The Jehovah's Witness War doctrine disproved
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ต.ค. 2024
- #pimo #apologetics #exjw
Chicken Scratch Apologetics. Jehovah's Witnesses have a very strict NO WAR policy. They refuse to fight in any armed conflict or engage in any way. They say this position is biblical, but it's just another invented rule.
Amen! Another great video!
I'm glad you discussed this topic. I was looking thru the videos at one time to see if you had already covered it.
Another great video!
See also Luke 3:14 where John the Baptist advises some soldiers "Be content with your pay." This in no way invalidates military service. If this had been wrong advice, no doubt Jesus would have rebuked him.
Great point.
Who is the ruler of this world today? And why did Jesus tell us to he NO PART of it? Think about that. True Christians learn war no more. It’s a spiritual war we are in. And would never want to kill our own brother. (1 John 3:10-12)
WowTHank you my brother in Christ! May Our Strong God bless you and your ministry ❤
The Prophecy about the final part of the days, shows that the followers of GOD will LEARN WAR NO MORE
That's true. And we are in the final part of the final part of....you clown.😂😂😂
@@Jonboatjax 2 Peter 3:3
First of all know this, that in the last days ridiculers will come with their ridicule, proceeding according to their own desires
@@Mr.DC3.1914 And you never ridicule ANYONE, right?
@@evanwindom3265 I'm exposing false logic and teachings and you cannot take it
@@evanwindom3265
I know you do.
If the rest of the world did like JW in WW2, we would all speak German today. Enough said.
just your own false opinion. GOD can use the nations who are non worshippers of GOD to defend GOD's people. Remember Cyrus the Great?
@@Mr.DC3.1914 So all of the 407,000 American servicemembers who died liberating Europe and ending the wholesale extermination of the Jews were "non-worshippers of God" all because they weren't JWs? Is that what you're implying? That's "just your own false opinion."
Not only that, all Jews, Eastern Europeans, Roma and other "sub humans" would have been murdered and would be no more.
@@Mr.DC3.1914 Would He have? Thats your false opinion.
@@wfqsfg Remember Cyrus the Great
Early Christian would not be in the military or go to war.
From The March of Civilization, Ancient and Medieval World by Jesse E. Wrench, Professor of History, University of Missouri, p.205: “The Christians refused to show their loyalty by burning incense to the emperor. Being men of peace, they would not serve in the Roman armies.”
From From the Old World to the New by E.A. Golligan, Associate Superintendent of Schools, City of New York, and Maxwell F. Littwin, Principal of New York City Public Schools, pp. 88,89: “They preferred the Kingdom of God to any kingdom that they might serve on earth. …The early Christians were ready to die for their faith. …Since they believed in peace they would not serve in Rome’s imperial armies.”
The Church the Gospel and War, by Rufus M. Jones, on page 78, reports on what Celsus, the pagan critic of Christianity said regarding Christians during the decade of about 170-80: “ ‘If all men were to do the same as you, there would be nothing to prevent the king from being left in utter solitude and desertion and the force of the empire would fall into the hands of the wildest and most lawless barbarians.’ Such words are so explicit as to warrant the assumption that Celsus knew of no Christians who would accept military service.”
From this same book, (p.83), which quotes from Acts of Archelaus and Mani 1, ANF VI, 179, we read: “A case of the rejection of military service by Christians in the region of Mesopotamia is recorded for the closing years of the 4thcentury where a large number of soldiers having been converted while on garrison duty, ‘threw off the belt of military service’.”
While the first century Christians, who were taught directly by Jesus Christ, were well-known for their neutrality-their whole-hearted denunciation of war and any political involvement in state affairs-it is of interest that even in the 2nd and 3rd centuries, well after pagan teachings and practices had been ushered into the Christian religion, this attitude against war continued for a time (as also seen by the previous quote). Please note the following:
The Ante-Nicene Fathers, edited by A. Roberts and J. Donaldson, Vol. III, pp.99,100, (quoting the words of Tertullian, an early Christian historian who wrote these words about 204 A.D.): “To begin with the real ground of the military crown, I think we must first inquire whether warfare is proper at all for Christians. Shall it be held lawful to make an occupation of the sword, when the Lord proclaims that he who uses the sword shall perish by the sword? And shall the son of peace take part in the battle when it does not become him even to sue at law? Of course if faith comes later, and finds any preoccupied with military service, their case is different, as in the instance of those whom John used to receive for baptism, and of those most faithful centurions, I mean the centurion whom Christ approves, and the centurion whom Peter instructs; yet, at the same time, when a man has become a believer, and faith has been sealed, there must be either an immediate abandonment of it, which has been the course with many; or all sorts of quibbling will have to be resorted to in order to avoid offending God, and that is not allowed even outside of military service. Nowhere does the Christian change his character.” By the time Tertullian wrote these words, apostasy and compromise had already begun to set in.
The book, The Early Fathers on War and Military Service, by Louis J. Swift, has much to say about the attitude of the ante-Nicene “Fathers” and their collective attitude toward Christians being involved in war. For example, on page 50 Swift reports that Clement of Alexandria, (c. 150-215), said: “In peace, not in war are we trained.” Regarding Tertullian’s attitude toward war, this book relates on page 42: “For him (Tertullian) Christ’s action in the garden of Gathsemane settled the mater beyond doubt. In disarming Peter he disarmed all soldiers, and as he says elsewhere (in Tertullian’s On Patience) it was on this occasion that Jesus ‘Cursed the works of the sword for ever after’.” The Scriptural reference to the above is Matt. 26:52, where Peter drew his sword and cut off the ear of one of the soldiers there to arrest Jesus. Jesus said to Peter: “…Return your sword to its place, for all those who take the sword will perish by the sword.”
The same is reported by Rufus M. Jones in his book, The Church the Gospel and War, on page 85, where Jones states: “In the West, Tertullian is the most unambiguous [of the ante-Nicean Church Fathers] when he says that Christ in disarming Peter ungirt every soldier.”
From this same book we read on page 84: “The pronouncements of the [ante-Nicean] fathers up to A.D. 180 are general. Athenagoras says that Christians ‘do not strike back, do not go to the law when robbed; they give to them that ask of them and love their neighbors as themselves’.” (Jones quotes from Legatio pro Christianis XI).
Jones quoting from I Apol. XXXIX further states the words of Justin Martyr: “We who formerly murdered one another now not only do not make war upon our enemies but that we may not lie or deceive our judges, we gladly die confessing Christ.”
From Early Church History to the Death of Constantine by Backhouse and Tylor, p.128, we read: “There were two grounds on which service in the imperial armies was irreconcilable with the Christian profession; the one that it required the military oath, and the countenancing, if not the actual performance of idolatrous acts; the other that it contravened the express commands of Christ and the whole spirit of the Gospel.”
From A Short History of Rome by Ferrero and Barbagallo, p.382: “The army suffered even more than the civil services. Even in the second century, Christianity had affirmed that ‘it is not right to be a man of the sword’ and that ‘a son of peace, whom it becometh not even to engage in a litigation, should still less take part in a battle,’ had affirmed the incompatibility of military service with Christianity.”
From The New World’s Foundations in the Old, by R. West and W.M. West, Professor of History, University of Minnesota, p.131: “The first Christians thought it was wrong to fight, and would not serve in the army even when the Empire needed soldiers.”
The following quotes are from early Christian historians themselves on this subject: Says Justin Martyr (110-165 A.D.), in his Dialogue with Trypho: “We who were filled with war, and mutual slaughter, and every wickedness, have each through the whole earth changed our warlike weapons-our swords into ploughshares, and our spears into implements of tillage.” Justin Martyr is paraphrasing Isaiah 2:4 where it says in prophecy, that “…they will have to beat their spears into plowshares and their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, neither will they learn war anymore.” (See also Micah 4:3 where the identical prophecy is given).
From Tertullian’s Treatise De Corona, chapter XI, discussing “whether warfare is proper at all for Christians,” he argued from Scripture: “the unlawfulness even of a military life itself,” concluding, “I banish from us the military life.”
Will Durant’s Caesar and Christ states on p. 647,650,667: “The detachment of the Christian from earthly affairs seemed to the pagan a flight from civic duty…Tertullian [who died about 230 A.D.] advised Christians to refuse military service. …In 249 a wave of religious emotion swept the Empire; men and women flocked to the temples and besieged the gods with prayers. Amid this fever of patriotism and fear the Christians stood apart, still resenting and discouraging military service. …it [Christianity] had discouraged its adherents from holding office, or rendering military service; …they turned from Caesar preaching war to Christ preaching peace.”
A quote in Treasury of the Christian World, (New York; 1953), edited by A. Gordon Nasby, p. 369, says: “Its members [early Christians] refused to enter the army or to take any part in war. Origen (185-254 A.D.) remarks that ‘the Christian Church cannot engage in war against any nation. They have learned from their Leader that they are children of peace.’ In that period many Christians were martyred for refusing military service. On March 12, 295, Maximilian, the son of a famous Roman veteran, was called upon to serve in the Roman army and he refused, saying simply: ‘I am a Christian’.” The following is the account between Maximilian and Dion, the Roman Proconsul, who sentenced Maximilian to death, as related by Louis J. Swift in his book The Early Fathers on War and Military Service. (M. Glazier, Inc. 1983, Wilmington, Delaware, pp. 72-74).
How is early Christians refusing to serve in an OCCUPYING army (Rome) proof that Christians shouldn't defend their country?
When I was studying theyvtold me that because the organization is world wide they don't want to kill a brother
The big problem with joining the military is you don't have a choice of which war is ethical/moral. You do what your told.
Going across the sea to another country and getting involved in a war which you have no fight in, and is definitely not
a self defense of you, your family or country, and may at times seem like your on the wrong side, ethically or morally, I think isn't
what a Christian should do. Which is why I would never join the army.
Never mind what it does to a person's psyche when you end some one's life who may themselves be defending their home and family.
You could very well be the aggressor against the one defending their home/family.
This cheapens the value of life and desensitizes a person.
I don't believe you thought it through very well.
Chicken scratch apologetics alright.
I’m pretty sure I said it’s up to the individual to decide for themselves. Also definitely said “I’m not saying wether you should or shouldn’t join the military”
@@LightoverDarkMinistry Yes, I guess you did say that. I guess I kinda flew off the handle too.
But do you see my point? Some of which could be applied to a non military situation.
@@davidmcbrine4527 Very much so. In today's world, it's very difficult to know what exactly you're fighting for.
@@LightoverDarkMinistry Yes, these issues can be confusing.
@@LightoverDarkMinistry How many times is it now that you've made a video excoriating JW's for a belief, only when pushed, to either not definitively state YOUR position on the topic, (The Hellfire video, for example),or to - in effect - say, 'Well, you're not doing wrong either way' like in this instance?
I believe that the witnesses are right not to go to war to invade another country and kill people. Doing that is not Christian. That is very different from defending your house from the thief who comes to steal and kill. It's common sense.
Exactly. The idea of going to fight in war where you have to kill another Christian (OR ANYONE WHO IS INNOCENT) is incompatible with what Jesus taught. The second greatest command is to love your neighbor. It’s one thing to defend yourself or family or friends if directly attacked, quite another to be sent away to another place to fight and kill and bomb innocent civilians, many of whom may be Christian’s.
Yes that is true. Big difference between that and state sponsored violence.
1 John 3:10-12. What category did we want to be in?
If nobody went to war and murdered, Well the no one would murder..
the Witnesses are right for following Jehova God commands!
Yeah murder would just disappear if there was no war
JW’s took up arms against the Arkansas draft board during the WWI draft. This was known as the Cleburne County Draft War.
Thanks for this information.
so did they fire the gun to the other humans or to the sky?
@@Mr.DC3.1914 no, it wasn’t a gun, it was 25 men with 25 guns. Yes they exchanged fire as to do physical harm.
@@JerryDavis-jb1ht and how did you know , were you there when they shot the guns?
@@Mr.DC3.1914 this event happened in 1918. Your welcome to look up the event yourself.
IN ISAIAH 2:4 - They will beat their swords into plowshares And their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, Nor will they learn war anymore.
Yeah, and what's the context for that passage? The timeline?
@@evanwindom the LAST DAYS until the judgment
The Bible tells us there was war in Heaven. So if there can be war in a spiritual place of purity then we will definitely be faced with war down here.
Well, yes. In a sense. We have that prophecy concerning the last days at Matthew 24:6 ("..wars and reports of wars.") But that doesn't mean Jehovah considers them to be righteous. As for humans going to war to avenge wrongs, Jehovah has said that vengeance belongs to him. (Romans 12:9; Hebrews 10:30)
@@mattgardiner614 I tend to be like Paul when he said " I save not to know anything among you save Jesus Christ and him crucified."
That certainly is not the case of war down here on earth. Full of greed, politics, power.. no wonder why Jesus said to he no part of it.
@@NickHawaii he is our only hope
A minute in and the Muslims are getting it in the teeth lol
Great video DH! This answered a lot in terms of war and also self-defense. Great work. I think another scripture that supports self-defense/protecting people using combat is Deuteronomy 22:25-27 - A woman is sexually assaulted and says "there was no one to RESCUE her". I wonder how you "rescue" a woman being assaulted? Obviously through fighting the criminal. Also, do you plan on doing a video refuting JWs claiming God has/needs an earthly organization? I have trouble answering that one.
GOD is organized and has an organization and that's why we have Congregations
Check out John 1:12. "But *_as many as received Him,_* to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name:" "As many as received him" carries no thought of having to belong to a particular "organization" or "congregation".
And then there's...
“And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that *_whoever believes in Him_* should not perish but have eternal life. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that *_whoever believes in Him_* should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that *_the world_* through Him might be saved. *_He who believes in Him_* is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." -- John 3:14-18
There's a lot of "whoever" in there, and not a single "congregation", "organization", or other required grouping under the direction of nine self-appointed anointed in New York. Nowhere does it say that belief in Jesus *_AND_* attendance at a Kingdom Hall is required.
@@Mr.DC3.1914 Christ is the head of the Church. The Church is composed of all who believe in Jesus and call upon his name. The Bible says nothing about God choosing a publishing company as his "organization" or requiring membership therein.
- "But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." - John 1:12-13.
- "However, to all who did receive him, he gave authority to become God’s children, because they were exercising faith in his name." John 1:12, NWT
See? Even the NWT says "all who did receive him", not "all who joined our congregation".
The idea of required membership in an organization is the contrivance of corrupt men who seek power and control for themselves. I pray you someday find freedom from their grasp.
@@evanwindom3265 so you think the ONES who are NOT PART OF THE BODY RECEIVED Jesus? Nope. you don't as JESUS IS PART OF BODY, he is the HEAD if you are CUT OFF the body, the vine, then you are NOT saved as you don't have Jesus as your head
@@Mr.DC3.1914 If you are defining "the body" as the WT, you're writing things into scripture that you cannot prove or at least haven't bothered to prove so far. Believing in Jesus, not membership in the WT, is what adds a person to the Body of Christ. Prove otherwise. Oh, wait. You said "nope". I guess that settles it. My bad.
I do not subscribe to JW theology, however this article has many errors as JWs do believe in self defence on the micro level. However on the macro level, they do not go to war because Satan is control of this world and the nations.
1 John 5: 19. We know that we are of God, and that the whole world is under the power of the evil one.
Lastly, Jesus and his followers were not political and never took up arms to overthrow the wicked governments and rulers of their time. Surely, if war was ok for Christians, they would have fought back and took up armed resistance against the persecutors of their day. They didn't.
JWs are correct, people can defend themselves, but Christians should not go war unless instructed by Yahweh. True Christians however, will wait on the kingdom of Christ and follow him as the peaceful role-model he was.
The whole world lies in Gods hands, not satans. The “world” as in sinners of the world, align themselves with the devil and put themselves under his power. If there whole world was controlled by Satan, there would be no true followers.
If you shouldn’t fight in war unless Yahweh approves it, where the allies sinning for fighting against the nazis?
@@LightoverDarkMinistry GOD can manipulate the nations to protect others from the Nazis for example. Does not mean that the Allied Nations are all correct and righteous such as those who kill and commit genocides to those who oppose them even in their own country? btw, the one to be cast out is NOT GOD but SAtan - John 12:31
Now there is a judging of this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out.
@@Mr.DC3.1914 So God manipulates? Are you a Nazi sympathizer? So the allied nation are causing genocides in their own countries? You're a very messed up person DX. I pray you repent.
Sorry to interrupt but the JWs were not neutral during ww2. In a comment I have listed the pro stance of the JWs namely Mr Rutherford with the Third Reich. I have reprinted a letter that went to Hitler and the Third Reich. It’s also printed in the Watchtower 1934 yearbook and available also on Wikipedia. The JWs under Rutherford fully supported the Army and ideals of the Third Reich. Thank you.
@@RowanTasmanian I am talking recent history.
The interpretation by the author of this video reminds me of the scripture "seest thou a man wise in his own eyes there is more hope of a fool" no wonder "the natural man discerned not spiritual things"
I've repeatedly come to the conclusion that trying to have a logical dialogue with a JW on any of these posts is about as useful as a screen door on a submarine.
IN ISAIAH 2:4 - They will beat their swords into plowshares And their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, Nor will they learn war anymore.
@@Mr.DC3.1914 Yes, after the 2nd coming.
What, do you think we believe this will last forever the same way it is now? I asked for a single verse where Jesus told anybody to STOP being a soldier.
All Christians believe there will be NO MORE WAR some day, but that is AFTER Jesus returns for the Church, and destroys all those whos names are not written in the Book of Life, and throws them into the lake of fire with the devil and the antichrist..
Try again there skippy.
@@Mr.DC3.1914you didn’t watch the video!! He disproves this verse being about No military service. Brother you are a daily disgrace to conversations being had here on TH-cam.
@@jaredpetersmith914 so soldiers do not go to war?
@@Mr.DC3.1914 Is that what you get from what he said? HOW?
Psalms 127:1-2
Unless the LORD protects a city, guarding it with sentries will do no good.
Sentries have weapons for defense. God has your back if you're righteous. Lock and load, brothers. And be ready for we don't know the hour that we may be called upon to defend ourselves
What's the second greatest commandment? "Love thy neighbor as thyself ". It doesn't say to "kill thy neighbor " does it?
@@thomastaylor6699 killing someone who is threatening to kill your neighbor is loving your neighbor.
@@thomastaylor6699 So why do we have a judicial system and prisons? is it because everyone "Loves Thy Neighbour" ? When people break the law, there is prosecution. Israel had an army in the Old Testament, and God sent people off to war. The Old Testament is in a collection of books called the Bible. Have you ever heard of it. Read it sometime.
@xxxViceroyxxx Not according to the Bible its not.
@@thomastaylor6699 Dear Thomas, what happens when someone doesn't love their neighbour, but wants to kill their neighbour, do you just tell them they must love their neighbour and the problem will be solved.
This is akin to people believing in Mary Poppins and the Brady Bunch were a real family.
Here's a challenge, drive through the worst neighbourhood and stop your car in the worst area and tell all the thugs, "hello everyone, you must love your neighbour". Will you do that for me and let me know how you went. Take a video and post it on TH-cam. I would love to see the reaction.
Better still, invent a Time Machine and go back to 1939 Nazi Germany and with a loud steady voice in German say "love thy neighbour as thyself" just when the Jews are being rounded up and put into Gas Chambers.
You sanctimonious half wit.
So what about christians killing christians from different countries because of war? How is that loving your cristian brothers?
1 Corinthians 13 says love protects
Wars are evidence of God's judgments
Stauros means Cross in the Greek New Testament according to the Catholic Answers says
"This ossuary is not the only thing archaeology has to show us. The Palatine crucifix is the oldest depiction of a crucifixion. It was uncovered by archaeologists more than a century ago on the Palatine Hill in Rome. It is second-century graffiti scratched into a wall that was part of the imperial palace complex. It includes a caption-not by a Christian, but by someone taunting and deriding Christians and the crucifixions they underwent. It shows crude stick-figures of a boy reverencing his “God,” who has the head of a jackass and is up on a cross with arms spread wide and with hands nailed to the crossbeam. Here we have a Roman sketch of a Roman crucifixion, and it is in the traditional cross shape."
Tertullian testifies to how widespread and ingrained the habit of making the sign of the cross is. “In all our travels, in our coming in and going out, in putting on our clothes and our shoes, at table, in going to rest, whatever employment occupies us, we mark our forehead with the sign of the cross.”
Catholic Answers is a prodigious site for the truth of the Cross.
What's your point? You think because Tertullian says something, everyone does it? If you think that, you're mistaken. (Oh, and you're off topic again. It's like breathing to you, isn't it?)
@@evanwindom3265 Dear Brother, read the comments that were written yesterday with prudence and patience.
Tertullian witnessed the Stauros Cross everywhere in his travels in Pre Nicean times.
As an eyewitness to the Cross, he was correct in claiming its non-pagan origin.
Is the Torture Stake biblical. NOPE
The Torture Stake is a man oriented emblem to take away the true meaning of the Crucifixion with Christ on a real Cross (Crux Latin).
Jesus is God.
@@MrD2C.1914 Who are you?
@@evanwindom3265 It's a play on words D2C "Deity 2 Christ" or "Christ is the 2nd Person of the Trinity"
Catholic Christians must preach the Gospel, not of the Kingdom, but the Christ who bore our sins on the Cross and Who said you must be born again. No religion has the answer, Only him who died on the Cross and his Loving Father and the Blessed Comforter, the Holy Spirit.
This is all revealed in His Holy Word, the Sacred Holy Scriptures
More to come soon
🙏🤴
@@MrD2C.1914 I think you know that's not what I'm really asking...
: “I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, that you also love one another.” (John 13:34)
KILLING people and murdering them is NOT LOVE. during war, you don't know who you kill and if you kill your own brother, then obviously you are a murderer
Did God ever end anyone's life?
@@LightoverDarkMinistry GOD has his own war and JWs do not oppose the war coming DIRECTLY from GOD. Even in Armageddon, Jesus will WAR with those who are wicked. the worldly wars right now are NOT from GOD himself. why, you think the Russian war against Ukraine is actually from GOD?
It’s not loving to let murderers murder. They must be stopped. Sometimes that means they must be delivered directly to the Father for judgment. We should avoid taking life at all costs. And most of the wars we have been in in the last century have been unjust. But that does not mean that there is never a time to fight, and fighting sometimes means killing.
There are 230 million Christians living in persecution right now around the world. They are raped, enslaved, slaughtered, crucified, tortured and murdered. The people doing this to them do not care about the great commandment. And us sitting back and saying “we can’t help because helping would require passing judgment on your oppressors, invading, fighting and likely killing them” is NOT what God had in mind when he said through Isaiah “Even the captives of the mighty shall be taken, and the prey of the tyrant be rescued, for I will contend with those who contend with you, and I will save your children.”
To pretend like there is never a righteous time to fight is foolish - and an affront to the Father, who puts conviction in us to defend and rescue the weak.
When Jesus (Remember him? Savior of the world?) told his disciples “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one", was he advocating murder? That seems to be what you're saying. Why would he want them to have swords? I have trouble taking anyone seriously who wants to lecture me about love and believes that the WT's practices around disfellowshipping are a "loving arrangement". You have no credibility on the subject of love, WatchTower.
@@evanwindom3265 the word there for sword,. also means large knife or a dagger. Do you honestly believe that you use a large knife only for killing people?
What is the evidence from the earliest Christians?
Well there really isn’t any. But it’s logical to assume you wouldn’t join the military of the country hunting you.
If Jesus had a problem with the military, He might have advised the centurion who’s servant required healing, “please leave the military and I will heal your servant”, but Jesus didn’t.
There’s no command by Jesus or the Father “don’t join the military,don’t defend your country”
It’s an argument from silence.
@@LightoverDarkMinistry OK, so explain why they didn't join the Jewish rebels then? That certainly would have made their lives easier as far as persecution went. Plenty of other examples from the book of Acts onwards, of certain Jewish brothers in particular trying to placate the Pharisees. (Galatians 2:12; 6:12; Titus 1:10,11)
@@RowanTasmanian Sorry Rowan, not a good example. Remember that it wasn't an option for Gentiles to be bought into the Christian fold until Cornelius in 36 C.E. The world does was the world does. It's Christians who need to adopt "the new personality" (Ephesians 4:24; Colossians 3:10)
@@mattgardiner614 G'day Matt, I hope all is well. When you get a chance can you get back to me about Johannes Greber and John S Thompson, these are the gentlemen that the Watchtower used as endorsements for the NWT for over 35 years. Thanks in Advance. I reply to your other query shortly.
This is actually one of the places where the JWs are correct. The early church objected to violence on principled grounds. They interpreted Jesus' commands in the Sermon on the Mount to be against Christians engaging in violence. Yes, in the Old Testament God permitted violence, just as he permitted other non-ideal things like divorce and polygamy. However, as Jesus says, "You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth,' but I say, 'Do not resist the one who is evil.'" Jesus has shown us a new way.
Anyone can take Bible verses and rip them out of context to make them say what they want them to say! That's what you're doing..... Jesus said to his disciples, sell your cloak and buy a sword. That was not for making peanut butter and jelly sandwiches. It was for protection, to protect what is your own. We are christians, we are not pin cushions.... We live in a fallen world and there will be war until the end of time. Not only that but scripture is Cristal clear Jesus is coming back with fire in His eyes, and making the final war, haven't you ever read Revelation?❤😊
Did you watch the video?
@@jaredpetersmith914 Of course I watched it. I simply disagree with it.
I cracked up too much with the vodka example, its so silly. To teach a lesson.... Smh
So Hiroshima and Nagasaki were justified?
Bombing Dresden was justified?
Sending depleted uranium tank shells to Ukraine is justified?
Where to draw the line?
Use the bible to draw the line.
Isaiah 34:2 (NET): "For the LORD is angry at _all_ the nations and furious with _all_ their armies. He will annihilate them."
Matthew 5:9: "Blessed are the peacemakers."
What good did Maccabean self-defense do the Jews?
Daniel 11:14 (CEV): At this time many of your own people will try to make this vision come true by rebelling against the king of the south, but their rebellion will fail."
Daniel 11:27: "And as for the two kings, their hearts shall be bent on doing evil. They shall speak lies at the same table."
Daniel 11:32 (CEV): "The king will use deceit to win followers..."
Daniel 11:36 (CEV): "This king will do as he pleases. He will proudly claim to be greater than any god and will insult the only true God."
You will fight wars for such governments?
The problem with killing someone, however tempting it may seem at times, is that you prevent them from getting right with God. You could take away their eternal salvation and yours. Many people who killed have come to regret it. And you will have to answer to God for it.
2 Cor 5:18 (BBE): "God through Christ has given to us the work of making peace."
Hosea 7:11: "Ephraim has been easily deceived and lacking discernment. They called to Egypt for help; they turned to Assyria for protection."
Rev 13:10: "If anyone is to be killed by the sword, then by the sword he _must_ be killed."
What can Christians do to stop this? Nothing. Best to leave it in God's hands to provide whatever help he provides (Rev 12:16; Daniel 11:34).
All of your verses, I agree with, but none of them teach pacifism to our own destruction. Context is everything.
Wars are what is in question, and there is a time for peace and a time for war. If a person doesn't want to go to war, that is their personal decision. The whole idea that NOT gong to war makes you somehow holier than those who do is ridiculous.
You have freedom because of those that died in war for you.
You gonna hide behide those that are willing to die and protect you? Your feeble argument is to condemn those that protect you.
Feel free to hide in the basement with the rest of you. I'll try my best to fend off the enemy from your family without your help or approval
@@sammypsycho8273 So Christians in China, Russia, North Korea etc do not have freedom? Do you think I need an atheist, murderous soldier to defend my Christian freedom?
You know I did say that all wars arnt justified. And even all actions within wars are not automatically justified. Don’t put words in my mouth.
@@davidagnew8792 Matthew 22:39-40 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”
John 15:13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends.
Isaiah 1:17"Learn to do right; seek justice. Defend the oppressed. Take up the cause of the fatherless; plead the case of the widow."
Psalm 82:3-4 "Defend the weak and the fatherless; uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed. Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver them from the hand of the wicked."
Ecclesiastes 3:1, 3:8
"To everything there is a season, and a time for every purpose under heaven... a time to love and a time to hate, a time for war and a time for peace."
James 4:17 So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.
Huh? You really should be more selective in your topics. You've got some great videos on the wacky JW cult, but you also have some bizarre ones. Just go after the low hanging fruit!
What about when Jesus says you can't serve two masters. So when your pledge so when you pledge of allegiance what does that tell you. 🤔🤔🤔.. again I'm telling you you got to go after watchtower as a business there real estate publishing company disguised as a religion😮😮 I don't know any witness that wouldn't protect themselves. All the witnesses I know believe in self-defense. Not sticking up for them but I know because I've talked to the many of times I've been with them for over 45 years. Seems like a lot of cherry picking. On both sides of this explanation on war. 🤔
which PERSON OF GOD is talking here? If there are TWO more persons of GOD, then for you this person of GOD is lying. I am Jehovah, and there is no one else. There is no God except me. - ISA 45:5
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The condescending nyew! (no) starts to get annoying after a while. But that's your thing I guess. Defending yourself and your family is definitely something that is advocated amongst Witnesses. Or at least it was. If you have Christians in every country.... then enlisting in the military might not be a good idea as you could kill your own brothers. Lastly I can't see Jesus in an F18 and last time I checked he rejected all earthly responsibilities and advocated putting the kingdom first.
JWs are suspicious but not everything they say is bad. Just most of it
JWs are the fulfillment of Micah 4:1-5. One striking feature among them being:
Verse 3....They will beat their swords into plowshares And their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, Nor will they learn war anymore.
JWs are nations 😳?
@@timd3895 : Micah 4:2 is about a worldwide invitation to people to leave their false beliefs behind and embrace the Restored True Worship in these last days.
It is these who do that learn war no more.
No JWs will join an army and kill someone of another nation.
@@jimjuri6490 why you quote verse 3 about nations will not lift up sword against nation and say it's fulfilled? 🤔 You didn't check the news? 🤨
@@timd3895 : The nations who will learn war no more are about Jehovah's Witnesses. The ones God has pulled out from all nations.
Read Micah 4:5. It will be clear.
@@jimjuri6490 I read in verse 4 it says every man in the nations and no one from the nations will go to war, and in verse 5 it says all the people. Clearly it's about Jesus' millennial reign. You are 🤥🤡
Jesus is Jehovah. The Trinity is True.
WHO IS OVER ALL? Ephesians 4:6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all. GOD and FATHER is OVER/ABOVE ALL and that "All" includes the SON so they are NOT EQUAL
THE BIBLE teaches that Jesus was MADE As Lord and Christ and as Son (ACTS 2:36, Prov 8, HEB 1:5), CREATED/PRODUCED/INSTALLED (Prov 8) , COME INTO BEING/MADE (Mat 21:42 - egeneto) and GIVEN LIFE by the Father - John 5:26 and it uses TODAY (Heb 1:5), and uses future tenses and is a prophecy in Isa 9:6 (Isa 9:6, - WILL BE) . If you are called MADE AND CREATED AND GIVEN LIFE, and NEVER CALLED in the BIBLE as Creator or Maker , then you are A CREATION. ALL FROM THE BIBLE
From the Lord was this (this is referring to the chief cornerstone who is Jesus) , the word WAS is egeneto (made or came into being) - Matthew 21:42 and the exact Greek word used in John 1:3 - MADE, egeneto (came into being) - JESUS WAS MADE/CAME INTO BEING FROM THE FATHER , yes, Jesus was MADE/CREATED!, See also Acts 2:36, Heb 1:5, 1 john 5
Isa 9:6 the word Prince in the Prince of Peace means PATRON ANGEL also Leader. WHO IS the ONE LEADER that we have? Jesus. Now, that same exact Hebrew word was used for Daniel 12:1 which is used for Michael the Archangel. So are you saying there are MANY LEADERS now?
you are copying my ID again. what a crook!
@@Mr.DC3.1914 Now you have found your counterpart with whom you can maintain a constructive exchange.
@@MR-gx3gc and you agreed with a crook, no surprise
@@Mr.DC3.1914 I abhor any action that causes real harm to fellow human beings; however, this incident is not devoid of a certain comedy. However, any attentive viewer will be aware that these contributions are not attributable to you.
You should show a higher degree of kindness towards me; firstly, I am not responsible for this fake and secondly, I did not insinuate that these comments were attributable to your authorship.
I simply recommended that you take the opportunity to enter into a constructive exchange with your counterpart.
Perhaps you want to use this incident as an opportunity to communicate with your counterpart in a particularly eloquent way.
IN ISAIAH 2:4 - They will beat their swords into plowshares And their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, Nor will they learn war anymore.
The Prophecy about the final part of the days, shows that the followers of GOD will LEARN WAR NO MORE
No.
The prophecy of the last days shows this...
"And these will make war with the Lamb ,and the Lamb will overcome them, because He is Lord of lords and King of kings, and those with Him are called, chosen, and faithful."
Rev.17:14
@@mattmurdock2868 those enemies of GOD will WAR against the Lamb. but GOD's followers will NOT learn war anymore. Micah 4:3 - Nor will they learn war anymore.
@@Mr.DC3.1914
These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, because He is Lord of lords and King of kings, AND THOSE WITH HIM ARE CALLED, CHOSEN, AND FAITHFUL."
Rev.17:14
Those with Him...why do you think they were chosen and called..?
And for what purpose?
@@mattmurdock2868 This is referring to the Anointed (144,000) who will execute God's judgement upon the Earth alongside Jesus Christ at Armageddon. It doesn't refer to the great crowd.
"These will battle with the Lamb, but because he is Lord of lords and King of kings, the Lamb will conquer them. Also, those with him who are called and chosen and faithful will do so." (Revelation 17:14)
@@mattgardiner614 Based entirely on the false premise that the 144,000 are your self-appointed anointed. You have to really creatively interpret scripture to arrive at that.