Thank you!!! This is saved me from thinking the entire issue was that I'd made a mistake with building the GAL based PLA. My PLA tested as fine... still don't know why the C64 only gives a black screen but at least I feel better knowing I didn't mess up the PLA build lol :-)
Excellent. If you haven't already, you might want to check out the troubleshooting series th-cam.com/play/PLh38SbsQfKYehk1ZErQc6NPRx5OinVN3-.html Feel free to ask me any questions as well. Good luck
Great video I thought about creating the truth table for the minipro for testing the PLA , and now I don't have to :) . Heres a little tip for you, when you want to go to a command prompt of a specific folder, instead of copy and pasting the path, type CMD in the path box and bingo your CMD prompt is opened within that folder
Thanks for the tips! I updated to 11.71 today and I try to make such an adapter, also got ZIFs here, so I hope it will work, also downloaded the PLA logic file, thank you for the good video!! Michael
Great tip immediately had to try it if I can test a PLA works very well. Next time I solder a GAL PLA I can test it with the programmer first before putting it in a board. Btw. latest version of the TL tool did no longer give a virus message when I downloaded it.
I know this is old but I'm having a lot of trouble finding how to create the 24 to 28 pin adapter to test the old c64 chips. Everything wants to show me the other way around (28 to 24). Any idea where I can find info on how to create that adapter?
Hello! Thanks for your very usefull video, now I know more about my Tl866 I have ;) ! I have also a question: as I need to test my dead C64 PLA too, I need the the spreadsheet and logic (lgc) file that seems it's not more available on the web. Could you have maybe a copy of that C64-82S100-PLA.zip to share? Thanks again!
Hi, thanks for letting me know. As I don't have a website myself, I've added it to my Patreon tools list. You don't need to be a member to download it, just scroll to the end of this post www.patreon.com/posts/77570017
I really thank you for the explanation. A question: Do exist generic instructions (using something like a truth table) on how to read/verify and possibly write into any generic logic IC which actually is not in the capabilities of the TL-866? I mean, i.e. I've to necessity to read some old PAL 16V8 and possibly write the content into a new one. Do you think it would be possible to make a .lgc file, together with some added hardware just as you did, so to allow the TL-866 to program PAL/GALs?
A lot of PALs and GALs are supported out of the box to be programmed. You should be able to find them by just searching in the IC list (not the logic test list). But if you need to read one back, chances are it will be encrypted so likely won't work. Maybe it would be possible to create your own logic table by analysing the inputs and outputs. Take a look at L Break Into Program's video (link in the description) as he goes into how to make a custom truth table in the programmer software
@@TheRetroChannel you are a very kind person! THANKS!!! I've just scanned the IC list and I've found the 16V8 PAL I was looking for! The list is jaw-dropping! The last time I did a search on the TL-866 IC list, and wouldn't be able to find it in that list. Maybe the TL-866II has more capabilities! Thanks, bro for your kind help!
There's an easier way to verify a 4K ROM (like the character ROM). In the minipro software, when loading the original ROM image, just change "TO buffer strat addr" (the typo is just like in the minipro software) to 1000. You can then verify the ROM against the one in the adapter directly.
@@granpawa I thought that it might be easier to save a full copy of a good character rom, including everything above 0001000 and then using that, to compare other character roms to, using this method.
@Mr Guru The question was not about the SuperPLA product from Individual Computers, but about the big or fat PLA found on original assy 250469 short mainboards.
As others have mentioned there's no easy way to overcome the 40pin limit of the tl866. Just looking at the pinout of the 251715-01 almost all pins would need to be able to be addressed. And the last rev 25235-01 has the colour ram integrated so no chance there
Thank you so much for the re-shot. Will keep this link in my wiki for future consultation. You are the best ,-)
Thank you!!! This is saved me from thinking the entire issue was that I'd made a mistake with building the GAL based PLA. My PLA tested as fine... still don't know why the C64 only gives a black screen but at least I feel better knowing I didn't mess up the PLA build lol :-)
Excellent. If you haven't already, you might want to check out the troubleshooting series th-cam.com/play/PLh38SbsQfKYehk1ZErQc6NPRx5OinVN3-.html
Feel free to ask me any questions as well. Good luck
Great video I thought about creating the truth table for the minipro for testing the PLA , and now I don't have to :) . Heres a little tip for you, when you want to go to a command prompt of a specific folder, instead of copy and pasting the path, type CMD in the path box and bingo your CMD prompt is opened within that folder
Thanks for the tips! I updated to 11.71 today and I try to make such an adapter, also got ZIFs here, so I hope it will work, also downloaded the PLA logic file, thank you for the good video!! Michael
Thanks for the re-upload with screen capture! So much clearer now to understand what you did in the software.
I still use a Needham PB-10 programmer. It works on a ISA slot. I replaced many corroded ROM chips with eproms using it.
VRY NICE! I didn't know you could test the commodore ICs that way.
Thanks Aaron, yeah it makes the tl866 just that little bit more useful
Great explanation. Thanks! I was going to look into how this test of L Break Into Program worked. You just made it a whole lot easier. :-)
Great tip immediately had to try it if I can test a PLA works very well. Next time I solder a GAL PLA I can test it with the programmer first before putting it in a board. Btw. latest version of the TL tool did no longer give a virus message when I downloaded it.
Thanks for that !! All best from Croatia!
Some good information here. Thanks!
I know this is old but I'm having a lot of trouble finding how to create the 24 to 28 pin adapter to test the old c64 chips. Everything wants to show me the other way around (28 to 24). Any idea where I can find info on how to create that adapter?
When the TL866 plus says : "Test Failed: over Current Protection" it just means you inserted the chip wrong side round (notch at wrong end.)
What about the 64pin C64C super PLA?
Are you using the TL-866 II Plus or the A/C S, or something completely different?
TL-866 II Plus
Hello! Thanks for your very usefull video, now I know more about my Tl866 I have ;) ! I have also a question: as I need to test my dead C64 PLA too, I need the the spreadsheet and logic (lgc) file that seems it's not more available on the web. Could you have maybe a copy of that C64-82S100-PLA.zip to share? Thanks again!
Hi, thanks for letting me know. As I don't have a website myself, I've added it to my Patreon tools list. You don't need to be a member to download it, just scroll to the end of this post www.patreon.com/posts/77570017
Can someone tell which one is the most inexpensive programmer around $20 that can be used for this?
Hey! Great video! How about reading Commodore 128 KERNAL chips (28 pin?) I am not able to read them using TL-866II device.
It should be possible to read them as a 27C256 without any adaptors, you just need to turn off pin detect
@@TheRetroChannel yes. I found it by myself to turn off pin detect and it works, thanx for the answer :)
Thanks for this video Mark. I wonder if that other changed byte is a bug fix in the code.
Ha yeah could be. When it comes to code I have NFI 😄
can a person add new logic table to the program
I really thank you for the explanation. A question: Do exist generic instructions (using something like a truth table) on how to read/verify and possibly write into any generic logic IC which actually is not in the capabilities of the TL-866? I mean, i.e. I've to necessity to read some old PAL 16V8 and possibly write the content into a new one. Do you think it would be possible to make a .lgc file, together with some added hardware just as you did, so to allow the TL-866 to program PAL/GALs?
A lot of PALs and GALs are supported out of the box to be programmed. You should be able to find them by just searching in the IC list (not the logic test list). But if you need to read one back, chances are it will be encrypted so likely won't work. Maybe it would be possible to create your own logic table by analysing the inputs and outputs.
Take a look at L Break Into Program's video (link in the description) as he goes into how to make a custom truth table in the programmer software
@@TheRetroChannel you are a very kind person! THANKS!!! I've just scanned the IC list and I've found the 16V8 PAL I was looking for! The list is jaw-dropping! The last time I did a search on the TL-866 IC list, and wouldn't be able to find it in that list. Maybe the TL-866II has more capabilities! Thanks, bro for your kind help!
Where to download xg pro software?
There's an easier way to verify a 4K ROM (like the character ROM). In the minipro software, when loading the original ROM image, just change "TO buffer strat addr" (the typo is just like in the minipro software) to 1000. You can then verify the ROM against the one in the adapter directly.
Haha, yes of course, didn't even think about that. Right, time to do another reshoot 😉
@@TheRetroChannel Ok then I'll wait for the next reshoot to post my next comment... so you'll have to do yet another reshoot.
@@granpawa Ice cold 😄
@@TheRetroChannel Yup. That's me.
@@granpawa I thought that it might be easier to save a full copy of a good character rom, including everything above 0001000 and then using that, to compare other character roms to, using this method.
Great video. Can you test the super pla from a 250469 board?
No, because it has 64 pins while the TL866 has only 40 pins in its socket, no way you can solve this with an adapter.
@Mr Guru no i mean the pla on the 250469. this pla is also called superpla and its an old one with commodore id. 😉
@Mr Guru The question was not about the SuperPLA product from Individual Computers, but about the big or fat PLA found on original assy 250469 short mainboards.
As others have mentioned there's no easy way to overcome the 40pin limit of the tl866. Just looking at the pinout of the 251715-01 almost all pins would need to be able to be addressed. And the last rev 25235-01 has the colour ram integrated so no chance there
@Daniël
This. And also thanks for your work on the GAL PLA 👍
90 Day Fiance in your search history?