I hear you on why you want the synthetic stock, but in my eyes every nick, bang or gouge in that wood is the character the rifle gains over usage. Think of all the 100 year old Winchesters or marlins that have the marks of honest use, they just seem to be so awesome to shoot and they all have a story to tell. My 2 cents anyhow. Great looking rifle!
i understand that most modern hunters want synthetic stocks because they're lighter. however, i don't own a single rifle that has a plastic/synthetic stock. i'm guess i'm more of a "blued steel and walnut" kinda guy. but, each to his own. i love the CZ's (and even though there aren't any metal mags for the 22wmr) it's my favourite rimfire without question.
Hey Ozzie! Great to see you back doing what you (and we) love. Great honest review as always. I have a CZ -452 that I have had bedded and floated and I've fitted it with a Yo Dave trigger kit. It definitely loves the Hornady 30gr V-Max pills. Thanks for sharing!
I agree with you 100%! Those CZ's in 22 WMR prefer those lighter 30-grainers! I have yet to try the 30-grain CCI or Federal ammo, but I'm getting good groups with the Hornady V-max, for now. Let me know if you've tried any others, OK? Thanks!
Nice review Ozzie. I have a CZ 455 which came with all three barrels, 22LR, magnum and 17HMR. Changing barrels is easy. Haven't had any problems being unsubscribed so far but will keep an eye on that.
Unfortunately TH-cam unsubscribes over 1000 of you per month in order to silence me, so I need everyone to check their subscription regularly and enable that bell icon to get my updates!
@@ozziereviews Its a given that a channel like yours would be subject to false stats. Literally no chance your actual sub count is only 72k If it was they wouldnt be unsubscribing followers
Nice guns mate. Got the CZ457 in the MDT assault AR stock with the varmint barrel. Found the action was a bit notchy but ended up modifying the bolt and removed the sharp edges. Now it's butter smooth like my Tikka .243.
So the cz synthetic stock is a big big step down in quality. I had the 22lr cz already and bought the synthetic stock 22mag. There's a lot of flex in it, heaps of flex. It was so disappointing I went and bought a wood stock to swap it over. To date, it has taken more critters than any other rifle I own.
Good to know about those synthetic stocks. I bought a Savage B-mag (.17 WSM) with a synthetic (plastic?) stock...what a piece of junk! That stock had so much flex in it, it wasn't usable!
@@ozziereviews shot some groups off hand with the iron sights from 50 yards. About 2" groups which is good for my eyes. Ordered a Vortex crossfire 3-9x40 for it which should let me make those one hole groups like I get from my 452FS. 22 Mag has a satisfy crack compared to the 22lr.
@@markf3229 I have a CZ 452 mannlicher I've had for twelve years. I found it used with an older Leupold 3-9 Vari-X. It looked barely shot when I bought it. Managed to lose the sight hood somewhere along the way. Wanted a similar rifle with irons in 22 Mag for that extra range and power.
Good see ya back ozzie wasnt to concern with review first thing i looked at was video was hours old was worried about ya there fella good see ya firing on all cylinders again
I just bought a CZ 457 Varmint in .22 lr for practice. In the future I am looking to get an exchange barrel but I am currently uncertain wether I'd like a .22 wmr or .17 hmr, it seems to be a question of belief. I tend towards the .17 hmr since for small game it seems to be more accurate in general while also allowing for longer shots with good lethality but I'd still appreciate your opinion on it. Cheers
I brought a CZ 457 American in 22LR back in the COVID lockdown days my first ever rifle absolutely love it paid $1250.00 but when u love something so much price doesn’t mean anything roughly 6000 rounds later and still my favourite rifle to use great video as always Ozzie glad your back out on the farm doing reviews again!
Was wondering what scope you have on your CZ? I just got myself a regular CZ. 457 with a standard 22mag barrel and looking for a good scope. Do you have mid or low scope rings on as well
Great to see you back on deck.. waiting to pick up my CZ 457 Varmint in .22lr with a 4-16x44 tactical vortex FFP. Also love my old Brno 222 with the double set triggers..
Love your views of all rifles no bullshit the are good or shit keep on with that oh and you can shoot as for the shooting public not sure on that no support anywhere we look love your views on products 😀
Hmm. I would have liked to see the Hornady at 100 yards. Just my experience perhaps but I have found it takes quite a while to break in rimfire barrels. Never had any luck with Remington or Winchester. Really not reliable enough for me to happily use on vermin control. Hornady is the only 22 Magnum round that has worked really well for me anyway.
I've found similar results but now the new Remington ammo seems insanely good through my Ruger American Rimfire th-cam.com/video/rpOU2uc_U9A/w-d-xo.html
@@ozziereviews I've got a bit of old stock to get rid of first but it's so bad it's not worth chambering. I wish eley did 22 magnum. That's my go to brand in 22lr. Amazing consistency. I have my CZ dialed in for subsonic but high velocity raises the group half an inch with no change to windage ! Excellent.
What's the go with the 22mag ammo prices? I paid $28 / 50 rounds and now the cheapest I can get the same ammo for is $33-36 /50 with no discounts for buying bulk.
seems like the problem I had with my CZ 457 varmint in 17hmr. I just couldn't seem to get any decent groups until I played around with the torque settings on the action screws. Now my 457 will shoot 5 rounds into a one whole group.
I enjoy all your videos, and this one in particular. I own a 457 .22 WMR 'American' with the 24.8" sporter bbl. I've done some work on it...trigger spring, glass-bedding, bolt shim, etc. to try to squeeze as much accuracy as possible from it. My rifle definitely prefers the lighter 30 grain Hornady V-max ammunition! I'm getting consistent 3/4 to 7/8" groups @ 100 yards, and sometimes even better! I also tried some 33 grain Remington polymer tipped, and they grouped about 1". The heavier 40-grain CCI ammo groups opened up to over 1-1/2". Listening to other guys with this same rifle, the general consensus seems to be the same...they shoot best with lighter-weight bullets. At any rate, those CZ 457's are great rifles with tremendous potential, they really are a good value! Good luck with yours, and thanks for another good video!
My partner has this rifle also in 22MAG, love it feels nice to hold and shoulder. Only one big NEGATIVE was the trigger was Terrible, loose fitting, so much trigger creep and couldn't get it under 3 pound. Quick send off to a qualified gunsmith and it's 10x better
Hey Ozzie. Great review, definitely going to get one but as a leftie I’ll have to buy the 22lr version and then add a 22wmr barrel set. Does that scope come with the flip up caps or are they an accessory?
Hey mate. Haven’t found any answers online and want to know. Is it possible to get a hold of FN Ballista’s here in any capacity or not? Never seen them around. Cheers
Welcome back Ozzie luv the 22 magnum rifles I recently purchased a CZ 457 Varmint in 22 Magnum I was getting a lot of misfires nearly 50% and the accuracy was not what I hoped it would be I put a Yo Dave 10% stronger firing pin spring in it and no more misfires and the accuracy improved greatly very happy with it now
My groups always open up if I swap around different ammo brands, if I shot 10 or more fowling shots then stick to the same ammo then my group tighten up heaps.
I’ve been in the US for the last 3 months (back to Oz next week) and living with a range out the back. Everyone here was into pistol of huuuge calibre. But I introduced them to the Taurus TX22 Competition and the Kel Tec PMR 30. After the usual teething problems, everyone is delighted by the TX22 and astounded by the PMR30.
Had the same issue with my 515. Instead of fixing the magazine issue. Which it is, they made me go through the hassle of sending the rifle back and they replaced it. I took the mag apart and fixed it.
glad to see you back mate as per usual love your 15:22 reviews just a quick question if possible i also love the lithgow rifles i have yet to get a .22 and i think the cz 515 is neat but would you recommend the lithgow over the cz ?
That's what I was wondering. It looks identical to the American. I think that the difference might be the beech stock. The American comes with Turkish Walnut as standard. They're also considerably more expensive. My wife has one and it is a stunning rifle for the money.
I bought a 17hmr Lithgow, I was tossing up between CZ or lithgow. Went for Australian made in the end ,cost more but hey. Accuracy with Lithgow, nothing to write home about. I'm thinking I should have saved $500 and got the CZ. I think it would have been on par. So far Ive tried about 5 different sorts of bullet brands but Mehh !
Great to see you back! Just one question: Will the smaller .22lr magazines fit into the well of the .22 Magnum receiver after the .22 Magnum barrel is swapped for a .22lr one? Or will it just work if you convert between .17HMR and .22 Magnum, because I guess they chare the same magazines? Besides, I haven't found a channel that makes better reviews on repeating rifles yet.
Awesome video mate. Looking at either 22 wmr or lr. I have a .223 sauer 100 and it’s quite loud. On a percentage scale, where would you say the .22wmr lands if the .223 is 100% loudness and the .22 lr is at say 20%?
22 magnum is a bit louder than 22lr. running supersonic ammunition. Think of .22 lr. with a bit more of a crack. Yes, they're louder, but nothing like the .223.
The 457 is made for rimfire cartridges only. It only has a single locking lug on the bolt handle, so it won't handle higher-pressure center fire rounds.
Never seen a 22 mag shoot any good @ 100 irrespective of if it shoots well @ 50. I think it's to do with the bullet as it isn't even as aerodynamic as a 22 lr for the same weight because of the slightly larger diameter. It's akin to throwing a round rock. It's all about the BC.
Check out our review of the Ruger American Precision 22 Magnum: th-cam.com/video/Spn_PbnWXNY/w-d-xo.html
Wonderful to see you back mate. Hope you're doing well.
By the way, what is that wonderful intro song you used? It's absolutely fantastic!
@@jakesoros2376 The Bluest Star by the 126ers
@@ozziereviews Thank you! 👍
I love My PISTOL my Read more information that the way to see you have a lot and then you can get mg
I hear you on why you want the synthetic stock, but in my eyes every nick, bang or gouge in that wood is the character the rifle gains over usage. Think of all the 100 year old Winchesters or marlins that have the marks of honest use, they just seem to be so awesome to shoot and they all have a story to tell. My 2 cents anyhow. Great looking rifle!
Yup definitely want a synthetic stock
i understand that most modern hunters want synthetic stocks because they're lighter.
however, i don't own a single rifle that has a plastic/synthetic stock. i'm guess i'm more of a "blued steel and walnut" kinda guy. but, each to his own. i love the CZ's (and even though there aren't any metal mags for the 22wmr) it's my favourite rimfire without question.
Mua hàng @@ozziereviews
Great to see you back on the farm, looks like a great little set up, love my vx freedom 4-12x40.
Yeah for the price the VX-Freedom is a good budget scope I've found
She'll get more accurate after a few hundred.
Welcome back mate. Love those CZ rimfires. Looking forward to seeing your regular reviews again.
Me too Simon
Hey Ozzie! Great to see you back doing what you (and we) love. Great honest review as always. I have a CZ -452 that I have had bedded and floated and I've fitted it with a Yo Dave trigger kit. It definitely loves the Hornady 30gr V-Max pills. Thanks for sharing!
I'm looking at putting a Timney Trigger in it for some fun and review
I agree with you 100%! Those CZ's in 22 WMR prefer those lighter 30-grainers!
I have yet to try the 30-grain CCI or Federal ammo, but I'm getting good groups with the Hornady V-max, for now. Let me know if you've tried any others, OK? Thanks!
Try the CCI WMR 2200FPS polymer tip ammo .
My magnum shoots clover leaf with this stuff . The most accurate magnum ammo there is .
Nice review Ozzie. I have a CZ 455 which came with all three barrels, 22LR, magnum and 17HMR. Changing barrels is easy. Haven't had any problems being unsubscribed so far but will keep an eye on that.
cz 455 stainless and synthetic stock loves those remington 40gr PSP. shoots less than 1in groups at 100 yards.
This is a quality channel that deserves more subscribers. You’ve got mine good sir.
Unfortunately TH-cam unsubscribes over 1000 of you per month in order to silence me, so I need everyone to check their subscription regularly and enable that bell icon to get my updates!
@@ozziereviews Its a given that a channel like yours would be subject to false stats. Literally no chance your actual sub count is only 72k If it was they wouldnt be unsubscribing followers
I want one in .22. Or a Tikka
And yeah YT unsubscribed me the dogs
What’s the scope specs please
Hey Ozzie, just want to thank you for your great videos, they have been very helpful...
You're very welcome my friend
Nice guns mate. Got the CZ457 in the MDT assault AR stock with the varmint barrel. Found the action was a bit notchy but ended up modifying the bolt and removed the sharp edges. Now it's butter smooth like my Tikka .243.
Cool, I haven't had an issue with this rifle thankfully as it's pretty smooth
What a great review mate. They're beautiful rifles. Quality and style from another time.
Welcome back Ozzie! Wondering what ear pro you're using in this vid?
th-cam.com/video/rZU1L8Y4TcA/w-d-xo.html
For me the scratches and marks you get on wood gun stocks is like a road worn guitar and I find it to be a desirable final look of a gun.
CZ sure does make great rifles Ozzie, I agree with you.
So the cz synthetic stock is a big big step down in quality. I had the 22lr cz already and bought the synthetic stock 22mag. There's a lot of flex in it, heaps of flex. It was so disappointing I went and bought a wood stock to swap it over. To date, it has taken more critters than any other rifle I own.
Good to know about those synthetic stocks. I bought a Savage B-mag (.17 WSM) with a synthetic (plastic?) stock...what a piece of junk! That stock had so much flex in it, it wasn't usable!
Great timimg. Just picked up my CZ 457 Lux .22 Mag. Can't wait to shoot it this weekend.
Cool, let me know how it goes mate
Thats the one i'm looking at.
Hope to get on soon
@@ozziereviews shot some groups off hand with the iron sights from 50 yards. About 2" groups which is good for my eyes. Ordered a Vortex crossfire 3-9x40 for it which should let me make those one hole groups like I get from my 452FS. 22 Mag has a satisfy crack compared to the 22lr.
@@markf3229 I have a CZ 452 mannlicher I've had for twelve years. I found it used with an older Leupold 3-9 Vari-X. It looked barely shot when I bought it. Managed to lose the sight hood somewhere along the way. Wanted a similar rifle with irons in 22 Mag for that extra range and power.
Awesome to see you back in action and looking well Ozzie. Enjoyed the review as always.
Good see ya back ozzie wasnt to concern with review first thing i looked at was video was hours old was worried about ya there fella good see ya firing on all cylinders again
G'day mate 😊 You were right I was unsubscribed fixed.
Please keep an eye on it and let’s beat them!
My old CZ 452 22lr loves RWS-50 at 100 meters and grouping is spot on. I thought the .22 mag would be better then 22lr
So glad to see you back in the field legend we all missed you
I just bought a CZ 457 Varmint in .22 lr for practice. In the future I am looking to get an exchange barrel but I am currently uncertain wether I'd like a .22 wmr or .17 hmr, it seems to be a question of belief. I tend towards the .17 hmr since for small game it seems to be more accurate in general while also allowing for longer shots with good lethality but I'd still appreciate your opinion on it. Cheers
I wish I could find a barrel kit for sale. Bought the .17 version and now it seems nobody around here has the ammunition!
I brought a CZ 457 American in 22LR back in the COVID lockdown days my first ever rifle absolutely love it paid $1250.00 but when u love something so much price doesn’t mean anything roughly 6000 rounds later and still my favourite rifle to use great video as always Ozzie glad your back out on the farm doing reviews again!
1200$???... Wow.. You should move to a country that is not completely cucked on gun ownership.
Was wondering what scope you have on your CZ? I just got myself a regular CZ. 457 with a standard 22mag barrel and looking for a good scope. Do you have mid or low scope rings on as well
Great to see you back on deck.. waiting to pick up my CZ 457 Varmint in .22lr with a 4-16x44 tactical vortex FFP. Also love my old Brno 222 with the double set triggers..
Great to see you back. Thanks for the fantastic reviews!
I wonder if those that are being unsubbed are located in Australia?, not had an issue myself however I am in NZ.
Interesting yes but I think it's globally
Great review mate, and for those wondering I believe this is called the 'CZ457 American' in most shops here in Australia.
You seem very happy with the rifle ! Watch out don't let your wife see you happy,,,,,,,
Good review mate and it's great to see you back and healthy, take care and stay safe cheers Yogi 👍🤘🇦🇺
Love your views of all rifles no bullshit the are good or shit keep on with that oh and you can shoot as for the shooting public not sure on that no support anywhere we look love your views on products 😀
Welcome back OZZIE..🪖👍
Thank you buddy
Hmm. I would have liked to see the Hornady at 100 yards.
Just my experience perhaps but I have found it takes quite a while to break in rimfire barrels.
Never had any luck with Remington or Winchester. Really not reliable enough for me to happily use on vermin control. Hornady is the only 22 Magnum round that has worked really well for me anyway.
I've found similar results but now the new Remington ammo seems insanely good through my Ruger American Rimfire th-cam.com/video/rpOU2uc_U9A/w-d-xo.html
@@ozziereviews
I've got a bit of old stock to get rid of first but it's so bad it's not worth chambering. I wish eley did 22 magnum. That's my go to brand in 22lr. Amazing consistency. I have my CZ dialed in for subsonic but high velocity raises the group half an inch with no change to windage ! Excellent.
Great to see you back in the saddle Ozzie!
Yes mate I'm glad to be back I can tell you
I have the synthetic 457. Absolutely love it.
720$!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!😂😅😂for a bolt action 22????????????
Good to see you back in action 👍
I've got heaps to review so looking forward to getting more content out to you guys!
I've got a cz 457 22lr, picked up the extra 17hmr and 22mag, dropped it into an mdt chassis and it's been great!
Which MDT chassis did you get for your 457? I've been looking at one from MidwayUSA and/or Brownells for $430. Are they worth it?
@@bobhamulak3646 I put it in an lss. It's a nice little chassis. I plan to use it for rimfire prs.
A beauty. Have you seen the Royal model? Disgusting imprints in the wood. This looks like a rifle should.
I want the walnut stock and no plastic stuff.
Good to see ya back in your element mate
What's the go with the 22mag ammo prices? I paid $28 / 50 rounds and now the cheapest I can get the same ammo for is $33-36 /50 with no discounts for buying bulk.
seems like the problem I had with my CZ 457 varmint in 17hmr. I just couldn't seem to get any decent groups until I played around with the torque settings on the action screws. Now my 457 will shoot 5 rounds into a one whole group.
Great to see you back mate 😊👍
It's great to be upright again :)
I enjoy all your videos, and this one in particular. I own a 457 .22 WMR 'American' with the 24.8" sporter bbl. I've done some work on it...trigger spring, glass-bedding, bolt shim, etc. to try to squeeze as much accuracy as possible from it.
My rifle definitely prefers the lighter 30 grain Hornady V-max ammunition! I'm getting consistent 3/4 to 7/8" groups @ 100 yards, and sometimes even better! I also tried some 33 grain Remington polymer tipped, and they grouped about 1". The heavier 40-grain CCI ammo groups opened up to over 1-1/2".
Listening to other guys with this same rifle, the general consensus seems to be the same...they shoot best with lighter-weight bullets.
At any rate, those CZ 457's are great rifles with tremendous potential, they really are a good value! Good luck with yours, and thanks for another good video!
My partner has this rifle also in 22MAG, love it feels nice to hold and shoulder. Only one big NEGATIVE was the trigger was Terrible, loose fitting, so much trigger creep and couldn't get it under 3 pound. Quick send off to a qualified gunsmith and it's 10x better
Hey Ozzie. Great review, definitely going to get one but as a leftie I’ll have to buy the 22lr version and then add a 22wmr barrel set. Does that scope come with the flip up caps or are they an accessory?
👍👍👍
Hey mate. Haven’t found any answers online and want to know. Is it possible to get a hold of FN Ballista’s here in any capacity or not? Never seen them around. Cheers
Great review, and great to see you back online posting. Can't keep a good bloke down👍
That's what they say lol
Welcome back Ozzie luv the 22 magnum rifles I recently purchased a CZ 457 Varmint in 22 Magnum I was getting a lot of misfires nearly 50% and the accuracy was not what I hoped it would be I put a Yo Dave 10% stronger firing pin spring in it and no more misfires and the accuracy improved greatly very happy with it now
If you can get a hold of SK Standard, try this in that rifle, for me they shoot 0,2" with my CZ 457 on 50 Meters
My groups always open up if I swap around different ammo brands, if I shot 10 or more fowling shots then stick to the same ammo then my group tighten up heaps.
I’ve been in the US for the last 3 months (back to Oz next week) and living with a range out the back. Everyone here was into pistol of huuuge calibre. But I introduced them to the Taurus TX22 Competition and the Kel Tec PMR 30. After the usual teething problems, everyone is delighted by the TX22 and astounded by the PMR30.
For some reason, I found scrupulous cleaning of the mag cured feed probs, I think the use a sticky preservative at the factory
Great see you back mate.
Thanks mate
Had the same issue with my 515. Instead of fixing the magazine issue. Which it is, they made me go through the hassle of sending the rifle back and they replaced it. I took the mag apart and fixed it.
Awesome review Ozzie, you should do the Chiappa Little Badger in .22 magnum 👌
glad to see you back mate as per usual love your 15:22 reviews just a quick question if possible i also love the lithgow rifles i have yet to get a .22 and i think the cz 515 is neat but would you recommend the lithgow over the cz ?
Be interesting to see how Winchester 40gr jacketed hollow point's go in it. My Ruger 77 loves it!
😂😅😂@ aussies reviewing guns
Before you shoot, I’m backing the Federal, even though I use CCI
Great to have you back Ozzie!👍 love ya mate and cheers from us in Darwin 🇦🇺👍🇦🇺
The 50 grain shoots nice groups mate but in my humble opinion there's just too much bullet drop to confidently hunt with it
Asking because I don’t know… are there caliber restrictions in Australia..?
I might get one, 22 mag, since they offer it in a left-hand. Thanks for the review.
When you say “classic” is this the American model. Im not seeing a classic model for CZ457?
That's what I was wondering. It looks identical to the American. I think that the difference might be the beech stock. The American comes with Turkish Walnut as standard. They're also considerably more expensive. My wife has one and it is a stunning rifle for the money.
@@davidbrayshaw3529 Yes correct, we seem to have the beechwood classic offering here in Australia
re subscribed!! hope you are feeling better mate, YT just ain’t been the same👍
Can you do a full review on the lithgow la105, i know you have a video on it but its not quite the ozzie review
Idk whether to get one of them in 22lr or spend a bit more and get an anschutz
Great review! Do a trigger job on it and you’ll get the tighter groups :)
NICE gun
I bought a 17hmr Lithgow, I was tossing up between CZ or lithgow. Went for Australian made in the end ,cost more but hey. Accuracy with Lithgow, nothing to write home about. I'm thinking I should have saved $500 and got the CZ. I think it would have been on par. So far Ive tried about 5 different sorts of bullet brands but Mehh !
Try sum rws
Great to see you back! Just one question: Will the smaller .22lr magazines fit into the well of the .22 Magnum receiver after the .22 Magnum barrel is swapped for a .22lr one? Or will it just work if you convert between .17HMR and .22 Magnum, because I guess they chare the same magazines? Besides, I haven't found a channel that makes better reviews on repeating rifles yet.
The 22lr barrel kit comes with a new magazine and a spacer for magazine well
Great price, classic not my choice, I prefer polymer
Love CZ rimfire rifles…always shoot good.
Awesome video mate. Looking at either 22 wmr or lr. I have a .223 sauer 100 and it’s quite loud. On a percentage scale, where would you say the .22wmr lands if the .223 is 100% loudness and the .22 lr is at say 20%?
22 magnum is a bit louder than 22lr. running supersonic ammunition. Think of .22 lr. with a bit more of a crack. Yes, they're louder, but nothing like the .223.
I've got 457 Cz 22WMR American , great rifle for the money 👍CCi ammo is the best in mine 👌
Wish CZ did a 457 in 22 hornet or in 222
The 457 is made for rimfire cartridges only. It only has a single locking lug on the bolt handle, so it won't handle higher-pressure center fire rounds.
nice to have ya back mate . good rifle to kick off with take care
30 and Winchester 34 grainers are the ducks nuts
Time to upload to "Rumble"!
Please do hk300 review 🙏
Great
Great to hear you're back on track Mate!!
have you tried aquila ammo yet
Back at it! 👌
Yup you bet!
Had one, traded it in for a Weihrauch hw66 in .17 hmr. More accurate.
I'd like to review the Weihrauch as I've heard great things about them
Wat is current price?
Welcome back mate👍🙂
Love it
Ksa. 🇸🇦 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
🫤I agree I hope
Never seen a 22 mag shoot any good @ 100 irrespective of if it shoots well @ 50. I think it's to do with the bullet as it isn't even as aerodynamic as a 22 lr for the same weight because of the slightly larger diameter. It's akin to throwing a round rock. It's all about the BC.
It isn't the MOST accucurate round but getting close groups can be totally done. Need to find certain ammo for your gun and fiddle around