Unwritten Thai Vowels
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ส.ค. 2024
- Video Description
In many Thai words there are vowels that are pronounced but not written. With certain words there are a few simple rules you can follow, but with other words that have implied vowels there are no obvious rules. This video will explain more.
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This is gold
Thank you!
Thank You again for your time and effort to record and upload videos like this ! I hope people who watches this leave more commons and show support !
Pleasure, thanks for your comment! This is my second attempt at getting the channel going after the first wasn't successful. I'll give it a bit longer and if it's still not successful I have plenty of other things to be getting on with. We shall see.
Incredible helpful video! thank you sir!
Thank you! It's good to see people making an attempt to learn. Good luck!
The Thai language is complicated and at the same time very interesting.Definitely challenging for over thinkers who constantly need to know the "whys"
Constantly wanting to know 'why' has been one of my biggest challenges living in Thailand! I have always found it very difficult to get answers to 'why' questions. The Thai rote learning system teaches Thais 'how' but not 'why'. Thus when you ask a 'why' question you rarely get an answer. Like you, I find the language very interesting but also challenging. I have always needed to keep my brain busy and since moving to Thailand trying to learn the language has been a major source of intellectual stimulation!
@@LearnToReadThai , Totally agree with you about the brain stimulation as I'm also one who always needed to keep my brain busy and learning Thai just did that.
I didn't think I needed this video but there were a couple bits that I had wrong. I appreciate the guy asking the question and you quickly putting up a video about it.
That applies to a lot of us, including me! Teaching is a great way to learn and often when I am asked a question I realise that there are big gaps in my knowledge. I then have to go back to my books again, but it's a good thing. When I taught English to Thai kids they would never ask any questions. "Any problems, any questions?" was always met with silence. 'Greng jai' is strong in Thai culture and Thai kids don't want to impose on their teachers by asking questions. But it's true that there is no such thing as a stupid question. If you don't know something there's a good chance that other people don't know either, so ask!
I actually learned more than what I came here for, thank you
Thank you!
Very good, interesting and informative! Thanks.
Thank you!
Thai Education is really something, I asked my ex why did Thailand change the name from Siam, she said I have no idea.
This is a common theme. The education system is still based on rote. Students get information from teachers and books, which they then have to remember and regurgitate in exams. They aren't encouraged to ask questions and with many students there isn't a great desire to actually find out anything. When I was learning to read Thai I gave up asking Thais questions in the end because they couldn't answer anything. When I am learning I always want to know why, but most Thais aren't the same. I asked my wife how Buddhist observance days are decided. She didn't know, so I had to find out for myself.
The good news is that Thais now realise there are problems with the education system - the emphasis on rote learning and the lack of critical thinking. Just last week I heard something on the radio that the Ministry of Education will be addressing these problems. The bad news is that although Thais pay lip service to the problems, I don't actually observe anything changing in the education system. Change will come eventually, but I think it will take a long time.
Thank you for this interesting tutorial. I asked this question to my companion and she answered the same. When she learned at school, she just had to remember what the teacher said and repeat the same stuff. I asked the same question about unwritten vowels to her son’s girlfriend who is a young teacher in primary school and expected this to be obvious since I imagined she explains this to her young students. Obviously, I was wrong to believe it would be obvious, as it looks like I’m the first to as her the question. I assume she’s happy that all her students are not like this naughty old student from Belgium :-). This info is also difficult to find on the web, especially the part related to the unwritten “sara a”. I found your channel very interesting and I subscribed to it.
It all leads back to the Thai education system. I've witnessed Thai teachers in action and the teaching is completely one way. The teacher copies something from a book on to the blackboard and students then copy the same stuff into their text books. They are expected to remember, but not to ask questions. Most students have no interest in asking why, or they don't ask why because doing so isn't encouraged. Whenever I ask a 'why' question in Thailand I never expect to get an answer.
When I was teaching English quite a few years ago I was teaching some bright students, but I had to explain to them that Thai consonants make different sounds depending on whether they are initial or final consonants. Unbelievably, they didn't realise this and didn't realise that it seems very strange for foreign learners of Thai.
This is why I say learn to speak from Thais because that's the only way you will learn the correct tones and pronunciation, but if you want to understand the writing system it is better to learn from a foreigner who has been through the process. All the little strange anomalies of written Thai seem so natural to Thais that they can't answer questions that foreigners ask.
Thanks for your comment, which I found very interesting and it's always good to have other people confirm the same experiences that I have had!
It happened the same to me, I asked a Thai if there's any specific rule for this, and he didn't know how to answer me hahaha
Anyway, thanks so much for this kind of videos, it really helps :)
It's all to do with the education system and the way Thais are taught. Ever since I've lived in Thailand I have always had problems getting answers to 'why' questions - and that applies to all things, not just language. Thais are taught 'how', not 'why' and many don't have a great desire to want to find out why. When you ask why, they can't answer because they don't know themselves. And also, with certain things, there are no reasons why. It's the same with English. Why do the sound of vowels and consonants change in English depending on the word in which they are used? Anyway, thanks for your comment!
Priceless this explanation how things are tought at school there! Say is it not possible that you provide some more of these texts where the words are phonetically explained? Sounds so valuable. Its impossible to buy a book like that i assume?
It's been an eye-opener for me observing how my kids are taught Thai and it explains why Thais can't explain anything to foreigners. For example, we learn tones from tone rules, but they they are taught tone rules by rote. As a result they can identify the tone of a word immediately from the spelling, but if you ask them why they don't know. They can't give you any rules because they were never given any rules. Sure, I can do some more if it's useful. Buying these school books in Thailand is very easy and very cheap. Just go to the kids' education department of any book shop and look for books on Thai for Anubaan and early Pratom level. However, outside of Thailand it's going to be very difficult, if not impossible.
@@LearnToReadThai Yeah, it is super useful. About the tone rules you know i know they excist, consonent classes and the live or dead ending of the sylables but putting that into use seems like a bridge to far. It is frustrating because when i say something to my wife every other word she corrects the tone. That is for me also the reasoning in starting to learn how to read as in that way to come closer to the tone rules. But here i am stuck also, so for me this lesson was a great background.
But yeah i wonder when it will be possible for us to come. We had 1st plans for april, tickets everything then december also not. Must be quiet there i assume?
@@Erwin_AMS Tone rules are clumsy, difficult to remember, and slow. The Thai method of rote learning means that Thais know tones straight away without thinking, but it's not a practical way for foreigners to learn.
Yes, everything here related to tourism is pretty much dead. Many hotels are closed, as are shops, massage shops, restaurants, even some 7-Elevens. I've never seen anything like it. Even normal shops and restaurants have problems because many locals have no work and therefore no money. I'm not going to risk leaving the country in case I can't get back in. Not sure when it will return to normal, if ever. They keep using this ghastly term 'new normal'. Thailand has just launched a new visa aimed at long-term tourists, but there are lots of requirements to be met. 2020 was the year that the world changed. Who knows what's coming next?
@@LearnToReadThai They use that term here also. That and that we have to keep 1 1/2 meter distance. I feel in your area, SEA, especially bit scary situation since people do not have much to fall back on. Its crazy all since the consensus seems to be it is more or less comparable to a flew. But for that the world does not stop also, so. Hopefully things will clear up but i fear it wil take more time even.
Hi Phil. Thanks for another interesting and useful tutorial. Just like you, I can never find the reason behind Thai spelling and pronunciation. If I ever find out, I'll let you know!
A lot of it has to do with the origin of words. With loan words they will try to follow the original spelling and this has strange effects. Many Thai words originate from Pali and Sanskrit. Why are there three S consonants that are all high class? It's because these consonants actually made different sounds in the original language, but in Thai they all perform the same function. Out there somewhere there will be Thais who can explain these anomalies, but I never meet the right people! The Thais I know have been through the Thai education system and know how, but not why. Anyway, thanks for your comment!
Learn To Read Thai thanks a lot for the video. Gives me what i needed. You made my day. Stay healthy
@@lennarttellander8462 Pleasure! Hopefully, it will help others as well. If you have any more questions, let me know.
Hey Phil, hope things are well there in Hat Yai. miss reading your blogs
That was a while back! I got too busy and things changed. People prefer videos these days so I decided to give TH-cam a go. Maybe something else next year?
@@LearnToReadThai Your blog posts are a joy to read and i looked forward to every entry back then. TH-cam is a great choice too with sight and sound and I am sure it will go a long way with information regarding the way of life in Thailand interpreted by a British with the knowledge of Thai. Keep it up, Phil *thumbsup*
@@fuzagi Thank you! It hasn't gone very far up to now! I keep thinking about expanding the content beyond language. Hopefully that will appeal to a wider audience.
@@LearnToReadThai That would be great. Learning of Thailand and all things Thai is certainly a vast and interesting knowledge to acquire, especially the social culture.
@@fuzagi I'll bear it in mind. Thanks for the feedback.
Please can you explain the hidden vowel rules in สุวรรณภูมิ
This section วรร I cannot find an explaination to anywhere. thanks
When you see two ร's together it is known as 'ror hun'. If the two ร's are followed by a final consonant they just make a 'u' vowel. Example, the word ธรรมดา - in the first syllable there is a 't' initial consonant and an 'm' final consonant with รร in the middle. This syllable makes a 'tum' sound. In สุวรรณภูมิ the second syllable has a 'w' initial consonant and an 'n' final consonant with รร in the middle, therefore it is 'wun' (วรรณ). Suu-wun-na-poom. If there is no final consonant after รร it makes an 'un' sound. For example, the word หรรษา is pronounced 'hunsaa'.
It's been a while since I made the video, but I have never been able to find any rules about implied vowels. It just seems to be a case of knowing that certain words have hidden vowels. In สุวรรณภูมิ there is an implied vowel between สุวรรณ and ภูมิ. I'm not sure why. It's a word I know, so when I read it I know the pronunciation, but if I didn't know the word I wouldn't know that there is an implied vowel. Hope this helps.
@@LearnToReadThai Thanks for your help. Just when I think I am getting a grasp of reading Thai, I always come across new problems. I have a long way to go.
@@anthonyh4700 We all have a long way to go! I've been at it for 17 years and I will still be learning right up to the point when I go to my grave. Some aspects of Thai are very simple, but others are extremely difficult. If it's any consolation, very few Thais have an in-depth knowledge of their own language. I used to be friends with a university law professor and all of his Master's degree students had big problems with the Thai language required at that level. All Thais, of course, are fully proficient with the spoken language, but the written/formal language is very different.
น. สระ โอะ. ม. นม. Cut โอะ. อ่านว่า nom
นอม ?