Writing Style is how you present a story/plot, whenever you take a serious or funny approach. The most voyant example is standard and minimalist prose. One is emotionally invest, the other isn't. "X blushed" vs "X cannot help to blush"
It strikes me in focusing on 'plain' and 'honest' there is a void of the humanity of emotion. I want to say more but, instead I will say thank you! This fills me glee that a educater sees the value in how I (and others!) write...and when you pointed out all those different words in the bird poem...i laughed because it looked like my poems and stories.
Yes! I often think that so-called plain and honest writing might tell us what someone thinks, but it can totally hide how someone feels (which can be dangerously deceptive too!) Delighted to hear you found some glee! Words are free, so it doesn't cost anything to have fun with them. Thanks for watching--and keep on writing with joie de vivre!
Great explanations, descriptions, and examples. Clarity is simply a skill you need to achieve proficiency with first. Hence the reason schools focus on it. Clarity establishes a stable platform to then showcase your unique voice. Style is one of the core attributes that separates pedestrian writers from great writers.
Great video! I love thinking about writing style analogous to fashion. Playing with word choice, sentence structure, punctuation-I find these techniques fascinating. Style reveals so much.
Woah, subscription earned. My friend and I teach AP Literature and we were both struggling with how we can explain style better this year and my friend went so far as to say, let’s skip it all together. This was a perfect guide to what I’ve always been able to feel but not how to say.
Sweet! I think English studies does a pretty poor job generally of talking about style--but that's where all the fun happens! I'm really pleased to hear it--I hope the year goes well!
More like: Great art MOSTLY follows conventional rules, but understands EXACTLY WHEN to break them - and exactly whem to follow them. Simply breaking the rules and not following them at all is no different from not knowing or understanding them at all. You have to understand _why_ a rule became a rule in the first place and why/to what extent it is good. Only then can understand to what extent to use them, and to what extent to use the opposite. In my experience, great art is neither completely conventional nor completely unconventional. It is some amount of both. And by being great, it becomes convention - and the cycle begins anew.
Great content, completely agree with the statement that when we talk about style, we frequently talk about usage and rules, rather than the extra-grammatical, extra-usage quality of style. Thanks!
Then, I can definitely say as a heavy CHATGPT user: it doesn't have any style, and it would never have one if it even wanted to. Thanks, though. Greetings from Ukraine. Keep it up!
Thank you so much for sharing this video. It's been a timely blessing. I've been contemplating whether or not to follow my heart and inject a "stylish" poem much like Hopkins' writing into my novel. You succinctly pointed out my exact fear of breaking all those rules of clarity; now, I know the answer. Not deleting will bring added personality to the story, characters and, most importantly, the readers. Thank you! P.S. I'm very curious to read more of Gerard Manley Hopkins. Sounds like wonderful company and my cup of tea.
Another great video, Andrew. Many Thanks. I am now daydreaming about coming back in my next life as myself , with my memories intact but with Hilary Mantel’s sublime style of writing. What must it feel like to have the ability to hand someone your books (“The Wolf Hall” trilogy, for instance) and know that they have transported out their body (on page one) and are actually walking alongside , Cromwell and into the filth and dangers of the streets of Medieval Tudor Putney..or , even being in the presence of Henry? Gotta stop daydreaming now and get back to reality.😂.
Thank you! I am so relieved to see this! I was getting tired of all the writing “rules” which seemed more like “don’t wear white after labor day!”… sort of made up “usage” as you say. Although I haven’t used much of these sort of books or plugins etc. (Scrivener and such) except for the purpose of testing, they seemed to be more curtailing than inspiring which might tend to make all writing (even from the classics or renowned writers) into some boring 5th grade text book! Nothing wrong with simple which could be as delightful fancy but too plain could be boring! The fact that there are so many writers and poets who you can guess just by reading even an unread sample of their work goes to show the importance of style. Would love to see a part 2 with some analysis/examples of diverse and distinct styles in both prose and poetry. Or perhaps you already have one in the archives… looking… 👀
Thanks! Style is at the heart of my academic work, which, paradoxically, has made one of the things I've talked about least (every time I think I have it untangled, I find more knots 😅). But I definitely plan to address it further--thanks for the suggestion!
I wonder.. do you make decisions about style and what to emphasise before you begin or at the end when editing? This was super helpful and an original perspective ! Now that you suggest it, it make sense why dos and don'ts didn't help me improve my writing style.
Thanks! I think the easiest answer to your question is yes--I think I make style-related decisions at every stage of the process, but they're probably more deliberate and refined during revision than drafting
This may seem like a non-sequitur, but I find that CSS (in web dev) also exhibits the problem of conflating usage with style. CSS contains all you need to layout your page (e.g. set position, size, etc.) and to set appearances (e.g. colors, textures, etc.). And therein lies the confusion. Page layout is like Usage with its flow of text and boxes. Setting colors, etc. is like Style, which can affect the "clarity" of layout, but doesn't change the underlying structure. Without Style, though, all designs and literature would be depicted only in shads of gray. Very depressing, indeed.
Andrew, I just noticed something about your videos... I can't get my head to skip even 1 second of you videos. Can you tell me what is the "Thing" that make me want to watch the whole video. I think its the flow and paragraphs of your speech. Is it?
Cool insight--it could be! I do try to have a structure that leads naturally from one point to the next and to include interesting sentence-level stuff, so I hope that it works on a macro and micro level to maintain some level of interest--but I'd be curious to know if that agrees with how you experience it
Your clothing style includes jaunty bow ties. Would you write a stylistic poem in the style of Gerard Manley Hopkins ( he seems to be a favorite of yours) about bowties and what pleasure it gives you to tie and wear them? (I notice an aspect of your bowtie bearing behavior in that it is tied slightly askew and off balance.)
You've just asked the hardest question 😆 Practice is part of it--seeing what you like that others do, trying it out yourself, innovating on your own. These might give someone a place to start.
This is very helpful for short story I’ve been trying to write forever. It’s about an alien that I call Skydeer who’s the last of their species and has amnesia. They’re floating in a blue box that has nothing in it except clouds. Basically what this means is that they don’t remember most nouns so they have to talk in these weird sentences like “they have these flat Things with long Things coming out of them that bend and twist like a wrist only there’s many more places they bend.”They’re trying to describe human hands, which they’ve never seen in their life. I keep kicking myself over trying to make this make the kind of code this creature speaks in be consistent and make sense but now I realize I don’t necessarily need too. Skydeer is an extremely confused creature who gets migraines when they try too hard to properly articulate something, of course their internal monologue is inconsistent! As long as I can make it clear through signifiers and context what they’re trying to communicate I think the audience will be able to follow. Just gotta get some proofreaders when push comes to shove.
What you wear is none of my business, but you write for me and other people to consume, right? If you write in your secret diary, then again, I wouldn’t care what you write or how you write it.
For sure! Especially when it comes to a secret diary, the prescriptive clarity rules that usually get taught are even less useful, highlighting the need for a more comprehensive understanding of style. Good insight!
"Rules" is not the right word for all of the reasons you described. "Guidelines" is a more precise word when describing grammar, punctuation, etc. There are no "rules" per se. Loose rules, maybe? Strict guidelines?
Indeed--I can understand why teachers present them as "rules," but I also think it ends up being counterproductive. If not either of your suggestions, maybe non-binding suggestions that snobs will judge you for ignoring 😆
I think it's a bit of a fluctuating thing. The saying 'You must know the rules in order to break them' applies here. They start as rules while you're striving to understand them and when you finally do, they naturally become more like guidelines. Now, it's still possible to learn with them being guidelines from the start, as everyone learns in different ways. It's a matter of perspective.
Writing Style is how you present a story/plot, whenever you take a serious or funny approach.
The most voyant example is standard and minimalist prose. One is emotionally invest, the other isn't.
"X blushed" vs "X cannot help to blush"
It strikes me in focusing on 'plain' and 'honest' there is a void of the humanity of emotion. I want to say more but, instead I will say thank you! This fills me glee that a educater sees the value in how I (and others!) write...and when you pointed out all those different words in the bird poem...i laughed because it looked like my poems and stories.
Yes! I often think that so-called plain and honest writing might tell us what someone thinks, but it can totally hide how someone feels (which can be dangerously deceptive too!) Delighted to hear you found some glee! Words are free, so it doesn't cost anything to have fun with them. Thanks for watching--and keep on writing with joie de vivre!
Thank you. You're the only person on TH-cam who understands STYLE. Subscribed.
Hey, thanks--I try!
Great explanations, descriptions, and examples.
Clarity is simply a skill you need to achieve proficiency with first. Hence the reason schools focus on it. Clarity establishes a stable platform to then showcase your unique voice.
Style is one of the core attributes that separates pedestrian writers from great writers.
Great video! I love thinking about writing style analogous to fashion. Playing with word choice, sentence structure, punctuation-I find these techniques fascinating. Style reveals so much.
Thanks!
This is valuable content Andrew, thank you for making these videos. That Kaput is quite the looker.
Thanks, Jeff--I appreciate it! (I'll also be sure to convey the complement to our golden friend)
Woah, subscription earned.
My friend and I teach AP Literature and we were both struggling with how we can explain style better this year and my friend went so far as to say, let’s skip it all together. This was a perfect guide to what I’ve always been able to feel but not how to say.
Sweet! I think English studies does a pretty poor job generally of talking about style--but that's where all the fun happens! I'm really pleased to hear it--I hope the year goes well!
A saying of mine (I don't remember where I got it): bad at is not knowing the rules, good art is following the rules, and great art breaks the rules.
Intriguing--I think I could get behind that
This is true of all artistic tasks. Abstract art works when the artist knows the rules, the. Breaks some of them. It is the intent that makes it work.
*then…
More like: Great art MOSTLY follows conventional rules, but understands EXACTLY WHEN to break them - and exactly whem to follow them.
Simply breaking the rules and not following them at all is no different from not knowing or understanding them at all. You have to understand _why_ a rule became a rule in the first place and why/to what extent it is good. Only then can understand to what extent to use them, and to what extent to use the opposite. In my experience, great art is neither completely conventional nor completely unconventional. It is some amount of both.
And by being great, it becomes convention - and the cycle begins anew.
@@acerazorakjsflasjfka true... but it doesn't roll off the tongue though
Great content, completely agree with the statement that when we talk about style, we frequently talk about usage and rules, rather than the extra-grammatical, extra-usage quality of style. Thanks!
Hey thanks!
Then, I can definitely say as a heavy CHATGPT user: it doesn't have any style, and it would never have one if it even wanted to.
Thanks, though.
Greetings from Ukraine.
Keep it up!
This is fantastic. Thank you thank you.
You bet!
Thank you so much for sharing this video. It's been a timely blessing. I've been contemplating whether or not to follow my heart and inject a "stylish" poem much like Hopkins' writing into my novel. You succinctly pointed out my exact fear of breaking all those rules of clarity; now, I know the answer. Not deleting will bring added personality to the story, characters and, most importantly, the readers. Thank you! P.S. I'm very curious to read more of Gerard Manley Hopkins. Sounds like wonderful company and my cup of tea.
Glad to hear it! As far as cups of tea go, Hopkins is a winner 😁
Another great video, Andrew. Many Thanks. I am now daydreaming about coming back in my next life as myself , with my memories intact but with Hilary Mantel’s sublime style of writing. What must it feel like to have the ability to hand someone your books (“The Wolf Hall” trilogy, for instance) and know that they have transported out their body (on page one) and are actually walking alongside , Cromwell and into the filth and dangers of the streets of Medieval Tudor Putney..or , even being in the presence of Henry? Gotta stop daydreaming now and get back to reality.😂.
Thank you! I am so relieved to see this! I was getting tired of all the writing “rules” which seemed more like “don’t wear white after labor day!”… sort of made up “usage” as you say. Although I haven’t used much of these sort of books or plugins etc. (Scrivener and such) except for the purpose of testing, they seemed to be more curtailing than inspiring which might tend to make all writing (even from the classics or renowned writers) into some boring 5th grade text book! Nothing wrong with simple which could be as delightful fancy but too plain could be boring! The fact that there are so many writers and poets who you can guess just by reading even an unread sample of their work goes to show the importance of style. Would love to see a part 2 with some analysis/examples of diverse and distinct styles in both prose and poetry. Or perhaps you already have one in the archives… looking… 👀
Thanks! Style is at the heart of my academic work, which, paradoxically, has made one of the things I've talked about least (every time I think I have it untangled, I find more knots 😅). But I definitely plan to address it further--thanks for the suggestion!
@@WritingwithAndrew thank you so much for your consideration!
I wonder.. do you make decisions about style and what to emphasise before you begin or at the end when editing? This was super helpful and an original perspective ! Now that you suggest it, it make sense why dos and don'ts didn't help me improve my writing style.
Thanks! I think the easiest answer to your question is yes--I think I make style-related decisions at every stage of the process, but they're probably more deliberate and refined during revision than drafting
❤Good one
Thanks!
This may seem like a non-sequitur, but I find that CSS (in web dev) also exhibits the problem of conflating usage with style. CSS contains all you need to layout your page (e.g. set position, size, etc.) and to set appearances (e.g. colors, textures, etc.). And therein lies the confusion. Page layout is like Usage with its flow of text and boxes. Setting colors, etc. is like Style, which can affect the "clarity" of layout, but doesn't change the underlying structure. Without Style, though, all designs and literature would be depicted only in shads of gray. Very depressing, indeed.
Very interesting insight! The real trouble is when people think shades of gray are clearer: since when is boring clear?
Andrew, I just noticed something about your videos... I can't get my head to skip even 1 second of you videos.
Can you tell me what is the "Thing" that make me want to watch the whole video.
I think its the flow and paragraphs of your speech. Is it?
Cool insight--it could be! I do try to have a structure that leads naturally from one point to the next and to include interesting sentence-level stuff, so I hope that it works on a macro and micro level to maintain some level of interest--but I'd be curious to know if that agrees with how you experience it
Your clothing style includes jaunty bow ties. Would you write a stylistic poem in the style of Gerard Manley Hopkins ( he seems to be a favorite of yours) about bowties and what pleasure it gives you to tie and wear them? (I notice an aspect of your bowtie bearing behavior in that it is tied slightly askew and off balance.)
Yes, I got Strunk and White years ago. It didn't appeal to me at all; unlike your great videos, Andrew.
Thanks!
How does one develop style?
You've just asked the hardest question 😆 Practice is part of it--seeing what you like that others do, trying it out yourself, innovating on your own. These might give someone a place to start.
You have a nice TH-cam style 😊
Thanks!
Thanks!
You're welcome!
This is very helpful for short story I’ve been trying to write forever. It’s about an alien that I call Skydeer who’s the last of their species and has amnesia. They’re floating in a blue box that has nothing in it except clouds.
Basically what this means is that they don’t remember most nouns so they have to talk in these weird sentences like “they have these flat Things with long Things coming out of them that bend and twist like a wrist only there’s many more places they bend.”They’re trying to describe human hands, which they’ve never seen in their life.
I keep kicking myself over trying to make this make the kind of code this creature speaks in be consistent and make sense but now I realize I don’t necessarily need too. Skydeer is an extremely confused creature who gets migraines when they try too hard to properly articulate something, of course their internal monologue is inconsistent! As long as I can make it clear through signifiers and context what they’re trying to communicate I think the audience will be able to follow. Just gotta get some proofreaders when push comes to shove.
What is your skull's name? She always makes me laugh with her sarcasm.
It's me, Kaput Mortuum. You have discerning taste.
What you wear is none of my business, but you write for me and other people to consume, right? If you write in your secret diary, then again, I wouldn’t care what you write or how you write it.
For sure! Especially when it comes to a secret diary, the prescriptive clarity rules that usually get taught are even less useful, highlighting the need for a more comprehensive understanding of style. Good insight!
"Rules" is not the right word for all of the reasons you described. "Guidelines" is a more precise word when describing grammar, punctuation, etc. There are no "rules" per se.
Loose rules, maybe?
Strict guidelines?
Indeed--I can understand why teachers present them as "rules," but I also think it ends up being counterproductive. If not either of your suggestions, maybe non-binding suggestions that snobs will judge you for ignoring 😆
I think it's a bit of a fluctuating thing. The saying 'You must know the rules in order to break them' applies here. They start as rules while you're striving to understand them and when you finally do, they naturally become more like guidelines. Now, it's still possible to learn with them being guidelines from the start, as everyone learns in different ways. It's a matter of perspective.
@kangazoos2083 I think that is an excellent way to capture this progression. I'm going to write your response down.