It reminds me of when my grandpa told stories about serving as a US MP in Italy during WWII. none of the men spoke Italian, but he was a devout Irish Catholic and spoke fluent Latin, so he ended up being an impromptu translator between the US army and the Italian civilians. He would also schedule rendezvous between GIs and escorts that way and score the good wine. Um okay grandpa let's get you to bed now.
My grandparents - pure Vietnamese - were parts of the exodus. One of their relative was killed by the Vietminh before due to his association with Vietminh’s enemy (remember here was a time where there were many political parties in Vietnam). Btw, the majority of ppl leaving were Catholic people.
My college roommate's family was from North Vietnam and were catholic. His grandparents were killed by the communists so his dad and mom went down to Saigon and he signed up for the US military as a chopper gunner. That's how his parents got to California. Nice old man, barely speaks any English to this day. I can only imagine what he saw before he was discharged.
@@dtice69 Lots of Vietnamese people were like him after the war. 1954 people fled to the South, 1975 people fled to the sea. There were many people vanished in the course of doing that, and yet this fact has not been recognised by the current regime. (My father attempted to do the same thing (become a boat people) but failed, yet lucily enough he is still alive) Tragic!! Having said that, Vietnam is now a mixture of both new and old memories brought by the changes of globalisation while its past is still lingering since there have not been any attempts to reconcile the past wound by "both sides - especially the victors" (in fact, the VC actually worsened the wound after 1975).
My priest was a teenager when he fled during this time from North Vietnam. He was so impressed by the priests he saw he determined to become one, himself.
People really downplay the anti communist sentiment that was in Vietnam. The ARVN would fight really hard later on between 1972-75... but nobody knows any of the battles because the media ignored it.
Well, America's little nation building project could hardly stand, just like Iraq and Afghanistan later, and the South Vietnam government did not manage to sort themselves out.
The effects could still be seen today, there are some parts in the South where you can see more churchs than you can count in a single street. You know that was one of the 1954 settlements.
Thanks for sharing this, I have grandparents were born in Vietnam before during their time escape North to South from prosecution and here I am in USA enjoyed my life, relearning my family past are dark and USA it not perfect but I having a good time.
The situation in which that immigrants didn't know about the Hanoi's atheist policy because of the communist doctrine really didn't help the situation in the South.
People are saying that the cause of the refugees was the American invasion. Operation passage to freedom was in the late 50s. ...US combat troops did not land until 1965.
Operation "passage to freedom" begin 1954 and end 1955, but US subsidize the French colonial oppression and literally make the conflict via supporting corrupt Vietnamese proxy puppets - since (at least) 1950. >May 1, 1950 - After the capture of Hainan Island from Chinese Nationalist forces by the Chinese People's Liberation Army, President Truman approves $10 million in military assistance >September 1950 - Truman sends the Military Assistance Advisory Group (MAAG) Indochina to Vietnam to assist the French. >1951 - Truman authorizes $150 million in French support. >1954 - In January, Navarre's Deputy asked for additional transport aircraft. Negotiations ended on March 3 with 24 CIA pilots (CAT) to operate 12 U.S. Air Force C-119s, flying undercover using French insignia, but maintained by the USAF.[12] >November 1, 1955 - President Eisenhower deploys the Military Assistance Advisory Group Then the Vietnam war 1955-1975 started - fueled directly from US. The Vietnamese were pleading for independence from French rule since 1919, all petitions - ignored.
Hanoi is an inland city and at the time was used as a staging point, from which refugees would go to Haiphong and board ships or fly south via Gia Lam and Bach Mai airfields.
Guys can you please do something about the way your Cold War videos are sequenced? As it is, the latest videos are on top of the list and the oldest at the bottom, understandably. But, this actually makes binge-watching/listening from the beginning to the latest quite difficult. Can you make it so that the playlist can be played automatically in a chronological manner, like the Kings and Generals playlist on the Imjin War, the 30 Years War, etc.? As an educator I have been meaning to binge watch/listen to your entire playlist and compel my students to do the same, but being Gen Z kids, my students might get confused with the order of events and topics featured in your videos. Thanks guys and keep up the good work!!
Ah, you missed an opportunity to mention Tom Dooley. He was a doctor from St. Louis who was involved in both providing humanitarian aid to refugees and gathering intelligence for the CIA. His best-selling book about his experience, "Deliver Us From Evil," played a key role in selling Americans on the Diem regime and the religious-freedom angle of his government. A lot of what he wrote, however, wasn't true and was just part of the propagandizing that surrounded the operation. That said, this video does provide important background and helps me understand Dooley's story better. You did mention the USS Montague, though, which is the ship that brought Dooley to Vietnam.
hi, not sure whether you guys wanna read this convoluted recount of the two sides of my family, but here you go. i'm an overseas vietnamese, born and raised in germany. both my paternal and maternal grandparents used to or still live in saigon. (i refuse to call the city otherwise.) my late maternal grandfather was actually part of the southern/central vietnamese who went to the north because he was (i assume) so disappointed with the very corrupt southern vietnamese government. i never got to ask him further about this, since when he still lived, he did so in vietnam, and asking about the vietnam war in general is dangerous as an overseas vietnamese. i however do know that in his later years (when i was around, ca. 2006?) he was heavily disillusioned with the corrupt vietnamese government. his children (except for my mother who left for east germany) and my grandmother, his wife, however did join the socialist party (it helped their career). to this day my grandmother still believes that she would only pray to ho chi minh, if need be. my paternal grandfather in the meantime was a reservist officer (he only finished his training at the very end of the war, and he was never called to arms) and was sent to one of those correction camps which he and other reservist officers were basically made to built themselves. he was in there for about 2 years i think, and afterwards was not allowed to work for 6 months. he sold his house (it had a garage but they didn't own a car yet), his fridge, his vesta, and had to move his family (his wife (my late grandmother), 3 children and his mother (my great-grandmother)) to a much smaller place. my grandfather, my grandmother (both teachers) and my great-grandmother worked several jobs so they could make ends meet. eventually in the late 70ies, he decided that he couldn't continue living there, since they were simply too poor, although my father told me that they were "not starving". my grandfather and his childhood friend tried to leave on one of those smuggling fishing boats, but were robbed in vietnamese waters and came back. this happened quite a few times. on their last trip to freedom (in the very early 80ies), they had somehow managed to get seats on one of the not at all built for the high sea fishing boats, for themselves and while my grandfather took his eldest son (leaving his mother, his wife, his daughter and his youngest son, my father, behind), his friend asked him to took his son instead. this time they did barely succeed to depart. the fishing boat somehow made it past the vietnamese navy patrols and made it into international waters. my uncle and my grandfather recount the event quite differently, so i'm not sure whether one of the refugees did indeed hold an umbrella but scared off patrols by acting as if it was a gun. the fishing boat dragged them into open waters and then turned back (helping refugees escape vietnam was heavily punishable by law, i think even by death, depending on the case?). countless stories exist of thai pirates swooping in, robbing, raping and killing the refugees (my aunt's coworker seems to have been one of the rape victims), but for this one particular trip, they were lucky nothing of the sort happened. they instead were left stranded for two days without any water nor food and were once more lucky that the Cap Anamur (a ship sponsored by the now late german correspondant and humanitarian Rupert Neudeck, his wife and friends) was passing by, took them in and left for the philippines, where my grandfather and my uncle entered a refugee camp. originally, my grandfather wanted to go the united states, but he was told that the waiting list was literally going to take 10 years until he could possibly leave for america, whereas the one for germany only took 10 months, so he settled for central europe instead. he later was able to reunite with my grandmother, my aunt and my father. (my great-grandmother had already passed shortly beforehand, but she would not have been allowed to come over to germany according to regulations.) my uncle, aunt and father would later go on to finish their education here and go to university as well, while my mother (she went to highschool but didn't actually graduate), was one of the guest workers in east germany. they took her passport, she and her coworkers were not allowed to learn the language (lest they'd flee somewhere else). i'm not sure how she managed to do so, but she somehow got to berlin. about a week or two before the berlin wall fell, checkpoint charlie had become somewhat pervious, and she dressed up as a boy. she watched people passing through the checkpoint and then linked arms with a random elder german gentleman (acting as his son, i think?) to pass the checkpoint. he didn't blow her cover and they managed to get through. i'm not sure whether she thanked him or not (or if she could even manage a "thank you" with her blotchy german at that time) and she went and applied for asylum. later somewhere down the road in united germany she met my father. my parents both still view the vietnamese government and the time back then very critically and have been german citizens since 1991.
The fleeing of the anti Communists to the South serving the North in a manner by diluting resistance to the Vite Minh sounds like what happened when the Greek and Turks booted each others religious minority out. Instead of trying to live together, both nations simply got rid of opposition. I doubt Ho Chi Minh would have tried much to reason w/the anti communist minority anymore than he did anyway but maybe he'd have played Popular Front for a bit longer, that might have saved many lives.
@@terrorgaming459 Since officially the War ended some 40 odd years ago (excluding the guerilla aspect against the North) there is technically no South anymore. But my sympathies were w/them when they were fighting
Made sense that Catholics would oppose the independence movement because they would lose their privileged status Same reason Protestants in Ireland where and still are loyal to Britain
To put aside any notion specifically that the partition was permanent, an unsigned Final Declaration, stated in Article 6: "The Conference recognizes that the essential purpose of the agreement relating to Vietnam is to settle military questions with a view to ending hostilities and that the military demarcation line is provisional and should not in any way be interpreted as constituting a political or territorial boundary." State of vietnam made by france led by Bao Dai but in 1954,america support Ngo Dinh Diem overthrown Bao Dai
regardless of who would win the unification election, there would have been manipulations from both sides. The Southern govt obviously knew the North had a great PR for winning against the French militarily and they themselves are a mirror to the repression the northern govt had . The North if it looked like they were going to lose, would make it so that they would win if they had to, as you can see how all the other nationalist groups working under the Viet Minh seem to "disappear" during the French War years despite the Viet Minh being a united front and not just the VCP, a kind of inverted Chinese political relation (KMT almost wiped out the communists vs the VCP almost wiped out the VNQDD and Viet Cach) Vietnam was living a in a desperate time where the future was uncertain. one saw the opportunity to run a new system that was demonstrated to work with the Soviet Union vs one that saw independence but with the model that was in place since its old dynastic or white colonial times. The fact that the communist system wasn't working after being reunified with the south and that they had to implement what did work for the south (HCM city has been growing a lot through its capital investments since the early 90s) shows that the Vietnamese are not a hive mind that believed in one side as it seems to be portrayed in popular history books.
What is the purpose of partitioning Vietnam into two political entities? And after only two years, it is scheduled to be unified in the 1956 elections. I don't get it.
The partition was never meant to be permanent but only a temporary one. At the 1954 Geneva Conference, Ho Chi Minh was given the northern half of the country while the south was handed over to a French puppet government. Elections to reunite the country were supposed to be held two years later but never took place because the US was afraid that Ho Chi Minh would win them. It was not so much a policy of partitioning the country into two political entities, but rather a temporary compromise in recognition of the Vietminh's victory over the French at Dien Bien Phu.
It was a face-saving measure for the French. Think "it's not a rout, but a tactical withdrawal !" They then could leave two years later claiming their respect for the democratic will of the people, especially if the West-leaning anti-communists won (unlikely, which is why the elections were never held).
@lati long That's true. What's ironic is how the US sent some 60,000 soldiers to their deaths, with the North Vietnamese/Vietcong loss of life estimated to be 1.1 million. Seeing as how Vietnam has long since embraced free market economics, the US may as well have waged a war of KFC and Mcdonald's. Would have saved a lot of lives.
@N Fels Where is my "hatred against anything American" ? I was merely stating the facts of the situation as they were. Ho Chi Minh spent most of his life championing the independence of his country. He even looked to the United States as his inspiration, even going so far as to read the American Declaration of Independence. The US was only too happy to help him against Japan during WW2, but then conveniently decided that he was of no further use with the beginning of the cold war. They effectively pushed him away in favor of the return of the French. Once the French decided to give up their Indochinese colonies, all they had to offer was the inept puppet Bao Dai. From the onset, Vietnam had no real alternative to Ho Chi Minh. Most Vietnamese did not see themselves as communists, but rather as nationalists, something the US and the west failed to see.
@N Fels The elections never took place because they didn't. The Eisenhower administration wanted to "postpone" the elections for as long as possible because they knew that Diem would probably lose them. It's now common knowledge. Again, how does any of this make me "anti-American" or "pro-Putin" ? Do you live in a binary world of US vs. them ? Or do you just have anger issues ?
reverend Thich Quang Duc had set himself aflame to protest against the atrocities of the corrupt southern vietnamese government against its people. a month before, president Ngo Dinh Diem had government forces fire into a peaceful demonstration of buddhist protesters (killing 9 people), but would later blame vietnamese communists for the deed.
"Glory" "Heroes" I think it's a little more stark and serious than that. Is simplistic bombast the only thing your mind can conjure in the face of war? That's your take? Humans are appalling.
@@anthonymaslow798 Let me guess you, support the Russian war criminals. Ukrainians are fighting for freedom against overwhelming odds. Sounds heroic to me.
This was an event covered in the Catholic parochial schools in the American midwest for some years afterwards. Elements of a Marion visitation (a manifestation of the Virgin Mary) was also worked in. This was very murky to my childhood self and caused me to wonder what really was going on.? The childhood perspective framing questions of why do they have to leave their home and where will they go? The answers from the adults were not convincing
The emigration did more harm to the State of Vietnam and the Republic of Vietnam that succedded it as it brought a plethora of people from different ideology and religious to the south soon the Republic of Vietnam face isolation within it own capital as many faction flock Saigon which was one of many reason Diem surround himself with family nember and Christian fellow in goverment possition as he could not trust outsider, this would eventually lead to his downfall and the RVN in general
The governor of New York went on tv and told those people who did not agree with her virus policies (constant masking, essentially compulsory shots, vax passports) to LEAVE the state and to go place like Florida
The cause of all the bloodshed in Vietnam was the American Invasion. When the Americans finally left Vietnam, the country began to recover, develop and is now a powerful economy. The same will happen in Afghansitan. Now that the American Invaders have been kicked out, Afghans will solve their problems amongst themselves and move forward as a nation. The Americans increased hatred between Vietnamese people and they did the same in Iraq and Afghanistan and exacerbated the Sunni Shia sectarian hatred. It's the divide and rule tactic. But history teaches us that this tactic does not last and the people hate the foreign invader more than anything else.
@@starventure America is the biggest Satan on the planet. America is a bully nation that only picks on smaller nations like Iraq and Afghanistan. Now that Russia is attacking your ally you are too afraid to send in troops and fight someone your own size. You got humiliated by Vietnamese farmers and Afghan tribesmen so how could you even face Russia? America is a joke of a nation
Which is also why there were so many communist in the south, southern communist have little reason to migrate to north vietnam since to them it make little different.
Pls break down ethnicity of both north and south Vietnam. During medieval time, the Vietnamese were never >30% of all today Vietnam 's population. They massacred millions of other ethnic groups especially Khmer and Cham peoples then 1942 to become 80%.
Did us have a nuclear arsenal program during the Vietnam War? China made its first nuclear bomb in October 1964. Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson knew before that, but Johnson chose the election in 1964, so he did not prevent China from completing all this.After 1965, this was crazy because Vietnam and China had nuclear weapons.
This channel scarily turned from a lesson from history to a guide into the future real fast.
What do you mean?
There has been several books that turned from "science fiction" to "near reality" in a very short period of time.
@PAVER Have you watched any news from the last three days?
Those who do not understand their history have no future.
@@Marinealver *cough* 1984 *cough*
The part of the linguistic barrier was so interesting to know just how strange the history could be.
It reminds me of when my grandpa told stories about serving as a US MP in Italy during WWII. none of the men spoke Italian, but he was a devout Irish Catholic and spoke fluent Latin, so he ended up being an impromptu translator between the US army and the Italian civilians. He would also schedule rendezvous between GIs and escorts that way and score the good wine. Um okay grandpa let's get you to bed now.
My grandparents from both my mom and dad were among the migrate, my dad told me my grandfather had to fake his paper to get on the ship.
My grandparents - pure Vietnamese - were parts of the exodus. One of their relative was killed by the Vietminh before due to his association with Vietminh’s enemy (remember here was a time where there were many political parties in Vietnam). Btw, the majority of ppl leaving were Catholic people.
My college roommate's family was from North Vietnam and were catholic. His grandparents were killed by the communists so his dad and mom went down to Saigon and he signed up for the US military as a chopper gunner. That's how his parents got to California. Nice old man, barely speaks any English to this day. I can only imagine what he saw before he was discharged.
@@dtice69 Lots of Vietnamese people were like him after the war. 1954 people fled to the South, 1975 people fled to the sea. There were many people vanished in the course of doing that, and yet this fact has not been recognised by the current regime. (My father attempted to do the same thing (become a boat people) but failed, yet lucily enough he is still alive) Tragic!!
Having said that, Vietnam is now a mixture of both new and old memories brought by the changes of globalisation while its past is still lingering since there have not been any attempts to reconcile the past wound by "both sides - especially the victors" (in fact, the VC actually worsened the wound after 1975).
My priest was a teenager when he fled during this time from North Vietnam. He was so impressed by the priests he saw he determined to become one, himself.
@lati long that's just humanity in general. Flood any country with tons of people not from that country and the locals will start to get uneasy.
This video mentions that the of majority of people who left the north where Catholic
People really downplay the anti communist sentiment that was in Vietnam. The ARVN would fight really hard later on between 1972-75... but nobody knows any of the battles because the media ignored it.
American bot
@@terrorgaming459 Bolshevic NPC.
@@terrorgaming459Commie bot
Well, America's little nation building project could hardly stand, just like Iraq and Afghanistan later, and the South Vietnam government did not manage to sort themselves out.
It's interesting to learn such lesser known events like this mass migration.
The effects could still be seen today, there are some parts in the South where you can see more churchs than you can count in a single street. You know that was one of the 1954 settlements.
The way the host ends all these video's is really interesting. My compliments to all those who made this video a reality.
Thanks for sharing this, I have grandparents were born in Vietnam before during their time escape North to South from prosecution and here I am in USA enjoyed my life, relearning my family past are dark and USA it not perfect but I having a good time.
The situation in which that immigrants didn't know about the Hanoi's atheist policy because of the communist doctrine really didn't help the situation in the South.
This is so much more informative than college courses on the subject ever were.
People are saying that the cause of the refugees was the American invasion. Operation passage to freedom was in the late 50s.
...US combat troops did not land until 1965.
American bot
Operation "passage to freedom" begin 1954 and end 1955, but US subsidize the French colonial oppression and literally make the conflict via supporting corrupt Vietnamese proxy puppets - since (at least) 1950.
>May 1, 1950 - After the capture of Hainan Island from Chinese Nationalist forces by the Chinese People's Liberation Army, President Truman approves $10 million in military assistance
>September 1950 - Truman sends the Military Assistance Advisory Group (MAAG) Indochina to Vietnam to assist the French.
>1951 - Truman authorizes $150 million in French support.
>1954 - In January, Navarre's Deputy asked for additional transport aircraft. Negotiations ended on March 3 with 24 CIA pilots (CAT) to operate 12 U.S. Air Force C-119s, flying undercover using French insignia, but maintained by the USAF.[12]
>November 1, 1955 - President Eisenhower deploys the Military Assistance Advisory Group
Then the Vietnam war 1955-1975 started - fueled directly from US.
The Vietnamese were pleading for independence from French rule since 1919, all petitions - ignored.
@@terrorgaming459 Provide evidence that he is wrong. Or else don't talk, go back to liberating Ukraine.
@@terrorgaming459Commie NPC
David's threat of nuclear war if we don't press the bell button. Was the best, but not the only such threat we have received this week.
People dont know that a lot of northerners fought for South Vietnam, especially in theAirborne division.
Majority of the south supported the north
@@terrorgaming459 prove it
@@terrorgaming459 bruh...
The Cold War, can you please make a video on the February 28th Incident in Taiwan. Thank you very much.
When the mission was already not so easy a typhoon made things even worse.
Hanoi is an inland city and at the time was used as a staging point, from which refugees would go to Haiphong and board ships or fly south via Gia Lam and Bach Mai airfields.
Vietnam facing continuous wars for decades and still developing this much is great thing
Ironically, the development was due to western investments
@@badluck5647 due to socalism your just mad socalism is working lol
@@terrorgaming459 They abandoned socialism in 1986 and it lead to major economic growth.
@@terrorgaming459 dude...
Guys can you please do something about the way your Cold War videos are sequenced? As it is, the latest videos are on top of the list and the oldest at the bottom, understandably. But, this actually makes binge-watching/listening from the beginning to the latest quite difficult. Can you make it so that the playlist can be played automatically in a chronological manner, like the Kings and Generals playlist on the Imjin War, the 30 Years War, etc.? As an educator I have been meaning to binge watch/listen to your entire playlist and compel my students to do the same, but being Gen Z kids, my students might get confused with the order of events and topics featured in your videos. Thanks guys and keep up the good work!!
Ah, you missed an opportunity to mention Tom Dooley. He was a doctor from St. Louis who was involved in both providing humanitarian aid to refugees and gathering intelligence for the CIA. His best-selling book about his experience, "Deliver Us From Evil," played a key role in selling Americans on the Diem regime and the religious-freedom angle of his government. A lot of what he wrote, however, wasn't true and was just part of the propagandizing that surrounded the operation. That said, this video does provide important background and helps me understand Dooley's story better.
You did mention the USS Montague, though, which is the ship that brought Dooley to Vietnam.
Thanks
Superb episode! Masterfully done 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
hi, not sure whether you guys wanna read this convoluted recount of the two sides of my family, but here you go.
i'm an overseas vietnamese, born and raised in germany. both my paternal and maternal grandparents used to or still live in saigon. (i refuse to call the city otherwise.)
my late maternal grandfather was actually part of the southern/central vietnamese who went to the north because he was (i assume) so disappointed with the very corrupt southern vietnamese government. i never got to ask him further about this, since when he still lived, he did so in vietnam, and asking about the vietnam war in general is dangerous as an overseas vietnamese.
i however do know that in his later years (when i was around, ca. 2006?) he was heavily disillusioned with the corrupt vietnamese government. his children (except for my mother who left for east germany) and my grandmother, his wife, however did join the socialist party (it helped their career). to this day my grandmother still believes that she would only pray to ho chi minh, if need be.
my paternal grandfather in the meantime was a reservist officer (he only finished his training at the very end of the war, and he was never called to arms) and was sent to one of those correction camps which he and other reservist officers were basically made to built themselves. he was in there for about 2 years i think, and afterwards was not allowed to work for 6 months.
he sold his house (it had a garage but they didn't own a car yet), his fridge, his vesta, and had to move his family (his wife (my late grandmother), 3 children and his mother (my great-grandmother)) to a much smaller place. my grandfather, my grandmother (both teachers) and my great-grandmother worked several jobs so they could make ends meet.
eventually in the late 70ies, he decided that he couldn't continue living there, since they were simply too poor, although my father told me that they were "not starving". my grandfather and his childhood friend tried to leave on one of those smuggling fishing boats, but were robbed in vietnamese waters and came back. this happened quite a few times.
on their last trip to freedom (in the very early 80ies), they had somehow managed to get seats on one of the not at all built for the high sea fishing boats, for themselves and while my grandfather took his eldest son (leaving his mother, his wife, his daughter and his youngest son, my father, behind), his friend asked him to took his son instead. this time they did barely succeed to depart.
the fishing boat somehow made it past the vietnamese navy patrols and made it into international waters. my uncle and my grandfather recount the event quite differently, so i'm not sure whether one of the refugees did indeed hold an umbrella but scared off patrols by acting as if it was a gun.
the fishing boat dragged them into open waters and then turned back (helping refugees escape vietnam was heavily punishable by law, i think even by death, depending on the case?). countless stories exist of thai pirates swooping in, robbing, raping and killing the refugees (my aunt's coworker seems to have been one of the rape victims), but for this one particular trip, they were lucky nothing of the sort happened.
they instead were left stranded for two days without any water nor food and were once more lucky that the Cap Anamur (a ship sponsored by the now late german correspondant and humanitarian Rupert Neudeck, his wife and friends) was passing by, took them in and left for the philippines, where my grandfather and my uncle entered a refugee camp.
originally, my grandfather wanted to go the united states, but he was told that the waiting list was literally going to take 10 years until he could possibly leave for america, whereas the one for germany only took 10 months, so he settled for central europe instead. he later was able to reunite with my grandmother, my aunt and my father. (my great-grandmother had already passed shortly beforehand, but she would not have been allowed to come over to germany according to regulations.)
my uncle, aunt and father would later go on to finish their education here and go to university as well, while my mother (she went to highschool but didn't actually graduate), was one of the guest workers in east germany. they took her passport, she and her coworkers were not allowed to learn the language (lest they'd flee somewhere else). i'm not sure how she managed to do so, but she somehow got to berlin.
about a week or two before the berlin wall fell, checkpoint charlie had become somewhat pervious, and she dressed up as a boy. she watched people passing through the checkpoint and then linked arms with a random elder german gentleman (acting as his son, i think?) to pass the checkpoint. he didn't blow her cover and they managed to get through.
i'm not sure whether she thanked him or not (or if she could even manage a "thank you" with her blotchy german at that time) and she went and applied for asylum. later somewhere down the road in united germany she met my father. my parents both still view the vietnamese government and the time back then very critically and have been german citizens since 1991.
Thank you for sharing your story! :)
The fleeing of the anti Communists to the South serving the North in a manner by diluting resistance to the Vite Minh sounds like what happened when the Greek and Turks booted each others religious minority out. Instead of trying to live together, both nations simply got rid of opposition. I doubt Ho Chi Minh would have tried much to reason w/the anti communist minority anymore than he did anyway but maybe he'd have played Popular Front for a bit longer, that might have saved many lives.
Are you supporting the south?
@@terrorgaming459 Obviously you are supporting a failed system, communism.
@@terrorgaming459 Since officially the War ended some 40 odd years ago (excluding the guerilla aspect against the North) there is technically no South anymore. But my sympathies were w/them when they were fighting
Made sense that Catholics would oppose the independence movement because they would lose their privileged status
Same reason Protestants in Ireland where and still are loyal to Britain
@@titisuteu your supporting a colinal state majority of people in the south wanted to join the north
This is a very underrated channel.
To put aside any notion specifically that the partition was permanent, an unsigned Final Declaration, stated in Article 6: "The Conference recognizes that the essential purpose of the agreement relating to Vietnam is to settle military questions with a view to ending hostilities and that the military demarcation line is provisional and should not in any way be interpreted as constituting a political or territorial boundary."
State of vietnam made by france led by Bao Dai but in 1954,america support Ngo Dinh Diem overthrown Bao Dai
regardless of who would win the unification election, there would have been manipulations from both sides.
The Southern govt obviously knew the North had a great PR for winning against the French militarily and they themselves are a mirror to the repression the northern govt had .
The North if it looked like they were going to lose, would make it so that they would win if they had to, as you can see how all the other nationalist groups working under the Viet Minh seem to "disappear" during the French War years despite the Viet Minh being a united front and not just the VCP, a kind of inverted Chinese political relation (KMT almost wiped out the communists vs the VCP almost wiped out the VNQDD and Viet Cach)
Vietnam was living a in a desperate time where the future was uncertain. one saw the opportunity to run a new system that was demonstrated to work with the Soviet Union vs one that saw independence but with the model that was in place since its old dynastic or white colonial times. The fact that the communist system wasn't working after being reunified with the south and that they had to implement what did work for the south (HCM city has been growing a lot through its capital investments since the early 90s) shows that the Vietnamese are not a hive mind that believed in one side as it seems to be portrayed in popular history books.
You should make a 1 hour documentary on French Vietnam war just like you did for korean war
I remember he did
@@user-cx1ki8li4t send me link
Video on Operation Urgent Fury ?
They fled to Saigon, only to find themselves in Ho Chi Mihn City.
Why was IndoChina broken up into several countries rather than kept together.
In Indochina, wars often occur, and Burma invaded Thailand and China for the two time, and Thailand and Vietnam beat Kampuchea together.
Because they would rather their countries be seperate.
Before French colonization, there were multiple kingdoms in that part of SE Asia.
Great operational name
What is the purpose of partitioning Vietnam into two political entities? And after only two years, it is scheduled to be unified in the 1956 elections. I don't get it.
The partition was never meant to be permanent but only a temporary one. At the 1954 Geneva Conference, Ho Chi Minh was given the northern half of the country while the south was handed over to a French puppet government. Elections to reunite the country were supposed to be held two years later but never took place because the US was afraid that Ho Chi Minh would win them. It was not so much a policy of partitioning the country into two political entities, but rather a temporary compromise in recognition of the Vietminh's victory over the French at Dien Bien Phu.
It was a face-saving measure for the French. Think "it's not a rout, but a tactical withdrawal !" They then could leave two years later claiming their respect for the democratic will of the people, especially if the West-leaning anti-communists won (unlikely, which is why the elections were never held).
@lati long That's true. What's ironic is how the US sent some 60,000 soldiers to their deaths, with the North Vietnamese/Vietcong loss of life estimated to be 1.1 million. Seeing as how Vietnam has long since embraced free market economics, the US may as well have waged a war of KFC and Mcdonald's. Would have saved a lot of lives.
@N Fels Where is my "hatred against anything American" ? I was merely stating the facts of the situation as they were. Ho Chi Minh spent most of his life championing the independence of his country. He even looked to the United States as his inspiration, even going so far as to read the American Declaration of Independence. The US was only too happy to help him against Japan during WW2, but then conveniently decided that he was of no further use with the beginning of the cold war. They effectively pushed him away in favor of the return of the French. Once the French decided to give up their Indochinese colonies, all they had to offer was the inept puppet Bao Dai. From the onset, Vietnam had no real alternative to Ho Chi Minh. Most Vietnamese did not see themselves as communists, but rather as nationalists, something the US and the west failed to see.
@N Fels The elections never took place because they didn't. The Eisenhower administration wanted to "postpone" the elections for as long as possible because they knew that Diem would probably lose them. It's now common knowledge.
Again, how does any of this make me "anti-American" or "pro-Putin" ? Do you live in a binary world of US vs. them ? Or do you just have anger issues ?
The French prime minister (4:16) was Pierre Mendès France, not Pierre Mendès.
LMBAO its always the "subscribe to our channel" lines that get me....LMBAO
10/10 for vietnamese pronunciation.
This would probably soon be a travel guideline in many countries
I once saw a picture of a Vietnamese Buddhist (Thigh Quang Duc) during the Vietnam War, he surrounded by flames, like Buddha sitting in a lotus.
reverend Thich Quang Duc had set himself aflame to protest against the atrocities of the corrupt southern vietnamese government against its people. a month before, president Ngo Dinh Diem had government forces fire into a peaceful demonstration of buddhist protesters (killing 9 people), but would later blame vietnamese communists for the deed.
Glory to Ukraine 🇺🇦!
Glory to Heroes ✊️!
"Glory" "Heroes"
I think it's a little more stark and serious than that. Is simplistic bombast the only thing your mind can conjure in the face of war? That's your take? Humans are appalling.
@@anthonymaslow798 Let me guess you, support the Russian war criminals.
Ukrainians are fighting for freedom against overwhelming odds. Sounds heroic to me.
I saw a tank with Soviet Union flag marching on Ukraine on
today news.
This is just unbelievable
I min lilla stad Nybro i Kalmar Län i Småland i Sverige har vi en del Vietnameser som bedriver restauranger. 🇻🇳 🇸🇪
Deli Sushi 🍥 i Nybro kan varmt rekommenderas. Rose Lotus också.
People in Vietnam using Latin as a lingua franca in the 1950s...you couldnt make this up
This was an event covered in the Catholic parochial schools in the American midwest for some years afterwards.
Elements of a Marion visitation (a manifestation of the Virgin Mary) was also worked in.
This was very murky to my childhood self and caused me to wonder what really was going on.? The childhood perspective framing questions of why do they have to leave their home and where will they go?
The answers from the adults were not convincing
Basically, North Vietnam was right in its propaganda, except for the date of victory...
12:50 Funnily enough, it is now a thing, except in China with their dear leader.
👍👏
The emigration did more harm to the State of Vietnam and the Republic of Vietnam that succedded it as it brought a plethora of people from different ideology and religious to the south soon the Republic of Vietnam face isolation within it own capital as many faction flock Saigon which was one of many reason Diem surround himself with family nember and Christian fellow in goverment possition as he could not trust outsider, this would eventually lead to his downfall and the RVN in general
And people say latin is useless.
There is literaly a war right now happening in europe.
It will end soon. Until the next one. There is no such thing as a dietary meal to a wolf.
Yes, because the dictator Putin wants to reestablish the hegemony of the Soviet Union.
Pierre Mendès France , not Pierre Mendès
Ho ho ho chi minh
Cough?
👍
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Ukraine's refugees brought me here. There is nothing new under the sun.
🇺🇸 🍁
The governor of New York went on tv and told those people who did not agree with her virus policies (constant masking, essentially compulsory shots, vax passports) to LEAVE the state and to go place like Florida
And that's got what to do with Vietnam?
The cause of all the bloodshed in Vietnam was the American Invasion. When the Americans finally left Vietnam, the country began to recover, develop and is now a powerful economy. The same will happen in Afghansitan. Now that the American Invaders have been kicked out, Afghans will solve their problems amongst themselves and move forward as a nation. The Americans increased hatred between Vietnamese people and they did the same in Iraq and Afghanistan and exacerbated the Sunni Shia sectarian hatred. It's the divide and rule tactic. But history teaches us that this tactic does not last and the people hate the foreign invader more than anything else.
You were that kid at the back of history class who was asleep from having smoked a bowl the night before, weren’t you?
I tend to lean towards this interpretation.
@@starventure America is the biggest Satan on the planet. America is a bully nation that only picks on smaller nations like Iraq and Afghanistan. Now that Russia is attacking your ally you are too afraid to send in troops and fight someone your own size. You got humiliated by Vietnamese farmers and Afghan tribesmen so how could you even face Russia? America is a joke of a nation
Didn't Vietnam start separate wars with Cambodia and China after the Americans left? Hardly peaceful or prosperous.
@@badluck5647The Cambodian one saved lives, the war with China was a result of Cambodia being in a defense agreement with China.
Now I wonder if I live in a sort of matrix. Maybe Elon Musk is right after all.
🇸🇪 🇺🇦
Looks like this channel just got an extension.
And it's hot.
🇷🇺 🇸🇪
Large migration from north to south,Tiny migration from south to north
Which is also why there were so many communist in the south, southern communist have little reason to migrate to north vietnam since to them it make little different.
Pls break down ethnicity of both north and south Vietnam. During medieval time, the Vietnamese were never >30% of all today Vietnam 's population. They massacred millions of other ethnic groups especially Khmer and Cham peoples then 1942 to become 80%.
Did us have a nuclear arsenal program during the Vietnam War? China made its first nuclear bomb in October 1964. Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson knew before that, but Johnson chose the election in 1964, so he did not prevent China from completing all this.After 1965, this was crazy because Vietnam and China had nuclear weapons.
Kennedy tried to stop China's nuclear technology development, but he died. I think Johnson was too busy with the election, so he forgot it.
:DD