Thanks everyone! Watch here for the full episode: th-cam.com/video/kXsc40m4iRU/w-d-xo.html Start the journey by clicking "subscribe" on TH-cam. Strength, endurance, and wellness supplements to fuel your performance. SAVE 10% at BPN Supps: bit.ly/nickbare10audio
This is important for those who are overweight and always hated exercise. They think of running as that painful thing that is really hard. Instead focus on targeted heartrate. At big bodyweight powerwalking at a moderate heartrate for 30 minutes is enough to grease the weels and begin a healthy love of lifetime exercise
Service station 3km away from me has a good coffee machine. I just go get a coffee every day. Started a month and a half ago. I run up the hills now and walk the flat. Don’t have to push ur self at the start, only to get out the door. No rush.
I found the biggest advantage to stacking up miles of base running is that you also condition the feet, ankles and calves to be able to endure the longer runs. That was what was holding me back before. My cardio was never an issue, it was the conditioning of my feet and all the connective tissue in the lower leg, and my hip flexors to a lesser extent.
@@mchase4 start off with shorter runs interspersed with walking. Say a minute of running followed by two or three minutes of walking and gradually increase your running time from there. As soon as you feel your running form start to break down, that’s enough running. You should be running up on the balls of your feet, but not right up on your toes. Your toes, feet and ankles should work as a suspension system, they should not “slap” on the ground like dead fish. There are a lot of videos on TH-cam and Instagram about strengthening and warming up the muscles in your toes, feet and ankles. This is super important, particularly in the early days. Don’t push through pain, but also understand the difference between soreness and injury. Most importantly, like the video says, run much slower than you think is necessary. I started off running six minute kilometres and tried to build speed from there, when really, even now, the majority of my runs sit around 7-7.30/km. So, if you haven’t already, invest in a cheap running watch. I have stuck with Garmin, but some of the cheaper models didn’t last very long, so maybe do some research on what would be the best option for your budget. Good luck. 🤙🏼
Great info! I started out my running career exactly the same, by always going as hard as I could. In recent years I've tried to keep my heartrate lower for most of my "longer" runs. However, I'm currently studying to become a PT, and my endurance coach emphasized the importance of running with high intensity again, something I'd almost forgotten about. He went as far as to recommend strictly doing high intensity runs, unless you have a spesific goal of running at least a half-marathon. So, and I'm sure you already know this, but the sweet spot is a good combination of the two. And if your only goal is to get better at the 10k, 5k, or even shorter distances, intervall training is probably the most important.
I really found this episode so insightful, thank you! I started jogging (not calling it running yet) and it's not been easy, but having the info now on building the right foundation is going to help, especially keeping within the correct heart rate (180 less my age). I really loved what you said about not comparing ourselves to others as we might be at Chapter 1 and others Chapter 10, that gives such perspective👌🏻 And at the very end, to be patient, that's gonna be my mindset now. Thanks, you're a great inspiration and thanks for coaching us!! ❤️
I found that running slower actually made me slower. I spent time having to remember the pain felt from running faster. Maybe half the kilometres for a week at low pace might be good, but for me at least, any more than that and i become sluggish.
180-64=116. I’m not sure that’s reliable (I’m also not sure it’s not). I’m 64yo, 5’7”, 139 lbs. and I hit 116bpm at a mere 3-3.5mph walk, so I don’t think I could build an aerobic base at that speed. For me, slow jogging starts at 4.5mph, and slow running at 6.0mph. Using the “talk test” to determine Zone 2, I can carry on a broken conversation between ~133bpm (easy) and ~147bpm (struggling), then I can give 1-2 word responses up to ~170bpm, at which point I have to focus on breathing only. My recent max heart rates have been 171 (this week), 185 (month), and 194 (six months)-well above the 220-age model, which indicates my MHR should be a mere 156. I lift exclusively on Tonal (~2.2 million lbs. in 2.5 years) 2-3 times/wk., do 45-75 min. of Z2 (run/cycle) 2-3 times/wk., and run Z5 4x4x4s twice/mth. My body fat is currently 16% (lost 13 lbs. in last 7 months via nutrition adjustments) and my VO2max is ~40.5 (Cooper run test).
I don’t have that age but for my training for an Ironman it took me 4 months to get my hr under 165 regardless of pace or distance. Now 10 months it’s pretty good resting 50’s bpm and long runs 119 ish if hydrated :) consistency is key!
its a generalized formula, and maf guys says it dosent really work on people over 50-60 years. you could probably easily add 10-15 beats on that and still be fine
@@cefrayersure I’m 34, currently training for a full Ironman (first one) Typically I have 2 runs, 2 swims, and 2 bikes a week. I do a long run 8-10 miles, a mid distance 5 miles or so, and some track work of 400-800 repeats. My bikes during the summer are outside minimum an hour, maximum 3-4 depending on how far along in my training. When it’s winter (I live in Germany it’s very icy) I do zwift and keep in wattage 150-210ish sustained at the moment. My swims are my weakness but it’s a lot of technical work, usually 1.5 hours and 1.5-2 miles in a pool. My hr usually on a sustainable long run 9ish minute pace range between 119-140 depending on hydration and recovery. I find it usually spikes up at mile 3 but then drops again after a while for whatever reason.
Agreed. The formula isn’t accurate but is helpful for younger estimates. Keep your HR below 140, 145 for slow runs. Which means for a lot of people hiking the hill sections.
I am 73 and the numbers suggested are about 15 beats too low for me. I quite believe in building a base and also I strongly believe in the benifits of interval training for speed work. I don’t think the 180 or 220 minus age holds for older athletes.
You're right, it doesn't. It's most accurate for people who don't workout. If you've been working out throughout your life, most likely your max-heartrate will fall at a much slower rate. Best way to find out is to do a max-heartrate test!
If your max aerobic heart rate is say 142, would it be optimal to run close to 142 without exceeding it, say 140-141 BPM or would being at 125-130 BPM provide similar benefits on these slow runs?
The lower range because your HR will be fluctuating and it usually trends up than down when staying at a consistent pace. Easy runs easy. Hard runs hard.
Fairly sure the benefits comes from time on your feet, and pushing your heart rate towards the top end doesn’t do much, because you’ll just spend less time there.
I’d say lower is better. James Dunne just did a video on z2 running that was good. In my experience the greater benefit of running slow is having fewer injuries, then you get more training days with less gaps. Then you get a huge benefit from compounding.
@@AnthonySegretohave you noticed though, that there is not a single video in the entire world telling anybody to do the opposite and I find that very strange. It’s as if the whole world has copied one another, and I’ve been running at 150-190 HR for 3 months, comfortably, and have seen massive improvements in fitness, I couldn’t run 1 mile 3 months ago, now I’m running a 10k in 48 minutes and I ran my first half marathon 4 weeks into running, btw, hadn’t ran in 7 years or so, prior, and I never run easy pace. And there’s no information on why you SHOULD do it.
@@paulwhalley6789I disagree, you’re only assuming it doesn’t do much because that’s what everyone on the internet tells you, where as, I’ve been testing it myself as a new runner and I’m pretty fucking fit right now, and I’ve seen my paces getting faster and my heart rate dropping, BUT in all fairness I did just pick up a pair of Asicc Superblast 2’s.
When I was in I would run head lights for Charlie group or tail lights for Bravo. I was never fast enough for Bravo but faster then Charlie. I do not miss running in formation 🤣
Heart rate is highly individual, so the formula may give poor recomendations to people of many ages. Another commonly given rule of thumb that I think works better is to run at a "conversational" pace where you can speak in full sentances. A bit heavier breathing than a normal conversation, but you shouldn't need to stop in the middle of a sentance to catch your breath for a few seconds. And as mentioned by others, depending on your starting fitness level, you might expect to not be running the whole time, espesially if there are hills.
A more accurate way that I read is to do a threshold pace for 30 minutes, so fastest pace you can hold for that time. What ever your highest heart rate was during your threshold run, get 60%-70% of that and that is your zone 2 pace which is what you'll stay under during your MAF runs. There's other calculations out there for your MAF HR, I've seen one that adds a certain number of HR depending on your fitness. Like if you're very fit then you add + 5-7 beats from your MAF calculation, but I found that doing the 30 minute threshold pace was more accurate for me since it takes into account your current fitness. Plus as your fitness improves then so does your threshold HR and this will affect your MAF HR calculation so every 2-3 months I plan on doing the 30 minute threshold test to gauge my fitness. Hope this helps!
There’s a large gap in my numbers. I’m 48yrs old, been running for years without much knowledge - recently used the Garmin LT test and got 185 MHR- so now my Zone 2 using MHR at 60-70% is 110-129, for HRR at 60-70% is 127-141, LT at 80-89% is 133-148. Why is LT at 80-89%?? And what should I use??? I’ve been running for years but just ran my first marathon at 4:05 in Knoxville. Should I run the lowest and increase weekly volume or will I be running too slow for my fitness level?
The problem is that when I use this 80 20 method I need to stop to walk or run dragging myself so I dont exceed the aerobic HR, it is not pleasent or fun to run like that One time I tried this method for 1.5 month and gave up because I wasnt even enjoying to run anymore
You're right , it's not fun at first. It's also hard to take an ego check but you need to accept that that's where your current level of fitness is. I started Z2 training at 13 min/mile pace and 6 months later I'm running an 8:50 min pace at the same heart rate. Run every single day 👍
you are probably still running way quicker than you think, try going even slower, as absurd as it sounds when i first started i almost feel like i was jogging on the spot instead of moving forward with how slow i was going, was going from 9-10min/km to now 7min/km as my ez run pace took me around 8 months
Saying that MAF training is the best way to train is like saying the way you cook a steak is the best. There’s lots of ways to make a great steak. None of the MAF training is based on science. It was invented by a chiropractor. There are many ways to train. There is no evidence that MAF is any better than any other style of training. There’s a lot individual variability. Some runners respond to higher volume and lower intensity. Other runners respond to lower volume and higher intensity. Some training programs are based on FTP. Some are based on critical power. Some are based on RPE. You have to figure out what works for you. Good news is that you don’t need to wear an HR bra to train more optimally.
I agree. There is no measurable maximum aerobic function. I see it more as a method to prevent men from running to fast. Because most of the people run way to fast for what should be an easy run.
@@ryanmiskin8925 220-age is the first reference by NIH If we take 180-age, then the heartrate reserve will be less than measured by other people. Having a standard does have value. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7523886/#:~:text=An%20alternative%20approach%20to%20estimate,in%201971%20(14).
This is true. The vast majority of people will get way more "bang for the buck" by going for different forms of intervall training, unless you have a spesific goal of running a marathon.
![“อ.เบียร์ คนตื่นธรรม” มาตามคำเรียกร้อง แหกศาสตร์ฮวงจุ้ย เตือนสติอย่างมงาย | แฉ 7 พ.ย. 67 [1/3]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/5fc4S3xBNfc/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks everyone! Watch here for the full episode: th-cam.com/video/kXsc40m4iRU/w-d-xo.html
Start the journey by clicking "subscribe" on TH-cam.
Strength, endurance, and wellness supplements to fuel your performance. SAVE 10% at BPN Supps:
bit.ly/nickbare10audio
Where can I get trenbologne sandwiches like you nick?
This is important for those who are overweight and always hated exercise. They think of running as that painful thing that is really hard. Instead focus on targeted heartrate. At big bodyweight powerwalking at a moderate heartrate for 30 minutes is enough to grease the weels and begin a healthy love of lifetime exercise
Service station 3km away from me has a good coffee machine. I just go get a coffee every day. Started a month and a half ago. I run up the hills now and walk the flat. Don’t have to push ur self at the start, only to get out the door. No rush.
Your body doesn't know whether you are running swimming cycling. It doesn't care aerobic training is training 👍🏻
This is actually a breath of fresh air for me as a beginner who doesn’t want to hate my runs. 😅 Happy to be patient and consistent.
You got this
I found the biggest advantage to stacking up miles of base running is that you also condition the feet, ankles and calves to be able to endure the longer runs. That was what was holding me back before. My cardio was never an issue, it was the conditioning of my feet and all the connective tissue in the lower leg, and my hip flexors to a lesser extent.
How did you do this. I have the same issue. Ankles, shins, calves. They hurt.
@@mchase4 start off with shorter runs interspersed with walking. Say a minute of running followed by two or three minutes of walking and gradually increase your running time from there. As soon as you feel your running form start to break down, that’s enough running. You should be running up on the balls of your feet, but not right up on your toes. Your toes, feet and ankles should work as a suspension system, they should not “slap” on the ground like dead fish.
There are a lot of videos on TH-cam and Instagram about strengthening and warming up the muscles in your toes, feet and ankles. This is super important, particularly in the early days. Don’t push through pain, but also understand the difference between soreness and injury.
Most importantly, like the video says, run much slower than you think is necessary. I started off running six minute kilometres and tried to build speed from there, when really, even now, the majority of my runs sit around 7-7.30/km. So, if you haven’t already, invest in a cheap running watch. I have stuck with Garmin, but some of the cheaper models didn’t last very long, so maybe do some research on what would be the best option for your budget. Good luck. 🤙🏼
Great info! I started out my running career exactly the same, by always going as hard as I could. In recent years I've tried to keep my heartrate lower for most of my "longer" runs.
However, I'm currently studying to become a PT, and my endurance coach emphasized the importance of running with high intensity again, something I'd almost forgotten about. He went as far as to recommend strictly doing high intensity runs, unless you have a spesific goal of running at least a half-marathon.
So, and I'm sure you already know this, but the sweet spot is a good combination of the two. And if your only goal is to get better at the 10k, 5k, or even shorter distances, intervall training is probably the most important.
Charlie group 11B here
I was so slow that the A group lapped me to where they thought I finished as A group. 😂
I really found this episode so insightful, thank you! I started jogging (not calling it running yet) and it's not been easy, but having the info now on building the right foundation is going to help, especially keeping within the correct heart rate (180 less my age). I really loved what you said about not comparing ourselves to others as we might be at Chapter 1 and others Chapter 10, that gives such perspective👌🏻 And at the very end, to be patient, that's gonna be my mindset now. Thanks, you're a great inspiration and thanks for coaching us!! ❤️
Great advise ! Thank you 🙏
MAF has been really useful for me.
Run for Health
I found that running slower actually made me slower. I spent time having to remember the pain felt from running faster. Maybe half the kilometres for a week at low pace might be good, but for me at least, any more than that and i become sluggish.
Same!
180-64=116. I’m not sure that’s reliable (I’m also not sure it’s not). I’m 64yo, 5’7”, 139 lbs. and I hit 116bpm at a mere 3-3.5mph walk, so I don’t think I could build an aerobic base at that speed.
For me, slow jogging starts at 4.5mph, and slow running at 6.0mph. Using the “talk test” to determine Zone 2, I can carry on a broken conversation between ~133bpm (easy) and ~147bpm (struggling), then I can give 1-2 word responses up to ~170bpm, at which point I have to focus on breathing only.
My recent max heart rates have been 171 (this week), 185 (month), and 194 (six months)-well above the 220-age model, which indicates my MHR should be a mere 156.
I lift exclusively on Tonal (~2.2 million lbs. in 2.5 years) 2-3 times/wk., do 45-75 min. of Z2 (run/cycle) 2-3 times/wk., and run Z5 4x4x4s twice/mth.
My body fat is currently 16% (lost 13 lbs. in last 7 months via nutrition adjustments) and my VO2max is ~40.5 (Cooper run test).
I don’t have that age but for my training for an Ironman it took me 4 months to get my hr under 165 regardless of pace or distance. Now 10 months it’s pretty good resting 50’s bpm and long runs 119 ish if hydrated :) consistency is key!
its a generalized formula, and maf guys says it dosent really work on people over 50-60 years. you could probably easily add 10-15 beats on that and still be fine
@@MichaelDavis-uu9zh Do you mind sharing your age and what specific training you did during those four months? Thanks!
@@cefrayersure
I’m 34, currently training for a full Ironman (first one) Typically I have 2 runs, 2 swims, and 2 bikes a week. I do a long run 8-10 miles, a mid distance 5 miles or so, and some track work of 400-800 repeats.
My bikes during the summer are outside minimum an hour, maximum 3-4 depending on how far along in my training. When it’s winter (I live in Germany it’s very icy) I do zwift and keep in wattage 150-210ish sustained at the moment.
My swims are my weakness but it’s a lot of technical work, usually 1.5 hours and 1.5-2 miles in a pool.
My hr usually on a sustainable long run 9ish minute pace range between 119-140 depending on hydration and recovery. I find it usually spikes up at mile 3 but then drops again after a while for whatever reason.
Agreed. The formula isn’t accurate but is helpful for younger estimates. Keep your HR below 140, 145 for slow runs. Which means for a lot of people hiking the hill sections.
I am 73 and the numbers suggested are about 15 beats too low for me. I quite believe in building a base and also I strongly believe in the benifits of interval training for speed work.
I don’t think the 180 or 220 minus age holds for older athletes.
You're right, it doesn't. It's most accurate for people who don't workout. If you've been working out throughout your life, most likely your max-heartrate will fall at a much slower rate.
Best way to find out is to do a max-heartrate test!
If your max aerobic heart rate is say 142, would it be optimal to run close to 142 without exceeding it, say 140-141 BPM or would being at 125-130 BPM provide similar benefits on these slow runs?
The lower range because your HR will be fluctuating and it usually trends up than down when staying at a consistent pace. Easy runs easy. Hard runs hard.
Fairly sure the benefits comes from time on your feet, and pushing your heart rate towards the top end doesn’t do much, because you’ll just spend less time there.
I’d say lower is better. James Dunne just did a video on z2 running that was good. In my experience the greater benefit of running slow is having fewer injuries, then you get more training days with less gaps. Then you get a huge benefit from compounding.
@@AnthonySegretohave you noticed though, that there is not a single video in the entire world telling anybody to do the opposite and I find that very strange. It’s as if the whole world has copied one another, and I’ve been running at 150-190 HR for 3 months, comfortably, and have seen massive improvements in fitness, I couldn’t run 1 mile 3 months ago, now I’m running a 10k in 48 minutes and I ran my first half marathon 4 weeks into running, btw, hadn’t ran in 7 years or so, prior, and I never run easy pace. And there’s no information on why you SHOULD do it.
@@paulwhalley6789I disagree, you’re only assuming it doesn’t do much because that’s what everyone on the internet tells you, where as, I’ve been testing it myself as a new runner and I’m pretty fucking fit right now, and I’ve seen my paces getting faster and my heart rate dropping, BUT in all fairness I did just pick up a pair of Asicc Superblast 2’s.
TY NB!
Ft Benning was awesome for me. Ft Hood wasn’t bad at all
Piggy back ON. Based ON.
When I was in I would run head lights for Charlie group or tail lights for Bravo. I was never fast enough for Bravo but faster then Charlie. I do not miss running in formation 🤣
Nick can you just explain to people that your on Test. Or post your BMI and body fat % im sure your BMI is above 30 and body fat near 10%
Never trust anybody sauced to the Gills and not honest about it
Does the 180 formula work for older runners. I’m 55, but a heart rate of 125 is very hard to stay under while still actually running.
Yes. Do a jog / walk mix until your cardiovascular system gets used to staying low. It takes about 6 weeks for your body to acclimate
What this guy said 👆 good advice
Heart rate is highly individual, so the formula may give poor recomendations to people of many ages. Another commonly given rule of thumb that I think works better is to run at a "conversational" pace where you can speak in full sentances. A bit heavier breathing than a normal conversation, but you shouldn't need to stop in the middle of a sentance to catch your breath for a few seconds. And as mentioned by others, depending on your starting fitness level, you might expect to not be running the whole time, espesially if there are hills.
A more accurate way that I read is to do a threshold pace for 30 minutes, so fastest pace you can hold for that time. What ever your highest heart rate was during your threshold run, get 60%-70% of that and that is your zone 2 pace which is what you'll stay under during your MAF runs. There's other calculations out there for your MAF HR, I've seen one that adds a certain number of HR depending on your fitness. Like if you're very fit then you add + 5-7 beats from your MAF calculation, but I found that doing the 30 minute threshold pace was more accurate for me since it takes into account your current fitness. Plus as your fitness improves then so does your threshold HR and this will affect your MAF HR calculation so every 2-3 months I plan on doing the 30 minute threshold test to gauge my fitness. Hope this helps!
There’s a large gap in my numbers. I’m 48yrs old, been running for years without much knowledge - recently used the Garmin LT test and got 185 MHR- so now my Zone 2 using MHR at 60-70% is 110-129, for HRR at 60-70% is 127-141, LT at 80-89% is 133-148. Why is LT at 80-89%?? And what should I use??? I’ve been running for years but just ran my first marathon at 4:05 in Knoxville. Should I run the lowest and increase weekly volume or will I be running too slow for my fitness level?
The problem is that when I use this 80 20 method I need to stop to walk or run dragging myself so I dont exceed the aerobic HR, it is not pleasent or fun to run like that
One time I tried this method for 1.5 month and gave up because I wasnt even enjoying to run anymore
You're right , it's not fun at first. It's also hard to take an ego check but you need to accept that that's where your current level of fitness is. I started Z2 training at 13 min/mile pace and 6 months later I'm running an 8:50 min pace at the same heart rate. Run every single day 👍
you are probably still running way quicker than you think, try going even slower, as absurd as it sounds when i first started i almost feel like i was jogging on the spot instead of moving forward with how slow i was going, was going from 9-10min/km to now 7min/km as my ez run pace took me around 8 months
Saying that MAF training is the best way to train is like saying the way you cook a steak is the best. There’s lots of ways to make a great steak. None of the MAF training is based on science. It was invented by a chiropractor. There are many ways to train. There is no evidence that MAF is any better than any other style of training. There’s a lot individual variability. Some runners respond to higher volume and lower intensity. Other runners respond to lower volume and higher intensity. Some training programs are based on FTP. Some are based on critical power. Some are based on RPE. You have to figure out what works for you.
Good news is that you don’t need to wear an HR bra to train more optimally.
I agree. There is no measurable maximum aerobic function.
I see it more as a method to prevent men from running to fast. Because most of the people run way to fast for what should be an easy run.
Bad analogy, as the constant flip method is indisputable as the best way to cook a steak :)
@@mattstone8111 My chiropractor recommends one flip. I’m so confused.
@@mattstone8111 I'll go for the reverse sear method. Preferably with a dry aged steak.
Is it not 220 instead of 180 to subtract age?
220 - Age is for maximum heart rate. 180 - Age is for max aerobic heart rate, where you want to be running to build an aerobic base. 👍
Not 220-age?
That's a worthless equation.
@@ryanmiskin8925 220-age is the first reference by NIH
If we take 180-age, then the heartrate reserve will be less than measured by other people. Having a standard does have value.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7523886/#:~:text=An%20alternative%20approach%20to%20estimate,in%201971%20(14).
That’s supposed to be for your Max Heart Rate, he’s talking about the Max Aerobic Heart Rate
Idk if it’s just me but nick looks wore out tired not saying anything bad don’t come for me
He just had a another baby.
@@oguinn84yup that’s the answer😂 , new baby=no sleep
And he forces him self to run in the morning when he could simply do it after work
The having a new-born mate while running a 7 figure business.
Yea it’s the new baby Nico I thought about it after
😂
Dude on more juice than tropicana
Why you mad? I hope this comment brought you closer to your fitness goals.
He isn’t
so much insecurity in one comment. zero value provided.
Your father is a shemale
@@TheMassdaddy he is though
Very debatable, by running faster you will become more efficient. Period.
🤦🏻♂️
This is true. The vast majority of people will get way more "bang for the buck" by going for different forms of intervall training, unless you have a spesific goal of running a marathon.
I don’t take advice from people on PEDs
That's dumb
Hoooah!
Damn. Thanks for the heads up.
@@guille8756no its not. This huys recovering like wolverine. You will get injured if you run like him and you are natty
@@megrefitness shut up