Can’t get enough? Find more Highside/Lowside and all your Moto Content over on Common Tread! rvz.la/3UkRDP9 If your bike needs some freshening up, check out what Motul has to offer! rvz.la/3Uj1G7X
I did my first track day on my Honda CB500X, and rode it to the track with a giant duffel bag full of gear strapped to the back. It was the best day of the year.
The best time of my life was doing a track day a month. Felt like Christmas every month. No depression, no frustration, was super productive at work. I miss those days so much.
So when is Zach getting another show? You guys nailed the “Top Gear without assholes” vibe so so hard I’ve been pining for more adventures since season two wrappers
My first track day I rode to/from the track on my DL650 V-Strom. My very first contact was with a control rider who I now call a close friend. I wound up sharing garage space with a guy on a GL1800 Gold Wing and an XR1200 Sportster. At one point a stranger walked up to me and rubbed my shoulder saying something about wanting to get some of that newb energy for himself; that stranger is now one of my closest friends. Within 2 years I had a dedicated track bike with several track days under my belt and was getting ready to go racing. Best thing I’ve ever done. Best thing.
Ha! I remember that 2007 Zack Courts bike and helmet. We were acquaintances at that point, and I had no idea who Jen Ross was (we didn't meet until 2008). Crazy small world stuff man... NH Loudon Crew! Ari, Zack, Jen, and Alex :)
No way!!! Jen's first track day was at Loudon?!?!? 😳.....and Zack was there??? 😲 My first track day was at Loudon but, it was August 2021 and I was 55. I am 57 now and can't get enough. I live 20 minutes away from the track and I don't have a trailer so I ride my bike to and from track days. I am incredibly fortunate to have an amazing wife that fully supports my track "addiction". She drives the car loaded with all the necessary tools and gear and is my scheduler, organizer, pit crew, cheerleader, etc, etc...... 😉 The Penguin racing school has been great and the NEMRR race organization has what they call Super Street which is a half step to full on racing where you can register your track day prepped bike to race without the cost of a full race prepped bike. Some riders do it for "fun" but there are also some riders that are serious about it..... and very fast. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and insight, keep yourselves safe! 😃👍❤️🏍 Randy
The "street is free" comments make any track rider cringe. Hopefully you'll all realize that it really isn't free, before you pay the price. A triple digit speeding ticket will eventually cost you multiples of a single track day. A high speed street wreck will cost much more. Simply put, the cost of a track day is worth it. Rode to my first track day. Removed the luggage, taped up the lights and had blast all day. Bought a fully prepped track bike, for the price of a Grom, and have done many track days since. Worth every dollar.
That's a very good point about not being sure how to get your bike to the track. I bought a track only bike with the intention of doing my first track day but procrastinated so long due to this that the carbs need to be cleaned! Now that's one extra step to take care of before getting on track. But It will happen soon and it will be epic!
I like the advice of trying different providers. This was my first year and I tried two different providers and one of them that I really liked. Their instructors have perspective about why it's important to ensure new riders enjoy the sport and learn, and they're eager to help. At another provider, it felt like most of the instructors were there to rip around the track instead of helping.
Did my first track day a couple weeks after my 54th birthday. I can't manage to figure out how it took me that long to go. I was nervous as hell going to my first track day all by myself. Getting there on time and attending the morning safety class eased the nerves somewhat, but getting a few laps in helped a lot more. I researched the track (google maps satellite view, watched laps on youtube, read every page on the track's web site), and that helped a ton too. The day I went, there were only 3 people in the slow group, so they combined the groups, and did away with set sessions, so that anyone could be on track at any time. I tried to time my first session to when the track only had a few people on it. But I still found myself going faster than I wanted (so as not to hinder, piss off, or cause a crash with the club racers), instead of setting my own pace to really learn each corner. Several sessions later, I encountered what I figured was another person on his first track day, following a coach. They were going way slower than my first laps, so I shouldn't have worried so much about going slow myself.
Don’t know if was mentioned, but “Dual Sport Rides” at least here in southern OH/IN are run on enduro/race sections with the majority of them run by motorcycle clubs. A blast to do and are usually 2 days in length. I still need to go do a track day especially having just acquired a ZX4RR.😊
i moved to colorado from missouri, and grew up in illinois, and there are absolutely no places to ride for free in the rural midwest unless it’s your land or someone you know. i have been amazed how much terrain there is to ride on here in the colorado wilderness.
My local mx track has dedicated nights for minis vets and pros. Only one tiny little excuse of a track that somehow became the only surviving mx race track in the state of CT
You 3, and Ari should visit WNY and ride Demon Run. The trails are intermediate, however they are flowing and open with great hilly sections and hairpin turns. The only downfall is that you have to be there before the ATVs arrive, say 7am. Also, it hurts to crash here.
Had my first track experience at Willow Springs earlier this year at 61 years old. HFS what a good time. Did that track a second time later in the year, and will soon be visiting Chuckwalla. Why, oh why, did I wait so long to do this? Not only fun, but skill & confidence building. One point where I disagree with Spurg is on trail braking. Learning that early...along with covering the front brake...should be something learned and practiced from square one. Those two skills together can save your life on the street. Just ask Nick or any of the other professional instructors at YCRS.
There was a time when there weren’t any track days… we’re fortunate to have them now. I’ve rented midsized pickup trucks from Enterprise car rentals, for multiple days and hundreds of miles, it’s way cheaper than u-haul
ey guys. Trashed my motorcycle and broke some bones. Spent 30 minutes off line in the road and I am a collection of scars now. The gear saved my shitty ass. But is time to hang my helmet after some 20+ years. Stupidity must not be rewarded and I did a big one. Love the show, love you guys and loved this world. But it is what is.
I ride a new KLR650. What kind of track would be most suitable for procticing my 80/20 riding preferences on my KLR? I ride street for commuting and occasional hard-pack dirt back roads for recreation. I've been riding Honda CBs since the '70s and now use an HD ElectraGlide for long, mostly two-up road trips. I would like to become proficient for some BDR adventures on the KLR. Thanks for another great HSLS episode!!
Regarding the question at the end of not the news: Ducati DOES have a sub-brand, all those models of scrambler are their own line. I've got a desert sled, and love it, but Ducati definitely separates them from the rest of the brand.
On topic of track days. Do you think that KTM 390 RC, Yamaha R3 is good enough starter track bike for rider that's riding on road for 7 years but never on the track. Will it give enough to get the best out of riding on the track. Or is it better to invest in bigger bike like Yamaha R6, Kawasaki ZX6,.... And Zack once again congrats on the new addition to the family?
Driving 4 hours to NYS Safety Track from Finger Lakes area, and getting a passport so I can go to the track Southwest of Toronto near lake Erie is keeping me from first track day. I have to ride to Wayne County, NY in order to ride decent roads here in glacial NY.
Thats the closest one for me and its like 2hrs. No truck, id have to ride there and theres no way id ever push the bike near any limits if i still have to drive it home lol. And i think all the classroom stuff is mandatory the first time so idk how much you even get out there on the first visit. Idk, kinda not a great situation haha
Haven't listened yet but the reason I haven't done a track day is due to the risk of low-siding my bike and at 50+ I don't heal like I did when I was 20. So risk and money. i mean if I had a beater ninja 400 maybe but not an $15k-$20k bike.
I totally get this BUT the track really is a lot safer place to ride than the street pretty much full stop (rarely hit an elk/deer, rarely get t-boned by a car). The odds of low-siding is really low if you work your way up through your ability. The odds of riding off the track standing straight up is very high (on purpose) as you intelligently work up to your limits. In short, the level of risk is directly proportional to your willingness to work slowly toward your limits...so how good is your restraint. At 50 myself, I have developed that wisdom and restraint which I lacked when I first tried racing in my early 20's.
Zack, you asked: Should Ducati and other brands create sub-brands to expand their market share. It looks to me like this is exactly what Ducati has done with the Scrambler line. They don't even include the Scramblers on their website so as to not tarnish their $30k+ machines.
I wish the tracks up here in oregon had vet or beginner tracks. There are only tiny tracks for pw50s and the big track. I've done 5 track days and it's still very scary.
No track EXP, BUT you lads need to switch screen sides. (Back to normal) Love the pod cast, also there is SO much more when watched. As I have all of them. Just to say, nice work all involved! Also, KTM. ;)
I think Sam Sunderland won the 2022 on a GasGas branded KTM so it’s not just MOTO GP that they are pushing the brand . Also the VW group has lots of same platform cars with VW, Audi, Skoda and Seat in Europe and have a huge share of the market/ profit. Spread the cost of R&D has to make sense 👍🏻
I am going to say that most Street riders have ever done a track day. Just the same .. I have always said learn how to ride on a dirt bike before you have to deal 4 wheelers ect before you have learned motorcycle riding basic skills.
Calling them "sport bike track days" is pretty limiting these days. Here in the Midwest, the novice classes at least are packed with riders on nakeds and ADV bikes and whatnot out there to push the limits and improve their skills. "Street bike track days" would probably be a better descriptor at this point.
This. Its a hobby for wealthy people or people SO into it enough that they get sponsors. Its like - spend $500 on a day at the track where you drive an amount of time thats counted in minutes or spend that $500 on gas to drive on the street anywhere for massive amounts of time and distance. Could be enough for the whole year if gas prices go down again :D
@@Jagknorr It's always gonna be more expensive than street riding but it does not need to be $500/day. I see plenty of normal people carpooling together, sleeping in the car/tent, or riding their regular old street bike on regular old street tires. The only real investment they've had to make is a good set of leathers (yet to see an org check a closed face helmet for SNELL compliance or similar) which I would argue is still plenty useful for the street.
@@Jagknorr Are you flying to Germany and doing th Nubergring?? Laguna Seca is a legendary motogp track for $150 a day bruh, in what world is it $500+ lmfao
@@wizardmoto NYST is $280 a day for non members (too far away to go often enough) and then $80 for the gear (wouldn’t buy full gear for the first time im doing this) and then you have the trailer rental fees if i go that route and lastly the fees for being a scrub and needing to do the first time rider stuff. So maybe not $500 every time but about $300ish if i gotta rent a trailer every time. (Thats assuming i bought all my own gear already 😬)
Been riding over 15 years. Over 10 years on an R6. I’m in Northern California. Laguna Seca, Sonoma Raceway (Sear’s Point, Infineon), and Thunderhill are all very close. I ride very fast on perfect twisty coastal roads and freeways (on twisty roads I aim for 2x the speed limit on turns and up to 3x between them, and 120+ on a freeway is nothing). Lots of friends do track days regularly. Some even race. I’ve never been to a track. I’ve heard all about how expensive it is. Renting a truck to get there. The cost of the gear used on the track (I priced out a set of track gear at 4K and that’s on the cheap side). The lousy experience of sleeping in a tent near the track for weekends with 100+ degree heat, or the added expense of hundreds of dollars per night sleeping in a hotel. Am I going to buy a trailer? Not every apartment even has space for my one car and one bike, where the hell would I keep a trailer? Want to talk about what theft is like in Oakland California and how long a trailer would last parked on a street? I just don’t have thousands of dollars per year to throw at it. I’m currently paying off debt (school and such) at a rate of roughly 6k per month. And living in an area where a cheap one bedroom apartment costs 2500-3000 per month (luxury one bedroom apartments will go for 4K and more). And houses here basically start at 1-2 million dollars. If I add up my total expenses for my time riding bikes I’m at $1,000 per year or less. That’s the cost of both motorcycles I’ve owned, all the gear, all the repairs, and all the maintenance (I don’t do anything to my own bike). The people I know who do track days spend a LOT of money on the hobby. As soon as I have money I can set on fire and not care about …. I’ll get a cheap track suit, and a decent cheap set of gauntlets and boots and an air vest, and then look into a way to transport the bike that works when you don’t have a garage. But, I’m pretty sure I’m also supposed to have about 200k in savings by now, so I feel like after I get debt squared away I’ll need to focus on saving for retirement. Maybe if I can get a job that pays $250k per year. I’m making close to $200k per year and I cannot afford to go to the track. Not while being responsible about my finances. Not looking to eat cat food as a way to live within my fixed income as a retiree.
There's a lot of extreme overthinking here. There's a difference between going to a track day and going to a trackday every month for the rest of your life! Just go to one, see if you like it and have a good time. Don't buy a trailer, don't drop $4k on gear. Here's a breakdown on what you should expect to spend on your first track day with a bit of my experience thrown in for extra detail. Trackday: $195 | Pacific Track Time hosted at Thunder Hill Raceway Gear : $75 | Z2 Track Days offers a full-body rental of boots/gloves/suit/helmet. (Their prices aren't listed for trackdays as their calendar for the year is done, so I used PTT instead) Transport: $45 | This will vary a lot, but in my instance I owned a truck that could pull a rental trailer.* Gasoline: $63 | Gas for truck + bike** Food : $25 | You're gonna eat that Saturday anyway, but breakfast+lunch on the road. Total: $403. I didn't rent a room or sleep at the track, I just drove up the morning of. Sucked a bit but go to bed early the night before. *I rented a Uhaul Moto trailer for $15 a day + $15 insurance. Add $40+per-mile costs if you rent a pick-up, or don't have a friend/family that you can borrow one from. **I went 120 miles round trip in a truck getting 17mpg, plus about 7 gallons of gas at the trackday. 120/17=7.05+7. I used $4.50/gal because thats' what Gasbuddy says you can find gas for around San Fransisco. If you want to do a trackday, do a trackday. Don't blow ten grand to play amateur racer before you've even touched a track. Rent a uhaul truck, buy a $100 trackside ramp worst case, have a friend help you push the bike into the back, then make more friends at the track to help you pull it out since it sounds like you can't street-park a trailer overnight, you'll be able to pick up a Uhaul truck the night before, then in the morning load it up and hit the road. I helped three people drag their bikes out of pickups my first trackday and they became friends to relax in the "pit" that we set up between our vehicles. PS: Find a social group who rides the tracks in your area, I bet you could find someone who doesn't live too far from you who has a spare spot in a truck or trailer they already own going to the same track and would pick your bike up for gas cost. Track riders are a very friendly bunch and we're all a community together.
Dude this reads like a manifesto, %95 of thats in your head. I currently live near Sac. Little 99 in Stockton is only $400/YEAR (although small, and admittedly a zoo compared to ThunderHill). 1) Don't need a trailer, ride your bike because you live like 3hrs tops from all those tracks. 1a) I bought a hitch and trailer brand new for my STATIONWAGON for ~$350, a uHual is ~$20. 2) Camping?!?!? Bruh ur 2-3 hours away and track days end at like sundown, is your bedtime 9:30pm?? Just do one day, fun trip. 3) Don't need a track bike, especially for your first few times. Just tape your mirrors like everyone else lol 4) Theft is real forsure, but that can happen to ANY bike. I got my cheapest bike jacked, just becuase it was the lightest (125cc dirtbike) 4a) $89 for a RingCam, $28 for an AirTag, $5 for a 3/4" concrete anchor to run chain thru (its an apartment complex, but my bikes are worth more than security deposit, only drilling 3 holes total they havent said anything yet). Barely breaking $100 for a decent security setup with live video. 5) if you're paying off $6k+ debt you clearly don't mind spending money, and with 15 minutes of googling and $2500 you could have full gear (see 6) and a year of track time with your daily bike. Clearly motorcycling proficiency simply isn't a priority for you. 6) $4k track setup is insane, no idea where you were looking. Can get full Sedici set at under a grand, if it's good enough for Zack and Ari it's definitely good enough for you🤣🤣 6a) Used gear on Marketplace can be a steal too, avoid helmets but everything else is worth looking at in person. Got my Dainese Seca for $350 I swear to god, old dude just quit track riding. TLDR: ur negativity is astounding, clearly didnt even attempt to research trying. It's ridiculousy cheap and easy where we live. I'm at like a quarter of your income and living ten times the life man, go get after it!
@@wizardmoto thanks for the comment. I’ve clearly done the research. 200 for boots, 200 for gloves. I’d need another 600 or so for a helmet. And most suits start at about 1500. That’s 2500. I’d want an air vest. Those run another 700 or so. So, now this is 3200 for pretty inexpensive items and there’s no sales tax. That’s pretty close to the rough estimate of 4K. That’s without base layers and other stuff you can skip. I can’t assume that my bike isn’t going to go down. So, no, I’m not going to ride my bike there and hope it’s in one piece at the end of the weekend. Also, riding it for more than 5 hours is torture. It really sucks being on a supersport for a whole day. Hours to get to the track and a day there and hours back? No way. Some of my friends go to the track and sleep there to do a multi day weekend because the per day amount is cheaper (like snowboarding or whatever). Assuming you don’t eat it on the first day. Some of my friends bring a toy hauler or an RV to stay in for the weekend. Others do tents or hotels. It’s cool with me that you ride your bike to the track and are willing to just …. Deal with it if you get an issue with your bike running it hard on a track or if you are testing boundaries and go down in a minor way but enough to actually damage your bike. That’s cool. You can find a tow home. If I go, I’m going to have a plan and finances in place to deal with that outcome that near as I can tell happens to everyone sooner or later. It can be done for less. I’m obviously more risk adverse than you. I have plenty of run racing up and down highway 1 along the coast. I just don’t feel like I NEED to deal with all of this crap to go to the track.
@@zero11010 some dude above me did the math, so idk why you're lying when the facts are clear. You're hilariously uneducated on helmets. Snell rated Sedicis start at $150 dude, my $600+ Shoei GTAir isn't allowed on track. Brand=/=track rating. Full suits are also under $1000. If you ride "3x pace on straightaway" on the street without feeling the need for an airbag, and without fearing "wrecking your bike" you definitely won't need one on a perfectly manicured track with limited variables in controlled 20minute sessions with a soft backstop. That's entirely psychological; in fact I almost guarantee you will ride underpace the entirety of your first year. It is not 5hrs from Oakland to ANY of the tracks you mentioned, unless you ride a grom. It takes 6 to get to Oregon ffs😭😭 Saying you have "ridden street for 10 years" followd up by "id rather die than ride 5 hrs" entirely invalidates your experience. Just say you've OWNED bikes for ten years, not so much a rider by mileage, hours, or any other definitive metric?🧐🧐 I'd say seeya at the track but with your mentality I know you'll never show, so I'll just say ride safe man✌️🏍
@@Thaillus this is interesting info! Thanks for sharing! Everyone I know who does track days has spent a FORTUNE on it. Maybe I’m just surrounded by people who are spending a lot more than they need to. They are they folks on new Ducatis with sets of Dianese gear (which getssv an eyeroll from me). Renting the suit would help a lot. I need to replace my helmet, gloves and boots anyway. But, I really, really don’t want to drop 1-3k on a suit I may only use once. I hate the whole idea of that. What are your thoughts on having a track coach assist you? I feel like to get the most out of it I need to eliminate unknown unknowns. I can’t fix problems I don’t know about. What other incidentals should I be thinking about? The girls I know who do track days end up bragging about the free things they get at the track by showing up with cleavage (suspension tuning, tires, mild work or bike tuning). Everyone I know who’s been has had a great time! But, everyone I know who went to Tokyo or Paris had a great time, too. Shit is expensive! 🤣 Folks have a great time at the track, but they do still talk about the hit to their bank account. The people I know who sky dive are similar. They spend a fortune on it, and as long as they don’t think about the annual total they don’t mind dropping a few hundred on it per weekend for several weekends per year.
Ok, lets start by addressing the elephant in the room, you guys are on the wrong side of the screen. You need to go back to your spots. What gentlemen, shifting all the blame to talented and lovely Jen Dunstan. Mr. Courts can please give us your impression of track days in Southern California? (Mr. Courts) - Sorry I'm a motovlogger I don't do impressions. Spurge likes break it on down for minute and roll it up in third gear for minute. I'm still here, I love these podcasts. Would like to try a track day but no tracks near where I live, and not sure my bike would be allowed on a track. Would also like to try some dirt stuff and actually found a school not too far from me. So, when spring rolls around I'm signing up for the class, any tips? I'm thinking thats an Akro exhaust with the baffle removed. Maybe a newish CB650R, not sure. Did Moto Guzzi ever make four banger? Wrong again, oh well. Had a deer sideswipe me the other day. It needed to bank about 93 degrees to avoid hitting me and got to about 87 before it lost lost traction. No damage outside of a few scratches on the bike and one scared deer. Good show chaps, see in two!
Access to a track is a pretty big impediment. Not everyone lives in SoCal or whatever with 4 tracks nearby. I'll continue to excessively speed for another 30 years on surface roads I suppose, or die. WTV
Surprising you guys never touched on gears, considering what channel this is. Perhaps not name any particular brand or models, just some general idea like price range for beginners, what helmet safety certification is required, is one-piece suit a must, etc.
The metric shit ton of money it costs? I don't have leathers, I don't have a race helmet, I don't have money to burn on tires, and worst of all, I ride a fucking R1200GS. Sure, it would be fun ripping around on a track with her, but is it really worth a 2-3k investment before I can even acquire a beginners license? Shits expensive.
You don't need a license for track days, only for racing. Some organizations let you rent gear for cheap, if not then a scorpion r420 is $150 and it's snell cert will get you into any track. Leathers can be had for a few hundred bucks second hand. It is expensive but even if you can't rent anything you can do it for under 1k if you are smart about it
Can’t get enough? Find more Highside/Lowside and all your Moto Content over on Common Tread! rvz.la/3UkRDP9
If your bike needs some freshening up, check out what Motul has to offer! rvz.la/3Uj1G7X
I did my first track day on my Honda CB500X, and rode it to the track with a giant duffel bag full of gear strapped to the back.
It was the best day of the year.
The best time of my life was doing a track day a month. Felt like Christmas every month. No depression, no frustration, was super productive at work. I miss those days so much.
Didn't do my first track day until I was 47. Now 11 years later, I can't believe I waited so long!
So when is Zach getting another show? You guys nailed the “Top Gear without assholes” vibe so so hard I’ve been pining for more adventures since season two wrappers
He has a baby. Fun ends with babies.
@@lovelessissimo "Two guys, Two Motorcycles and A Baby" - I'd watch
Invention... motorcycle baby seat.
@@tonylastname6468 What a prediction for the babies on bikes CTXP
My first track day I rode to/from the track on
my DL650 V-Strom. My very first contact was with a control rider who I now call a close friend. I wound up sharing garage space with a guy on a GL1800 Gold Wing and an XR1200 Sportster. At one point a stranger walked up to me and rubbed my shoulder saying something about wanting to get some of that newb energy for himself; that stranger is now one of my closest friends.
Within 2 years I had a dedicated track bike with several track days under my belt and was getting ready to go racing. Best thing I’ve ever done. Best thing.
Ha! I remember that 2007 Zack Courts bike and helmet. We were acquaintances at that point, and I had no idea who Jen Ross was (we didn't meet until 2008). Crazy small world stuff man... NH Loudon Crew! Ari, Zack, Jen, and Alex :)
No way!!!
Jen's first track day was at Loudon?!?!? 😳.....and Zack was there??? 😲
My first track day was at Loudon but, it was August 2021 and I was 55. I
am 57 now and can't get enough. I live 20 minutes away from the track and
I don't have a trailer so I ride my bike to and from track days. I am incredibly
fortunate to have an amazing wife that fully supports my track "addiction".
She drives the car loaded with all the necessary tools and gear and is my
scheduler, organizer, pit crew, cheerleader, etc, etc...... 😉
The Penguin racing school has been great and the NEMRR race organization
has what they call Super Street which is a half step to full on racing where you
can register your track day prepped bike to race without the cost of a full race
prepped bike. Some riders do it for "fun" but there are also some riders that are
serious about it..... and very fast.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and insight, keep yourselves safe! 😃👍❤️🏍
Randy
The "street is free" comments make any track rider cringe. Hopefully you'll all realize that it really isn't free, before you pay the price.
A triple digit speeding ticket will eventually cost you multiples of a single track day. A high speed street wreck will cost much more.
Simply put, the cost of a track day is worth it. Rode to my first track day. Removed the luggage, taped up the lights and had blast all day. Bought a fully prepped track bike, for the price of a Grom, and have done many track days since. Worth every dollar.
That's a very good point about not being sure how to get your bike to the track. I bought a track only bike with the intention of doing my first track day but procrastinated so long due to this that the carbs need to be cleaned! Now that's one extra step to take care of before getting on track. But It will happen soon and it will be epic!
I like the advice of trying different providers. This was my first year and I tried two different providers and one of them that I really liked. Their instructors have perspective about why it's important to ensure new riders enjoy the sport and learn, and they're eager to help. At another provider, it felt like most of the instructors were there to rip around the track instead of helping.
Did my first track day a couple weeks after my 54th birthday. I can't manage to figure out how it took me that long to go.
I was nervous as hell going to my first track day all by myself. Getting there on time and attending the morning safety class eased the nerves somewhat, but getting a few laps in helped a lot more. I researched the track (google maps satellite view, watched laps on youtube, read every page on the track's web site), and that helped a ton too.
The day I went, there were only 3 people in the slow group, so they combined the groups, and did away with set sessions, so that anyone could be on track at any time. I tried to time my first session to when the track only had a few people on it. But I still found myself going faster than I wanted (so as not to hinder, piss off, or cause a crash with the club racers), instead of setting my own pace to really learn each corner. Several sessions later, I encountered what I figured was another person on his first track day, following a coach. They were going way slower than my first laps, so I shouldn't have worried so much about going slow myself.
Don’t know if was mentioned, but “Dual Sport Rides” at least here in southern OH/IN are run on enduro/race sections with the majority of them run by motorcycle clubs. A blast to do and are usually 2 days in length. I still need to go do a track day especially having just acquired a ZX4RR.😊
On my first track day I destroyed my pride & Joy, broke my ribs & wrecked a one piece leather suit! Great success 👍🏼
U Haul motorcycle trailers are a steal @ 24.00 ish a day. I great option to go pick up a new bike, or use to haul to a track day, etc.
i moved to colorado from missouri, and grew up in illinois, and there are absolutely no places to ride for free in the rural midwest unless it’s your land or someone you know. i have been amazed how much terrain there is to ride on here in the colorado wilderness.
My local mx track has dedicated nights for minis vets and pros. Only one tiny little excuse of a track that somehow became the only surviving mx race track in the state of CT
I guessed it right. Only because I have been looking at tuonos a lot and I don’t know many bikes to have other guesses to choose from.
You 3, and Ari should visit WNY and ride Demon Run. The trails are intermediate, however they are flowing and open with great hilly sections and hairpin turns. The only downfall is that you have to be there before the ATVs arrive, say 7am. Also, it hurts to crash here.
Love you guys ... did want to point out ... only 2 A's in Husqvarna.
American accents don't brake well when different consonants are juxtaposed like that 😆
Had my first track experience at Willow Springs earlier this year at 61 years old. HFS what a good time. Did that track a second time later in the year, and will soon be visiting Chuckwalla. Why, oh why, did I wait so long to do this? Not only fun, but skill & confidence building.
One point where I disagree with Spurg is on trail braking. Learning that early...along with covering the front brake...should be something learned and practiced from square one. Those two skills together can save your life on the street. Just ask Nick or any of the other professional instructors at YCRS.
So it has been Spurg that has been drinking my sparkling waters at the Get On ADV Fests? Key Lime La Croix is not easy to find in those places.
There was a time when there weren’t any track days… we’re fortunate to have them now.
I’ve rented midsized pickup trucks from Enterprise car rentals, for multiple days and hundreds of miles, it’s way cheaper than u-haul
ey guys.
Trashed my motorcycle and broke some bones. Spent 30 minutes off line in the road and I am a collection of scars now.
The gear saved my shitty ass. But is time to hang my helmet after some 20+ years. Stupidity must not be rewarded and I did a big one.
Love the show, love you guys and loved this world. But it is what is.
Awesome as always. Usually listen to this on podcasts. Always look forward to a new one.
Cams licence, leather suit, distance from track, risk (myself and others). So basically just time and money.
I ride a new KLR650. What kind of track would be most suitable for procticing my 80/20 riding preferences on my KLR? I ride street for commuting and occasional hard-pack dirt back roads for recreation. I've been riding Honda CBs since the '70s and now use an HD ElectraGlide for long, mostly two-up road trips. I would like to become proficient for some BDR adventures on the KLR. Thanks for another great HSLS episode!!
Regarding the question at the end of not the news: Ducati DOES have a sub-brand, all those models of scrambler are their own line. I've got a desert sled, and love it, but Ducati definitely separates them from the rest of the brand.
On topic of track days. Do you think that KTM 390 RC, Yamaha R3 is good enough starter track bike for rider that's riding on road for 7 years but never on the track. Will it give enough to get the best out of riding on the track. Or is it better to invest in bigger bike like Yamaha R6, Kawasaki ZX6,....
And Zack once again congrats on the new addition to the family?
Driving 4 hours to NYS Safety Track from Finger Lakes area, and getting a passport so I can go to the track Southwest of Toronto near lake Erie is keeping me from first track day.
I have to ride to Wayne County, NY in order to ride decent roads here in glacial NY.
Thats the closest one for me and its like 2hrs. No truck, id have to ride there and theres no way id ever push the bike near any limits if i still have to drive it home lol. And i think all the classroom stuff is mandatory the first time so idk how much you even get out there on the first visit. Idk, kinda not a great situation haha
@@Jagknorr trust me your never going to get any training better than that first day class. It's a plus not a detractor
Haha, loved to Cwofee Twalk reference at 13:09.
He had shpilkes in his genechtagazoink.
Haven't listened yet but the reason I haven't done a track day is due to the risk of low-siding my bike and at 50+ I don't heal like I did when I was 20. So risk and money. i mean if I had a beater ninja 400 maybe but not an $15k-$20k bike.
I totally get this BUT the track really is a lot safer place to ride than the street pretty much full stop (rarely hit an elk/deer, rarely get t-boned by a car). The odds of low-siding is really low if you work your way up through your ability. The odds of riding off the track standing straight up is very high (on purpose) as you intelligently work up to your limits.
In short, the level of risk is directly proportional to your willingness to work slowly toward your limits...so how good is your restraint. At 50 myself, I have developed that wisdom and restraint which I lacked when I first tried racing in my early 20's.
Zack, you asked: Should Ducati and other brands create sub-brands to expand their market share. It looks to me like this is exactly what Ducati has done with the Scrambler line. They don't even include the Scramblers on their website so as to not tarnish their $30k+ machines.
I wish the tracks up here in oregon had vet or beginner tracks. There are only tiny tracks for pw50s and the big track. I've done 5 track days and it's still very scary.
I would LOVE an “Anything but sport bikes” track day for my xr650
No track EXP, BUT you lads need to switch screen sides. (Back to normal)
Love the pod cast, also there is SO much more when watched. As I have all of them.
Just to say, nice work all involved! Also, KTM. ;)
Great podcast. Insights here were great
1:21:32 im not sure every rider would agree😄😂 we need to just go fast sometimes🤣💥 "mindblowingly fast" cit
I think Sam Sunderland won the 2022 on a GasGas branded KTM so it’s not just MOTO GP that they are pushing the brand . Also the VW group has lots of same platform cars with VW, Audi, Skoda and Seat in Europe and have a huge share of the market/ profit. Spread the cost of R&D has to make sense 👍🏻
daxa here - thanks so much for answering my question! time to swelter in the tropical heat in my leggings
I don't go to track days because I don't think track rated helmets and boots that would fit me exist, if they do I have no idea where to find them.
I heard the ticks in the Pine Barrons are really bad…between that and the Jersey Devil, I’m out!😂 kidding, loved this episode!
You guys didn’t mention track day for the straight line guys which is very popular
Everyone else: "husk-varna"
Spurgeon: "husker-vonna"
Where’s Zack and Ari’s videos been??
I am going to say that most Street riders have ever done a track day. Just the same .. I have always said learn how to ride on a dirt bike before you have to deal 4 wheelers ect before you have learned motorcycle riding basic skills.
Money. Money, money, money.
Calling them "sport bike track days" is pretty limiting these days. Here in the Midwest, the novice classes at least are packed with riders on nakeds and ADV bikes and whatnot out there to push the limits and improve their skills. "Street bike track days" would probably be a better descriptor at this point.
Three things:
1. Money
2. Distance
3. Money
This. Its a hobby for wealthy people or people SO into it enough that they get sponsors. Its like - spend $500 on a day at the track where you drive an amount of time thats counted in minutes or spend that $500 on gas to drive on the street anywhere for massive amounts of time and distance. Could be enough for the whole year if gas prices go down again :D
@@Jagknorr don't forget the protective gear, trailer, and trackside stuff.
@@Jagknorr It's always gonna be more expensive than street riding but it does not need to be $500/day. I see plenty of normal people carpooling together, sleeping in the car/tent, or riding their regular old street bike on regular old street tires. The only real investment they've had to make is a good set of leathers (yet to see an org check a closed face helmet for SNELL compliance or similar) which I would argue is still plenty useful for the street.
@@Jagknorr Are you flying to Germany and doing th Nubergring?? Laguna Seca is a legendary motogp track for $150 a day bruh, in what world is it $500+ lmfao
@@wizardmoto NYST is $280 a day for non members (too far away to go often enough) and then $80 for the gear (wouldn’t buy full gear for the first time im doing this) and then you have the trailer rental fees if i go that route and lastly the fees for being a scrub and needing to do the first time rider stuff. So maybe not $500 every time but about $300ish if i gotta rent a trailer every time. (Thats assuming i bought all my own gear already 😬)
The 2hrs each way is discouraging. I need 2 get there.
Why did you switch their places? 😕
Spurge having an AI moment there at 40:45
Zach, you look like you would need some more good sleep 😜 how is the new life with the newborn? :)
As austrian, how you say Pierer just hurts 😂
no no no noooo..... Zack is back, and Spurgeon is still on the wrong side..... !
You can take your bike to a drag strip too..
Been riding over 15 years. Over 10 years on an R6. I’m in Northern California. Laguna Seca, Sonoma Raceway (Sear’s Point, Infineon), and Thunderhill are all very close.
I ride very fast on perfect twisty coastal roads and freeways (on twisty roads I aim for 2x the speed limit on turns and up to 3x between them, and 120+ on a freeway is nothing).
Lots of friends do track days regularly. Some even race.
I’ve never been to a track.
I’ve heard all about how expensive it is. Renting a truck to get there. The cost of the gear used on the track (I priced out a set of track gear at 4K and that’s on the cheap side). The lousy experience of sleeping in a tent near the track for weekends with 100+ degree heat, or the added expense of hundreds of dollars per night sleeping in a hotel.
Am I going to buy a trailer? Not every apartment even has space for my one car and one bike, where the hell would I keep a trailer? Want to talk about what theft is like in Oakland California and how long a trailer would last parked on a street?
I just don’t have thousands of dollars per year to throw at it. I’m currently paying off debt (school and such) at a rate of roughly 6k per month. And living in an area where a cheap one bedroom apartment costs 2500-3000 per month (luxury one bedroom apartments will go for 4K and more). And houses here basically start at 1-2 million dollars.
If I add up my total expenses for my time riding bikes I’m at $1,000 per year or less. That’s the cost of both motorcycles I’ve owned, all the gear, all the repairs, and all the maintenance (I don’t do anything to my own bike). The people I know who do track days spend a LOT of money on the hobby.
As soon as I have money I can set on fire and not care about …. I’ll get a cheap track suit, and a decent cheap set of gauntlets and boots and an air vest, and then look into a way to transport the bike that works when you don’t have a garage. But, I’m pretty sure I’m also supposed to have about 200k in savings by now, so I feel like after I get debt squared away I’ll need to focus on saving for retirement.
Maybe if I can get a job that pays $250k per year. I’m making close to $200k per year and I cannot afford to go to the track. Not while being responsible about my finances. Not looking to eat cat food as a way to live within my fixed income as a retiree.
There's a lot of extreme overthinking here. There's a difference between going to a track day and going to a trackday every month for the rest of your life! Just go to one, see if you like it and have a good time. Don't buy a trailer, don't drop $4k on gear. Here's a breakdown on what you should expect to spend on your first track day with a bit of my experience thrown in for extra detail.
Trackday: $195 | Pacific Track Time hosted at Thunder Hill Raceway
Gear : $75 | Z2 Track Days offers a full-body rental of boots/gloves/suit/helmet. (Their prices aren't listed for trackdays as their calendar for the year is done, so I used PTT instead)
Transport: $45 | This will vary a lot, but in my instance I owned a truck that could pull a rental trailer.*
Gasoline: $63 | Gas for truck + bike**
Food : $25 | You're gonna eat that Saturday anyway, but breakfast+lunch on the road.
Total: $403. I didn't rent a room or sleep at the track, I just drove up the morning of. Sucked a bit but go to bed early the night before.
*I rented a Uhaul Moto trailer for $15 a day + $15 insurance. Add $40+per-mile costs if you rent a pick-up, or don't have a friend/family that you can borrow one from.
**I went 120 miles round trip in a truck getting 17mpg, plus about 7 gallons of gas at the trackday. 120/17=7.05+7. I used $4.50/gal because thats' what Gasbuddy says you can find gas for around San Fransisco.
If you want to do a trackday, do a trackday. Don't blow ten grand to play amateur racer before you've even touched a track. Rent a uhaul truck, buy a $100 trackside ramp worst case, have a friend help you push the bike into the back, then make more friends at the track to help you pull it out since it sounds like you can't street-park a trailer overnight, you'll be able to pick up a Uhaul truck the night before, then in the morning load it up and hit the road. I helped three people drag their bikes out of pickups my first trackday and they became friends to relax in the "pit" that we set up between our vehicles.
PS: Find a social group who rides the tracks in your area, I bet you could find someone who doesn't live too far from you who has a spare spot in a truck or trailer they already own going to the same track and would pick your bike up for gas cost. Track riders are a very friendly bunch and we're all a community together.
Dude this reads like a manifesto, %95 of thats in your head. I currently live near Sac. Little 99 in Stockton is only $400/YEAR (although small, and admittedly a zoo compared to ThunderHill).
1) Don't need a trailer, ride your bike because you live like 3hrs tops from all those tracks.
1a) I bought a hitch and trailer brand new for my STATIONWAGON for ~$350, a uHual is ~$20.
2) Camping?!?!? Bruh ur 2-3 hours away and track days end at like sundown, is your bedtime 9:30pm?? Just do one day, fun trip.
3) Don't need a track bike, especially for your first few times. Just tape your mirrors like everyone else lol
4) Theft is real forsure, but that can happen to ANY bike. I got my cheapest bike jacked, just becuase it was the lightest (125cc dirtbike)
4a) $89 for a RingCam, $28 for an AirTag, $5 for a 3/4" concrete anchor to run chain thru (its an apartment complex, but my bikes are worth more than security deposit, only drilling 3 holes total they havent said anything yet). Barely breaking $100 for a decent security setup with live video.
5) if you're paying off $6k+ debt you clearly don't mind spending money, and with 15 minutes of googling and $2500 you could have full gear (see 6) and a year of track time with your daily bike. Clearly motorcycling proficiency simply isn't a priority for you.
6) $4k track setup is insane, no idea where you were looking. Can get full Sedici set at under a grand, if it's good enough for Zack and Ari it's definitely good enough for you🤣🤣
6a) Used gear on Marketplace can be a steal too, avoid helmets but everything else is worth looking at in person. Got my Dainese Seca for $350 I swear to god, old dude just quit track riding.
TLDR: ur negativity is astounding, clearly didnt even attempt to research trying.
It's ridiculousy cheap and easy where we live. I'm at like a quarter of your income and living ten times the life man, go get after it!
@@wizardmoto thanks for the comment.
I’ve clearly done the research. 200 for boots, 200 for gloves. I’d need another 600 or so for a helmet. And most suits start at about 1500. That’s 2500. I’d want an air vest. Those run another 700 or so. So, now this is 3200 for pretty inexpensive items and there’s no sales tax. That’s pretty close to the rough estimate of 4K. That’s without base layers and other stuff you can skip.
I can’t assume that my bike isn’t going to go down. So, no, I’m not going to ride my bike there and hope it’s in one piece at the end of the weekend.
Also, riding it for more than 5 hours is torture. It really sucks being on a supersport for a whole day. Hours to get to the track and a day there and hours back? No way.
Some of my friends go to the track and sleep there to do a multi day weekend because the per day amount is cheaper (like snowboarding or whatever). Assuming you don’t eat it on the first day. Some of my friends bring a toy hauler or an RV to stay in for the weekend. Others do tents or hotels.
It’s cool with me that you ride your bike to the track and are willing to just …. Deal with it if you get an issue with your bike running it hard on a track or if you are testing boundaries and go down in a minor way but enough to actually damage your bike. That’s cool. You can find a tow home. If I go, I’m going to have a plan and finances in place to deal with that outcome that near as I can tell happens to everyone sooner or later.
It can be done for less. I’m obviously more risk adverse than you. I have plenty of run racing up and down highway 1 along the coast. I just don’t feel like I NEED to deal with all of this crap to go to the track.
@@zero11010 some dude above me did the math, so idk why you're lying when the facts are clear.
You're hilariously uneducated on helmets.
Snell rated Sedicis start at $150 dude, my $600+ Shoei GTAir isn't allowed on track. Brand=/=track rating. Full suits are also under $1000.
If you ride "3x pace on straightaway" on the street without feeling the need for an airbag, and without fearing "wrecking your bike" you definitely won't need one on a perfectly manicured track with limited variables in controlled 20minute sessions with a soft backstop. That's entirely psychological; in fact I almost guarantee you will ride underpace the entirety of your first year.
It is not 5hrs from Oakland to ANY of the tracks you mentioned, unless you ride a grom. It takes 6 to get to Oregon ffs😭😭
Saying you have "ridden street for 10 years" followd up by "id rather die than ride 5 hrs" entirely invalidates your experience. Just say you've OWNED bikes for ten years, not so much a rider by mileage, hours, or any other definitive metric?🧐🧐
I'd say seeya at the track but with your mentality I know you'll never show, so I'll just say ride safe man✌️🏍
@@Thaillus this is interesting info! Thanks for sharing! Everyone I know who does track days has spent a FORTUNE on it. Maybe I’m just surrounded by people who are spending a lot more than they need to. They are they folks on new Ducatis with sets of Dianese gear (which getssv an eyeroll from me).
Renting the suit would help a lot. I need to replace my helmet, gloves and boots anyway. But, I really, really don’t want to drop 1-3k on a suit I may only use once. I hate the whole idea of that.
What are your thoughts on having a track coach assist you? I feel like to get the most out of it I need to eliminate unknown unknowns. I can’t fix problems I don’t know about.
What other incidentals should I be thinking about? The girls I know who do track days end up bragging about the free things they get at the track by showing up with cleavage (suspension tuning, tires, mild work or bike tuning).
Everyone I know who’s been has had a great time! But, everyone I know who went to Tokyo or Paris had a great time, too. Shit is expensive! 🤣 Folks have a great time at the track, but they do still talk about the hit to their bank account.
The people I know who sky dive are similar. They spend a fortune on it, and as long as they don’t think about the annual total they don’t mind dropping a few hundred on it per weekend for several weekends per year.
Money
This.
RSV 1000 Factory V2
KTM co and Beta.. does anyone else make enduro bikes? I always think of “the big 4” as being MX only
V-4 Yamaha V-Max.. Honda Magna or a Ducati V-4
I was born the same year as Zach's dad? damn...
Ok, lets start by addressing the elephant in the room, you guys are on the wrong side of the screen. You need to go back to your spots. What gentlemen, shifting all the blame to talented and lovely Jen Dunstan. Mr. Courts can please give us your impression of track days in Southern California? (Mr. Courts) - Sorry I'm a motovlogger I don't do impressions. Spurge likes break it on down for minute and roll it up in third gear for minute. I'm still here, I love these podcasts. Would like to try a track day but no tracks near where I live, and not sure my bike would be allowed on a track. Would also like to try some dirt stuff and actually found a school not too far from me. So, when spring rolls around I'm signing up for the class, any tips? I'm thinking thats an Akro exhaust with the baffle removed. Maybe a newish CB650R, not sure. Did Moto Guzzi ever make four banger? Wrong again, oh well. Had a deer sideswipe me the other day. It needed to bank about 93 degrees to avoid hitting me and got to about 87 before it lost lost traction. No damage outside of a few scratches on the bike and one scared deer. Good show chaps, see in two!
Access to a track is a pretty big impediment. Not everyone lives in SoCal or whatever with 4 tracks nearby. I'll continue to excessively speed for another 30 years on surface roads I suppose, or die. WTV
Money is stopping me. After the bike safety mods, rider gear & paying $300 for the weekend on a crappy old track.
Surprising you guys never touched on gears, considering what channel this is.
Perhaps not name any particular brand or models, just some general idea like price range for beginners, what helmet safety certification is required, is one-piece suit a must, etc.
You're on the wrong side.
We fear change.
The metric shit ton of money it costs? I don't have leathers, I don't have a race helmet, I don't have money to burn on tires, and worst of all, I ride a fucking R1200GS. Sure, it would be fun ripping around on a track with her, but is it really worth a 2-3k investment before I can even acquire a beginners license? Shits expensive.
You don't need a license for track days, only for racing. Some organizations let you rent gear for cheap, if not then a scorpion r420 is $150 and it's snell cert will get you into any track. Leathers can be had for a few hundred bucks second hand. It is expensive but even if you can't rent anything you can do it for under 1k if you are smart about it
A track day on a Himalayan seems a bit pointless.
Feeling the same way about my dirty KLR...
I would love to smoke some people on a Himalayan, that sounds hilarious and fun.
Eh, the Isle of Man has a storied history of people thrashing antiquated thumpers.
God, she is way prettier than you guys.
It’s too expensive and the road is free. 😊