Over the last few weeks or so, I have been learning and playing the final movement of this wonderful symphony on the piano, and am currently learning the 2nd subject of the first movement. Seeing this video has definitely given me a big insight into Tchaikovsky's state of mind at the time of writing this symphony. When playing the coda of the finale movement, I have felt it so strongly that I have cried. I find it so sad. I agree with you about the development section in the first movement. Even now,it makes me jump out of my skin. It's almost as if an almighty thunderstorm is hitting just out of nowhere, literally! So exciting. It's the first symphony of Tchaikovsky's I have ever heard, and one of my favourites of all time. Thankyou, anyway, for your video!👍👏
The opening theme of the first movement is closely related to the opening of Beethoven's "Pathetique" Sonata op.13. The overall form of Tchaikovsky's 6th seems to presage the unusual form of Mahler's 9th symphony. In fact, Mahler alludes to the so-called "love theme" from the first movement of Tchaikovsky's 6th, in several places in the first movement of Mahler's 9th. (He had already alluded to that same Tchaikovsky theme at the climax of the slow movement of the Fourth.) Mahler had an on again off again relationship with Tchaikovsky's music: he loved the opera "Queen of Spades", but thought the themes of the 6th symphony weren't symphonic enough.
I think the third movement is a sonatina form with some additional sections of transition. Sonatina means sonata without develpment section, the real development will come in the last movement separately (the death), that's my interpretation. The first clever sonatina (but rather classical) was the first mov. of his string serenade. In his ouverture "Hamlet" he again used a strong modified sonata, which leads more into a sonatina form with some additional developping sections, but without clear development. I believe, that Tchaikovsky was more creative in forms as usually described.
Yes good point - it could be described as a sonatina form movement, particularly as the march ends in the home key in it's final statement (G major, rather than E major) thus being in effect a recapitulation. I think I didn't describe it thus, because usually you would have a transition between the exposition and recapitulation, which is almost non-existent in this movement.
The first Tchaikovsky symphony I became aquainted with.and yes that sudden fortissimo is frightening But what a beautiful work. I like the Jansons cycle but the Riccardo Muti/Philharmonia holds a special place for me. Thank you for these insightful videos How does it feel to play these pieces compared to just listening ? If I could name a request: analysis and comparison of the Festival Overture on the Danish National Anthem, Op.15, Marche Slave, Op.31 and 1812, Op.49.
Great question. To my mind, although both A and B share the same motif, in A it sounds far more fragmented & nebulous, whereas in B it is heard as a confident march theme. In addition, the first time we hear B it is in a different key - E major (a sub-mediant modulation from the A section which is in G) which helps us differentiate the sections too. Does that help?
Vincent Sheehan Yes, a key change would certainly be something to note! In trying to hear B section clearly apart from the A section, it also sounds like the motif that B is built on becomes a longer melody/theme, rather than a short motif. It’s repeated twice like that, similarly in B’ near the end. A defining indication for me was seeing the downwards sixteenth runs that would seem to cap off the phrase, since those are pretty noticeable. And similar to the A section repeating in A’, when B and B’ come in they are started practically in the same way, and continued similarly as well. Thanks!
I'm attempting to write an essay on the symphony at the moment, so your measure numbers have been really helpful. I do have a couple other questions, now that I'm curious after you've answered the first! One being, in measure 44, the horns have a 'motif' (if that's the right thing to call it) which is extremely similar to Beethoven's 5th symphony. Do you think there's any correlation between the two, or is it probably a coincidence? I'm thinking it may be the latter since I haven't read anything that has said this before, but I can't help but be interested as the two symphonies have said often to be on or including the topic of fate. Secondly, if you were to give the third movement a form name, what might it be? I've heard tertiary before, but I'm not sure if that's correct. ABA'B'? March form? Although it kind of lacks a trio... Last, you've provided some sections for the last movement, but I wonder if it could be called something like a fantasia, since form is so elusive there. I apologize for so many questions! If you have any suggestions, I'd be pleased to know. :)
1. I haven’t noticed that before! I think it is a coincidence as Beethoven’s 5th fate motif is something you see everywhere if you look for it (although the intervals are right here - so you might have a point after all!). 2. I’d suggest that this movement is in a simple ‘song form’ with a coda - or binary repeated. You could also argue that is a truncated sonata (or sonatina) form - as the B section for the second time is in the tonic (G major) although I’d argue against this as there is no 2nd subject in the ‘Recapitulation’. 3. I’d regard the finale very definitely as a ternary (ABA) form. Hope this helps
Over the last few weeks or so, I have been learning and playing the final movement of this wonderful symphony on the piano, and am currently learning the 2nd subject of the first movement. Seeing this video has definitely given me a big insight into Tchaikovsky's state of mind at the time of writing this symphony. When playing the coda of the finale movement, I have felt it so strongly that I have cried. I find it so sad. I agree with you about the development section in the first movement. Even now,it makes me jump out of my skin. It's almost as if an almighty thunderstorm is hitting just out of nowhere, literally! So exciting. It's the first symphony of Tchaikovsky's I have ever heard, and one of my favourites of all time. Thankyou, anyway, for your video!👍👏
Wonderfull video, thank you!
Thanks for commenting
The opening theme of the first movement is closely related to the opening of Beethoven's "Pathetique" Sonata op.13. The overall form of Tchaikovsky's 6th seems to presage the unusual form of Mahler's 9th symphony. In fact, Mahler alludes to the so-called "love theme" from the first movement of Tchaikovsky's 6th, in several places in the first movement of Mahler's 9th. (He had already alluded to that same Tchaikovsky theme at the climax of the slow movement of the Fourth.) Mahler had an on again off again relationship with Tchaikovsky's music: he loved the opera "Queen of Spades", but thought the themes of the 6th symphony weren't symphonic enough.
Yes Mahler must have concluded the 9th with a slow movement because of Tchaikovsky’s 6th
I think the third movement is a sonatina form with some additional sections of transition. Sonatina means sonata without develpment section, the real development will come in the last movement separately (the death), that's my interpretation. The first clever sonatina (but rather classical) was the first mov. of his string serenade. In his ouverture "Hamlet" he again used a strong modified sonata, which leads more into a sonatina form with some additional developping sections, but without clear development. I believe, that Tchaikovsky was more creative in forms as usually described.
Yes good point - it could be described as a sonatina form movement, particularly as the march ends in the home key in it's final statement (G major, rather than E major) thus being in effect a recapitulation. I think I didn't describe it thus, because usually you would have a transition between the exposition and recapitulation, which is almost non-existent in this movement.
Thank you very much. This was very helpful in understanding the symphony.
Thanks for watching- glad it was of use
Your video helped me a lot!Thank you!
Y Planeta Thanks for watching!
Amazing videos
Hello Mr Sheehan it’s me Rooh it’s been a long time since you’ve released a video. Nice video
Thanks Rooh!
The first Tchaikovsky symphony I became aquainted with.and yes that sudden fortissimo is frightening But what a beautiful work. I like the Jansons cycle but the Riccardo Muti/Philharmonia holds a special place for me.
Thank you for these insightful videos How does it feel to play these pieces compared to just listening ?
If I could name a request: analysis and comparison of the Festival Overture on the Danish National Anthem, Op.15, Marche Slave, Op.31 and 1812, Op.49.
I’m due another Tchaikovsky video! Watch this space!
In the third movement, how do you determine between the A and the B section?
Great question. To my mind, although both A and B share the same motif, in A it sounds far more fragmented & nebulous, whereas in B it is heard as a confident march theme. In addition, the first time we hear B it is in a different key - E major (a sub-mediant modulation from the A section which is in G) which helps us differentiate the sections too. Does that help?
Vincent Sheehan Yes, a key change would certainly be something to note! In trying to hear B section clearly apart from the A section, it also sounds like the motif that B is built on becomes a longer melody/theme, rather than a short motif. It’s repeated twice like that, similarly in B’ near the end. A defining indication for me was seeing the downwards sixteenth runs that would seem to cap off the phrase, since those are pretty noticeable. And similar to the A section repeating in A’, when B and B’ come in they are started practically in the same way, and continued similarly as well. Thanks!
I'm attempting to write an essay on the symphony at the moment, so your measure numbers have been really helpful. I do have a couple other questions, now that I'm curious after you've answered the first!
One being, in measure 44, the horns have a 'motif' (if that's the right thing to call it) which is extremely similar to Beethoven's 5th symphony. Do you think there's any correlation between the two, or is it probably a coincidence? I'm thinking it may be the latter since I haven't read anything that has said this before, but I can't help but be interested as the two symphonies have said often to be on or including the topic of fate.
Secondly, if you were to give the third movement a form name, what might it be? I've heard tertiary before, but I'm not sure if that's correct. ABA'B'? March form? Although it kind of lacks a trio...
Last, you've provided some sections for the last movement, but I wonder if it could be called something like a fantasia, since form is so elusive there.
I apologize for so many questions! If you have any suggestions, I'd be pleased to know. :)
1. I haven’t noticed that before! I think it is a coincidence as Beethoven’s 5th fate motif is something you see everywhere if you look for it (although the intervals are right here - so you might have a point after all!).
2. I’d suggest that this movement is in a simple ‘song form’ with a coda - or binary repeated. You could also argue that is a truncated sonata (or sonatina) form - as the B section for the second time is in the tonic (G major) although I’d argue against this as there is no 2nd subject in the ‘Recapitulation’.
3. I’d regard the finale very definitely as a ternary (ABA) form.
Hope this helps