The New Lumo Train from London to Edinburgh
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ก.ค. 2024
- There's a new train operator in town! A few years ago, there was an offer for an Open Access Operator to run services up the East Coast Mainline, and starting with two return trips a day (this will later increase to five) that's exactly what LUMO are doing, with their 'one class only' five carriage train, it's a very cheap way to travel ...
Book tickets at the official Lumo Website : www.lumo.co.uk/
Roger's Blog (A must read) : busandtrainuser.com/2021/10/2...
Chelsea from Cheap Holiday Expert : cheapholidayexpert.com/blog/h...
Secret Link to Tom Walker performance ... has been taken down. TH-cam still put in a Copyright claim against me (not a strike!) so i thought it safer to remove it anyway. Sorry about that.
![[ไฮไลต์] ฟุตบอลชาย ญี่ปุ่น vs ปารากวัย รอบแบ่งกลุ่ม | โอลิมปิก 2024](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/X_BeGaAv1oM/mqdefault.jpg)
If Lumo can compete with low cost airlines and keep it's service running with the low fares then this service deserves to succeed.
Would be a lot easier to compete if they removed the airline subsidies :)
Unfortunately that is a big if.
@@squelchedotter or going the french way and banning inland airtravel. i mean, if you are not travel to an island, do you really need to be flying within a european contry?
@@enisra_bowman Banning domestic air travel would make the trains even more expensive as it would create a near monopoly. Trains need to be much, much cheaper.
@@squelchedotter Yet again the tax payer has to pay for everything. did you not know the railway fares are also subsidised by the taxpayers who never travel by train.
It's about time someone recognised that British trains are massively too expensive. I once did a comparison of a UK train with one I caught in Berlin and the UK train cost 6x the price. Let's hope it succeeds and forces other train companies to reduce their prices.
Not only are the train tickets in the UK ridiculously expensive, but there are people paying massively different prices for the same journey. One person might be paying £15 and the person in the next seat £120. So I always drive. Driving is far cheaper and you can leave when you like and travel door to door.
A few years ago I paid for a family of 4 to travel from Amsterdam Schipol to Hanover for 99 Euros. The price difference was ridiculous to the average UK train.
As a German I would like to add that Germany's regional and long distance passenger trains are usually heavily subsidised. Is it the same with UK's passenger railways?
@@ABC_DEF while you're not wrong, if we want to reduce carbon emissions train travel should be made far more accessible and competitive to driving or flying, it being one of the least carbon emitting forms of transport per person.
@@John1986ATR You actually beat an electric train in co2 emissions with both electric busses and cars (4 passengers). The problem with trains is, they drive on schedule regardless of passenger demand. So every unused seat worsens the co2 efficiency. Their current pricing model is actively working against filling every last seat, by making the tickets more expensive the closer the travel date, regardless of capacity. Trains are expensive because not enough people are using it, but people won't be using it, if their travel costs are significantly higher than just driving with a car.
I really really hope this company succeeds and expands their services. Train travel should be affordable and the east coast mainline is a gorgeous route
They are not affordable
@@MrDanielfff777 he said should be, not is
@@Xighor lumo is not affordable
@@MrDanielfff777 how so? It's cheaper than every other ripoff train service but it's the price it should be for every train service considering UK is a small country so a couple hundred miles on a train shouldn't cost £100 with return
Considering I've paid more for a 51mile journey..
Although I believe that train travel should be 'affordable', what does that actually mean? Should transport companies be allowed to make profits? Should it be Government run?
As an aside, the public transport for Sydney in Australia actually turns a profit, even though it's pretty damned cheap... this means that public transport can be affordable and profitable if there is sufficient service and sufficient users to make it profitable in aggregate.
This won't work for low volume passenger routes or transport services, if there isn't enough money coming in to make it profitable... that's when punitive taxes and congestion or 'clean air' zones are also introduced, to try to collect revenue that otherwise would be unjustified or excessive, but can be explained away by unreasonable charge zones and onerous taxation elsewhere...
Great to meet you Geoff - cracking summary as per!
Ha, love a subscription crossover!
Definitely needs to be another Geoff Marshall x Cheap Holiday Expert collaboration in the future. Loved this video Geoff/Chelsea
I'm a regular Chris Moyles listener so I primarily know you, Chelsea, as James's "housemate". Seeing you pop up in a Geoff video was a big surprise! And with some very useful info too.
@@andrewwebb3431 when I saw Chelseas story on instagram about a new train service, I just knew Geoff would pop up somewhere!
Mentioning about clinging on to a 26-30 railcard is a big mood xD lovely to meet you via Geoff's video, Chelsea!
As someone living in Edinburgh with family in the South of England, I'm so excited by this!! The biggest barrier to visiting has always been the cost. Its great that Lumo are taking on the cheap airlines, and that they've put thought into the passenger experience! No more breaking the bank to sit in an uncomfortable seat for six hours!
Yep! I grew up with one parent in Edinburgh and another in London. Cost made it very inaccessible, and whilst flying is horrid for the environment, it was often a quarter of the price!
The time it took between London Glasgow and Edinburgh made it a pretty ghastly option by train,I am glad they have speeded it up.
LNER are basically the same price for edinburgh to london at around £30 though.
this is a very clever business idea.
take on the planes.
no waiting for hours at an airport.
good luck to Lumo
It's a game-changer IMO. Good on 'em @lumo
The sad thing is that it's actually an incredibly simple idea that's been around for a long time. Give people an affordable price for a train journey, and it often speaks for itself.
@@trojjer
Honestly for a under 5 hours journey their one class makes sense.
These seats look great and the supposed first class experience doesn't really make a difference when travel time is less than 5 hours
Next time I am in the UK, I will definitely choose this over flying. As a Canadian, less than 5 hours of travel is no problem at all. I love London and Edinburgh and am happy to have a viable alternative to flying available.
And what other parts of the UK you love??
@@mikekaraoke Yes, I love many other parts of the UK too.
@@rebeccawiens4224 What other parts of the UK do you love??
There has always been a train service between Edinburgh and London
The whole time I was watching this, was thinking about the Montreal - Toronto rail corridor could have something like this; as someone who takes the train once every couple of weeks from MTL to Toronto at substantially higher prices over 5.5hours, this kind of improvement could be fantastic.
I am a Thameslink commuter - and I can confirm the windowless seats on class 700s are preferable for falling asleep on - for me personally as there is no window ledge it is just easier to balance my neck. Therefore I'm sure others will appreciate a similar setup on the 803s.
It's great we finally have an open access on the busiest line. Shame the hotel rates in Edinburgh are through the roof.
Recently I paid £152 return on LNER (and that was only to Newcastle), which had worse seats than Thameslink, so good to hear Lumo picked up on that when they designed theirs, which are clearly way more comfortable than the 800s. I reckon LNER will have to revamp their interiors to compete.
A small seat cushion between neck, shoulder and window and your set.
Lumo executives: The logo just isn’t working
Design team: What if we elevate the u
Lumo executives: Madness!
Design team: What if we elevate the m
Lumo executives: You’re getting warmer
this lot couldnt design a donkey and cart, dreadful train
Enjoyed our interview, where I enthusiastically explain the York avoiding line. Good to meet you and another enjoyable video. Thank you.
For those of us chemistry folks, LUMO is an acronym for "Lowest Unoccupied Molecular Orbital". So, I suppose it makes sense that transport does occur most effeciently via a low-lying available electronic state.
yes lol
Thank you so much Geoff for taking the time to chat to my son, Levi, at Edinburgh Station, give him an autograph and have your photo taken with him. It really made his week!! (Levi's Mum) 😊
Only 2 years later and these trains have gone up to 49£ from KX to Edinburgh! For one way! We need to renationalise
Wow Lumo is just amazing I'm surprised that their journey is so much cheaper than LNER.
The train itself is probably the best Hitachi train to the run in the UK unlike LNER, GWR, TPE and Hull Trains where their trains have uncomfortable seats and terrible ride quality this one has much more comfortable seats
I agree. I would use Lumo to Scotland than LNER has its more cheaper.
The seats are definitely more comfortable, I understand Avanti have chosen the same design for their Hitachi trains. The ride also does seem to be better, perhaps the lack of diesel gensets adding weight?
That’s the advantage of open access operators - they only have to pay marginal industry costs.
@@hexagon7895 j
I've never had an issue with the IET seats.
Wishing the best for the driver of 159102 and all involved in the Salisbury Train Crash
Love the detail! Chelsea got an absolute bargain there...💰🚉
OMG HI TH-cam!
@@TEBEnthusiast it’s fake bro how do u not know YT is American and he only has 25 likes the real YT would get thousands but he is verified
@@Londons_railways if you press on the icon then the banner you would see the subs 32m
@@Londons_railways it is very real actually all you have to do is click on there picture
It's TH-cam
If they do have significant issues with luggage space, which seems to be a running concern, then it might be better to convert some of those non-window seats to luggage racks.
wait until a couple of cyclists want to use the racks - then the fight for space will really kick off !
@@fToo Just ban wearing lycra or spandex on the train
fares are based on revenue /seats per mile. basic way of thinking of this 100 seats £1 pear seat per trip £100 TOTAL FOR THE TRIP. Remove the seats so the price needs to increase to make the £100. What Geoff did not mention( unless I missed it) Was that the layout was mostly airline style seating with very few tables so its an high density configuration.
They definitely do have a luggage problem as I have seen on the train and seen in this video and other videos with the luggage in bike storage, door ways and most dangerously on the luggage racks above people’s heads which can be dangerous for heavy luggage. What we have to remember is that this is to be the same as plane which means it’s going to take lots of big bags but Lumo just don’t seem to be ready for that.
@@Trains_At_York Ban the extra bags. It's a cheap service, if people want extras they should go with other operators.
I’ve been waiting for this Geoff and I wasn’t disappointed! You nailed it (except the diesel slip!!!), packed with Lumo facts and features. I can’t wait to have a look round one. 👍
The enthusiasm from everyone is this video has made me really enthusiastic by proxy for Lumo too!
I’m an American. I’m so jealous! I’ve been to Germany, France and Spain. I love your trains to say the least. Here in America we have to drive EVERYWHERE or fly. I hate flying especially after 911. Trains (and quite a few other things) would make America great 😭
If only our trains were as good as European trains.
We seem to have issues with American trains that Brits and Europeans don't have.
Thanks for mentioning the cheapest fare /after/ the introductory offer, Geoff - not noted on the other earlier reviews that I watched.
Good video & review as ever. : )
4:55 that's no allotment! That's the site of the old wagon repair shed, that got knocked down a few months back
I’m very glad they appear to be succeeding, 6months on. I regularly travel by train between Oxford and Newcastle, and I genuinely look out for the Lumo services over LNER between London and NCL. They’re typically faster, more comfortable and often a few quid cheaper
Amusing that back in the day (under British Rail) we pushed hard for more rapid journeys (EDB-KGX under 4 hours at best, 3h29 for the one-off "special"), yet now we'll happily not mention the ~30 minute slowdown in exchange for a GOOD fare. It is, admittedly, also a plus that a train is likely to arrive on time or early given a slack schedule, for ongoing connections, etc. : )
Worth pointing out that:
1. LUMO have been given essentially the spare paths, hence the off-pattern timetable. These are full of pathing time, over 35 mins in some cases.
2. The LUMO times are planned to be tightened up when the ECML timetable is recast, but of course that's now been postponed.
3. The 1053 Sundays Edinburgh-London LUMO service is timetabled for 4 hours and 3 mins with 2 stops. That's only 3 mins slower than LNER's Flying Scotsman which has one fewer stop. If LUMO had decent paths they could very easily have faster journeys timetabled its just the nature of the ECML set-up at present, all being well within a few years (not an ideal timescale I appreciate) it should be resolved somewhat.
@@hexagon7895 I missed spotting that Sunday service, thank you: almost worth catching in its own right for rapidity!
Looking forward to seeing how this develops over the next few years, even if being stuck north of ABD nowadays makes full appreciation somewhat more difficult!
@@dw620 No worries, I didn't notice it myself either - I had it pointed out. Sadly it ran 22 mins late on its first day, but that was very much out of LUMO's control. Now if in a couple of years they can get most/all services down to nearer the 4-hour mark I think they'll really be on to a winner and LNER will have to watch out! ;)
The tickets are now basically all the same price as LNER…. So this was more of a marketing stunt than anything
Nice to see another open access on the east coast, joining Hull Trains and that Grand Central 180 at the start of the video!
Thank you, Geoff. An excellently produced, and encouraging, introduction to this new service.
Thanks for the video on the new Lumo Train. Once we get past the pandemic stage and can freely travel again, this train would be a good alternative to plane travel between London and Edinburgh. I graduated from Edinboro University of Pennsylvania many years ago, and it would be fun to see the place that was possibly my alma mater's namesake, Edinburgh, Scotland. Thanks for all the other links in the description.
always love these types of videos from you. have been waiting for this one.
Hi Geoff. One issue I had when trying to have a greener holiday with my partner was bike storage on these longer distance trains. Often there are only 4 or so "racks" but they didnt actually only really fit smaller bikes or racing bikes. If you have a bike with slightly wider tyres, or handlebars they dont fit! also 4 spaces is not enough! We actually had to get a different service than our preferred because there wasnt bike space. Thats something else that could be done with those windowless seats!
I cannot wait to try them for myself, I live in Edinburgh and go down to London fairly frequently. I have often flown instead of taking the train as it's cheaper. A minimum of £100 return with LNER, most of the time, compared to around £60 return flights to Gatwick, or £90 to Heathrow or City.
Looking forward to taking the greener way to London sometime soon!
Brilliant video Geoff, it was lovely to bump into you along the way!
Looking forward to when I get the chance to ride on these between Edinburgh and Newcastle, was great chatting with you Geoff hope to see you again soon
From Kieron Adam 👍
Very, very good, Geoff. So informative on so many of the little things, which can make a huge difference.
I figured you would upload LUMO sooner or later. I’m also glad that you got to have such a good adventure
Well this was rather well timed! I’ve been talking to my good lady about going to Edinburgh and this looks ideal, especially as we usually take our own grub and usually have to plan months in advance! Plus I would ALWAYS rather go by train than fly 🤓
Plus, like most, I have never been on the York Avoiding Line, so that would be a saddo ‘tick’ for me too 😂 The seats looked comfy and I like that they seem to have done their homework, so let’s hope they succeed. Main thing is, it looks a lot nicer than going on poxy Ryan Air 😏
Cheers Geoff, another interesting thing that I might not have otherwise found out about! 😀👍
Brilliant - thanks for sharing this with us, looks to be a great service and an a real alternative to flying.
I used Lumo this week and it's a good service. Helpful and friendly staff, comfortable seats. Could only get a cheap ticket on the return trip to kings X, but paid £19.50 each. 4.5hrs is long but, honestly, it's comfortable so you don't really notice if you remember to download some shows/movies/music.
I road the train from London to Edinburgh on 02 Nov 2021. Love the service. I have ridden the route before with other train operators so I know what to expect for the journey. The Lumo service met or exceeded expectations.
I had never seen a Geoff recording before. Great style.
I'll be keeping my eyes open for these trains on the East Coast Main Line from Now (although if I am on the viewing deck at the National Railway Museum at York I'll remember that I won't be able to see the Blue Train when they go North) Great Train as always, keep it up Geoff.👍🚋🚂
A another Geoff Master - piece -Keep on tracking.
Excellent video on the new Lumo service Geoff, well done. 🙂👏👍
Thanks for the video on this new company, the experience looks great and good luck to them in the future!!😎🚆🚆🚆🚆🇬🇧
Great to see a train company actually have comfortable seats on their new trains - Thameslink & TfL Rail take note
I'm not sure that seat comfort is that big of a problem on the Elizabeth line because people are using it for short journeys, but Thameslink, LNER, and GWR really ought to sort it out
Coming to London later this month- been booked as two singles so I’m one way with LNER and then return with LUMO so this is very interesting
Competition on the ECML will hopefully drive up standards and keep fares competitive. The lack of stopping stations on the route is good as these slow journey times down.
LOVE THIS! About time! Hopefully this ultimately has a knock on effect and brings down prices for everything else.
The York avoiding line goes past our house and I heard it the other day without realising what it was
Not been over it for years........think the last time was behind a 37 on a rake of NSE liveried Mk1s....
Been waiting for this. Absolutely brilliant video, hopefully get a chance to travel up. I went up on the Virgin train a few years back. This looks a lot better.
can’t beat virgin
I know nothing about trains but I was really entertained during this video and learned a lot! Great detail and amazing video! Well done mate 💯👏🏻
Looks like a nice service and solid pricing, the no-window seats are a great thing in my opinion, not for everyone but really nice to hide away on a cold day.
I cannot WAIT to travel Lumo to London village! I’m guessing it’ll be in January - bring it on!
Another great vid Geoff 😀
Great review! Yes, I believe those windowless seats should be left alone. During holiday, peak travel times they will come in handy. Cheers.
Thanks much for this introduction. I’ve now added it to my list and the Lumo app to my phone. This Yank can’t wait to get to the UK this Spring. I’ll take Lumo to New Castle and Hadrian’s Wall.
Thanks Geoff
Newcastle.
yes i was waiting for this since the tweet you uploaded about the Lumo trains
Absolutely brilliant. Hopefully it'll be a fantastic success and more will come going forward 👍🏻
I saw this go past earlier in Bedfordshire and was very confused by it! This video explains why I didn't recognise it!
hey Geoff! It was nice to see you on the Monday (white jumper at 1:02). Someone actually had a spare ticket for the train but I wasn't ready for a long trip out at all. Hope the journey was alright for you though! :)
Omg that was you! Hello! (I'm the guy who offered you a ticket and you're in my video, hope you don't mind!)
I love the livery on that Shinkansen! Good to see more Shinkalion in the UK.
It's our very own train buff love your videos trains like I do as I said in other videos I stay in Aberdeen and am gratefull we have trains from here on route too London and all stops on way love your enthusiasm for trains great video thank you
I absolutely love when Geoff posts a new video, they are so good!
Great video Geoff. I would definitely convert the windowless seats into a luggage rack, I'd be very peeved if sold a ticket there.
This was super helpful in planning a trip, as I hadn't yet heard of Lumo. Will definitely be using this (the prices are still very affordable!) Thanks for the video!
Good information and talking to the right people for not too long. Great video.
The UK has got a good tie up with Hitachi one of the best in the business for its high speed trains being the maker of the famous bullet trains in Japan.
Thanks Geoff, this is good to know.
A minor comment but some of us live in Edinburgh and might want to go to London. 😉
Great video Geoff! The new Lumo trains look fantastic :)
Finger cross for this to succeeded, this will be a breath of fresh air to cheaper rail travel and how much train tickets should cost. Fantastic Lumo 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
This is great. This could be the beginning of the end of extortionate train ticket prices. As the other firms will have no choice but to lower their prices. Hopefully they can eventually expand their network to plenty more locations 👍🏼
2:00 Traveling from London to Edinburgh and then returning the next day? Damn girl, you definitely have some endurance!!!
It was nice to see you and have a brief conversation in person Geoff last Monday morning on the train.
Great video! I was talking to a group of rail workers, on a hire-narrowboat, a while back. They were definitely fans of you! Then I got chatting to a Network Rail crossing manager near Oxford a couple of weeks back concerning very confusing signage by a third party operator and he'd heard of you too. 🙂
Only thing is the window blind which covers two seats - that is definately going to cause annoyance to at least one customer.
Geoff showed no concern at all about possible fisticuffs over the shared blinds and plug sockets🏃♀️🏃♂️👮♂️😲 5:40
It's no different to any train carriage seating in the UK, except if you decide to adjust the blind, you aren't always sat face to face with the person whose lighting you are adjusting...
If you want total control over the blind that covers your window when travelling, the only hope you have is flying first class. Flying economy you will often find that you share your blind with someone else too, and thats with an airline style porthole blind....
@@draycotewateris5056 shared blinds is a non starter - find me another uk rail provider who doesn't have them - shared sockets is a bit stretched too - one socket and two USBs to share between two people is above and beyond for a low cost carrier wouldn't you say?
That's why it is always a good idea to speak to the person/people in the other seat before opening or closing the blind
that is a very strange design smaller windows that allowed every seat to have there own window and blind would have been more practical.
Thanks for the autograph geoff
Love the reason why you got interested in trains. I remember the same, the black & white A-Z map book with the tube map.
Interesting new service. Subscribed.
Good to see next video from you mate. I hope to visit ASAP some of new Cross line stations.
Simply Railways was there with you Geoff!
Great video and I loved seeing Chelsea in it. I’ve been following her on Instagram and TH-cam for ages and she’s great 👍🏻
I'll be taking this lumo train to Edinburgh when I go there on my trip. I'm excited for it very much.
I'd be fascinated to compare Lumo's prices with the average ticket prices for London to Edinburgh services in decades past. It's fantastic that they are offering such an affordable service; I've always found it ludicrous that train travel is often more expensive than FLYING, so good on Lumo for tackling that! But I would be curious to see how it compares to ticket prices for the same journey down the years, and whether the 'cheap, low-cost' option now was once upon a time just the standard price for train travel between the two cities.
Excellent video, Geoff! and for the record, given how much I hate them on Pendolinos, NO to no-window seats! Give me a window and extra luggage space any day ^_^
I travelled 120 miles from Warsaw to Kielce in Poland for.£13.45 a few years ago. That was a standard fare on their newest fastest trains. Rather than marvelling at how cheap the fares for a trip across the UK can be, we should be looking at how expensive travel in the UK is. I'm sure if fares were cheaper more people would travel across the UK which in turn would bring more business to other parts of the country
I paid around £8 for that exact same journey
Didn't know about the 26-30 railcard, thanks Chelsea! This is a nice deal as someone who's not been to Edinburgh in a very long time
Brilliant as usual. Best railway TH-camr
The really exciting bit is that ECML overhead is notoriously unreliable, that Lumo sets are the only ones operating north of York without diesel back up and that they don't have a Thunderbird contract of any sort to shift their trains if the wires stop working. It could be fun ...
I love how Geoff introduced the logo 😂
Brilliant, I could have done with that 3 months ago, I could have taken my whole family by train for the price of one BA airline ticket. I will definitely be using this on my next visit to Scotland.
This is great. As a Londoner who went to University in Scotland, I travelled by plane and train, moreso by plane as it was literally cheaper and faster, though I felt bad about the green energy aspect of it, and the sub-hour flight time felt a little silly. I wish this service had come in sooner. It looks great.
Good to see a rail company taking a competitive outlook, lets hope for more routes with cheap fares in the future! ECML avoiding York is a strange choice though..?
That is almost certainly a way of meeting the requirement for an open access operator to not be "primarily extractive" of the core franchises. The Morpeth stop is probably related to that too, and because of the infamous curve south of the station it doesn't add that much time to the journey either because trains already have to run slowly through Morpeth...
Looks like I will use this for Edinburgh Fringe next year.
This is the Mega Bus of trains. Do the same review in 6 months time to compare if its better, worse or the same, well done Geoff.
another great video mate.
look fwd to trying this route one day.
As somone who always drives this is an amazing service and idea. Might actually use it !
Go for it, it's such a boring drive!
Ditto. I live in Edinburgh and always drive to everywhere in the UK except London. When I need to make a long journey (Edinburgh to Exeter, for example) I check the train prices and they are always hundreds of pounds, so I drive.
Hey Geoff, could you please consider making a video about all the terminus stations in London and what it might look like if through services were created to emulate the RER? Which stations would connect etc?
I also loved the secrets of the underground series. Any more? Maybe even secrets of other metro systems in other cities? Cheers.
Worth waiting for. Thank you.
Another great video, Geoff. Fun and fact-filled. I agree: definitely Star Trek uniforms. Thanks for taking a look at the accessible area, and toilet, Hoping to take a trip myself soon. #Lumocomotion
Great idea to take on the airlines, especially in light of COP and recent budget madness! Definitely rather let the train take the strain than do that trip on a plane.
Those Politicians and Elitists who went to cop still went on their private jets, drove in there gas car Motorcades than went in a private jet home
They're hypocrites and I personally don't listen to people who don't practice what they preach
It looks great and railways need to compete with the airlines (I flew with my family Gatwick to Glasgow return for around £240 including luggage; looking at Trainline, the cheapest tickets are around £380 for the same thing currently - not with this new train.)
The only bad thing about these trains appears to be the lack of luggage space.
This seems like a wonderful train operating company and I will consider using Lumo when going to Edinburgh :)
I have no interest in trains yet I consistently watch your videos lool.
Brilliant video as I never knew this service existed. Definitely will consider this when I travel to Edinbrugh.
Now we need a open acess operator like this on the great Western line especially between Cardiff and london
It will probably happen but only once HS2 is up and running as there very little spare capacity on the line at the minute.
Err... That would be competing with First Group who own GWR and, er, Lumo too. 😅
@@anylex5328 Maybe LNER will sneakily do the reverse there and create an open access operator to compete with GWR lol