Great video George! My TruLock Extra-Full finally showed up today. TruLock sent me 9 more chokes that I am waiting on now. Canada Post was on strike so I’ve been waiting over a month for these to show up. Videos and reviews on them coming soon!
George, I would love to see a comparison of various 20 gauge steel number 3 loads. I have done well with Kent, but would like to see a head to head comparison with others like speed shock, boss steel reserve, hevi steel etc. Really excited to see you post more 20 gauge stuff!
Another great test George. BUT WOW I struggle to justify the regular BOSS ($1.89 per) over federal speed shock (0.72c per) because of the price difference. Good to know what I can spend my money on when I make it LOL.
Thanks! If you'd rather use steel over bismuth, then go for it. For me, I don't even give it a second thought, but if I shot 2 cases of shells a season, it would probably be another story. But my current shooting volume is budget friendly for bismuth. When it comes to TSS, that's another story. But that video should come next week!
You should check out Winchester’s last call TSS I’ve been shooting it in 20ga through a Carlsons cremator the last few weeks and it’s absolutely devastating on birds.
The use of a 3 inch hull arguably protects the chamber from the extra hard, tss shot. Hull in England recommends when shooting tss or steel to pair cartridge length to chamber length for that reason.
There are two levels of Steel Shot proofing in England and Continental Europe. For their High Performance CIP Superior Proof loads Hull actually recommends 1/4 choke (IC). This is for pattern reasons. Hull in the standard proof steel loads recommends no tighter than M as does CIP. There are one or two Continental firms that will build a fun and warranty it with High Performance (HP) CIP superior proof steel shot. Personally, my new HO Steel Proof double (for tungsten) is being built w CIP HP Superior Steel Proof and M/M (1/2) choke on both barrels.
Even George would not shoot 2 and BB steel through full chokes. Modified is just fine up to 4 shot. Doubles which Hull cartridges are designed around have other considerations such as thin(er) barrels. In Europe/England most shooting is done w doubles. HP Superior Steel Proof proofing is also higher than SAMMI spec for the 3 inch 12.
I have a test suggestion. I was in SD last week pheasant hunting, one day the wind kicked up to 55 mph. Some of the guys were talking about going up in shot size. Physics would tell me a larger shot size would have more wind resistance. Short of a wind tunnel any idea how to test this theory?
The same factors that impact bullet drop impact wind drift. Velocity and density primarily. Going to bigger shot will give you more mass and more retained velocity and thus be less affected by wind. Is it enough difference to make a difference in a hunting scenario? According to my ballistics charts, no. Steel #2s at 40 yards with a 50mpg cross wind has 41 inches of drift, #1 shot drops to 39 inches of drift. So not enough to matter. But the effect of high winds is massive. Testing that practically is hard. But it is worth a video. I'll look more into it. Thanks!
Do you think that this waterfowl ammo could be used for turkey hunting with a reasonable expectation of doing close to as well as a turkey specific load?? The turkey loads are so dang expensive for tss and so on!! This would be a better choice price wise for turkey hunting even if you lost a lil range but after finding your channel these loads seem to work very good out to 40 maybe even 50 with a little testing with my personal setup!! I find it hard to belive also that there is a huge difference in Turkey and waterfowl loads from the same company am I wrong in my thinking is this a good way to get more ammo at a better price?? I’m curious of your response after all the testing you do!!
I should do a video about that. But yes, this would be a viable turkey load out to 40 yards, maybe even 50. There is quite a big difference in the wad between waterfowl and turkey shells, the turkey loads hold much tighter patterns. Easier to get head shots with fewer body hits. But these pellets are going so fast, you are likely to have pass through shots in the body so it's less of an issue. I'll see if I can include something along those lines in my turkey videos this year.
@ I wasn’t aware the wad was different. I just assumed they were about the same with either and called turkey or waterfowl for marketing or something. Thanks for the info and I think that would make a good video just to see how they compared if someone held their shots on turkeys to 40-50 yards.
Pretty remarkable that 100 FPS didn't translate into deeper penetration. It would be another interesting test to have unplated vs 100 FPS faster unplated. My PHD is telling me insane FPS might be marketing hype as well.....
I have learned that velocity claims are often temp specific. BOSS measures their velocity at cold Temps which translates into higher velocity at higher temps, most others do it at room temp. I don't know about Apex. But they could be nearly the same velocity in practice.
Which load of BOSS vs. Which load of Winchester? I have some BOSS 1 5/8 oz loads that kick harder than a 3.5" turkey load. I wouldn't use them, they are punishing. But then the BOSS Stinger is the lightest recoiling 12 gauge hunting load on the market, lighter than 28 gauges. So with BOSS you can pick your load and recoil to be whatever you want it to be.
You definitely deserve more subs! Man, what you do is a lot of work! Hats off to you sir, thank you!
Thank you so much!
Wow, those two are close.Thanks for the info
Thanks for watching!
Thanks for the video!
Thanks so much Ben!
Another awesome vid bud
Thank you!
Great video George! My TruLock Extra-Full finally showed up today. TruLock sent me 9 more chokes that I am waiting on now. Canada Post was on strike so I’ve been waiting over a month for these to show up. Videos and reviews on them coming soon!
Thank you so much! So sorry to hear about the mail strike!
George, I would love to see a comparison of various 20 gauge steel number 3 loads. I have done well with Kent, but would like to see a head to head comparison with others like speed shock, boss steel reserve, hevi steel etc.
Really excited to see you post more 20 gauge stuff!
Thanks! I just did one with 12 gauge #3 steel, I would expect the results to be about the same for 20s, just a few pellets less across the board.
Interesting. Keep them coming. I like your vids
Thank you!
Good Video George. 🦆🦆🦆I only use TSS for Turkey, but I use now steel for Duck ,I brought a box of Bismuth #4 to try . Thank for the Videos. 🦆🦆🦆
I would like to see a test and your thought on apex tss/steel blend. Also what shot blend of shot sizes would you recommend?
I generally am not a fan of blended metals, but I'm not opposed to testing some if I can get ahold of it. It certainly could use some testing.
another great topic. Thanks
Thanks so much!
Another great test George. BUT WOW I struggle to justify the regular BOSS ($1.89 per) over federal speed shock (0.72c per) because of the price difference. Good to know what I can spend my money on when I make it LOL.
Thanks! If you'd rather use steel over bismuth, then go for it. For me, I don't even give it a second thought, but if I shot 2 cases of shells a season, it would probably be another story. But my current shooting volume is budget friendly for bismuth. When it comes to TSS, that's another story. But that video should come next week!
How much do you shoot?
You should check out Winchester’s last call TSS
I’ve been shooting it in 20ga through a Carlsons cremator the last few weeks and it’s absolutely devastating on birds.
I just got a box, but it came months after I recorded this video. Hoping to test in the future.
The use of a 3 inch hull arguably protects the chamber from the extra hard, tss shot. Hull in England recommends when shooting tss or steel to pair cartridge length to chamber length for that reason.
I have not heard of that one before. Interesting idea.
Hull in England also recommend choke no tighter than 1/2/modified when using steel shot.
Another shotgunning myth you seem to have called out George.
There are two levels of Steel Shot proofing in England and Continental Europe.
For their High Performance CIP Superior Proof loads Hull actually recommends 1/4 choke (IC). This is for pattern reasons. Hull in the standard proof steel loads recommends no tighter than M as does CIP.
There are one or two Continental firms that will build a fun and warranty it with High Performance (HP) CIP superior proof steel shot.
Personally, my new HO Steel Proof double (for tungsten) is being built w CIP HP Superior Steel Proof and M/M (1/2) choke on both barrels.
Even George would not shoot 2 and BB steel through full chokes.
Modified is just fine up to 4 shot. Doubles which Hull cartridges are designed around have other considerations such as thin(er) barrels. In Europe/England most shooting is done w doubles.
HP Superior Steel Proof proofing is also higher than SAMMI spec for the 3 inch 12.
I have a test suggestion. I was in SD last week pheasant hunting, one day the wind kicked up to 55 mph. Some of the guys were talking about going up in shot size. Physics would tell me a larger shot size would have more wind resistance. Short of a wind tunnel any idea how to test this theory?
The same factors that impact bullet drop impact wind drift. Velocity and density primarily. Going to bigger shot will give you more mass and more retained velocity and thus be less affected by wind. Is it enough difference to make a difference in a hunting scenario? According to my ballistics charts, no. Steel #2s at 40 yards with a 50mpg cross wind has 41 inches of drift, #1 shot drops to 39 inches of drift. So not enough to matter. But the effect of high winds is massive. Testing that practically is hard. But it is worth a video. I'll look more into it. Thanks!
Thanks George, I always say shoot the best shells you can afford for me that's bismuth, Merry Christmas god bless you and go get them in the marsh.
Thanks Jeff! Looking at the cost factor, just wait till next week's video.
Do you think that this waterfowl ammo could be used for turkey hunting with a reasonable expectation of doing close to as well as a turkey specific load?? The turkey loads are so dang expensive for tss and so on!! This would be a better choice price wise for turkey hunting even if you lost a lil range but after finding your channel these loads seem to work very good out to 40 maybe even 50 with a little testing with my personal setup!! I find it hard to belive also that there is a huge difference in Turkey and waterfowl loads from the same company am I wrong in my thinking is this a good way to get more ammo at a better price?? I’m curious of your response after all the testing you do!!
I should do a video about that. But yes, this would be a viable turkey load out to 40 yards, maybe even 50. There is quite a big difference in the wad between waterfowl and turkey shells, the turkey loads hold much tighter patterns. Easier to get head shots with fewer body hits. But these pellets are going so fast, you are likely to have pass through shots in the body so it's less of an issue. I'll see if I can include something along those lines in my turkey videos this year.
@ I wasn’t aware the wad was different. I just assumed they were about the same with either and called turkey or waterfowl for marketing or something. Thanks for the info and I think that would make a good video just to see how they compared if someone held their shots on turkeys to 40-50 yards.
So 1/4 inch of shell length adds 100 fps. Makes sense.
No, it makes no different at all, I do not think either shell is at capacity.
Pretty remarkable that 100 FPS didn't translate into deeper penetration. It would be another interesting test to have unplated vs 100 FPS faster unplated. My PHD is telling me insane FPS might be marketing hype as well.....
I have learned that velocity claims are often temp specific. BOSS measures their velocity at cold Temps which translates into higher velocity at higher temps, most others do it at room temp. I don't know about Apex. But they could be nearly the same velocity in practice.
I will get crap for this but I tried Boss for the first time and recoil is absolutely higher than Winchester.
Which load of BOSS vs. Which load of Winchester? I have some BOSS 1 5/8 oz loads that kick harder than a 3.5" turkey load. I wouldn't use them, they are punishing. But then the BOSS Stinger is the lightest recoiling 12 gauge hunting load on the market, lighter than 28 gauges. So with BOSS you can pick your load and recoil to be whatever you want it to be.
@@TheNewHuntersGuide I was comparing Winchester 3" 1-1/8 oz #2s with Boss Legacy 3" 1 1/2oz #2s and Warchief 3" 1 3/4 oz #2s.
"Exactly zero points ahead."
Haha, yup.
Sorry, my wallet cannot afford either one 🤷🏼♂️🤷🏼♂️
Wait till next week's video before you set that idea in concrete!
@ 👍🏻👍🏻 Can’t Wait 😃 Thanks George