Thanks Rob, I'm glad these videos are out there for all of us whenever we need them, Great work!, tried my shear cutter today great results, great way to make steel wool.
James Dedmon Thanks James. I had the devils own job doing that video - dogs barking, lawnmowers starting up, noisy cars, you name it. I always try to get it right so newbies can understand. Cheers Rob
Thanks for showing that, Robert. I'd never seen one of those and frequently have finish problems just like the ones you've shown here. Cool. Another tool in the toolbox. And I won't get chased by any Poms. 😉 John
Hi Rob, if you go to a truck and trailer repairs and ask them if you can have some old "S" cams from truck and trailer brakes, they are nice steel to machine, the trailer s cams are longer than the truck, I use them quite a bit.
Ian Craig Hi Ian. Yes, bearings and bush journals were going through my mind on this as well. I have yet to try it on cast iron. Should be excellent for making piston rings. Cheers Rob.
Rob, I've seen that type of cutter before. You get a great finish, but it's like watching paint dry having it cut so slow. Thanks for the video. Have a good one! Dave
Swarf Rat I just crank up the speed and it works OK. I can't see any benefit from cutting at a slow speed. The fine feed rate of course is important. Cheers Rob
Rob I use this tool as well for finishing, another advantage of this tool is that if one uses a QCTP one can quickly raise and or lower the tool to get a new sharp cutting edge. This is duo to the tool only cutting on the center line of the stock that is chucked up.
Al Slitter Good point Al. You can also shim the cutter up or down in a conventional tool holder to change the cutter edge. I also have one with a double facet cutting edge (secondary relief) which allows it to be angled and get in close to large shoulders. A good tool and very easy to grind. Cheers Rob
Thanks for sharing. I am just getting into cutting my own lathe bits, and I will be sure to give this one a go! What type of steel would you recommend? Would m2 be fine? I'm sure it would.
Love mine, I also have one for facing that works great. I have found the best finish combo on any material with these is high speed, slow feed and a small amount of lubricant.
I have to agree. I couldn't see any benefit from running at the slower speed in the video. How does the facing one work? I haven't seen that application. Rob
xynudu The facing tool has a curved front (you need to set the height more carefully but it isn't as critical as a normal facing tool if you have a hole in your stock). I am sure there are pictures online but if you have trouble shoot me a message and I'll take some pictures of mine for you.
It's done 20 years daily work. I have a newer one with a smaller diameter body as well. I could pull it apart and reface it with the TPG, but it still works OK.
For best results with this cutter, you want a razor sharp edge on the 30 degree cutting face. Also, the cutting method as described by caskwith in comments is optimal for the best result. Crawling along at a slow speed seems pointless IMHO. Overall, a very handy cutter, able to give a stunning finish on basically rubbish steel. Cheers Rob
Nice tip Rob, I struggle with that feathered finish on mild steel. What is the slowest feed rate per revolution on that lathe? It appears much slower than mine. The Atlas lathe's slowest feed rate is .0042 per rev of the spindle which is probably the fastest of any lathe made. You think a bit like this will work well traveling that quickly ? Regards, Rich
The Atlas speed equates to 0.1 mm and should work OK. My lathe goes down to 0.05 mm, but 0.1 is quite common on larger lathes. I use my shear tool to finish most jobs, as the end result is always very consistent and fine. Try it. Easy grind. Just be sure not to apply too much pressure/depth of cut as the tool can easily swing into the work and dig in. I generally just wind the cutter up against the out side of the job so I get a scratch mark when I move the carriage to the start position. That's enough pressure to do the job. Cheers Rob
Unbelievable! Just made & tried one, crap hot rolled steel, one pass with HSS...decent....finish pass with shear tool & hit with scotchbrite...looks like ground drill rod!! I have always had to sand to get a finish...I am amazed!! Mind if I do a video on it for my subscribers? Will give you full credit for the tip, let me know :)
Ever try a water finish tool. Grind like a normal HSS tool except instead of a point, have a 3mm radius as the cutting point then a 3mm flat level with the job then a slight taper leading off the job. Hone the front of the tool with a stone. Then use a slow spindle speed, double your normal cutting feed and use plenty of coolant.
bloodyripperau I have a carbide finishing tool with a similar profile - ground it myself, and it works well. I use regular speed with it and no coolant. The taper leading off from the job is critical. Cheers Rob
Redwood Machinery in South Australia. It's just a standard 12/13 mm TCMT set same as you can buy from all the major sellers, Banggood, Ebay etc. Not very expensive. Rob
Ray Jones Yes, they work well. I haven't played around with the leading edge vertical angle much, but I suspect too much angle could be counter productive. Rob
Nice tool and video. Thanks. But why go to the trouble to grind the side clearance angle? Why not just increase the face clearance angle by 10 degrees and rotate the tool post 10 degrees from perpendicular to the work? This is less grinding and then a person can use the tool to turn up to any height of shoulder.
This is how the original proven grind is done, and it works 100% . Try other approaches if you like. I have played about with the various angles a bit, but the standard grind works best. The danger with this tool is that it can easily catch and dig in, if not applied correctly. Cheers Rob
Hey Rob....Jim again :) Just another quick question. I've started to run out of Suttons TECMAX HSS blanks that I've had for yonks. Are Chinese HSS tool blanks ok? Or do you go for a name HSS tool blank?
I've never knowingly used Chinese HSS blanks. That's not to say they aren't any good. I get mine from Paramount Browns, but that was quite a while back. They generally last a long time. I assumed they would be good quality. Some are marked Made In England and some are Super Capital brand, which is top quality for HSS. All I can say is that my Paramount ones last and hold an edge well - no complaints. Where the current ones come from I can't say. HSS comes in many hardness grades, but that is rarely marked on them. As a basic rule of thumb, if there is a brand or grade marking and it's sold for turning, it's likely to be decent quality. Good luck. Cheers Rob
Thanks for that. I will have a read. I used to have a list of the most common grades, but it seems to have gone walkabout. The more exotic stuff is usually a lot more expensive and mainly used by industry for specialised tasks like die making, extrusion formers etc. Cheers Rob
This is a very old technique from at least 1830's. I learned it decades ago from an old 1905 book and in 1905 it was considered a very old technique. It was originally created as a finishing tool for Shapers and Planers and then adapted for use in other situations like lathe turning. Unfortunately the current "Shear tool" "fad" has it backwards. The chip should be driven toward the finished side not the uncut side. Doing it this "fad" way gets chips caught between the work and the tool, wedging it in and marring the surface. Even calling it a "shear" tool is a corruption since ALL metal cutting tools cut by shearing.
@@Xynudu The tool is backwards. Grind the cutter facing the tail stock so the chip flows to the right side. That is exactly how it was done on planers/shapers but today I see even guys using it on shapers have it wrong pushing the chip into the un cut side.
Keep in mind that the original application on the planer/shaper the whole tool face cuts the work and the feed rate can be almost as high as the width of the tool per pass. On the lathe the contact is only on the tangent so the feed has to be much finer to overlap the previous pass.
Thanks Rob, I'm glad these videos are out there for all of us whenever we need them, Great work!, tried my shear cutter today great results, great way to make steel wool.
He He, yes sure is. It's a handy tool when you just can't get a decent finish. Cheers Rob
Excellent tool for piston OD finishing. Made mine about 6 months ago and use it all the time. regards from the UK
First time I've seen that tool. Thank you!
Rob I have seen those tools by other folks, but your demonstration was the clearest of any I have seen. Great job
James Dedmon Thanks James. I had the devils own job doing that video - dogs barking, lawnmowers starting up, noisy cars, you name it. I always try to get it right so newbies can understand. Cheers Rob
Thanks for showing that, Robert. I'd never seen one of those and frequently have finish problems just like the ones you've shown here.
Cool. Another tool in the toolbox. And I won't get chased by any Poms. 😉
John
Hi Rob, if you go to a truck and trailer repairs and ask them if you can have some old "S" cams from truck and trailer brakes, they are nice steel to machine, the trailer s cams are longer than the truck, I use them quite a bit.
Good video with useful tips. Keep them coming! 😃
Been doing some research on these tool geometries. Apparently they do a good job for PITA metals like copper. Thanks for the video!
Great video quality!
G'day mate. Great video as usual. Very interesting tool. Thanks for the video.
Shaving tools are excellent for fitting bearings on shafts etc--fine gossamer swarf comes off with a beautiful finish..Good stuff Rob regards Ian
Ian Craig Hi Ian. Yes, bearings and bush journals were going through my mind on this as well. I have yet to try it on cast iron. Should be excellent for making piston rings. Cheers Rob.
Rob,
I've seen that type of cutter before. You get a great finish, but it's like watching paint dry having it cut so slow. Thanks for the video.
Have a good one!
Dave
Swarf Rat I just crank up the speed and it works OK. I can't see any benefit from cutting at a slow speed. The fine feed rate of course is important. Cheers Rob
woow, thanks, didn't know this, gonna make me one today, thanks for showing this.
Rob I use this tool as well for finishing, another advantage of this tool is that if one uses a QCTP one can quickly raise and or lower the tool to get a new sharp cutting edge.
This is duo to the tool only cutting on the center line of the stock that is chucked up.
Al Slitter Good point Al. You can also shim the cutter up or down in a conventional tool holder to change the cutter edge. I also have one with a double facet cutting edge (secondary relief) which allows it to be angled and get in close to large shoulders. A good tool and very easy to grind. Cheers Rob
Very similar to a wood turning skew chisel. Looks useful.
Thanks for sharing. I am just getting into cutting my own lathe bits, and I will be sure to give this one a go! What type of steel would you recommend? Would m2 be fine? I'm sure it would.
Love mine, I also have one for facing that works great.
I have found the best finish combo on any material with these is high speed, slow feed and a small amount of lubricant.
I have to agree. I couldn't see any benefit from running at the slower speed in the video. How does the facing one work? I haven't seen that application. Rob
xynudu The facing tool has a curved front (you need to set the height more carefully but it isn't as critical as a normal facing tool if you have a hole in your stock). I am sure there are pictures online but if you have trouble shoot me a message and I'll take some pictures of mine for you.
caskwith Ok. Thanks. Rob
I'd go in anything up to .003. It does that nicely on most steel and on quality stuff, it can make it look like its been chrome plated.
That live center has had a hard life.
It's done 20 years daily work. I have a newer one with a smaller diameter body as well. I could pull it apart and reface it with the TPG, but it still works OK.
For best results with this cutter, you want a razor sharp edge on the 30 degree cutting face. Also, the cutting method as described by caskwith in comments is optimal for the best result. Crawling along at a slow speed seems pointless IMHO. Overall, a very handy cutter, able to give a stunning finish on basically rubbish steel. Cheers Rob
This tool make taper but I am not samile
Tried the shaving cutter on Nylon great results
Great to hear!
Works a bit like a spindle gouge in woodturning :)
Nice tip Rob, I struggle with that feathered finish on mild steel. What is the slowest feed rate per revolution on that lathe? It appears much slower than mine. The Atlas lathe's slowest feed rate is .0042 per rev of the spindle which is probably the fastest of any lathe made. You think a bit like this will work well traveling that quickly ?
Regards,
Rich
The Atlas speed equates to 0.1 mm and should work OK. My lathe goes down to 0.05 mm, but 0.1 is quite common on larger lathes.
I use my shear tool to finish most jobs, as the end result is always very consistent and fine.
Try it. Easy grind. Just be sure not to apply too much pressure/depth of cut as the tool can easily swing into the work and dig in.
I generally just wind the cutter up against the out side of the job so I get a scratch mark when I move the carriage to the start position.
That's enough pressure to do the job.
Cheers Rob
Yes, I can see from the grind that it can lead to trouble quickly on a deep cut, but for a finish cut you get great results. Will try it! Thx :)
Unbelievable! Just made & tried one, crap hot rolled steel, one pass with HSS...decent....finish pass with shear tool & hit with scotchbrite...looks like ground drill rod!! I have always had to sand to get a finish...I am amazed!! Mind if I do a video on it for my subscribers? Will give you full credit for the tip, let me know :)
Go right ahead. Spread the word.
Most people have never heard of a shear tool.
Easily the best finishing tool I've ever used.
Cheers Rob
I stood there in shock as that cutter moved across the surface. You sir have saved me from hours of sanding steel parts. Thanks for doing that video 🍺
Ever try a water finish tool. Grind like a normal HSS tool except instead of a point, have a 3mm radius as the cutting point then a 3mm flat level with the job then a slight taper leading off the job. Hone the front of the tool with a stone. Then use a slow spindle speed, double your normal cutting feed and use plenty of coolant.
bloodyripperau I have a carbide finishing tool with a similar profile - ground it myself, and it works well. I use regular speed with it and no coolant. The taper leading off from the job is critical. Cheers Rob
Where did you get the carbide cutter? (the holder not the insert)
Redwood Machinery in South Australia. It's just a standard 12/13 mm TCMT set same as you can buy from all the major sellers, Banggood, Ebay etc. Not very expensive.
Rob
I use a boring bar as a shear tool... just rotate it up to the near vertical.
They work great don't they?
I ground one up recently, also a good finish :-D
Ray Jones Yes, they work well. I haven't played around with the leading edge vertical angle much, but I suspect too much angle could be counter productive. Rob
Nice tool and video. Thanks. But why go to the trouble to grind the side clearance angle? Why not just increase the face clearance angle by 10 degrees and rotate the tool post 10 degrees from perpendicular to the work? This is less grinding and then a person can use the tool to turn up to any height of shoulder.
This is how the original proven grind is done, and it works 100% .
Try other approaches if you like.
I have played about with the various angles a bit, but the standard grind works best.
The danger with this tool is that it can easily catch and dig in, if not applied correctly.
Cheers Rob
Hey Rob....Jim again :) Just another quick question. I've started to run out of Suttons TECMAX HSS blanks that I've had for yonks. Are Chinese HSS tool blanks ok? Or do you go for a name HSS tool blank?
I've never knowingly used Chinese HSS blanks. That's not to say they aren't any good.
I get mine from Paramount Browns, but that was quite a while back. They generally last a long time. I assumed they would be good quality. Some are marked Made In England and some are Super Capital brand, which is top quality for HSS.
All I can say is that my Paramount ones last and hold an edge well - no complaints. Where the current ones come from I can't say.
HSS comes in many hardness grades, but that is rarely marked on them. As a basic rule of thumb, if there is a brand or grade marking and it's sold for turning, it's likely to be decent quality.
Good luck.
Cheers Rob
@@Xynudu Cheers Rob, thanks mate
@@Xynudu Just found this, an interesting read - www.tttg.org.au/php/ArticleView.php?id=71
Thanks for that. I will have a read. I used to have a list of the most common grades, but it seems to have gone walkabout.
The more exotic stuff is usually a lot more expensive and mainly used by industry for specialised tasks like die making, extrusion formers etc.
Cheers Rob
Fine on Mild Steel and maybe En9 but anything else you would be 're grinding all the while,and it wouldn't cut Nimonic steel
how to sharpen hss lathe finishing tool?
This is a very old technique from at least 1830's. I learned it decades ago from an old 1905 book and in 1905 it was considered a very old technique. It was originally created as a finishing tool for Shapers and Planers and then adapted for use in other situations like lathe turning. Unfortunately the current "Shear tool" "fad" has it backwards. The chip should be driven toward the finished side not the uncut side. Doing it this "fad" way gets chips caught between the work and the tool, wedging it in and marring the surface. Even calling it a "shear" tool is a corruption since ALL metal cutting tools cut by shearing.
So how do you drive the chip towards the finished side ?
@@Xynudu The tool is backwards. Grind the cutter facing the tail stock so the chip flows to the right side. That is exactly how it was done on planers/shapers but today I see even guys using it on shapers have it wrong pushing the chip into the un cut side.
@@Xynudu Or you could use the tool as is but feed to the right. The angle of the cutting face can also be varied so you can feed faster if you like.
Keep in mind that the original application on the planer/shaper the whole tool face cuts the work and the feed rate can be almost as high as the width of the tool per pass. On the lathe the contact is only on the tangent so the feed has to be much finer to overlap the previous pass.