My Secret Ride Cymbal... shhh dont tell anyone
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Ive been flooded with questions about this ride cymbal since the first time I used it. This is a made in Japan cymbal made out of brass which doesnt have the best reputation when it comes to cymbals. B20 iS tHe OnLy AlLoY cYmBaLs ShOuLd Be MaDe Fr0m! 👈 That was me until I found this cymbal. I've been on the hunt for another one and have missed out a couple. Though, in the process I came across some other MIJ cymbals, but they dont compare to the illusive 22" ride cymbal. These things are RARE! (as in theyre impossible to find) I finally got my hands on a 22" MIJ Apollo Ride Cymbal, but its not exactly like my original. So lets see how it compares!
My Secret Ride Cymbal... shhh dont tell anyone - เพลง
Whats your all time favorite ride cymbal?
Zildjian Avedis Sweet Ride 21”…
Zildjian A Custom 20” Medium Ride
Byzanth medium thin 22’ dry
22’ big apple dark ride
21 sweet ride
Have you tried to put a key in the keyhole to see if it unlock anything?
Just the secrets of the universe. Nothing exciting really...
Wow I wish I had your wisdom sir
How do you think he got his chops
Kind of a stupid comment but since I'm here so early maybe it'll have more chances to be read: David, I've been watching your videos for YEARS, thank you for keeping up the awesome job and for yes, kinda being a pillar in the online drumming community. Lots of love from Italy!
nah bro this comment rules 💯
Seconded
U jammin on some Ufip pies? ;-)
È davvero un eroe
@@mariorossipuzza Unico nel suo genere
David probably just single handedly raised the price of those cymbals
Yeah! Just like those WalMart rides lol
That’s why he bought one first
Neat. For those that might not know, Apollo was a cheap, import drum company that brought Japanese kits to America in the 60s. You see them all over the place in St Louis as there was a music store here that was a major importer of the Apollo stuff. I have my Step Dad's Apollo kit he got when he was 12. Nothing great, but it's cool to jam on a 50+ year old kit sometimes.
One of my first drum kits was a red sparkle Apollo from the 60's! It wasn't very good but it helped me get started on the instrument. It also had an amazing-sounding 18-inch brass cymbal with no markings other than "Made in Italy.'
Put the two in a hi-hat stand and have 22" Ride Hats.
My god the old one has such a sweet tone...the new one is also amazing but more as a crash.Both make an amazing combo,maybe you should try them as hihats :p
I second the hi-hat suggestion but un-ironically. Also I would totally use those two guys in tandem. They would probably sound pretty great together.
Ha! I'd like to see him try that too :D
Haha’ imagine using some 22” highhats! They would sound so rad I reckon’ they would probably sizzle like nothing else and they would look completely over the top aswell’ but yeah it’s amazing how some brass cymbals just have something to offer that bronze alloy mix cymbals don’t have’ usually that’s abit of a flat kind of long to to them but hey it’s all personal preference’ ✌️🥁✌️
th-cam.com/video/M32Daj4WWLc/w-d-xo.html
I’m surprised how similar they sound when crashed. The ride is very different though. I kind of prefer the Apollo, at least as a main ride, a bit more defined. I’d likely use the other as a left side crash/ride, being higher pitched and able to open quickly. Nice video, good tune!
Exactly what I was thinking
This is the drummer equivalent to a legendary item in an action RPG game.
Ive been watching you since 4th grade when i started playing drums for church... Im now an 11th grader and im still watching you.. Keep up the good work!
I haven’t personally done this, but I have seen grommets used to “repair” keyholes.
I used a #3 grommet on an old Zildjian ride. It works and doesn't choke the cymbal. I Installed it at a sailmaking loft. Got a 22" 2002 ride from '77 with a 1" crack coming off the keyholed hole. On the fence about installing a grommet on that because it still sounds rad and I don't lay into it that much. It had the crack when I bought it for $50
@@adderon7476 the worst that can happen if you put the grommet on it is it'll be somewhat annoying to remove if you don't like it. I've experienced the regret of not making a preventative fix when I had the chance.
This just popped into my head, but maybe an Aquarian cymbal spring with those rubber "felts" would also go a long way to prevent further cracking. Maybe, maybe not. Just an idea.
I use rubber grommets on all my cymbals
Interesting. Brass is now the bottom of the barrel and considered beginner cymbals, usually coming with starter kits, which is why they aren't branded. I had brass cymbals when i first started. Still have them somewhere. The problem is they do tend to crack and bend super easy. One of mine became so warped and cracked with chunks out of it, it became an awesome effects cymbal before effect cymbals were cool.
I have a cheap 16 in crash that warped weirdly inside out and sounds like a weird short decay china.
Excellent JAM RDVR. You are always inspirational to this 70 yr old, still gigging. THANK YOU
You can repair your ride with a English two pence coin
I add lead soldier used from the plumbing industry
I first melt a puddle of the solder to the face of the coin
Once the solder has cooled I then place the coin the the under side of the Cymbal bell
Then re heat the Center of the cymbal until the lead solder re melts then drill the hole
It’s a very strong fix and will never fail and I can’t tell any difference in the sound
If anything it make the cymbal stronger than they are from new
Try not to over heat the cymbal or it will change the colour and once it starts to melt I just role the cymbal round a bit just to even out the pool of solder
I’m a plumber but to be honest it’s so easy anyone can do it with a few basic tools
"I'll fix those cymbals, no sweat... well."
I did a similar repair using a brass washer just over an inch, about 30mm, diameter, but on a Paiste bronze crash cymbal where i was worried that any heat would make the alloy brittle. So i used the best epoxy i could buy locally in the UK, called Araldite. I hammered the washer slightly into a curve to match the top of the cymbal,and after carefully adjusting the cracks round the hole with a hammer to optimum level surface, glued it on. I used a bolt and nut with two other washers to carefully clamp it tight, and left it set up over a basin of warm water to optimise the temperature for curing the adhesive. Later i smoothed a bit more epoxy on to fill the cracks and around the washer outer edge and sanded it smooth. I had a can of gold metallic aerosol paint lying around, after a touch of that you could hardly see the repair. A year later, it was still good, even the bell sound not bad tho dulled a little, i had been careful to use a nylon sleeve and good supportive felts.Then i sold it cheap with a beginner kit to a friend.
When i was in the USA, i found an epoxy called JB Weld which was the best i ever used, but i could not find a supplier near me in the UK. So i would recommend that.
Nice sound.
Love the video editing at the end. The Oriental kept changing orientation with each beat.
Good score on that ride!
I rehearsed at a children's music school in Kiev a few times. They had barely usable Amati set (from Czechoslovakia) and a 19-20" ride that came with it -- obviously machine stamped (with possibly some hammering), looked like a trash can lid.
It was one of the most musical jazz rides I ever played (and I used to own an old Istanbul K and played many exceptional cymbals).
A little like the Zildjian Breakbeat Ride (which you should absolutely check out, some are absolutely magical).
I have a Meinl 20 " HCS brass that came with a kit. Buffed the top, added hammering to it, and now really enjoying it. More mellow ,dry ping sound to it! The custom brass ozones sound nice too. Brass can make good trash stacks for practice. Another good cymbal to toy with and hammer is those old zbt's, fun projects. I also have a 14" zbt crash, hammered it and it goes on top of my "S" family b12 master sound hi-hat.
That keyhole is nightmare fuel. Never had a cymbal do that personally but it makes it so that I would be afraid to really hammer on that bad boy.
yeah Ive been scared tbh, Ive never had a cymbal keyhole before, but I understand peoples pain now! haha
I have had a Pearl Wild (first series) ride cymbal that is 22 inch. I have had it since about 1985-6 and everywhere I have played and even recorded...everyone thinks it is a Pastie Rude ride cymbal. It has that sound but at a 1/4 of the price. That is back then...they have become quit high in price due to the fact they sound like the Rude. I polished the top to match all my Zildjians and thus nobody could see the name which is also on the bottom. Some stuff made in Japan has a good to great sound...but purests refuse to try ot give them credit.
They remind me of this old Zilco 22" medium/medium thin ride with 5 rivets I had for a long time. Super dry, almost clangy but when you laid into it the thing would really come to life. Always sounded good crashed along my 22" Zildjian medium ride or 18" Wuhan
I like that the talk is of gear that isn’t “the best” but sounds amazing. I have a Zildjian Amir 20” ride from when I was a kid that sounds phenomenal. Additionally I have a Sabian HHX Evolution ride I paid tons for that also sounds phenomenal - proving that not everything with a hefty price tag is ALWAYS better than any other gear.
So... Gear aside... Cool groove on this video! I've seen a huge growth in your playing since I first started watching your videos. Just wanted to tell you that. Keep up the stellar content! Thanks!
Your flow is outstanding
Cool! I have a 20” with the same “Japan” stamp as well as an 18” crash and 14” hats with a similar stamp but saying “made in Japan”. Really fun cymbals!
Very nice. One of my favorite channels. I was grooving to the background music in the early parts of the video and I would love to see a demonstration of that tasty little brush flourish (or whatever it was) @ 3:37 - 3:38.
I'm digging the new-to-you one. A little brighter but still nice and washy, I found it worked a bit better in that mix.
I have played many ride cymbals along the way, but the Meinl 21" Transition ride just has so much presence and many subtle tone differences. The bell is beautiful, and the feel most importantly is so responsive.
mike really knocked it out the park with the transition, one of my favorite cymbals
The way you make that snare dance is crazy, love your style bro keep it up
They both sound fantastic! Great finds :)
Dave, I totally understand the cheap, brass surprise gem cymbal. I have a pair of old 14" Camber brass hats that punch WAY above their weight class and I love them. Now I no longer immediately dismiss any brass cymbal I encounter because I may find a keeper.
Study Lance's keyhole rescue videos to save your Apollo buddy.
My high school had a Camber 20" ride that was an absolute gem. I wish I could go back and buy it, but it was in pretty bad shape, it's probably been destroyed by some kids by now.
Sounds beautiful!
The Apollo seems a bit quieter, it's probably from it being some-odd 200 grams lighter than the old cymbal.
Sounds really nice dude! Have you given thought to putting a rubber grommet in the hole of the old one? Might mitigate some of the cracking and keyholing
Pefect sound! Love it!
I recently dug out my old Paiste Dixie 21' that was also added to Pearl kits in the 60s. Made out of nickel silver, extra thin. Had one hidden at my parent's place for years, didn't want to sell it because it's so cheap. Similar story, after rediscovering it I sometimes prefer it over K Sweet Ride. Gonna give it a couple of rivets this year.
I have a whole set of those Japan stamped cymbals. I have a 22" sizzle ride with no rivets, 3 odd sized crashes, 2 odd sized splashes and a set of high hats 14". Its awesome to come across this video because I was obsessed with finding them and completing the set. The hats are stamped with Japan under the bell and Kingston on the top.
Great playing!
hi david, love your channel. have you thought about making a video that shows how to maximize an aluminum snare drum? i have an old one of those and i'd love to see your point of view on how to get the best out of an aluminum snare. cheers.
The cymbal sounds GREAT....
More like OLD school stuff.
Best of all your drumming has improved
Immensely congrats.
J.p.
Daaaamn Dave! 'Dem ghost notes though! 😎🤘🥁
I have an 20" "APPOLLO" that is both the worst and the best sounding cymbal I have. It's super thin and all bent up, with thick patina. So it's like a verrry dark sounding FX cymbal.
It reminds me of the Zultan Dark Matter series. They sound like this to me and are reasonably priced, it might be worth checking that ride out if you haven't before. At least then if you need another you know what it is by having branding on it. (First video of yours I've seen).
Personally I prefer rides with a bit more definition and nice thick ping to the bell like the Sabian 21" Raw Bell Dry but thats irrelevant.
Nice piece!
I've been watching your videos since like 2015 you have such consistently good content
David I like the old, has darker sounds!☺
Maybe it’s fun to hydrodip a tom or snaredrum for a video. I’ve seen it already once or twice on different channel’s, but I’ve never seen it on yours😁
The Apollo ride sounds surprisingly good!
The brass cymbals tend to be more brittle, hence the keyholing/cracking you're experiencing.
I've never cared for the sound of brass cymbals tbh. But that one sounds pretty good.
I’m digging the “new” ride! 👌
I had a 24 inch Beverley that was probably made in the same Japanese factory. Great sounding ride and even a fantastic crash for "trash can endings". Unfortunately, also a little too easy to dent with a side stick on "trash can endings." You night want to treat it gently.
Each ride sounds good. Sounds like a win to me.
My ride is late 70’s early 80’s 20” zildjan.and also the 21” sweet ride demonstration my Hannah Ford in brilliant finish
Best ride I ever played was a 20” Zildjian that was half of a pair of high school marching cymbals. Still looking for one...
My school has an 18 inch pair, both are in pretty rough shape but I can almost guarantee it would sound different. Let me know if your interested
I guess these are the matching cymbals that came with stencil kits back in the day. Now the cymbals are becoming a thing. You are starting a trend rdavidr!
P.S. I need to start a reverb, you have inspired me.
David- great video! Could you make another possibly where we don't have any music accompanying? Just the drums & cymbal. Btw: I recommend putting a grommet on your original one here.
Just posted the drums only of this on my 2nd channel for ya!
th-cam.com/video/FBGmhRxUCis/w-d-xo.html
I had a Sabian prototype made and it’s been the best crash I ever had but it did come in cracked. It lasted about 5 years still sounds great but I don’t want to use it live all the time so I ordered another and it’s amazing… but not the same at all. Totally does the job but side by side they’re completely different animals so I guess my lesson is if you’re a newer drummer don’t be surprised by sonic myriad on the high end cymbals. Once you get into hand hammered stuff each one is it’s own unique creature unlike the lower end cymbals. They can be same series type and size and still have different crispness pitch sustain and tone.
Good skills nice syncopation well played
Nice comparison, both sound good with your setup. I prefer the Apollo.
DUDE! I totaly have one!! It came with a vintage Ludwig kit someone gabe me a few years ago! It sounds amazing!!!!
The older one has a more subtle, smoother sound. The new one sounds pretty damn good. Sounds like you found a suitable replacement.
Nice video dude, keep going... Thank you
I like the Apollo a lot. Nice stick defenition and its crashes nicely too. I'd buy it if I had the chance.
Dave, that RIIIDE 😩😩
Legend
Is it possible to use a hole saw or step bit to remove just the keyhole and cracks and then perhaps find some type of rubber grommet to put in the hole that will size it back down to fit on a cymbal stand?
You can really see and hear how the extra mass of the "old" one really adds to the sound.
sounds like a sweet ride. really digging my xsr 20" monarch ride currently.
Way darker and more stick definition than a Sweet Ride. Totally different
@@pacificdrumma i agree its darker (could be mics) but the sweet ride has more definition than this after countless years of playing it. the way it crashes is totally different from the sweet ride and that says a lot regarding stick definition. its not totally different. it just plays differently but its all there...
OG is still the GOAT‼️
everything sounds amazing
The old cymbal that you just have, the sound of it is just the same of my ride cymbal. I have one but the brand is 22" Ride Avedis Zildjian. But the tone is really same of mine and yours.
I could imagine the keyhole in the old one has to do with how small the hole originally was, because the owner had to put it on a stand with no sleeve.
At first, when I seen all of the jump cuts I was beginning to doubt your drumming abilities. I wondered why you couldn’t play more than a bar at a time. Then, I remembered what the subject of the video was and came to the conclusion that they both sound a lot a like! The new one is a bit more crashy but that just means it has more dynamics. I’m glad that you found a replacement. Your Goodwill is MUCH better than mine!
Why bother making the comment about his drum skills? Seems a bit unnecessary and mean-spirited if you realized that isn't the point.
@@jeffsmith441
Read my comment again and you’ll realize that I thought the jump cuts were because he couldn’t drum consistently but it was actually because he was switching ride samples every bar so we could hear the difference in cymbals. However, considering I personally couldn’t tell a difference between the two cymbals being played (and he is a master at jump cuts) my thought process at the that time resulted in my original comment. Meaning, the two cymbals sounded extremely similar and he found a great replacement. I thought it was funny because instead of him not being good at drums, it was just me being stupid. Which, actually made his tone test work better for me because I didn’t even realize it was two different cymbals to begin with. Having noticed my ignorance in everything stated above, I humbly shared my thoughts in the “comment” section of the video.
Clearly, he doesn’t suck at drumming dude. Don’t be such a pansy next time.
@@ryanwilson5936haha - fair enough. I gotcha.
It's a crashride like Zildjian built 50 years ago. I have one. But yours sounds great.
I have a ride that has that same stamp on it. It is a 24” beast! The thing is so dirty and dry I don’t want to clean it b/c I don’t want to lose its sound. I did do some research years ago, and only found one cymbal manufacturer in Japan, and they started up in like 2004. I got mine used like 16 years ago. So, it couldn’t have been them, and they claim to be the first “made in Japan” cymbal company. So, I have no idea where these cymbals came from, but they aren’t from Japan…
The cymbal lathing on the old 22" looks like the lathing on a CB700 cymbal I had when I was younger. 1980's
Thanks for this info. I have a very similar model that’s 23.5”. Couldn’t have paid more than 60$ for it.
If I was a drummer, I would be obsessed with finding weird, odd ball-off-brand stuff that NO ONE else has in order to get my own sound. I'd have a Mutt Kit for sure. Pieces from all over the place
Man I used to have a killer brass ride that came with a Borg kit from Sam's Club. I would have replaced the cymbals long before I ever considered getting a better kit, the hi hats warped like mad. I have no clue where they are now, I seriously doubt I threw an entire set of cymbals out.
What I'm finding says it would have been made by Zildjian, but there were no logos at all, and the bell was super shallow, almost flat.
I need to know where you got that track? 👀👀👀👀 both you and that track were 👌🏾👌🏾🔥🔥
Very interesting sound. I can see the appeal. Both are nice.
I swear, he could probably play anything and it'd sound great
It is easy to repair brass. It welds well. My grandfather makes a reinforcing sleeve in such cymbals and they work long and well.
By the way, this baby sounds incredibly good for brass.
Apollo sits in a mix better in my opinion. But the original has a crisp attack that could be better depending on what you're doing.
Now I want one too! Hey btw i was wondering how you're doing that 3 or is it 4 note ruff with your left hand? It comes in like right before the 1st beat of the measure... I think... Anyway would like to learn to do that. Is there a rudiment or is that called something in drummer speak?
Anyway always dig your videos, have learned so much. Thank you!
I vote for 20" Crash of Dooom!
the Japan ride has a bit better and more complex Washy sound, but very close on the newest one.
Meinl Byzance Extra Dry Medium Ride, mainly the 20".
So cool!
I haven't had a shower in 3 days, but I feel like I don't need to after listening to that cymbal wash
Hi David, I hope you see this. I think your original cymbal might be a lower quality sheet bronze cymbal and I'm pretty sure it is a Kingston. I remember a youth centre in my area had a ride that sounded nearly identical and it was really poorly stamped with kingston. You could just barely make it out. But it had japan on the inside of the bell. I'd imagine some of the cymbals didn't receive the stamp. This cymbal was quite heavy and used to flex the stand when you played on it.
Both sound great, what hats are they?
its a great chrash cymbal...
has a nice jazz ride feel and sound...
That original ride is a Kingston MIJ. I have a 22 and 20 that are gems. But not all Kington's are the same. My 12" hats SUCKED. To find a true match for your original, or a matching set of other cymbals is a pipe dream. I paired my vintage pre serial 602 hats with them, and the set is a joy.
Tried a few rides but always go back to my trusty 21" Sweet ride traditional finish
were did you get the track????
its awesome!!
tasty drumming as always
The tastiest
I try! haha
Interesting.
For the "B20 iS tHe OnLy MaTeRiAl cYmBaLs sHoUlD Be MaDe Of": I played a really cool B8 ride a few years ago. It was am awesome cymbal. It had deep wash, nice stick definition and just that unreal fatness in sound.
The tone if the old one is so good. Preserve it that's a legit gem. Anddddddd if you ever go to sell it, hmu lol, but seriously hmu😅
Sounds fantastic, Dave. Can you explain the extremely strange thing I’m seeing with your crash moving positions on it’s own during your play and you not hitting it? It was as if you stopped shooting the video, moved the position & resumed playing. It was very strange indeed.
I was switching between takes. One is with the original ride and the other with the new one.
David, as of 4/27/22, theres one of these up on FB in PA!
David(in the video title): My secret ride cymbal.... Shhh don't tell anyone
After few moments
David: (posting the video on TH-cam revealing ride cymbal)
As an electrical engineer (with zero knowledge of drums or anything, i have no idea why i find these videos so fascinating), every time you point out a crack in a cymbal that you're worried about I just have to wonder how practical it'd be to repair it (or at least stop its growth) with solder. Cymbals are usually made of bronzes or brasses, which are quite solderable with mild fluxes and simple tin-silver or tin-lead solder. Nickel is moderately solderable too, though I'm not sure about the nickel silver alloy occasionally used for cymbals. The large mass means you'll probably need to use tools for plumbing soldering rather than the small irons I'm used to, though; the stuff I'm typically soldering weighs a fraction of a gram and heats up quickly.
Does heating a cymbal to solder it change the sound or something? Does solder just not hold up to the beating cymbals take that well? Is it just that no one's ever thought of it? (I doubt that, if there's one thing I've learned from these videos it's that drummers are resourceful sorts of people.) Basically, why doesn't soldering ever come up as a possible fix for cracked cymbals?