SHOGUN! Seiko Prospex SBDC029 Diver's 200m Automatic Watch Review - Perth WAtch
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ต.ค. 2024
- Review of this very popular "mini-grail" of mine, featuring Dia-Shield titanium case, ISO 6425 standard, Seiko 6R15 movement, and Hardlex glass!
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Perth WAtch - Sharing my passion for horology and watches. Enjoy the videos on watch reviews, general thoughts & discussions, side-by-side comparisons, horology topics, and more!
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The Shogun has been one of my mini-grails. After watching your mini-grails video, I went ahead and finally picked up one. I got it for just shy of $800. It’s the second titanium watch I’ve ever owned. Even with all of its shortcomings, it’s still an excellent watch. The lightness of the watch is amazing along with way it conforms to wrist makes it feel almost weightless. I also prefer the design of the Shogun over the Sumo, but have both (sumo in blue though). Great video. Cheers!
Thanks for that Christian! Happy to have inspired you to go ahead with the purchase and glad to hear you're enjoying it - I'm loving mine for sure :)
One of Seiko's best designs IMO, one that I'd be willing to buy despite it's shortcomings. It has a long list of unchecked boxes but I can't help wanting one anyway.
Thanks for that Jarrod... that's very much my own feeling about this watch I must say! :)
Wrong - Flixzone sucks!
I have this watch and I really am enjoying it, the finish is amazing. Usually titanium is darker and usually not polished. Seiko makes it look like it’s stainless steel. My biggest problem is the bracelet collars are on the outside and not in the middle, makes sizing a pain. Great review as usual.
Thanks for that - you're very right about those pin and collars, they can be an absolute dog to handle! Loose a collar and the pin becomes useless!
One month ago I bought the SBDC029 SEIKO Shogun Titanium for 900 $. This is my first automatic watch and I have been wearing it every day. I love this piece of art
Nice! Well many have said that it decimates their other watches and takes up ALL the wrist time! :)
Hi! I live in Japan. Thanks to this video, I could find that Seiko Shogun is a pretty awsome watch. After I watched your video, I went to watchstore near my house and actually saw Seiko Shogun. It was very pretty, and I bought it! Thanks to your video, I could buy so nice watch. Thank you. :)
Thank you very much for that - very happy to hear that it was helpful! :)
Hi, i purchased my Shogun from Bic Camera and previously a different Seiko from a Yodobashi store in Tokyo. Good luck with your Shogun.
I have one of these. When the hands and dial markers, as well as the bezel, catch the light at certain angles it can look quite stunning. Have had quite a number of comments about this.
It’s really quite a classic piece from Seiko, lots to like about it and it’s still one of my regular wears :)
I got mine last week.
I had to have it calibrated by a local watch repairer as it was gaining roughly ten seconds a day but he got it down to almost a second. Lovely watch! I can live with the clasp and bezel complaints.
Thanks for that - glad you managed to get it regulated to very good result! :)
I gave up on seiko about 2 years ago because of alignment issues and it still continues. I bought a pre loved Orient Saturation Diver and it's fantastic. cheers
Thanks for that - I think you're definitely not alone in that, that's one of the major gripes that people complain about with regards to the Seiko divers.
Dang I have a titanium Mido Ocean Star iv really good watch I wanted a titanium that's why I went with that it was 1200 bucks I had no idea Seiko my favorite brand in the world made a titanium for an equivalent price or I would have went with the Shogun. Great review
Thanks for that - they make more than just this one in titanium, but the Shogun is surely my favourite :)
I had one of these and you’re right , the bracelet stinks! Way too much gap between the end links and lug and crappy clasp. I wore it on a NATO then sold it shortly thereafter! Love the light weight tho
Thanks for sharing that - I am loving the overall design and titanium of this watch... gonna be a keeper for me I think :)
It's a very good watch. Picked mine up pre-owned under 600US, sold off for a good measure more. One of the best bezels I've tried. Size esp. thickness was just a bit too big for my 6.75" wrist, it lost out to my Mido Ocean Star titanium which is thinner & has ratcheting clasp.
Thanks for that - a pity you found it too big, I am very much loving this so far, and it's a keeper for sure! Cheers, Ivan.
Great review, thank you. I'm somewhat underwhelmed by the bracelet... the recent reissues (051/053, for instance) have a much better bracelet design, albeit the same lame clasp. Not sure what to think about hardlex... Kind of a minus, innit.
If only Seiko had released the sbdc053 with a titanium case...
Thanks for the thoughts! The new 62mas designs in Titanium would be interesting indeed, although to be honest I haven't found that range appealing or attractive personally. I think there are reasons to go with Hardlex but they really should charge less for not having sapphire...
My thoughts on titanium is that it might get more scratches than stainless steel, but it’s easier to fix, I just used the glass fiber pen to remove scratches once a while
Thanks for sharing that... I might have to get myself one of those pens!
I wish the braclet had more articulation. I don't mind the pin and collars for adjusting it. I swapped the clasp for the type found on a Marinemaster. It also looks great on a Nato strap as well when paired with colors that go with the dial. Enjoy your watch I'm good health!
Thanks for that! Yeah you make a good point, the bracelet does kinda not want to fold in on itself much at all, but I guess one the wrist that's not a problem. Agreed - it would go very well with a matched NATO! Cheers, Ivan.
Excellent, unbiased review of a personal watch. Were it not for the titanium it could pass for an Orient Ray 2 without the day complication. Interesting that even at around $1K Seiko still has QC issues.
Thanks again Brian... yeah the QC issues continue to be a bugbear for sure! A killer for some, but for me I love this watch nonetheless :)
I'm a little late to this video but you did a fantastic job. I own this watch and even with all of its issues, I absolutely love it. It is by far my favourite watch in my collection. This was also my mini grail watch. My grail was the Rolex Submariner which I also own but I actually like the Shogun better. Like others have already said, the thing I hate most is the pin and collar bracelet. What a pain in the ass that was. Screws would have been so much nicer.
Thanks for sharing that mate - I wish that someday I might be offered to purchase a Sub!
When push comes to shove, pin and collar wins over screws… but for the average day to day use, screws are just much more pleasant.
I don't know if it's like my new turtle but I got a double dome sapphire from crystal time and installed it on mine. I got to learn to like those bracelet so for me the only real negative was the hardlex. I scratched all of my hardlex over time and anyway I wanted a dome not a flat one. It's relatively easy to install so I did it myself. Really worth the trouble for the look on the turtles but on your watch maybe a flat one is better.
Thanks for that - I've seen high dome sapphire crystals on Turtles and I think they look great. For this watch I think best complement would be a gentle dome sapphire.
that would be great to know the material of the polished marker borders and bezel insert. would also be great to find out they are both Ti. luv mine since May 2015 script Automatic
Hmm good point, however I'm pretty sure the bezel insert is not Titanium...
It is a lovely watch and happy I have one.
The rubber strap that comes with 029 though is pretty cheap in my opinion for a watch in this bracket. It just feels like an afterthought and quite hard.
Also, with a Titanium watch it sort of defeats the purpose a bit if we pay for Titanium and then stick run rubber on it.
By comparison I also have a 053 Seiko and the rubber/silicon (not sure) on the 053 is so very much better and more comfortable than the one that comes with the 029 and I really enjoy it.
My clasp is pretty well scratched already, probably from desk surfing but other than that the diashield is holding up well.
My 029 runs a little to slow, needs an adjustment, but no alignment issues here.
Thanks for the review
Thanks for sharing those thoughts, much appreciated! It's a pity this rubber strap is so sub-par... it really should've been better than that. Cheers, Ivan.
I looked a all the Seiko range....
It came down to the Captain Willard (strictly for nostalgia) or the Titanium Black Shogun with the bracelet . Nicer indexes than the review watch. The gold second hand is a delight ...I don't even mind the cyclops bubble.
Understated, elegant and manly.
It's not a BIG watch. It's just right. It fits my average 7 inch wrist ...exactly.
This one....if you only can have one...this is it.
Classy enough for dress...tough enough for play.
Haha very nice - thanks for sharing those thoughts
Yes a great watch in many ways, but i must have got a friday afternoon one. The bezel is so tight i can't move it and the watch loses almost 1 minute a day. Sent it back to Seiko for a service [£135.00] and for that they would put a new movement in it, which surprised me because i thought they were adjustable?
Oh dear, sorry to hear that. Yes the movement can be regulated but at that much deviation perhaps they feel it has been damaged. Possibly.
Congrats on your acquisition! Fine presentation too. Other than the pressed clasp, your complaints truly are nits, to my mind. An almost intrinsic Seiko.
Funny thing about titanium: I enjoy its use in many personal accessories but I find, with watches, I miss the solidity and wrist sensation of a good chunk of steel. Odd.
Thanks for that bro - interesting comment on titanium too.
Regardings to nitpicks - what about the poor end link fit? Surely that's no minor thing...
Perth WAtch Meh. What's half a mil among friends? :) Not like it's gonna wrench your arm from centrifugal force when you gesticulate. Might be an artifact of the manufacturing process with the non standard material or tolerance stacking.
Disconcerting as this example might be, the absurd precision achieved in mass watch production is staggering and a good part of my enjoyment of the hobby.
Well depends on where that half mil is... :)
Ironically I've heard of stories of bracelet failure during gesticulations but I'm not sure if that can be blamed on said half mil...
Overall I love the watch, it's a great piece... but as always I point out what I notice with full disclosure ;)
Perth WAtch Well, fair enough. I recall a bracelet failure with an Invicta Super Diver that involved a moving fridge and narrow doorway. Didn't feel the impact but heard watch hitting floor. No other damage, the cast mid link had sheared. Easy enough to replace, once at home, as skinny wrist equals spare links. Working with pick up crew that day gave me a chance to sport the Invicta without being pretentious or risking a more expensive piece.
Decades earlier when beating on my then only watch, a Seiko Pogue, a jeweler educated me about Seiko's thick spring bars after a second similar failure.
Bracelets have been good to me and I'm sure that lack of floppy excess of strap material has little to do with my preference for 'em. :)
Oh wow, dramatic! No other damage is remarkable... must've been a soft floor, carpet or something? A hard surface would almost certainly put a mechanical movement off by some extent... not to mention dent the case... that was a good stroke you had!
Nice Seiko Dive watch, improved movement, like the titanium and diasheild..but poor bracelet design and no saphire , poor bezel fit and finish...not a piece for my collection. Thanks for sharing..!
Thanks for that Don! The weaknesses are there for sure, but despite all that I find myself loving this! :)
You missed when the hour and minute hand line up they form a rocket shape. The rubber strap is plasticy and crap. Looks great on a Seiko turtle rubber strap though.
Interesting point about the rocket shape... haven't heard that description before! Thanks for the feedback about the rubber strap.
Thats a Seiko rocket! www.flickr.com/photos/63058860@N02/27975036875/
I guess that's another one of those official unofficial fan terms so prominent of Seiko :)
I wish this was 42mm not 44mm, I think it would be a lot more proportional to the bracket and less overbearing although i'd still love to try one on my 190mm wrist to see how it looks
Thanks for the comment - all the best with getting in to try one, hopefully there is a dealer near you?
I like watching your videos. You do a great job. I do want to point out that this watch has a terrible chapter ring issue just like practically every Seiko. I know, because I have a lot of the very good Seiko divers. It is incredibly sad because I really love Seiko, but I find it Unforgivable how they can't get it right with the chapter ring
Thanks for that bro! The alignment issues are definitely one of the most common complaints people have about Seiko divers, no doubt! I have reviewed close to a dozen Seiko watches and this one is the only one where there has been a notable alignment problem, and this was with the bezel, *not* with the chapter ring (see 12:55 onwards). So I would say that any Seiko has the *possibility* of a chapter ring issue, rather than this being a certainty.
Actually, if you look at the index at 6 and 12 you will see that there is a misalignment with the chapter ring. It might be a slight misalignment, but it still is bothersome to me.
I think the chapter ring on this watch is lined up straight... I don't think you can judge in photos and video - unless it's absolutely dead straight on there will be some parallax error which may make it look off...
Perth WAtch that's a good point, however I make sure always that the position of my eye is exactly perpendicular to the plane. As long as you're happy with it, that's all that matters. However, I promise you it has actual errors just like the majority of my watches. Especially, at the six. You are a better man than I. Keep up the great work!
Really beautiful Seiko watch. Titanium is lightweight and very durable, but the finishing normally more fade than steel. But the design and polishing on this watch is awesome. Thanks to the DLC coating it is pretty and scratch resistant
Thanks Azam... I am loving it for sure! Just to clarify the Dia-Shield isn't DLC, it's some Seiko proprietary coating but it does protect it from scratching somewhat.
Nice one Ivan. Seiko are a very good choice for any collection.
Thanks for that - indeed, many would say everyone needs to own a Seiko :)
It's hard to stop at one seiko.
That's why I have 4. Or was it 5? :D
Another great review there Ivan. Thanks. Definitely a step up from my Samurai dive watch. Double the price of the Samurai. Is it worth the extra? Maybe... but for now, I am happy with the Samurai.
Did you mention if this is a JDM only or international release ??? I probably missed it.
Thank you very much for that - I didn't mention about the distribution market. I think initially it was JDM but it is now available at retailers outside Japan, including Seiko dealers in east Australia as far as I've heard. Cheers, Ivan.
Nice watch and I love my Seikos but man in man for this type of money? Dunno I think I'd go Swiss like maybe Tissot?
Good review though Thanks!
Thanks for that... definitely in reasonable Swiss range, but Seiko gives them a fair run. I'd challenge anyone who has a perception that a $1000 Swiss is automatically (pun intended) superior to a $1000 Seiko :)
Have to say I like the SBDC51 more cause of the sapphire crystal and the bracelet is kind of better.. Although I like the titanium on the shogun
Fair enough - it's a marginal choice between the two I think...
Perth WAtch would just get both haha
Haha yes that'd be an option although realistically I can't give much wrist time to even one watch as it is! :)
Nice watch Ivan. Bit tough on it though haha (with the nit picks). Us Seiko fans are very very discerning haha although $1000 USD is a heafty pricetag so i see what you mean. Keep up the good work 👍
Thanks Sam! Oh I can nitpick with the best and seeing as I bought this watch I felt freely inclined to do so :)
Perth WAtch yeah your right. A thousand dollars is a lot of cash too 💵
I have used a Seiko Turtle for diving at wetsuit extension in bracelet worked great. Even over a 7mm wetsuit.
Thanks for that - great to know it's functional in real life! :)
Hi, thanks for the honest review. pleasant voice.
Most welcome, thank you for the positive feedback :)
Beautiful watch. Great review.
Thanks for that! :)
thats a good looking time piece
Thanks - Agreed! :)
I'm interested to see what happens when the bezel takes a knock against a piece of coral. I suspect a ceramic insert would crack.
Ceramic may crack if knocked hard enough. Aluminium of course would not.
I purchase a Seiko SBDC029 but the bracelet is too short . Where can I buy a spare link? Thanks for your help
Probably just try eBay?
Great watch in my opinion, slightly overpriced though. At that price point , it should definitely be a sapphire crystal, although Hardlex is Ok I guess. The main negative point for me was the clasp. The machining was poor and the inside part of the clasp was digging into my wrist making the watch unwearable. Luckily for me a saw a video on TH-cam from a guy called George who suggested the ratcheting type clasp from the Titanium Tuna. It cost me a little to get that put in, but Seiko had it in stock and they installed it for me. I also had to buy an extra link which was not cheap, but again Seiko customer service and repairs took care of that for me. Overall I like it because it is a brand with history, it has a great design and wrist presence, and it is super comfortable and light which for me is important as I simply can't wear a lead ball on my wrist. I don't understand people who equate the weight of a watch with quality. A watch is supposed to be well built and solid, yes, but first and foremost it should be comfortable. The Seiko Shogun is very ,very comfortable, once you change the clasp.Good review, keep up the good work!
Hey thanks for that detailed mini review! I actually agree with just about everything you said there, a lot of good observations you have made from wearing it. Only thing where I differ is that whilst I also think the clasp is rather poorly done, I have not had any problem with discomfort myself... outta the box this has been one very comfortable watch for me :)
Imho, hardlex is (ahem) just about as good (hides from flying rotten fruit from angry protesters) as sapphire. It's a perfect example of Japanese technology rising to the level of the highest quality. My 007 hasn't got one scratch on the hardlex. The stainless steel body is all scuffed up.
Thanks for that, however I don't think it's a matter of opinion... just objective fact. Even the most ardent Seiko fan would not claim it's the same hardness. Documented MOHs hardness is typically anywhere from 6 to 8 (6 being typically for hardened mineral, 9 being sapphire) but there is no objective data from Seiko or a third party that I know of. The SKX bezel helps protect the glass... my orange monster definitely has scratches on the Hardlex.
I own one.Had to buy a ratcheting clasp from Seiko that normally goes on the Tuna Titanium . The clasp is made of steel and titanium and is much better built without sharp edges that cut into your wrist like the stock clasp . It also offers “ on the fly , tools free, “ micro adjustment which is handy . At this price point Seiko should have put that on the watch .That is my main complaint , the rest is fine, I can live with it. The clasp though, if I had not managed to switch it out I could not have worn the watch on the bracelet as it was hurting my wrist. I would have had to put it on a rubber strap most probably . Oh, and the silicone strap supplied with the watch is absolute rubbish, why bother ? Either supply a decent strap or a NATO or just don’t include anything .
Yeah the ratcheting clasp is a nice upgrade - I’ve reviewed some watches with that. Was the rubber strap that bad? I can’t recall but I suspect ones bundled with current releases would be much better.
Those applied indices are badly out of alignment with the chapter ring, surprised you can't see it when discussing the bezel misalignment . Shame, hopefully can be adjusted.
Do you mean the markers are applied incorrectly, or the chapter ring is installed wrongly? I still can't see it holding Watch in my hand here, the 12 o'clock looks dead right on, so either it's parallax error you're seeing, or my eyes just ain't good enough - in which case I happily live in ignorant bliss :)
☑️ sir : very good information.
Thanks and welcome
Fabulous watch 👍 thanks Ivan
Most welcome James - glad you like it too :)
One question... Do the chapter and bezel, hands and indices line up?
Did you watch the video?? Please see from 12:55 onwards for alignment comments.
Perth WAtch I asked the question as soon as I started to watch the video 😂
Haha no worries - hope its answered your question!
Where did you buy that watch from?
Please check out the links in video description for my sources :)
did the minute hand jumps 3 seconds at 2:59?
Haha I think you mean the second hand? It did not jump in reality - that's just my video editing to cut out verbal mistakes :)
@@PerthWAtch hahaha... Yes. the second hand. it makes me wonder. thank you. lol.
What size are your wrist?
17cm
@@PerthWAtch awesome can’t believe you answered. Thank you 🙏
I used to be a Seiko fanboy, but man... that clasp and still Hardlex? For 1200 bucks???
But Seiko know, they´ll get away with it. There are just too many people who´d buy anything that says "Seiko", "200m" and "Prospex".
Thanks for that - exactly right, in many ways Seiko can get away with it. I can understand the reasoning for Hardlex but it's not excusable that they charge same or more compared with brands that give sapphire. With regards to the labelling ironically it seems to me the "Prospex" is in fact less desirable, and people will generally prefer older models that don't have that extra branding if given a choice (eg. monster models, and the older version of this SBDC007).
I like it so much, i bought 2. But, i must say the Spring-drive SBGA 231 is the one to look out for if one prefers titanium. The way the zaratsu polished ring circling the lumibrite pop out is just mesmerizing.
Thanks for sharing that Canon... oh yes, where this Shogun was a "mini grail" for me, the SBGA231 is fit to be a proper grail watch for some!
I was looking at the GS but couldn’t like any of them unfortunately. Ended up buying this one for under $800 in Japan. Bezel aligns perfectly and no play in the bracelet attachment. I mean I bought it from a shop and could inspect all of that. Really happy with this watch so far 👍
Awesome, glad you bought one that you could check out first and are now enjoying it. All in all I do love this watch :)
What I find annoying on this model seiko is the short hand set to far from your markers? Plus the pointer is far to thick for my liking, And I would have expected a window on underside of the watch for the price?That said the rest is quite average for a seiko!!
Yeah I get what you mean about the hands - less critical for hour hand but the minute would do better closer to the chapter ring. The thick pointer I don't mind because that what you need to give the kick ass lume. As for a display case back, well these are ISO 6425 compliant designs and Seiko pretty much never do them for the Diver's 200m watches... a solid back is just, well, more solid ;)
Certina DS Action diver Titanium is better in every single way and cheaper
Rolex clone looks and bracelet, no hard coating, and definitely poorer lume and resale.
Why do you say it’s cheaper? Second hand price is coming up more expensive than the Shogun. Unless you mean the quartz version!?
At this price point it does not really clicks many boxes. Even if you pay $900-1000 I believe Longines Hydroconquest would be a far better choice than a Seiko!!!
Longines has terrible, terrible lume
I think you're paying mostly for titanium (as compared to say a Sumo) and also for the design. The Longines design is quite specific and some really hate that...
Then you have Certina diver, very good Tissot, Rado Hypercrome. Lume is not the best argument but if someone says Titanium then I have nothing to say.
MrBacchus18 But Longines has a far better value than a Seiko.
Not sure about Longines having better value - how do you quantify value??
Can I asking the price ,in any world owner,because I have one,ser No,770466.bought in Taiwan,ROC,It is good watch,
Sorry I don't understand your question...
Sorry in Taiwanese, English not good,
But your film is nice,
@@PerthWAtch my item is made in Japan
Thank you - I am happy that you think my film is nice! :)
"But, you know, you're not paying for the box, really, you're paying for the watch." You are wrong. You are paying for the packaging.
You’re wrong. I’m paying for the watch ;)
@@PerthWAtch Of course you are being charged for the packaging. Don't be silly.
Don't be silly - what the statement is referring to is that many people don't really care for the packaging, and popular pieces will resell even if you have disposed of the box ;)
👍🇨🇿
👍
I'm pretty sure the Oris Aquis would get more wrist time than that Seiko! 😂
Maybe
no hi-beat movement, no sapphire, crappy clasp. How much??? It's just not worth it. 'very balanced.'...looks just like every other sub hommage
Thank you for sharing your opinion... I wouldn't call this a sub-homage. Individual views not-withstanding, the masses continue to clamour for Seiko... it's much more than the logical on-paper value.
Any way thank you
No problem :)
For a $1,000 watch those end links, cheap clasp, and no sapphire are not acceptable. I’m sorry this watch shouldn’t sell for more than $600
Unfortunately par for the course when considering Seiko or any other big name... many may also feel that a Submariner shouldn’t sell for more than $2k, etc
Throw in sapphire and it's worth it, otherwise nope.
Very definitive - I like that ;)
nice watch but completely overpriced for what you get , or dont get....
Yeah that's one of the serious drawbacks here... it's really the Titanium that the price is marked up for, and therefore shouldn't be so high...
Great watch but that tacky pressed metal!!!! ugh
Yeah that sucks
Shitty hardlex crystal, shitty bezel and insert, chapter-ring misalignment, all standard with Seiko overpriced shitty dive watches. Much better watches, including Swiss, available for same price or less.
Thank you for your restrained comment... so can I clarify whether you think this is a shitty watch?
Perth WAtch I think it has a few good features, the drilled lugs, the quality of the finish on the case, the lume. These alone don’t justify the ridiculously inflated price. Nor should they distract from Seiko’s piss-poor, contemptuous quality control. Seiko have invested a lot into development of their mediocre movements and are recovering those costs and more by increasing prices and lowering their already low production values. So yes, this watch measures high on the shitty-watch scale as do most of Seiko’s watches, including the entire ‘Prospex’ range.
Thanks for clarifying - I actually agree with much of that. I haven't looked into the pricing of this movement but for what you can get an NH35 for (about $30, or less?) I think that's a very fair and reliable movement actually.
Seiko will likely continue to play the high margins as they have established a fanatical following, and as long as it sells, that will not change. Much as this leaves a distaste for us, I think other companies play similar hands. It's just that Seiko sometimes hits the spotlight more as no other company have the range that they do...
Do you still have the Shogun? Thoughts on ownership after all this time?
Yes I do... and I will likely never let this go. There’s something special about this watch... it’s just very well designed and the titanium adds to it.
@@PerthWAtch Yup, I won't be selling mine either. These are going for big money now, easily over a thousand bucks.