7 Bad Guys Who Had a Point, Now I Think About It
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.ค. 2024
- When you think about it, the ostensibly bad guy sometimes has a good point after all. Reconsider Streets of Rage 2's beleaguered barkeep Barbon, Batman Arkham Origins' took-it-too-far activist Anarky and did-what-he-had-to King Logan from Fable 3, for starters, and subscribe to Outside Xbox why not: www.tinyurl.com/SubToOxbox
Speaking of misunderstood tyrants, we spent years hating those dreadful Templars, and then Haytham Kenway in Assassin’s Creed 3 was the first to make us think, hey maybe those jerks aren't total jerks.
That’s partly because we spent the first 10 hours of the game playing as Haytham and not his Assassin son, seeing things from Haytham's perspective and furthering his cause before we found out we were doing odd jobs for the people who were, up until now, the baddies of the series.
It just goes to show you: something about not judging a man until you've stealth-murdered a bunch of people in his shoes, I imagine.
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the pacman ghosts had a point, you broke into their home and ate all their food, i mean cmon, who would like that?
Bidoof actually whatculture is a theory that those are ghost eggs
And then he ate them
Not sure if pacman or jews...
would you eat someone for eating your food
spoops me goops goops yes
One of the more amusing parts of that Deus Ex game is if you DON'T get the upgrade. She tries to hit the killswitch on you and Jensen just shrugs "I never had time to get it" it is a great moment.
I ignored getting it like I ignore getting every update IRL since it didn't mess with my augs and was worried it would cost me money (I didnt hear that it was free) so when that happened I felt so validated in my cheap ways.
But it is a cool Moment.
@@sancer1781 I rate to that on all levels, including physical.
it was so satisfying.
Yes!!!! That was a fantastic moment!
In my first playthrough I got the upgrade whoops but I always thought it was funny that his body would reject any and all augments
“Listen kiddos, every one thinks they are the hero of their own story.”
-Handsome Jack
I had this when I was directing a tabletop roleplay. I wanted to create some reasonable villians with their own backstory and even gave the good guys some bad sides... In the end the heroes doesn't want to to anything, didn't know who to fight and even started to fight against themself because of slight differences in their morality. In the end we stopped the story right in the middle. Huuuge mess
What If i wanted to be the villain of my story? Like, killing/stealing from other people for fun/greed.
@@loremipsumdolorsitamet9542 so basicaly last seasons of RWBY?
Hate to be that guy but...
Thinks*
@@loremipsumdolorsitamet9542 it sounds good!
My favorite kind of "villains" are the ones you can kind of understand their reasons for being "bad"
@@bobono where is the body jestream. ANSWER ME!
I mean, I guess... but I still think 🖇dolf went too far.
I guess thats joker
Yea but pagan min far cry annoyed me.
My favourite kind of villains are one of pure terror like Palpatine or Darth Vader.
"All villains are the heroes of their own story" Lets be honest, the vast majority of villains don't see themselves as the bad guy; theres always some justification for what they do, even if it only makes sense to them.
Magnus Chase- Actually called his gang of villains the "League of Evil Mutants"
Victor Von Doom-Actually calls himself Doctor Doom, despite having the best motivation of any Marvel villain
The Joker-Knows and relishes in the fact that he is basically chaos incarnate
The entirety of Heaven's forces (Ghost Rider: Heaven's on Fire)-Don't care that killing the Antichrist would lead to chaos.
These are only a few examples of villains that know and either don't care or enjoy being the villain
Scott Hollis id see myself kinda as the bad guy but also not . Like i would know id be doing bad shit but care ? Nah fam
Viewtiful Z Did you mean "Magneto" instead of "Magnus Chase"? If you did, then the thing to remember is that he was created during the Silver Age, when villains were all "evil" this and "evil" that. In most incarnations since then he drops the "evil", or is using it as a political statement about how humans view mutants. He, Doom, and Heaven's forces (I think because I don't know the story) all believe that the ends they seek to achieve justify their means. That's the epitome of "every villain is the hero of his own story". As for the Joker, yeah, he's a villain, knows it, and owns it, but he's also madder than a hatter in a sock factory. He's the exception, not the rule.
Just like a soldier fighting for their own country
"All heroes are villains of someone's story"
Funnily enough, you can actually beat Far Cry 4 without doing a damn thing. When Pagan Min leaves to 'take care of business', just sit tight and wait. After some time, he'll come back, and you get a quick helicopter ride up to the mountain peak, thus winning the game.
No, you're not "winning" the game, like in Far Cry 5 at one point you're ending it without doing anything, that's a slight difference. Even at the end there's no real winner in both games.
@@vladdracul5072 You're winning in FC4 because you completed your one objective. FC5 is different
@@tranquil5273 There's some truth in there, but did you stop playing after that ending? You've won after all, no reason to continue. ;-)
Vlad Dracul thats why i still havent bought farcry 4 because to me waiting ending is cannon.
@@berkgulec5819 Well, I waited, just to see what happens, but then I started playing for real and had to help those Golden Path buggers. Afterwards I wish I could have helped Pagan Min instead of those morons.
Anyway, it's a good game and I don't regret buying it.
I love that the best ending for that Farcry was to literally do nothing. When you're brought in to see Pagan Min at the beginning, he has to leave and tells you to wait. If you leave, you start the whole game... if you just wait for him... he hands you the country and you can rule properly.
Far Cry 4: *exists*
Everyone: "Why no Pro-Pagan DLC?!!"
So fucking true. I loved that they added the alternate ending but I hated that they didn’t ever expand on it.
Darth Cannabris I know right if they made a working for pagan dlc I would have bought it
Does it even need to be a dlc?In my opinion it should have been part of base game.
you guys make pagan min like a god or something
dude is bad, i remember when noore killed herself after knowing that pagan kiled her family years ago but keep lying and using noore
when Ajay on the phone with pagan, its sound like pagan dont regret it and enjoy it
but its true pagan have some good point, but still an evil
btw, if we can choose side with pagan at the start its no fun since pagan regyme already claim 80% of the map
what i want is after the game end, i end my game without kiling pagan, but after put his mom ashes i RPG pagan Heli and kill him, then i also kill the other i choose (wether it amita/sabal) now acting as a new king but only have the north (the other map area is golden path) now back to reclaim it all
@@rotua98 I would rather take Min’s side than Amita or Sabal though.
They'd be lazily, badly written cliché villains, if they wouldn't have a point.
The best villains are absolutely right.
***** Good point.
But I was actually talking about non-comedic games.
Paraphrasing Yahtzee Crossshaw, "There's something fascinating about somebody who self-identifies as the villain, he wears their label as a badge of honour"
Yeah, I even saw a video about him that showed why he did some of his actions and how he really cares about his followers even if doesn't seem like it sometimes.
+Spiritus Sancti
Naw, the world is grey scale, not black and white.
***** Your logic lacks actual logic.
In Far cry 4 you can choose between.
1) The Dictator. Who will leave anyways.
2) The Drug Lord. Who is Pure evil.
3) The Extremests. Who want kill everyone who triggers them.
i choose 1
i know the dictator. but whats the drug lord and extremists?
Amita, wanting to have a thriving nation through the use of drugs.
Where the inhabitants either help or are against them..
Sabal, wanting and truly believing in traditions. To not loose Kyrat's heritage.
Where anyone challenging that idea needs to be sacrificed to appease Kyra.
+Kasper Lindström k, thanks for telling me.
pagan min all the way
05:01 'His point remains valid, even if his methods aren't.'
And that's the core principle of what in my eyes makes for a good antagonist.
Only barely. In many ways, he's ultimately a complete hypocrite, using the exact same subversive methods as the people he claims to fight against.
@@manuelmateo3392 I see that happen more with antagonists. I can't recall anh example right now though.
Nah his methods were completely valid violence is needed for change to happen
@CharCole Depends on the situation.
Sometimes violence only "change" things only for the worse.
@@Acacius1992 ya that’s true but this situation needs violence the people in power don’t give that power up so take it by force
Actually, in fable 3, I managed to stay rich and mostly loved. There was only one pkace that hated me and I realized that I didn't even need to sacrifice them either after the fact. Then again, I did a hell of a lot of exploring and doubled back in every place I visited multiple times. On top of that, I joined other player's games too and got paid pretty well for my work.
I found the key to success, as in all fable games, was real estate
@@JuliePeloquin not the first one.
the key there is mostly 'buy all the things in the entire game', lol.
@@leeman27534 in the first one you just speedrun until you reach the Arena, then fight until you’re about to fight the giant scorpion and retreat to the quarters, you get all the money and XP, save your hero and then load the game, restarting the Arena and giving infinite money/XP
Just gotta be a landlord, mate lol.
I think the other paddle in Pong had a good point come to think of it.
Yeah he was so misunderstood.
xD that was a good one
we passed judgment on him too fast
yes, the real evil was the ball, making you fight a meaningless battle without end.
lol
Pagan Min was arguably the most likable guy in Far Cry 4. Sure, there was a secret ending with him where you could wait for 15 minutes, but I kinda wish that at some point during the middle of the game you could change sides or something like that.
tkristians123 Literally all I wanted to do was fight the Golden path. For the next game it would be interesting if it was a civil war and you could pick sides between two armies.
Clinton Beene Skyrim flashbacks
Honeybeard Jones Did you know you can make both sides have a truce? You just needed to do the main story before joining either side
Tod Vulpes what is the main story.
StruckerX The main quest.
Weird fact; Anarky was intended to become robin at one point but it didn'tpan out. I always found him to be a great rival for tim drake specifically.
What I find odd is their inclusion of Arkham Origins Anarky. Unlike the one from the comics who avoids hurting innocent people, the one from this game has a deliberately inconsistent philosophy.
@Ember Fist hurting people doesn't necessarily invalidate an abstract point that the character makes. It certainly can, so when you need to remind the audience that "villain bad," you undercut their message with their actions. If anarky were meant to be the focus of the game and not a side story, they'd probably have to use him with a lot more thought.
@@paulweyer4339 No they deliberately wrote him to be inconsistent in his ideology as he is just a kid. This is most obvious when you finally face he wants you to join him then he wants to kill you because you refuse and when he is arrested he has a monologue about how he wants to help you only to reverse his position again halfway through.
@Ember Fist I see what you mean. I think it may come down to splitting hairs in whether you feel having methodology clash with ideology compromises the ideology itself. I would say it doesn't but I understand why you might see it differently.
Weirdly enough. Handsome Jack deserves an honerable mention from me. Atleast until he went full blown murderer because he enjoyed the fight
And because everyone he'd ever given even the slightest trust towards betrayed him outright.
@@MrJinglejanglejingle Do the Vault Hunters, specifically Athena, in the Presequel fall under that category, or do they just count as "following his orders"? This is given that Wilhelm and technically Nisha are still loyal to him in BL2.
@@ThePheonix66 Not 100% certain, honestly. We don't really know why they stuck with him. But we do know what happened to Wilhelm, so...
batmans does not say lalalala when he plugs his ears he says nanananana....
Yes that is the most true thing ever
+kitten is a cat F to pay respects
So he's singing an MCR song?
That would make sense seeing how emo
Batman is
or "nanananananaa batmaan"
...
Holy Hilarity Batman!
In Fable 3 I bought every house and business over time and paid for the army myself whilst keeping all the promises I made. I was basically Bill Gates.
Exactly. Buy every house, make the best decisions, and still have enough to save everyone.
Yeah but that's only because time only passed when you did edict event and the house money generation happened in real time. I think it would have been more interesting if there wasn't a way to have your cake and eat it too. A kind of dark knight decision. Either be hated by your people for their own good or loved by them and get a lot of them slaughtered.
Yep. Same. Remember the fucking pies I had to make for my first home
MrZederikus Mate, I was a lute master! By the end of it I was Hendrix reborn. So much money made Lute soloing
It was like game couldn't decide, is it serious for small children. The way it was possible to get entire country in your pocket (which is bollocks) if you played long enough destroyed story and immersion.
I love the guy behind pagan while he was killing someone with a pen, just like "oh hell nah"
"When there is evil in this world that justice cannot defeat, would you taint your hands with evil to defeat evil? Or would you remain steadfast and righteous even if it means surrendering to evil?"
I'm stealing this-
In your quote, is a good person being forced by an evil person to stop the evil act by doing an evil thing? Cuz being forced by another person to do an evil act doesn't make you evil, it makes the evil person more evil.
@@revanche1431 The question's basically "do the ends justify the means".
@@heededshadow509 You don't, It'll make you look stupid.
@Revanche Well depends how the "force" you.
How to win fable
Buy all the houses
All of them
Wait.
I aways hated that you coudnt buy the castle and rent it. It was such a grat and unused place it would mean millions of investment
@@AllNiin let your child be King or Queen for a day! Only 1,000,000 gold coins!
Uh oh
Spaghettio
Adorable fursona my child.
you mean the long way of buying everything and waiting long enough so you can pay for the national army out of your own pocket?
yeah i tried that took a few irl days to work but it did work kept every promise made too with enough gold left over to do more than just afford the army. Had to buy everything in the game and rent it all out though lost access to 1 area for not getting to it in proper part of the story so didn't do anything on that one dock area. Still unsure what the bad ending is as i never found a way to get it. Always got the good ending no matter how hard i tried to get the evil one.
My pencil had a point. It stabbed me with said point
Ass
Wanna see a magic trick?
TADA! it vanished.
@@WouldYouKindlyWatch nice reference
Shut up
"Horrors from beyond the veil of time and space are coming to eat us so shut up, sounds like a pretty good draw card for a leader to have." - Yahtzee on Fable 3
My phone crashed, so I put in headphones and watched the rest of this video on my laptop. After immediately dropping me into the video again, the first thing I heard was the gunshot at the end of the clip for "The Last of Us" at full volume.
Worst jumpscare in a while, compounded by the fact that it isn't even a scare if I hadn't watched him take out the gun and point it first because I'd be expecting the gunshot. Thanks TH-cam.
tenpenny from fallout 3
if you think about it
megaton really was ruining his view.
Billy Thomson be honest those kids where dicks
Billy Thomson I told Care of that for him
Billy Thomson then I helped...the ghouls in ...
In the worst way
*Clap Clap Clap Clap*
😂😂😂
It's OK guys. Just wait for Pagan Min to come back and enjoy the Crab Rangoon to get the best ending.
That ending should be cannon.
UnBR0k3enAngel
I will fight anyone who says it is not.
DGneoseeker1 I will be on your side.
it /was/ the best ending at that, argh. wish they'd made some kinda dlc for it or something, anything. >_>
I wish you could actually play on thatbranch, fighting for Pagan Min and killing the Golden Path.
Batman in a nutshell: I GOTTA FIND THE BAD GUY AND PUNCH HIM A LOT REALLY HARD
Then get sanctimonious on people who also beat the crap out of bad guys.
@@Delightfully_Bitchy Leave him alone! Did you know his parents were murdered????
Outsidexbox: The fireflies would have saved humanity.
MatPat: Let me introduce myself
The fact that fungal vaccines don’t exist + vaccines aren’t bloody cures + Fireflies don’t have a single certified doctor on hand: Let us introduce ourselves
I wonder if the Geneva conventions cover tortured memes.
@@azural5722 but in reality if you start to put real life logic in the game almost non of it makes any sense whatsoever
Fireflies are bloody incompetent no point in trusting them to save the world.
@@jamespratt4260 But last of us works on realistic logics. It is a what if Cordyceps affected not just ants but humans. Besides Cordyceps fungal virus world is as realistic as it could possibly be
"It's a face, not a bikini line!" - Jane Douglas, 2016.
It'd look perfect if he had a butt-chin
Fuck off lady no female should ever shave it at all
@@miyakothecyberlesbian6315 anyone can shave anything they want on their body.
@@miyakothecyberlesbian6315 Bush scrotum spotted
haha i got to that part right as i read this
When I played Fable 3, I had so much money from buying and renting every single building in Albion that I was able to be a generous King AND pay for the whole army I needed with my own money with plenty leftover. And I only overcharged all my tenants until I was able to afford every building, then I went and reset them all at -20% pricing
Did the same thing.
So if you play as the Monopoly guy you get the best ending? Wild.
@@Violet-Spark That's essentially what Tom Nook in Animal Crossing is and everyone seems to be happy.
@@Violet-Spark yeah, economies in fable games are laughable
fable 1, you could essentially break the game, get as much yellow exp, and basically all the stuff you could ever buy, like an hour in, given trading with people is both something you can upgrade, as well as dependent on the stockpile of items held by the vendor - buy an apple when he's got 20, it's probably discounted. buy his last one, it's probably expensive.
so, just buy/sell everything in one go, and you're good. you can even sell stuff back to the same vendor, he'll pay full price for like 400 apples, and you can bu them back for as cheap as a single apple can ever get, for the whole shebang, despite getting top price for them a second ago
fable 2/3, buying up property can make money slower than the jobs, but you can also just cheese it by buying a couple dozen places, change the date to a month later, and log back in and be rich.
@@S1RLANC3 animal crossing is a piece of shit why you even talking about mobile games
Mercer In Skyrim. "Were thieves, were supposed to steal." He robs the guild blind and hypocritically they get get mad about It. Thieves being organized Is ridiculous and almost never ends well.
You've clearly never seen American politics.
Or heard the phrase honor among thieves
@@codyreed717 honor among thieves just means don’t screw each other on a job. It doesn’t mean you’re honorable forever just cause you’re both thieves. Why WOULDN’T they all have their own vaults and only give a cut to the guild?
Tbf the Thieves Guild in Skyrim takes an approach to thieving similar to the Dark Brotherhood does to murder; you get contracted to steal particular items (or target a particular person/business for economic ruination) and by being a useful tool they are tolerated - even funded - by the powerful. That's a whole lot different to the regular/our idea of thievery which is just a lone person taking other's property for their own benefit. It's the difference between an amateur and a professional so I totally understand why it'd have a different culture and set of expectations in the same way that Dark Brotherhood members despite being murderers don't typically go around murdering each other.
When your chin has a landing strip, it makes you curious about what’s flying into there.
Far Cry 4 was pretty messed up. I spared Pagan Min only for the Golden Path to make Kyrat even shittier. I wish the real ending was another choice: either leave Kyrat since you spread your mother's ashes or stay and take your country back from the corrupt Golden Path.
DLC maybe? I don't know how DLC for the franchise works, but it sounds like it could work.
Well, there is that secret ending.
The secret ending is the most fulfilling.
"Use secret ending, then glory"
I wish there was an ending where you don't choose who leads the Golden Path and kill both of them. Then you side with Pagan Min and yay! Kyrat isn't as corrupt as it should be.
For the last of us, there were no good guys or bad guys. That's the whole point of the story. It's just the last humans fighting like they always have.
Except for that one cannibal guy who was an implied rapist. He was pretty damn bad.
+thekillers1stfan think about it even if the fireflies got the vaccine how would they distribute it all?
Nuka._.gh0ul
It's not like it would immediately be available to everyone but they would certainly be able to distribute it throughout their ranks and then possibly set up clinics throughout the country and/or sell it to doctors and hospitals as they came into contact with them. It's a pretty simple progression actually.
Not to mention there is a recording you can find where they will admit that there have been other people immune to the infection that they operated on and failed at getting a vaccine from.
+UltimateWolfy so a sacrificing a couple of people is worth saving humanity it doesn't matter how many fails theyre were if there's a chance to save the human race then u take it
In fable i invested all into the housing, where I made so much money I was able to do all the good! Money is the source of happiness only if you have it!
Killing how many people to own homes?
@@MitchThePlank did not have to kill people in fable 3 to buy homes
You forgot "Kain from Legacy of Kain" . The first few games he seems like the villain but in the end he was right all along because he was just trying to protect the world from a hidden threat. Some sort of greenish gas entities that possess people from another dimension or something , I don't know they never fully explained it nor did the game developers ever finish the series.
Still one of the best protagonists from a criminally underrated franchise.
Defiance was technically supposed to be the end...with killing the elder god
I love Pagan Min. He's a bad guy, and good man, but damn if he isn't the best choice that shithole has.
same
I feel like Andrew Ryan from Bioshock belongs on this list.
That was what I was thinking too.
pagan min is protagonist. golden path are terrorists
+Greg Hendrix basically! lol, I have always thought the golden path were the bad guys tbh 😂 I feel Like pegan wasn't as bad as vaas
Did King Logan tell his subjects about the threat that would make him look a lot less tyrannical
You assume anyone would believe him. More likely, they'd just think he was either crazy(ier) or that he was making excuses to consolidate his power.
He could have at least tried. If they're all cynical dicks thats their problem lol.
Telling the masses the truth would either: 1. They dont believe him, and think he is trying to decieve them into subjugation, or 2. Cause mass panic, loss of order and a lot of unnecessary deaths
"Hey, everyone, there's a sinister, unstoppable dark force approaching that will inflict a fate worse than death on everyone in the Kingdom, when it arrives in about a year. Now, if we could all just put aside our petty differences, and pay lots of tax, we can afford... guys?". Logan was still a terrible King, because his solution was so bad, it led to his being deposed, but he was fundamentally doing the right thing
@@talltroll7092 the thing is, he started out with good intentions, doing the bad stuff to get more money, but once he had gone that far, something switched within him to the point he realized there are no limits to what he can do and became power mad, it's like the Dark Side in Star Wars, you start wanting power to do the right thing, but in the end all you want is more power. Killing your sweetheart versus killing innocent protesters has no gain but to prove he has more power
Literally no one disagreed with Marlene, my only gripe is that they didn’t make it Elies choice to sacrifice
Or just kill them and not play the trash that is 2
with the villians in gotham i was reading this light novel at one point and the main character made a spell in which it targeted all the corrupt bad guys cops etc and just ripped their heart out. all bad guys gone and his company that no one knew that he had swooped in saved everyone and made the place safer for all
Actually the whole reason Pagan Min is the bad guy is because the Golden Path killed Lakshmana Min, the protag's half sister. He was honestly a pretty okay dude.
Wait wait wait a minute. Wouldn't that make the Golden Path the bad guys? Y'know, since they apparently killed the protag's half sister, thus turning the protag *against* them?
You just realized?
I thought the fact that the ending being a choice between turning country into North Korea or ISIS Islam Caliphate would make it pretty obvious.
"Hidden" ending is best(the one where you just sit at the table and wait).
Yeah, I mean honestly I never felt compelled to fight against Pagan. "Oooo, he stabbed some anonymous guard and some guy who I can't even remember his name." I'm sure he had his reasons. Besides, you know how many people I stabbed along the way to overthrowing Pagan? Hundreds. Who's the real monster?
Also he is funny as hell, some of his lines were the funniest ive heard in gaming.
+StarWarsJockey its not just about what he's done its about what kyrat will be in the end and his rule sounds better than the solutions the golden path has to offer
If you had read the journals/notes that belonged to a doctor in The Last of Us, you'd know that the surgeries rarely worked and the Fireflies only did it to keep morale up. That's why Joel had gone back to save Ellie.
I think I know which one you talking about. For that specific entry, the doctor said that when compared to other infected, Ellie shared similar conditions, but there are few unique conditions which only Ellie have that made her "immune" and prevent her from being turned. So, instead of using the cordyceps fungus that is traditionally found in infected, the doctor wanted to use Ellie's cordyceps and make a vaccine or at least mimic her condition. Plus, to be able to make a vaccine or mimic Ellie's condition is not guaranteed either.
Especially that you can't make vaccines for fungi.
Not to mention humanity was already starting to recover during the game and that having an immunity to cordyceps was not going "save the world" as many who played the game would of thought.
Based on Kenny Tran's explanation of the document, it would technically be a vaccine. For fungi. It just works differently.
The theory there is to infect you with the strain of cordyceps that does not turn you into a zombie, so that the more dangerous version of cordyceps cannot infect you because the path/location it needs to infect you at is already 'used up' by the supposedly harmless cordyceps. Theoretically.
Yeah, I mean no offense but there wasn't even a guarantee that they'd successfully create a vaccine. The resources of the Fireglies were impressive by post-apocalyptic standards, but they were no where near to a functioning government.
Even IF they create the vaccine, how do they distribute it? Basically all major infrastructure has been destroyed or withered into disrepair. And even IF they could distribute it all over the country, that doesn't solve the problem that there are still millions of infected wandering about. Sure you may not catch the disease, but you can still be eaten alive.
Some might have sacrificed Ellie for the CHANCE of a vaccine, but not Joel who has spent the last several months (at least) doing everything in his power to keep her alive and forming a bond with her.
"It's a face not a bikini line" gave me a good chuckle lol
“If God is all powerful, He is not all good. If He is all good,He is not all powerful”- Luther- Batman vs Superman
Faulty logic
This same point has been made and disproven many times
The thing is, Humans can not make since of God, if you could then he would not be God. Your brain is designed to survive on Earth and that's it. Survive.
Merk Six18 honestly I thought that the quote sounded cool
So this is basically ark survival evolved and we just chilling but no dinosaurs
No Jane, always make decisions based on the hat you get.
If she gets a Sombrero dies that mea. she should learn Spanish.
And when there is no hat to get?
True chaos
+Danny Fink just murder every NPC in the game if there's no hat
Just ask fallout 4. Side with literally anyone other than the Brotherhood of steel and get Elder Maxson's sweet jacket!
Left out every single Metal Gear antagonist.
Wow really now your just being ludacrious.
Even if they do have a valid point the methods are messy tactics.
Except Volgin
***** IConnor Randles And how exactly did Raven have a valid point?
***** I would need to look him up.
Villains can have valid points the problem is how do they accomplish their goals?
Typically it's through destructive messy methods and with a complete disregard for bystanders.
To them if they have to step on the toes of bystanders they'll say the whole old as a watch :
"The ends justify the means."
Jason Case Obviously I'm talking about the main antagonists.
In Far Cry 5, Joseph Seed had a point about you, who always was gunning all of the cultists, but when you finally confront him, he asks you “do you ever think about solving a problem without a bullet?” And you kill every cultist you see. And Faith Seed, Joseph’s sister, told you to have faith in Joseph, because he is actually trying to save you. At the end, he still forgives you.
Kefka from Final Fantasy 6 is the most justified villain. He was tortured and experimented on with Magicite throughout his childhood. The experiments eventually gave him access to godly knowledge of the universe. At the end of the game he genuinely knows that there is no point to existance and is trying to end everything to save everyone from a pointless existance full of pain and loss.
no , he doesn't have a point.
Like you said , he pretty much turned insane over an experiment , and *assume* that there is no point to exist , which is a sanctimonious and poignant reason.
there was life before humans and there will be life long after , "living" in itself do not bring a "reason" , it's what you do with that life that brings a reason to it.
Damn... i guess i should've just stayed in the dining room, enjoying the crab rangoon...
The crab Rangoon, am I right? It's delicious
You can actually.. :3 You can trigger a secret ending if you stay for like fifteen minutes I believe?
+SimpDev yeah. I was tying to say what min said. It was something like "The Crab Rangoon, riiight? It's HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHA delicious"
+SimpDev yeah. I was tying to say what min said. It was something like "The Crab Rangoon, riiight? It's HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHA delicious"
LivingShadow13 Yep xD
I gotta say I pretty much agree with Anarky something close to 100%.
Squared Up honestly same
Nah, he's just reaching for justifications. People say the ends justify the means, I say the means shape the ends. When has murder and terror ever created something worthwhile?
The Roman Empire.
It’s Matt Mercer’s voice making him sound so reasonable. :)
Minus the bombs... right?
"I did what had to be done." In the fight for the greatest good the line between good and evil is razor thin.
There are times when the choice is not between good and evil, but between bad and worse. Having no safe alternative, no result which can be considered good, no place of moral safety, and the choice is yours to be made. And whatever choice you make, you will be legitimately criticized and mocked, possibly cursed. Even the public knowledge that things might have been worse will be no refuge, as in the minds of those around it had only the potential to be worse, and in light of a possible better outcome the reality of our current difficulties will always seem a worse alternative. In such circumstances, in the hands of those who have power, who do not wish to make decisions over the lives of millions but do so anyway, there is little solace, much loneliness, and few who will ever understand the strain.
If you actually stand there and listen to Anarky's ramblings, he flip-flops around four or five times.
Pagan Min is fucking awesome in far cry 4. I wish Ubisoft could have given us a choice to to become rulers of Kyrat. Pagan Min himself said it belongs to us and one day we'll kill Amita and Sabel and take throne back.
I wish you would have got to choose if you wanted to fight against or with the golden path
There is when pagan min ask you to wait while he is torturing the other guy that got into his house with you actually wait for 10 minutes he will comeback and you will see for yourself
+Roberto Marú but it's not a proper ending, it's like a 5 minute tease of awesomeness
Missed an opportunity for a dlc.
S.M. grimbldoo it could be a what if DLC like "The Tyranny of King Washington"
I really wish that there had been a DLC for Far Cry 4 that gave best ending a full campaign, where Pagan teaches you about the beauty of Kyrat, while you cleanse a few infestations with him, accompanied by some great hits from the 80s blaring in the background.
instead: YETIS!!!
agreed
Is it true that the DLC for FC4 figures a Piece of Eden? (from the Assassin's Creed mithology)
Felipe Carvalho IT might be. Far Cry 3 had some DLC talking about the evil company from AC (Abstergo?).
there is Farcry yetis and there are the bonus hurt missions
"Nanomachines, son"
Most villains of MGRR have some sort of point to them, especially Senator Armstrong. Even Jetstream Sam, although we never hear it.
Metal Gear in general is great for that. Liquid, Solidus, Ocelot. They're not all wrong, and do have decent arguments....at points. About the only ones who really are wrong completely are Volgan and Zero. Maybe Skullface, although I do like the idea of everyone shutting up already.
*i was watching a movie with my family and I said “the bad guy has a point” and my family looks at me weird now idk why there mad about a WW2 movie🤷🏻♂️*
You tried justifying the holocaust?
Kellen Nicholson what are you mad about? 🤣
No Handsome Jack from Borderlands 2 and 1 1/2? He may have been crazy buuuut he’s got a bit of a point
Id say hes probably the most validated villian up to Thanos
@@DocD4nk in all honesty he was right in a way
@@Santeneal Thinking about it, yeah. Pandora is a shitshow of a planet and he wanted to fix it. Though most of his decisions were fucking terrible, atleast his intentions were somewhat good 🤷♀️
@B_x !! honestly even if you couldn't side with Jack he doesn't deserve to die. I mean Lilith scared his face, made him lose the use of an eye then you go kill his daughter the only family he most likely has left the vault hunters could have just taken him prisoner
@B_x !! ya I know
There are many times where I would side with the "bad guy" in a game if given the choice.
like?
Any game that trades morals for cool powers.
Any game that trades morals for cool powers.
+okhalo45 infamous
Morals. Morale is not what you seem to think it is.
Think all of the fun of being terribly sorry about everything. Damn that made my day 😂
For Far Cry 4, Pagan Min will let you spread your mother’s ashes if you don’t just leave, which makes the point even better.
anything: * happens *
Batman: BATPUNCH
🦇👊
batman intesifies
Joker: ALL WOMEN ARE QUEENS!!!
Batman: IF SHE BREATHES SHES A THOOOOOOOOOOOTTT!!!!!!!!!
Everyone watching: THE WHAT!?
Wow, Anarchy is a pretty cool character he should be used in more stories
+mrwindupbird101 that's why I honestly don't like batman. His methods aren't very good. He could have saved many people if he put down villains, rather than let the villains free by putting them in the jail they will soon escape from
Lol, you guys sound like Red Hood
+Eden Is A Unicorn And I completely agree with everything, most people can change but they aren't given a chance and I hate killing but sometimes it truly is the only option its like what Joker said "So are you going to do it this time? Or just put me in another body cast for six months" If he can injure people to the extent he can then he can kill for the greater good. Its his antiquated sense of morality in Jason Todd's words that keep him from doing what is truly right he has to get over his dead parents and be logical, he is killing those people just as much as Joker his because he let the Joker live.
I have a theory that Bruce Wayne could do more good for Gotham than Batman ever could. With his money he could easily fund the campaigns of any politicians he wanted to run for office. Meaning he could choose politicians who want to serve, rather than further there own ambitions. He could also use that money to buy up real estate, create affordable housing, and employ people. People are less likely to turn to crime if they have a job and a roof over their head.
Eden Is A Unicorn Exactly, like the first time someone goes on a crazy fueled kill spree, lock them up. If they escape and do it again, tighten security. If they do it for the next 30 years, all those dead innocents are on your head though. And Batman isn't above letting someone he likes get away with crimes if it suits him so just let ol Hood to go visit the Joker for one night while the Bat is on the other side of Gotham.
Asgore, If he gets your soul then he can save all monsterkind. And in the genocide run Chara has quite a bit of motivation for erasing your game.
This is a bit late, but Asgore from Undertale just wanted to free his kingdom
I'm reminded of the saying, "Every villain is a hero in his own mind." The most fascinating and well-written villains are always the ones with identifiable reasons for doing what they've done, rather than the cookie-cutter "Imma do bad things cuz I'm bad" sorts.
They're the best because they're realistic. They have a separate ideology of what's right and wrong, and you just so happen to play as someone from the competing ideology. It's like Democrats and Republicans. They both see the other as hateful bigots trying to destroy America, and themselves as the patriotic saviors trying to restore it. In some ways, they're both right, and they're both wrong. What we've lost is the ability to meet in the middle and legislate the best of both worlds. Fun times.
Topical, and actually quite true. Nice observation!
+Ryan Gunn - You ruined your comment by using politics as an example.
+Sexual Pan Nah, it was a great comment.
Nkechi Nnachetta
*ahem* liketheJoker ;)
You can pull off anything if it's done well and makes sense.
Handsome Jack had a point he was egotistical but had a point. the vault hunters were the raiders of Pandora
Pepper Playing through the pre-sequel and Tales from the Borderlands made me realise that not only is he a great villain, but yes he indeed have a point.
Yeah Handsome Jack was created very much by Lilith's idiocy, and the larger narrative was basically "Jesus Christ you dumb fuck you did this to yourself congrats you moron"
Some other examples of bad guys who had a point...
Infamous - Kessler
Kessler is the main character from the future. In his timeline, he didn't defeat a villain called the Beast, who ended up destroying most of the world. So his whole thing as villain was to give himself (you the player) your powers and toughen you up so that you could face the Beast and win, thus saving the planet. Yes, there was a lot of local carnage... but it was the whole "greater good" thing. All the damage he caused was nothing compared to what the Beast would do if left unchecked.
Witcher 2 - Letho
He was assassinating kings in order to revive the School of the Viper and bring more Witchers to the world, who were needed to stop the rampant threat of monsters.
Red Dead Redemption - Edgar Ross
While he's the villain TO YOU... you are actually the bad guy in the game. Ross is a lawman, who kidnaps your family and forces you to hunt down the rest of your gang. While it's by no means moral what he's doing, he's using one criminal to take out others, and making the country a safer place without you and your gang in it.
Kirby's Adventure - King Dedede
King Dedede has the Star Rod, which powered the Fountain of Dreams to give everyone in Dream Land good dreams. So as Kirby, you fight your way to him to get the Rod back. The thing is, Dedede stole the Rod in the first place because the REAL villain, Nightmare, was going to use it to invade the dreams of everyone and give them never ending nightmares.
Half-Life 2 - Dr. Breen
The "Administrator of Earth" as appointed by the Combine after they conquer the planet, he's seen as the villain, as he helped them do so. The thing is, with his help, they were able to conquer the planet in 7 hours. The alternative, was them wiping out the planet entirely. So he chose to have the Combine conquer the Earth instead of just flat out murdering everyone.
Chrono Trigger - Magus
Magus is one of the "villains" in Chrono Trigger (until you recruit him later). You fight him to stop him summoning the world destroyer Lavos. However he's actually from far in the past, a world that Lavos destroyed while killing his sister and throwing the 3 wise men he learned from through time. He was summoning Lavos not to destroy the world, but to destroy Lavos itself. However the heroes mess all that up. :p
Darksiders - Abaddon
He knew that eventually humanity would get the power to rival heaven and hell, and when they did, billions would die in the war, including countless angels. So his plan was to break PART of the seals, to get hell's generals in place to take them out without fully breaking the seals and bringing the Horsemen into the picture. But unfortunately, thanks you War, that plan goes to hell and humanity gets wiped out, and heaven and hell beat the crap out of each other.
Joel was the villain in the last of us. Not the fireflies
Exactly. Joel is shown to be extremely selfish and possessive. I fail to see why people think TLoU is a masterpiece by rooting for such a piece of shit.
I really feel like we should have been able to kill both Amita and Sabal in far cry 4
Oliver Chapman I did I killed Anita then went back and killed Sabal
Oliver Chapman I did that
You can actually end the game, ....right at the start. After the bus scene at the start, you go to Pagan's house and he says to wait 10 or 15 minutes. If you actually wait, he will return and you will have the ending.....at the start of the game. :), Weird, right?
I agree; I kinda got annoyed that I was the one that did everything, then had to turn the country I pretty much single headedly liberated over to someone who'd screw it up even more
Oliver Chapman i did.
Most the the time, the problem is not about if they have a point, but how they are making it.
Amen
I've found that to be how everything works.
Murder can work after a while. People usually respond to fear.
@@yourpsychicfriendfredbear you can't murder ideas. Faith is more moving than fear. Fear is not respect. An afraid person can be the most irrational and dangerous. A mind broken with fear will no longer know fear
The means to an end. You don't burn down the house when the roof leaks. Or cut off the jammed toe
As a huge DC and Batfan, I've always loved Anarky's costume in the comics. It's one of my all time favorite costumes
broooo same
One thing that always puzzled me is why King Logan didn't just tell people the Crawler was coming. I'm pretty sure you'd get less disagreements about the high taxes if people knew they were going to fight the Elder Gods.
Logan wasn't a good person. Trying to protect your kingdom from invasion is just what leaders do, even evil ones.
I'm still wondering why THE PLAYER couldn't tell people about the Crawler, I mean something like "Hey, listen, Page. I know child labor is bad but we're preparing for war here. Would you rather those kids died instead of helping us all survive? We can form schools afterwards." The Hero was a popular guy/girl, I'm sure at least some people would understand, those who didn't wouldn't have a choice.
Aska2468 The game handwaves it away by saying Reaver (the guy who makes all the buildings and renovations) leaves Albion after the game so that's why you can't make evil choices then revert them after the Crawler attacks. (It's a shit justification but that's what they said)
southparkkenny2 It really is a shit justification.
Since the Hero spends their days after the final battle doing nothing, they could easily go to the industrial district, gather some volunteers, clear out the factory those children were working at of tools and machinery and make some damn desks.
Just because Reaver left Albion after the battle means the infrastructure and economy has to be frozen solid? Is nobody is willing to take Reaver's place?
What I'm wondering is if buying property was so cheaply why didn't the king himself buy up all the houses and store and fund the war, that's what I did. I had 50,000,000 when I finally took over and transference it all to the treasury. Got to keep all my promises.
I thought Alduin the World Eater had a point.
I mean, it's a world where Braith exists, so... Tuck in.
Braith and The Man Who Sucked Everyone In The Cloud District's Dick
+Graviton Forfeit Hey now. Nazeem's achievement is actually pretty impressive.
i always wondered how literal the whole "world eater" part is...
I always thought the world eater title was just part of Alduin's legend and that he really wanted to bring Skyrim back to the days when the dragons ruled over the country.
We alduin in this world, it's all shit anyway.
plus I live in it, so that's a great reason right there
Two that come to mind for me are Andrew Ryan, from Bioshock, and N from Pokemon Black/White. Both of them really have a point.
You know, to the antagonist, your character is the "bad guy".
Going by that, at the very least 50% of "bad guys" in games have a point.
Only the joker was really evil, he didn't have a reason to do anything, he just wanted to fk the world up
Well, technically the joker is not that much of a bad guy because he knows the world he is in, is not real. he also knows that he is in a comic/game and that the world he is in needs a bad guy. he also knows that characters in comics which are not important become forgotten and that batman needs a main villain so that the comics can continue.
+Energy DRAGPNSLAYER
Wow, I had no idea that the "Joker" character from Batman was actually a fourth-wall breaker... I thought ALL of the characters in that series acted as if their world was real, like how our world is the real world, I didn't figure any of them knew they were in a comic. But of course, that's probably because I never looked at a single Batman comic, show, or anything. I just heard about the basic stuff. But upon reading this comment, I might look into it, I just might.
Oh so that explains why he doesnt reveal his backstory, he knows it gets changed in the next issue lol
Anarky does have a point about Batman being the cause of everything. I mean, he did indirectly create the Joker, and maybe Hush. And Bane wouldn't have traveled to Gotham to challenge him.
How did he create the Joker?
joker fell into a giant container of acid because of him and those chemicals are part of the reason he is what he is today.
Thats only in a movie. Joker doesn't have an origin in the comics. As he stated, he "like it multiple choice", and he makes up several origin stories for himself.
H. John Well, I mean, the Killing Joke is pretty much considered the best Batman story of all time. And the multiple choice line is from that.
PixelRush exactly, so Batman couldn't have indirectly created the Joker.
See I think Logan is wrong still. He didn't need to have child slavery, raise taxes and all that.
He just had to buy all the real estate and keep the rent the same as what it was before the purchase.
That's what I did, it took me about an in game year starting with no gold and in less then the year I saved up enough to cover everything and enough to get the weapon at the top of the vault.
With the kingdom's gold he could have picked up real estate a lot faster and could have had the money faster then I did.
"All those years hating the templars". You clearly did not play AC I.
I knew they'd mention at least one assassin's Creed Game. You're right too, every single AC game presents the dilemma of government/freedom. It's nothing new suddenly in the 3rd game.
Yep. ACIII is the first time the Templars make their case very clear, but it's still summed up in one word: control. For years (and I'm gonna get a little political here so bear with me), I've always said that the Templars were like modern leftists and the Assassins were like conservatives. The former wants power and control any way they can (just like the Democratic Party), and the latter wants to preserve freedom and let things happen naturally, with minimal interference.
@@AdderTude I think that's closer to the truth, but really liberals and conservatives are the Templars, because they're government. The assassin's are anarchists. Even libertarians aren't extreme enough to be assassin's I don't think. More in their direction though.
@@samuelbarrett1082 If the Assassins are anarchists, they'd seek to overthrow every government they could find. Within ACIII, they'd support the Sons of Liberty and then turn on them after the American government is established.
Anarchy, being the absence of government, is usually taken to the extreme by anarchists, who seek to do away with government altogether (they essentially live by "no government, ever"). History has shown that anarchy never prospers or lasts.
Your view of lumping leftists (there's a clear difference between liberals and leftists, btw) and conservatives together under the Templars is far too simplistic.
@@AdderTude I think you have a misunderstanding of anarchists. While anarchy is an ideology of no control, it's not necessarily one of violence. I would say usually not. Live and let live. If you want to be ruled over by someone, who am I to say that's wrong?
The early days of this country were very different than today. Freedom was actually a concept people understood. We'd lay down if someone wanted a percentage of our tea profits. Not we ponder how much the government should be tracking our every move and in what situations it's really ok.
I know there's a difference between liberal and leftist but common modern vernacular doesn't differentiate so I took the opportunity to be lazy.
I'm sure this whole back and forth is a case of "there's nothing libertarians hate more than libertarians" so I'll settle my side here. At least we both appreciate AC for our own reasons. So that's good.
Isn't there an alternative ending for FC4? You just have to wait for the villain to return in the beginning and beat the game without any huzzle.
Yes. After the intro portion, Pagan Min sits Ajay down to dinner with himself and a few other guys, stabs one of the back after catching him texting the Golden Path for help, then leaves to suppress the uprising. If you decide to wait there, Pagan Min will be happy Ajay waited for him and takes him to the peak of the mountain via his helicopter to leave Ajay's mother's ashes. It's winning while doing aboing absolutely nothing because that's all Ajay wanted to do.
For real?!? LOL . Talk about speed run
The crab rangoon right?
@@James-mm2zc I've no idea what that means :D never played the game.
@@mandoschMUh that what they eat during that first scene
I never considered marlene in TLOU bad. What she wanted was for the greater good and I think Ellie would have agreed with her.
well it is technically the games' antagonist, therefore making her the bad guy
+The Camera Box just because they're an antagonist doesn't mean they're the bad guy, it just means they're the opposition of the main character
Maybe it's just me but when I finished TLOU I interpreted the ending to be a passing of judgement on the human race, after seeing all the bitter fighting Joel had seen he'd completely given up on the human race and willingly doomed it to extinction. The way I see it Joel is the villain, it's just he happens to be a relatable one
an antagonist does not have to be a bad guy.. The antagonist just simply has to be working against the main character...
Humanity was too far gone a cure would only help stop the infection buy the real problem is people.
In Far Cry 4, there was no reason to kick off Pagan Min. If I knew the fact that I could sit and wait at the dining table for 10 min for Pagan to return, I would. All Ajay was meant to do was bring his mother's ashes. The real villain in Far Cry 4 was the Golden Path itself who brainwashed Ajay.
4:10 "Gotham city is fantastically, spectactularly corrupt"
Me, a Brazilian: *laughs in Brazil*
It's fine and dandy to save money to save Albion, but did you really have to traumatise your brother by threatening to kill either his best friend or 15 innocent people? Kind of a dick move.
Trauma can leave lasting scars, and by association lasting lessons. To a tyrant who believes (maybe rightly so) that the ends justify the means, his purpose could be as stated: he regularly has to make hard decisions, investing in the future of the safety of the nation by sacrificing freedom, safety, and life now. He was likely a good dude until he saw the truth of what was coming, and that caused him to become desperate.
I do believe that Anarky is right about everything. Bruce could have saved Gotham City long ago if he had been more willing to do what is necessary. Should he indiscriminately kill every criminal? No, just those who deserve it, especially Joker. But he can't do that, because his precious moral code is much more important than the thousands that the Clown Prince has killed (Jason Todd) and the many more that have suffered (Barbara Gordon). THAT is the definition of arrogance.
The more I think about it, the more I realize batman is actually as bad as the rest of Gotham's villains (I guess that's sort of the whole underlying plot in the Gotham games).
Most of them are either crazy, misunderstood or justified. Batman is just a histrionic sociopath. Of course he doesn't want to kill the terrorists and psychopaths, he gets so much validation and 'fun' out of it.
Sure, he does some good when he saves people and as Bruce Wayne when he throws money around him, but I think it's disingenuous. Once again I think he just loves the attention and validation.
Isaac Gleeth Jason isn't dead
In batman arkham city game batman finally let joker died because he kill talia
No, in Arkham City Joker destroys the cure by accident. Batman even says "Even after everything you've done, I still would have saved you."
Chong Weiliang what, no. Lmao. He goes out of his way to still try and save Joker. Joker dies because Joker screws up really hard.
Regardless, yeah, with the money Bruce has, it's entirely reasonable to think that he could invest in better infrastructure in the city and remove corruption over time. But he doesn't. He goes all vigilante. Most Batman villains seem far more partial than many villains in other comics, and it's because they exist due to Gotham's corruption. Batman never seeks to solve that issue beyond putting people in Arkham. Because of that, the cycle will never end. The GCPD is always corrupt, and Batman's friends suffer. While you can't really condone Anarky, you can easily understand why. And realistically, Batman is simply another problem invented by Gotham itself. A vigilante is still a grievous offense to justice most of the time.
C’mon! You had to spoil Streets of Rage 2, released 28 years ago!?
Major armstrong was the first villain i encountered that made me sit back and think about what he was saying, he wanted to end wars as a business, he wanted to save the lives of Billions by sacrificing the lives of millions
Surprised Handsome Jack wasn't on here.
me to honestly
because he kinda was a huge asshole and killed alot of people for no good reason, I mean jack and Roland had the same exact goals except jack wanted to control the warrior to subjugate and kill people
Jack didn't have a point, though. He wanted to make Pandora a dictatorship over an anarchy, which isn't really all that great either.
+Walter C. Dornez (The Angel Of Death) But Jack was mostly doing that for revenge after the crimson raiders kinda sabotaged him for no reason and his girlfriend betrayed him for no reason in Pre-Sequal... He was a pretty cool guy.
+George Rose (ONI Section Zero) at least there would be order
3:17 I've played through all of Fable 3 knowing there was something familiar about Logan's voice and have now just realized it's Michael Fassbender.
When first time meeting Amita,I feel *I think I fell in love with this character* then after getting closer to the end of the game,I find out that Amita is really evil and I feel *NO,HOW COULD YOU BETRAY ME,I CANT BELIEVE THIS*
The mission that I need to do i really painful because I need to kill her...
8:10 I remember laughing my ass out while he forced him to scream for help, his screaming was just funny.
Handsome FUCKING Jack
Handsome Jack wanted to purify Pandora from all the bandits and marauders and lawless mercenaries (vault hunters) to do so he needed The Warrior to be under his command.
yeah but he had no real good intentions for a end game and remember he had innocent people killed not just bandits
Handsome Jack's story is more one of good intentions gone bad. Can't say much without spoiling it, but he HAD good intention. It's just that after the events of Pre-Sequel, those he loved turning on him, constantly being interrupted at every turn, and no one really giving him a figurative shot without firing a literal shot at him he eventually became the dickish, murderous, relentless and merciless man we now him as now. If you've never played Pre-Sequel, it's not the best game ever, but it does do what it set out to do, give more insight as to Jack's reasons for what he did.
+poptop89 that's what I thought but he was a bad Apple before his apperent corruption started hence why he has a double and getting shot at lol
Yeah, yeah. He was still bad. He wasn't GREAT. But He wasn't that bad. He is in a sort of "I have a good idea, I just have a bad way of doing it" He wants to bring Pandora to peace, that's a great idea, he just has a bad way of pulling it off. Most of the innocent killings happen as his frustration and resentment to the world grows.
Except in Fable 3, the villain having a point is expressly part of the plot, not something you realize "Now I Think About It". Logan is a tyrant and an asshole, but he's trying to raise an army to fight the creeper. Once you get on the throne, you quickly realize "doing the right thing" isn't as easy as one might think.
Actually, the thought I realized when I got the throne was 'great, now I have something to do with all this useless money' and proceeded to single handedly fund the kingdom.
I may have had a different playing experience than everyone else, though.
It's part of the plot, but more of a spoiler if anything. You're not supposed to know that beforehand.
But that's the same with Far Cry 4 and The Last of Us as well. Part of the plot. Really just a spoiler, not a convoluted motivation.
Unless you farm gold like a maniac, buy all the properties in Albion and use the rent to fund your war like I did.
Exactly as Blaine said. Seeing how easy it is to make money in real estate it just makes Logan look incompetent.
Corey1873 Agreed, that what I did as well. If you invest and rent out all of Albion, you can easily fund the war AND keep all your promises; especially if you don't rush to kick Logan out.
This was my first Oxbox video ever and 5 years later, Oxbox and Oxtra are my favorite channels. Thanks for almost 5 years of entertainment.
Thanos.
‘Nuff said! (R.I.P. Stan Lee)
I don't think Joel from Last of Us thought killing Ellie was the "wrong thing to do". I don't think he cared about right or wrong anymore. He cared about Ellie. As far as the rest of the world was concerned, they could all rot into a giant pile of semi-sentient fungus.
And I get it. Sure, it's selfish, but who out there cared about Joel--other than Ellie? Pretty much everyone he met tried to rob him, kill him, _eat_ him...why would he sacrifice something so important to him for a world that was gone beyond recovery, in which the denizens, even the still-sapient ones, are barely above animals?
Joel did what was best for Joel and what Joel cared about. I can't for the life of me think of a real reason why he should have done anything else.
By murdering even more people, he's sacrificing people he doesn't care about to save the one he does.
That's selfish, not saying I wouldn't feel the same in his position but that's what it is.
+Sagnus1 Selfish for a good reason
+UltimaKeyMaster Actually the whole thing would have failed. Ellie isn't immune in the sense that the fungus can't infect her, she's been infected with a mutated strain that doesn't drive you insane and keeps all the insanity strains out of your head. They were trying to create a vaccine for a fungus when they should have been taking a look at their anti fungal developments and compare what effect they have on the cordecyps instead of cutting up multiple "immune" people to develop a cure that was never going to be a cure in the first place. Joel isn't in the right for killing all those fireflies, but they weren't in the right either for removing the brains of people without the medical knowledge to know that this whole plan of theirs wasn't going to work from the beginning.
Killing the doctors now that was "wrong"
+UltimaKeyMaster Even if the cure worked, the world was beyond recovery. Humanity had regressed, social order had broken down, and nothing short of a massive armed takeover/subjugation from some miraculously incorruptible sorts would have restored order.
+Slaine McCool Again, Joel didn't care.
Handsome jack isn't that bad. He was betrayed by people he thought were friends. I would turn in to a murderous psycho if that happened to me.
Someguy1237 thats why im a sociopath :D
Fun fact about Fable 3. There's a set cost for funding the Army to beat the darkness with maximum efficiency. If you already happen to have that much money you can still take all the good decisions and use your personal treasury to fund the army instead. Best of both worlds despite it take me a few days of AFKing while having everything bought out
RIP Sir Walter, May the Great Beard in the Sky save his soul from the Darkness
king logan didn't have a point.
He could have just invested in real estate, and he would have enough money to win as many wars as he wants.
you do what you know how to do being driven by fear made him a tight wad and hated by the people . what could you do in that situation? if your hated they drive prices up so you cant buy or never sell .
if an exile can amass a fortune big enough to run a kingdom and and army at the same time.
I'm sure a king can do the same.
Haiiry Cake a hero can do things other humans cant. not an exile a Hero.
there are heroes around and instead of consulting with people who can do extraordinary things, Logan decided to keep the monsters a secret. Which had no purpose
Clearly you know nothing about psychology or crowd control. He kept it a secret because if they people knew then there would be fear and chaos of an immense intensity, crime would go up, people will lose hope, the though of impending doom would drive weak minded people to almost insanity or insanity, etc there are many factors to calculate. His method are not acceptable but fear can do a lot to a man specially something so powerful that will for sure come at you.
Actually, you find out through little hidden thingies that Marlene and the Fireflies have found hundreds of people who are immune to the fungus, like Ellie.
She's desperate to get Ellie under the scalpel because she's the last one they've found in a while, and they've already managed to kill the others they've found.
So yeah, Joel was in the right, and Marlene saw Ellie as another chance.
It's kind of unclear, but personally that's definitely my interpretation. And even IF killing child somehow wound up making a cure, the Fireflies wouldn't want to or be able to distribute a cure even if they were interested in using it for humanitarian purposes, and not a weapon for overthrowing what's left of civilization.
*cough* Joel murdered bunch of people just to save one person regardless *cough*
No matter how you cut it, he's in the wrong. Had it been the case of "Save Ellie and doom any chance of finding a cure" it still been pretty shitty but its an old philosophy question like the "Trolly Problem" but what he actually did was "Kill bunch of people to save Ellie and doom any chance of finding a cure" so yeah, he was just selfish and in the wrong. Now, I'll say it is very much a human thing to do, but in the end its selfish and destructive and in now way a morally correct answer.
you don't even know if it's possible to make a cure with what they had. it's only ONE sample. and if that ONE sample get's contaminated, well, Ellie is now dead for nothing. sense the human race seems to be evolving to become immune to this fungus, the more that lives the better. For the LONG TERM saving Ellie is the best choice.
***** "the more that lives the better" Are you forgetting the part where Joel kills bunch of people to get Ellie back?
100aegir i'm talking about those that are immune. I could have worded that better