You questioned (at about 07:10) the additional attachment length of the comb to the bars over a standard top bar if the same cross-sectional depth - it's double. So the comb should in theory b that much more stable. That is the ratio between the long isection (or "diameter") of a hexagon and three of it's sides, at any rate. Of course, that is human mathematics, and the bees may not have read those books, so may use stronger or weaker attachment by way of compensation anyway. As they say, the difference between theory and practice is that in theory, there is no difference between theory and practice - in practice, however, there is!
Phil Chandler that makes so much sense to me. I am looking for a video where you said that, you were curious about the fact that the bees didn’t build on the observation window. Did you find out the reason why?
I think they may have trouble moving cluster across to get to honey,as where the heat moves "up" it's easier for them to move up as compared to moving "across" here in mo.neat though, I also think that be hard to draw out unless you make really strong split,even for a swarm
there is a bee highway through the bars... look again. it stays warm in there. you can consolidate the brood and honey to a smaller area with a false back.
They can make it in a few days. It takes lots of Honey to build comb. So make sure the hive has lots of stores (honey) or feed them 1:1 Syrup (1:1 is for Comb, 2:1 is for Brood build up.) Bees don't re use wax, they have to make if afresh, using their Wax Glands. Hope this helps. 🐝
Go to BackYardHives.com this is the site of the inventer, Corwin Bell. Lots of great info. I build his hives for him, if you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.
@@johncardinal6975 I just finished building the cathedral hive kit. There is quite a substantial open space / gap between the roof and top of hive, which is confusing to me because of all the screens on the vents. The space sort of defeats the purpose of the screens and am also worried the bees or wasps may try to build in that space, is this a valid concern? Also what would be a fix / solution?
This may be a bit late but, to answer your questions, the screens over the vents are to keep insects from getting into the "attic space" and setting up housekeeping. My understanding of it is that the space is there so that the heat in the hive can rise up and away from the combs rather than being kept in close as you would find with Langs or top bars. The bees shouldn't be getting up there at all. If they are, the vent slots on your bars are too large. They should only be 1/8" and the bars need to be kept tightly together to keep the bees from escaping. I taped mine together until the bees propolized them and that worked nicely. I hope this helps.
I think that greater attached comb area may be an advantage for safe handling, and it is easier to see what is going on without removing combs from the hive. Against that, is the much more complicated woodwork involved, especially with the top bars themselves.
The surface/volume ratio would also be quite low with this build, minimizing heat loss. I wonder if the bars high centre of gravity is a problem when handling them though. Do you need to be carefull not to tip them? If so, you could easily latch the bars together two and two with a small removable crossbar between them.
To be honest, I'm really not sure what the designer had in mind. I would never put holes anywhere near the top of a hive myself, as it creates a chimney effect and warm air will escape, although this is somewhat mitigated by the insulated roof in this case.
Apparently the holes create a super highway for the bees to travel between combs. I will work on the cathedral part for one of my 2 top bar hives to create more stability for the combs. My 2nd year of bee keeping. Langstroth hive is doing also well, but not a good design anymore as new designs with less intrusion are being developed.
@@dieterditrich7520 ah yes, I didn't realise those were the holes you were talking about - I thought you meant the gaps in the tops of some of the frames. My version of these bars have squared faces, so I couldn't use this system.
No single hive is ever strong enough to defend itself from robber bees, for example: your neighbor harvested his say,12 hives in late fall and you have 4 very strong hives!! That's a 3 to 1 strength ratio so, all of your hives get robbed and you will have a 100% dead-out over winter!!
I love these types! I have two hives of this design!
You questioned (at about 07:10) the additional attachment length of the comb to the bars over a standard top bar if the same cross-sectional depth - it's double. So the comb should in theory b that much more stable. That is the ratio between the long isection (or "diameter") of a hexagon and three of it's sides, at any rate.
Of course, that is human mathematics, and the bees may not have read those books, so may use stronger or weaker attachment by way of compensation anyway.
As they say, the difference between theory and practice is that in theory, there is no difference between theory and practice - in practice, however, there is!
Hello Phil, love your videos. Why not insulate year round like people do, wouldn’t that make light e work of them cooling and heating their bee space?
I do indeed insulate my top bar hives all year round.
Phil Chandler that makes so much sense to me.
I am looking for a video where you said that, you were curious about the fact that the bees didn’t build on the observation window. Did you find out the reason why?
I would think that the comb more secure because it is supported by three sides instead of one @@timothymitchell9956
@@timothymitchell9956no idea!
Ok Phil , I just watched again and my thoughts are that maybe they didn’t connect to the observation window because that area isn’t very deep.
Hi Phil great info, I'm in the process of building my hive using your idea's, I wondered if in your cathedral hives if you incorporated the eco floor?
This is not one of mine.
Hi Phil do you have any sizes for the top bars please , hole size and thickness would be great as i'm thinking of making a cathedral hive thank you
At 15:20 they talk about defending against robber bees, a very simple robber screen will prevent that issue!!
I would love to build it but cant find plans anywhere? Would your friend share measurements?
Maybe, although I doubt if he drew plans up beforehand.
backyard hive.com has cathedral hive plans for sale. They also sell the hive in an unassembled kit.
Sorry - pesky autocorrect. That is backyardhive.com
@@deborahpercell321 you can edit comments, you know! ;-)
I think they may have trouble moving cluster across to get to honey,as where the heat moves "up" it's easier for them to move up as compared to moving "across" here in mo.neat though, I also think that be hard to draw out unless you make really strong split,even for a swarm
Theories have a habit of being challenged by experience.
there is a bee highway through the bars... look again. it stays warm in there. you can consolidate the brood and honey to a smaller area with a false back.
Such a small amount of liquid feed for such a large amount of bees, did they survive?
As far as I know. I may do a follow-up later this year.
How long does it take, for the bee's to make a comb?
They can make it in a few days. It takes lots of Honey to build comb. So make sure the hive has lots of stores (honey) or feed them 1:1 Syrup (1:1 is for Comb, 2:1 is for Brood build up.) Bees don't re use wax, they have
to make if afresh, using their Wax Glands.
Hope this helps. 🐝
Is there a cathedral nuc box?
Not at this time that i could find. I went with packaged Saskatraz bees, they are drawing comb quickly in this hive!
Where can the cathedral hive can be bought I live in South Carolina
Go to BackYardHives.com this is the site of the inventer, Corwin Bell. Lots of great info. I build his hives for him, if you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.
Hi, I live in the Caribbean, would this hive be practical here?
@@johncardinal6975 nothing there now, unless he is asian
@@johncardinal6975 I just finished building the cathedral hive kit. There is quite a substantial open space / gap between the roof and top of hive, which is confusing to me because of all the screens on the vents. The space sort of defeats the purpose of the screens and am also worried the bees or wasps may try to build in that space, is this a valid concern? Also what would be a fix / solution?
This may be a bit late but, to answer your questions, the screens over the vents are to keep insects from getting into the "attic space" and setting up housekeeping. My understanding of it is that the space is there so that the heat in the hive can rise up and away from the combs rather than being kept in close as you would find with Langs or top bars. The bees shouldn't be getting up there at all. If they are, the vent slots on your bars are too large. They should only be 1/8" and the bars need to be kept tightly together to keep the bees from escaping. I taped mine together until the bees propolized them and that worked nicely.
I hope this helps.
Love this concept, i have a TBH .....
What are the advantages over a standard Top Bar? Just another version really...
I think that greater attached comb area may be an advantage for safe handling, and it is easier to see what is going on without removing combs from the hive. Against that, is the much more complicated woodwork involved, especially with the top bars themselves.
The surface/volume ratio would also be quite low with this build, minimizing heat loss. I wonder if the bars high centre of gravity is a problem when handling them though. Do you need to be carefull not to tip them? If so, you could easily latch the bars together two and two with a small removable crossbar between them.
Very nice I'm not sure I could make it work in the cold though
This hive was specificly designed for cold climates. BackYardHive.com
@@johncardinal6975 how cold?
the holes on the top of the frames just passageways? Or is there another purpose.
To be honest, I'm really not sure what the designer had in mind. I would never put holes anywhere near the top of a hive myself, as it creates a chimney effect and warm air will escape, although this is somewhat mitigated by the insulated roof in this case.
Apparently the holes create a super highway for the bees to travel between combs. I will work on the cathedral part for one of my 2 top bar hives to create more stability for the combs. My 2nd year of bee keeping. Langstroth hive is doing also well, but not a good design anymore as new designs with less intrusion are being developed.
@@dieterditrich7520 ah yes, I didn't realise those were the holes you were talking about - I thought you meant the gaps in the tops of some of the frames. My version of these bars have squared faces, so I couldn't use this system.
Hello Phil, thanks for the informative videos.
No single hive is ever strong enough to defend itself from robber bees, for example: your neighbor harvested his say,12 hives in late fall and you have 4 very strong hives!! That's a 3 to 1 strength ratio so, all of your hives get robbed and you will have a 100% dead-out over winter!!
slow bees...special breed?
Just local mongrels.