Welcome back Keeper Tyr! - Patch 10.2 Guardians of the Dream [Warcraft Lore]
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 ก.ย. 2024
- Patch 10.2 finished up the tyr rebuilding quest and the major story of dragonflight. There will be more story & patches, but this is a good 'end' point as any... I hope you'll enjoy ^_^
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![Vyranoth & Wrathion - Dazzling Diplomats (Patch 10.2 Guardians of the Dream) [Warcraft Lore]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/xfP8jdN9WB8/mqdefault.jpg)
![Vyranoth & Wrathion - Dazzling Diplomats (Patch 10.2 Guardians of the Dream) [Warcraft Lore]](/img/tr.png)
![The Story of: Aberrus, the Shadowed Crucible - Patch 10.1 [Lore]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/dWZr2PsbYyY/mqdefault.jpg)
![How The Worgen Took Back Gilneas [Warcraft Lore]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/axVi7I3HX4c/mqdefault.jpg)
![โฮ่ง! (SUGOI) - LYKN [ OFFICIAL MV ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/nFp4zjAARFs/mqdefault.jpg)
![Tyr Reborn Cinematic: Elisande Returns - All Cutscenes [WoW 10.2: Guardians of the Dream]](/img/n.gif)
Tyr: I have missed so much history
Cho: I am Loremaster Cho.
Cho: Would you mind walking with me and help with a few chores?
When Tyr says " I have much to learn it seems" The rest of the Tyr's Guard should say "Quick! summon the loremaster!"
Tyr: The who?
The Loremaster: Hello Everyone!
They need to add an NPC either in the SW library or IF museum of Nobbel that gives recaps of the different expansions/major lore moments.
If you transmog your weapon to any version of the Silver Hand legion artifact, Tyr will comment on it. A nod back to Legion I imagine.
He will also react if you have equipped the Infinite version of his hammer, but he'll react in horror and ask you to put it away
I think this situation to be extremely interesting. Dragonflight started with the Idea that the Aspects had to resume their great purpose to be able win in the fight against the primalists, but every single flight decided to stray from that purpose to aid those close to them. This is ultimately what turned them back into the aspects.
Now, Tyr has reawakened into a world that does no longer follow the plans of the titans, yet it prospers, will he understand its value just like Algalon had or will he try to force us back into the order the titans envisioned.
Nonsense.... "NONE" of the dragonflights earned anything or did anything correctly for the world. They surrendered and failed to the "together virus" conspiracy perpetrated by cosmic team life to enslave them all in a hivemind; soon to destroy our freedom and individuality as well.
Wait... wait... NOW i know why this situation sounds so familiar.
This Tyr story is similar to God of War Raganarok. We all talk about trying to find Tyr and we finally get him back in the end, once everything has cleared and peace has been restored to the land. And now we have a purposeless Tyr who must now ponder on his role in this new world.
lol, at least that Tyr situation was planned out, while this one is a victim of unfocused writing and cut content.
@@mokarokas-1727 Hes literally getting a patch related to him man , yall so face value
@@GazingTrandoshan - Says who, some article you took at face value? ;)
Tyr was clearly meant to build to some finale along with the main story of Dragonflight, and then it was delayed and made the whole thing pointless. Alexstrasza LAMPSHADES it by saying they rebuilt him to get help, but ultimately didn't need it. lol
I'd much rather Tyr be treated as a friend than this weird character assassination angle that it would be if they brought him back and immediately started shitting on him.
Their relationship is messy and not all good, but if they started treating Tyr like some monster and ignoring all the good he'd done, it'd feel so revisionist and wrong. He genuinely was her friend, but he was also her boss and the contact point between the Dragons and the Titans. If nothing else it'd be blaming the messenger. So I'm glad they didn't essentially "cancel" Tyr.
I like the "waves" explanation for the timelines to be honest. It at least tries to explain inconsistencies in a poetic way, but most importantly, it allows the story to not take itself too seriously and fall back to the powercreeping mess of cosmic proportions. Also, that scene with Tyr and Koranos made me think of them and Rupert, the Gentleman Elemental travelling and checking wonders of the earth
IDK. It's understandable to feel like certain story beats are abandoned, and maybe somtimes they are, but a lot of things are also "in the back pocket" to be pulled out in future storylines. Like, say, a giant zone-sized sword.
What Sword
nah, I believe that the plan was to have the "worldsoul saga" right after Legion, but Chris left and they went with BFA and SL which were pulled out of the ass. Now that Chris is back he said "back off, we continue where I left off and thats it"
i think BFA was planned and itegral with Azshara and Nzoth and the first consequnces of the sword being stabbed in the Planet(to also set Xal free) but SL seems iffy. Its about what big story telling changes were made by afrasiabi nd co for BfA(which then lead to SL).@@cci9459
tl;dr Koranos and Tyr are unemployed now
Tyr looks happy to see the Azeroth has growth and many of his battles (and suffering) always meaningful.
I'm not surprised the Game didn't address the Novel at all, at this point reading the Novels are pointless because the Game rarely connects to them.
It's quite ironic considering in MOP/WOD/BFA days not reading one was equivalent to skipping on a whole season in a TV show.
@@Gapis321 To be fair even they could've been skipped, only small pieces was taken from the Novels added into the Game.
@@aster4jadenprobably the biggest offender: MoP ended with Garrosh getting detained to stand trial in Pandaria. There is a novel covering said trial, it's conclusion and Garrosh's ultimate escape to alternate draenor. If you didn't read it, the dark portal suddenly turns red one day and orcs start flooding through. There is zero set up for the expansion in game, and next time you see Garrosh at the end of the leveling experience, with only the general context on how he got there.
@@Gapis321 I think trying to make sense of it is better than knowing the truth. They had Baine as a lawyer in some Pandaria court?
@aster4jaden Outside novels and card games and such are not canon. Metzen specifically made that rule back in 2011. You are completely backward on your logic...... the novels don't matter to the game at all, and they have zero obligation to even acknowledge their existence.
i feel like people forget that there are 2 more patches in dragonflight that are confirmed to have story content. i feel like they'll address the dragons and the titans in one of them. right now they're just saying "alright, he's back. that is objectively good. let's save the bad and the ugly for tomorrow"
"You join us in a time of peace and friendship." Don't remind me.
"and family"
kinda curious for more info on what Khadgar and his "old friend" are investigating too... We know some, but only a little.
Also as Mon-Ark reminds us, Decatriarch Wratheye is going to be /very/ interested in a giant tree full of Life...
I have to say, it's beautiful they did a throwback to Runas. Honestly one of the saddest quests in WoW
I kind of like what they're doing with Tyr (so far). With everything that is happening on the ptr as well, despite all of the changes around him, he doesn't feel the need to impose his will or the Titans will on on everyone. He seems to just be content with just following along for the ride and letting everyone else take the lead.
In the novel that should have had stuff put in the game, they made it seem like he probably would have a reaction similar to how Odyn would react to someone defying him or doing anything different from what he wanted. However, much like the quest that we had that allowed us to see his memories from the past and his final battle, he didn't really seem to care if the aspects would do things differently from what he wanted. All that seemed to matter was them and Azeroth just living. Now that he sees everything in one piece (mostly), he is just sitting back and letting things just play out while he observes.
It could have been worse. Like Algalon wanted to wipe out all life because things went completely different from what the Titans knew. This is right along the lines of the Titans' position as well. They came back in Legion and didn't really mind everything being different.
Alexstrasza and Nozdormu are the only remaining of the original aspects that were empowered by Tyr (Neltharion, Malygos and Ysera being dead), perhaps that's why the others stayed away?
Yeah I’m thinking Tyr is being eased into what has happened since his death. Since introducing him to all the changes is a lot to process. His reaction when asking about the rykhul seemed less like he was annoyed about more like him trying to process everything
It is quite the... situation. He was "away" for as long as the Dracthyr, slightly longer even - but they were always confined to the Dragon Isles while Tyr saw the whole world, which is now unfathomably changed. How will he react to all the new, and all the old that's changed, or the old that hasn't changed so much, like Odin?
I think Tyr will be an ally in the Worldsoul Saga, and possibly our guide in The Last Titan expansion. He could lead the charge against Iridikron.
People give the ending a lot of crap and while it's a little cringe I think it fits the theme of the expansion really well. Even since DF launch the entire story of Azure Span is Kalec learning the importance of family from the Tuskar. I think now people are saying the usual "IT'S A HELLO KITTY BABY GAME NOW" but with time people will appreciate it as a lighter expansion before we got into the real heavy/dark trio that's coming up. Not to mention that after Shadowlands we needed some more light-hearted character focused stuff. Even though Fyrakk's introduction was him killing a Centur and genociding Loamm.
Finally a more rational opinion of Dragonflight’s story.
I was going to say isn't this what people wanted? A more grounded story, family and friends are the forefront, however people don't seem to like that ?
@@craig3850People seem to like edgy stuff more.
I've seen people complain about that as well but for me that isn't really the main issue. I don't mind a lighter story or tender moments but they just feel..poorly done? or rather not done at all. We see Vyranoth come to Alexstrasza and next we see her they are apparently besties again. But that all happened off screen. She gets made an aspect..of what? or did she? Tyr returns which she certainly must have some reservations about and surely Tyr must feel some sort of way about there being an additional aspect one that opposed order to start with and..does she still oppose order?
It's just a lot of blanks and unearned moments.
Even Fyrakk what exactly was his goal at the end? To burn the world of Azeroth through Amirdrassil..ok? What exactly does this accomplish? Does that make him more powerful? Does he wish to rule this new fiery world? Is it still about the whole titans and order thing? But if it is then why did Alexstrasza say at first you fought for a goal but now you just seek power. Does setting the world on fire make him more powerful..?
I feel like there is a good book here but half the pages are missing.
People gave it a lot of crap because it just did not feel like it was a final boss. Fyrakk was so underwhelming. He just didn't go out with a bang.
Will be interesting to see what new tidbits the next few patches provide.
"Kalecgos, Merithra and Vyranoth were busy elsewhere I guess".
You kinda missed Ebonhorn in that list :D
Remember we have never seen proof that alternate timelines are unnatural or a bad thing, the Titans just went "because we said so" and everyone went along with it. They know a single timeline is a lot easier to keep in order than one that is shifting and branching, so what better way to keep their dominion absolute.
Totally the opposite.
The time of the dragon is over now is the dawn of man!! TTOOOO WWAARR!! LEAVE NONE ALIVE!
not sure if its been mentioned yet but, dragonflight is literally avengers infinity war and endgame and it shows in all the bad cliche ways.
I kinda wish the silver hand artifact weapon from legion played a part in the Tyr questline. Considering said artifact is literally the warhammer Tyr used in battle. But nope. No mention of it after legion.
I heard you get some extra dialogue from Tyr if you have it equipped idk if that’s true or not
Look, we're smart adults. We shouldn't need to think so little of ourselves to attempt to justify how bad Dragonflight's plot was.
When you said "Maybe my interperetation is entirely wrong." It shouldn't be man. Your one of the smartest, biggest lore guys in this entire fandom, if not the biggest. And If anyone is going to get it, its going to be you who understand this stuff wayyyyyy before me.
I promise you they did not think this deeply when crafting this story.(unfortunately) And honestly If we still don't get it at the end of the expansion? thats not on us. Thats on them. for failing to tell a coherent story.
If the story was overly complex. it would also be a bad story. right? your not gunna be very popular if nobody is smart enough to appreciate your work.
A story should be simple. A good story makes you think about it for days, weeks after you put down a good book. Allowing you to see deeper meaning and read between the lines. A good story will exceed all expectations, and (here's my favorite line these days) Subvert our expectations in a satisfying way. Emphasis on the satisfaction.
The ending of Dragonflight merely subverted our expectations
"Wow i bet nobody saw that coming huh!?"
No, we didn't. Because you didn't set that up in any meaningful way. It just ends.
Does anybody else feel like the story changed halfway through the expansion again? I certainly do. the Dragonflight loading screen makes no sense looking at it now. why does it feature Ysera and Wrathion. Getting big shadowlands flashbacks here.
At this point multiple people in the fandom can write fanfiction far exceeding the canon narrative. while paying more respect to the existing lore.
Wow feels like a ship with no captain ever since SL. and it probably is. A bunch of young junior devs doing their damndest to pull it all together, follow a formula and make the magic happen.
And I now see why Metzen was back up on that stage at blizzcon. They lacked a vision, and unity. and daddys home to pull it all together for une last hurrah.
I'm tired. I want the story above all to be successful. I want wow to end in a satisfying way. Like chris said "We don't wanna be there with our grandkids piloting the game for us when we wrap this thing up." so that all the characters I love and MY characters that i am so invested in can know peace.
Anyway apologies for the long winded rant. Il be tuned in. Love ya Nobbel.
I read your comment, great comment. I love wow so freaking much that I don't want to pay a sub for this. I NEED to punish the executives that let "a bunch of young junior devs" (as you say) make a messy game. My heart would be whole again if I had wow do well again, and I refuse to pretend this is OK and continue paying for their expansions and subs. Please bros stand with me in this, I beg you, I need wow to be good again.
A story being complex doesn't make it bad, it's execution. but this story was terrible
So, when Tyr first met his demise none of the races on Azeroth existed yet right? So, why do the aspects have visages of elves?
I might be wrong, but I think as time passed they just had the power to change their appearance to walk among people. Not only aspects can do that, for example Onyxia, Nefarian and many many more dragons.
@@macieq44 True I suppose they can look like anything they wish. But Tyr recognizes Alexstrasza and Nozdormu when his memory is restored at Tyr's hold. If fact, Tyr says that they have not changed.
@@christopherdaffron8115I suspect it's due to him being a Keeper, and able to see more than just their present physical form. Might be he can see their "aura" to put it simply.
@@christopherdaffron8115 - This is for budget/time constraints reasons rather than logical reasons. It's safe to assume they had different visage forms way back then, but they're not going to bother designing them for a small tidbit. So if you want an in-universe excuse for that, the "aura" thing suggested above might apply. lol
@@mokarokas-1727 Well the aspects had the same visages in the early part of the Tyr quest line when they show a vision of the past where Tyr is saying goodbye to the aspects. Seems to be a pretty consistent use of the same visages.
Take a drink everytime someone says "their people" Can`t we just do things just for selfish reasons and every just has to deal with it.
“Their people” who act exactly the same as all the other “peoples” and everyone all has the same values. Diversity!
So I ran through this questline right before watching this video and none of it for me was voice acted. Must of been an addon that killed the sound. This was way more enjoyable actually hearing them speak 🤣🤣
I think what they did with the aspects here was right. Alextraszas relationship with the keepers and their plans are complex at worst, but it has always been shown that tyr was a close friend to the original aspects, and immediatly questioning and antagonizing an old friend who was revived after thousands of years wouldn't feel in-character, and save the conflict of ideals a bit later.
It was probs smart that they didn't include vyranoth into the equation right at the start as well. Imagine if u wake up from a long ass coma and ur family decides to invite someone they know hates you lol.
Mm. It'd frankly feel like character assassination if they immediately had the aspects shitting on him after reviving him. If Alexstrasza herself isn't a pariah, why should Tyr be? They didn't consider Order to be anything other than good at the time. It'd be very hypocritical to shun Tyr over it now.
I don't think we'll get the messy feelings Alexstrasza has on the events fully explored though. And thats a shame. We're about halfway through a good character story.
The entire "together virus" is just an evil conspiracy by cosmic team life to enslave them all in a hivemind; and destroy us as free individuals in the process. The dragons failed, and Tyr should help save us from the evil conspiracy.
Huh, I didn't know Tyr goes to Amirdrassil with Koranos...I wonder how he gets there...since I haven't noticed how to get him there in my playthrough.
Thought about a video about the Time Rifts?
Eugh. World of Warcraft really was something else. wish it had stuck with a more grimdark tone that it originally had
With each cosmological force heving a direct oposite, what if all Titans eventually fall to chaos as Sargeras did. Aman'thul is obsessed with Time and one true Timeline. Eonar is obsessed with life and could become entangled in there. Norgannon is obsessed with keeping knowledge. What if he doesn't have enough storage to keep it all. he might need chaos to get rid of some redundant information.
life and death is intertwined as we know from Ardenwield. Maybe this cycle is something that has been something like a "truce" between life and death as cosmological forces.
I think a big question that that raid cutscene has spawned for me is what does Azeroth want the Aspects to do for her. Because they all got their aspectral powers originally from different titans (ie. Alexstrazsa and Ysera from Eonar, Nozdormu from Aman'thul, etc.) for different reasons, but now they all got it from one titan/world soul. I can only imagine that Blizz could tinker with their new powers being stronger than before and what Azeroth is telling them to do in the epilogue and/or future expacs in the Worldsoul saga.
Azeroth did not make them aspects; they got tricked by cosmic team life into having a "together virus" that would turn them into a hivemind enslaved to have all of our freedom and individuality destroyed. Azeroth is being attacked by cosmic team life, it is not a victory...it is a failure and a tragedy.
Yeah, I really hope they drop the stupid, "traditional good guys are actually the baddies" trope. It's fine for the Titans to be nonchalant and undervalue lesser beings. I don't think they were ever supposed to be malicious though. Humans don't look at ants the same way we look at dogs and other humans. It's understandable the Titans might come off as callous or uncaring. That's why they cared about Azeroth herself more than the creatures crawling on her surface.
Everything has pointed to the Titans overall being friendly towards most things that the Azerothian races perceive as good and honorable. Especially when they are shown our force of will and determinism. As Algalon deemed us worthy it seems the Titans now hold us in similar regard.
This is the same as the forces of light and void. I'm fine with saying that when the light and void is reduced to there primordial elements they are dangerous to life but to me that's not overt malevolence. I think though the light has been done dirty just to subvert story tropes. I think it's reasonable that the best outcome for the Azerothian peoples is to have balance between all the primordial powers. The thing I don't like is painting historically good things like Light, Life, and Order as oppressive and evil when given the chance to be dominant.
It's lazy and is just as tropey at this point as the traditional Good vs Evil. Except it doesn't usually follow a logical and satisfying method of story telling. It's just the now infamous Kylo Ren line, "let the past die, kill it if you have to." Which is just cringey self self-aggrandizing writing by people who think they can do better than what traditionally works well in storytelling.
I expected Tyr to either be confused or even upset that they are now empowered by something other then order magic.
Tyr is the most chill and nicest of the Titan Keepers. In Norse Mythology, Tyr is not only the God of War but also the God of honor, law, and oath-keeping.
Or happy. Alexstrasza went along with it because she thought it was best at the time. Who knows if Tyr thought the same.
Its 'he' not 'they'
@@studiosraufncingr6965 - Instead of eagerly jumping at the opportunity to be upset by something, try actually reading what it says properly. lol
He's certainly confused, but he seems so disconnected right now that I don't think he's decided whether to be upset or not yet. It's understandably a lot to take in being "awakened" after 20 000 years.
Nozdormu and the infinites need a dedicated expansion or even a saga tbh.
I am pretty sure Dragonflight suffered the same fate as Warlords of Draenor.
They most likely shifted resources from Dragonflight to work on War Within. And that's why the story of DF feels to stunted and rushed.
can we stop saying this every expansion lol. SL had the WoD treatment. DF has alot of story telling. we might miss a raid but thats it. Story telling and the amount of it doesnt suffer from having a Raid Tier less anymore bc of the in between patches and we even get some story in the Fated Saison patch so. Before yes, when we had 3 raids we knew we lost alot of Story but now thats different. Is there still room for more? def but lets have more than tiktok memory and remember other expansions and set it in relation.
@@1Forn61 You're invalidating and proving your own claims wrong by your own example. Which expansions are overwhelmingly and irrefutably valued and liked and celebrated for making sense storywise....? Wrath and Legion. Each of them had 4 major raids and complete stories for each. Which expansions are overwhelmingly and irrefutably judged as the worst....and for not making sense....? WoD and SL. Each of them had only 3 major raids and incomplete story for every single one of them such that we still don't understand or accept their inconsistency and contradiction to real lore. The storytelling absolutely and undeniably and irrefutably suffered..... and DF being only 3 major raids and incomplete stories that are inconsistent and contradictory to real lore puts it smack dab into the "WORST" category by people who care about the real lore.
I wonder if i'm alone here but... We have multiple timelines and versions of the universe *yet* we live in the "perfect" timeline where we never lose, barely fail and so many time scrap as much as possible.
I wonder why they never get us get back and lick our wounds and then work a way around, that using the knowedge of other universes...
So far our biggest defeat was the starting events of WoD wich tell us plany on the matter...
👏🏻
You wanted more than this shit expansion and the writers had for it. Chris came in and has changed the ending to try and link it back into the actual story of WoW since the first 2/3's of this expansion was completely disconnected from every other than the dragon aspects not having thier powers (and even that is extremely vague). So the whole thing is just a mess, now that chris is guiding they are just trying to wrap whatever up with out causing any more damage to the mainline story, so the less things outside of dragonflight that are referenced, the better. Just pu this shit in the ground and move on. Tyr should never have been brought back in any form either, like, i could go down the biggest worm hole talking about the lore and why all of this is just bankrupt storytelling with an incomplete understanding of the lore they are writting for.
In general I didn’t mind the general idea of dragon flight but yeah until Chris came in it was kinda all over the place
The way we got the disc was so awful.
World of Ask Politely?
idk if this is an unpopular opinion or not, but chromie feels even more cringe in DF than any time (no pun intended!) before.
"What would Tyrsus do?"
As for why Alexstrasza and co still calls him friend. Perhaps it's some remnant of that fear they have, that is mentioned in the War of the Scaleborne?
Maybe the reason Alexstrasza calls him Friend now, is the same reason she stole the Protodragon eggs and had them infused with order magic: She's still afraid of him, just a bit, and so to avoid ruffling any feathers, she addresses him as she did in the past. For now, at least.
Your outside books are not canon.
Personally, i do think people are not happy with the story but it did work, DF is liked, however the end cinematic is not well written or directed.. the issue is they could have said the same thing and the reveal of azeroth being the whisper or giving them aspect powers & people would have liked it. The cinematic was a hello kitty baby game, see the War Within cinematic , nothing happens and so much happens. I think they failed in showing the end and thats what people are hating more than just the expansion on a whole.
Valunei is so lame. She's the exact type of character that makes world of warcraft feel small.
God all the time travel alternate timeline stuff is just so awful.
These outfits that dragons wear in human form make the world seem not believable. Like they exist in a vacum. We never get to see the society that develops and lives this style. It completely breaks the immersion and believability for me.
Hopefully this is the last time they keep butchering the main storyline because reasons.
Why is Tyr walking in slow motion? 12:37 It's year 2023.
Also why is Tyr such an emo looser? He is literally made from stone. Who's fantasy of a "titan keeper" is this? He should be highly intelligent, emotionless (like Algalon), efficient executive. He should move at lightning speed to put this world in order as he interprets will of the Titans. He should be a front seat driver of the story type character, like Vegeta, instead of back row, lethargic and passive.
And the Drachtyr were useless. XD
Man you spend too much time on the ending that you want rather than just telling us the story. A conflict about what was done to the eggs just largely seems irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Yeah, it's the choice that started it but does it matter anymore?
It was a total lie anyway..... evil ice dragon and her siblings did more evil to dragon eggs than any force in the universe; including horde and void and elements. The Danuser replacement writing was so incredibly contradictory and inconsistent.
It's touchy feely, it's feminine and I love it
Men here acting like men cant be more than brutes is wild
The cinematic and this entire expansion was one gigantic failure...... the only thing I can gather is that cosmic team life conducted an evil conspiracy to lie about the titans and force a "together virus" on the dragons and as many mortals as possible....to turn them into a hivemind of slaves. That would explain them completing each others' sentences, and constantly spewing out together/family/together/family/together/family when it didn't make any sense. We don't have a single piece of evidence showing that Azeroth as a world soul had anything to do with it. Them "telling" us something as unreliable narrators doesn't show or prove anything objective.
Dude talking out your ass when you clearly only watched 2 cinematics and think the whole expac is like this lmao
DF has the worst story other than Shadowlands. It really is bad. Gameplay is good, but BFA even had a far better story overall than DF which is Disney+ level nonsense.
im so tired of that sjitty slow whisperly talking of those hero's... its so soft and boring and doesnt even make sense in war times.
The game’s lore is still so fucking bad. Therapy for mentally distressed teenagers