Many thanks to you my friend. I haven’t really been feeling this patch due to how drastically different it felt to play compared to the (comparatively) grounded feel of the last few patches. But your explanations and breakdowns of the many characters I take interest in have helped me better understand their place in the meta, and the tools available to them. Always been into Frieza sauce, and knowing that he got anything makes me confident I can play him again.
I get the feeling after how wild and insane the new DBFZ patch is and how Sparking Zero recently released, there will be a lot of discourse between hardcore FGC fans who want to stick with FighterZ and casual Dragon Ball fans who like the game but will be moving to Sparking Zero, DBFZ was my first fighting game besides Smash Bros, so as for me, I like the new patch, I think they made some good changes and some weird changes, and while I think Sparking Zero is an amazing game, I'm not personally interested in it.
I’m definitely sad as a Lab Coat enjoyer, especially with those HUGE nerfs to her Mediums, but I think we’ll still see her competitively, at least in the short term. At Thunderstruck, we had three Lab Coats in Top 8, as LeviShoto got 3rd with SSGSS Vegeta/Lab Coat/ 17, Lucar in 7th, with Videl/Lab Coat/16, & Snakessj4 in 7th, with Gogeta 4/Lab Coat Vegito. UFA also had two Lab Coats in Top 8, with Zane getting 5th with Lab Coat/Zamasu/Beerus, and Kasuga getting 7th with Kefla/Lab Coat/18. So she might still have a future, even if she’s probably the Biggest Loser of the patch.
Tbh i wouldn't say she's the biggest Loser, id say that Z Broly was NUKED by the new Changes compared to the Rest of the cast, the Powered Shell Buff is Good as he gets 50/50's off Assists in the Corner, but the Sparking Changes noodered him compared to the Rest of the Cast, he cannot get the Absurd Solo Damage other characters can get off Sparking without doing things like Double Super.
I won’t lie, I played Labcoat 21 for the longest time. And these nerfs did do her in for me. I’ve switched over to Vegito now, and he’s a lot of fun to play. However, I might consider her still, I play mainly against my friends who aren’t really that competitive to know that her mediums are extremely unsafe.
its interesting how in a patch all about buffing characters to crazy and even giving a lot of compensation buffs to some, lab coat pretty much got hit with severe nerfs with no so much compensation... its an interesting way - i hear bardock didnt get much, unfortunate - and of all things ot just get buffs after buffs its a very interesting patch to end off on... of all things it seems like its either gonna kill the game or make the game very fun - i wonder who is gonna be top tier, i hear trunks, vegito, baby are very good rn but we will see
Real talk- why didn’t they name her “Android 21 (Human)” instead of “Android 21 (Lab Coat)”. I feel like her not being a Majin is way more important than wearing her coat
@@fissilewhistle I mean, it depends if she's fully mechanical or not. Android 17 and 18 are technically cyborgs, just being modified humans, so calling them human would be fair imo. Calling 16 one wouldn't be, since he's fully mechanical. So I guess it's fair to say it would depend on which camp she falls into.
@@fissilewhistle unless the game is non cannon she was once human but given cells of the worlds smartest, and strongest. Including Majin dna Android in DB seems to be a loose term for human-like or once human
I didnt mention this in the Jiren video, but i really dont like the change of making a move more balanced by just making it a light starter. Like Jiren's 2L getting that change makes sense. That move has no right being a med starter. But his Infinity Rush and 21's Spins getting the light penalty like that just feel kinda BS. I do the medium versions of these moves and yet i get a light starter. I guess i can understand it more for the verticle spin cause it does already do a ton so the scaling nerf does make more sense, but horizontal doesn't as much. I get that they're strong moves, but i still feel like nerfing them like this feels like a lame way to fix em. Kinda the same thing with the meter nerf. If the fusions could escape the half penalty into 25% penalty, lab coat should as well. The meter nerf is a lame way to balance the characters. Sorry, but seeing all the changes characters get to make them insane when they were already insane (Baby 2, Beerus, the fusions, 17, and 18) and yet Labcoat is where they put their foot down to give some nerfs too feels like having strange priorities. Like yes Beerus can do all this oki shenanigans with his orbs, 17s rekkas and A assist are fair, and Vegito can now use a full screen tracking projectile but 21 isnt allowed to use her full 5m or 2ms anymore for pressure. Yeah that seems fair. ...why yes i do play Labcoat and am slightly salty, how could you tell lmao?
I disagree with Jiren's 2L getting the change. I think it deserved a slight nerf, in conjunction with the nerf to his mediums as a whole, but Jiren's 2L being a medium WAS FINE for years. Vegito's 2L has been a medium starter for years as well. There are plenty of other extremely strong normals. Hit's 5M is -2 and one of the best roundstart lariats. It's all about how it plays with the rest of his kit. Reverting the 2M speed buff already makes a huge difference, as now the mixups are neutered and Jiren's forced to rely on stagger pressure. People who didn't play Jiren at the start may not care, but his 2L being a medium starter was fundamental to his identity for awhile. Jiren's also one of the few characters who has gotten very little from the universal changes such as beam SD, so his damage is actually reasonable, even with medium starters. I dunno, agree to disagree ig.
@@andrewlee7755 yeah these are some fair points. I always forget that they didn't give him the universal beam to SD confirm especially since Gogeta got that and his beam is also a 5S. Also trust me if it were up to me then Vegito 2L should certainly get the light starter as well. Especially now that Vegito is as cracked as he is with the recent changes. He definitely doesn't need that.
@@StreetFighterWWE TBF, there's a bit of a difference. Jiren was fine with a medium 2L for awhile, he just needed some of his other changes dialed back. To KEEP your Medium Starter, Frame-4 invincible, Safe on block DP? That also comboes without extra resources? That was singlehandedly the best move in the game methinks.
@@andrewlee7755 I won’t deny that, and I’ll concede I’m biased, but Cell SHOULD be the best, considering being the Perfect Being with the DNA of all of Universe 7’s strongest fighters is literally his gimmick as a character. It absolutely WAS the best move though, aside from maybe Photon Pulse.
I was begging for this patch to destroy LC21. I hate her so much. I don’t think she's bottom tier (sadly), but I know I'll rarely be seeing her now which is the least I can ask for
I am just now returning to teh game for the first time in years, and I was looking to try L21 to learn her in a team with Gogeta4, and someone else. Watching the videos, I wasn't aware until now at how much she has been gutted. Should I just stick to A21? Cause it sounds like L21 is more or less dead.
Is the game now less balanced than before ? The fusions and trunks seem worse than cell and jiren of previous patch, and with all these buffs some of the low tiers are even worse in comparison.
Giving Trunks what's basically a tickthrow lvl3 is ridiculous, but nah. Fusions aren't even close to as bad as pre-nerf Cell PA and Jiren 2L being a medium starter. The game is absolutely more balanced than before imo
Good to see this character is finally in the dirt, still probably worth playing but they got rid of most of the really obnoxious stuff about the character which I can respect. Only thing I wish they did was make it to where if you kill her the debuff goes away.
That would probably COMPLETELY put her in Bottom Tier though at that point. Literally all of her old strengths that made her the menace she was would be gone. She’d need to at least have Meter Penalty revoked if they did that.
@@StreetFighterWWE It shouldn’t even be in the game in the first place if we’re being serious about it. And having your damage nerfed by 21% for the rest of the game because she landed a grab is dumb. That wouldn’t change anything considering that isn’t even a big loss vs everything else that could be touched.
@@ImaNeedHalf I’m not saying it shouldn’t go away when she dies, but her being able to debuff entire Teams to effectively negate the game’s Comeback Mechanics is fine. It makes her unique, and for my money, I’m trying to completely oppress people out here.
@@StreetFighterWWE She can still do that, it just needs to go away when she dies. She is unique enough already with a grab that heals and gives her 70f of oki, a lariat that hits both sides, an otg stomp, decent zoning tools, and a grab that nerfs your damage, and great mix. This is a team game set up your team around her and she can still oppress people just fine.
@@ImaNeedHalf I’m not saying it shouldn’t, but the devs clearly don’t want it to go away, when they’ve passed up doing it four or five times now. They want that to be why you pick Lab Coat. Just be grateful she can’t combo into it anymore.
now u finish all the new patch notes for every character lets not see this trash game anymore lets see marvel vs capcom fighting collection now A Real hype game
DBFZ blows MVC out of the water, how about you go to a different channel instead of whining like a little baby about one not posting the content you want
@@ITS-A-ME-xx8tq You say this as you talked shit about DBFZ on a channel where DBFZ is one of THE games it talks about. Sure thing, little buddy. Stay mad 👍
Thank you as well for going over all the characters and giving us a more in-depth analysis of the changes! I've only followed the competitive scene as a viewer and mostly stick to my team, so I wasn't really aware the implications each change had for the other characters. Overall, I'm admittedly still negative about it primarily because of what they did to Bardock. I know the clips show crazier things all over the place, but in my opinion, the wild combos we can do now don't really bother me since the game has always been a 2-3 touch game when played optimally anyway, it just became easier for casual players. The big thing that bothers me is the direction or lack thereof of the character balances they made, like giving Bardock next to nothing that solves his problems while giving characters like Vegito fullscreen confirms even though his strong midscreen presence more than made up for his lack of fullscreen threats. I'm still gonna play this game, I love it too much to drop it just because of this, but I'm still genuinely saddened by it. In any case, thanks again for the breakdowns, and you earned a good rest o7
Might be time to sing "Ding dong the witch is dead".
DING DONG THE WICKED WITCH IS DEAD
My friend loves to play lab coat so I'll be able to make fun of him >:]
@micahfurlow2624 careful with that he might not want to play anymore 😂
Many thanks to you my friend. I haven’t really been feeling this patch due to how drastically different it felt to play compared to the (comparatively) grounded feel of the last few patches. But your explanations and breakdowns of the many characters I take interest in have helped me better understand their place in the meta, and the tools available to them. Always been into Frieza sauce, and knowing that he got anything makes me confident I can play him again.
Thank you for the videos! Have a nicd rest!
(Also rip my 21. At least majin version is cracked now)
Majin 21 will possibly stay on the Same position she was on Patch 1.33 tbh
I get the feeling after how wild and insane the new DBFZ patch is and how Sparking Zero recently released, there will be a lot of discourse between hardcore FGC fans who want to stick with FighterZ and casual Dragon Ball fans who like the game but will be moving to Sparking Zero, DBFZ was my first fighting game besides Smash Bros, so as for me, I like the new patch, I think they made some good changes and some weird changes, and while I think Sparking Zero is an amazing game, I'm not personally interested in it.
I’m definitely sad as a Lab Coat enjoyer, especially with those HUGE nerfs to her Mediums, but I think we’ll still see her competitively, at least in the short term. At Thunderstruck, we had three Lab Coats in Top 8, as LeviShoto got 3rd with SSGSS Vegeta/Lab Coat/ 17, Lucar in 7th, with Videl/Lab Coat/16, & Snakessj4 in 7th, with Gogeta 4/Lab Coat Vegito. UFA also had two Lab Coats in Top 8, with Zane getting 5th with Lab Coat/Zamasu/Beerus, and Kasuga getting 7th with Kefla/Lab Coat/18. So she might still have a future, even if she’s probably the Biggest Loser of the patch.
Tbh i wouldn't say she's the biggest Loser, id say that Z Broly was NUKED by the new Changes compared to the Rest of the cast, the Powered Shell Buff is Good as he gets 50/50's off Assists in the Corner, but the Sparking Changes noodered him compared to the Rest of the Cast, he cannot get the Absurd Solo Damage other characters can get off Sparking without doing things like Double Super.
I won’t lie, I played Labcoat 21 for the longest time. And these nerfs did do her in for me. I’ve switched over to Vegito now, and he’s a lot of fun to play. However, I might consider her still, I play mainly against my friends who aren’t really that competitive to know that her mediums are extremely unsafe.
its interesting how in a patch all about buffing characters to crazy and even giving a lot of compensation buffs to some, lab coat pretty much got hit with severe nerfs with no so much compensation... its an interesting way
- i hear bardock didnt get much, unfortunate
- and of all things ot just get buffs after buffs its a very interesting patch to end off on... of all things it seems like its either gonna kill the game or make the game very fun
- i wonder who is gonna be top tier, i hear trunks, vegito, baby are very good rn but we will see
Real talk- why didn’t they name her “Android 21 (Human)” instead of “Android 21 (Lab Coat)”. I feel like her not being a Majin is way more important than wearing her coat
Because she’s still an Android. Though I agree it would’ve sounded better.
She’s not a human. Her name is literally *ANDROID* 21.
@@fissilewhistle I mean, it depends if she's fully mechanical or not. Android 17 and 18 are technically cyborgs, just being modified humans, so calling them human would be fair imo. Calling 16 one wouldn't be, since he's fully mechanical. So I guess it's fair to say it would depend on which camp she falls into.
@@fissilewhistle unless the game is non cannon she was once human but given cells of the worlds smartest, and strongest. Including Majin dna
Android in DB seems to be a loose term for human-like or once human
LESS GO
I didnt mention this in the Jiren video, but i really dont like the change of making a move more balanced by just making it a light starter.
Like Jiren's 2L getting that change makes sense. That move has no right being a med starter. But his Infinity Rush and 21's Spins getting the light penalty like that just feel kinda BS. I do the medium versions of these moves and yet i get a light starter. I guess i can understand it more for the verticle spin cause it does already do a ton so the scaling nerf does make more sense, but horizontal doesn't as much. I get that they're strong moves, but i still feel like nerfing them like this feels like a lame way to fix em.
Kinda the same thing with the meter nerf. If the fusions could escape the half penalty into 25% penalty, lab coat should as well. The meter nerf is a lame way to balance the characters.
Sorry, but seeing all the changes characters get to make them insane when they were already insane (Baby 2, Beerus, the fusions, 17, and 18) and yet Labcoat is where they put their foot down to give some nerfs too feels like having strange priorities.
Like yes Beerus can do all this oki shenanigans with his orbs, 17s rekkas and A assist are fair, and Vegito can now use a full screen tracking projectile but 21 isnt allowed to use her full 5m or 2ms anymore for pressure. Yeah that seems fair.
...why yes i do play Labcoat and am slightly salty, how could you tell lmao?
I disagree with Jiren's 2L getting the change. I think it deserved a slight nerf, in conjunction with the nerf to his mediums as a whole, but Jiren's 2L being a medium WAS FINE for years. Vegito's 2L has been a medium starter for years as well.
There are plenty of other extremely strong normals. Hit's 5M is -2 and one of the best roundstart lariats.
It's all about how it plays with the rest of his kit. Reverting the 2M speed buff already makes a huge difference, as now the mixups are neutered and Jiren's forced to rely on stagger pressure.
People who didn't play Jiren at the start may not care, but his 2L being a medium starter was fundamental to his identity for awhile. Jiren's also one of the few characters who has gotten very little from the universal changes such as beam SD, so his damage is actually reasonable, even with medium starters. I dunno, agree to disagree ig.
@@andrewlee7755 yeah these are some fair points. I always forget that they didn't give him the universal beam to SD confirm especially since Gogeta got that and his beam is also a 5S.
Also trust me if it were up to me then Vegito 2L should certainly get the light starter as well. Especially now that Vegito is as cracked as he is with the recent changes. He definitely doesn't need that.
Nice to know I’m not alone in being salty, especially since I play Cell too and also lost my Perfect Attack.
@@StreetFighterWWE TBF, there's a bit of a difference. Jiren was fine with a medium 2L for awhile, he just needed some of his other changes dialed back.
To KEEP your Medium Starter, Frame-4 invincible, Safe on block DP? That also comboes without extra resources? That was singlehandedly the best move in the game methinks.
@@andrewlee7755 I won’t deny that, and I’ll concede I’m biased, but Cell SHOULD be the best, considering being the Perfect Being with the DNA of all of Universe 7’s strongest fighters is literally his gimmick as a character. It absolutely WAS the best move though, aside from maybe Photon Pulse.
I was begging for this patch to destroy LC21. I hate her so much. I don’t think she's bottom tier (sadly), but I know I'll rarely be seeing her now which is the least I can ask for
I am just now returning to teh game for the first time in years, and I was looking to try L21 to learn her in a team with Gogeta4, and someone else. Watching the videos, I wasn't aware until now at how much she has been gutted. Should I just stick to A21? Cause it sounds like L21 is more or less dead.
shes no way dead next to baseku or yamcha
Base goku is fucking sick idc you doomers
Is the game now less balanced than before ? The fusions and trunks seem worse than cell and jiren of previous patch, and with all these buffs some of the low tiers are even worse in comparison.
Giving Trunks what's basically a tickthrow lvl3 is ridiculous, but nah. Fusions aren't even close to as bad as pre-nerf Cell PA and Jiren 2L being a medium starter.
The game is absolutely more balanced than before imo
They gutted her…. Terrible
Now that Lab coat is not extremely brocken... She seems interesting to learn
She was interesting to learn last patch they gutted her mediums whilst making everyone else more busted.
Bad change
@@denisn8336 Agreed
Good to see this character is finally in the dirt, still probably worth playing but they got rid of most of the really obnoxious stuff about the character which I can respect. Only thing I wish they did was make it to where if you kill her the debuff goes away.
That would probably COMPLETELY put her in Bottom Tier though at that point. Literally all of her old strengths that made her the menace she was would be gone. She’d need to at least have Meter Penalty revoked if they did that.
@@StreetFighterWWE It shouldn’t even be in the game in the first place if we’re being serious about it. And having your damage nerfed by 21% for the rest of the game because she landed a grab is dumb. That wouldn’t change anything considering that isn’t even a big loss vs everything else that could be touched.
@@ImaNeedHalf I’m not saying it shouldn’t go away when she dies, but her being able to debuff entire Teams to effectively negate the game’s Comeback Mechanics is fine. It makes her unique, and for my money, I’m trying to completely oppress people out here.
@@StreetFighterWWE She can still do that, it just needs to go away when she dies. She is unique enough already with a grab that heals and gives her 70f of oki, a lariat that hits both sides, an otg stomp, decent zoning tools, and a grab that nerfs your damage, and great mix. This is a team game set up your team around her and she can still oppress people just fine.
@@ImaNeedHalf I’m not saying it shouldn’t, but the devs clearly don’t want it to go away, when they’ve passed up doing it four or five times now. They want that to be why you pick Lab Coat. Just be grateful she can’t combo into it anymore.
FIRST
Im glad she fed. Fusions mains rise up
Boooo
Let's goooo
Lab Coat can burn in hell until that debuff can be nullified by Raw Tag
now u finish all the new patch notes for every character lets not see this trash game anymore lets see marvel vs capcom fighting collection now A Real hype game
DBFZ blows MVC out of the water, how about you go to a different channel instead of whining like a little baby about one not posting the content you want
L
@@Kitsune986 LMAO What a noob
@@Kitsune986 My comment roasting this L take was deleted 😐
@@ITS-A-ME-xx8tq
You say this as you talked shit about DBFZ on a channel where DBFZ is one of THE games it talks about.
Sure thing, little buddy. Stay mad 👍
Thank you as well for going over all the characters and giving us a more in-depth analysis of the changes! I've only followed the competitive scene as a viewer and mostly stick to my team, so I wasn't really aware the implications each change had for the other characters.
Overall, I'm admittedly still negative about it primarily because of what they did to Bardock. I know the clips show crazier things all over the place, but in my opinion, the wild combos we can do now don't really bother me since the game has always been a 2-3 touch game when played optimally anyway, it just became easier for casual players. The big thing that bothers me is the direction or lack thereof of the character balances they made, like giving Bardock next to nothing that solves his problems while giving characters like Vegito fullscreen confirms even though his strong midscreen presence more than made up for his lack of fullscreen threats.
I'm still gonna play this game, I love it too much to drop it just because of this, but I'm still genuinely saddened by it. In any case, thanks again for the breakdowns, and you earned a good rest o7