Making Solid Steel Rollers For A Steel Mill - Manual Machining
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ต.ค. 2024
- A large local steel fabricator has custom made processing equipment and from time to time, I make them replacement parts.
in this episode, I make another roller out of solid bar. 3 1/2" Cold Roll 1045 is turned down to bearing stubs on each end and drilled for a roll pin for a drive sprocket.
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You know you have talent when you can blend in a radius using both hands for duel feed.
Thanks.
A master craftsman at work.
I used to do that to, but i mostly work in cnc machines now.
When your chip guard vibrated.... my wife gave ME a dirty look!! 🤣😂
@@mikep1085 lol.
Wise man explaining why you use solid instead of round. Otherwise keyboard experts would have had a field day. A few are already questioning alternative repairs to existing shafts. How about they bow to you and the customer's research of down time created versus extra cost of manufacturing new rollers from scratch rather than risk issues with weld buildup of 1045 steel which in most cases needs normalizing at 550 - 600 degrees C for a few hours to allow the stresses in steel grain structure to dissipate (plus finding someone who has a big enough furnace). Without normalizing, welded 1045 steel has quite a high risk of fracturing. Hobby machinist in Land Down Under.
Excellent point. We just make new ones because most of them are beaten to death on the roller itself. Not to mention the bearing surfaces. I had one suggestion of boring and shrinking a stub into it, which would work if the rollers were good.
Spot on, ref what works for the customer.
I center the steady rest the same way as you. But with a long axle like this, i also use a live center with a piece of metal puck between gently pressed against the face, so i get rid of the overhang caused by the weight of the axle. Have been doing this 39 years now.
Owning my auto shop for 40 years, we used to make gaskets with the ball peen hammers all the time, new guys would eat that up. Thanxx for the content !
It's a great skill to know. You can save your butt sometimes.
Been there, done that.
That’s how I make gaskets for my Massey Fergusson 135, as pre-made gaskets need to ordered and sometimes are not the right thickness for the application.
You were probably the etch-a-sketch champion of your school!
Excellent work. Even though this is a simple mostly low tolerance job you treat it like aerospace work anyway. Thank you for sharing.
You know, I has an etch-a-sketch as a kid and didn't really do much with it. Lol. I found it dumb that you wouldn't stop a line and start in a new spot. Lol. I try to put out the best possible quality I can, just to spite the last of my competition. They hate seeing my work in the local facilities. Lol.
HI, Josh. Thanks for letting us watch this job. I'm always impressed with the quality of cuts you get from those inserts. You were doing a 200K cut, the lathe is grunting under the load, but you were leaving a near-finish pass result using the same insert edge for the whole job. I don't know how many times I would have been sharpening a carbide tool to get the same results...just impressive as hell. More job for less time.
Have a great week, Josh. Cheers.
Chip deflector is a good idea I'm a retired Machinist of 35 yrs I never thought of that one
Great work as usual Josh! Don't worry about offending anyone with your method of setting up your steady rest. With cold rolled raw material, no machined surfaces to use as a reference, and the fact that you're relying on a 3 Jaw for alignment - it should be obvious to other machinists that perfect part alignment isn't the objective.
Thanks again for putting yourself out there and making great content. Cheers from the land of oil and gas in Canada 🍻
but he is doing it wrong! wrong, you hear?
Were I 60 years younger I would put up with Wisconsin winters and apprentice for you. I did some machining in EE/ME classes in college. Used those skills and amazed my co workers who hadn't a clue.
Josh Topper Keeping it real, since as long as I have been watching. Nice job Josh cheers!
Thank you.
Nice work, the bearing journals look to be very small compared to the diameter of the roller - though as you said they had been running over several years with the same design there is clearly no issue with the design there. Nice to see a local business supporting you.
Local Ish, 40+ miles away
Interesting that you'd have to modify your Lion equipment. The machining of the roller is very interesting and the mill will get many more years of service. And If they develop a maintenance sched. for the bearings maybe many more years of use. Bonus on the card stock protector device
Nice set up, and nice also to have repeat clients, even if they are sometimes years apart.
really love that chip deflector........
Like the spindle stop Josh, modified to utilise with the chuck 👌.
Nice job shop setup and batch production.
Thanks for sharing
Josh , I may not be a machinist, and I've seen kurtis from cee do this the same , you just keep doing these awesome jobs!!!!!!!!!!!
Thank you Josh!
Is the cardboard to protect the part, or to protect the steady rest. I've haven't seen that done yet. Great video. Thanks for taking us along
hey Josh...great to see you back in acton, Paul in Florida
Nice job
Hi Josh & it's is Randy and i like yours video is Cool & Thanks Josh & Friends Randy
Absolutely brilliant Josh! 👍🏻
Nice job Josh. Thanks for sharing.
Nice work
Excellent job Josh, great video, keep'um coming.
You're taking some pretty deep passes there. That's a really nice machine to handle it so well!
Gm, there’s always the lesson when watching your videos. Applying time to that job. How much time did it take?
I figured about 30 minutes each. Obviously when filming, it takes way longer. I had about 2 hours into this one shaft. Rest of them went fast.
Nicely done josh if you’ve been setting steadys wrong for 25 years I’ve been doing it wrong for over 40 lol I thought the idea was to get the job done with the least amount of messing about as possible 👍👍👍
Exactly. I guess we are both wrong because we get stuff done. Lol. As long as the part comes out correctly, what does it matter.
I like to center drill rollers and shafts because if you need to use a puller to get the bearing off, it makes life easier.
Good job
Beautiful work, hopefully you transition into a manual/cnc lathe like a prototrak, it will benefit you , I was a skeptic at first and with all the turning cycles they have, you can do other things at the same time
Not gonna happen. I have zero need for CNC, I can farm that work out for far less than I could ever do it in house.
Thanks for sharing
26:26 made me laugh out loud, reminded me of the company I used to work for 'Breakwind Productions LTD.'
hi there looks real good . best to all john
Another great video Josh!
Thanks again!
I'm making shorties 22" Long, 4.25" major dia, snouts (minor dia) are 2.000" x 2.125" for the bearings/blocks.
Hey Josh, very nice work, well done 😊👍 even if you used the wrong measurement system, set up the steady wrong and worst, used an adjustable imperial wrench to tighten the metric nuts on the steady 🤣🤣🤣🤣 oh boy, what a world we live in 😅 Greetings from Germany, Chris p.s. i even got 2 imperial starrett micrometers and an imperial indicator in metric land 😂
Thanks for the video!!! You are always interesting!!!!Rocky is a good dog!!!!!
Very nice job. I'm surprised how small the diameter of those bearing journal stubs are. Interesting design. Thanks for the explanations and discussions. They are invaluable for certain! Thanks, too, for another excellent video. Love that Lion lathe! Oh, and that chip deflector on the steady is genius!
@@BruceBoschek thanks.
Wonder if you can recondition the old ones simply by drilling out the end, and shrinking in a rod that then gets turned to diameter and length. Would allow the solid bar to be used another few years, as it does not seem to be getting destroyed much. Easy enough to drill out the stub when damaged again as well, and the rod could be made out of a harder steel as well, or use one that has been induction hardened on the outside diameter.
It is possible, but this was the last spare they had. It hadn't seen service. They get quite beaten up.
@@TopperMachineLLC Suppose so, cold rolled steel is cheap, though this would be an option on one where a bearing blew up and galled the shaft and the rest is in good order still. Only would need to have a hole drilled through after shrink fit to add in a pin near the end of the new shaft, as a method to keep it from walking out, and then welding the friction fit pin in, or simply peening the end, as a belt and brace approach, as the shrink fit should keep it running, unless the shaft gets really hot.
Nice! Let the chips fly. Always seems a waist to cut so much off the diameter, but that’s the way it is done. Guaranteed concentric.
Until next week, have a great week and becwell
What I am understanding is that the three jaw chuck does not require indicating. Apparently the work self aligns in a three jaw chuck while it does require the work in a four jaw chuck to be dial indicated in for concentricity. Am I correct?
3 use chucks are almost all self centering, I have seen a few independent 3 jaw. Most 4 jaw are independently adjusted. I have a 4 jaw combination chuck that is independent and self centering.
I saw you set up the steady rest that way in another video, and you made the same comment about it. I can’t see what is supposed to be wrong with your method. Seems to bring the shaft visually concentric instantaneously.
Some people waste half a day indicating the steady rest. I was taught this by a very skilled machinist. It's fast and accurate.
@@TopperMachineLLC Plus good enough for use with a self aligning bearing, that likely will be replaced along with the shaft, if not a few times during the useful life of the shaft. Steel mill, which has tolerances measured in feet in parts, not exactly a precision job, just has to be within the bearing alignment capacity, and using the steady rest to get it eye straight is good enough.
If you were making spindles for a hard drive, which requires precision within nanometer accuracy, it will not work, but that lathe is not even going to be within 4 orders of magnitude accurate enough anyway for that. for getting a job out fast, where the tolerances on runout are "not too much visible" this method of yours works well. If it was requiring more precision the shaft would have a cut on the diameter on it as well, not simply left as rolled. Regular rollers which are hollow have much worse runout anyway, unless you take each one and surface grind them to a more precise diameter. most i see have either a visible weld from the manufacture, or are made from spiral welded sheet, so diameter is not exactly consistent anyway.
What would it take for you to make a tool post mounted cross drill? It would save the move to mill operation, but would really only be important if you had a very large run of these parts. I'm thinking take the base and column off of something like a mag drill and attaching it to a tool holder for fine control to get it on center.
It's a good idea, but like you said, not practical for one or two pieces.
KISS always works.
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
LOVE that LION !!!!!!!!
Don
What was your reasoning to not use coolant? Nice to see non CNC hand machining occasionally. Ray
I don't like wearing coolant. It isn't necessary for every application. Most of my work is dry as it is.
The reason I asked if they get hardened after is because plate rolls are usually around 50 to 55 rockwell c.not sure what Rockwell hardess the cold rolled is.
You said the only issue they have with the solid cold rolled rollers is bearings wearing the 1.25” section of the rollers.
At least that’s what I remember. Couldn’t you increase that a larger diameter and use bigger bearings? It seams like larger bearings would have less failures.
While bigger bearings may fix the problem, a complete redesign and rebuild of the mating equipment would be needed. Therefore it is not feasible
That was a pretty simple job compared to some of the more complex jobs you get it. But as simple as it may be, you still put the quality into the finished job. More water on the fire of your competitor that hates you.
Always do your best. If you can't do that, then it's not worth doing.
I wish you would center drill all rollers it makes it easier to pickup center of rollers during repairs of journals? Please think of the next Repair shop person.
Since these are scrapped at the end of service, it is not necessary.
I'm rather curious, given this job was for a steel mill, did they provide their own stock to use for the rollers? I don't know how much a steel mill specializes, so I don't know if they only do IE plate of specific dimensions, or if they do the a gambit of stock&materials and could provide their own bar for the stock.
They don't supply the material. Different specialties.
I noticed a magnetic lifting clamp used to lift the shaft when end for ending it, source?
Yup, works great
It's a vevor magnet he has an earlier video where he tested it with a load cell.
Do you mind elaborating a little on what failed on those hollow shafts? I have round baler rollers that have a track record of failures and one of my goals is to make my own to get around the poor OEM design and also their obscene price. The OEM part is a pipe with two discs in each end and a shaft welded in the discs. Pipe diameter varies depending on which roller exactly but is in the 4-5” size. Shaft for the bearing is 40mm. Approx. 60” long. Too big to make from solid shaft IMO.
Don’t let your shaft to bearing fit get at all loose. I have seen problems from that, it results in fretting of the shaft under the bearing. I’d rather have the bearing be a slight interference fit. If you haven’t seen problems with this, disregard!
Their problem with hollow shafts was weight capacity. They just dented under the load.
Can frequently using emery cloth on parts that are in the lathe leave abrasive on your ways or is it negligible? Those repair shop videos from Pakistan show people arc welding and grinding on parts fitted in a lathe.
Yes it can. I try not to use emery cloth unless necessary. Absolutely no grinding or welding in the machine Shop either. Keep it clean
Yes, but I have also seen them drop a chuck on the floor, then roll it across the floor. I gave up watching any of them, put them on my don't show me this channel list.
@@billdoodson4232 Keep in mind, the machines these guys are using are the ones that got scrapped in the western industries because they're totally worn out. So it doesn't matter if they get abused even more (the machines, not the guys😉).
And to be honest, what these ppl are able to do with their machines is almost magic.
I have a question because I’m still new to machining. But is oil really needed for the steady rollers before starting the job or not?
Not on rollers, but I still give them a little or a dab of grease.
@@TopperMachineLLC thank you! I have another question if you don’t mind. I’m sure you have come across those brass lubrication points on some lathes. One of mine has lost the ball in the middle. Are they hard to replace? And where can I get them?
wow, that taper plug was hard as Chinese Algebra..........
I replayed the fart chip guard about 7 times
👍
I would have gone about modifying the plug adapter completely different. Your way is much better.
Cool, thanks
What kinda beans you feeding that lathe?
Lol.
In gunsmithing, we always modify the least expensive part.
"Excuse me!" 😂
👍😎👍
I can't understand why you still use fractions in the US. When i was an apprentice toolmaker in the late 70s we used imperial measurements, but during the 80s we changed to the decimal system which was by far the better way going forward. I'm now in my 60s and still think in yards feet and inches, but when it comes to actual measurements it's always in metric. So the one question i ask of you is, have you ever received a job that has metric dimensions and if so do you measure it using decimal equipment, or do you convert to imperial dimensions using feet, inches and thousands etc?
Freedom is why.
Same here . I learned machining in South Africa in 80’s and small things are metric and big feet. If it’s important, I’ll convert inch to metric.
Because it's easy if you work with it. Not everything needs to be super accurate; "move about a quarter inch" is quick and good enough a lot of times. Plus we have all these mystical devices to tell us what a quarter inch is.
In the states, everything is in inch. So, our measuring tools are in inch. Since I have almost $50k in measuring tools, why would I go out and buy duplicates in deer turds(metric)? Since very few of my customers are foreign, Deer Turds are never really a concern. Just convert it to real measurements and go about your day.
@@TopperMachineLLC I suppose when you're just an everyday machinist accuracy doesn't really matter!
When I use a steady, I have had heavy shafts walk out of the chuck due to the steady not centered. I then started using an indicator on the top and front, running the compound back and forth. Stopped walking. This was on motor rotors, probably 500 lbs
I have too, but it doesn't happen often. My method works great on light stuff.
Oh the Horror an Adjustable Wrench on the steady Rest. Let me tell you about how 'wrong' that is in detail.......... 🤣
Lol.
Puno pričaš a slabo radiš (blebetalo) nesigurnost
I like watching your channel.ig you would not talk souch sounds like your not sure
Nice work
Thanks