Wanting to be a "good" wife isn't the problem, liking masculine things like clothes isn't the problem, and being quirky isn't the problem. The problem is thinking you're better than other girls, invalidating them and mocking them for not having the same beliefs you have.
You're right. But saddly that's kinda how adolescence works. We're looking around us in search of a sense of identity and most of the times we valorise people thinking like us and bring down those who are too different (at least in our heads). But it's really worrying to keep doing it too long after puberty.
@@Anna-xh6fk I don't think she targeted masculine girls in particular. She just said that you can be however you want to be as long as you don't mock or invalidate those who are different. Nothing more.
@@alecoloxa if you haven’t already, I recommend checking out sharp objects. It is and adaptation of a novel by the same author and has a lot of the stuff I like about Gone Girl but it focuses more on parental relationships. The audiobook is really good too.
It's so depressing when you realise how much of women's behaviour and the way we feel about ourselves comes from the male gaze and the influence of men lol
I mean it’s only so influential because men still have greater access to money and power. So when viewed this way it’s actually survival. We’re all just observing what doesn’t get us eaten by wolves basically and performing accordingly 💀🙏
I never saw Maeve from sex education as a pick me girl, yes she was "different" and had a non traditional style but she never brought other women down, when ruby's intimate photo got leaked she did everything in her power to protect her even when ruby was such a horrible person to Maeve.
I don't think the point was to show Maeve as a pick me girl, but examples of how pop culture still perpetuates, in one way or another, the "cool girl" stereotype.
I think they intentionally tried to make Maeve seem like a "not like other girls" type, only to subvert our expectations. She may act a certain way, but she has always supported other girls, even if they're different from her, and even if she doesn't personally like them.
@@stephaniemasson1224 exactly. That’s the whole point of the show. The characters are all subversions of the typical high school show tropes. Just like Eric first seems to be just another black/gay best friend
Yeah, I think it's ridiculous that she's featured here. I think it was more to emphasize her arc of starting out as a rude loner and then learning the power of female friendship or whatever, which is not even what her arc is lol. Maeve is a feminist from the start and her issue is she can't let people in because she's traumatized and used to people being unreliable and then she gradually overcomes that. I feel like the whole pick me cool girl thing is being blown out of proportion atm.
I've always felt that when a girl says "I'm not like the other girls" she really means "Please see me as a human and don't dump me in a pile with most people like me who you deem unworthy." It's very sad. I think most self-hateful comments--like a Black person degrading other "lower" kinds of Black people, or a trans person criticizing other trans people who don't pass for cis like they do--I think these attitudes stem from a deep desire to be seen as an individual, not a stereotype. It's sad that they have to throw others under the bus to achieve that. And it's sad our society can't make them feel seen in the first place.
Exactly but that's the whole point - pitting people against each other, trapped in a cycle of work and consumption therefore keeping the ruling class rich and in control
Sometimes it actully means that they're really not like other girls. It's a near 50/50 split between what you're suggesting and just... not being a fuckin' girl/woman.
As a 31 y/o millennial, is SO crazy to look back at the messaging we got through movies, music, and pop culture. These same beloved movies and shows were so problematic, and reckoning with the fact that the same things we love were a product of their times is a constant practice of push and pull for me. Women were constantly fighting each other over a man, anything feminine was scorned at (while still holding expectations of that same femininity), lesbian relationships were for the male gaze, single-hood was vilified and always the woman’s burden, and the prize at the end of the movie was always getting a man. The undeniable strength and reality of female friendships is a testament that these were in fact all just social constructs. We still have a long way to go, but it feels like we have turned so many corners, making it into this era of self-reflection and change. Thank god for times changing, for people evolving, for everyone calling bullshit, for gen z holding it down, for millennials and older generations for being strong despite so much social conditioning.
Ironically The Pick Me is always afraid of men. She doesn’t want to be subject to sexism or romantic rejection. She hopes that by pointing out how different she is, she’ll be spared
@@caitlinbelforti870 I saw that too! They’ve seen how cruel(some) men can be to women and assume the woman did something wrong. It really depends on the guy. Some men just want to hurt women. There’s nothing we did or didn’t do to receive the treatment.
I used to be a pick me girl in elementary school, mostly because all the girls were more interested in other stuff but sports and i was the only girl playing sports, plus they always found me a bit weird and too guyish. Funnily enough when i got to highschool, i met "girly girls" who completely accepted me for who I am, always standing up for me and thats when i realised that I gave girls the bad rep. In fact guys at my school were the "mean girls" always gossiping and bullying, the girls were always cool with me. Honestly made me appreciate my womanhood a lot more.
There's a difference between "pick me" behavior and "I am not like other girls" mentality. Every pick me is most probably "not like other girls" but not every "not like other girls" is "pick me". Both have internal misogyny tho which they can't be blamed for, it's the society that made them feel that they'll only be worth it, successful or serious if they are not girly and like masculine stuff. Obviously there are so many women that genuinely like these stuff but then they are either put in the above boxes or are made fun of for not being feminine enough.
Also women might say they’re “not like other girls” because they’re lgbtq+, neurodivergent, gnc, or another minority who has been excluded from traditional womanhood
@@madelinevlogs5898 But thats still false. By saying women if colour and LGBTIQA+ women and neurodivergent womem are "not like othr women" you are further othering them. Instead women of colour *are just like* OTHER women of colour. And LGBTIQA+ women are literally a group founded in order for othered women to have a community.
@@beepbopboop7727 that’s true. I was more referring to how these types of women might feel left out of most of society. This is somewhat from my own experience as a gnc lesbian and an autistic person who grew up in a conservative neighborhood and was alienated. I’ve found amazing community with other women like me in college, but when I was younger I was bullied for not being like most of the other girls at my school.
You can still state your experience! People won’t (or, they shouldn’t) think you’re NLOG-ing just for using those particular words. Also, you can ad a caveat to your self history and start a conversation about the ideas presented here, if you would enjoy discussing it. You could also say that you felt you were not like other kids or that you felt you had more in common with boys, or felt criticized/ alone, whatever the case is, if you want to avoid the NLOG phrasing.
I have sympathy for the young pick me's since i believe that sadly most of us had that phase in middle school/high school where we really didnt wanna be "ordinary" but the adult ones at like 20 or older year olds just make me cringe and i feel pity for them lmao
Totally, I witnessed that happen. I was a pick me when I was 13-15, then after high school (so 17/18) I saw many of the girls I ~didn't want to be like~ start showing pick me behaviour. That was a wild time because I realised what I used to be like 😶
Thanks god for addressing the girls who make fun of pick me girls, I watched a TikTok compilation where girls make fun of pick me girls and it really made me depressed, I just thought like the pick me girl term was just a way to create self awareness for us to stop hating on each other, but if you just make fun of every girl who you consider “pick me” then is all the same sh*t, just rebranded on a different way.
As a black afab, we created the term to combat really messed up shit that got ingrained in our community, it did start off as mocking but not in the way you're thinking, the way how cultural norms of pick mes no matter the culture or race does stem from the same traits, but its monvered differently between cultures and for us in the black community so there's a reason why and no it doesn't cause a cycle, I do recommend to go look into how it started because you'll get the picture as to WHY we created the term.
Side note: as someone who read the Gossip Girl books can I just say how much I hated that they made Chuck this “cool guy” in the show when in the books his character was just a total creep everyone only put up with because their parents were friends. I also hate how they completely ruined Vanessa as a character in the show.
I read the first book of the "Twilight" series before the film adaptation, and there it seemed to me that the heroine was described as a beauty who came from a big city to a remote village. She is even called "Bella" to emphasize this. Naturally, all the boys drew attention to such a newcomer. Then they chose this actress for her role, and now every film reviewer cites her as a classic example of a gray mouse that everyone falls in love with, despite the fact that there is nothing remarkable about her
I never read the books, but I could never get over what he did in the first episode and what? We are suppose to just brush it off because he loves Blair?😬
I'm so glad I've finally come across someone talking about how they butchered Vanessa in the show! Everything down to her casting was a disservice to her.
There's nothing wrong with being a pick-me, most will end up having happy fulfilling lives. You just want them to suffer because they are doing something you dislike.
@@cristinarivera5707 Are they sacrificing their own wants and needs if their wants and needs are catering to a man and getting his validation? Not everyone wants to be lonley girl boss with only a dog to keep them company.
I’ve always loved that line from SATC about letting our female friends be our soulmates! I often really do feel like my own female best friends are my soulmates, and it’s funny because most of my “movie moments” have come from them! My best friend heard me mention something I wanted three years ago and gifted it to me this Christmas! Moments like that make me feel special and loved (and I didn’t have to change myself around her to feel “worthy”). I also do sympathize with the “pick me” girl because as the video stated we’ve all been there at some point. I can definitely remember times where I’d laugh extra hard or try to fit a manic pixie dream girl image to impress a crush (CRINGE LOL). This video just makes me grateful to have true girlfriends now who love me as I am. Also, they remind me that if you have to pretend to be someone else for a person to like you, they are NOT for you :)
I feel I used to slide into that mentality quite naturally, I wasn't necessarily acting, I was just really pleased to meet someone new, but other people accused me of this. Like, if you are into someone, you will laugh extra hard for them anyway, it isn't necessarily an act.
My sister...I think she is my soulmate. She is my best friend and my family wrapped in one and we have grown together, made so many mistakes, got married, had kids but I still believe she is the one person who just gets me effortlessly.
My BFF is absolutely my soul mate. When she came out as trans over a decade ago, my response was, "Yeah, that makes total sense." When I came out to her as non-binary a good number of years later, her response was, "Ha! So you *finally* figured it out!" We're siblings who didn't grow up together, but still absolutely there for each other. Sometimes we just tell people we're married as a joke, or for a discount. If I didn't see her as a sister, I damn well *would* marry her!
I was friends with a pick me girl, and let me tell you, it is annoying! This girl would always try to look pretty and always ditched me the second she got a whiff of male approval. She would even lie to me about dressing to go to a party, so while I was casual, she was glammed out looking her best. The thing that ended it though, is when she slept with a guy I told her I liked and then told me he wasn't interested in me while still talking about the sexual encounter. If what I describe is someone you know, be careful people! Stay on your toes.
That’s the main problem I have with Pick-Meism. At some point you end up betraying the other women in your life because you see them all as competition. I’m sorry that happened to you.
I used to be one of those "not like the other girls" in college. I judged other girls for being basic like jeans and a cute top was sooo basic and too normie for me. I was a raver and convinced myself that girls that didnt do what i did, listen to obscure music, or dress wild like i did were boring and lame and that i was the one all the guys wanted. How fucking nuts I was.
Well, I think I never really found anyone who was into the crap I was into. Not even guys for sure. But that resulted in a great deal of depression. They wanted stuff that I didn't want, like I swear I started college at 17 because I got put into school early as a kid (Not gonna go into details, but it wasn't right imo) and some of these girls wanted to get married at that age. Not judging them, but that was so not me. I feel like all my life I was at the wrong place, with the wrong people. Caused me to have depression and anxiety, I really didn't want to live (Not as in I wanted to die, but as in I saw no point in living because there was no joy in the people I met or where my life was heading). I feel like being not like everyone else is not being associated with feeling... Not right. It's being associated with either being cool or trying to put other people down, when in reality it should signal personal issues that one must try to work through.
@@samf.s.7731 I completely agree with you. Not fitting in or not feeling present is an incredibly isolating experience. Not having people to connect with can manifest in loneliness and resentment. Hope you are in a better place now.
I'm a former NLOG, and I don't think it really matches with pick-me behavior. Mine was motivated by the smart label, in conjunction with my sister being a lovable academic alpha bitch. She was sporty (figure skating), girly, outgoing, and smart, plus much older, and it left me feeling that I didn't have a lane, because she took all the good ones. So I became a classic black-wearing, book-devouring, makeup-eschewing, intentionally geeky NLOG. So what if my sister beat me in all the classically feminine ways? I don't care, because I'm not like other girls. It was never about male approval, it was an attempt to find some worth in a sister dynamic that left me feeling like I was always in second place. In the decade since, I've thankfully moved out of the NLOG mindset, embraced my feminine interests, and my relationship with sister has much improved. We both had to grow and learn that while we are fundamentally different, neither of us is morally superior because of those differences.
You weren't a NLOG. NLOG puts down other women and women's activities...you just wanted to be different and get noticed by your parents and friends! I was like that too
The pick me phase is like a rite of passage before you mature and realize other women were never the problem, our desire to be regarded as beings with substance stems from patriarchal teachings. While we can and should educate pick-mes, we need to extend them some grace because everyone who perpetuates misogyny are victims of it first.
Personally I feel like we should be trying to be superior to who we were yesterday. The only person we should ever compare ourselves to is ourselves in the past. Look at who you were in the past and if you are embarrassed or you cringe at your behavior that's great! That means you have made so much progress as a person that you are horrified by your previous behavior that's a good thing. If you are better, smarter, more disciplined, more self-confidence, closer to your goals, than you were last year or 5 years ago or 10 years ago then you are going in the right direction. We all move at our own pace. Comparing yourself to other people is like only driving your car by looking at the rear view mirror. You will never get to where you want to go if you are constantly looking back at other people and focusing on what they are doing. Focus on what you are doing. You can't live your life looking backwards. It doesn't matter whether anyone else likes you. The only thing that matters is that YOU like YOU. You're the one who has to live with yourself for the rest of your life. And that's how you should make all of your decisions. Will I regret doing this in 10 years? Will I regret not doing this in 10 years? You shouldn't be trying to be superior to other women. You should be trying to be superior to who you were last year, last week, yesterday. Even if your progress is slow, life isn't a race. And if you take one step forward every year in the direction you want to go. You are winning at life. What's that saying that the race of life is long and wide. It doesn't matter who meets milestones first or what other women are doing all that matters is what YOU are doing.
I agree with all of this! Except the last sentence, I wanted to clarify your point. Earnest question from a male who's seeking to learn how far misogyny goes, do you think that even men who perpetuate misogyny are victims of it first, too? I personally thought men are brainwashed into misogyny because dehumanizing women maintains their social status "above" women in the hierarchy, and isn't a direct cause of experiencing misogyny, even indirectly.
In high school I was an insane anti-feminist and men's activist. It even got me into friend groups where we thought making jokes with slurs we're okay. I'm ashamed of that phase of my life and am so happy to be supported by and supporting other women.
You should speak publicly about how wrong you were and how you came to recognize how wrong you were. People don’t listen to those who never made the same mistakes they did. You can change more minds of those still mired in the muck by explaining your epiphany than others who never felt that way could.
@@nataliaalfonso2662 that's a really good idea. I've thought about it before but was scared if getting cancelled tbh. Like, I have told people the way I thought and spoke were wrong, but I know others will say that I'm unforgivable and I don't want it to ruin my life or my family's.
@@smithstoneware well, you Can’t live in fear of getting cancelled. It’s not a real thing anyway. We’re any of the monsters spreading the insanity with which you were brainwashed cancelled? People don’t generally cancel those who come forward after escaping cults or indoctrination. It’s healing and powerful. And yes of course some chronically online assholes are going to pretend they’ve never erred and put you down for having been wrong in the first place. But you’re going to live your life based on the hypothetical possible reactions of insecure losers? Who are lying about being perfect? I think you should speak on it somehow. Or maybe writing about it with a pseudonym would make you more comfortable? It will be good.
@@sunray2.041 feminism does stand up for men’s rights. Men’s rights activists do not. They deflect from accountability and try to pretend the patriarchy doesn’t exist. The patriarchy is horrifically harmful for men as human beings. It’s dehumanizing, objectifying, sees them as worthless if they’re not proving themselves productive and exemplary as “true men.” Feminism also DEFINITELY addresses toxic aspects of femininity. No one ever did before feminists. That’s literally the whole point. It’s feminist addressing how often and how badly and how dangerously snd how murderously women can perpetuate the WORST attributes of patriarchy. Men’s rights activists are not doing that. They’re caught in a maladaptive cycle of victim playing and accountability deflection, which is ironically what they try to accuse feminism of doing. Any one woman, feminist or not, can be horrific. And anybody can go about achieving an idea incorrectly. But as a movement, feminism has only been trying to suggest that women and men, while different as genders and obviously while all individuals who are different within their demographic, deserve equal rights. Suggesting it’s anything else is a bad faith argument. Besides, saying it’s ok to defend men’s rights while no one is trying to enslave them or take away their rights sounds like standing up for defending “white live who matter!” No one is trying to make it ok to enslave white people, or kill them in the street with impunity. No one is trying to control men and police their bodies and restrict their human rights. They’re trying to help get women equal rights. Which we still do not have. Everyone should defend every man’s HUMAN RIGHTS as an individual. But “mEnS rIgHtS AcTivIsM” sounds like a fundraiser for billionaires. Men already have rights. What’s the activism for? It’s crucial to defend black men’s right to life, native men’s right to their land, gay men’s right to love who they want, trans man’s rights to be who they are, and ANY cis straight white’s man’s HUMAN RIGHTS when they are being infringed. Activism isn’t supposed to be to support the mildly inconvenienced who feel that finally being held accountable is the same as being oppressed.
As a Gen X woman, this is my least favorite trait of ours. A lot of us are just starting to distance ourselves from this and lean into things we felt embarrassed to like when we were younger.
As a Millenial who is a former pick me, you'll grow out of it. It's usually due to the fact that you're still young and finding yourself. Good thing is at least your generation is aware of this phenomenon. During my time, we weren't. 😂
What I find a bit frustrating about 'one-of-the-guys' girls in particular is that they have stereotypically male interests and dress in ripped jeans and crap, but you won't see many with zero makeup, baggy clothes that clearly haven't been washed in three days, and when messy, her hair is still stylish and attractive. No 'unladylike' behavior, no slouching, no belching, perfect posture. Nothing that would turn off a potential suitor. Something about it just seems extra fake to me.
My ex cheated on me then left me for an older chick like this. She was the exact description you speak of. She’d post things like “once you make money, you can f*ck anybody boyfriend you want.” Things like that.
@@p994able so basically she's just like all the narcissistic men who think money = entitlement to women. ugh, hope you didn't even want your ex back after that.
Thank you girl I’m just seeing this and hell no he was corny. Mind you, he is 31, she is 37. Both older than me yet so lost, and childish asl. And I LOVE that you shed light on narcissists with money. Because that definitely is a thing. As they were both heavily narcissistic.
It’s good to call out what a Pick Me is, some of anti Pick Me stuff I’ve seen involves quite anti Feminist behaviour like mocking women, even body shaming them and pitting women against each other
Truly, I remember when I was a pick me, it was all about shaming other women because I was jealous and insecure, can't forget about the internalized misogyny as well.
That’s because narcissistic traits are supposed to be grown out of by adulthood. When they are not, it can develop into a disordered personality. Validation seeking, grandiosity, insisting no one can understand them bc they’re so unique, these are all diagnostic criteria for narcissism. Adolescents ARE, rightfully, developmental still narcissistic. They are children. By the time they are older adolescents or young adults it should subside.
@@Cherrycola5555 lesbians can be as desperate for the patriarchal validation of men as straight men are! I’ve known many who derive validation from the number of women they score with, from being seen as tough, from being “one of the guys.” I don’t know you so CSNT claim to know if you’re one of them, but you positing that lesbians can’t be pick mes is absurd and a bad faith argument
Honestly, I came here to say the girls who make these TikTok’s making fun of NLOG’s give off serious pick me vibes themselves. Catty and mean spirited- they’ve made it their entire personality to hate on other women. I’m so glad you pointed it out.
If the declaration "I'm a nerd" is a sign the girl has "male interests," that is a problem. Nerditude is, or should be, gender-neutral, and we need to be working toward that goal. We need to see more and better nerdy-woman representation on-screen -- representation that shows her interest in science fiction and fantasy media does NOT set her apart from the women around her. Nerd girl communities!
No it's not. There no nothing wrong with being a female nerd. I'm not interested in video games because of men. I love these hobbies because it gave girls like me a fantasy escape. I'm a nerd because I'm socially awkward and quirky. I call myself a nerd because I embrace who I am! Iam NOT try to seek male approval. I do this things because I love them! I don't give a damn if a guy is not attracted to me.
I was thinking the same thing. Like, I have always loved dinosaurs, Star Wars, Pokemon, etc. And I have never wanted a man. Why should I get labelled as a "pick me" for genuinely liking what I genuinely like.
Okay but why is it always assumed that women who actually do love “typically male interests” aren’t actually into that stuff? Like why can’t we even imagine women enjoying video games? Why do we just assume it’s always done for male validation? Why can’t we just let people like what they like? Why do we have to assume it’s disingenuous? Liking video games or other “male” hobbies does not automatically mean I don’t support other women and that giant leap in logic baffles me.
My TH-cam name is misleading, I am a woman. But Yeah it's a bit weird. I mean, I grew up with keeping my nerdy and male interests on the down low because I didn't want to be thought of as weird. It wasn't until college that I found there were guys who actually appreciated that. ...THEN I became a pick me in the sense that I knew the power my interests could yield 😒 but the interests were always genuine
Dear Pick-me's, we are all unique in different ways. Thats ok. Doesn't mean you are less of a woman, and not like other women. I guarantee you that you can find other sporty, crude humoured, no make-up wearing, christian women at just stone throws away.
Hold on one second. Why is it that you frame pickmes as those who fall into this particular type of behaviour? It's hilarious because most pickmes are the opposite of this, and are known for trying to promote their sexual attractiveness to get validation from other men. Usually, they'll play into stereotypes men like to fetishize, while also adopting overtly childish, highly approachable behaviour. That's the essence of what a pickme is, and a similar trope is explained by the famous gone girl monologue.
@@olenabogdanov I don't think there's a "general rule" for what a pick me is like... She'll mainly play up a stereotype to get male validation, doesn't matter what it is...
On the bright side, this type of pick me girls usually attract to other anti-feminist men and misogynistic men who are self-centered which think too highly of themselves that their lifestyle are biologically, logically, biblically, traditionally and politically accurate. They were built for each others.
I had a colleague who was an anti fem. she told me to my face that women should not be promoted and all women are incompetent and too emotional. She basically insulted me and everybody I love and respect. Honestly I started to feel sorry for her. My great loves are my girlfriends they support me, they love me at my worsts. Not having girlfriends in your life is punishment enough.
Tried so hard to be a Pick Me girl in high school and at the beginning of college, but realized it's kind of a futile endeavor for anyone who isn't white, thin, or pretty.
Yes I agree! At my high school there were two "pick me " girls. One was very attractive and the other was not. All the boys liked the attractive one, while making fun of the other, even though they had the same problematic behaviour. I personally didn't like any of them and I hope that they are doing well now and have left that mentality in their past.
I feel like being a pick-me girl doesn't guarantee that you'll get picked. Being conventionally attractive and a male fantasy is more important to them. As a black girl, my pick-me phase went completely unnoticed, I was always a good friend to them. Good thing I realized that my girl friends were just like me and I could be myself with them without worrying about looking for attention. Skippable Edit: I just want to clarify that I no longer need the validation on my femininity. I'm a woman in my own way and I don't think being picked would be a good thing. My insecurities would've still been present if I got picked because that's something I needed to work on by myself.
Not being interested in makeup doesn't make you a pick me girl . It's not about what you like or don't like. It's the reason behind it. If you don't like makeup because it's just not your thing , or because you think women are so much beautiful without it and you don't like that women are pressured to put it, then great. But if you don't put it because you want to stand out and make the guys think you're better than other girls , then there lies the problem. It's all about doing something ,not wrong , to please men and make other women look inferior to you . That's the essence of the " pick me girl ". I personally find makeup so fun , but I find women's natural beauty more captivating. And i think that having natural long nails and natural eyelashes is more beautiful. And women need to know that feeling not good enough and not beautiful enough without makeup is internalised misogyny . I hear lots of people around me say that men's beauty is natural when instead , women should put fake nails , fake eyelashes and lipstick to compensate for their ugly faces . They put difficult beauty standards on women , and when women stick to these standards , they call them fake. Women should do whatever they want and be their true selves for THEMSELVES. Not for anybody else.
I admit that I was a pick me back in high-school and college. I had a lot of internalized misogyny. I was also afraid of being stereotyped as a angry ghetto black women so I tried really hard to “ not be like other girls”. I didn’t realize it was wrong until I was called out on it and I went to therapy.
Love this vulnerability, thanks for sharing! As they said, we all want to be liked and often will appeal to those that want to like us even if it isn't genuine. I'm glad you took some action to care for yourself and find a way through it.
hope you feel better now. i know from being a black girl myself this happened to many of us, but the think is that i learn how to love my mental health more than people's opinions about my color, my body, my dress or my faith. PS: sorry for spelling mistakes, i'm steal learning English ( i'm a Frensh Girl) God bless you and happy new year yall
Personnally, I have more guys friends and I am a woman. I have very good female friends tho. But many of my friends are guys. I don't see any thing wrong about that and I don't think I'm a pick me. I'm just the way I am. I get along with people with who I have a good connection. That's it. Actually, this term is not clear to me.
This one has to be me, I just ended up in more male circles in life than female, but I also have plenty of female friends because I basically love everyone I meet. This was never intentional and whenever I start dating a guy, I eventually have to break it to them that he'll have to get along with them and know that these guys are important to me. So what I want to say is that I really don't think it makes sense to put things in this bubble of what is normal for guys or not, like being friends with guys when you're pretty. From my experience, every guy is kinda different and I can't conclusively state that looks are a factor for who they like to be friends with.
The tiktok pick me creators always show situations, where the dudes dont ever say anything when the pick me is misogynistic or flat out abusive/ cruel to their female friends or girlfriends. Like why do you only hate on the pick me girl and NEVER on the dudes that love the attention they get from the pick me and let them be cruel to their friends/ partners? OOOOH YEA.. its (internalized) misogyny again. Those tiktok creators and their audience once again wanna feel better than other women because "they dont care about male validation" and that makes them cooler. Yes being a woman, especially a straight woman is very complicated in how much you are expected to serve the male gaze while still being independent and "not caring" about male attention. But damn, this is a misogyny catch 22.
I came across the ultra pick me girl in London once. She was on a date with a man (probably a new relationship) and was all dolled up and turned her nose at getting into the same train carriage with me and was loud about it. I wasn't dressed up at the time as probably on my way back from my parents' home or going to an evening class but now I realise she was hostile towards female strangers on their own and who hadn't done anything to her in order to impress her new man. Excuse me but I don't have to be all dolled up everywhere I go, especially on a cold winter's night, and have a man in tow to escape this inexcusable behaviour. It's good that I can now re-evaluate this situation instead of making excuses for her.
I don’t have tiktok but the footage they show here is just as problematic showing girls expressing negative thoughts or toxic behaviours online towards other “pick me” girls. There is absolutely no need for that and is just a different form of seeking validation just from a different audience.
No men definitely get pitted against each other alot. It's also in eof the reason some men are so hostile to women that defy feminine expectations of not being social, economic or physical threats to them because that means they will have even more competition. One of the reasons of sexism is even to erase women as social, economic and physical competition to men which is why traditional and patriachal ideology and people react to negatively and aggressively to women challenging and defying gender norms because it would break their system and mode of source of human exploitation. That's hey they panic so bad at feminisim because that would mens they'd have to compete against the whole planet instead of only men (and also lose free labour and favourable bias toward them that helps them).
It’s so funny coz all these labels are for heterosexual women… there are none for LGBTQ women or men. Personally I find these labels a bit of a continuation of sexism. It’s one thing to say a “pick-me” is anti-feminist, maybe we should say the labels themselves are anti-feminist. Feminisms used to be encouraging all women to be able to be who they are
Loved it!! It's so sad how much I saw "not like other girls" as a compliment as a girl. Now I am like if you can't compliment me without insulting my entire gender I don't want it.
There was another TH-camr who mentioned that sometimes the "Pick Me" may be a pick-me because of a survival technique. She brought up a woman who maybe in an abusive relationship and doing the things to not get attacked or the girl who says she hates girly things because her environment is toxic as all hell.
That's a good point. Your comment makes me think of some of the mohogany pink videos with regards to environment, safety and femininity. I'll have to reflect on that thought some more.
As a recovering pick me, this video deeply resonated with me. I love how The Take called out some of our favorite TV characters for their pick-me behavior. I remember internalizing Meredith Grey, Blair Waldorf, Serena van der Woodsen, Carrie Bradshaw and Charlotte York’s love stories hoping I can emulate that to find my dream guy. I also internalized Katherine Heigl’s rom coms as the ultimate romance bible. It takes time to unlearn “pick me” behavior. However, the journey of self love helps you understand the greatest love is yourself.
Thanks for saying that about Bella/Tessa/Anastasia etc because i always found ironic that they are deliberately generic in order to girls to see themselves as them BUT they are also told to be "not like other girls" and is too weird, bella is a sad case since i´ve seen a lot of twilight fangirls who indentify with Bella despite that if Bella was real /if a girl like Bella existed, she wouldn't like her own fans
Informative video but I disagree with Blair's inclusion. The "3 words, 8 letters" line wasn't about Blair wanting to be chosen. She ALREADY knew Chuck loved her, his inability to say it to her (he already admitted his feelings to other characters) was about Chuck's problem with being vulnerable because of his complicated relationship with his dad/lack of family. It had nothing to do with other women 🤨 And, Blair left with another guy when he didn't say it in that scene...so I don't believe she fits this narrative 🤷🏾♀️
Yes she does. She's always making misogynistic and slut shaming comments to other women, but stays with a man who is a sexual predator and makes excuses for him. And when he was being sued for sexually harassing his employees, she just takes his side and calls the women gold diggers, despite the fact that she already knew about his rape victims. And how she banished Jenny, who was a minor at the time, for having sex with Chuck but didn't get mad at him. Also, she pretends to be independent and all that but is always relying on and gives up her future for this man. Same thing with Nate and Serena, she hates Serena but has no problem being with the guy who cheated on her with her own best friend. Blair has always been shown to care more about how men see her and throws women under the bus
@@gensai93 Clearly you didn't watch the show 🤣. Blair has always been the hardest on herself. All of the female characters have insulted each other throughout the entire series - and Blair insulted Dan throughout the show as well. And the sexual assault allegations against Chuck were made up by Jack. Save your paragraphs for someone who will buy it 🥱
Blair had massive internalized misogyny(99% of the female characters on that show did tbh) hence why she bullied, slutshamed and harrassed other girls in her school.
@@HereIAmInYourLife I completely disagree. Blair was definitely a mean girl BUT she was mean to whomever was in her way. All of the people she idolized were female (i.e. idolized certain female professors or businesses women). Whenever a male got in her way she treated them with the same sass (i.e. manipulated Cyrus when she believed he wasn't good enough for her mom, and battled Dan when they were interns together, she's gone head-to-head with Chuck a few times etc.). Being mean to girls doesn't make you a misogynist...this is a much more nuanced topic 🙄
For most of middle and high school, i was a pick me and it’s crazy to think about how I use to act. I remember I would try to center around myself with guys and having to hate my female peers b/c they were acting girly and liked all the things I wasn’t interested at the time. However, while I acted like I didn’t care about being like the other girls, I was lonely and didn’t really have anyone to confide with. I was a girl who was constantly seeking external validation from others and felt like I wasn’t good enough for anyone. Now, as an adult, I have a better understanding of myself and continue to work through my issues of low self-esteem and not compare myself to others.
Thank you for acknowledging at the BEGINNING of the video how this concept of "pick-me-ism" actually having it's roots in the Black community. Before the word was co-opted to mainstream society (kind of like the concept of being 'cancelled' which also had its start on, you guessed it...Black Twitter!!) Black Twitter was the forum that allowed us to call out some of the crazy male-worshipping behaviors that many of us don't even realize because its such the norm in our community, especially in the church. Because historically, Black women (in America at least) have gotten the short end of the stick when it comes to options for dating within our race-- i.e. our own men abandon us by dating out when they reach a certain level of success/status, leaving us to deal with men who are less than desirable-- we have no choice but to be independent, go to school get and education so we can take care of ourselves. But then we get labeled as "too independent" or "aggressive" or "masculine" for getting it on our own. As a result, many women have to make a choice and if they want a man/family they need to downplay themselves quite a bit in order to make a man who is probably nowhere near her level feel better about himself, just so they can say they have a man. But I'm glad things are changing and women are realizing having a man for the sake of having a man isn't the flex it used to be
Thank you for pointing out that the trope of those Tiktok girls making fun of the "not like other girls" girls are, in fact, doing the exact same thing. "Look how cool and relatable I am for tearing down the group of women who are also tearing down another group of women by trying to be cool and relatable." We all go through the "not like other girls" phase because society (in every era) puts women into a box of liking the same things, then they make fun of us for liking those things - this is where we get the basic bitch label. When I grew up it was Starbucks, Tiffany charm bracelets and Ugg boots. Nobody's all the 'basic bitch' things, and nobody wants to be one of a hundred colours in a box - so we go through the phase where we rebel against it and tell people we're not like that, not realising that puts us in another kind of box.
Thank you for this wonderfully educational video ESPECIALLY highlighting AAVE and the history of the “pick-me” girl in Black culture. You guys are truly the best.
I can’t believe I’m watching this for free, everything in this video is perfect! The references, tweets, movies, series, celebrities, TikToks this is extensive work! Thank you
Definitely went through that- but during teenage I think both boys and girls try to feel special and are quite immature in the process. I still relate to my teenage self now when trying to fit in a group of girls though, daaamn It's hard :/
Being autistic, when I went through my “cool girl/pick me” phase I ended up aquiring up lifelong hobbies/obsessions from getting into activities specifically to be more likable to guys and I’m so glad because COD Nazi Zombies in particular will never not be fun
Ugh, I just flashed back to how I was in high school. I knew I wasn't the most attractive, and yet I thought I should have plenty of male attention because "Oh, I'm smart, I can sing, I have love in my heart" - never mind that I was seriously stuck-up. I'm fortunate I had friends who loved me anyway. Edit - for reference, I didn't end up dating until college, and I think it's because I had to get knocked down a few pegs.
Lmao no you sound awesome and self aware😂😂 I feel the same way about myself but not about dating, but about friends...My mom was judgmental as hell and gossiped about all our neighbours and how they all have horrible hair and are overweight, so I dragged that arrogant attitude with me to school, I don't think I'm unattractive, but before I was bearable to keep around as a friend, I had to be humbled by how arrogant and annoying I was.
Haha, you actually thought that? That’s crazy. I have never liked a girl more because she could sing, be smart, and has love in her heart. I like a tone-deaf, dumb, hateful bitch as long as she is hot
I definitely had a NLOG phase, because I didnt FEEL LIKE I fit in with other girls who I felt were girlier than I was. I also felt pressure from family to perform femininity in a way that didnt come naturally to me. It made me insecure, so I wore being a tomboy as a badge of honor. Although, I'm still not too girly, Ive let go of that image and I'm just myself. As an "elder" millennial I feel like alot of us went through that phase, especially growing up in the 2000s. I think fanfiction culture also contributed to that, because you have women who felt like I did, writing these stories that glorify the Mary Sue/Pick me type, and rewards that character with a impossibly hot love interest. In the moment it felt empowering, but looking back, it wasnt....
I understand that. It wasn't me who didn't want to be like other girls, it was other girls 'othering' me - girls I really did want to be friends with. It wasn't until college I was able to meet more women and develop any female friendships. But before that - what do you do? As a kid, you don't have the freedom to move or change your environment so you're stuck with a small-minded area of girls and maybe they don't accept you.
I feel you, this "i am not like the other girls" phase i had was definitely because i felt misfit. My family is a conservative one, so you see it's a lot of pressure to look like a barbie doll, it felt so wrong me trying to relate to that, all my cousins were feminine and stuff and when i tried to look like that seemed like i was trying too hard, plus my sexuality was a huge obstacle too. I am a adult now and learned how to councilliate a lot of those feelings of misfit, and now that sexuality and other things are more acceptable it's easier to not feeling so different.
I wasnt girlier either and my mother always tried (and still to this day doesnt respect me as a person whatsoever) to be what she wanted, buying me stuff she likes but I dont,my room pink my bedsheets flowers clothing I dont like etc but she does. And at the era it was harder to find things in general that I liked or where i fit in (as oppose to today where theres so much available and blendee). As much as I also did other things for male approval to feel special or accomplished, I also think some of it stemmed from not being loved from my family and needing that love elsewhere. Through the pick me things, I definitely found somethings I like and dislike and I'm grateful for that experience.
This really hurt. We can all recount having a pick me moment but the end that talks about female friendships broke my heart. My best friend of +12 years have "split" due to her putting 100% of her efforts in her relationships (IMO) and not putting in just 10% of that into our friendship. This woman could lie, fly to another country, cheat and borrow money for her boyfriends but she struggled to catch a 2hour train to come visit for a weekend and she'd disguise it as me "asking too much from her" she was one of my last strong female friendships and while I have a lot of male friends who are great people, I do miss the fun that came with being around other women. Its just harder to make friends as an adult now but my friendships with men seem less affected by romance. Maintaining female presence in my life has become very difficult lately and I don't know how to fix it.
Thank you! Thank you thank you. For the quick coverage of how it has changed over time. The same people who point out pick me girls, end up being pick me girls based on their criticism. And now everyone is a pick me girl… just because you don’t agree. If definitions keep changing it shard to know exactly what it is. There needs to be a criteria and behaviour that this “trope” follow and that socially defined if we’re going to keep using it. And if not, let’s stop using it as a insult. The women vs women things is getting very annoying. I always viewed a pick me as someone who values women based on a male validation and perspectives. For the life of me I can’t seem to figure out how these women enjoy misogyny and sexism (but if you value traditional roles for yourself and don’t tell other women what to do - I don’t think your a pick me).
We absorb a lot of this media as children, and as someone who went through this phase at a young age and is climbing out of it, I can say it felt validating seeing all that media because a lot of the time, girls who weren't traditionally feminine were made fun of and bullied.
I love your channel, it has help me a lot to see the world and life in general in a different perspective, to be more understanding and supportive of others and also feel confident of who I am and what I want in life, thank you so much and keep up the good work , greetings from Bogotá - Colombia
So I had a friend who changed her personality and interests based on who she was hanging out with, it was blatantly obvious with the guys she dated. I'm not sure if she falls under "pick me" or "cool girl" because she changed each time. I definitely tried to boast "not like other girls" in highschool during the early 2000's. I liked comic books and Broadway musicals and it didn't seem to be as mainstream. Though I did reach out to my friends to borrow their CDs so I could listen to more popular music and connect with others.
The funny thing about the ''not like the other girls'' trope is that a lot of guys think that this is something that you as a girl want to hear. But the funny thing is that a part of growing up is understanding that you are so ''basic'' but it isn't a bad thing, but a universal part of being human.
Def was a NLOG type of pick me from middle school-25ish. Not proud of it, but happy to be over that phase. I was so insecure and could only feel valid/worthy through male attention (which also fueled my ED in my teens.) I’m so happy that young women and girls are seeing true healthy female friendships on screen. 💜
The most dangerous is the wifey, I tried that out and I got abused behind closed doors and left stranded by my own judgements. The friends I made were all fake, I wasted so many good titty years on thanklessly cleaning up after a guy who I no longer speak to.
Also that trying to get Pike to like her was not her goal at all… he just happens to be the one who likes her authentic self. Her goal is to save her friends from vampires.
One of the entire points of Buffy was that she *was* a normal girl who just happened to have superpowers and a "chosen one" identity that she didn't want! Her struggles to try and balance a normal life with her duties as the Slayer were what made the show and the character interesting in the first place. And she never acted like a "pick me" girl - the first person she befriended in Sunnydale, who became her BFF throughout the entire series, was shy, nerdy Willow, rather than cool, rich, Cordelia, because she could see who the better person was. She never left Cordelia to the monsters, either, though she had plenty of opportunities to do so. Buffy was just a stand up girl.
I'm going to have to defend against "To All the Boys" being included in this, female friendship and sisterhood is uplifted in the series and in the end Laura Jean does not let "getting picked" take over her life.
Went through a pick me phase and I found it empowering when people called me "a man". Turns out I was just trying to impress the girls more than the boys but made a fool out of myself in the process. It's all thanks to my reading habits I realised how wrong my mentality was and how much society antagonises feminity. The me who used to find it an insult to be even called a girl now takes pride in the way god created me. I love myself and will never belittle my fellow women for the way they are.
Glad you noted that the pick me term originated with black people/black twitter, particularly black women - Like most popular trends do to be honest☕️😏
I was THOROUGHLY confused at all the white examples in this video lol but I am glad they pointed out where it started (I guess). I know the take focuses on movies/shows but I think this video would look much different had they used examples from social media.
Say it for the ones in the back! Most things that are part of pop culture were originated from black content. The harlem shake is another prime example. Honestly I find it disgusting but everything about black people are used for other gains, even black women looks.
It's crazy how much movies have influenced us, I always admired the vulnerability in those scenes with Meredith Grey, and Julia Robert's (my best friends wedding), I would even cry, thinking maybe one day I'd have that type of courage. I actually went thru a major "pick me" faze in high school, "teardrops on my guitar" was my theme song, really the entire fearless album was lol. But then I went thru a bad feminist, hating every guy faze, that was based on the lack of male attention, and yet still a desire to get it. Finally at 28, I can say I feel my most authentic, and that doesn't change regardless of which gender I'm around. I hope all the other "pick me" girls come out on the other side, but to insult them in order for them to see the truth doesn't help anyone.
I agree! Ironically some women who call other women “pick mes” simply for liking stereotypically “male” interests are the ones who are actually bringing down other women. I’ve been called a pick me not because I was ever putting anyone else down, but simply because I was just vibing and enjoying things I enjoyed. I hope someday we get to a place where we don’t gender interests and we can all just like what we like without anyone insulting each other for it.
There was a time when I was a Pick-me. I got into manga because the guy I fancied was into it but you know what? I don't regret it. Manga saved my life and it's carried me through until today.
Out of curiosity you say you used to be one, because you liked Manga? Is it because you first pretended to like it for male attention, but then actually started to like it? Because isn’t the definition of a “pick me” someone who believes that makes them somehow better than other women? So I hope you still love Manga but are no longer a pick me because you don’t believe that makes you any better than any other woman, but you can still freely enjoy any hobby or interest you like. :)
@@loverrlee No, I was one because I took up an interest and played it up to get the attention of a guy (didn't work). But yeah, in those days, I did put myself above other women but, in my own defense, a lot of those girls were bullying bitches. I still absolutely adore manga and anime. At present, I have more manga volumes than I have clothes!
I always end your videos with a smile on my face and a more positive outlook on life overall. Not to mention feeling a lot more informed and skeptical of the media Im consuming each day. Thank you for what you do.
The most annoying thing about pick mes is how they limit us. I love video games and fashion and nails and makeup and action movies and a whole variety of other things. I don’t appreciate my hobbies being forced into “normal girl” and “pick me”, especially to please some lowlife boys lmao I’m very proud of being a girl’s girl, and I don’t think liking sports or fighting takes away from that in any way. Poor pickmes will hopefully realize we contain multitudes someday
THANK YOU! I hate that I had to scroll WAY down to see your comment. I love all kinds of hobbies/interests! I really don’t like how the definition of a pick me has devolved from “a woman who puts down other women to impress a man” to “a woman who enjoys x, y, and z, assumably for male approval.” Like bro, I can like Barbies and pink and makeup AND Video games and fast food?? And I can like those things for myself, and not for anyone else’s approval? Like why do we have to limit ourselves so much? Why are people always put into these rigid binary boxes? Why can’t we just like what we like without it meaning something else?
Yeah I think this video misses the point in one important thing, the Pick-Me is a Pick-Me because she harms other women, whether it's to tear them down in comparison, defending men over women or being misogynistic. To add NLOGs aren't always pick-me's, all pick-me's are NLOGs but not all NLOGs are pick-me's eg Zoya isn't really a pick-me she's a self-righteous NLOG.
Not necessarily. A pick me is a state of mind too. it's a woman that feels validated by being chosen. A good example is Carrie from S3x and the City or Grey from Grey's Anatomy never put down women but they definitely wanted to be chosen
@@ms.bubs4fun506 grey never wanted to be chosen.. She only said " Pick me " To Derek coz she fell heads over heels for him. Hell..she was a no strings attached person who pick guys from bars.
Literally just watched the end of Mean Girls and was crying because its an inspiration to young woman and how we should love each other rather than hate.
I think that it is important that we not vilify young girls who go through this kind of phase if they aren't mistreating others, however I do think it is important to directly call out this kind of behavior when it leads to others being mistreated. It's really no different then any other kind of behavior, no one can stop you from cultivating habits that may prove to be directly destructive to you, but the minute these habits start causing you to abuse and/or bully other women/people just so that you can feel less insecure in a moment is when you deserve to be called out for being the kind of pick me who is also a bully/user/abuser.
But of course if she is a pick me it's implied that she doesn't respect other women or puts them down so she looks better!. There are not picks me that doesn't hurt other women
@@kahkah1986 yes it's kinda sad because it says how much this young girls hace selfsteem issues just to prove they are enough,I also think the parents are kinda responsable..
Thanks for showing recognition of where the term comes from... didn't realize people outside of my black girlfriends/ black twitter were using this term. Shocked to see it's now popular slang lolll
Just be you and you'll find someone for you. I hate the " pick me" hate because it puts girls who are truly like that look bad for not being the" hot popular girl." I don't wear make up, bit of a line and I get along better with guys and play video games but it's not for acceptance of men it's just who I am. We as women shouldn't hate on each other regardless of how we are approved by men. If you ever feel like you are acting a certain way for acceptance stop it as soon as you realize it. It's not worth it just be you.
This is what I find most concerning about the whole calling other women “pick mes.” Because I’ve been called a “pick me” simply for saying I enjoy certain things, and I never once put another woman down, but ironically I was being put down for liking what I like? I like video games (and pink and makeup) and I swear that I just like these things because I like them, not for some weird “male approval.” Why does me simply existing have to be about men anyway? Why can’t we just like what we like without that having some different meaning?
I grew up with my brothers and if I wanted someone to play with the majority of my neighborhood was boys, I didn't have a choice. The girls were too young or too old.
@@loverrlee Okay, listen, no offense but I hate when people do this just because the term got out of hand due to people using it in situation when its not supposed to be used, pick me hate stemmed from internalized misogyny that got way out of hand in the black community, not whatever y'all are thinking. Pick mes within our culture actually did real harm and it never spreaded to stigmatized people who are like OP, and we were trying to call that out/start getting afab within the community to wake up, black afabs who literally talked down to other afabs and pointed out how they were better because they were married and went on fucking soap boxes about how we should even sacrifice their children just to keep a man, and it doesn't help that afabs within our community are already stigmatized as the least attractive women due to race so having a husband and being a token/pick me is already badly ingrained in us due to microaggressions against us. And I can go on and on about how badly this shit is, but please, look into WHY the term started before saying stuff like this. We did not create this to hate other afab or anything like OP is saying, we did this create unity among us and it worked FOR US, the term only got out of hand when it was spreaded among people outside of our community.
What I hate is that in the books Arya is not an nlog, she acknowledges that she is different than Sansa but does not pretend to be better than her for it. The tv show writers made her like that.
I'm so glad the not-pick-me's were called out!! At this point it's no longer about us women realizing that we all went through that phase, the whole internet is on it and guys joke about pick me's as well. So if you want to male validation you have to not be a pick me, which essentially makes you a pick me. It all boils down to that quote of Margaret Atwood: "Even pretending you aren’t catering to male fantasies is a male fantasy:
A cousin recently had a break up with a guy who used to say she "is not like other girls". They dated for years, and aa month after the break up, he was with a girl she considered "promiscuous". She was obviously wrong to think that about others, but i felt bad for her... She was really depressed for a long time. In a way, she is also the victim here. She was taught, if she was a "good girl", she would get the guy, which made her pain worse and her life more difficult in many ways... So we should try to see pick me girls as victims of sexism, just as much as the girls they hate on.
This happened to me...wasted thousands of dollars, time and energy being the pick me and years later he still won't say I love you and we're on the verge of breaking up...
Yep, so true. The thing about the other girl is she probably put her boundaries clear and he respected her for that. :) I feel bad for your cousin tho, i hope she finds peace and a better guy 🤗🤗🤗 all love
it’s very concerning that when people “call out” the pick me girl they expose their own internalized misogyny when they make fun of these girls, when really they should be helping them find their own self worth outside of male validation. When women make fun of and denounce “pick me girls” they are inviting the male onlooker to jeer at the “pick me” as well.
I was definitely an NLOG once upon a time. I'm really glad I grew out of it (mostly. I think we all exhibit this behavior sometimes, as it's so ingrained in us to be pleasing to men), because internalized misogyny sucks.
Internalized bigotry (whether for skin color, gender, species, etc.) is a scary thing to see. You have those like Serena Joy who have this cruel sense of feeling their internalized bigotry is just and right, that what they're doing is the righteous thing to do. Unfortunately, some will see these things as good. Whether in reality or in fiction (which is still terrifying as to the meaning fiction has) some see those who enact on their internalized bigotry is right and good, ex. Serena Joy, Blade, Issac (until he changes), etc.
I can wholeheartedly say that I was a "not like other girls" girl in high school and after. It was deep seated, internalized misogyny that made me associate anything feminine with weak, less than and undesirable. It got worse after high school when my two closest female friends and myself, drifted apart at the time. One was due to her finding Jesus and the other was geographical. I was left with all of my male friends from our group, so yeah, it got worse. I can say that I have completely changed, just wished it hadn't taken till my late 20's early 30's to figure it out. I'm a huge fan of letting people do whatever makes them happy as long as they're not hurting themselves or other people.
I have been called a pick me since yr 3. The girls in my class bullied me, and the guys literally had my back. I genuinely like video games but no matter what, I still get called a pick me for saying that, or talking to guys. I am very much for womens rights, and I now have many female friends. I know this sounds very pick me, but it’s something that I always have to deal with.
Thank you so much for crediting black culture and how these are 2 overlapping but separate things. A pick me and a NLOGs are very similar, but started in different cultural settings.
This is a great and comprehensive video :) I would say though that there are girls who hold strong views and anyone who doesn't like that can just call her a pick-me girl as a way of shutting her up. It's also sexist to think that she can't come to those opinions on her own and is just saying them to attract guys.
The Take is truly a genius channel and whoever picks or research these subjects is/are a genius(es)... I learn so much about movies and culture from this one TH-cam channel.
It would have been great if you spoke on pickme mothers who prefer having sons & favour their sons and treat their daughters bad because they’re girls. Internalised misogyny is a big part of it. Hopefully women will stop centring men and start finding value in themselves and other women ❤️
When I was young I always wanted to have boys instead of girls because, I thought they would be easier to raise. Thank God I left that mindset behind me.
@@taniar2739 you would be surprised how often I see this mind set. "Boys are easy to raise, why they practically raise them selves after a certain age." "Ugh, Girls are rough! Just the worst! They are so whiny and emotional and you have to keep after them and guide them more than boys. And expensive! You got to treat them like princesses or they whine. So much more work! Had a girl in my class tell me that if she ever had a daughter than she would cry and be disappointed. SMDH
I totally would've been a pick-me in high school, if the term existed in 2008. I went to a girls school, and with undiagnosed autism, I was painfully hermione granger-like, eager to please and share all this interesting knowledge (not, as people believed, to make other people feel stupid, I just didn't understand how I came across) as well as being a year younger than everyone else due to skipping a grade. I think part of the reason I was a pick-me, is that I conciously saw all that I was told girls should be, the sum of "what a girl should be like" and I was painfully aware that I was nothing like that at all, and I was certain even trying would fail, and I'd be relentlessly bullied for it. Thus, as an avenue for self protection, I went violently the other way.... and just a bit too much the other way, to the point it probably even bordered on misogyny. To me, other girls were stupid, vapid, shallow and yes, makeup was something only "skanky girls" wore, and the idea of dating and conforming was giving up on gender equality. If a guy deserved me, they'd come to me, and because none came it just proved I was better than other girls, because instead they were all my friends, because having a "boyfriend"? I think the hell not, said 15 year old me. I'm nearing 30 now, and for me it's very easy to see the intense damage behaving like that, as a pick-me girl, has really altered my life, and I absolutely think that it affects me to this day, because it influenced the path I'd take. Thus, I've never seriously dated *anyone*. I've never even kissed, at the practically geriatric, millennial twenty-eight (my brother, a zoomer at ten years my junior meanwhile has already gone through two girlfriends, with whom he absolutely kissed). Ironically,I actually got really into makeup because of youtube in my mid twenties. I guess that, once I realised that I'm a girl, and I'm ok with that---because there is NO right way to be a girl so I could just *be* just am---it became a lot easier to acknowledge that wanting a relationship and a family and perhaps more traditional things (that I used to believe admitting to was worse than death), because "normal girls" did that, and I didn't want that like because "those girls" did too.... it was, well... well, it was ok of I wanted those things too. Iit was definitely a big realisation, to say the least. I've always struggled with female friendships, and that kind of thinking from my teens---which was absolutely supported and intrenched by media---held me back so much it's unreal, and I needed to stop hating other women.... mainly, in fact, because I was using it as an escape or a decoy for the fact that I was directing most of that anger at other girls for things I wanted, and it was because I hated myself too, and maybe more than them. ((It's annaddendum that I have to add.... the worst friendship group I've ever, ever had---it was catty, shallow, rude, judgemental and unbelievably cruel, mostly by going after the relationships I had with others, and trying to discredit me to those others---was made up of, yup, completely guys, with me as the only girl. I've never had anywhere near the level of any of that with the girl groups I've been part of, and it goes to show that girls aren't my enemy......And that boys are stupider, send them to Jupiter! (jk!!......... I think)
The warning sign to me with real or fictional women is when they say, "I don't have any female friends," or "women just hate me." What usually follows is some deeply troubling misogyny about women being too dramatic or catty or frivolous or jealous. While I really appreciate my male friends, my female friends understand my lived experience in ways I don't need to explain. Men who can't make female friends are also worrying, but for different, also misogynistic reasons.
I think girls who are calling out pick me girls aren't hating on them to hate on them or hating on them to make themselves look better. They are calling out the behavior and pointing out how ridiculous they sound when they patronize other girls for embracing their femininity.
But I’ve been called a “pick me” and I wasn’t hating on other girls. I was just saying how I genuinely love typically masculine hobbies like video games and building things with power tools and stuff like that (but I also love Barbies and pink and makeup too). I never once put down other women but when you even admit you like stereotypically “male” hobbies/interests you’re automatically assumed to be putting down other women? Ironically the woman who called me a “pick me” was, in fact, putting me down.
@@loverrlee I've noticed this alot too. Y is it that if a woman says she likes male interests automatically all kind of names like nlot or pick mes would be categorized for her while a woman that likes feminine things would instantly be praised by other women. At this point I just sense jealousy and hate from women that do this. What happened to just liking what u like? Just like how men spoil and devalue the word simp women spoilt and also devalue the word nlot and pick me.
@@themysticwarriorgal9465 Yeah, I think this trend of calling anyone who isn't traditionally "feminine" or is into anything "alternative" a "pick me" can be a bit, dangerous. It implies this message that women can't possibly be into anything other than ultra feminine hobbies, fashion, or media, and if they say do, they're lying and are just trying to get male attention.
I love how you analyze this archetype through such empathetic lens. What matters is facing our insecurities and empowering ourselves and one another so that we don’t feel the pressing need to be picked by others anymore. We choose ourselves and those who sincerely like us will naturally stand by us
I'm glad they finally did this. That was one of the questions I always had about some of their vids was while criticizing male behaviour and social ills affecting women, that half the problem comes from other women. I know women like this too. I think in large part tho it is biological. The need that animals feel to enhance their survival in an unforgiving environment. Essentially that being independent and proud in one's self is nice and all (men and women), but in the real world you'll still lose or at the least be considered not as successful in life and therefore reflecting badly on your own value. Its not just social either and exists in all societies and higher intelligent animal species. The real challenge I think is going to be trying to forge a new version of life that is both not as cut throat and still allowing someone to prosper regardless of the perception or life they choose.
Wanting to be a "good" wife isn't the problem, liking masculine things like clothes isn't the problem, and being quirky isn't the problem. The problem is thinking you're better than other girls, invalidating them and mocking them for not having the same beliefs you have.
You're right.
But saddly that's kinda how adolescence works. We're looking around us in search of a sense of identity and most of the times we valorise people thinking like us and bring down those who are too different (at least in our heads). But it's really worrying to keep doing it too long after puberty.
Why do u assume masculine girls think they’re better than you? It sounds like u have some deep insecurities
@@Anna-xh6fk I don't think she targeted masculine girls in particular. She just said that you can be however you want to be as long as you don't mock or invalidate those who are different. Nothing more.
I totally agree with that 👍
It's also well expressed, thank you!
@@cepahreinholt8710 I totally agree with that
The Take is putting the Gone Girl monologue into every video they can and I am there for it!
Makes me want more gone girl like movies
I’m not. That film is so overrated.
@@alecoloxa if you haven’t already, I recommend checking out sharp objects. It is and adaptation of a novel by the same author and has a lot of the stuff I like about Gone Girl but it focuses more on parental relationships. The audiobook is really good too.
Lol
Me too
It's so depressing when you realise how much of women's behaviour and the way we feel about ourselves comes from the male gaze and the influence of men lol
I mean it’s only so influential because men still have greater access to money and power. So when viewed this way it’s actually survival.
We’re all just observing what doesn’t get us eaten by wolves basically and performing accordingly 💀🙏
But they still “wE dOnT nEeD fEmiNiSm aNyMoRe”
And it gets so confusing at times!! Like, do I really like makeup and enjoy doing it or am I conditioned to like it??
@@noble_experiment makeup is awesome, and you're awesome for liking it, no guilt🌺
troo (also sad*)
I never saw Maeve from sex education as a pick me girl, yes she was "different" and had a non traditional style but she never brought other women down, when ruby's intimate photo got leaked she did everything in her power to protect her even when ruby was such a horrible person to Maeve.
I think the framing was a bit more NLOG for Maeve, which I honestly can see especially with the start of the show.
I don't think the point was to show Maeve as a pick me girl, but examples of how pop culture still perpetuates, in one way or another, the "cool girl" stereotype.
I think they intentionally tried to make Maeve seem like a "not like other girls" type, only to subvert our expectations. She may act a certain way, but she has always supported other girls, even if they're different from her, and even if she doesn't personally like them.
@@stephaniemasson1224 exactly. That’s the whole point of the show. The characters are all subversions of the typical high school show tropes. Just like Eric first seems to be just another black/gay best friend
Yeah, I think it's ridiculous that she's featured here. I think it was more to emphasize her arc of starting out as a rude loner and then learning the power of female friendship or whatever, which is not even what her arc is lol. Maeve is a feminist from the start and her issue is she can't let people in because she's traumatized and used to people being unreliable and then she gradually overcomes that. I feel like the whole pick me cool girl thing is being blown out of proportion atm.
I've always felt that when a girl says "I'm not like the other girls" she really means "Please see me as a human and don't dump me in a pile with most people like me who you deem unworthy." It's very sad.
I think most self-hateful comments--like a Black person degrading other "lower" kinds of Black people, or a trans person criticizing other trans people who don't pass for cis like they do--I think these attitudes stem from a deep desire to be seen as an individual, not a stereotype.
It's sad that they have to throw others under the bus to achieve that. And it's sad our society can't make them feel seen in the first place.
Exactly but that's the whole point - pitting people against each other, trapped in a cycle of work and consumption therefore keeping the ruling class rich and in control
This is a really insightful comment, and I appreciate you sharing it. Thanks
that first part of your comment hits me so hard
Sometimes it actully means that they're really not like other girls. It's a near 50/50 split between what you're suggesting and just... not being a fuckin' girl/woman.
Yeah, that's exactly how I felt like in my nlog phase
As a 31 y/o millennial, is SO crazy to look back at the messaging we got through movies, music, and pop culture. These same beloved movies and shows were so problematic, and reckoning with the fact that the same things we love were a product of their times is a constant practice of push and pull for me. Women were constantly fighting each other over a man, anything feminine was scorned at (while still holding expectations of that same femininity), lesbian relationships were for the male gaze, single-hood was vilified and always the woman’s burden, and the prize at the end of the movie was always getting a man. The undeniable strength and reality of female friendships is a testament that these were in fact all just social constructs. We still have a long way to go, but it feels like we have turned so many corners, making it into this era of self-reflection and change. Thank god for times changing, for people evolving, for everyone calling bullshit, for gen z holding it down, for millennials and older generations for being strong despite so much social conditioning.
But who copies what they do in movies? They are designed to entertain not raise you.
People are just as judgmental even though they claim they aren’t
@@Chris-rg6nm movies influence people’s thinking whether they should or should not, and it’s good to call it out
@@Chris-rg6nm lmao what are you even doing on this channel if you don’t get the discussions we’re trying to have?
Great comment. Yes it is great to have words put on a discomfort millenials have may have felt and internalized without being able to understand it.
Ironically The Pick Me is always afraid of men. She doesn’t want to be subject to sexism or romantic rejection. She hopes that by pointing out how different she is, she’ll be spared
lol 😂 false
What sexism will they be subject to?
I saw a quote on Facebook that said "im not like other girls deep down means don't treat me terribly like you treat other girls"
@@caitlinbelforti870 I saw that too! They’ve seen how cruel(some) men can be to women and assume the woman did something wrong. It really depends on the guy. Some men just want to hurt women. There’s nothing we did or didn’t do to receive the treatment.
@@Zikomo7 Yeah some women just want to take from and hurt men they only care about themselves.
“Harry Styles-inspired fanfiction ‘After’” I still can’t get over this 🤣🤣🤣
Lmao same
Also "Bella's fanfic descendant"
I love how they call it out for what it is 🤣
Im crying pleasee
I used to be a pick me girl in elementary school, mostly because all the girls were more interested in other stuff but sports and i was the only girl playing sports, plus they always found me a bit weird and too guyish. Funnily enough when i got to highschool, i met "girly girls" who completely accepted me for who I am, always standing up for me and thats when i realised that I gave girls the bad rep. In fact guys at my school were the "mean girls" always gossiping and bullying, the girls were always cool with me. Honestly made me appreciate my womanhood a lot more.
I think that's an NLOG, not a pick-me.
@@Visplight in the video they described the nlog as one of the type of pick me girl.
“Mean girls” are a myth. Never met any in my life. In school guys were always the nasty ones
100% relatable! ❤
I still don't get how you're a pick me just for liking sports or games or beer or whatever. Just like whatever you like.
There's a difference between "pick me" behavior and "I am not like other girls" mentality. Every pick me is most probably "not like other girls" but not every "not like other girls" is "pick me". Both have internal misogyny tho which they can't be blamed for, it's the society that made them feel that they'll only be worth it, successful or serious if they are not girly and like masculine stuff.
Obviously there are so many women that genuinely like these stuff but then they are either put in the above boxes or are made fun of for not being feminine enough.
Also women might say they’re “not like other girls” because they’re lgbtq+, neurodivergent, gnc, or another minority who has been excluded from traditional womanhood
Women are as variable as the sand. Every women is "not like other women" and therefore *just* like other women.
@@madelinevlogs5898 But thats still false. By saying women if colour and LGBTIQA+ women and neurodivergent womem are "not like othr women" you are further othering them. Instead women of colour *are just like* OTHER women of colour. And LGBTIQA+ women are literally a group founded in order for othered women to have a community.
@@beepbopboop7727 that’s true. I was more referring to how these types of women might feel left out of most of society. This is somewhat from my own experience as a gnc lesbian and an autistic person who grew up in a conservative neighborhood and was alienated. I’ve found amazing community with other women like me in college, but when I was younger I was bullied for not being like most of the other girls at my school.
You can still state your experience! People won’t (or, they shouldn’t) think you’re NLOG-ing just for using those particular words. Also, you can ad a caveat to your self history and start a conversation about the ideas presented here, if you would enjoy discussing it. You could also say that you felt you were not like other kids or that you felt you had more in common with boys, or felt criticized/ alone, whatever the case is, if you want to avoid the NLOG phrasing.
I have sympathy for the young pick me's since i believe that sadly most of us had that phase in middle school/high school where we really didnt wanna be "ordinary" but the adult ones at like 20 or older year olds just make me cringe and i feel pity for them lmao
Love your pic 😂
Totally, I witnessed that happen. I was a pick me when I was 13-15, then after high school (so 17/18) I saw many of the girls I ~didn't want to be like~ start showing pick me behaviour. That was a wild time because I realised what I used to be like 😶
Thanks god for addressing the girls who make fun of pick me girls, I watched a TikTok compilation where girls make fun of pick me girls and it really made me depressed, I just thought like the pick me girl term was just a way to create self awareness for us to stop hating on each other, but if you just make fun of every girl who you consider “pick me” then is all the same sh*t, just rebranded on a different way.
As a black afab, we created the term to combat really messed up shit that got ingrained in our community, it did start off as mocking but not in the way you're thinking, the way how cultural norms of pick mes no matter the culture or race does stem from the same traits, but its monvered differently between cultures and for us in the black community so there's a reason why and no it doesn't cause a cycle, I do recommend to go look into how it started because you'll get the picture as to WHY we created the term.
Exactly
Side note: as someone who read the Gossip Girl books can I just say how much I hated that they made Chuck this “cool guy” in the show when in the books his character was just a total creep everyone only put up with because their parents were friends. I also hate how they completely ruined Vanessa as a character in the show.
Yeeeees!
I read the first book of the "Twilight" series before the film adaptation, and there it seemed to me that the heroine was described as a beauty who came from a big city to a remote village. She is even called "Bella" to emphasize this. Naturally, all the boys drew attention to such a newcomer. Then they chose this actress for her role, and now every film reviewer cites her as a classic example of a gray mouse that everyone falls in love with, despite the fact that there is nothing remarkable about her
So true!!!
I never read the books, but I could never get over what he did in the first episode and what? We are suppose to just brush it off because he loves Blair?😬
I'm so glad I've finally come across someone talking about how they butchered Vanessa in the show! Everything down to her casting was a disservice to her.
I feel bad for Pick-Me’s! You realize later on in life that all that work you did to appeal to men did nothing to enrich and fulfill YOUR life.
There's nothing wrong with being a pick-me, most will end up having happy fulfilling lives. You just want them to suffer because they are doing something you dislike.
@@Chris-rg6nm Sacrificing your own wants, needs and desires to obtain validation from others does not lead to a happy fulfilling life.
@@cristinarivera5707 it's a phase, most of girls goes through it for some degree (I'm no exception).
Right?!! Even women in a relationship with a man can’t get him to enrich their life.
@@cristinarivera5707 Are they sacrificing their own wants and needs if their wants and needs are catering to a man and getting his validation? Not everyone wants to be lonley girl boss with only a dog to keep them company.
I’ve always loved that line from SATC about letting our female friends be our soulmates! I often really do feel like my own female best friends are my soulmates, and it’s funny because most of my “movie moments” have come from them! My best friend heard me mention something I wanted three years ago and gifted it to me this Christmas! Moments like that make me feel special and loved (and I didn’t have to change myself around her to feel “worthy”). I also do sympathize with the “pick me” girl because as the video stated we’ve all been there at some point. I can definitely remember times where I’d laugh extra hard or try to fit a manic pixie dream girl image to impress a crush (CRINGE LOL). This video just makes me grateful to have true girlfriends now who love me as I am. Also, they remind me that if you have to pretend to be someone else for a person to like you, they are NOT for you :)
I feel I used to slide into that mentality quite naturally, I wasn't necessarily acting, I was just really pleased to meet someone new, but other people accused me of this. Like, if you are into someone, you will laugh extra hard for them anyway, it isn't necessarily an act.
Amen!
My sister...I think she is my soulmate. She is my best friend and my family wrapped in one and we have grown together, made so many mistakes, got married, had kids but I still believe she is the one person who just gets me effortlessly.
My BFF is absolutely my soul mate. When she came out as trans over a decade ago, my response was, "Yeah, that makes total sense." When I came out to her as non-binary a good number of years later, her response was, "Ha! So you *finally* figured it out!" We're siblings who didn't grow up together, but still absolutely there for each other. Sometimes we just tell people we're married as a joke, or for a discount. If I didn't see her as a sister, I damn well *would* marry her!
I was friends with a pick me girl, and let me tell you, it is annoying! This girl would always try to look pretty and always ditched me the second she got a whiff of male approval. She would even lie to me about dressing to go to a party, so while I was casual, she was glammed out looking her best. The thing that ended it though, is when she slept with a guy I told her I liked and then told me he wasn't interested in me while still talking about the sexual encounter.
If what I describe is someone you know, be careful people! Stay on your toes.
That’s the main problem I have with Pick-Meism. At some point you end up betraying the other women in your life because you see them all as competition. I’m sorry that happened to you.
@@cristinarivera5707 Its life my friend, but the good thing is, I have new friends
@@RedPillCosby-012 internal value? like organs :D
@@RedPillCosby-012 I see you in every replies, got your butt hurt Jonathan?
Your ex pick me friend sounds horrible.
I used to be one of those "not like the other girls" in college. I judged other girls for being basic like jeans and a cute top was sooo basic and too normie for me. I was a raver and convinced myself that girls that didnt do what i did, listen to obscure music, or dress wild like i did were boring and lame and that i was the one all the guys wanted. How fucking nuts I was.
Ironically, most men are turned off by pick me girls. Men like a challenge and they can smell desperate energy miles away.
We all were finding ourselves in college. You grew out of it..nothing to be ashamed of.
Well, I think I never really found anyone who was into the crap I was into. Not even guys for sure.
But that resulted in a great deal of depression. They wanted stuff that I didn't want, like I swear I started college at 17 because I got put into school early as a kid (Not gonna go into details, but it wasn't right imo) and some of these girls wanted to get married at that age.
Not judging them, but that was so not me.
I feel like all my life I was at the wrong place, with the wrong people. Caused me to have depression and anxiety, I really didn't want to live (Not as in I wanted to die, but as in I saw no point in living because there was no joy in the people I met or where my life was heading).
I feel like being not like everyone else is not being associated with feeling... Not right. It's being associated with either being cool or trying to put other people down, when in reality it should signal personal issues that one must try to work through.
@@samf.s.7731 I completely agree with you. Not fitting in or not feeling present is an incredibly isolating experience. Not having people to connect with can manifest in loneliness and resentment. Hope you are in a better place now.
@@ms.bubs4fun506 nah..
Men Love pickme girls
I'm a former NLOG, and I don't think it really matches with pick-me behavior. Mine was motivated by the smart label, in conjunction with my sister being a lovable academic alpha bitch. She was sporty (figure skating), girly, outgoing, and smart, plus much older, and it left me feeling that I didn't have a lane, because she took all the good ones. So I became a classic black-wearing, book-devouring, makeup-eschewing, intentionally geeky NLOG. So what if my sister beat me in all the classically feminine ways? I don't care, because I'm not like other girls. It was never about male approval, it was an attempt to find some worth in a sister dynamic that left me feeling like I was always in second place.
In the decade since, I've thankfully moved out of the NLOG mindset, embraced my feminine interests, and my relationship with sister has much improved. We both had to grow and learn that while we are fundamentally different, neither of us is morally superior because of those differences.
You weren't a NLOG. NLOG puts down other women and women's activities...you just wanted to be different and get noticed by your parents and friends! I was like that too
The pick me phase is like a rite of passage before you mature and realize other women were never the problem, our desire to be regarded as beings with substance stems from patriarchal teachings. While we can and should educate pick-mes, we need to extend them some grace because everyone who perpetuates misogyny are victims of it first.
Personally I feel like we should be trying to be superior to who we were yesterday. The only person we should ever compare ourselves to is ourselves in the past. Look at who you were in the past and if you are embarrassed or you cringe at your behavior that's great! That means you have made so much progress as a person that you are horrified by your previous behavior that's a good thing. If you are better, smarter, more disciplined, more self-confidence, closer to your goals, than you were last year or 5 years ago or 10 years ago then you are going in the right direction. We all move at our own pace. Comparing yourself to other people is like only driving your car by looking at the rear view mirror. You will never get to where you want to go if you are constantly looking back at other people and focusing on what they are doing. Focus on what you are doing. You can't live your life looking backwards. It doesn't matter whether anyone else likes you. The only thing that matters is that YOU like YOU. You're the one who has to live with yourself for the rest of your life. And that's how you should make all of your decisions. Will I regret doing this in 10 years? Will I regret not doing this in 10 years? You shouldn't be trying to be superior to other women. You should be trying to be superior to who you were last year, last week, yesterday. Even if your progress is slow, life isn't a race. And if you take one step forward every year in the direction you want to go. You are winning at life. What's that saying that the race of life is long and wide. It doesn't matter who meets milestones first or what other women are doing all that matters is what YOU are doing.
I agree with all of this! Except the last sentence, I wanted to clarify your point. Earnest question from a male who's seeking to learn how far misogyny goes, do you think that even men who perpetuate misogyny are victims of it first, too? I personally thought men are brainwashed into misogyny because dehumanizing women maintains their social status "above" women in the hierarchy, and isn't a direct cause of experiencing misogyny, even indirectly.
Facts
In high school I was an insane anti-feminist and men's activist. It even got me into friend groups where we thought making jokes with slurs we're okay. I'm ashamed of that phase of my life and am so happy to be supported by and supporting other women.
You should speak publicly about how wrong you were and how you came to recognize how wrong you were. People don’t listen to those who never made the same mistakes they did. You can change more minds of those still mired in the muck by explaining your epiphany than others who never felt that way could.
@@nataliaalfonso2662 that's a really good idea. I've thought about it before but was scared if getting cancelled tbh. Like, I have told people the way I thought and spoke were wrong, but I know others will say that I'm unforgivable and I don't want it to ruin my life or my family's.
@@smithstoneware well, you Can’t live in fear of getting cancelled. It’s not a real thing anyway. We’re any of the monsters spreading the insanity with which you were brainwashed cancelled?
People don’t generally cancel those who come forward after escaping cults or indoctrination.
It’s healing and powerful. And yes of course some chronically online assholes are going to pretend they’ve never erred and put you down for having been wrong in the first place.
But you’re going to live your life based on the hypothetical possible reactions of insecure losers? Who are lying about being perfect?
I think you should speak on it somehow. Or maybe writing about it with a pseudonym would make you more comfortable? It will be good.
It is ok to stand up for men's rights. There are such things as toxic femininities.
@@sunray2.041 feminism does stand up for men’s rights. Men’s rights activists do not. They deflect from accountability and try to pretend the patriarchy doesn’t exist. The patriarchy is horrifically harmful for men as human beings. It’s dehumanizing, objectifying, sees them as worthless if they’re not proving themselves productive and exemplary as “true men.” Feminism also DEFINITELY addresses toxic aspects of femininity. No one ever did before feminists. That’s literally the whole point. It’s feminist addressing how often and how badly and how dangerously snd how murderously women can perpetuate the WORST attributes of patriarchy. Men’s rights activists are not doing that. They’re caught in a maladaptive cycle of victim playing and accountability deflection, which is ironically what they try to accuse feminism of doing. Any one woman, feminist or not, can be horrific. And anybody can go about achieving an idea incorrectly. But as a movement, feminism has only been trying to suggest that women and men, while different as genders and obviously while all individuals who are different within their demographic, deserve equal rights. Suggesting it’s anything else is a bad faith argument.
Besides, saying it’s ok to defend men’s rights while no one is trying to enslave them or take away their rights sounds like standing up for defending “white live who matter!”
No one is trying to make it ok to enslave white people, or kill them in the street with impunity.
No one is trying to control men and police their bodies and restrict their human rights.
They’re trying to help get women equal rights. Which we still do not have.
Everyone should defend every man’s HUMAN RIGHTS as an individual. But “mEnS rIgHtS AcTivIsM” sounds like a fundraiser for billionaires.
Men already have rights. What’s the activism for? It’s crucial to defend black men’s right to life, native men’s right to their land, gay men’s right to love who they want, trans man’s rights to be who they are, and ANY cis straight white’s man’s HUMAN RIGHTS when they are being infringed.
Activism isn’t supposed to be to support the mildly inconvenienced who feel that finally being held accountable is the same as being oppressed.
As a Gen X woman, this is my least favorite trait of ours. A lot of us are just starting to distance ourselves from this and lean into things we felt embarrassed to like when we were younger.
As a Millenial who is a former pick me, you'll grow out of it. It's usually due to the fact that you're still young and finding yourself. Good thing is at least your generation is aware of this phenomenon. During my time, we weren't. 😂
What I find a bit frustrating about 'one-of-the-guys' girls in particular is that they have stereotypically male interests and dress in ripped jeans and crap, but you won't see many with zero makeup, baggy clothes that clearly haven't been washed in three days, and when messy, her hair is still stylish and attractive. No 'unladylike' behavior, no slouching, no belching, perfect posture. Nothing that would turn off a potential suitor. Something about it just seems extra fake to me.
Yes! It's like, they want to be like all the guys AND have all the guys. Make it make sense (eye roll)
My ex cheated on me then left me for an older chick like this. She was the exact description you speak of. She’d post things like “once you make money, you can f*ck anybody boyfriend you want.” Things like that.
@@p994able so basically she's just like all the narcissistic men who think money = entitlement to women. ugh, hope you didn't even want your ex back after that.
Thank you girl I’m just seeing this and hell no he was corny. Mind you, he is 31, she is 37. Both older than me yet so lost, and childish asl.
And I LOVE that you shed light on narcissists with money. Because that definitely is a thing. As they were both heavily narcissistic.
It’s good to call out what a Pick Me is, some of anti Pick Me stuff I’ve seen involves quite anti Feminist behaviour like mocking women, even body shaming them and pitting women against each other
Truly, I remember when I was a pick me, it was all about shaming other women because I was jealous and insecure, can't forget about the internalized misogyny as well.
@@RedPillCosby-012 Fair enough. It's the average culture for everyone really. Lol
"He might be dreamy, but he's not the sun. You are"
Ouch.
But honestly, most of us either have or used to have a bit of this character trait in us. At least it was a phase.
I think we all do, yes, absolute emotional security is as much of a myth as the idea of the Romantic 'lonely individual' a lot of this is referencing
That’s because narcissistic traits are supposed to be grown out of by adulthood. When they are not, it can develop into a disordered personality. Validation seeking, grandiosity, insisting no one can understand them bc they’re so unique, these are all diagnostic criteria for narcissism. Adolescents ARE, rightfully, developmental still narcissistic. They are children. By the time they are older adolescents or young adults it should subside.
Not really, Ive always been a lesbian so I never needed to put down women for male validation,stay safe y'all tho 🥶
@@Cherrycola5555 you’re seriously on this thread being a pick me and suggesting you’re not like other girls?
@@Cherrycola5555 lesbians can be as desperate for the patriarchal validation of men as straight men are! I’ve known many who derive validation from the number of women they score with, from being seen as tough, from being “one of the guys.” I don’t know you so CSNT claim to know if you’re one of them, but you positing that lesbians can’t be pick mes is absurd and a bad faith argument
Honestly, I came here to say the girls who make these TikTok’s making fun of NLOG’s give off serious pick me vibes themselves. Catty and mean spirited- they’ve made it their entire personality to hate on other women. I’m so glad you pointed it out.
Thank you lol we need to stop mocking people for having insecurities. We all behave in a shitty way, and acting like you don't is being delusional
If the declaration "I'm a nerd" is a sign the girl has "male interests," that is a problem.
Nerditude is, or should be, gender-neutral, and we need to be working toward that goal. We need to see more and better nerdy-woman representation on-screen -- representation that shows her interest in science fiction and fantasy media does NOT set her apart from the women around her. Nerd girl communities!
No it's not. There no nothing wrong with being a female nerd. I'm not interested in video games because of men. I love these hobbies because it gave girls like me a fantasy escape. I'm a nerd because I'm socially awkward and quirky. I call myself a nerd because I embrace who I am! Iam NOT try to seek male approval. I do this things because I love them! I don't give a damn if a guy is not attracted to me.
@@cosplayingcat099 the problem is that she is ok obviously lying
I was thinking the same thing. Like, I have always loved dinosaurs, Star Wars, Pokemon, etc. And I have never wanted a man. Why should I get labelled as a "pick me" for genuinely liking what I genuinely like.
That moment when you're 17 and you feel SO PROUD just because some dude told you that you'e "not like other girls" 😂
yep. this is such a red flag to me now!
Okay but why is it always assumed that women who actually do love “typically male interests” aren’t actually into that stuff? Like why can’t we even imagine women enjoying video games? Why do we just assume it’s always done for male validation? Why can’t we just let people like what they like? Why do we have to assume it’s disingenuous? Liking video games or other “male” hobbies does not automatically mean I don’t support other women and that giant leap in logic baffles me.
Seriously this is my big problem with the term and these “critics”. I don’t even date men or care to, all my “male” interests are my own.
My TH-cam name is misleading, I am a woman. But Yeah it's a bit weird. I mean, I grew up with keeping my nerdy and male interests on the down low because I didn't want to be thought of as weird. It wasn't until college that I found there were guys who actually appreciated that. ...THEN I became a pick me in the sense that I knew the power my interests could yield 😒 but the interests were always genuine
It's sexism and gender roles rebranded
I AGREEEE
Same. I will legit hide my interests from other women cause they get judgy or laugh :/
Dear Pick-me's, we are all unique in different ways. Thats ok. Doesn't mean you are less of a woman, and not like other women. I guarantee you that you can find other sporty, crude humoured, no make-up wearing, christian women at just stone throws away.
👍👏
Hold on one second. Why is it that you frame pickmes as those who fall into this particular type of behaviour? It's hilarious because most pickmes are the opposite of this, and are known for trying to promote their sexual attractiveness to get validation from other men. Usually, they'll play into stereotypes men like to fetishize, while also adopting overtly childish, highly approachable behaviour. That's the essence of what a pickme is, and a similar trope is explained by the famous gone girl monologue.
@@olenabogdanov wait all the famous porn star ,strippers and gold diggers follow ''I am traditional feminine girly lady trope''
@@olenabogdanov I don't think there's a "general rule" for what a pick me is like...
She'll mainly play up a stereotype to get male validation, doesn't matter what it is...
You are awake
The anti-feminist/internalized misogynistic pick mes are the worst. They are basically cutting off their own nose to spite their face. Great video!
On the bright side, this type of pick me girls usually attract to other anti-feminist men and misogynistic men who are self-centered which think too highly of themselves that their lifestyle are biologically, logically, biblically, traditionally and politically accurate. They were built for each others.
True!
What's wrong with being anti-feminist when feminism isn't needed anymore and the whole movement is based on hatred?
I had a colleague who was an anti fem. she told me to my face that women should not be promoted and all women are incompetent and too emotional. She basically insulted me and everybody I love and respect. Honestly I started to feel sorry for her. My great loves are my girlfriends they support me, they love me at my worsts. Not having girlfriends in your life is punishment enough.
@Nomad This!^^
Tried so hard to be a Pick Me girl in high school and at the beginning of college, but realized it's kind of a futile endeavor for anyone who isn't white, thin, or pretty.
Lol yep. Being someone who loves to eat but isn't remotely thin doesn't have the same effect it turns out
Hey you are pretty and who wants to be thin and white anymore? It's thick and browns time now..
Yes I agree! At my high school there were two "pick me " girls. One was very attractive and the other was not. All the boys liked the attractive one, while making fun of the other, even though they had the same problematic behaviour. I personally didn't like any of them and I hope that they are doing well now and have left that mentality in their past.
I feel like being a pick-me girl doesn't guarantee that you'll get picked. Being conventionally attractive and a male fantasy is more important to them. As a black girl, my pick-me phase went completely unnoticed, I was always a good friend to them. Good thing I realized that my girl friends were just like me and I could be myself with them without worrying about looking for attention.
Skippable Edit: I just want to clarify that I no longer need the validation on my femininity. I'm a woman in my own way and I don't think being picked would be a good thing. My insecurities would've still been present if I got picked because that's something I needed to work on by myself.
Wtf? How is it not a futile endeavor for them? Are you…. Are you still thinking being “pick me” is POSITIVE??
Man I'm 34 and didn't really think I'd take much from this essay. Turns out, I needed to reflect on my own behaviors.
Not being interested in makeup doesn't make you a pick me girl . It's not about what you like or don't like. It's the reason behind it. If you don't like makeup because it's just not your thing , or because you think women are so much beautiful without it and you don't like that women are pressured to put it, then great. But if you don't put it because you want to stand out and make the guys think you're better than other girls , then there lies the problem. It's all about doing something ,not wrong , to please men and make other women look inferior to you . That's the essence of the " pick me girl ".
I personally find makeup so fun , but I find women's natural beauty more captivating. And i think that having natural long nails and natural eyelashes is more beautiful.
And women need to know that feeling not good enough and not beautiful enough without makeup is internalised misogyny . I hear lots of people around me say that men's beauty is natural when instead , women should put fake nails , fake eyelashes and lipstick to compensate for their ugly faces . They put difficult beauty standards on women , and when women stick to these standards , they call them fake.
Women should do whatever they want and be their true selves for THEMSELVES. Not for anybody else.
Exactly.
I admit that I was a pick me back in high-school and college. I had a lot of internalized misogyny. I was also afraid of being stereotyped as a angry ghetto black women so I tried really hard to “ not be like other girls”. I didn’t realize it was wrong until I was called out on it and I went to therapy.
Love this vulnerability, thanks for sharing! As they said, we all want to be liked and often will appeal to those that want to like us even if it isn't genuine. I'm glad you took some action to care for yourself and find a way through it.
hope you feel better now. i know from being a black girl myself this happened to many of us, but the think is that i learn how to love my mental health more than people's opinions about my color, my body, my dress or my faith.
PS: sorry for spelling mistakes, i'm steal learning English ( i'm a Frensh Girl) God bless you and happy new year yall
@@RedPillCosby-012 Wrong comment section, pal
@@RedPillCosby-012 TF💀
It takes a lot of courage to face stuff about ourselves. Love and support from this corner of the internet♥️
The „i have more guy friends“ flex is easily the worst, men are very easy to befriend and they are especially when you‘re a pretty girl 😂
Personnally, I have more guys friends and I am a woman. I have very good female friends tho. But many of my friends are guys. I don't see any thing wrong about that and I don't think I'm a pick me. I'm just the way I am. I get along with people with who I have a good connection. That's it.
Actually, this term is not clear to me.
This one has to be me, I just ended up in more male circles in life than female, but I also have plenty of female friends because I basically love everyone I meet. This was never intentional and whenever I start dating a guy, I eventually have to break it to them that he'll have to get along with them and know that these guys are important to me.
So what I want to say is that I really don't think it makes sense to put things in this bubble of what is normal for guys or not, like being friends with guys when you're pretty. From my experience, every guy is kinda different and I can't conclusively state that looks are a factor for who they like to be friends with.
No lol I’m a tomboy and I have mostly guy friends
Some individuals just get along with the opposite sex though
Exactly
The tiktok pick me creators always show situations, where the dudes dont ever say anything when the pick me is misogynistic or flat out abusive/ cruel to their female friends or girlfriends. Like why do you only hate on the pick me girl and NEVER on the dudes that love the attention they get from the pick me and let them be cruel to their friends/ partners? OOOOH YEA.. its (internalized) misogyny again. Those tiktok creators and their audience once again wanna feel better than other women because "they dont care about male validation" and that makes them cooler. Yes being a woman, especially a straight woman is very complicated in how much you are expected to serve the male gaze while still being independent and "not caring" about male attention. But damn, this is a misogyny catch 22.
That reasoning is so circular it's eating its own tail.
I came across the ultra pick me girl in London once. She was on a date with a man (probably a new relationship) and was all dolled up and turned her nose at getting into the same train carriage with me and was loud about it. I wasn't dressed up at the time as probably on my way back from my parents' home or going to an evening class but now I realise she was hostile towards female strangers on their own and who hadn't done anything to her in order to impress her new man. Excuse me but I don't have to be all dolled up everywhere I go, especially on a cold winter's night, and have a man in tow to escape this inexcusable behaviour. It's good that I can now re-evaluate this situation instead of making excuses for her.
I don’t have tiktok but the footage they show here is just as problematic showing girls expressing negative thoughts or toxic behaviours online towards other “pick me” girls. There is absolutely no need for that and is just a different form of seeking validation just from a different audience.
This is exactly what crossed my mind watching those
Kinda wild that men get to just exist without being pitted against each other
must be nice
Lie you don’t even know
No men definitely get pitted against each other alot. It's also in eof the reason some men are so hostile to women that defy feminine expectations of not being social, economic or physical threats to them because that means they will have even more competition. One of the reasons of sexism is even to erase women as social, economic and physical competition to men which is why traditional and patriachal ideology and people react to negatively and aggressively to women challenging and defying gender norms because it would break their system and mode of source of human exploitation. That's hey they panic so bad at feminisim because that would mens they'd have to compete against the whole planet instead of only men (and also lose free labour and favourable bias toward them that helps them).
Ikr???
It’s so funny coz all these labels are for heterosexual women… there are none for LGBTQ women or men. Personally I find these labels a bit of a continuation of sexism. It’s one thing to say a “pick-me” is anti-feminist, maybe we should say the labels themselves are anti-feminist. Feminisms used to be encouraging all women to be able to be who they are
In conclusion: we can call out the pick me girl and still acknowledge that they're a consequence of mysoginy
Loved it!! It's so sad how much I saw "not like other girls" as a compliment as a girl. Now I am like if you can't compliment me without insulting my entire gender I don't want it.
There was another TH-camr who mentioned that sometimes the "Pick Me" may be a pick-me because of a survival technique. She brought up a woman who maybe in an abusive relationship and doing the things to not get attacked or the girl who says she hates girly things because her environment is toxic as all hell.
That's a good point. Your comment makes me think of some of the mohogany pink videos with regards to environment, safety and femininity. I'll have to reflect on that thought some more.
This reminds me of EmilyArtful's story
As a recovering pick me, this video deeply resonated with me. I love how The Take called out some of our favorite TV characters for their pick-me behavior. I remember internalizing Meredith Grey, Blair Waldorf, Serena van der Woodsen, Carrie Bradshaw and Charlotte York’s love stories hoping I can emulate that to find my dream guy. I also internalized Katherine Heigl’s rom coms as the ultimate romance bible. It takes time to unlearn “pick me” behavior. However, the journey of self love helps you understand the greatest love is yourself.
Thanks for saying that about Bella/Tessa/Anastasia etc because i always found ironic that they are deliberately generic in order to girls to see themselves as them BUT they are also told to be "not like other girls" and is too weird, bella is a sad case since i´ve seen a lot of twilight fangirls who indentify with Bella despite that if Bella was real /if a girl like Bella existed, she wouldn't like her own fans
Informative video but I disagree with Blair's inclusion. The "3 words, 8 letters" line wasn't about Blair wanting to be chosen. She ALREADY knew Chuck loved her, his inability to say it to her (he already admitted his feelings to other characters) was about Chuck's problem with being vulnerable because of his complicated relationship with his dad/lack of family. It had nothing to do with other women 🤨 And, Blair left with another guy when he didn't say it in that scene...so I don't believe she fits this narrative 🤷🏾♀️
Agreed 100%
Yes she does. She's always making misogynistic and slut shaming comments to other women, but stays with a man who is a sexual predator and makes excuses for him. And when he was being sued for sexually harassing his employees, she just takes his side and calls the women gold diggers, despite the fact that she already knew about his rape victims.
And how she banished Jenny, who was a minor at the time, for having sex with Chuck but didn't get mad at him. Also, she pretends to be independent and all that but is always relying on and gives up her future for this man. Same thing with Nate and Serena, she hates Serena but has no problem being with the guy who cheated on her with her own best friend.
Blair has always been shown to care more about how men see her and throws women under the bus
@@gensai93 Clearly you didn't watch the show 🤣. Blair has always been the hardest on herself. All of the female characters have insulted each other throughout the entire series - and Blair insulted Dan throughout the show as well. And the sexual assault allegations against Chuck were made up by Jack. Save your paragraphs for someone who will buy it 🥱
Blair had massive internalized misogyny(99% of the female characters on that show did tbh) hence why she bullied, slutshamed and harrassed other girls in her school.
@@HereIAmInYourLife I completely disagree. Blair was definitely a mean girl BUT she was mean to whomever was in her way. All of the people she idolized were female (i.e. idolized certain female professors or businesses women). Whenever a male got in her way she treated them with the same sass (i.e. manipulated Cyrus when she believed he wasn't good enough for her mom, and battled Dan when they were interns together, she's gone head-to-head with Chuck a few times etc.). Being mean to girls doesn't make you a misogynist...this is a much more nuanced topic 🙄
take a drink every time The Take mentions Gone Girl’s “cool girl” monologue
Lmaoooo it’s a lot I think I’ve memorized it by now
For most of middle and high school, i was a pick me and it’s crazy to think about how I use to act. I remember I would try to center around myself with guys and having to hate my female peers b/c they were acting girly and liked all the things I wasn’t interested at the time. However, while I acted like I didn’t care about being like the other girls, I was lonely and didn’t really have anyone to confide with. I was a girl who was constantly seeking external validation from others and felt like I wasn’t good enough for anyone. Now, as an adult, I have a better understanding of myself and continue to work through my issues of low self-esteem and not compare myself to others.
I'm so proud of your journey and wish you all the best in working towards better self-esteem.
Thank you for acknowledging at the BEGINNING of the video how this concept of "pick-me-ism" actually having it's roots in the Black community. Before the word was co-opted to mainstream society (kind of like the concept of being 'cancelled' which also had its start on, you guessed it...Black Twitter!!) Black Twitter was the forum that allowed us to call out some of the crazy male-worshipping behaviors that many of us don't even realize because its such the norm in our community, especially in the church. Because historically, Black women (in America at least) have gotten the short end of the stick when it comes to options for dating within our race-- i.e. our own men abandon us by dating out when they reach a certain level of success/status, leaving us to deal with men who are less than desirable-- we have no choice but to be independent, go to school get and education so we can take care of ourselves. But then we get labeled as "too independent" or "aggressive" or "masculine" for getting it on our own. As a result, many women have to make a choice and if they want a man/family they need to downplay themselves quite a bit in order to make a man who is probably nowhere near her level feel better about himself, just so they can say they have a man. But I'm glad things are changing and women are realizing having a man for the sake of having a man isn't the flex it used to be
Thank you for pointing out that the trope of those Tiktok girls making fun of the "not like other girls" girls are, in fact, doing the exact same thing. "Look how cool and relatable I am for tearing down the group of women who are also tearing down another group of women by trying to be cool and relatable."
We all go through the "not like other girls" phase because society (in every era) puts women into a box of liking the same things, then they make fun of us for liking those things - this is where we get the basic bitch label. When I grew up it was Starbucks, Tiffany charm bracelets and Ugg boots. Nobody's all the 'basic bitch' things, and nobody wants to be one of a hundred colours in a box - so we go through the phase where we rebel against it and tell people we're not like that, not realising that puts us in another kind of box.
Thank you for this wonderfully educational video ESPECIALLY highlighting AAVE and the history of the “pick-me” girl in Black culture. You guys are truly the best.
I can’t believe I’m watching this for free, everything in this video is perfect! The references, tweets, movies, series, celebrities, TikToks this is extensive work! Thank you
Definitely went through that- but during teenage I think both boys and girls try to feel special and are quite immature in the process. I still relate to my teenage self now when trying to fit in a group of girls though, daaamn It's hard :/
yes, I don't think you magically just leave insecurity behind, there is still an element of teenage me in there somewhere!
Being autistic, when I went through my “cool girl/pick me” phase I ended up aquiring up lifelong hobbies/obsessions from getting into activities specifically to be more likable to guys and I’m so glad because COD Nazi Zombies in particular will never not be fun
You comment so much on these videos, maybe go touch some grass girl 😂
Same with cod zombies!
Ugh, I just flashed back to how I was in high school. I knew I wasn't the most attractive, and yet I thought I should have plenty of male attention because "Oh, I'm smart, I can sing, I have love in my heart" - never mind that I was seriously stuck-up. I'm fortunate I had friends who loved me anyway.
Edit - for reference, I didn't end up dating until college, and I think it's because I had to get knocked down a few pegs.
Lmao no you sound awesome and self aware😂😂 I feel the same way about myself but not about dating, but about friends...My mom was judgmental as hell and gossiped about all our neighbours and how they all have horrible hair and are overweight, so I dragged that arrogant attitude with me to school, I don't think I'm unattractive, but before I was bearable to keep around as a friend, I had to be humbled by how arrogant and annoying I was.
Haha, you actually thought that? That’s crazy. I have never liked a girl more because she could sing, be smart, and has love in her heart. I like a tone-deaf, dumb, hateful bitch as long as she is hot
I definitely had a NLOG phase, because I didnt FEEL LIKE I fit in with other girls who I felt were girlier than I was. I also felt pressure from family to perform femininity in a way that didnt come naturally to me. It made me insecure, so I wore being a tomboy as a badge of honor. Although, I'm still not too girly, Ive let go of that image and I'm just myself. As an "elder" millennial I feel like alot of us went through that phase, especially growing up in the 2000s. I think fanfiction culture also contributed to that, because you have women who felt like I did, writing these stories that glorify the Mary Sue/Pick me type, and rewards that character with a impossibly hot love interest. In the moment it felt empowering, but looking back, it wasnt....
I understand that. It wasn't me who didn't want to be like other girls, it was other girls 'othering' me - girls I really did want to be friends with. It wasn't until college I was able to meet more women and develop any female friendships. But before that - what do you do? As a kid, you don't have the freedom to move or change your environment so you're stuck with a small-minded area of girls and maybe they don't accept you.
I feel you, this "i am not like the other girls" phase i had was definitely because i felt misfit. My family is a conservative one, so you see it's a lot of pressure to look like a barbie doll, it felt so wrong me trying to relate to that, all my cousins were feminine and stuff and when i tried to look like that seemed like i was trying too hard, plus my sexuality was a huge obstacle too.
I am a adult now and learned how to councilliate a lot of those feelings of misfit, and now that sexuality and other things are more acceptable it's easier to not feeling so different.
Guys can be just so manipulative but girls are terrible as well. I always hated that some girls think they’re better bc of what they like
I wasnt girlier either and my mother always tried (and still to this day doesnt respect me as a person whatsoever) to be what she wanted, buying me stuff she likes but I dont,my room pink my bedsheets flowers clothing I dont like etc but she does. And at the era it was harder to find things in general that I liked or where i fit in (as oppose to today where theres so much available and blendee). As much as I also did other things for male approval to feel special or accomplished, I also think some of it stemmed from not being loved from my family and needing that love elsewhere. Through the pick me things, I definitely found somethings I like and dislike and I'm grateful for that experience.
This really hurt. We can all recount having a pick me moment but the end that talks about female friendships broke my heart. My best friend of +12 years have "split" due to her putting 100% of her efforts in her relationships (IMO) and not putting in just 10% of that into our friendship. This woman could lie, fly to another country, cheat and borrow money for her boyfriends but she struggled to catch a 2hour train to come visit for a weekend and she'd disguise it as me "asking too much from her" she was one of my last strong female friendships and while I have a lot of male friends who are great people, I do miss the fun that came with being around other women. Its just harder to make friends as an adult now but my friendships with men seem less affected by romance. Maintaining female presence in my life has become very difficult lately and I don't know how to fix it.
this is why I'm an advocate for women's rights... and wrongs. Imma choose a woman every time.
Thank you! Thank you thank you. For the quick coverage of how it has changed over time. The same people who point out pick me girls, end up being pick me girls based on their criticism. And now everyone is a pick me girl… just because you don’t agree.
If definitions keep changing it shard to know exactly what it is. There needs to be a criteria and behaviour that this “trope” follow and that socially defined if we’re going to keep using it. And if not, let’s stop using it as a insult. The women vs women things is getting very annoying. I always viewed a pick me as someone who values women based on a male validation and perspectives. For the life of me I can’t seem to figure out how these women enjoy misogyny and sexism (but if you value traditional roles for yourself and don’t tell other women what to do - I don’t think your a pick me).
We absorb a lot of this media as children, and as someone who went through this phase at a young age and is climbing out of it, I can say it felt validating seeing all that media because a lot of the time, girls who weren't traditionally feminine were made fun of and bullied.
I love your channel, it has help me a lot to see the world and life in general in a different perspective, to be more understanding and supportive of others and also feel confident of who I am and what I want in life, thank you so much and keep up the good work , greetings from Bogotá - Colombia
So I had a friend who changed her personality and interests based on who she was hanging out with, it was blatantly obvious with the guys she dated. I'm not sure if she falls under "pick me" or "cool girl" because she changed each time.
I definitely tried to boast "not like other girls" in highschool during the early 2000's. I liked comic books and Broadway musicals and it didn't seem to be as mainstream. Though I did reach out to my friends to borrow their CDs so I could listen to more popular music and connect with others.
The funny thing about the ''not like the other girls'' trope is that a lot of guys think that this is something that you as a girl want to hear. But the funny thing is that a part of growing up is understanding that you are so ''basic'' but it isn't a bad thing, but a universal part of being human.
Def was a NLOG type of pick me from middle school-25ish. Not proud of it, but happy to be over that phase. I was so insecure and could only feel valid/worthy through male attention (which also fueled my ED in my teens.) I’m so happy that young women and girls are seeing true healthy female friendships on screen. 💜
The most dangerous is the wifey, I tried that out and I got abused behind closed doors and left stranded by my own judgements. The friends I made were all fake, I wasted so many good titty years on thanklessly cleaning up after a guy who I no longer speak to.
LOL.
YOU DESERVED IT
@@eaglemgtow2789 and that's why you're still a virgin
I am so sorry to hear that, all love💗💗
I understand you were using it to make a point, but the next line after "you're not like other girls" in that Buffy clip is literally, "Yes, I am."
Thank you!!!
The tragedy of Buffy Summers was that she wanted so badly to just be like other girls instead of the exceptional person that she was. 😢
Also that trying to get Pike to like her was not her goal at all… he just happens to be the one who likes her authentic self. Her goal is to save her friends from vampires.
One of the entire points of Buffy was that she *was* a normal girl who just happened to have superpowers and a "chosen one" identity that she didn't want! Her struggles to try and balance a normal life with her duties as the Slayer were what made the show and the character interesting in the first place. And she never acted like a "pick me" girl - the first person she befriended in Sunnydale, who became her BFF throughout the entire series, was shy, nerdy Willow, rather than cool, rich, Cordelia, because she could see who the better person was. She never left Cordelia to the monsters, either, though she had plenty of opportunities to do so. Buffy was just a stand up girl.
I know, that irritated me as well! She literally isn't like other girls because she's the Slayer "the one girl in all the world".
I'm going to have to defend against "To All the Boys" being included in this, female friendship and sisterhood is uplifted in the series and in the end Laura Jean does not let "getting picked" take over her life.
Went through a pick me phase and I found it empowering when people called me "a man". Turns out I was just trying to impress the girls more than the boys but made a fool out of myself in the process. It's all thanks to my reading habits I realised how wrong my mentality was and how much society antagonises feminity. The me who used to find it an insult to be even called a girl now takes pride in the way god created me. I love myself and will never belittle my fellow women for the way they are.
Glad you noted that the pick me term originated with black people/black twitter, particularly black women - Like most popular trends do to be honest☕️😏
I was THOROUGHLY confused at all the white examples in this video lol but I am glad they pointed out where it started (I guess). I know the take focuses on movies/shows but I think this video would look much different had they used examples from social media.
I thought the term “pick me” came from Grays Anatomy in 2006 when Meredith begs Derek to “pick me. Choose me. Love me”????
Say it for the ones in the back! Most things that are part of pop culture were originated from black content. The harlem shake is another prime example. Honestly I find it disgusting but everything about black people are used for other gains, even black women looks.
@@kirag9509 Well the writer of that show is a black woman so your point is still invalid...
Sometimes I hate when our words and phrases go “mainstream” 🙄.
It's crazy how much movies have influenced us, I always admired the vulnerability in those scenes with Meredith Grey, and Julia Robert's (my best friends wedding), I would even cry, thinking maybe one day I'd have that type of courage. I actually went thru a major "pick me" faze in high school, "teardrops on my guitar" was my theme song, really the entire fearless album was lol. But then I went thru a bad feminist, hating every guy faze, that was based on the lack of male attention, and yet still a desire to get it. Finally at 28, I can say I feel my most authentic, and that doesn't change regardless of which gender I'm around. I hope all the other "pick me" girls come out on the other side, but to insult them in order for them to see the truth doesn't help anyone.
I couldn’t agree more!
I agree! Ironically some women who call other women “pick mes” simply for liking stereotypically “male” interests are the ones who are actually bringing down other women. I’ve been called a pick me not because I was ever putting anyone else down, but simply because I was just vibing and enjoying things I enjoyed. I hope someday we get to a place where we don’t gender interests and we can all just like what we like without anyone insulting each other for it.
There was a time when I was a Pick-me. I got into manga because the guy I fancied was into it but you know what? I don't regret it. Manga saved my life and it's carried me through until today.
yup, just learning from your relationships is not the same, surely?
Out of curiosity you say you used to be one, because you liked Manga? Is it because you first pretended to like it for male attention, but then actually started to like it? Because isn’t the definition of a “pick me” someone who believes that makes them somehow better than other women? So I hope you still love Manga but are no longer a pick me because you don’t believe that makes you any better than any other woman, but you can still freely enjoy any hobby or interest you like. :)
@@loverrlee No, I was one because I took up an interest and played it up to get the attention of a guy (didn't work). But yeah, in those days, I did put myself above other women but, in my own defense, a lot of those girls were bullying bitches.
I still absolutely adore manga and anime. At present, I have more manga volumes than I have clothes!
I got into anime and some other interests the same way, but the interests far outlasted the men's presence in my life so 🤷🏽♀️
I can honestly write that I never had a "pick me" phase. I love other women. I like sex with men, but I trust women.
same ma'am
You must have at least some trust in men if you're having sex with them, lol.
Exactly
I always end your videos with a smile on my face and a more positive outlook on life overall. Not to mention feeling a lot more informed and skeptical of the media Im consuming each day. Thank you for what you do.
The most annoying thing about pick mes is how they limit us. I love video games and fashion and nails and makeup and action movies and a whole variety of other things. I don’t appreciate my hobbies being forced into “normal girl” and “pick me”, especially to please some lowlife boys lmao
I’m very proud of being a girl’s girl, and I don’t think liking sports or fighting takes away from that in any way. Poor pickmes will hopefully realize we contain multitudes someday
THANK YOU! I hate that I had to scroll WAY down to see your comment. I love all kinds of hobbies/interests! I really don’t like how the definition of a pick me has devolved from “a woman who puts down other women to impress a man” to “a woman who enjoys x, y, and z, assumably for male approval.” Like bro, I can like Barbies and pink and makeup AND Video games and fast food?? And I can like those things for myself, and not for anyone else’s approval? Like why do we have to limit ourselves so much? Why are people always put into these rigid binary boxes? Why can’t we just like what we like without it meaning something else?
This right here! Fuck that shit is so annoying!
Ok, you're sexist
Yeah I think this video misses the point in one important thing, the Pick-Me is a Pick-Me because she harms other women, whether it's to tear them down in comparison, defending men over women or being misogynistic.
To add NLOGs aren't always pick-me's, all pick-me's are NLOGs but not all NLOGs are pick-me's eg Zoya isn't really a pick-me she's a self-righteous NLOG.
Not necessarily. A pick me is a state of mind too. it's a woman that feels validated by being chosen. A good example is Carrie from S3x and the City or Grey from Grey's Anatomy never put down women but they definitely wanted to be chosen
@@ms.bubs4fun506 grey never wanted to be chosen.. She only said " Pick me " To Derek coz she fell heads over heels for him. Hell..she was a no strings attached person who pick guys from bars.
Literally just watched the end of Mean Girls and was crying because its an inspiration to young woman and how we should love each other rather than hate.
I think that it is important that we not vilify young girls who go through this kind of phase if they aren't mistreating others, however I do think it is important to directly call out this kind of behavior when it leads to others being mistreated. It's really no different then any other kind of behavior, no one can stop you from cultivating habits that may prove to be directly destructive to you, but the minute these habits start causing you to abuse and/or bully other women/people just so that you can feel less insecure in a moment is when you deserve to be called out for being the kind of pick me who is also a bully/user/abuser.
But of course if she is a pick me it's implied that she doesn't respect other women or puts them down so she looks better!. There are not picks me that doesn't hurt other women
@@Janette388 absolutely, this has definitely happened to me in the past and it was so difficult to describe, the damage has been really long lasting
@@kahkah1986 yes it's kinda sad because it says how much this young girls hace selfsteem issues just to prove they are enough,I also think the parents are kinda responsable..
Thanks for showing recognition of where the term comes from... didn't realize people outside of my black girlfriends/ black twitter were using this term. Shocked to see it's now popular slang lolll
Just be you and you'll find someone for you. I hate the " pick me" hate because it puts girls who are truly like that look bad for not being the" hot popular girl." I don't wear make up, bit of a line and I get along better with guys and play video games but it's not for acceptance of men it's just who I am. We as women shouldn't hate on each other regardless of how we are approved by men. If you ever feel like you are acting a certain way for acceptance stop it as soon as you realize it. It's not worth it just be you.
This is what I find most concerning about the whole calling other women “pick mes.” Because I’ve been called a “pick me” simply for saying I enjoy certain things, and I never once put another woman down, but ironically I was being put down for liking what I like? I like video games (and pink and makeup) and I swear that I just like these things because I like them, not for some weird “male approval.” Why does me simply existing have to be about men anyway? Why can’t we just like what we like without that having some different meaning?
I grew up with my brothers and if I wanted someone to play with the majority of my neighborhood was boys, I didn't have a choice. The girls were too young or too old.
@@loverrlee Okay, listen, no offense but I hate when people do this just because the term got out of hand due to people using it in situation when its not supposed to be used, pick me hate stemmed from internalized misogyny that got way out of hand in the black community, not whatever y'all are thinking. Pick mes within our culture actually did real harm and it never spreaded to stigmatized people who are like OP, and we were trying to call that out/start getting afab within the community to wake up, black afabs who literally talked down to other afabs and pointed out how they were better because they were married and went on fucking soap boxes about how we should even sacrifice their children just to keep a man, and it doesn't help that afabs within our community are already stigmatized as the least attractive women due to race so having a husband and being a token/pick me is already badly ingrained in us due to microaggressions against us. And I can go on and on about how badly this shit is, but please, look into WHY the term started before saying stuff like this.
We did not create this to hate other afab or anything like OP is saying, we did this create unity among us and it worked FOR US, the term only got out of hand when it was spreaded among people outside of our community.
Your videos are so amazing. Every time I watch one I end up broadening my horizons to new perspectives.
What I hate is that in the books Arya is not an nlog, she acknowledges that she is different than Sansa but does not pretend to be better than her for it. The tv show writers made her like that.
I'm so glad the not-pick-me's were called out!! At this point it's no longer about us women realizing that we all went through that phase, the whole internet is on it and guys joke about pick me's as well. So if you want to male validation you have to not be a pick me, which essentially makes you a pick me. It all boils down to that quote of Margaret Atwood: "Even pretending you aren’t catering to male fantasies is a male fantasy:
BRUH
@@mychannel-lp9iq Bruh?
'we all went through that phase' bruh speak for yourself
@@idontknowmyname.9202 that's a slight exaggeration but the vast majority of women had it. Just look at the comments
A cousin recently had a break up with a guy who used to say she "is not like other girls". They dated for years, and aa month after the break up, he was with a girl she considered "promiscuous". She was obviously wrong to think that about others, but i felt bad for her... She was really depressed for a long time. In a way, she is also the victim here. She was taught, if she was a "good girl", she would get the guy, which made her pain worse and her life more difficult in many ways... So we should try to see pick me girls as victims of sexism, just as much as the girls they hate on.
This happened to me...wasted thousands of dollars, time and energy being the pick me and years later he still won't say I love you and we're on the verge of breaking up...
@@en2336 hope you will be in a relationship that fulfills you and makes you feel loved for who you are
Yep, so true. The thing about the other girl is she probably put her boundaries clear and he respected her for that. :) I feel bad for your cousin tho, i hope she finds peace and a better guy 🤗🤗🤗 all love
it’s very concerning that when people “call out” the pick me girl they expose their own internalized misogyny when they make fun of these girls, when really they should be helping them find their own self worth outside of male validation. When women make fun of and denounce “pick me girls” they are inviting the male onlooker to jeer at the “pick me” as well.
I was definitely an NLOG once upon a time. I'm really glad I grew out of it (mostly. I think we all exhibit this behavior sometimes, as it's so ingrained in us to be pleasing to men), because internalized misogyny sucks.
Internalized bigotry (whether for skin color, gender, species, etc.) is a scary thing to see.
You have those like Serena Joy who have this cruel sense of feeling their internalized bigotry is just and right, that what they're doing is the righteous thing to do.
Unfortunately, some will see these things as good. Whether in reality or in fiction (which is still terrifying as to the meaning fiction has) some see those who enact on their internalized bigotry is right and good, ex. Serena Joy, Blade, Issac (until he changes), etc.
I can wholeheartedly say that I was a "not like other girls" girl in high school and after. It was deep seated, internalized misogyny that made me associate anything feminine with weak, less than and undesirable. It got worse after high school when my two closest female friends and myself, drifted apart at the time. One was due to her finding Jesus and the other was geographical. I was left with all of my male friends from our group, so yeah, it got worse. I can say that I have completely changed, just wished it hadn't taken till my late 20's early 30's to figure it out. I'm a huge fan of letting people do whatever makes them happy as long as they're not hurting themselves or other people.
I have been called a pick me since yr 3. The girls in my class bullied me, and the guys literally had my back. I genuinely like video games but no matter what, I still get called a pick me for saying that, or talking to guys. I am very much for womens rights, and I now have many female friends. I know this sounds very pick me, but it’s something that I always have to deal with.
Good job properly representing the origin of this term in AAVE and it’s co option while still offering something new and accurate too 👍🏾
Thank you so much for crediting black culture and how these are 2 overlapping but separate things. A pick me and a NLOGs are very similar, but started in different cultural settings.
This is a great and comprehensive video :) I would say though that there are girls who hold strong views and anyone who doesn't like that can just call her a pick-me girl as a way of shutting her up. It's also sexist to think that she can't come to those opinions on her own and is just saying them to attract guys.
The Take is truly a genius channel and whoever picks or research these subjects is/are a genius(es)... I learn so much about movies and culture from this one TH-cam channel.
It would have been great if you spoke on pickme mothers who prefer having sons & favour their sons and treat their daughters bad because they’re girls. Internalised misogyny is a big part of it.
Hopefully women will stop centring men and start finding value in themselves and other women ❤️
My mom is a pick me mom😡 and i hate it
When I was young I always wanted to have boys instead of girls because, I thought they would be easier to raise. Thank God I left that mindset behind me.
@@taniar2739 you would be surprised how often I see this mind set. "Boys are easy to raise, why they practically raise them selves after a certain age."
"Ugh, Girls are rough! Just the worst! They are so whiny and emotional and you have to keep after them and guide them more than boys. And expensive! You got to treat them like princesses or they whine. So much more work!
Had a girl in my class tell me that if she ever had a daughter than she would cry and be disappointed. SMDH
I totally would've been a pick-me in high school, if the term existed in 2008. I went to a girls school, and with undiagnosed autism, I was painfully hermione granger-like, eager to please and share all this interesting knowledge (not, as people believed, to make other people feel stupid, I just didn't understand how I came across) as well as being a year younger than everyone else due to skipping a grade.
I think part of the reason I was a pick-me, is that I conciously saw all that I was told girls should be, the sum of "what a girl should be like" and I was painfully aware that I was nothing like that at all, and I was certain even trying would fail, and I'd be relentlessly bullied for it. Thus, as an avenue for self protection, I went violently the other way.... and just a bit too much the other way, to the point it probably even bordered on misogyny.
To me, other girls were stupid, vapid, shallow and yes, makeup was something only "skanky girls" wore, and the idea of dating and conforming was giving up on gender equality. If a guy deserved me, they'd come to me, and because none came it just proved I was better than other girls, because instead they were all my friends, because having a "boyfriend"? I think the hell not, said 15 year old me.
I'm nearing 30 now, and for me it's very easy to see the intense damage behaving like that, as a pick-me girl, has really altered my life, and I absolutely think that it affects me to this day, because it influenced the path I'd take. Thus, I've never seriously dated *anyone*. I've never even kissed, at the practically geriatric, millennial twenty-eight (my brother, a zoomer at ten years my junior meanwhile has already gone through two girlfriends, with whom he absolutely kissed). Ironically,I actually got really into makeup because of youtube in my mid twenties.
I guess that, once I realised that I'm a girl, and I'm ok with that---because there is NO right way to be a girl so I could just *be* just am---it became a lot easier to acknowledge that wanting a relationship and a family and perhaps more traditional things (that I used to believe admitting to was worse than death), because "normal girls" did that, and I didn't want that like because "those girls" did too.... it was, well... well, it was ok of I wanted those things too. Iit was definitely a big realisation, to say the least.
I've always struggled with female friendships, and that kind of thinking from my teens---which was absolutely supported and intrenched by media---held me back so much it's unreal, and I needed to stop hating other women.... mainly, in fact, because I was using it as an escape or a decoy for the fact that I was directing most of that anger at other girls for things I wanted, and it was because I hated myself too, and maybe more than them.
((It's annaddendum that I have to add.... the worst friendship group I've ever, ever had---it was catty, shallow, rude, judgemental and unbelievably cruel, mostly by going after the relationships I had with others, and trying to discredit me to those others---was made up of, yup, completely guys, with me as the only girl. I've never had anywhere near the level of any of that with the girl groups I've been part of, and it goes to show that girls aren't my enemy......And that boys are stupider, send them to Jupiter! (jk!!......... I think)
These videos are always informative and thought provoking 😌😌
Thank you so much for mentioning "Pick Me's" AAVE origins. It is greatly appreciated! Keep up the great work...
The warning sign to me with real or fictional women is when they say, "I don't have any female friends," or "women just hate me." What usually follows is some deeply troubling misogyny about women being too dramatic or catty or frivolous or jealous. While I really appreciate my male friends, my female friends understand my lived experience in ways I don't need to explain.
Men who can't make female friends are also worrying, but for different, also misogynistic reasons.
I think girls who are calling out pick me girls aren't hating on them to hate on them or hating on them to make themselves look better. They are calling out the behavior and pointing out how ridiculous they sound when they patronize other girls for embracing their femininity.
yes, there is an element of just making a point with your joke, but context is key surely
But I’ve been called a “pick me” and I wasn’t hating on other girls. I was just saying how I genuinely love typically masculine hobbies like video games and building things with power tools and stuff like that (but I also love Barbies and pink and makeup too). I never once put down other women but when you even admit you like stereotypically “male” hobbies/interests you’re automatically assumed to be putting down other women? Ironically the woman who called me a “pick me” was, in fact, putting me down.
@@loverrlee I've noticed this alot too. Y is it that if a woman says she likes male interests automatically all kind of names like nlot or pick mes would be categorized for her while a woman that likes feminine things would instantly be praised by other women. At this point I just sense jealousy and hate from women that do this. What happened to just liking what u like? Just like how men spoil and devalue the word simp women spoilt and also devalue the word nlot and pick me.
@@themysticwarriorgal9465 Yeah, I think this trend of calling anyone who isn't traditionally "feminine" or is into anything "alternative" a "pick me" can be a bit, dangerous. It implies this message that women can't possibly be into anything other than ultra feminine hobbies, fashion, or media, and if they say do, they're lying and are just trying to get male attention.
@@mynameisreallycool1it's really sad
Thank you for being clear about the Black/AAVE etymology of the concept of a "pick-me"; The Take's always well researched.
I love how you analyze this archetype through such empathetic lens. What matters is facing our insecurities and empowering ourselves and one another so that we don’t feel the pressing need to be picked by others anymore. We choose ourselves and those who sincerely like us will naturally stand by us
I'm glad they finally did this. That was one of the questions I always had about some of their vids was while criticizing male behaviour and social ills affecting women, that half the problem comes from other women. I know women like this too.
I think in large part tho it is biological. The need that animals feel to enhance their survival in an unforgiving environment. Essentially that being independent and proud in one's self is nice and all (men and women), but in the real world you'll still lose or at the least be considered not as successful in life and therefore reflecting badly on your own value. Its not just social either and exists in all societies and higher intelligent animal species.
The real challenge I think is going to be trying to forge a new version of life that is both not as cut throat and still allowing someone to prosper regardless of the perception or life they choose.
Thank you for respecting the cultural origin of this
@Jalondra Davis Brown The voice over woman was a black woman fyi.
@@doctordl7757And. You're comment is irrelevant.