I have serviced hundreds of these. The three 47uF caps, R1, and BR1 are the main failure points. That board has already been serviced, the original R2 R3 resistors are much smaller, and the varistor has replaced a regular resistor at R1. Ideally, the BR1 bridge rectifier should also be replaced with a 1000V one. You should also adjust the white trimmer RV1 to 85V across the red and gray motor wires. R32 (560k) is another potential trouble spot. But most important of all, anyone attempting a repair should unplug the turntable before going near the board. These boards are powered up 24/7 whenever the turntable is connected to power, that's why they are failing after 30 years. By the way, the oil you took out is the factory supplied graphite based Linn black oil. That's what's supposed to be in there.
I agree on the oil I replaced being factory, it was very tacky and gummy. Good info on all the other stuff, I've serviced a dozen or so of these but no where near hundreds.
I have this exact problem but took mine to my local very expensive Linn dealer for repair a few weeks ago. I'll be on the phone picking it tomorrow so I can fix it myself. Cheers man 👊🎶
Thank you so much for this video!! I just inherited an LP12 from my Dad (his pride and joy - and a huge part of my childhood) but it's having motor issues like those in the clip ....bit worse actually, a really bad knock and the tiniest resistance stops the motor. I'm looking forward to getting her on the workbench! Thanks again, and for all the folks who commented for noobs like me that just love listening to music how it should be ....yup I can't seem to listen to any of our bluetooth speakers now : )
I respect an electronics tech that has a clean,organized work area. Several TH-cam Electronics sites work benches are a cluttered disaster. Drives me nuts!
Thanks for the tips, just picked one up today, $35 at a thrift store, turns on, but no movement from turntable, but now I have somewhere to start from on the list!
You've probably got cracked and burnt resistors too. I recommend you have a really close look. There is a known update you should carry out on the Valhalla power supply board. If you do a search you'll find there's a standard upgrade which Linn did in the late 80's. As yours hasn't been done (I can see by the old bridge rectifier) I would strongly recommend you do that - no need to send it to Linn. Also, if your electrolytic capacitors are drying our, you should look at replacing all of them as they're very old. I also found that Resistor R33 was completely fried and needed replacing (upgrading) . Here are the notes I made when I did mine: VALHALLA UPGRADE. Replace R1 with Surge Gard SG240 Thermistor (Digikey) Replace BR1 with Vishay KAB100E 1.2amp min (Farnell/Digikey) Replace C18/C1/C2 all with new 47microfarad 250volt axial NCC (Digikey) Replace C3 with 220microfarad 16volt radial Replace C14 and C20 with 1microfarad 63volt radial Replace C15 and C8 with 22microfarad 35volt radial use 22 mi-farad 50v in stock Poss replace R2 and R3 Welwyn W22 7watt 15K resistors Notes: RE: Valhalla thermistor The 3 big caps are 250V axial lead ones, they're perfect fit. Although higher rated voltage caps are sometimes suggested or seem a safer bet, its often they're bigger in diameter and may result with marginal or insufficient clearance to re-install the bottom board. Take note of this. Its imperative to replace all the other electrolytic caps for another lease of life, considering the whole thing is likely over 2 decades old. Note also that there's a capacitor (220uF/10V axial) nearest to the ribbon connector which one lead have to be soldered on the top and bottom plane, only this one. You can substitute this for the more commonly found 220uF/16V radial type, but again, ensure soldering the negative lead, top and bottom plane.
Just upgrade to the Mober DC motor and external control / SSP12 two piece inner platter and Mober bearing I did last weekend and will never regret it. Solid super stable ultra quiet, 45 & 33.3 and now much better resolution and dynamics. Linn charge us all way too much for upgrades that are no where near the cost effectiveness of this Mober upgrade.
The Alphason Sonata walked all over the top spec Linn , Pink T and Roksan when I auditioned them many, many ...many years ago. Basically I don't think Mike Knowles spent enough on advertising for the HiFi rags to upset Ivor and co by rocking the gravy boat.
One of my sales guys was mad about these turntables, and more importantly the tone arm. We thought it was a more sophisticated version of a Thorens TD125 series. Get Video. It show how capacitors in drive circuits are important as well as a good clean and lube.
You should use light machine old for the bearing , it's a white bearing liner . And you should fill the bearing with oil and put tissue knotted around the bearing and replace the inner platter and then remove the inner platter and the bearing oil is done , the way you did it , there's not enough oil in it the way you did it .
Use only oil supplied by Linn. Using a 2mm or 2.5mm hex key as a dipstick, there should be about 5/8" of oil in the housing before the inner platter is installed and the extra oil overflows.
Power for the motor board is direct off the power mains. Use an isolation transformer if the motor boards needs to be tested on the bench. Two power supplies on that board. One is HV used to drive the motor amplifier, other is a 9VDC used to run the CMOS logic stall divider, LP filter, control circuit and part of the motor drive amplifier. Most common fault, the three 47uF 'lytic capacitors, there is a power line inrush limiter that can give problems. The slow roasting of the capacitors is due to the 15K resistors used as a rectified power line voltage divider. These 15K resistors dissipate about 1.6 watts long as the Linn is plugged in. Highly recommended to replace these with two 7.5K @ 5 watt power resistors to spread out the heat and reduce further heat damage to the pcb. While you're in this board, replace ALL the 'lytic capacitors as the OEM units are mostly awful. The power mains rectifier some times die. Other designed in problem is R33, 180K @ 1/2watt resistor. It is under rated and tends to roast. This can happen to R32, 560K @ 1/4watt resistor which is a divider for the motor amplifier first stage using an op-amp. This resistor is also over worked by heat. It is possible to find poor solder connections on these boards. Check this as another potential intermittent problem source.
this is a later production turntable, or one that has been upgraded to have the gray sleeve inside the platter bearing (and black suspension bolts), made of a high-impact material called Peek, and which is ventilated to let the air out quickly when you reinstall the platter. Therefore don't let the platter fall hard into the bearing. Also, you didn't use anywhere near enough oil.
That's not a PEEK bearing. The only reason it dropped so fast is that there's hardly any oil in there. The bearing is designed to be filled to the point where the oil overflows the bearing. about 45 drops for a clean bearing.
Dude, Edgar Villchur of AR in 1961 came up with this suspension design and first such suspended type turntable selling for $78 usd. So they copy AR. Thorens came up with their springs suspension turntable in 1965 but Edgar Villchur came up with a turntable with this type of suspension in 1961 watch this video: th-cam.com/video/OOlAua3tBSw/w-d-xo.html
I had the same problems with my LP-12 a couple years ago. I re-capped the board but it didn't solve the problem. Then I ordered a Hercules power supply from Stamford Audio in the UK. It was not cheap but the Hercules gives you 45 rpm -- comes with a new switch to allow 33 1/3 or 45 rpm. Unfortunately that still didn't fix the problem :( so I bought a new motor, also not cheap. But that fixed the problem and even though it was a chunk of change, I think I won't have any more problems for a long time.
I own a Linn LP12 made in 1976.A couple of days ago the platter stopped rotating. For about a week before this happened I would notice a very mild noise for about 3 seconds that would go away as the platter reached full speed. When I now place my finger on the motor pulley I feel a vibration but no rotation. Could the problem be with the power circuit board which the original board and not an upgrade ?
Just to say if you aren't happy with re-capping your Valhalla, an alternative power supply is the Hercules. Arguably better sound but it does give you 33 and 45 RPM. I dropped one in when my Valhalla literally burst into flames! Oh, don't be worried about dark oil - Original Linn turntable oil is black! Very interesting video otherwise, thanks 👍
Same issue with the motor pulley after replacement of Majik PSU by Lingo 3 PSU. Please can you tell me how to fix this pulley which jerks and which is not able to pull the plate? Thank you.
To prevent belt stretch, slip and shine it is, in my opinion good practice to give the platter an assistive spin whilst you switch on....also periodic belt clean with isopropyl.
HiFinuts, no, do not clean turntable belts or other rubber parts such as tape deck pinch rollers with alcohol. It dries out the rubber! Use non alcohol-based cleaners. I recommend IntraClean.
Correct except no alcohol or organic solvent on the belts, it removes the plasticisers in the rubber and belt cracks also stretches. Belts only need a dry wipe. Pre spin the platter by hand before ON switching also remove belt after each play session and store in plastic bag or box away from heat, sunlight air conditioning. When removing belt use the back of your nail no finger tips, very important. Belt will last for decades and track with the correct tension.
You recommend synthetic 0W-30 oil for the bearing. What about 0W-16 or does it really matter since it is just a turntable and viscosity is not a big deal?
Just re caped mine interesting those small 16 volt caps in mine they are 35 volts ? may be that,s what Linn had at the time production or a later revision ? Motor is much stronger torque now . There is a pre set on the board which needed resetting, connected a meter to pin 1 grey wire and pin 2 red wire motor on the terminal strip and is now reading correctly at 85 volts +- 1 volt the motor starts first time.
I had an LP 12 years ago w/the Valhalla sound board, and the Itok 4 arm. Loved it, but man, if you bumped it by accident you had to set it up all over again. Had it before there were really good sound deadening/vibration cancelling racks. I had to buy a rack and mount it to the studs. Went to VPI, and never regretted it.
Yeah, I have an Aries 3 VPI and I picked up an LP 12 to mess with, when you look at how much money you can put into the Linn to get it sounding great, then look at a VPI classic on the used market the VPI is a no brainer if you want to plug and play.
Yes, a wall shelf mounted to the studs, on an outside wall if possible, is absolutely necessary for the LP12, or any suspended turntable, for that matter.
@@terrylarson7596 Yeah. I had the classic with (12” arm just before 3D arm), the outer ring, metal clamp, Lyra Kleos. The rest of the system and accessories were fantastic.
😂 +1 Probably mentioned elsewhere but there was in fact a legal dispute between Hamish Robertson (Ariston) and Ivor Tiefenbrun (Linn), to do with the design of the LP12 and how it was - in Hamish' view - a rip-off of the Ariston RD11.
Ivor Tiefenbrun would have told you that changing the caps away from the original make would completely destroy the sound. There again, he often talked bollocks.
I had a first generation LP12 (33 1/3 only) payed $400 in the late 70s or early 80s , and the Poster "Garbage In Garbage Out." Wish I had never traded it in.
Robert Kohut, Thorens *tonearms* are generally not great but some of the turntable models are pretty good, especially if they are designed to allow you to put a better tone arm on them. the TD 125 is a particularly nice unit.
THAT WAS GOOD BUT NOT PERFECT JOB,YOU HAD HAD TO ADJUST TO THE NOMINAL 33.33 SO FAR THIS IS A PRECISE DEVICE ONLY THE OPERATING VOLTAGE HAD TO UPRISE GAINING THE ADEQUATE RESULT.IF I SAW GOOD THERE WAS A QUARTZ LOCKED CIRCUIT
Sir, I have LP12 with Zeta arm just got from a friend from usa, but since I'm in India ur Voltage is 230v/50HZ but the one I have is 110v /60hz, where can I source 50hz pulley.
It so happens the Thorens TD150 top plate will fit exactly into an LP12 plinth. It is not by coincidence either. The spring points and subchassis fixings are measure for measure identical. Linn in fact (Ariston) made a well engineered TD150. The black oil is Linn's recommended lubricant. The Valhalla supply was notoriously unreliable. Every single Valhalla will end up the way this one has - this must have been low hours - most died in the same manner as yours 20 years ago? Speed is adjusted by carefully adjusting the motor tilt - Tilt away to slow, toward platter to increase. Use the arm board as an indicator for spring setting levels - and it looks nicer if the arm board is flush all round. Spend time dressing arm cable allowing a free bounce as this is crucial for performance, tighten that 'P' clip hard. The AR was NOT the first suspended turntable as history keeps forever flippin' telling us...there were others, and I will leave it to anyone interested to research and find one - at least.
Dude, Edgar Villchur of AR in 1961 invented the first of this type of suspension turntable and sold the first AR turntable with such a suspension in 1961 for $78 usd. And what were those others?????? Watch this video: th-cam.com/video/OOlAua3tBSw/w-d-xo.html
@@jogmas12On a different scale, but relevant - rather like Ferraris invented the polyphase motor in Italy before Tesla and Blumlein invented 45/45 stereo before anyone (a few claim this) in the USA. There are simply hundreds of injustices in engineering and it is always the self promoter that gets the glory. If you dig you will find. I have had a museum of audio back in the 90s - unfortunately I had to sell up.
paul davies, earlier LP12's have a white nylon- looking sleeve inside the platter bearing and on Linn turntables with this style of bearing it does take a while for the platter to settle into place as it displaces the oil and trapped air; however, later Linn's have a gray bearing sleeve made of some high tensile strength material called PEEK this gray bearing sleeve is ventilated so that air and slight splatter of oil will come right out of it almost immediately and the platter will drop in place very quickly.
Glad i came across this vid as i have heard so much about how great the Linn LP12 is - well for my money i will stick to my Rega Planer 2 , which to my mind is far simpler , less to go wrong and the sound it produces is magic to my ears.For starters that suspension - is that really needed and that sheet metal underside , does that not produce minute resonance acting like an amplifier? Then the metal sub and main platters are also resonance producers compared to the sensible glass platter of my Rega. Also my Rega has a ball bearing that sits at the bottom of the bronze centre sleeve and the sub platter's shaft sits on top of that ball bearing , which equates to a point load effect with minimum friction.For me a better system than this Linn. Another advantage with my Rega is that i can buy a new o-ring drive belt from an engineering supply at negligible cost and works just as good as an original Rega o-ring. The only criticism i had with my Rega was that the sub platter was made from resin and thus very light , so i made my own one out of SOLID brass with a hardened steel centre shaft and that adds another kilogram of extra torque to the spin.It will take a huge amount of cash to buy a turntable to better it.
I initially had one of the first Rega Planers close to 40 years ago and then upgraded to LP12 pretty quickly, now I am old and suffer from Tinnitus from too much load music...it is great fun.
It is recommended that the setup be done annually, to make sure that all hardware is still tight, that the suspension is still adjusted rightly, and that the belt is clean and not worn.
@@NateEll Any screw that goes into wood will need to be tightened occasionally. As will any fastener that goes through sheet metal (the nuts on the front and rear top plate bolts.
Linn SondeR? Wow Phone app for speed check? 👎 What power supply was that?? 2 -3 drops of motor oil? Um Linn oil is black If you have an LP12 run, don’t walk. I think this was this tech’s first experience with a Linn LP12
Concerning slow start-up times on an LP12 Valhalla: When servicing Valhalla boards, Linn now recommends adjusting the board to output 70-75 volts as opposed to the earlier spec of 85 volts. This results in a very slow start up, but also lower motor noise (smaller AC pulses), the benefit being an even a more black, more silent background when listening to music.
Clearly this guy has no idea of how to service an LP12. The main bearing should only be topped up with Linn black oil, no other type should be used. Likewise, you clean the spindle shaft with a soft cloth, not ruff kitchen paper. If you really want your deck to work at its best, have it serviced by your local Linn dealer who has all the tools, oil and parts to get it working at its very best. Guys like this are a definite no no.
Accelerometers in smartphones aren't really that accurate... I can recommend you to get a strobe light app and print a strobe disc, way more reliable. If you have the money to burn: factory made strobe disc might be even more accurate. I like your collection of Wiha tools there, I also have some, but not that many haha Mostly Knipex and Wera.
Mann, oh Mann, was für ein Murks. Schwarzes Schmiermittel im Tellerlager deutet auf einen hohen Verschleiß hin. Ich habe einen 10 Jahre alten Project RPM 1.3 Genie. Bei dem habe ich bis jetzt 2 Mal das Tellerlager kontrolliert, alles blank, glasklares weißes Schmiermittel.
the correct term is SONDEK not sonde'R' , You may also note that every LINN product features the letter K throughout its entire range from day one in 1972 to the present and every day going forward, more info:-www.positive-feedback.com/pfbackissues/0706/Ivor.7n6.html#:~:text=Bruce%20Kinch%3A%20It's%20been%20said,hundreds%22%20conventional%20gear%20goes%20for.
antigen4, I worked for a Linn and Ariston dealer some years ago, and I have owned both. Some of the Ariston turntables are pretty good, but not as good as the Linn in my opinion. It is almost impossible to get an Ariston subchassis set up correctly with the original springs and rubber parts, but used Linn Springs and bolts and rubber dampers work much better. I've upgraded Ariston's suspensions with the used parts that came out of an early Linn being upgraded to "Nirvana" springs; and once I used the actual Linn Nirvana spring kit in an Ariston. Either way, it's easier to get the Ariston suspension properly tuned with the Linn parts.
antigen4, that's a reasonable evolutionary chart! By the way, years ago, before I ended up working for a Linn dealer, I had an early AR with the crappy aluminum sub chassis and primitive tonearm, and I upgraded it with an acrylic sub chassis and platter bearing assembly that was sold as an aftermarket upgrade, I don't remember who manufactured it however. The new subchassis did allow me to put an Audioquest arm on it which was certainly better than the original AR tonearm, but a Rega P3 or Linn Axis sounded significantly better, and an LP 12 better still. we also sold Systemdek turntables, they made a nice, less expensive alternative to a Linn.
yes our local dealer had the same tables .. linn rega ariston etc ... my first table from them was a thorens TD160 which i stupidly traded in for a systemdex - i think IIX? the round one that looked like a UFO? i don't think it was that well made, that one
i'd never want a turntable like that, looks flimsy with it bouncing around like that and the belt slipping so much it can't have an accurate speed. My sl1200mk2 looks much better quality
Got memes? , the Technics sl 1200 is a fine machine for what it was designed to do, basically spin records in a nightclub or radio station, wow and flutter and isolation from speaker vibrations, 1200 cannot hold a candle to an LP 12 or any other well-designed belt drive turntable with a sub suspension. They're not built for hand cueing of records like a DJ would do (or for "scratching", definitely not designed for that either!); the Linn and other similar high-quality belt drive turntables are designed for extracting the absolute maximum last possible bit of musical information out of the record groove with minimal wear and damage to the groove, and to have extremely constant speed with very low wow and flutter , while also maintaining isolation from speaker vibrations that would otherwise muddy the waters so to speak. For what it's worth, I have repaired and installed dozens of SL-1200s in nightclubs over the years, but I personally own a Linn Sondek.
Sl1200 absolute benchmark for DJ work, or shops where people off the street may be allowed access, they’re designed to take a beating and with the latest model clocking in around £800 not cheap. The LP12 is a home system front end, Set up and left, flimsy is the last thing they are, they’re beasts, solid construction and basically unchanged in 5 decades. You can add & upgrade as you want. But think it’s fair to say they’re a one person turntable. I don’t let anyone touch mine.
I have serviced hundreds of these. The three 47uF caps, R1, and BR1 are the main failure points. That board has already been serviced, the original R2 R3 resistors are much smaller, and the varistor has replaced a regular resistor at R1. Ideally, the BR1 bridge rectifier should also be replaced with a 1000V one. You should also adjust the white trimmer RV1 to 85V across the red and gray motor wires. R32 (560k) is another potential trouble spot. But most important of all, anyone attempting a repair should unplug the turntable before going near the board. These boards are powered up 24/7 whenever the turntable is connected to power, that's why they are failing after 30 years. By the way, the oil you took out is the factory supplied graphite based Linn black oil. That's what's supposed to be in there.
I agree on the oil I replaced being factory, it was very tacky and gummy. Good info on all the other stuff, I've serviced a dozen or so of these but no where near hundreds.
Where can one contact you to fix a turntable?
THE LINN lp12 IS ONE OF THE BEST SOUNDING TURNTABLES EVER BUILD
Love my lp12. Had the same issue and the recap did the trick. Thanks the the insight you bring.
I have this exact problem but took mine to my local very expensive Linn dealer for repair a few weeks ago. I'll be on the phone picking it tomorrow so I can fix it myself. Cheers man 👊🎶
thanks to your videos i found my vahalla was 35volts to high omg ,it runs great now
Thank you so much for this video!!
I just inherited an LP12 from my Dad (his pride and joy - and a huge part of my childhood) but it's having motor issues like those in the clip ....bit worse actually, a really bad knock and the tiniest resistance stops the motor. I'm looking forward to getting her on the workbench!
Thanks again, and for all the folks who commented for noobs like me that just love listening to music how it should be ....yup I can't seem to listen to any of our bluetooth speakers now : )
I respect an electronics tech that has a clean,organized work area. Several TH-cam Electronics sites work benches are a cluttered disaster. Drives me nuts!
Thanks for the tips, just picked one up today, $35 at a thrift store, turns on, but no movement from turntable, but now I have somewhere to start from on the list!
Many thanks this was just what I needed. I’m going to maybe buy one used Lp12 next week
Cheers and stay safe these times
You've probably got cracked and burnt resistors too. I recommend you have a really close look. There is a known update you should carry out on the Valhalla power supply board. If you do a search you'll find there's a standard upgrade which Linn did in the late 80's. As yours hasn't been done (I can see by the old bridge rectifier) I would strongly recommend you do that - no need to send it to Linn. Also, if your electrolytic capacitors are drying our, you should look at replacing all of them as they're very old. I also found that Resistor R33 was completely fried and needed replacing (upgrading) . Here are the notes I made when I did mine: VALHALLA UPGRADE.
Replace R1 with Surge Gard SG240 Thermistor (Digikey)
Replace BR1 with Vishay KAB100E 1.2amp min (Farnell/Digikey)
Replace C18/C1/C2 all with new 47microfarad 250volt axial NCC (Digikey)
Replace C3 with 220microfarad 16volt radial
Replace C14 and C20 with 1microfarad 63volt radial
Replace C15 and C8 with 22microfarad 35volt radial use 22 mi-farad 50v in stock
Poss replace R2 and R3 Welwyn W22 7watt 15K resistors
Notes:
RE: Valhalla thermistor
The 3 big caps are 250V axial lead ones, they're perfect fit. Although higher rated voltage caps are sometimes suggested or seem a safer bet, its often they're bigger in diameter and may result with marginal or insufficient clearance to re-install the bottom board. Take note of this.
Its imperative to replace all the other electrolytic caps for another lease of life, considering the whole thing is likely over 2 decades old. Note also that there's a capacitor (220uF/10V axial) nearest to the ribbon connector which one lead have to be soldered on the top and bottom plane, only this one. You can substitute this for the more commonly found 220uF/16V radial type, but again, ensure soldering the negative lead, top and bottom plane.
Lovely video. Very informative and interesting. You have a natural, friendly manner!
Subscribed :)
Just upgrade to the Mober DC motor and external control / SSP12 two piece inner platter and Mober bearing I did last weekend and will never regret it. Solid super stable ultra quiet, 45 & 33.3 and now much better resolution and dynamics. Linn charge us all way too much for upgrades that are no where near the cost effectiveness of this Mober upgrade.
Thank you so much. Mine doesn't need it yet but yhis will be my go to video.
Happy new year!
The Alphason Sonata walked all over the top spec Linn , Pink T and Roksan when I auditioned them many, many ...many years ago. Basically I don't think Mike Knowles spent enough on advertising for the HiFi rags to upset Ivor and co by rocking the gravy boat.
What a rich trove of tips! Thanks a bunch!
One of my sales guys was mad about these turntables, and more importantly the tone arm. We thought it was a more sophisticated version of a Thorens TD125 series.
Get Video. It show how capacitors in drive circuits are important as well as a good clean and lube.
You should use light machine old for the bearing , it's a white bearing liner . And you should fill the bearing with oil and put tissue knotted around the bearing and replace the inner platter and then remove the inner platter and the bearing oil is done , the way you did it , there's not enough oil in it the way you did it .
Use only oil supplied by Linn. Using a 2mm or 2.5mm hex key as a dipstick, there should be about 5/8" of oil in the housing before the inner platter is installed and the extra oil overflows.
Correct, correct, correct also pre spin the platter before ON switching.
Power for the motor board is direct off the power mains. Use an isolation transformer if the motor boards needs to be tested on the bench. Two power supplies on that board. One is HV used to drive the motor amplifier, other is a 9VDC used to run the CMOS logic stall divider, LP filter, control circuit and part of the motor drive amplifier.
Most common fault, the three 47uF 'lytic capacitors, there is a power line inrush limiter that can give problems. The slow roasting of the capacitors is due to the 15K resistors used as a rectified power line voltage divider. These 15K resistors dissipate about 1.6 watts long as the Linn is plugged in. Highly recommended to replace these with two 7.5K @ 5 watt power resistors to spread out the heat and reduce further heat damage to the pcb. While you're in this board, replace ALL the 'lytic capacitors as the OEM units are mostly awful.
The power mains rectifier some times die. Other designed in problem is R33, 180K @ 1/2watt resistor. It is under rated and tends to roast. This can happen to R32, 560K @ 1/4watt resistor which is a divider for the motor amplifier first stage using an op-amp. This resistor is also over worked by heat. It is possible to find poor solder connections on these boards. Check this as another potential intermittent problem source.
Hey, neat idea - putting the platter on upside down! I've never thought of doing that.
this is a later production turntable, or one that has been upgraded to have the gray sleeve inside the platter bearing (and black suspension bolts), made of a high-impact material called Peek, and which is ventilated to let the air out quickly when you reinstall the platter. Therefore don't let the platter fall hard into the bearing. Also, you didn't use anywhere near enough oil.
That's not a PEEK bearing. The only reason it dropped so fast is that there's hardly any oil in there. The bearing is designed to be filled to the point where the oil overflows the bearing. about 45 drops for a clean bearing.
@@gotham61 5/8" - see above comment.
They took the idea from Thorens TD150 , 100% the same ...:D three spring-suspention 🤷🏼♀️👍
Dude, Edgar Villchur of AR in 1961 came up with this suspension design and first such suspended type turntable selling for $78 usd. So they copy AR. Thorens came up with their springs suspension turntable in 1965 but Edgar Villchur came up with a turntable with this type of suspension in 1961 watch this video: th-cam.com/video/OOlAua3tBSw/w-d-xo.html
Excellent Video Again! Thanks Mark!
I had the same problems with my LP-12 a couple years ago. I re-capped the board but it didn't solve the problem. Then I ordered a Hercules power supply from Stamford Audio in the UK. It was not cheap but the Hercules gives you 45 rpm -- comes with a new switch to allow 33 1/3 or 45 rpm. Unfortunately that still didn't fix the problem :( so I bought a new motor, also not cheap. But that fixed the problem and even though it was a chunk of change, I think I won't have any more problems for a long time.
I own a Linn LP12 made in 1976.A couple of days ago the platter stopped rotating. For about a week before this happened I would notice a very mild noise for about 3 seconds that would go away as the platter reached full speed. When I now place my finger on the motor pulley I feel a vibration but no rotation. Could the problem be with the power circuit board which the original board and not an upgrade ?
Just to say if you aren't happy with re-capping your Valhalla, an alternative power supply is the Hercules. Arguably better sound but it does give you 33 and 45 RPM. I dropped one in when my Valhalla literally burst into flames! Oh, don't be worried about dark oil - Original Linn turntable oil is black! Very interesting video otherwise, thanks 👍
I read that a defined viscosity oil is recommended for the lp12 to have a defined force to the belt. Any comments?
15:05 33 rpm is 1% too slow, not .01%
Can you describe how to troubleshoot the motor if the power supply repair did not fix the issue?
Same issue with the motor pulley after replacement of Majik PSU by Lingo 3 PSU. Please can you tell me how to fix this pulley which jerks and which is not able to pull the plate? Thank you.
thank you recap did the trick for my lp12
Linn use Velocite No 6 high speed spindle oil and filled so the oil seeps out of the bearing when the inner platter is fully down.
Thats why authorized Linn dealers had a jig to hold the turntable up in the air to work on it. I have one somewhere.
To prevent belt stretch, slip and shine it is, in my opinion good practice to give the platter an assistive spin whilst you switch on....also periodic belt clean with isopropyl.
HiFinuts, no, do not clean turntable belts or other rubber parts such as tape deck pinch rollers with alcohol. It dries out the rubber! Use non alcohol-based cleaners. I recommend IntraClean.
Correct except no alcohol or organic solvent on the belts, it removes the plasticisers in the rubber and belt cracks also stretches. Belts only need a dry wipe. Pre spin the platter by hand before ON switching also remove belt after each play session and store in plastic bag or box away from heat, sunlight air conditioning. When removing belt use the back of your nail no finger tips, very important. Belt will last for decades and track with the correct tension.
You recommend synthetic 0W-30 oil for the bearing. What about 0W-16 or does it really matter since it is just a turntable and viscosity is not a big deal?
Just re caped mine interesting those small 16 volt caps in mine they are 35 volts ? may be that,s what Linn had at the time production or a later revision ? Motor is much stronger torque now . There is a pre set on the board which needed resetting, connected a meter to pin 1 grey wire and pin 2 red wire motor on the terminal strip and is now reading correctly at 85 volts +- 1 volt the motor starts first time.
It's common for the radial lead caps' joints to fail, in addition to the large filter and output caps going bad.
Great vid and lots of good info thanks mate
rsanchez71
Great video. In another case, what if it was the motor?
Very cool and helpful video thank you
I had an LP 12 years ago w/the Valhalla sound board, and the Itok 4 arm. Loved it, but man, if you bumped it by accident you had to set it up all over again. Had it before there were really good sound deadening/vibration cancelling racks. I had to buy a rack and mount it to the studs. Went to VPI, and never regretted it.
Yeah, I have an Aries 3 VPI and I picked up an LP 12 to mess with, when you look at how much money you can put into the Linn to get it sounding great, then look at a VPI classic on the used market the VPI is a no brainer if you want to plug and play.
Yes, a wall shelf mounted to the studs, on an outside wall if possible, is absolutely necessary for the LP12, or any suspended turntable, for that matter.
@@terrylarson7596 Yeah. I had the classic with (12” arm just before 3D arm), the outer ring, metal clamp, Lyra Kleos. The rest of the system and accessories were fantastic.
Love your videos I am learning a lot.
Excellent tutorial. Thank you.
SondeK. I know it looks like an R
😂 +1
Probably mentioned elsewhere but there was in fact a legal dispute between Hamish Robertson (Ariston) and Ivor Tiefenbrun (Linn), to do with the design of the LP12 and how it was - in Hamish' view - a rip-off of the Ariston RD11.
The more common mistake I see is SOUNDek.
Hamish Spencer
Sondek
@@64bakes They both ripped off a TD150, they simply got a measuring tape out and re engineered it. All parts interchangeable.
@@martinda7446 they copied AR watch this video th-cam.com/video/OOlAua3tBSw/w-d-xo.html
Ivor Tiefenbrun would have told you that changing the caps away from the original make would completely destroy the sound. There again, he often talked bollocks.
Ivor would have said fuzz that 40 year old board in the bin mate as a Lingo would ring around it.. and he'd be right.
@@ronnie2163 And have an even fatter wallet.
I had a first generation LP12 (33 1/3 only) payed $400 in the late 70s or early 80s , and the Poster "Garbage In Garbage Out." Wish I had never traded it in.
Thanks for this video, it's an area I avoid but I'll send my viewers to this page.
Hi. Nice movie. I have same motor start problem issue. My Linn LP12 have got a Hercules II board. Solution for that board is same like for Vallhala?
iPhones a lot heavier than an lp how does it compensate!
Not really. Average LP, 140-180 grams. iPhone 8, 148 grams.
Don't forget Thorens has a chassis/sub chassis design as well.
Robert Kohut, Thorens *tonearms* are generally not great but some of the turntable models are pretty good, especially if they are designed to allow you to put a better tone arm on them. the TD 125 is a particularly nice unit.
Looks very similar to my Thorens TD150... Almost looks like some of the parts might be interchangeable.
Make damn sure you unplug it before going underneath. I caught a very nasty mains shock just by touching one of the springs.
I~have the adaptor to get the 45rpm but its a pain. There is an upgrade to the Valhalla PSU but it cost a load!
THAT WAS GOOD BUT NOT PERFECT JOB,YOU HAD HAD TO ADJUST TO THE NOMINAL 33.33 SO FAR THIS IS A PRECISE DEVICE ONLY THE OPERATING VOLTAGE HAD TO UPRISE GAINING THE ADEQUATE RESULT.IF I SAW GOOD THERE WAS A QUARTZ LOCKED CIRCUIT
Sir, I have LP12 with Zeta arm just got from a friend from usa, but since I'm in India ur Voltage is 230v/50HZ but the one I have is 110v /60hz, where can I source 50hz pulley.
I've used my LP12 in the US, Canada, Japan, and the UK. Never needed different pulleys. The power supply creates the AC sine wave to power the motor.
It so happens the Thorens TD150 top plate will fit exactly into an LP12 plinth. It is not by coincidence either. The spring points and subchassis fixings are measure for measure identical. Linn in fact (Ariston) made a well engineered TD150. The black oil is Linn's recommended lubricant. The Valhalla supply was notoriously unreliable. Every single Valhalla will end up the way this one has - this must have been low hours - most died in the same manner as yours 20 years ago? Speed is adjusted by carefully adjusting the motor tilt - Tilt away to slow, toward platter to increase. Use the arm board as an indicator for spring setting levels - and it looks nicer if the arm board is flush all round. Spend time dressing arm cable allowing a free bounce as this is crucial for performance, tighten that 'P' clip hard. The AR was NOT the first suspended turntable as history keeps forever flippin' telling us...there were others, and I will leave it to anyone interested to research and find one - at least.
Dude, Edgar Villchur of AR in 1961 invented the first of this type of suspension turntable and sold the first AR turntable with such a suspension in 1961 for $78 usd. And what were those others?????? Watch this video: th-cam.com/video/OOlAua3tBSw/w-d-xo.html
@@jogmas12 There were others I suggest you do more digging.
@@jogmas12On a different scale, but relevant - rather like Ferraris invented the polyphase motor in Italy before Tesla and Blumlein invented 45/45 stereo before anyone (a few claim this) in the USA. There are simply hundreds of injustices in engineering and it is always the self promoter that gets the glory. If you dig you will find. I have had a museum of audio back in the 90s - unfortunately I had to sell up.
@@jogmas12 DUDE Did you find any?
@@martinda7446 dude, the burden of proof is on you, after all you were the first one to state ‘there were others’ so……. get digging
Some euro tables spec a gear oil for their bearings. 75W90. I know Rega does. Can buy a quart of gear oil for $6.00
when using the lift , everything is moving too much, which is not a good thing of the LINN...
great video you need to put more oil down the bearing should take a while for the spindle to fully drop and put a bit on the motor
paul davies, earlier LP12's have a white nylon- looking sleeve inside the platter bearing and on Linn turntables with this style of bearing it does take a while for the platter to settle into place as it displaces the oil and trapped air; however, later Linn's have a gray bearing sleeve made of some high tensile strength material called PEEK this gray bearing sleeve is ventilated so that air and slight splatter of oil will come right out of it almost immediately and the platter will drop in place very quickly.
You have to fill the whole bearing with oil not just a couple of drops
Yes it must be filled until it overflows after spindle is inserted.
@@AshGrantASH8 Using the 2mm hex key (that tightens the cable into the tonearm) as a dipstick, 5/8" is about right for a little overflow.
Glad i came across this vid as i have heard so much about how great the Linn LP12 is - well for my money i will stick to my Rega Planer 2 , which to my mind is far simpler , less to go wrong and the sound it produces is magic to my ears.For starters that suspension - is that really needed and that sheet metal underside , does that not produce minute resonance acting like an amplifier? Then the metal sub and main platters are also resonance producers compared to the sensible glass platter of my Rega. Also my Rega has a ball bearing that sits at the bottom of the bronze centre sleeve and the sub platter's shaft sits on top of that ball bearing , which equates to a point load effect with minimum friction.For me a better system than this Linn. Another advantage with my Rega is that i can buy a new o-ring drive belt from an engineering supply at negligible cost and works just as good as an original Rega o-ring. The only criticism i had with my Rega was that the sub platter was made from resin and thus very light , so i made my own one out of SOLID brass with a hardened steel centre shaft and that adds another kilogram of extra torque to the spin.It will take a huge amount of cash to buy a turntable to better it.
I initially had one of the first Rega Planers close to 40 years ago and then upgraded to LP12 pretty quickly, now I am old and suffer from Tinnitus from too much load music...it is great fun.
Ezio Cucit
Rega is virtually plug n play, low maintenance
Older Linn tables are high maintenance
They look great though, very vintage in a good way
Excellent Video!
I have 3 dual tables love to have a Linn but they have sky rocket in price now
It took a 'turn' for the worse, but in the end it 'turned' out okay....LOL Nice!
Isn't the oil going to drain out when you flip it upside down?
The outer platter is all that's upside down
that turntable is truly amazing, its like perfection! one of these days i’ll have one of my own. are they high maintenance?
It is recommended that the setup be done annually, to make sure that all hardware is still tight, that the suspension is still adjusted rightly, and that the belt is clean and not worn.
TimmyP1955 Old news- an LP12 made in the last 25 plus years stays in adjustment
@@NateEll Any screw that goes into wood will need to be tightened occasionally. As will any fastener that goes through sheet metal (the nuts on the front and rear top plate bolts.
Jason B
Yes, the older ones are, the newer ones not so much
A tweaked out Linn will run about 10k, too pricey
I bought mine second hand 35 years ago. Other than replacing the PSU, oil and belt, I've done nothing with it.
I wonder if you can get strobe disks anymore, I used to do HiFi repair a long time ago, this brings back some memories!
You buy them or just download and print off - support.fluance.com/s/article/How-to-accurately-check-your-turntable-speed
Linn SondeR? Wow
Phone app for speed check? 👎
What power supply was that??
2 -3 drops of motor oil? Um Linn oil is black
If you have an LP12 run, don’t walk. I think this was this tech’s first experience with a Linn LP12
Concerning slow start-up times on an LP12 Valhalla: When servicing Valhalla boards, Linn now recommends adjusting the board to output 70-75 volts as opposed to the earlier spec of 85 volts. This results in a very slow start up, but also lower motor noise (smaller AC pulses), the benefit being an even a more black, more silent background when listening to music.
Never touch the spindle with your fingers!!!
And you shouldn't be working on it with the deck upside down!
It's Sondek not sonder?
33.03 is lousy job. that power supply can be dialed in exactly you know.
Clearly this guy has no idea of how to service an LP12. The main bearing should only be topped up with Linn black oil, no other type should be used. Likewise, you clean the spindle shaft with a soft cloth, not ruff kitchen paper. If you really want your deck to work at its best, have it serviced by your local Linn dealer who has all the tools, oil and parts to get it working at its very best. Guys like this are a definite no no.
Accelerometers in smartphones aren't really that accurate...
I can recommend you to get a strobe light app and print a strobe disc, way more reliable.
If you have the money to burn: factory made strobe disc might be even more accurate.
I like your collection of Wiha tools there, I also have some, but not that many haha
Mostly Knipex and Wera.
This is very informative and well presented. It looks like he`s punched the hi - fi dealer who ripped him off in the first place.
Your knuckles suggest you dont accept late payments..
He has a Led Zeppelin III platter mat, but mispronounces "Valhalla."
Mann, oh Mann, was für ein Murks. Schwarzes Schmiermittel im Tellerlager deutet auf einen hohen Verschleiß hin. Ich habe einen 10 Jahre alten Project RPM 1.3 Genie. Bei dem habe ich bis jetzt 2 Mal das Tellerlager kontrolliert, alles blank, glasklares weißes Schmiermittel.
the correct term is SONDEK not sonde'R' , You may also note that every LINN product features the letter K throughout its entire range from day one in 1972 to the present and every day going forward, more info:-www.positive-feedback.com/pfbackissues/0706/Ivor.7n6.html#:~:text=Bruce%20Kinch%3A%20It's%20been%20said,hundreds%22%20conventional%20gear%20goes%20for.
they did AR
More oil in the bearing of a LP12
point zero nine zero....? No it should run at 33 and a 1/3, so point three zero three off innit.
actually NO - Linn stole the idea from Ariston ... google those - the similarity is remarkable
antigen4, I worked for a Linn and Ariston dealer some years ago, and I have owned both. Some of the Ariston turntables are pretty good, but not as good as the Linn in my opinion. It is almost impossible to get an Ariston subchassis set up correctly with the original springs and rubber parts, but used Linn Springs and bolts and rubber dampers work much better. I've upgraded Ariston's suspensions with the used parts that came out of an early Linn being upgraded to "Nirvana" springs; and once I used the actual Linn Nirvana spring kit in an Ariston. Either way, it's easier to get the Ariston suspension properly tuned with the Linn parts.
yes i don't doubt the linn is better thought through and engineered/machined etc - esp. the bearing
i was just trying to 'correct' his assertion about the linn design being lifted from the AR turntables - more like AR -> Ariston -> Linn
antigen4, that's a reasonable evolutionary chart! By the way, years ago, before I ended up working for a Linn dealer, I had an early AR with the crappy aluminum sub chassis and primitive tonearm, and I upgraded it with an acrylic sub chassis and platter bearing assembly that was sold as an aftermarket upgrade, I don't remember who manufactured it however. The new subchassis did allow me to put an Audioquest arm on it which was certainly better than the original AR tonearm, but a Rega P3 or Linn Axis sounded significantly better, and an LP 12 better still.
we also sold Systemdek turntables, they made a nice, less expensive alternative to a Linn.
yes our local dealer had the same tables .. linn rega ariston etc ... my first table from them was a thorens TD160 which i stupidly traded in for a systemdex - i think IIX? the round one that looked like a UFO? i don't think it was that well made, that one
It is called a Linn Sondek.
이영표씨이구만요 ㅋㅋㅋㅋ
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I hate to do this and I'm sorry, but.......FIRST!
i'd never want a turntable like that, looks flimsy with it bouncing around like that and the belt slipping so much it can't have an accurate speed. My sl1200mk2 looks much better quality
Got memes? , the Technics sl 1200 is a fine machine for what it was designed to do, basically spin records in a nightclub or radio station, wow and flutter and isolation from speaker vibrations, 1200 cannot hold a candle to an LP 12 or any other well-designed belt drive turntable with a sub suspension. They're not built for hand cueing of records like a DJ would do (or for "scratching", definitely not designed for that either!); the Linn and other similar high-quality belt drive turntables are designed for extracting the absolute maximum last possible bit of musical information out of the record groove with minimal wear and damage to the groove, and to have extremely constant speed with very low wow and flutter , while also maintaining isolation from speaker vibrations that would otherwise muddy the waters so to speak. For what it's worth, I have repaired and installed dozens of SL-1200s in nightclubs over the years, but I personally own a Linn Sondek.
Sl1200 absolute benchmark for DJ work, or shops where people off the street may be allowed access, they’re designed to take a beating and with the latest model clocking in around £800 not cheap. The LP12 is a home system front end, Set up and left, flimsy is the last thing they are, they’re beasts, solid construction and basically unchanged in 5 decades. You can add & upgrade as you want.
But think it’s fair to say they’re a one person turntable. I don’t let anyone touch mine.