2021 Harley Davidson Ultra Limited defeats me once again!!!!!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ส.ค. 2024
- My 2021 Harley-Davidson defeated me once again. I finally get the elusive cable for the Screaming Eagle Tuner, download the software, but am still unable to tune my brand new Harley Ultra Limited.
Merch (tee shirts and stuff!) www.teespring.com/stores/professional-monkey-merch
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Just before someone else says it the wrong way, it’s 1 3/4 drag pipes. Great channel thanks!
What did I say?
@@ProfessionalMonkey inch an a quarter.. I shouldn’t comment sometimes I just can’t help myself
I only use the vision tuner on my fuel injection bikes , if you have Harley install the vision tuner they have to do it according to OEM , I don’t ever buy my stuff from Harley , and those people that don’t think you have to tune a carburetor but I have lost their marbles, I had a 76 shovel head that was not stocked by any way shape or form had it for 21 years never lost a race not even against crotch rockets
Ahhh..the T-27...stripped a few using a T-25 especially on derby cover.
It's like they WANT you to strip T27s with a 25.
are you JACK BLACK's big bro? 😂love the channel man!!
Ha!! I'd have more money if I was.
@@ProfessionalMonkey got a question, what's your opinion on the saying" if you don't ride in the rain you're not a biker"? Personally I don't like it and I'll avoid it if I can.
I don’t like the the fact that you have to lock in a tuner to stay compliant either. But when I bought the 2021 road glide limited and had Harley do the 131 kit they warranted all the work and parts. I’m thinking that after the warranty runs out I can get like a TTS and get some of the heat out of the motor. I had to wrap the pipes, Which did take about 50% of the heat out and then the Hi Airflow fan to keep it bearable in stop and go things like at rallies.
Enjoy you videos and I have subscribed, I am a looking forward to getting my first Tri ultra glide.
Welcome aboard!
Bacon grease prevents rust
And smells nice...
Stage one, is the base for the other 3 stages.
To me, it's just base period, right?
My tuner is the orange race tuner. 👏🏻
Yup, that's the good one!
Make sure it’s not beggin strips. 😂😂
It has its on 2021 and later tuner.
21s use the same screaming eagle tuner, just a different cable. No software yet to use the tuner though...
Hey man. I change pipes, headers, air filter and tune every Harley I've had. My Ultra I have the FP3 on it. Not sure Im happy with it yet but I have yet to Autotune it yet to see if it helps it out. Only time I had Harleys tuner was the first bike I bought (sportster) quite a few years ago
I like the FP3, perfect for just a stage one. There isn't one for the 2021s yet, but I am damn tempted to go that way when they come out with it. Warranty is a problem of course but... ya know...
Excellent info to know.
Just a side note: ECM stands for Engine Control Module, not Electronic. This is to differentiate it from the TCM, or Tranny Control Module, which is required out in California where some of the athletes from last century have transitioned ... and have the typical tranny problems, which you want to Control. Thus, the TCM was invented by a lame Danish man during a break from luge racing practice.
That's freaking hilarious. They call it the BCM now, Body Control Module. Seriously!!!
that other plug is for your battery tender…..
No it's not. That was another data port...
@@ProfessionalMonkey Damn harley! on my 2018 its a three prong plug for the Harley BT, but a regular SAE plug fits and keeps the battery charged. Great channel Sir!!
No, it’s not tuned right from the factory.
Agreed.
It comes with a sock so keep it in your saddle bag.
CVOs didnt come with a sock, that's what it's off of.
Quick questions. Why a Street Glide this time? Do you have a preference between Street Glide and Road Glide?
Good question. I love them both. They really are different from one another, and they both have weaknesses. The batwing fairing add a lot of weight to the forks, but I think it looks better, the dash is nicer to look at and I think it gives you better weather protection. Road Glide handles better at low speed. I got a batwing this time just because I already had a road glide and I didn't want two of them basically.
Freaking Harley Davidson is right. Just an atrocious outfit that could easily be so much better if they actually gave a crap about their customers. I love my Harleys to a point but these guys are clueless and they wonder why they are struggling. Customer loyalty with these idiots can only go so far. Great video by the way.
Thanks. I love my bikes, but damn...
You know you got a good one when you’re in the garage working on your bike and a hand pops out from the door with a piece of bacon. 🤘🏼😎🤘🏼
You got that right!
Bought new 09 FXSTC, with mandatory Kalifornia EPA Emission's . First mod was Screaming A/C Kit. Slight Change in throttle response. Cycle Shack 3" slip-ons. Motor running hotter as weather warmed up. Engine would cough and completely die leaving stop sign, lights yada yada. Found Nightrider website. For $100 plugged in their XIED connectors between O2 sensors you have two one for each cylinder. Tricks the ECM thinking I need to add more fuel. No reprograming to ECM. Its reading sensor voltage. Mixture is close to 13.5-13.7. Oil temp dropped 20 F, never spits and sputters. We ride two up on Vegas strip 90+ degrees no issues, mpg 45+ solo. Best $100 ever spent on Mistress III Check them out. Ride Safe
Damn, I am looking into that. Sort of a "fooler" huh?
@@ProfessionalMonkey Yep thats the way I understand it as explained by the web site. Never had code show up, so yea Im pretty sure ECM is sitting there fat dumb and happy. Ride Safe
Your videos are always spot on. I understand dat!!
I appreciate that
I would never buy a new motorcycle that would rat me out for anything all the new electronic stuff they rat you out if you change anything they rat you out if you go fast they rat you out if you pass a stop sign to your insurance company big brother is watching
@@frankmarkovcijr5459 Lol.
Hello Mr Monkey. I am a new comer to your channel and must say I find it interesting and well presented, so thanks for that. I’ve been a Triumph driver for years but have recently bought a Night Rod. Where do you stand on them as I know there is a big difference of opinions. Andrew from Bonnie Scotland.
I used to have a V-Rod. I am a fan. Not much in the turns, but it's just too interesting a bike to not like, ya know?
Sure do. I’m loving it. Stuck on an oil rig offshore Tunisia at the moment so won’t be able to join the live stream but as soon as I get home I’ll be online to get a chat with folks on your channel. Keep up the good work. Cheers and beers.
TTS is the only way to go. Gonna cam and big bore my 2021 road king, to heck with the warranty
There is a Magnuson law that says they can't void a warranty for after market parts without proving the part caused the malfunction or damage.
Not entirely true. If you’re a lawyer I’m interested, but the reality is a limited warranty has limits, and one of these is that a modified drivetrain doesn’t have to be warranted by the manufacturer. The cost of proving them wrong is greater than the potential benefit.
Not a lawyer.
What is the Act?
The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, passed by Congress in 1975, governs the warranties on consumer products. It was designed to help consumers understand, compare, and enforce the warranties on their products. This federal statute protects consumer rights by compelling warrantors to use clear language and complete information in their warranties and to avoid deceptive practices. Any consumer product that comes with a warranty-including car parts and accessories-must comply with the Act. The Federal Trade Commission (FTC) has since been reminding consumers of their rights to install aftermarket parts without fear of having their warranties voided.
What no cocktails .!!!!!!!!!!!!
HA!!!! They came after for sure.
Go eat some bacon you'll feel better
I see your using the split vision mirrors on your Glide.
Got the same ones on my King.
Hey now, Deuche CVO guy here, or will be next week. The dealer told me last week that they can now tune with the HD tuner. Were you able to get yours complete?
My 21 isn’t a CVO, but I don’t know why they would say they can’t tune one certain model???
I was wondering if you had access to the software yet for 2021.
By the way, Just your page last night. Very entertaining and informative.
@@gmac2555 yup. I bought the tuner and the address to download the software was in there. It updated and included new tables for 21s.
Hey did not know where to put this post. I posted awhile ago and you answered back. just a question can a guy ride 16A and 86 in one day. and still see Rushmore? bringing a guy with me that has never been there.
Hi! You can take 16 into keystone, go up to see Rushmore, go past it, then turn around right after at the turn off, etc. What is 86? I can't think of what highway that is.
@@ProfessionalMonkey Thanks been years since I was there.
Is the cat still at the end of the headers of a 21 touring ? Or did they put them in the mufflers ?
Conspiracy Theory #1: Harley wants you to log in to your account so they can keep an eye on you while you void your warranty.
Ha!
Absolutely, love working on my bike. Been at this for over 50 years and wrenching on a bike is one of life's little pleasures. I hear ya on the breather and Rain. I live in central Florida and it can come as buckets.
Keeps me sane!
Intake valve burning?
I picked up a 2020 RoadGlide S and at 64 I love this bike.I did a stage 2 torque cam, full exhaust,HD Street tune and smart tune.This bike runs really nice . I do have a power vision that I used on my last build I like Dynos all my bikes were varying degrees of builds and tuners but this 2020 needs nothing.Thanks for the detailed easy to follow video. Ice work
The cam makes the sound just right!!!
Hmmmmm.... They did my 2021 CVO in March I did a stage 1. It's done of course with the screaming Eagle tuner
Yep, I was able to do mine in March. I did a video on it.
Great!!!!! Video
Glad you enjoyed it
My son bought Indian bobber do you void warranty if you do tuner on it also
I think it voids their warranty also but I would be friendly with the dealer and see what they say.
For the price of harley to tune it can you just get another tuner capable of tuning it like my dynojet power vision? Or would that void warranty
Everything but HDs tuner voids warranty.
The only thing I did was pipes and air cleaner and a Fuelpak
Why in the FK if the Street Tuner is EPA Compliant Do Bikes Not Already Come out with a Better/ Street Compliant Tune So as Not to Waste money on that Crap.. I had a Orange Race tuner on My 18 HD but not Touching my 20 FXLRS Since it Runs Cool and with Great mileage too..
The bike is tuned right from the factory for factory conditions. It's only of you change things that you need to retune.
I guess I’m a Luddite, if I wasn’t an old fart, I’d still be putting around on my Panhead, I finally got tired of kicking it, and the almost constant maintenance for everyday riding. I finally got a “modern” sled in 2010, an 01 Road King Police. (From your neighborhood, Sunny Isles Beach) nothing fancy but after years with the Pan, it was great, and to top it off, my wife had no problem with the ultra seat vs the pogo stick. Still too old for extensive tuning with the Moretti Magnetti brain, but it works well, and you can’t beat Florida for 12 months of riding weather
All modern bikes are tuned lean to meet EPA dictates. Many Japanese bikes are running around with a Power Commander V and there's guys who make a living out of reflashing the ECU. This guy may know a bit about his old bike but then again, it being the internet and all he may not even have a bike.
I'm confused. Am I the guy you're talking about? I am the guy in the video, and yes, I own the three bikes in my videos and work on them. That's my garage I am in...
@@ProfessionalMonkey Sorry about that. Talking about the guy who made the tuning comment, hoping he might read the post and start putting things together. Maybe clear up the fog a bit. Though from the comment My guess is that he doesn't own a bike at all and is just a troll.
@@mose717 GOTCHA. I was thinking maybe you were responding to someone else. No worries. Thanks for chiming in!
Ah, reminded me of my old fuel pack days and the the orange HD tuner on my Road King...I miss that bike...thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it
So let the comedy begin!!! 🤣
Thanks for putting this up. Just purchased at 21' RGS and nobody could tell me about tuning it.
Yup. Even if you have the tuner and cable for the new bikes, there is no software for them yet.
high mr monkey, I have a 05 883c and i'm looking for a tee handle set, sae and metric, what do you recommend, size from small to large, allen or torx or both or should I just go to harbor freight and go nuts with a mad shopping spree !!!
Thanks
jim
stage one 05 883c
I do all of my own wrenching
Whether on my bikes, or my cars!
It appears your wife’s truck is an eco-boost, if it makes you feel any better you can tune the shit out of them very easily. There have been people who have gotten almost an extra 100 hp from tuning alone
I would imagine, I love that thing. I need it to last though, I can't afford to replace it for a few years!
I hear you. We have a 17 el. It’s our family hauler so it’s bone stock. I personally never had any issues with my tuned eco boost trucks but my best friend did host a meet and greet between his intake valve and piston. So I fully understand.
@@decoteau89 Oh hell that was expensive.
In the same boat brother... sitting dead in the water with my 2021 FXLRS, just waiting...
BTW, is there a way to PM you?
You can e-mail me at damonk@professional-monkey.com
Do cobra 909's sound good on a 1997 HD elecrtraglide classic?
Anything sounds good on an evo. I would imagine it would be great.
@@ProfessionalMonkey thank you
Not being a smartass but with the lowers isn't that a mute point installing the heavy breather with the lower directly in front? I'm still on my first Harley and truly not being a dick in asking?
Totally reasonable question. The end of the heavy breather is closed anyway. It pulls air from the top and bottom so the flow is fine.
Love the Video on tuners, My parts dear told me that story too a few years ago, It was nice that you said it again for the new bike owners .
Glad you enjoyed it
Same boat here. Bought a 2021 CVO Roadglide last week with some good plans for upgrades. Had heard about the 21 ECM lock crap from the MoCo. After a bit more research and several phone calls found out that even the dealers will not have new maps and tables until late March. Vin numbers are also screwed up in HD database. IE: The vin for my 2021 CVO RoadGlide in Sunset Orange and Sunset Black fade is registered with HD as a CVO limited in purple and black. Mind boggling, that with nearly 9 extra months for this MY's rollout, they still couldn't get their shit together.
Sorry about your VIN problems. My tuner at least recognizes that it doesn't recognize the VIN. I really hope it isn't March before the software is updated!!!
Have a good feeling it would be a blast to drink beer with this guy!!!
I'm good at it!
I like your videos. They are informative and you usually appear to be happy. I like your perspective on family and motorcycles.
Glad you like them!
1st world problems brother....enjoyed the video anyways.
Tell me about it
There has been some testing m8 don’t need a tune if you put a exhaust and air filter the afr stay the same
Who is doing the testing? If you put more air into the motor how can the AFR stay the same without richening up? The ECM can only adjust 10% and that's intended for altitudes.
Bought my 2015 Ultra new while I was working overseas. Had a stage 1 installed and they added the orange tuner. One year later I’m traveling up 95 near Boynton Beach doing 70+ in the #2 lane when the bike just dies. ECM quit. Bikes under warranty but I need to pony up $300 for a new tuner because HD won’t let me use the orange one anymore. LOL, gotta love HD sometimes!!
I recently subscribed to your channel. Enjoy watching. I have a 2018 H-D Street Glide Special that I accessorized to basically like a limited. (I know, I should have just bought a Limited, but I just liked the SGS so much.) Anyway, the one accessory that has worked well for me and Especially my wife as passenger living here in Central Fl. In the summer, is the H-D,” Cool fan”. It deflects the engine heat in slow traffic pretty well especially for the passenger. That and putting on passenger floor boards really helped. The cool fan is $300.00. H-D to install is extra. The auto mode works best. The cool fan is not an engine cooler. It just draws away heat from you and your passenger in slow traffic. I like it out of all the accessories I slapped on my SGS. Just wanted to share. Keep up the videos. They’re great!
Thanks for letting me know, I have always been curious about that one. I think that's one where the dealer has to plug it in to activate it though, right?
Yes, there is a Dealer computer software for it and the three modes button ( off, on, and auto) on dash.You can toggle through modes and it pops on odometer display.
@@mldiode I now want that...
Nothing rides like a road glide.
I enjoy wrenching on my 2000 road glide. It gives me satisfaction knowing I have a reliable machine under me for my travels. Plus it gives me a understanding of the mechanics behind bike if I were to break down on the open road.
It's the journey not the destination that I enjoy
Thanks for the upload,
new subscriber
Right on! Thanks a bunch...
Not trying to be political, but the police are fine. How do we defund the EPA?!?
I don't think that tuner works with Apple lap tops?
It Doesn't. I have both.
I did the HD tuner and latter on added a full exhaust with the smart tune pro wideband. Latter on went stage 2, did an S&S cam chest but used HD torque cam because I already had invested in these tuners. Bike ran much better than stock. Paid a local shop to do the cam, but everything else I did myself including the tuning.
That guy that commented is just an old fart like me. Years ago if you added pipes most of the time they came with instructions and new carb jets. That was it. I like it better now my FP3 tuned my bike and now it's my tachometer on my I phone. I love Tech. I live in mountains darn computer even adjusts for altitude. We used to do that manually also. Ain't life grand??
You are surprised and livid that Harley Davidson is unable to support 2021 Models yet??? First world problems Bro ;)
Ha! You've got a point for sure!
"I wrote several drafts of this...many of these involving his mother" LMFAO!!! Made my morning.got me laughing. Thanks
That's my goal, glad I gave you a chuckle!
It's hilarious that Harley postponed the 21s for half a year, and still can't get their shit together when it comes to something like this.
I’m still livid.
Thank you for your sacrifice, sir.
“Varying levels of understanding” you couldn’t have said it any better when it comes to the internet trolls. 🥃 & 🍻 👍🏽👊🏽
Ha!!! Can you tell I work with lawyers? (I’m not one.)
That was also the most informative ten minutes by the way. I had no idea. I found a tuner that eliminates the ecm. I however have Harleys not under warranty.
ThunderMax I am guessing?
Well, I was just defeated trying to do the same thing.
Space Coast Harley in Pam Bay FL sold me A USED TUNER.
Yep already married.
Guess what else. They are refusing to refund/exchange or make it right in any way.
They told me "To bad, but another one"
F#@'in @$$holes
You have GOT to be kidding me. Can they not tell you the VIN it is married to????? That is insane.
@@ProfessionalMonkey Yea, they said for 1/2 hour labor they could tell me. I said OK, then what, and the guy said, well you buy another programmer.
I’m more pissed about no extended clutch cables being available yet. Had the bike all apart and there is no slack available in the clutch cable like in the 20 hydraulic model.
You doing bars? I am hearing you can use a softail cable extension.
@@ProfessionalMonkey tried to get that confirmed from dealer. Of course that didn’t work out. Hopefully someone confirms that soon
My 2017 Electra Glide Limited came with the Screaming Eagle tuner. I changed it to Power Vision which is so much better. Wait till you try to upgrade your bars and you learn there are no 2021 extension cables available.
I'm way ahead of you. Clutch cable is on order, still ain't here. KSTs are already in hand.
You'd think they would tell you when ordering parts that even the dealer can't upgrade at the current time
They didn't know, can you believe that!
Probably a good idea to turn the radio off whenever flashing the ECU as it can cause fluctuations in the electrical current. Big Sounding Garden fan here too (hopefully it won't get flagged with that spelling either).
Just found your channel this morning. 👍 I like your videos. Keep em coming.
Thanks, will do!
Ok how many of you guys went to visual? A naked women handing you bacon? What else would you want? Geepers life is good in the Monkey House!
I literally laugh out loud dude! You are hilarious! The epic fail (not your fault) was sadly funny. You can laugh at yourself and we all laugh with you!
Great stuff man!
THANKS!
Slip on s don’t require a tuner. Heavy breather it does
Yup, that's what I said...
great video brother. a true Biker. not a rub. thanks for the honesty and showing harleys shortcomings. Southern Rebel
Grassy ass, budro. MLLH&R...
I just found your channel today, the first 10 minutes were great, lots of good info thank you for that sir. But I gotta tell ya I think I'm gonna stick with my 2016 street glide and old orange tuner. I've seen nothing but horror with the M8. Wanna keep working on the devil I already know.
I appreciate that completely. I have had three M8s, never had a problem with them. But, I have also had several TCs, never had a problem with them either. That orange tuner is worth it's weight in gold for sure!
Awesome videos bro! Just subscribed! 🤘☠🤘
i have a powervision module.which allows me to flash back the harley map.if for some reason a warranty issue should occur.would they still see the tampering?
As I understand it, yes. It will put back the factory map, but it will still know that a non-HD tuner was used.
So the thing that pisses me off about tuning today vs carb bikes is it use to cost a dollar fifty for a jet and I could take that jet out and put it into any bike I wanted. Harleys got you so tied to their shit its ridicules. Harley as a co. can blow me. That's why I by used bikes an do what I want to them and never have to deal with the company that is harley.
Now that is a good point. A full kit was like $30 with a needle, etc.
thanks Harley Guy.
"Us Harley Guys..."
Me and my son flashed my HD with stage 1 tune. After running a few "street tunes" or auto tunes the bike ran pretty well. Went to full exhaust wideband HD auto tune module. At stage 2 torque cam now, it was an easy flash. After that the tuner took over. Bike runs pretty well I must say. Much better than stock, especially at higher speeds.yes the new ECM thing sucks no tune yet lol
It's killing me. I am glad yours worked out.
@@ProfessionalMonkey yes it's a 2017. Bought the tuner and they didn't give me the connection cable. Went back and they said they don't stock them! Had to order one took 2 weeks I was pissed. Really want the thunder max tuner but it is $$$$
@@harryhowell5644 tons o money for the thunder max. I have no idea why Harley tried to hide that their tuner is user serviceable. It feels a bit dishonest?
@@ProfessionalMonkey well I was like you said they never heard of someone doing it their self. They wanted you to pay them to download a caned map and run a dyno
@@harryhowell5644 I don't doubt that someone who is an expert and with a dyno will do a much better job, but not enough to justify the expense. Not for a stage 1 anyway.
I thought the cable wasn't available until March?Good that it is available
That’s what they had said, but tada!
You don’t like it but your not gonna pay the $15 million they got fined. Some of you don’t understand Harley’s a manufacture. No difference with a car manufacturer. They’re not some custom builder.
Yup. My point is the software and cables should have been in stock/ready when the bikes started rolling in.
One other possibility is that from a corporate standpoint they may have gone to a lean production method. I’ve heard Indian does this and that’s why it takes so fricken long to get accessories when new bikes come out. They only make minimal amounts to cut back on over stock. Smart way to run a business on the money side, not so good for customers who are waiting for their shit.
@@motoGPness they don’t have the same level of manufacturing resources that Harley has . Let’s get real, many of Harley’s parts are sourced out to other countries.
@@tax905972 Probably not many manufacturers left that don’t these days. I’m not sure about manufacturing resources, Polaris makes a ton of other vehicles I’m pretty sure they’re capacity is up there to crank shit out.
Define that Harley paid when you divide it by the number of bikes that they built comes to a piddling small amount for a fine the amount are not large enough to keep them from doing things like that in the future they will sell their foreclosed course competition only part to the people to put on their road bike and they will continue to do so until they are really nailed by the government I couldn't care less because I ride real motorcycles and not a poser toy for an old man who has more money than God
Did I hear a Vice Grip Garage quote? 🤣
I'm sure you did!!! That dude freaking kills me!!! I yell "HELP ME UNDERSTAND!" At least once a day!!!
@@ProfessionalMonkey,
And when he installs/removes something he “snips” it in/out of there. Often followed by a “Hssss! Huyahhh” like it’s cattle of something. Says he got that from his dad. 🤣🤣
@@slyguyaction the dude makes me laugh my ass off. I swear he helped to keep me sane during this craziness. “Just give her a little tickle...”
Off to the dealership for you.
Your a funny dude. The explanation of software was very good. Harley just needs to figure out how to make a radiator.
Thanks!
Harley Waiting Lists. Harley Tuning. ROFL
Not sure which is more precious...Wal Mart demanding premium dollar to make you wait years to take your bread home, or paying premium to tune a bike that makes 43% less power than Indian, for the same price...The secret to Harley owner rage? The smart ones know this!
I’m on an Indian Challenger, but I’m no brand fanboy. It’s awesome out of the box, BUT 43% more power than a comparable HD? Love my scoot, but lets not get carried away.
What's in that pipe, dude? I think you're thinking crank power to wheel power... I had an Indian and it stranded me for three days during Sturgis, so singing their praises to me ain't gonna fly...
Yup. The Challenger is cool but too many people are reading crank power and thinking that's wheel power and comparing the two. My CVO with a cam and a tune is about 120 hp and 130 lbs of torque on a dyno at the wheel. Yes, it's a ton of money, but those numbers would be similar on a 114 with the same cam and tune.
Love your style of Video! Keep it up and Don’t Change!
Thanks! Will do!
Buy a 2021 HD they said, it will be fun they said. Lmao
THEY WAS WRONG, ha!
@@ProfessionalMonkey lmao
Thanks for the TTS info!
I’m going to look into purchasing it!
Any time!
great video! Love the humour. Educational. Seems pretty easy actually, thanks for breaking it down in layman's terms.
That’s my goal!!!
Ta Ta for now !? LOL. Love your vids, informative and entertaining. Thanks, keep up the good work !
Thanks for watching!
Today's motorcycles of any brand are not so much motorcycles but a collection of government regulations on two wheels that's why the older bikes are so much better
I got VH Fp3 in mine
Go back to the coo this year and give Harley time to catch up .👍👍
COO??
Hockey car guys and women Ike Holley carburetors
Sounds interesting...but for me..I enjoy the fact I can rebuild my bike without the computer..old school forever
Absolutely. There's always ups and downs. I like the smoothness of the new motors, but like you, I don't like having to depend on others.