1967 Porsche 911 Video 30 Electroplating process part -2 Caswell Plating system
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 ส.ค. 2017
- In this video a close up look at the a actual Caswell plating system plating process
Zinc electroplating
Yellow chromate conversion coating
Blue chromate on silver conversion coating
A close up view of finished product and quality!
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#electroplating #restoration #porscherestoration - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
This video was so good in many aspects: production quality, workflow, detailed, camera, audio levels and lighting - that I had to download it for future generations to come.
Thank you for the kind words and positive feedback!
Wow, the quality of this restoration is as good if not better than any vintage restoration I have ever seen - painfully and meticulously done .. Awesome job Mike 👍🏽
Thanks Sam
Trying our best to save everything
Its a real survivor.. and a rare piece of early Porsche history.
Theres not a whole lot that has been tampered with since it left the factory.
The engine has had some work but for the most part everything still intact and unmolested.
Hopefully when finished those painful details shine thru=)
I have been reading and you tubing for two years learning about plating and chromates,I have learned the most from watching your videos,thank you very much,I’m subscribed to your Chanel sir keep up the amazing work
Thank you Brian and welcome to the channel!
Cheers!!
My gosh, you have the patience of a saint! Looks amazing. Can't wait to see the completed car!
Thanks Huybrecht She's coming along nicely now..
Yes patience is big ingredient for these type of projects=)
Thanks for your comment!
Such a great video! Just bought the 4.5 gallon system. Cant wait to try it out. Thank you for posting this
Hi Mdanon
You're welcome hopefully will be of some help with your new 4.5 kit
Thats a great kit!!
Please let us know how things work out for you and any helpful tips you could share. Best of Luck!
Awesome! Thanks for sharing...if I get my garage cleared out s bit I might venture into doing this for myself.
I am setting up my own plating system at home to plate my parts for my Porsche restoration, also. One concern I have here is that the your not just plating for coverage, but also for thickness of coating to protect the underlying base metal for years. The rule of thumb for zinc plating is 14 amp-hours per square foot to get a coating of 5 to 10 mils thickness, with 5 mils thickness typically being the nominal amount. At a rate of 14 amp-hours, your going to need a much bigger power supply(I have a 20v 50amp digital system) to be able to plate in a reasonable time (a couple hours) to get 5 miles coating thickness before putting down the dichromate
Those really came out great!
Thanks Feeesh
It really is a great system for the restoration enthusiast
I always zinc plating parts for my classic but I'm wanna start do it myself. Thanks for video!
You're welcome!
You will be most surprised how convenient and fun it is!
Good Luck!!
Thanks Mike for this video. This is something I definitely want to get into.
Give it a try Russell I think you would be great at working this system!
Just Wow!
Impressive Mike. Very.
Thank you Karl
Great video thank you sir 🇺🇸😄👍
You're welcome Jose I hope it can be helpful!
By far, this is the best zinc plating video on TH-cam. Thanks for creating great content. My parts are coming out gray and dull. Have to brass brush back to a shine before chromating. Have not tried the post-pickling. Looking to get the Caswell zinc solution vs an on-line recipe....any recommendations on whether the Caswell solution will help? Again, fantastic process/restoration and an even better job on the video production/content.
Hello heatmyzer9 Thank you
I also have tried some home recipes but not much success with them..
The secret to a bright shinny finish would be in the brightener additive Caswell supplies.
If you read through some of the comments posted on the electroplating videos 1&2 I have explained in fairly deep detail
what will be needed for a successful zinc finish. Most of the viewers were having these same issues as you are having.
I recommend the complete Caswell system for the best results as some of the chemistry doesn't blend well with other systems.
The key to a good plating job will be cleanliness of the parts and solutions.. combined with the right conditions for plating.
High temperature working environment works best!
Good luck! and please let us know how things work out
Great video. Where did u buy the Taylor heat thermometer for the degreaser. I went to there website and couldnt find it.
Hello Mike
If my memory serves me correct I think it was Target
Great stuff thank you,
you can use saccharine as a brightness
I was told the solution should be plated out, with low current with a piece of scrap steel plate metal to remove the dissolved impurities in the nickel salts
Thanks for the tip!
Hey I really liked the videos. I did have a question about zinc plating and applying chromate with the caswell system. I will be removing the pistons, seals, bleeder valves etc from my calipers before degreasing, playing, and chromating and I’m wondering if this will create a thick enough layer that my piston, and bleeder valves won’t fit back into the piece. Is this an issue and can it be avoided? Thanks again for the videos
Hello Seth
The plating process will not be any issues for piston clearance or bleeder valves. During this process the zinc build up in what's called shadow areas is almost non existent. Also the chromate will not sick to bare steel if the zinc plating doesn't apply well enough either. When the plating begins it is the passing of water current over the surface that allows proper build up of zinc to the surface. In pocket areas such as cavities the current doesn't pass thru well enough for application..ultimately threaded areas, cavities and deep concaves will not plate.
Good Luck!
thanks for your videos, I already bought the sistem and works great, My only question or problem is with the yellow chromate, after dries (24hrs), peels very easy, any suggestions?
Hi O'Conner yes yellow chromate can be very sensitive.
I apply these coating in very warm weather only. After dipping gently in yellow rinse bucket I put in front of a fan blowing warm air and also I use compressed air to blow off residual water as its drying in front of the fan.
gently flash drying the yellow chromate works best. If sitting wet to long it will loosen the skin. Also if you will notice I have all hardware hanging in the booth after flash drying. Purpose of this is to allow chromates to cure before handling.
Yellow is sensitive and needs lots of time before working with it.
I had best results with:
-Warm weather
-Flash dry
-Hang to cure
Most of my hardware has been curing for one year however I find
yellow chromate needed at least one month curing not touching or handling
during this time works best.
Custom shops all use proprietary formulas for their chromates.
They will not not share these formulas with the public.
Yellow chromates we buy form parts suppliers are usually done over seas
regulations for cyanides and similar chemicals are different than USA.
These products are basically is all we are allowed to use as consumers
Lots of patience with curing time will give best results with Caswell system
Good Luck!
Mike M , Thanks
Just came across your videos as I’m gathering as much information as I can to restore a 2.4T from 1973. First of all thank you very much for taking the time to record and explain all the restauración process. I would have a couple questions. How long did it take you to go through all the hardware cleaning, rezinking and rechroming? It looks like a huge amount of time for each piece.
In the other hand it doesn’t seem like you are wearing any kind of breathing protection but working in a kind of open environment. Would you recommend any kind of breathing protection? I feel there must be some kind of fumes coming out of the chemical pots.
Hello eazar4u Thank you and seasons greetings.
Regarding the electroplating process..Its unbelievably time consuming and quite expensive to set up. Many things to consider before pulling the trigger on that direction for restoration work. I only do the electroplating seasonally..here in Las Vegas during the summer months temperatures are perfect to get nice results. Constant temps well over 100degrees.
Doors are open and fans are going as I can spend easy 8 hours a day nursing the parts thru. because of the open air and fan flow I don't where a mask. However when working the system my head is not directly over the fuming pots.
Most of the Caswell system is environmentally Dailed down for consumers where as commercial platers will use much more aggressive chemicals.
If you are doing any muriatic acid stripping I highly recommend a mask and keeping your eyes and head away from the bath materials.
Its nasty and you will definitely know when you are too close.
Good luck on you 73 2.4T! What a classic beauty that is!!
Really nice Mike. What did you use in the degreaser bath solution?
Thanks Andrew
The degreaser is a powdered solution supplied by Caswell
It doesn't suds up much and seems to be quite mild. Combined with the hot bath temp it works really well
Good video & great results, Mike. I'm struggling with the Caswell system. First couple of parts come out nice then the zinc process goes to hell and the yellow chromate has a dull finish. I must be contaminating the buckets. I wasn't spraying down the parts just using distilled water buckets. I'll reorder the Caswell system & try again. I'm currently restoring a 914 LE "Creamsicle" also here in Las Vegas.
Hello Flywheel702
A fellow Las Vegan how cool!
Wow you have a great looking car!!
and very rare too
If you would like to contact me by email perhaps
I could help you out a bit better with your Caswell system..Its sensitive but once you have it sorted out it goes quite smooth and trouble free
mikemuskcabinets@gmail.com
Cerakote makes different ceramic clear finishes that may be a extremely durable top coat. Bakes on at 150-350 degrees
Cerakote makes excellent clear finishes. These were done years ago before I started experimenting with Cerakotes
is the yellow chromate solution potassium dichromate and water? or is it chromic acid?
Great work. After the cromate bath is the rinse distilled water only? Thanks
Hello Rafael Thanks
Yes that is correct..distilled water only with temps above 80deg F works best
Hey Mike,
1.Did you acid etch your calipers too before sand blasting? I’m not sure if the pats are actually just cast iron, but their manual says not to soak cast iron parts in an acid pickle but to bead blast them instead. Anyway, my first set of calipers came out a little patchy around the bolt concave areas.
2. Also, when putting it in the 5% Muriatic pickling after the zinc plating my parts really fizzed right away (almost like it was tripping all the zinc off). Did you get similar results?
3. In this video it looks like your amperage for the calipers were right at 4.99 Amps. My calculations were 8-10 amps. Are you saying you did the max of your rectifier and then just plated longer?
4. What did you do with the baking soda rinse?
Hello Jaques
Im not sure what the ferrous metal is for the calipers as Porsche used some extreme metals
building cars those days. Ferrous and non ferrous.. No doubt the calipers do contain iron but I wouldn't be able to confirm the percentage.
My procedure was as follows:
calipers only-
1- lightly sandblast to clean them up
2- flash dip for 15 seconds in muriatic acid to dissolve the previous coating.
3- immediately rinse thoroughly with cold water and flush canals
4 -flash dry with compressed air
5- complete sand blasting process to eliminate any previous residual zinc prior to new coating.
6 wire brush with wheel and use small wire brush in bolt indents
7- begin plating process.
You will have better success if you have 100% stripping in your prep work.
It will not not plate if light coating still exists.
Also success will be better if you use less amps for longer period of time rather than higher amps
for shorter period of time. Constant movement will really help ensure good coverage.
Calipers are hard to do but if you are thorough in every step I think you will be happy with the results. Good Luck!
Hi that looks great . What's the starter kit you used?
Thanks Rui
Its a 1 1/2 gallon Caswell start up kit, with additional 5amp rectifier, and additional chromates
When you plate and chromate your brake calipers, is there any special prep to consider? The cylinder walls etc?
Hello Mercedes
Nothing special to consider.. the cylinder areas will not be an issue to do the way the plating process works.
Those are know as show areas and most likely will not plate anyways.
@@MikesRestorations Thank you so much. Loving the videos. I'm really impressed with your attention to detail.
Can the yellow chromate be applied to a new zinc plated nyloc nut without damaging the nylon insert?
Yes chromate and zinc process can be applied to a new nyloc nut.
I recommend muriatic acid stripping the new nut first then re-zinc coat and
chromate in sequence for best results. Its possible to just chromate a new nut with existing zinc coating but will need a muriatic etching dip for about 5 seconds 10% solution and then rinse and chromate. If it doesn't apply well
you will need to strip completely and start fresh. Needs to be at least 80 degrees.
The process will not hurt the nylons but it my bleach out a blue color nylocs.
Good luck!
Hey Mike I have this set up and after I plate a bolt and it dries there is like white water marks on the bolt. I see the marks on the bolt after I take it it the pickling bath before I put it in the zinc bath. I notice you don't do the pickling bath before the zinc Plating. Thanks for any help...
Hello Shawn
Yes for sure the whole process is very sensitive
I'll list out what I'm doing for best results and see if that helps.
1- Bare metal objects only-strip all paint with stripper or sandblasting/ all grease and oil wash with gasoline or equivalent and rinse with soapy water followed by clean water.
2- Muriatic acid dip to strip and zinc plated items to bare metal. followed with clean water rinse then followed with soapy water rinse /clean water and then flash dry with compressed air.
3- sandblast or wire wheel bare clean bare metal or both for best finish.
clean wire wheel gives best result.
4- wire items with nitrile gloves being careful not to touch with bare hands
5- soak in hot cleaning solution for 15 minutes- 170 degrees
6- pullout of cleaning solution and dip in distilled water rinse bucket
pullout and follow up with distilled water squirt bottle rinse.
7- quickly set in electrolyte zinc batch before item drys.
8- remove from zinc bath and dip in distilled water rinse bucket for zinc bath only.
9-pull out of zinc bath rinse bucket and rinse with distilled water squirt bottle.
10- dip in pickling bath and gently swirl for 3-5 seconds max.
11- pull out of pickling bath and rinse in distilled water picking batch bucket
only.
12- pullout of pickling bath rinse bucket and rinse again with distilled only squirt bottle.
13- slowly immerse the item in chromate bath and gently move back and forth. time varies..10-20 seconds approx.
14- gently remove from chromate bath and gently dip in chromate rinse bucket in and out 2 times max.sometimes one dip is all it needs.
Over rinsing at this point will cause water spotting problems.
15- gently and quickly place in front of a fan and blow on it with compressed air...not too much air pressure, warm day only, 80-100degrees works best.
rotate part as you blow the compressed air on it in front of the fan.
Your results should be perfect at this point.
Any long settling water will erode the chromate finish and create water spots.
Hang dry to cure for as long as possible for best results. minimum 24 hours
before touching with bare hands
Good Luck!!
Mike, any recommendations for what heaters to use for the plating bath and chromate bath?
Hi Jeff
I don't have any heater recommendations unfortunately.. I have found excellent success setting the all buckets with a lid out in the sun for about an hour before use. Im getting temps above 80-90 easily . The residual heat will last a good 1-2 hours of plating time during the summer months. If things start to cool down I take them back outside and warm them back up to keep going.
Heaters will take up considerable room in the buckets and you will need several of them.
I only do electroplating during the summer months.
Good luck and let us know what you decide!
Cheers!
Hi Mike, I'm very interested to get one of these kits, however what do you do with the left over chemical and storage? do you just leave it in there until next use? I'm worried that it will take up so much space and be a pain to store; also potentially wasteful if I'm only doing a few brackets and bolts at a time. Cheers.
Hello Corey
I recommend using this system only if you are doing a complete restoration from A-Z..
If you are doing a few or small amount of misc parts it really is best to send them out.
The home plating setup is extremely expensive and you will need a substantial amount of room to work in as well as storage area.
If you can find a reasonable plater in your area it sounds like that might work out better in your situation
Good Luck!
what solution are you using in the zinc bath ?
Hi Sh Kn
Zinc bath is distilled water and start up kit by Caswell
You can buy direct from they're website
Not sure what ingredients the are using but easy to buy and mix up
Good Luck!
One more question, what formula do you use for calculating the amps?
Hi O'Conner
I do it mostly by visual and feel. There is a mathematical formula Caswell recommends in the manual but it really is hard to go by that.
Typical parts like nuts and bolts in the video you see I set between 1.5 - 1.8
somewhere in there.. Best way to adjust is look of the fizz coming off of them when first putting them in the bath. Pull them out slowly, if too much fizz it will burn the bottom bolt.. start backing down the amps until it very slight.
Brake caliper halves if I remember were around 3-4 amps.
Lower amps and longer works best. Higher amps and kick will burn
Good Luck!
thanks for take time to answer me.
How do you De embrittle the bolts after plating them ? Love your videos helped me a few times on my 66 912 .
Hello Simon
Thank you Im glad they can be of assistance.
I have been getting quite a few questions regarding embrittlement so I'm going to post a couple helpful links for viewers to better understand the dynamics of it. I have replied to another viewer in great detail regarding my direction on this build please refer to the comment section on the other plating video. The following links are the best reading I have come across regarding embrittlement. The phenomenon really occurs on hardware grades above 8.8 although it could be possible at 8.8 hardness but most unlikely.
I have had no issues to date under full load torque specs.
Washers and lock washer are replaced with new..also all heavy
stress bolts and nuts are replaced with new. Only the best condition original were selected for re-use. all heat related bolts replaced with new.
www.theboulderco.com/products-specifications/product-specifications-05.pdf
www.boltscience.com/pages/the-stronger-the-better-is-not-necessarily-the-case-for-fasteners.pdf
@@MikesRestorations the amount of people i have seen plating everything and not even knowing about it , glad you are on the ball with it , i look forward to working my way through your videos , you are a far more patient man than me thats for sure . I run a small company in the uk making parts for early vw and Porsche now , mainly bits i needed for my projects , ButtysBits.com , im more of a maker than a fixerupper .
Welcome to the channel Simon
I think I will do a video down the road when getting into the engine about Bolt Fatigue,
stretch, embrittlement and replacing old v/s new. There has been a lot of questions on the subject so it might help make things clearer and safer for the DIY guys while doing restoration work.
Thanks for bringing up the subject and
Good luck with your restoration!
Really nice instructional. Question: Did you make your Zinc solution from distilled vinegar, or did you buy it? Thanks
Hello Peter thank you
The electrolyte solution is supplied by Caswell plating system.
It comes in a package and then the main liquid additive is distilled water.
Distilled water is also used as a base for all the other bath rinses and chromates
@@MikesRestorations ok thanks, I've been trying the vinegar way and my results don't come out as bright. I guess I'll have to pony up and get the Caswell product. I think they've slowed deliveries since the virus hit. Your resto work looks amazing, I'm working on a ferrari of the same vintage. Take care
Thanks Peter
Try the brightener additive sold by caswell..without it I don't think a bright shine is possible.. also are you polishing your work before plating? wire wheel works best..4500 min rpm wheel seems to have the best density for polishing. Lower RPM wheels are too rough to get a good result.
Ferrari sounds like a blast! I would love to do one someday=)
what content the yellow rinse bucket?
Hello O'Conner
Distilled water is the ingredient for all rinses and mixes
Good Luck!
Awesome video!! Just subscribed, too. Question: Can I send you some parts (prepped already) for you to zink and yellow chromate? I'll be happy to pay for your services. Thank you for posting such a good video.
Hello Xavier
Thank you and welcome to the channel
Unfortunately I don't do any for hire services but there may be some viewers
that have had some success possibly doing some sideline business.
Yellow chromate should also be available at your local plating shop.
If you have done the prep work the parts should turn out nice!
Thank you for the inquire and I wish you the best of luck!
Mike, you are using the 5% acid dip after the zinc plating bath. Caswell suggests using the acid bath right after the degreasing. Any comments?
Hello Hank
Yes using the 5% acid dip after sink plating bath
Im not using 5% acid dip after coming out of the digressing bath.
After degreasing I dip in clean distilled water followed by a spray down of clean new distilled water then straight into the zinc plating bath
Mike, did you seal off the piston area for the caliper? It looks a bit grey dark compared to the rest of the gold zinc color
Hello Phillip
The piston area will not plate properly because of the shadowing effect while plating. It remains bare metal throat the process
@@MikesRestorations I'm facing this exact problem the lack of zinc coating in the bore means it will corrode very quickly and the pistons will stick, since the brake fluid absorbs moisture as it ages
Caswell needs to pay you for your videos. They are much more enjoyable to watch and more informative as well
Thanks Steven
Wishful thinking there=) but glad they are of some help
Cheers!
What degreaser do you use in the crock pot?
Hello Hank
Im using a powder additive from Caswell.
Im not sure why the chemistry is but it does seem to work really well.. 170-180 degrees for 20 minute soak seems to work best!
Hey Mike
My larger items like the caliper have turned copper. Lol. Smaller ones seem to work fine. Ive tried lower amps and up to 6 amps from a battery charger. Not sure what’s going on. I’m guessing the copper from my zinc hangers has bled into the zinc solution. My zinc anodes have completely dissolved. Thanks.
Hi Chad
Sounds like its time for some new anodes.. The copper color could be from the chromate dip and its duration and rinse.
Sometimes if its dipped a little too long or the rinse was too quick..a copper color is usually the result.
I don't think you have contamination form your copper wires
What did you do differently (if anything) to get your calipers to plate? Amps, etc...
Thanks
is it possible to zinc plat, lightly polish, clean and then put in the yellow chromate?
Hello 05majortong
Unfortunately not much can be done after the zinc plating..In order for the yellow chromate to stick it will need to be in proper timing sequence and correct temperatures for successful chromating.
Any contamination will prevent the yellow chromate from sticking
How did you prevent the caliper cylinder walls from being plated
Hi Robert
The inside of the Caliper walls will typically not plate because of the shadowing effect of plating..it needs current and constant circulation in those blind areas in order plate..usually will just apply to the outer smooth surfaces. Also the dichromate will not stick to bare steel so no problem there either..Dichromate needs zinc to stick too
Good Luck!
@@MikesRestorations Thank you
Mike are you only using .77 volts? My parts come out of my DIY setup gray with a build up that has to be taken off with steel wool for it to look good. I am using a 6v phone charger. Maybe the voltage is too high.
Hello Mr10usdad
Its been awhile since doing the calipers but if my memory serves me it was almost a full 5 amps. It sounds like you need to add the brightener additive and be sure you are plating in very warm temperature. also lots of current passing over the parts really helps.
If the bath temperature is too cold it will plate dull and gray.
Try giving may latest video on the nickel plating a look when you have time..there are some tips in there that will help with your work. th-cam.com/video/rDfFE-AlDmo/w-d-xo.html
Good Luck!
Mike’s Restorations thanks so much! I was using 6 volts too so that might be too much.
Thank you for the excellent, detailed video. Your description of the process has inspired me to try it myself. One question: what ingredients and in what proportions make up the Zinc Bath?
Mike
Hello Mike
Your welcome I hope it helps sort out some of the mystery.
My zinc bath is made of of Caswells zinc bath crystals..I'm not sure what it is made of. Mixing is simple
Just buy the amount of crystals you will be using for a bath..example 1.5 gallon mix or 3 gallon mix. I have since gone with a 3 gallon mix and it sure is a lot easier to plate with. The formula is mixed directly into distilled water. Warm Warm temperatures is best for all your electroplating and rinse buckets.
Good Luck!
@@MikesRestorations I ordered the Caswell 3 gal system this morning. Looks like they have a secret brew for the zinc bath, so rather than try to guess the ingredients, I'll go to the source. Thanks again!
@@mikeealy4033 You're welcome Mike Best of Luck!!
@@MikesRestorations I just received my order from Caswell for the 3 gal system and I want to let everyone know that it's worth every penny. I think the keys to the process for me were the Copy Cad & Zinc Concentrates Part A and B for the zinc bath bucket. I used the yellow chromate bath as my final step just as in the video and the parts came out beautiful and exactly as expected.
Before purchasing the concentrates part A and B, I tried to make my own based on various recipes I found online. None worked as well as the product from Caswell. I have a DC power supply that I bought for $60 and has separate dials for both course and fine settings for amps and volts. Before using the concentrates I couldn't get the settings to be where they needed to be. Using the concentrates allowed me to dial in the settings accurately.
@@mikeealy4033 Fantastic Mike! Im glad everything is working out. Thanks for sharing with us!!
Cheers!
I noticed another guy online that dips his parts in muratic acid after the degreaser, then a rinser, then the plating bucket. Any ideas on that? Thank you
Hello kzem, Not sure on the outcome of that. I only stick with caswells recommended procedures and products only. If the parts are properly cleaned and degreased there should be no reason to go back to acid before plating. The acid could contaminate and end up lifting the fresh zinc down the road..via blistering etc.
On your yellow chromate, do you dilute it with water? I find my yellow chromate simply refuses to stick. If I do exactly as you do, and leave it to cure for 24 hours, it simply rubs off in some places yet sticks in others. I never have a problem with blue or black, only yellow. Any ideas?
Hello Audio
Yes the yellow chromate can be sensitive but I have found an excellent way to make it stay put and have nice color.
The problem with the chromate is the rinse bucket to drying time ratio.
I recommend dipping in the chromate and moving around gently for 10-15 seconds. Slow lift out of the chromate and slowly put into the rinse bucket. Do not move it around just gently remove it after dipping.
Immediately after pulling from the bucket, place in front of a fan and blow off 100% of the wet chromate with compressed air. Move the compressed air gun around the piece quickly to flash dry everything. It is the standing water that breaks down the chromate.
If it's left to dry out by hanging only the water will break it down and it will come off.
The fan won't be enough force to blow off the chromate.
It needs both fan and air gun.
Standing water is the enemy here.
Give that a try and see if things improve
Good luck!
I just tried the system for the first time I did make the mistake of pouring 3oz of yellow chromate into 2 1/2 gallons as that was supposed to be my rinse bucket so I ended up pouring all 4oz in the bucket to make up for it. Not sure if that was a good idea or not. Before adding the extra oz I had a problem with the yellow chromate. It just wipped off at 24 hours. It is very humid here in Charleston. Does that cause a problem? I hung the parts in front of a fan for about 2 hours. Is that not long enough? Should I hang them inside my house instead of outside in the humidity in my under house garage? Should I dry the parts with a blowdryer instead? Thanks.
Hello kzem968
The extra oz of chromate shouldn't be a problem as long as the bucket it free of contaminants and using distilled water.
The yellow chromate is extremely sensitive to get it to work. As long as you are gentle with it during the dipping and pulling out process.
Try dipping it in the final rinse bucket very gently one time and gently pull it out. After that place immediately in front of a fan.
Very hot conditions is need for this step.
While the hot fan is moving air over it flash dry it with compressed air at the same time. This will allow for proper adhesion.
If it takes too long for the chromate to final dry the excess water will dilute the finish and you will have problems with it.
It needs to be completely dry in 2-3 seconds for best results.
Do not handle for at least 24hrs. allow to hang and cure before working with it. At least a week in very hot conditions works best.
The blue chromate is not as sensitive and can be worked with in 24 hours. However the dipping time in the blue chromate works best 8-10 seconds max.
Yellow chromate 15-20 seconds works very nice but do not double dip either.
I can't stress enough the importance of working in very hot hot conditions..humidity shouldn't be any issue.
Here in the desert I don't have any luck working in 80-90 degree conditions but when its when its in the excess of 100 everything turns out perfect.
Also another trick is to allow your all your buckets to warm up out in the sun for at least one hour before electroplating. This will give you nice working temps.
If they begin to cool down take them back out in the sun and warm them up again. This should help
Good Luck!
@@MikesRestorations I will work on some of those things. They look great but then after 24 hours it wiped off on me. I have heaters on the plating solution at 90 degrees and 85 degrees in the yellow chromate. Maybe I need to heat them up a bit? I will definitely try the compressed air and maybe a hairdryer for extra hot air to dry them off fast. Maybe even my heat gun. I am definitely not getting a fast dry on the parts. Thanks for the information. I want to bad for this to work. I'd post pictures on here if I could. You are so helpful!!!
Good Luck kzem968 I think you are on the right track..Compressed air in front of a decent size fan will do the job. I think its the standing water that is creating your problems
Lets us know how things turn out!
and top of it all.... you can paint this surface in any colour you want. and have it as a double protection (y) maybe even strait satin clearcoat?
Hello Albert
yes a clear coat isn't a bas idea..There are several brake caliper clear coats on the market that would be suitable.
I uses a VHT high gloss caliper clear
@@MikesRestorations yhea VHT also is my brand to go by.. i had good sucess with there Chassi and rollbar paint. matches the Subframe look allot even tough that's a KTL coating but still :P hope the clear coat will just stick without fuz (should keep it all nice and tidy for years to come ):) keep it up man! love your attention of detail!
What specific fish tank pump did you use? What was your mix rate on the yellow chromate for the best Porsche color and proper attachment to the parts? Thanks
Hello Kzem
I don't recall the brand or model of the pump im using as I have thrown away the box a couple years ago..however any pump will work if it fits in the tank without taking up too much room.
An adjustable motor works best to adjust the outflow.
I prefer a strong flow of water while electroplating.
A weak flow will promote burning and shadows on your work. A good strong pump works best!
Good luck!!
@@MikesRestorations Thank you! GREAT video BTW!!
@@MikesRestorations I have read about fracturing problems with some bolts that are 5 and 8 hardness and hydrogen cracking. Do you know about that? Does this system have the same problem and if so, do you know about the baking process many are saying is needed if you want to have bolts and parts continue to have their strength? thanks
@@kzem968
Hello kzem
You bring up a good point with your hydrogen embrittlement concern.
All plating..including chrome plating and even welding process can be subject to this phenomenon. Its a phenomena that is still not completely understood in what exactly the conditions are to have it exist or not exist. Baking is an extra measure that can be done but even in this case its no guarantee the phenomenon won't take place. An Xray would be the only way to confirm it.
I have not baked my plating.
For restoration purposes I am using the following guidelines to help insure a quality restoration and maintain authenticity as much as safely can be allowed.
1st: all stripping and replacing of hardware is done in extreme dry hot conditions over 110 degrees and hung dry for over one year in 110 degree booth for several months.
All metal surfaces polished with a wire wheel or brush.
Polishing the surface will help to prevent the phenomenon.
All hardware is inspected for stress cracks,
corrosion, or heavy use.
All hardware exposed to high temperature and stress forces is replaced with new. Typically trade 10 or higher blacken hardware.
Any hardware inspected before and after plating showing questionable wear will not be used and replaces with new.
Only light and medium duty original hardware will be reused on the restoration.
Lastly this is more or less a museum grade type restoration and will see very few miles driven. If your car will be driven daily I recommend replacing with new hardware and not re-plating original for safety measures.
If you have any concern of the area it will be used its better to replace it that to bake it and assume you are free from any interior defects.
Good luck and thank you for the question!
@@MikesRestorations Thanks for the feedback. I have recently found out that there is zero chance of hydrogen embitterment at Grade 5 or below. Nearly all the bolts I have seen on the Porsche are 5.3 or 8.8. The large suspension bolts I have been told to replace before plating for safety even though the chances of a problem is small even at grade 8. Better to be safe than sorry with bolts that could cost you your life. :)
How much brightener do you add before you start each session?
1 teaspoon per 1.5 gallons of bath solution seems to work best..too much brightener can overwhelm the bath and cause blistering
@@MikesRestorations thanks. I have been adding 1/2 teaspoon every time I start and the shine goes away after not too many parts and big parts seem to need more pretty fast.
did you find a clear coat that works?
Hello Kickass..Any over the counter heigh temp clear will work but the the multi color iridescence will be eliminated. I have not tried the Cerakote clear but I imagine that would be the best alternative considering heat and brake fluid
all these parts are steel, i tried to nikel plate aluminium and it doesn't stick at all, do you only 'anodize' aluminium (without zinc or nikel) before cromate bath ? thanks
For Aluminum anodize works best!..would be be no need for a chromate bath afterwords..
Chromate will only stick to a freshly plated zinc surface
@@MikesRestorations ok, no doubt about anodize, i gonna try that, but i tried to zinc, nikel and copper plate aluminium and nothing sticks to that. you bet. i hardly tried, and it was not my mistake because i succesfully plated iron with same equipment very easy.
Hey Mike, awesome videos. I have a couple of questions about the Caswell Plating System.
How many amps did it take to plate each of the brake caliper halfs?
Did the yellow chromate solution break down after a few months and become unusable while stored in the bucket?
Is that the 1.5 gallon kit from Caswell?
How did the yellow chromate hold up on the calipers?
Thanks
Pat
Thanks Pat
Its been awhile since doing those but if my memory serves it was between 4-5 amps..
I still use the yellow chromate I purchased years ago. As long as it stays sealed and doesn't get contaminated it will last for years.
The kit is a Caswell 1.5 gallon. So far the chromate has had no issues to date on the calipers
@@MikesRestorations Awesome. Thank you for a quick response!
@@MikesRestorations I forgot to ask, where and how do you dispose of the rinse water?
The rinse can buckets can be diluted and washed out with dish soap rinsed thoroughly with a house and refilled with distilled water again if becomes dirty.
It can be evaporated until empty or if you have a suitable area around your property you wash cars with bucket and hose. Away from any plant life or grass.
In my case I have a carport with gravel perimeters for drainage.
You have done a fantastic job in your restoration. I love seeing the attention to detail and doing right. I’m restoring an old tractor and ordered the same kit. I looked at the Caswell forum and there isn’t much activity on it. Is there a forum or FB group you have found that others can share there experiences with plating?
Thank you
A Tractor sounds like a super fun project!
Unfortunately I also have not been able to find much on the web regarding
plating technics and experiences..If you purchase a Caswell kit I feel confident after a couple sessions you will have it figured out and know how to roll thru various size pieces.. It all sounds so technical but when I got into it
it really was quite simple and mostly went by feel. Warm temperatures was the most important link to tie it all together
I wish you best of luck!!
Mike M Thanks for the reply . I ordered the Caswell kit minus the supply. I was afraid the 5 amp was going to be a little under for some of the pieces I need to do. I think they measured 55sq inch. I was looking at some 10 amp units on amazon but I just don’t know enough about the power supplies to make a decision yet. I have watched your plating videos numerous times. Your pieces came out so nice I am going to follow your steps. Good tip about the plates. Before I saw your video I had several of those oil drip pan trays with little piles of parts trying to keep them sorted. Thanks for your help.
Great! I think you will be very successful
Please let us know how things are going when you get started
Good Luck!
Mike M I received the kit this afternoon. I have a question and tried to Caswell but they have closed for the weekend. I was hoping you could answer it for me. In the instructions it says to, add 13oz of A to 36wt. Oz of B, Then add 1.5 gallons dis-water. I am assuming these are already pre-measured. I wasn’t sure so I started to weight the bag of part B and the whole bag is only 14wt. Ounces. I’m not sure if I’m just overlooking something. Any ideas? Thanks
Hi DIY
I'm wondering your name?=)
I think you are mixing the bath electro solution?
If so yes mix part A as directed And Part B also as directed.
Make sure you mix them exactly as the instructions say.
Sometimes when we add acids out of right order with water
its possible to explode although I don't think you will have that problem.
I recommend to go slow and do exactly as its describing step by step
Good Luck!
can you share info, what brands liquid did you use? I wants to order.
Hello Odbayar
The system and chemicals I'm using are all the Caswell system. All mixes were mixed with distilled water that can be purchased at any grocery store
@@MikesRestorations thank you very much
Is there any concern for hydrogen embrittlement after electroplating? I came across several websites discussing this phenomenon and was wondering if you've taken it into consideration.
Hello calpitoc
If you you go thru the comment sections of the electroplating videos you will be able to find much discussion and direction there.
Its been fairly well talked about over the years since uploading those videos
@@MikesRestorations Thanks Mike. For the sake of keeping information on your channel, I found this: www.theboulderco.com/products-specifications/product-specifications-05.pdf
My understanding of the results is that fasteners lower on the Rockwell hardness scale are not as susceptible to hydrogen embrittlement (HE) stating the starting limit for degradation at around C36. It's even states that "Unhardened fasteners or those of Grade 5 or Property Class 8.8 or lower do NOT fail due to hydrogen embrittlement." I guess the challenge is figuring out what grade fastener you have.
@@livedeliciously yes that would be correct..usually the fastener grade is stamped on the nuts and marked on the ends of all fasteners used by Porsche.
Any fattener that had a blackened finish would be too hard and brittle to electroplate..grades 10 and higher
Very nice video, informative and to the point. Much better than almost all annoying, incomplete, and unprofessional plating videos I've seen on youtube. I wish Caswell mentioned more about the chemical contents, I think they just don't want people buying them cheaper. If you're doing a ton of bolts, could a basket be made to hold them instead of wiring them all together? Also what material is the caliper made out of? Is it cast iron? I read in a few places that plating cast iron isn't really workable?
Hello Alex
Thank you=) Yes its difficult to get enough information on you tube.
A quickie video won't really do the job.
Caswell keeps a tight lip on things but also so does the plating shops as the process and chromates are proprietary secrets.
Caswell is a great system for the DYI guy but can get expensive too.
Im not sure how the pro shops run current through large quantities of small nuts and bolts but I don't think it would work for the Caswell system.
Each item really needs the right amount of attention to get a quality finish.
It takes quite a bit of time and some experimenting around but a quality end product is possible at home. As for anything with iron in it..it can be plated
well.. but water current is your best tool. Lots of circulation
The bath might need to be cleaned after iron plating as its a bit contaminating to the water.
Strain the water in a coffee filter and plate some scrap metal afterward and your good as new
Good Luck!
@@MikesRestorations That is how it seems from my reading, lots of trade secrets. I wonder if the large shops don't rely on current but rather on the solution? Also I'm very confused about the chromate solution. Nobody ever talks about what's actually in it. Although I did find Alodine 1201 which looks the same, seems to act the same, but nobody ever mentions using it on zinc. Everyone uses it to prime or treat aluminum. The other one mentioned is Iridite 14.2, it's not as popular though and people say it's more like a coke vs pepsi thing when it comes to picking between them. So the calipers you coated, were cast iron after all? Or were they aluminum or cast steel? Much appreciation for your info and time. Btw, that rectifier you got from Caswell, judging by the specs it's similar to other variable dc power supplies on Amazon, I'm assuming it's safe to get one of those vs paying 2-3x more for the Caswell version?
Alex i'm not sure how the large shops run their current but electricity needs to happen to properly plate with zinc. Yes chromates are Mosley trade secrets but I have experimented making my own using the Cronak process developed in 1933. It worked pretty well but the color wasn't quite as beautiful as Caswell's or as close to Porsche's original..however with a little experimentation I'm sure various colors are possible.
Formulas break down as follows..
Yellow Chromate:
10oz sodium daichromate crystals per gallon of (distilled water)
(can be purchased on eBay form various vendors)
1/2 oz sulfuric acid per gallon (battery acid)
Blue Chromate:
.8oz sodium dichromate per gallon
3.2oz nitric acid per gallon
The calipers from Porsche appeared to be cast iron ..however
working with Porsche metals I have found they used various alloys
to composit their work.. I would have to run lab tests on some of the things Ive pulled of this car to know exactly what they were..
Amazing craftsmanship and knowledge they had back then working with alloys.
Aluminum can be zinc plated and polished or chromate dipped..
Daichromates will not stick to bare aluminum, steel, or cast iron.
It needs the zinc finish to adhere too.
Rectifier from Amazon should work just fine..its just a matter of dialing them in with a little practice
@@MikesRestorations Thank you for that valuable info! I'm taking notes. If I figure this out I can try making a video sometime of the setup to help others figure it out. I'm going to place the order for the power supply and look into other things for agitation/etc. I just pulled the trigger on someone's lot of materials after they no longer wanted to get into zinc plating. I hope I didn't waste money with this purchase but it seems to be fair priced when compared to actually filling up the cart with those on the manufacturer's website. Mind telling me what you think? www.ebay.com/itm/352516251667?ul_noapp=true
The list of ingredients included are:
(8) 500g Potassium Chloride
(3) 500g Zinc Chloride
(2) 500g Boric Acid
(1) 2kg Sodium Hydroxide
(2) Pure Zinc plates measuring 11"x8"x0.0625" - total weight is ~2.692 lbs. of pure zinc.
I asked the seller on which procedure or recipe they intended to use with the ingredients and they gave me two links they were following: p2infohouse.org/ref/29/28085.pdf and I guess they had intentions of doing nickel too so they also read: www.finishing.com/288/51.shtml
I'm still due to sit down and digest all of this information, there's a lot to soak in. Are there any recipes for black or olive chromate floating around or are those very proprietary?
The metallurgy qualities of Porsche are not surprising. I'm a BMW fan myself, and I have also noticed some areas where there weren't too many expenses spared. Are they on the same level these days? Or are they following the market like every other manufacturer and cutting corners? I can't believe the amount of shocking quality issues I've seen on many new vehicles in the past 5 years.
@@MikesRestorations Also want to ask, are you in Florida? Some of your videos look like it :). I'm in the area between Sarasota and Ft. Myers.
Nice work. Just one note, its actually Muriatic acid ,not muritic acid, which is how u guys pronounce it.
Thanks Mike - your info was also posted here; www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/nuts-ive-looked-all-over-and-nothing-germany.590604/
VCP Thanks! Its an honor to hang out with the Ferrari boys=)
Thats a car I really would like to take on some day... Incredibly Beautiful Art!
Do you have any photos of parts that you zinc plated but you didn't wire wheel after sand blasting?
Hello pattygq
I don't have any photos for reference..If you are wondering what the finish difference will be you could try experimenting around to see what works best for your application. I have found only sandblasting works but proves a darker more dull finish.
@@MikesRestorations Even with the Caswell brightener it's dull?
That Amazon link you give is no good.
Hello Bobcatt22
Thanks for the heads up..It seems to be working on my end can you describe to me what's not working when you click it on
Thank you!
@@MikesRestorations Working now - what I got was a blank page even after reloading it a few times. -Thumbs up.
I bet the yellow chromate rubbs off if you try hard enough
if you have a bright plating and do a dilute sulfuric bright dip before the chromate,
adhesion will be 100%. It has to be a bright plating out of the tank, no polishing. The "bright dip" kills the brightener polymer and leaves the zinc surface virgin. Atleast this is what ive found with Alkaline zinc plating and homebrew dichromate solution. Not so sure about the caswell chemistry adhesion. I tried zinc sulfate bath plating+ polishing after and no matter how clean i got the part or adjusted me chromate solutions, it just rubbed off. So the problem is, if you don't have a bright plating, it is pointless.