in South London.
Perfect time to get off work! Love your content!
Yay! Thank you!
Congrats, Florida! Achievement unlocked.
Does it sound louder in the left ear for anybody else?
That's odd thank you for letting me know!
@@PlainlyDifficult yeah in stereo it sounds like your behind and to the left.
@@lolnutshot he's sneaking up on you
Better watch out before he gets you
Another Florida disaster video?
Man, it seems like me getting outta there when I did was a good call.
Leaving is always the best part of Floriduh! (Source: born and raised former Floridiot)
One has got to ask where the project manager and Quality Control chief was
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Omgggg crazy!! My family is from Cocoa Beach!! My mom grew up there and my gramma lived there for decades lolol so cool to hear my neighborhood being talked about
Just in time, Thank you again John!
My pleasure!
It's great to see a rating scale back for the disasters. The videos had been feeling slightly incomplete without one.
Average Floridian architecture lel
Typical northern developer who comes to Florida and hires the cheapest contractor whose under qualified and incompetent. The owner/developer was Towne Realty of Milwaukee was the developer of Xanadu and about 10 other properties. They hired bottom barrel rednecks instead of the qualified local builders.
After watching several of your videos, I'm determined to never step foot in a building, or drive over a bridge, made of "structural" concrete. It's like they say, steel is real.
Don't miss the analysis of the Jan. 28, 2022, collapse of the Fern Hollow Bridge in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. It was real.
As if you have the choice, lol . . .
Considering a score of 4 is for gross negligence, as in this case, I'm guessing a score of 5 would require malicious intent in addition to gross negligence?
If Florida isn't the definition of a collapse then idk what is
The best thing about Plainly Difficult is that, if you're playing them for the first time while you're also doing things around the house, you stand a better than passing chance of walking in on a perfectly normal, even droll voiceover, but matched to a cartoon of a logo with a speech bubble that says "LICK MY CONCRETE BALLS."
Oddly enough, Denny Pate retains his license, in spite of the FIU collapse.
I see the problem already!
Those three guys at 7:00 are train drivers for the London Underground, not mechanical engineers!
I immediately thought “oh this happened before and it wasn’t Miami?” And then I was like “omg it’s Cocoa Beach where we went on that cruise one time.”
I’m getting afraid to stay in any condo in Florida.
Absolutely love the new rating scale.
A friend of mine was stationed near Cocoa Beach in the mid 80s. He said he could watch the space shuttle launch from his backyard. I saw the Challenger blow up on live TV. I went to work and that was all anybody was talking about. It was on every radio station, all day. Then Reagan went on TV and talked about it. This building collapse is kind of a vague memory. I was too busy getting high in 1981. I know it was on the news. They shouldn't build con-damn-miniums on sand.
Will you re-rate your older videos into "Balls Scale"?
I think some of your previous videos, particularly some of your nuclear ones, shouldn't be re-rated - for instance, the Chernobyl RBMK #4 disaster exceeds Balls Scale level 5 "dumpster fire" by such a significant margin, your haz mat men would call their shop steward if you rerated it down to 5.
On the other hand, the Vajont Dam disaster definitely would fit at a 5 rating on the Balls Scale, with Ibrox Stairway 13 rating at 4 (mayyybe 3?) on the Balls Scale, and the I-40 bridge collapse definitely a 2 on the Balls Scale.
Well, the conclusion wasn't what I was expecting, but, still absolutely NOT surprising.
When I heard you say, "8 inch floors, but State Law called for 11 inches," what I was really expecting was, "So they just poured the floor slabs 3 inches thicker." Paying no attention to the additional load on the uprights.
I've seen this.