I’ve seen the camera ignore the net in soccer too in my tests. It’s amazing. Interestingly, it didn’t work as well when I shot directly behind the net with a 35mm lens. Great video!
Really, really helpful. As is usually the case, you gave us the things that matter in a clear and meaningful way. Thanks. I noticed the manual says you can keep your subject in tracking toggling out of action priority. Which seems important. You lose control with some of this tech so it was a good design decision for them to let us toggle in and out of this mode if we want to set it up that way. You mentioned a hope that they'll improve player discrimination against similar backgrounds in a firmware update. I guessing this involves hardware more than firmware. The more discrimination you ask for the more decision cycles the chip has to proocess. The helpful list of elements that limit performance is in-fact an outline of how they've framed the decision cyles. That being said, what you are holding in your hand is a beast. Certain specs tell us that this is, already, a significantly faster chip than we have in the R3 even if it's flying under the same name. They would not even be able to do the pattern recognition you're now seeing without the coprocessor. It's my opinion that this will be a lasting advantage for Canon, because their organization may be more agile than Sony in this particular area. The world owes Sony a lot of gratitude for proving a stacked processor was possible and leading the way, but the coprocessor algorithms may be a stronghold for Canon simply because they have less legacy baggage in this area. We'll see.
Great video! Best on web. When Canon improves the AI algorithms and adds more sports, will this be likely available to the Canon R5 MII via software upgrades, or will you have to purchase their latest camera offering?
It seems like firmware upgrades will be able to take care of the upgrades we are asking for. It will be interesting to see how different the R1 AF system looks now that they've received so much feedback on the R5 II.
Really loved this video! I found this tonight after coming home from a Volleyball game with some mixed results and this really helped me better understand what's happening and how to use it to my advantage next time. One question I did have, I'm curious what your base AF settings are for some of these sports. I'm guessing you're using Whole Area AF (which I think has to be on for Sports Priority?) but I'm sometimes torn on what Whole Area AF is locking onto at certain times.
Thanks for the review, very useful for a sports photographer like me. I have no idea if you used the Canon R3 before, but if you did, how does this R5 II compare in this two areas: rolling shutter and viewfinder size and refresh speed? thanks
@@byuphoto similar in autofocus? i've been reading in other reviews that it his a big step ahead compared to the R3. Specially with that new feature that predicts where the ball his going
R5 Mark II is faster and more accurate in face/eye tracking, similar speed in spot, maybe a bit faster. Action priority mode in the R5 Mark II is new, not something the R3 can compete with.
At 15:00 I think it's prioritzing on faces and not the lost ball. I've seen this same thing happen with football, single AF point only + subject tracking on the back of primary players jersey out of focus while background subject right behind face in focus and outside of the AF point. Shooting from the side with volleyball where the faces of two blockers at the top of the net where AF jumped from the in focus foreground player who turned her head sideways through a sequence, the AF jumped to the background subject because both eyes were more visible. The Canon DPP has all the settings in the exif which has been helpful to understand what's going on, it's going to take some time. Agree I'm not a 100% sold on action priority.
The R1 is only available directly from Canon at marquee sports events (Olympics, US Open) to a select few photographers. When it ships (next year?) I'm sure Jaren will get one and review it in depth. As for the Z9, I think BYU is a Canon shop but they could probably convince Nikon USA to loan them some gear for a TH-cam review (which would overlap with Jaren's role as a teacher of photography)... would love to see it!
I think you skipped over the most important part: the two action priority configuration options. (section 4-4). Option 1: 1-point AF with Whole Area Tracking Servo AF turned on, and option 2: Flexible Zone AF with Whole Area Tracking Servo AF turned off. Ive found when shooting volleyball, option 2 works better, except when trying to get blockers (the Ai selects the hitters in this case). So for this I need Action Priority turned off, and Whole Area Tracking Servo AF turned back on. (Option #3 lol.) None of this can be a "single button" press so I have to set it as C1, C2, and C3. (Kinda the same issue with pre-focusing. It will never just be a single button because you also have to turn anti-flicker on and off too.) As for your basketball situation of a guy sitting in the background with the ball capturing focus - option 2 would have fixed this because he would have been outside of your focus area zone (and whole area tracking AF would be off).
Oh, and I had to go the the AF case setting and make the default (auto) a little less sticky. The AI was staying a little too long on the player. (This may have fixed your player serving photo where it locked on a guy in the bleachers and almost didnt make it back to the server in time.)
Thanks. It seems that people tend to underutilize the flex zone. Maybe they don't get it or have trouble retraining and letting go. Being able to turn off overrides from whole area processing will help with that and was needed. Not enough spare buttons! Right? We also need to be able to map a couple more functions to a single button toggle-through mode. Toggling through focus modes comes to mind. I've never mastered the art of storing and using in C1, C2, C3. Glad to hear someone's made that work in daily operations.
Thanks for mentioning that, I decided to leave it out of the video because I didn't have footage of it, so it was tough to explain. It is one of the things that I hope people try out after reading the AF guide. I'm testing the 2 configuration and should have more about what I think about it in our R5 II review video.
There is a HUGE PROBLEM with this review: I'm sitting here thinking what bills not to pay and which kids not to feed so I can afford to add the R5m2 to my camera bag! I wonder if adding more sports will be as simple as a firmware update. Not everything can be fixed with a software update: the hardware in the camera has to be able to handle the processing load (one of the reasons the older Nikon Z bodies had such issues with AF). I am curious if this "magical mode" narrows the gap between amateurs and pros in the images they can produce or if this will give the pros who thoroughly understand what they are doing the ability to make a huge leap forward beyond what a mere GWC with an R5m2 can do.
Wow. Lots to unpack here. I'm going to have to suggest you feed those kids first. As it stands right now, Action Priority mode will elevate amateurs much closer to seasoned pros. With some improvements such as those I mentioned in the video, it might change how pros photograph sports. I'm excited to see how Action Priority mode is implemented in the R1.
Just bursts of photos, and we used an external recorder to capture what you would normally see in the viewfinder so that we could help people visualize what happens when you use Action Priority.
Canon needs to update to team Priority also. If i put in a preference of green shirts and don’t want white shirts. Example is if my priority is the defender next to the ball. A lot of photographers are team photographers
What I would love to see is have the possibility to tell the camera what NOT to focus on, e.g. do no focus on a net, raindrops/splashing water/sand, crowd that does not move, ...
No. Your sony (I have an a1 too btw) isnt automatically switching focus to the person with the ball. Its either staying with the person you initially selected, or its selecting the closest person.
@@Jan-PeterMohwinkel I mean, my Canon R10 can do the same shit as well because AF has been impressive for years. I introduce you to the law of diminishing returns. There will no longer be any huge leaps in camera technology until one can literally read our minds
@@Jan-PeterMohwinkel It’s not on the same level, but I can achieve the same images because the AF system is incredible especially compared to something from 10 years ago. It’s a similar AF to what the R3 has, so while it may not be as fast, it has the same algorithms. I’ve never blamed the camera for missed focus
What a great vid, well explained points and examples. Please please keep these type of vids coming thank you.
Thanks, will do!
I’ve seen the camera ignore the net in soccer too in my tests. It’s amazing. Interestingly, it didn’t work as well when I shot directly behind the net with a 35mm lens. Great video!
Thanks!
what a great video. Thank you! Also thanks to the link to the Canon AF guide for this camera. Have you hit on the best settings for regular Football?
Ohhh I was wondering how this would work with volleyball. Thank you. 🙏🏾
Really, really helpful. As is usually the case, you gave us the things that matter in a clear and meaningful way. Thanks. I noticed the manual says you can keep your subject in tracking toggling out of action priority. Which seems important. You lose control with some of this tech so it was a good design decision for them to let us toggle in and out of this mode if we want to set it up that way.
You mentioned a hope that they'll improve player discrimination against similar backgrounds in a firmware update. I guessing this involves hardware more than firmware. The more discrimination you ask for the more decision cycles the chip has to proocess. The helpful list of elements that limit performance is in-fact an outline of how they've framed the decision cyles. That being said, what you are holding in your hand is a beast. Certain specs tell us that this is, already, a significantly faster chip than we have in the R3 even if it's flying under the same name. They would not even be able to do the pattern recognition you're now seeing without the coprocessor. It's my opinion that this will be a lasting advantage for Canon, because their organization may be more agile than Sony in this particular area. The world owes Sony a lot of gratitude for proving a stacked processor was possible and leading the way, but the coprocessor algorithms may be a stronghold for Canon simply because they have less legacy baggage in this area. We'll see.
Great video! Best on web. When Canon improves the AI algorithms and adds more sports, will this be likely available to the Canon R5 MII via software upgrades, or will you have to purchase their latest camera offering?
It seems like firmware upgrades will be able to take care of the upgrades we are asking for. It will be interesting to see how different the R1 AF system looks now that they've received so much feedback on the R5 II.
Really loved this video! I found this tonight after coming home from a Volleyball game with some mixed results and this really helped me better understand what's happening and how to use it to my advantage next time.
One question I did have, I'm curious what your base AF settings are for some of these sports. I'm guessing you're using Whole Area AF (which I think has to be on for Sports Priority?) but I'm sometimes torn on what Whole Area AF is locking onto at certain times.
One button is setup for spot focusing, another for head tracking, I'll go over my setup in a review video.
@@byuphoto Very much appreciate it and looking forward to it! Thank you so much for your contributions to the community!
Thanks for the review, very useful for a sports photographer like me. I have no idea if you used the Canon R3 before, but if you did, how does this R5 II compare in this two areas: rolling shutter and viewfinder size and refresh speed? thanks
Very similar to the R3 in autofocus and rolling shutter. Better viewfinder than the R3. The R3 is superior in ergonomics, buffer, and battery life.
@@byuphoto similar in autofocus? i've been reading in other reviews that it his a big step ahead compared to the R3. Specially with that new feature that predicts where the ball his going
R5 Mark II is faster and more accurate in face/eye tracking, similar speed in spot, maybe a bit faster. Action priority mode in the R5 Mark II is new, not something the R3 can compete with.
At 15:00 I think it's prioritzing on faces and not the lost ball. I've seen this same thing happen with football, single AF point only + subject tracking on the back of primary players jersey out of focus while background subject right behind face in focus and outside of the AF point. Shooting from the side with volleyball where the faces of two blockers at the top of the net where AF jumped from the in focus foreground player who turned her head sideways through a sequence, the AF jumped to the background subject because both eyes were more visible. The Canon DPP has all the settings in the exif which has been helpful to understand what's going on, it's going to take some time. Agree I'm not a 100% sold on action priority.
Do you have qccess to Canon R1 or Nikon Z9 to give a more comprehensive review
The R1 is only available directly from Canon at marquee sports events (Olympics, US Open) to a select few photographers. When it ships (next year?) I'm sure Jaren will get one and review it in depth. As for the Z9, I think BYU is a Canon shop but they could probably convince Nikon USA to loan them some gear for a TH-cam review (which would overlap with Jaren's role as a teacher of photography)... would love to see it!
@@AdamQuinnPhoto very valid points
Sorry, no R1 yet. We only shoot Canon so I can't speak to how it compares to the other systems.
@@byuphoto fair enough
I think you skipped over the most important part: the two action priority configuration options. (section 4-4). Option 1: 1-point AF with Whole Area Tracking Servo AF turned on, and option 2: Flexible Zone AF with Whole Area Tracking Servo AF turned off. Ive found when shooting volleyball, option 2 works better, except when trying to get blockers (the Ai selects the hitters in this case). So for this I need Action Priority turned off, and Whole Area Tracking Servo AF turned back on. (Option #3 lol.) None of this can be a "single button" press so I have to set it as C1, C2, and C3. (Kinda the same issue with pre-focusing. It will never just be a single button because you also have to turn anti-flicker on and off too.) As for your basketball situation of a guy sitting in the background with the ball capturing focus - option 2 would have fixed this because he would have been outside of your focus area zone (and whole area tracking AF would be off).
Oh, and I had to go the the AF case setting and make the default (auto) a little less sticky. The AI was staying a little too long on the player. (This may have fixed your player serving photo where it locked on a guy in the bleachers and almost didnt make it back to the server in time.)
Thanks. It seems that people tend to underutilize the flex zone. Maybe they don't get it or have trouble retraining and letting go. Being able to turn off overrides from whole area processing will help with that and was needed.
Not enough spare buttons! Right? We also need to be able to map a couple more functions to a single button toggle-through mode. Toggling through focus modes comes to mind.
I've never mastered the art of storing and using in C1, C2, C3. Glad to hear someone's made that work in daily operations.
Thanks for mentioning that, I decided to leave it out of the video because I didn't have footage of it, so it was tough to explain. It is one of the things that I hope people try out after reading the AF guide. I'm testing the 2 configuration and should have more about what I think about it in our R5 II review video.
I'll try it out, Thanks!
Suggestions for soccer please.
There is a HUGE PROBLEM with this review: I'm sitting here thinking what bills not to pay and which kids not to feed so I can afford to add the R5m2 to my camera bag! I wonder if adding more sports will be as simple as a firmware update. Not everything can be fixed with a software update: the hardware in the camera has to be able to handle the processing load (one of the reasons the older Nikon Z bodies had such issues with AF). I am curious if this "magical mode" narrows the gap between amateurs and pros in the images they can produce or if this will give the pros who thoroughly understand what they are doing the ability to make a huge leap forward beyond what a mere GWC with an R5m2 can do.
Wow. Lots to unpack here. I'm going to have to suggest you feed those kids first. As it stands right now, Action Priority mode will elevate amateurs much closer to seasoned pros. With some improvements such as those I mentioned in the video, it might change how pros photograph sports. I'm excited to see how Action Priority mode is implemented in the R1.
Dumb question were you shootings bursts of still images or video?
Just bursts of photos, and we used an external recorder to capture what you would normally see in the viewfinder so that we could help people visualize what happens when you use Action Priority.
Canon needs to update to team Priority also. If i put in a preference of green shirts and don’t want white shirts. Example is if my priority is the defender next to the ball.
A lot of photographers are team photographers
Team priority should be their priority! Especially if we can setup a button to turn it on and off quickly.
What I would love to see is have the possibility to tell the camera what NOT to focus on, e.g. do no focus on a net, raindrops/splashing water/sand, crowd that does not move, ...
Interesting thought, I really hope that they have a swimming mode that ignores splashing water and locks in on the swimmer.
If they could develop AI for swimming, I would gladly buy the R1!
This is cheating with this camera. It is quicker than human. I have one and I am impressed with its pre-capture feature.
Its a really impressive camera, and Pre-Capture is a great addition.
I don't think the camera can tell when possession changes--
There is nothing in the video what my Sony a1 cant do.
Really, what won't you say? Can your A1 also cook and wash? loool
No. Your sony (I have an a1 too btw) isnt automatically switching focus to the person with the ball. Its either staying with the person you initially selected, or its selecting the closest person.
@@Jan-PeterMohwinkel I mean, my Canon R10 can do the same shit as well because AF has been impressive for years. I introduce you to the law of diminishing returns. There will no longer be any huge leaps in camera technology until one can literally read our minds
@@Jan-PeterMohwinkel It’s not on the same level, but I can achieve the same images because the AF system is incredible especially compared to something from 10 years ago. It’s a similar AF to what the R3 has, so while it may not be as fast, it has the same algorithms. I’ve never blamed the camera for missed focus
@@Jan-PeterMohwinkel of course, of course, lol