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Brian Alsruhe casually barbell rowed my deadlift max a few years ago and I never stopped training the barbell row to catch up after being absolutely MOGGED
The barbell row is one of my favorite exercises. Having gotten my strict 30° bent angle row up to 225 for 20+ reps, I can say the carryover to everything else has been absurd. Cheers!!
@@adeelliftsstuff pulled 525 without any deadlift training ever! Probably due to training heavy rows in conjunction with heavy RDL’s!! Failed 545 the other day but I think I panicked as I got the weight off the ground then dropped it. Cheers!
Traditional Barbell Rows IMO are best for the more intermediate/advanced bodybuilder that wants a good overall full body stimulus. Best done Dr Mike style, and in rotation with another hip hinge like SLDL and good mornings. I don’t find that beginners have the wherewithal or strength to do them with a fully extended back, and more advanced people are more than likely smoking that powerlifting pack, so their low back is already getting whipped. I’m part of the chest supported row master race myself.
Barbell rows are a fantastic exercise for building your back & strengthens many other muscles that may be weak links, but I personally tend to avoid them due to 2 lumbar disc herniations that get aggravated from that movement. I’ve moved to other rowing movements that don’t put my lower back at an increased risk of injury, & separately focus on strengthening my core & lower back to dramatically reduce the risk of injury from by disc issues, which has been incredibly effective for me to date.
I don't plan on hurting my lower back ever, but this seems like some knowledge to keep in your back pocket, to try out if it happens. Thanks for sharing
@@pseudoscience2.011 Thanks. One thing I’ve learned over the years is that there’s generally always a way around any hurdle you might face in life if you want something bad enough. I know plenty of people who would’ve used that injury as an excuse to just sit on the “couch of doom” playing video games instead of hitting the gym, but I refuse to let an injury defeat me, so I find reasonable workarounds.
For a long time I avoided barbell rows, opting for advanced bodyweight rows and machines due to “muh lower back” + didn’t want to learn another move (I mostly love callisthenics) + just didn’t feel like doing them. Seen this video right before the gym, went f(un) it, looked the row up in one of the best, sweatiest book I found and did it today. Suddenly it clicked, I liked it and now I can’t look the same way at the machines. Thanks! And people, never give up on exercises and be ready to give them a second chance
bb row and pullups are, in my training experience, the 2 absolute best back exercises for strength and muscle development. Nothing comes close to these 2
love your memes and bloopers with the knowledge you're providing! Never change it man! Congrats on reaching the 50k mark! You will for sure reach 100k in no time!
i avoided rows for a while because it was getting irritated but recently I've started doing deficit penlay rows with light weight and perfect form and its really helped my lower back strength which is a limiting factor for me on deadlifts
Alsruhe's "row what you bench" has had me adding a lot more row variations (regular, yates, pendelay, ,chest supported, dead, meadows, etc. ) into my program and warming up to bench with a heavy single barbell row (doing pyramid sets for reps up to a single) using what my working weight for bench reps that day has helped me a lot with the mind muscle connection when I'm benching.
Rowing as much as you bench is silly. The chest/delt/tricep muscles combined are way larger than traps/lats/Biceps so doing the same weight rowing doesn't make sense.
@@randybobandy9828 why? Lats and pecs are the same size. Traps are the same as lats. Triceps is the same size as chest or a bit larger. So the main difference is in biceps and delts which is not huge. I think 120-150kg row and press are good
Barbell rows are a key underrated accessory to use when you are in a bench press/ohp focused cycle. Also, I cycle the barbell row variations fairly often.
Are they actually underrated? Thats stupid anything to do with benching rows are amazing for since you are essentially do the same movement pattern in reverse, obviously a strong back is also incredibly important for OHP people must be mad if they haven't figured this out by the intermidiate stage.
I’ve often thought that these coan and woolam style rows are essentially a more fun way to do paused deadlift work. I find that they have a large carryover to the deadlift. It makes sense, in regards to body angle and the static/dynamic control you need. I use them often. The axial fatigue does creep up from time to time though.
For sure. I also look at them as "speed work". Like instead of demolishing 50-60% of deadlift for reps, just continue upwards and row it. Might as well, it's already headed upwards, and this actually incentivizes speed more than anything else. Plus, yea, super fun.
I always superset barbell rows with bench press ever since I ran a Brian Alsruhe program (also weighted chins when I press). It saves so much time in the gym and makes it much easier to get more back and arm volume in. I personally love a fairly strict pendlay row with a deadlift grip width and stance. I have short arms and not very flexible hamstrings, so the more I practice that deadlift setup, the better it gets.
@@BS-bd5uq did you ever try using the same barbell, taking a few steps back from the bench and doing your rows right there? Then you can re-rack it and stay at the same bench. I just do the same reps, sets, and weight as my bench press to stay even Steven. You can do a similar thing with overhead press and weighted chin-ups if your gym has a power rack with a pull-up bar.
Great video as always I really enjoy this contnent. From a weightlifting perspective... Nora Koppel (argentinian female weightlifter) and her trainer Sergio Parra taught me and other students that the barbell row is a great excercise to add to a weightlifting program to balance the forces around the shoulder joint, weightlifters train the clean and jerk and a the snatch, most of the strength/practice training is a push movement so you need some pulling to prevent imbalances around the shoulder joint. I really dont know how common its for weightlifters to perform a barbell row/pendlay row or bent over row but I've seen them rowing plates. As for weight training for athletes and non athlets I think you need one vertical pull and one horizontal pull to maximize gains lat pull down/chin ups/pull ups/rows are great for everyone.
Back exercises that are great in rotation: Barbell Bent Row Pull-ups/chin-ups Trap Bar Deadlifts(low handles) Tbar rows Machine plate loaded Pullovers ISO lateral dumbbell rows 90 degrees(braced tripod style)
Excellent topic. I do barbell rows pendelay style mostly hitting upper back and rear delts. I actually just switched the exercise to my shoulder day. So right after I finish barbell overhead press I go into barbell rows as a primer to blast my rear delts, which I will follow up with more isolating rear delt exercises.
I fixed my lower back with alot of barbell rowing, doing it often and really getting stronger in the movement helped alot. DB rows lacks to much of the benefits of the barbell variant.
@@michaelomglol keep at it, you’ll get there. I had trouble with that in the beginning as well. High frequency helped the most for me, I rowed 3-4 times a week some periods
Barbell rows and deadlifts used to be my go to on back day. The only movement I would do in the vertical plain was pull downs. I built up a ton of thickness, especially in the upper back but was lacking on width. I'm in my late 30s now with a couple buldging discs, not to mention I've blown out my lower back before, so I still row but I focus more on pull up, pull downs etc and I've really refined my physique.
To be honest, the strict row with the 90 degree angle is hands down the safest non-chest supported free weight row for the lower back, because the more upright you are, and the more hip drive you use, the more weight that's required for you to use, to get the same stimulus that you would get with a full range of motion strict row.
chest supported row has quickly become my go-to back exercise, my mind only has to focus on my lats and not my other muscles being fatigued which is nice
Barbell row is easily the most underrated movement in the gym! I worked up to a fairly heavy weight of 180kg for 3s and my whole backside feels bulletproof. Before I could do that my lower back would often feel sore and deadlifts was my worst exercise, but the rows changed all that. More people really should barbell row, alot of the problems people usually have could easily be remedied with it. I like doing it often, heavy and for alot of volume and I usually switch between standing on like a 25kg bumper for some decline and do it more strict or just stand on the floor with some more body english.
I know most commercial gyms don’t have this setup, but seal rows are amazing! You can have DIY with a plyo box and somewhere to anchor your feet (like a smith machine)
I ascribe to Brian Alsruhe’s “your row should be as strong as or stronger than your bench” philosophy. I always superset them even in strength blocks of training
Plate loaded machine rows are superior in my opinion. Lots of these machines are designed to lighten the load throughout the pull, so it matches the strength curve. My best upper back training has been with my plate loaded row, easily!
Matching the strength curve is a double edged sword since it can limit you. Sure for pro bodybuilders it's good but for a natty, if you wanna look freaky and big you gotta do some variation of heavy rows for that thickness and powerfull traps.
@@redwildbear7253 Really most machine rows as long as it’s plate loaded. Tons of different brands make them, you’ve probably seen hammer strength. It’s pretty simple but effective engineering, if you have access definitely use them.
@@cimi93x Heavy rows can be somewhat useful, but I do think it’s mostly the heavy stretch you get that’s the biggest benefit, which you can still get from these plate machines. Either way, as long as heavy rows are set up properly in your program, you can get some results, but not my first choice
@@BasementBodybuilding yeah but you're not getting as heavy of a stretch on machines than you can with a barbell. If you can get really strong on barbell rows you are guaranteed to have a thick back and traps, if you get strong on plate machines you might end up just being wide.
I like barbell rows as 1st/2nd exercise in my pull workouts to overload back muscles IF previous leg workout did not contain any deadlift variations. Also, I feel like it's one of the few compound exercises that do really target rear delts
Any compound barbell movement is gonna be awesome for developing size and strength. Barbell rows are awesome the people that say they are bad for them are either dealing with a back injury which is a legitimate reason to not do them or they just don’t like them because they are difficult. There’s so many ways to do them and I think everyone will find at least one variation that will light up their back
I generally find training back to be awkward and unsatisfying outside of deadlifts. It's something like the lifts not being as well defined and being more prone to form breakdown. Like.. when I am benching or squatting, I know when I have completed the rep. With a row, it's more ambiguous. It's very hard to describe what I mean, but I'm sure some people can relate.
I feel the same way, not sure what to add to my program to make my back days better. I do warm up with chin ups, BB row, deadlift, and single arm or incline row. But it never feels like I’m targeting my back quite enough
@@OpalJess I don't have that issue, I can lock in on back very well. remember half your back is shoulder workouts too. (rear delts) Also focusing on scapula and erector muscles too.
Barbell rows at 45° are my favorite, but right now I am focusing the deadlift and weighted chins so rows are out. Will include them again after I achieve my goals on chins and deadlift.
I know I used to do barbell rows all different styles last year , this year i really just focus on pullups. doing both deadlifts and pullups just those two really built my back the most than rows
Barbell rows are necessary for building a massive back. A bigger back gives u more stability while benching and squatting. That's why powerlifters do BB rows. Chest supported rows are definitely better.
Love rowing- barbell, dumbbell, or cables. It's always my 1st or 2nd auxiliary after my main lifts and I'll even sometimes squeeze in some more as an accessory later on in my workouts. Most favorite are those "dead row" style rows, but I love the Yates-style too and seal rows have been growing on me. Just remember to mind those knees!
I like doing Woolam/Coan rows for strength, I treat them as my hip hinge for the day when I do them. I also enjoy doing Pendlay rows with an axle bar, which is more of a grip work thing.
I like rows for developing everything between the shoulders. If I want more lat development, I'm gonna mostly use pullup/pull-down type exercises. If I want to thicken up the back, lots of row variations. RDLs make up the difference if I'm not doing lots of row variations.
Unpopular opinion, but I don't think everyone is built to row. The back angle some people have to use makes the movement far less effective than for our more well leveraged counterparts. This is also why seal rows are a better overall movement.
I currently have a back injury (which then caused a muscle imbalance, which then caused a shoulder injury :/) so I am programing my program when I recover. I wish I could do seal rows but I can't set it up in my gym
Long legs/short arms guy here. To do rows off the floor my back actually starts angled down, ie hips higher than my head. Needless to say my lower back is toast long before my lats/traps/rhomboids on these.
Definitely. Even Yates rows are uncomfortable for my lower back and I stopped doing rack pulls / deadlifts alltogether for the same reason. Thanks to Geoff's book, I recognized that I was doing back extensions wrong previously and now do them properly with decent weight (62lbs for 14 reps at 155lbs bodyweight) while also now realizing that they're not an erector isolaton, but a hip hinge, so I sort of replaced deadlifts with that + shrugs.
A seal row has absolutely no core or spinal erector activation, so saying it's a better overall movement doesn't really make sense to me because it doesn't do what a free weight row does.. It's an apple to oranges comparison
@Inputoutput Fitness can be done under a bar like the Smith machine if you don't have rings or suspension straps. You want your feet and hands to be level so a box to prop your feet on is ideal. Minimal lower back fatigue if at all with maximum upper back stretch/contraction. Great to add extra volume when your lower back is taxed from bent over exercises.
For me personally, yep, lower back is my limiting factor so when I go heavy, I'll do much better with a dumbbell row where I can have some support. But man, such a great movement, in all it's variations you mentioned here. Awesome video Geoffrey...and even better SHIRT you're wearing. We totally need to bring that look back haha.
Just stumbled across this channel, I'm loving the knowledge dispersed in this video. I'll definitely sub. As far as the row goes, like you said, it depends on what training block I'm in, and how much fatigue I'm experiencing in my spinal erectors (if I'm squatting 2x a week, deadlifting once a week, I usually do them on a pull day, but if I'm doing either of those more frequently I cut them out).
Don't deadlift or squat cause of disk issues but these seem like a safe alternative (way less compression) in conjuction with hinge work already done, hypers and nordics along with isolation work, torso extensions. Will give them a try.
You are spot on that the spinal erector muscles are the weakest link. I do the seated pull and reverse barbell row in order to avoid putting unnecessary stress on my spinal erector muscles, since I need to reserve their volume for squats and deadlift.
I think the real problem is the glutes. Your erectors wouldn't take the brunt of the force if the glues, hammies, and abdominals are engaged. Your back actually arches when pulling because the erectors are taking over to compensate.
I ditched the bb rows and switch to tbar rows superset with chinup, my upper and mid back has blown up over the past 4 months, serious I'm thrilled with results.
Quoting the late Charles Poliquin (RIP) "A: The reason that I didn’t mention barbell rows is simply because I don’t believe that they’re a great upper back exercise, even when performed correctly. Why? Because there’s too much neural drive expended in firing the muscles involved in maintaining the postural aspect of the exercise. The body and mind are in high neural gear as they’re firing the erector spinae, glutes, and hamstrings at the same time ? so much so that the level of recruitment finally left over for the lats is too minimal to be worth it. That’s why I’d rather stick to variations of one-armed rowing exercises. I can hear the “functionalist cult” already arguing, “What about function? This a primary movement.” My answer to that is, if you did a good job in the loading parameters for the squat and deadlifting exercises, why overtrain the posterior chain" He still included them in some of his programs but in general preferred other movements. I share his thoughts. I prefer Db row variations, tbar row variations and chinup variations.
for me the problem with barbell rows is that there are so many degrees of freedom it's hard to push psychotically hard without lessening the focus on the target muscle--its hard for me to avoid hipping into them. i favour cable rows (if the machine goes heavy enough which admittedly is rare) since they mostly take out the legs, allowing you to still reap the spinal erector stimulus of barbell rows. i like to do them with a big spine bend at the bottom too kind of like a hybrid jefferson curl, works so well for me.
a horizontal pulling movement is probably a must in a strength training program but we don't have to specifically use barbell rows. Bodyweight, cable, machine or dumbbell rows can be as or even more beneficial than barbell rows for upper body horizontal pulling movement.
I like strict pendlay rows, feels harder/more stimulating to me. I guess it's still good to mix in some deficit/elevated type row but when I think of a "real' row I think pendlay. Dumbbell version doesn't tax my lower back too much, barbell version I've never really liked at any point. Weighted inverted rows are another great one
Great video as always! In terms of book pricing, have you thought about a "pay what you want" model? Set the minimum at $20, people can pay more if they wish? Stronger by Science do it for their programs to great effect. Maybe if people tend to pay more than the minimum, you could drop the minimum for those of lower means. Just an idea!
I prefer to use machine rows if I have the choice. My work gym has two different hammer strength plate loaded machines that I like (high row for more lats) and a mid chest supported row for more upper back (or rear delts). I'm also a big fan of cable rows. For free weights I usually will prefer a DB row over BB row. Maybe if I had a bench I could use to do seal rows, I'd like the BB better. I just haven't found a good way to do it with my adjustable bench (rogue incline/decline).
As an update to this... 18 months of working on my RDLs gave me the base to appreciate fairly strict barbell rows. I'm going to keep them as my primary row for the next 6+ months and see what happens. Started at 155x10 (4 months ago), currently at 205x10, hoping to get to 245+x10 this year. 💪
I used to love doing BB rows in my 20s, but now that I've been living with Ankylosing Spondylitis for the last 5 years, I can't load up enough weight for progressive overload. It's the same reason why I can no longer do standard deadlifts too, which makes me sad. So I do agree with your points on this topic.
@@chrisbarney1609 Yah I've been on Humira for 4 years now, as it took me about a year to get from: identifying the AS, testing, specialist, and diagnosis. I also previously had severe Ulcerative Colitis prior to that which required my entire large intestine to be removed. So while the Humira has significantly helped overall and reduced the rate at which the AS is progressing, there's still certain movements and positions I just can't do anymore unless I feel like dealing with horrible flare ups.
Geoff remember what you said in your previous video. Barbells are good for assessing strength and barbell rows are no exception. Ironically I'm only an early intermediate lifter yet Strengthlevel gives me a perfect intermediate score for bent-over rows, which is 183 lbs x 8 at 207 lbs bodyweight. Also let me tell you about something(that seems to be my most generic comment). I know you are planning to make a video about periodization. I finally implemented some light periodization into my workout program. This is what it looks like: Microcycle #1 low-rep compounds: heavy compounds(hex bar deadlifts/squats, Romanian deadlifts) 3-5 reps medium compounds(bent-over rows, Arnold presses) 7-9 reps Microcycle #2 high-rep compounds: heavy compounds(hex bar deadlifts/squats, Romanian deadlifts) 6-8 reps medium compounds(bent-over rows, Arnold presses) 10-12 reps isolations remain the same 8-12, 10-15, or 15-20 reps depending on the exercise. What I noticed with periodization is eventually you will find a form of it that you like. This took me a long time.
Horrible to see people doing barbell rows with momentum, especially not supporting the spine with constant back-muscle-tension. Some examples did even round their back, which to me is a clear sign of weekness and therefore danger for the spine. @gvs: your own example at 6.40min in my eyes didn't really target the lats. The moment you seem to pull the row to your chest actually you just bring down the your upper body; the barbell doesn't change it's heigt. What do you think about that? You're doing it for lower back?
Heavy barbell rows + SSB Hatfield Squats have been a staple for me to keep my deadlifting strength up while I’ve been focused on squats, and while I get to the point where deadlifts are back in my rotation again. I’ve been able to squat heavier and push the sets harder without as much back issues
Seal rows are amazingly humbling and effective. Also I do rows on lower body days with my squats and hinges, so I need something that won't tax the lower back.
I love the bent over bb row. It’s my favorite lift. I always look forward to it. That being said. I’m a fetal noob and I can already tell that my training will evolve over time. It already has! Thanks for the education we’ll see what happens.
Barbell rows are awesome I do them similar to the Yates row over hand driving the barbell to my waist I feel my entire back contacting. I think everyone should pick a style they like and perform with the best form possible and slowly progress with it over time and the back gains will be undeniable.
LET'S GET NASTY! Yep, Yates rows are, in my opinion, probably the greatest variation of a free barbell row simply due to the fact they don't tax the erectors as much... and also because of the sick lat activation.
I believe one should strive to make strength gains in the pendlay row as one would like to make strength gains in the bench. Those movements should be at least similar in weight if grip and arch isnt powerlifting style in the bench. All in all I like barbell rows not only because I believe they are great for overall strength increases or as a proxy where you can see what weaknesses your body has but also as a hypertrophy tool.
I ditched all forms of rows after 4 years of lifting. Started making good progress in squat, press, deadlift, pulldowns and pull-ups after that. Issue was too much erector fatigue even when using strict form and kyphosis went worse even though i put all of my energy in trying to perfect form on these. I know alot of people swear by these and thats fine if it gives you massive back then by all means do not stop.
I do back twice a week so doing pull, push, leg, pull, push, leg and rest. I do inverted rows on one pull day and barbell rows the second pull day.. not sure if it's efficient but I'm happy with it.
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Nice try buddy but I have Wikipedia
We have google, no need for another BS influencer kneckbeard style lol
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Buddy your comment goes against your first sentence
You should align the text better and release a 2.0 version. The info is very good but it looks like shit
Brian Alsruhe casually barbell rowed my deadlift max a few years ago and I never stopped training the barbell row to catch up after being absolutely MOGGED
This
Yup he does that.
LMAO
Is this mark rippertoe? Lol
Same bro, except it was cailer woolam for me
The barbell row is one of my favorite exercises. Having gotten my strict 30° bent angle row up to 225 for 20+ reps, I can say the carryover to everything else has been absurd. Cheers!!
Hello PBs 😁🙃
From a dead or a hang position?
How is the carryover to deadlifts? Numbers?
@@adeelliftsstuff pulled 525 without any deadlift training ever! Probably due to training heavy rows in conjunction with heavy RDL’s!! Failed 545 the other day but I think I panicked as I got the weight off the ground then dropped it. Cheers!
Traditional Barbell Rows IMO are best for the more intermediate/advanced bodybuilder that wants a good overall full body stimulus. Best done Dr Mike style, and in rotation with another hip hinge like SLDL and good mornings.
I don’t find that beginners have the wherewithal or strength to do them with a fully extended back, and more advanced people are more than likely smoking that powerlifting pack, so their low back is already getting whipped.
I’m part of the chest supported row master race myself.
The legend has spoken
Chest supported row master race!
I need to figure out a seal row set up. They look so freakin good.
Can confirm seal row is a great posterior chain saver
Sorinex bulldog pad ftw
Barbell rows are a fantastic exercise for building your back & strengthens many other muscles that may be weak links, but I personally tend to avoid them due to 2 lumbar disc herniations that get aggravated from that movement.
I’ve moved to other rowing movements that don’t put my lower back at an increased risk of injury, & separately focus on strengthening my core & lower back to dramatically reduce the risk of injury from by disc issues, which has been incredibly effective for me to date.
That’s awesome man always adapting.
I don't plan on hurting my lower back ever, but this seems like some knowledge to keep in your back pocket, to try out if it happens. Thanks for sharing
Glad you can find a way to train through it.
Bench assisted though?
@@pseudoscience2.011 Thanks. One thing I’ve learned over the years is that there’s generally always a way around any hurdle you might face in life if you want something bad enough.
I know plenty of people who would’ve used that injury as an excuse to just sit on the “couch of doom” playing video games instead of hitting the gym, but I refuse to let an injury defeat me, so I find reasonable workarounds.
For a long time I avoided barbell rows, opting for advanced bodyweight rows and machines due to “muh lower back” + didn’t want to learn another move (I mostly love callisthenics) + just didn’t feel like doing them.
Seen this video right before the gym, went f(un) it, looked the row up in one of the best, sweatiest book I found and did it today.
Suddenly it clicked, I liked it and now I can’t look the same way at the machines. Thanks!
And people, never give up on exercises and be ready to give them a second chance
Congratulations on 50k subs Geoff, keep up the great stuff! You're one of the true ones on this platform.
bb row and pullups are, in my training experience, the 2 absolute best back exercises for strength and muscle development. Nothing comes close to these 2
What variation of the barbell roe
@@patrickjulius7352 yates row is what i've been sticking with. Find it to be safer for my lower back as i've had some lower back issues in the past
@@bobcobb158 yeah id think that'd be best for that reason. thanks for replying
Add pullovers to that list and i agree
@@thejuiciestofallthehams8130 dumbbell pullovers or ?
love your memes and bloopers with the knowledge you're providing! Never change it man! Congrats on reaching the 50k mark! You will for sure reach 100k in no time!
i avoided rows for a while because it was getting irritated but recently I've started doing deficit penlay rows with light weight and perfect form and its really helped my lower back strength which is a limiting factor for me on deadlifts
Those are a great exercise
penlay...
Man your channel is deservedly getting huge. 100 k subs is closer than you think.
Alsruhe's "row what you bench" has had me adding a lot more row variations (regular, yates, pendelay, ,chest supported, dead, meadows, etc. ) into my program and warming up to bench with a heavy single barbell row (doing pyramid sets for reps up to a single) using what my working weight for bench reps that day has helped me a lot with the mind muscle connection when I'm benching.
Rowing as much as you bench is silly. The chest/delt/tricep muscles combined are way larger than traps/lats/Biceps so doing the same weight rowing doesn't make sense.
@@randybobandy9828 why? Lats and pecs are the same size. Traps are the same as lats. Triceps is the same size as chest or a bit larger. So the main difference is in biceps and delts which is not huge. I think 120-150kg row and press are good
@@randybobandy9828 dude i row way more than my bench, it differs from person to person. my row/bench is like 1.4
@@purgedsoy9518 your muscles are disproportionate.
@@purgedsoy9518 or your rows are sloppy and not at a proper angle.
Barbell rows are a key underrated accessory to use when you are in a bench press/ohp focused cycle. Also, I cycle the barbell row variations fairly often.
Are they actually underrated? Thats stupid anything to do with benching rows are amazing for since you are essentially do the same movement pattern in reverse, obviously a strong back is also incredibly important for OHP people must be mad if they haven't figured this out by the intermidiate stage.
I’ve often thought that these coan and woolam style rows are essentially a more fun way to do paused deadlift work. I find that they have a large carryover to the deadlift. It makes sense, in regards to body angle and the static/dynamic control you need. I use them often. The axial fatigue does creep up from time to time though.
For sure. I also look at them as "speed work". Like instead of demolishing 50-60% of deadlift for reps, just continue upwards and row it. Might as well, it's already headed upwards, and this actually incentivizes speed more than anything else. Plus, yea, super fun.
I always superset barbell rows with bench press ever since I ran a Brian Alsruhe program (also weighted chins when I press). It saves so much time in the gym and makes it much easier to get more back and arm volume in. I personally love a fairly strict pendlay row with a deadlift grip width and stance. I have short arms and not very flexible hamstrings, so the more I practice that deadlift setup, the better it gets.
I'd love to do that superset but as soon as I get up from the bench it would be taken by someone else : (
@@BS-bd5uq did you ever try using the same barbell, taking a few steps back from the bench and doing your rows right there? Then you can re-rack it and stay at the same bench. I just do the same reps, sets, and weight as my bench press to stay even Steven. You can do a similar thing with overhead press and weighted chin-ups if your gym has a power rack with a pull-up bar.
I love this exercise. Great complement to pull ups and deadlifts.
Great video as always I really enjoy this contnent. From a weightlifting perspective... Nora Koppel (argentinian female weightlifter) and her trainer Sergio Parra taught me and other students that the barbell row is a great excercise to add to a weightlifting program to balance the forces around the shoulder joint, weightlifters train the clean and jerk and a the snatch, most of the strength/practice training is a push movement so you need some pulling to prevent imbalances around the shoulder joint. I really dont know how common its for weightlifters to perform a barbell row/pendlay row or bent over row but I've seen them rowing plates. As for weight training for athletes and non athlets I think you need one vertical pull and one horizontal pull to maximize gains lat pull down/chin ups/pull ups/rows are great for everyone.
Barbell pronated and supinated Pendlay Rows are an absolute staple in my training. Part of the fundamental 7 movements
The single best exercise i added for deadlifts and bench, great video.
Back exercises that are great in rotation:
Barbell Bent Row
Pull-ups/chin-ups
Trap Bar Deadlifts(low handles)
Tbar rows
Machine plate loaded Pullovers
ISO lateral dumbbell rows 90 degrees(braced tripod style)
Excellent topic. I do barbell rows pendelay style mostly hitting upper back and rear delts. I actually just switched the exercise to my shoulder day. So right after I finish barbell overhead press I go into barbell rows as a primer to blast my rear delts, which I will follow up with more isolating rear delt exercises.
I always get lower back pain when rowing so I have cut it out of my workout!
Doing DB row is much better
Thanks for the Video Geoff 👍
I fixed my lower back with alot of barbell rowing, doing it often and really getting stronger in the movement helped alot. DB rows lacks to much of the benefits of the barbell variant.
@@dennisnordlund902 im trying to persist with the barbell row to build up ab endurance as well because my core often gives up before my lats
@@michaelomglol keep at it, you’ll get there. I had trouble with that in the beginning as well. High frequency helped the most for me, I rowed 3-4 times a week some periods
I’ve stopped doing them for the same reason. I’m thinking about adding them to my routine again…maybe with lighter weight and higher reps.
Barbell rows and deadlifts used to be my go to on back day. The only movement I would do in the vertical plain was pull downs. I built up a ton of thickness, especially in the upper back but was lacking on width. I'm in my late 30s now with a couple buldging discs, not to mention I've blown out my lower back before, so I still row but I focus more on pull up, pull downs etc and I've really refined my physique.
To be honest, the strict row with the 90 degree angle is hands down the safest non-chest supported free weight row for the lower back, because the more upright you are, and the more hip drive you use, the more weight that's required for you to use, to get the same stimulus that you would get with a full range of motion strict row.
chest supported row has quickly become my go-to back exercise, my mind only has to focus on my lats and not my other muscles being fatigued which is nice
Barbell row is easily the most underrated movement in the gym! I worked up to a fairly heavy weight of 180kg for 3s and my whole backside feels bulletproof. Before I could do that my lower back would often feel sore and deadlifts was my worst exercise, but the rows changed all that.
More people really should barbell row, alot of the problems people usually have could easily be remedied with it. I like doing it often, heavy and for alot of volume and I usually switch between standing on like a 25kg bumper for some decline and do it more strict or just stand on the floor with some more body english.
Of course you can row 180kg, you have a Viking sounding name. I imagine that you look like a strongman xD
Geoff how are you not at 100k+, you deserve all the subs and congrats on 50k 👍
Thanks...working on it!
I know most commercial gyms don’t have this setup, but seal rows are amazing! You can have DIY with a plyo box and somewhere to anchor your feet (like a smith machine)
I've always wanted to try them! My gym doesn't let me experiment much haha
Oh shit, the smith machine to anchor the feet is a great Idea. I might be able to try them now
I ascribe to Brian Alsruhe’s “your row should be as strong as or stronger than your bench” philosophy. I always superset them even in strength blocks of training
Commenting so that you get more algorithms. And so you appear next to jeff nippard and back guy when i look for training advice. Great work homie
Plate loaded machine rows are superior in my opinion. Lots of these machines are designed to lighten the load throughout the pull, so it matches the strength curve. My best upper back training has been with my plate loaded row, easily!
Same, what other machine is like that apart from the Chest Supported T-bar Row?
Matching the strength curve is a double edged sword since it can limit you. Sure for pro bodybuilders it's good but for a natty, if you wanna look freaky and big you gotta do some variation of heavy rows for that thickness and powerfull traps.
@@redwildbear7253 Really most machine rows as long as it’s plate loaded. Tons of different brands make them, you’ve probably seen hammer strength. It’s pretty simple but effective engineering, if you have access definitely use them.
@@cimi93x Heavy rows can be somewhat useful, but I do think it’s mostly the heavy stretch you get that’s the biggest benefit, which you can still get from these plate machines. Either way, as long as heavy rows are set up properly in your program, you can get some results, but not my first choice
@@BasementBodybuilding yeah but you're not getting as heavy of a stretch on machines than you can with a barbell. If you can get really strong on barbell rows you are guaranteed to have a thick back and traps, if you get strong on plate machines you might end up just being wide.
Abundant knowledge here. A complicated subject here to be sure. Bodybuilding? Powerlifting? Strongman? Olympic lifting? Crossfit? Wrestling? Football?
The title made my blood pressure go up. Well done.
I like barbell rows as 1st/2nd exercise in my pull workouts to overload back muscles IF previous leg workout did not contain any deadlift variations.
Also, I feel like it's one of the few compound exercises that do really target rear delts
thats exactly how im doing it
Any kind of row whether machine or free weight will do the same for the rear delts
@@rdg665 Yes. The person you're replying to agrees that rows work the rear delts. They are the one who brought it up, don't you think they know?
@@Mrraerae The point is
Hitting rear delts isn't exclusive to barbell rows only
the rear delts are just along for the ride when your rowing 200+ lbs, getting pushed around by traps late and biceps
Any compound barbell movement is gonna be awesome for developing size and strength. Barbell rows are awesome the people that say they are bad for them are either dealing with a back injury which is a legitimate reason to not do them or they just don’t like them because they are difficult. There’s so many ways to do them and I think everyone will find at least one variation that will light up their back
I generally find training back to be awkward and unsatisfying outside of deadlifts. It's something like the lifts not being as well defined and being more prone to form breakdown. Like.. when I am benching or squatting, I know when I have completed the rep. With a row, it's more ambiguous. It's very hard to describe what I mean, but I'm sure some people can relate.
I feel the same way, not sure what to add to my program to make my back days better. I do warm up with chin ups, BB row, deadlift, and single arm or incline row. But it never feels like I’m targeting my back quite enough
@@OpalJess lat pulldown is one of my favorite exercises not just for back but in general. You get such a juicy lat pump and the movement is hella fun
Pul ups are the best back exercises. But it's important to use wide grip while pulling the bar towards your chest.
@@OpalJess I don't have that issue, I can lock in on back very well. remember half your back is shoulder workouts too. (rear delts) Also focusing on scapula and erector muscles too.
Barbell rows at 45° are my favorite, but right now I am focusing the deadlift and weighted chins so rows are out. Will include them again after I achieve my goals on chins and deadlift.
I know I used to do barbell rows all different styles last year , this year i really just focus on pullups. doing both deadlifts and pullups just those two really built my back the most than rows
Barbell rows are necessary for building a massive back. A bigger back gives u more stability while benching and squatting. That's why powerlifters do BB rows. Chest supported rows are definitely better.
Love rowing- barbell, dumbbell, or cables. It's always my 1st or 2nd auxiliary after my main lifts and I'll even sometimes squeeze in some more as an accessory later on in my workouts. Most favorite are those "dead row" style rows, but I love the Yates-style too and seal rows have been growing on me.
Just remember to mind those knees!
I like doing Woolam/Coan rows for strength, I treat them as my hip hinge for the day when I do them. I also enjoy doing Pendlay rows with an axle bar, which is more of a grip work thing.
I like rows for developing everything between the shoulders. If I want more lat development, I'm gonna mostly use pullup/pull-down type exercises. If I want to thicken up the back, lots of row variations. RDLs make up the difference if I'm not doing lots of row variations.
Which barbell route variation do you like?
50k, congrats! 100k by end of this year!
got this notif while testing during barbell rowing 😭🤣
will watch later
Give your editor a raise for that amazing thumbnail.
All me!
I love doing bent over rows and deadlifts because it’s fun feels awesome
I didn’t know people questioned the efficacy of the row. It’s a great exercise and foundation builder
I think people question the risk versus reward benefit ratio more than questioning the hypertrophy aspect.
@@Awareness_With_Dennis maybe. It seems like a very safe movement to me. As long as you stay within your limits.
Unpopular opinion, but I don't think everyone is built to row. The back angle some people have to use makes the movement far less effective than for our more well leveraged counterparts. This is also why seal rows are a better overall movement.
I'm bout to replace barbell rows with seal rows, hoping for better results
I currently have a back injury (which then caused a muscle imbalance, which then caused a shoulder injury :/) so I am programing my program when I recover. I wish I could do seal rows but I can't set it up in my gym
Long legs/short arms guy here. To do rows off the floor my back actually starts angled down, ie hips higher than my head. Needless to say my lower back is toast long before my lats/traps/rhomboids on these.
Definitely. Even Yates rows are uncomfortable for my lower back and I stopped doing rack pulls / deadlifts alltogether for the same reason. Thanks to Geoff's book, I recognized that I was doing back extensions wrong previously and now do them properly with decent weight (62lbs for 14 reps at 155lbs bodyweight) while also now realizing that they're not an erector isolaton, but a hip hinge, so I sort of replaced deadlifts with that + shrugs.
A seal row has absolutely no core or spinal erector activation, so saying it's a better overall movement doesn't really make sense to me because it doesn't do what a free weight row does.. It's an apple to oranges comparison
Yates rows is much appreciated by community.
The inverted row is a great replacement for the barbell row if you don't want to do it.
First time watching one of your videos man, good stuff.
Nice. Just wrapped up a session with my 6 year old training partner ten mins ago and showed him my favorite way to row.
I like to do bent over dumbbell rows personally. Greater range of motion, allows body to move more naturally than fixed hand / wrist position.
Inverted rows on rings with plates on your stomach. Greatest range of motion ever.
@@IntoTheOutside000
I’ll have to try that out someday
@Inputoutput Fitness can be done under a bar like the Smith machine if you don't have rings or suspension straps. You want your feet and hands to be level so a box to prop your feet on is ideal. Minimal lower back fatigue if at all with maximum upper back stretch/contraction. Great to add extra volume when your lower back is taxed from bent over exercises.
For me personally, yep, lower back is my limiting factor so when I go heavy, I'll do much better with a dumbbell row where I can have some support. But man, such a great movement, in all it's variations you mentioned here. Awesome video Geoffrey...and even better SHIRT you're wearing. We totally need to bring that look back haha.
Just stumbled across this channel, I'm loving the knowledge dispersed in this video. I'll definitely sub. As far as the row goes, like you said, it depends on what training block I'm in, and how much fatigue I'm experiencing in my spinal erectors (if I'm squatting 2x a week, deadlifting once a week, I usually do them on a pull day, but if I'm doing either of those more frequently I cut them out).
For me the chest supported row with a barbell on an incline bench is the best of both worlds. 👍
Fancy seeing you here Nick lol if wasn't for you I wouldn't have started the incline barbell row great exercise
Yup. It's the perfect exercise.
The title made me think "Oh no, GVS is becoming dogmatic". Well played, sir; well played.
I use a home gym, but I also enjoy BB rows so I use them.
Iv only been training for about 8 months but barbell rows are probably the reason my back is very big plus they make my brain happy
Yes and rows have a big carry over to bench press they go hand to hand and it’s a. Good basis to get strength for pull ups deadlifts etc.
Seems like the meme edits have been turned down without removing them. I like the new pacing! Memes pretty hot this time around too.
Don't deadlift or squat cause of disk issues but these seem like a safe alternative (way less compression) in conjuction with hinge work already done, hypers and nordics along with isolation work, torso extensions. Will give them a try.
You are spot on that the spinal erector muscles are the weakest link. I do the seated pull and reverse barbell row in order to avoid putting unnecessary stress on my spinal erector muscles, since I need to reserve their volume for squats and deadlift.
I think the real problem is the glutes. Your erectors wouldn't take the brunt of the force if the glues, hammies, and abdominals are engaged. Your back actually arches when pulling because the erectors are taking over to compensate.
I ditched the bb rows and switch to tbar rows superset with chinup, my upper and mid back has blown up over the past 4 months, serious I'm thrilled with results.
I've been using all kinds of fancy expensive machines but the Barbell row is the best form of rowing movement.
Quoting the late Charles Poliquin (RIP)
"A: The reason that I didn’t mention barbell rows is simply because I don’t believe that they’re a great upper back exercise, even when performed correctly. Why? Because there’s too much neural drive expended in firing the muscles involved in maintaining the postural aspect of the exercise. The body and mind are in high neural gear as they’re firing the erector spinae, glutes, and hamstrings at the same time ? so much so that the level of recruitment finally left over for the lats is too minimal to be worth it.
That’s why I’d rather stick to variations of one-armed rowing exercises. I can hear the “functionalist cult” already arguing, “What about function? This a primary movement.” My answer to that is, if you did a good job in the loading parameters for the squat and deadlifting exercises, why overtrain the posterior chain"
He still included them in some of his programs but in general preferred other movements. I share his thoughts. I prefer Db row variations, tbar row variations and chinup variations.
for me the problem with barbell rows is that there are so many degrees of freedom it's hard to push psychotically hard without lessening the focus on the target muscle--its hard for me to avoid hipping into them. i favour cable rows (if the machine goes heavy enough which admittedly is rare) since they mostly take out the legs, allowing you to still reap the spinal erector stimulus of barbell rows. i like to do them with a big spine bend at the bottom too kind of like a hybrid jefferson curl, works so well for me.
a horizontal pulling movement is probably a must in a strength training program but we don't have to specifically use barbell rows. Bodyweight, cable, machine or dumbbell rows can be as or even more beneficial than barbell rows for upper body horizontal pulling movement.
I like strict pendlay rows, feels harder/more stimulating to me. I guess it's still good to mix in some deficit/elevated type row but when I think of a "real' row I think pendlay. Dumbbell version doesn't tax my lower back too much, barbell version I've never really liked at any point. Weighted inverted rows are another great one
For me, I have a weak barbell/pendlay row and because of this I'm motivated to improve my weakness 👊🏼
Master all movements
Great insight - thank you
Great video! Thanks.
Great video as always!
In terms of book pricing, have you thought about a "pay what you want" model? Set the minimum at $20, people can pay more if they wish?
Stronger by Science do it for their programs to great effect.
Maybe if people tend to pay more than the minimum, you could drop the minimum for those of lower means.
Just an idea!
Barbell rows are super fun especially heavy, that is all the reason I need :)
I prefer to use machine rows if I have the choice. My work gym has two different hammer strength plate loaded machines that I like (high row for more lats) and a mid chest supported row for more upper back (or rear delts). I'm also a big fan of cable rows. For free weights I usually will prefer a DB row over BB row. Maybe if I had a bench I could use to do seal rows, I'd like the BB better. I just haven't found a good way to do it with my adjustable bench (rogue incline/decline).
As an update to this... 18 months of working on my RDLs gave me the base to appreciate fairly strict barbell rows. I'm going to keep them as my primary row for the next 6+ months and see what happens. Started at 155x10 (4 months ago), currently at 205x10, hoping to get to 245+x10 this year. 💪
Geoffrey, great content and presentation. How about inverted rows using only 1 arm ?
You mean the fuhrer pullups
I do them. Love them
congrats on 50k mate!
Thanks!
Another good one!! :)
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Nice i didn't know the fact of lower back taking a back seat during Yates row. Nice. Will be doing Yates row from now on
I used to love doing BB rows in my 20s, but now that I've been living with Ankylosing Spondylitis for the last 5 years, I can't load up enough weight for progressive overload. It's the same reason why I can no longer do standard deadlifts too, which makes me sad. So I do agree with your points on this topic.
Humira? Game changer for me with AS. Completely wiped out my 3year long symptoms and allowed me to train
@@chrisbarney1609 Yah I've been on Humira for 4 years now, as it took me about a year to get from: identifying the AS, testing, specialist, and diagnosis. I also previously had severe Ulcerative Colitis prior to that which required my entire large intestine to be removed. So while the Humira has significantly helped overall and reduced the rate at which the AS is progressing, there's still certain movements and positions I just can't do anymore unless I feel like dealing with horrible flare ups.
@@therippedemon darn I'm really sorry to hear that
Great video! Didn't even realize there were so many named barbell rows. 😳
And I didn't even go into Meadow's Rows, T-bar rows, etc!
@@GVS You may need to do a 4-hour master class on rows! Just make sure there are time stamps. 😅
Rows are amazing I did them on my first year of training and it made my Back very strong.
Geoff remember what you said in your previous video. Barbells are good for assessing strength and barbell rows are no exception. Ironically I'm only an early intermediate lifter yet Strengthlevel gives me a perfect intermediate score for bent-over rows, which is 183 lbs x 8 at 207 lbs bodyweight.
Also let me tell you about something(that seems to be my most generic comment). I know you are planning to make a video about periodization. I finally implemented some light periodization into my workout program. This is what it looks like:
Microcycle #1 low-rep compounds:
heavy compounds(hex bar deadlifts/squats, Romanian deadlifts) 3-5 reps
medium compounds(bent-over rows, Arnold presses) 7-9 reps
Microcycle #2 high-rep compounds:
heavy compounds(hex bar deadlifts/squats, Romanian deadlifts) 6-8 reps
medium compounds(bent-over rows, Arnold presses) 10-12 reps
isolations remain the same 8-12, 10-15, or 15-20 reps depending on the exercise.
What I noticed with periodization is eventually you will find a form of it that you like. This took me a long time.
Horrible to see people doing barbell rows with momentum, especially not supporting the spine with constant back-muscle-tension. Some examples did even round their back, which to me is a clear sign of weekness and therefore danger for the spine.
@gvs: your own example at 6.40min in my eyes didn't really target the lats. The moment you seem to pull the row to your chest actually you just bring down the your upper body; the barbell doesn't change it's heigt. What do you think about that? You're doing it for lower back?
Rounding the thoracic spine is fine
I love your videos, I hope you never sell out. It's difficult to watch fitness videos these days
I like rows. Something about locking in and moving the weight just feels good.
The underhand Yates Row is an incredible lat builder.
My legs always shake like mad when I barbell row, but I do feel like back and deadlift is improving by rotating them in on every other pull session
Yeah I’m the same way, idk if that’s bad or not
Heavy barbell rows + SSB Hatfield Squats have been a staple for me to keep my deadlifting strength up while I’ve been focused on squats, and while I get to the point where deadlifts are back in my rotation again. I’ve been able to squat heavier and push the sets harder without as much back issues
I'm an athlete that needs this exercise, big wave surfing without this is not something I'd recommend
Seal rows are amazingly humbling and effective. Also I do rows on lower body days with my squats and hinges, so I need something that won't tax the lower back.
I agree with straps. Progress has continued to climb now grip isnt a problem. Also by using straps on my rows and deadlifts my elbow pain has gone.
I love the bent over bb row. It’s my favorite lift. I always look forward to it. That being said. I’m a fetal noob and I can already tell that my training will evolve over time. It already has! Thanks for the education we’ll see what happens.
Good vid, cheers
Barbell rows are awesome I do them similar to the Yates row over hand driving the barbell to my waist I feel my entire back contacting. I think everyone should pick a style they like and perform with the best form possible and slowly progress with it over time and the back gains will be undeniable.
WORTH IT, imo, with really, really, really good form only.
LET'S GET NASTY! Yep, Yates rows are, in my opinion, probably the greatest variation of a free barbell row simply due to the fact they don't tax the erectors as much... and also because of the sick lat activation.
I believe one should strive to make strength gains in the pendlay row as one would like to make strength gains in the bench.
Those movements should be at least similar in weight if grip and arch isnt powerlifting style in the bench.
All in all I like barbell rows not only because I believe they are great for overall strength increases or as a proxy where you can see what weaknesses your body has but also as a hypertrophy tool.
I ditched all forms of rows after 4 years of lifting. Started making good progress in squat, press, deadlift, pulldowns and pull-ups after that. Issue was too much erector fatigue even when using strict form and kyphosis went worse even though i put all of my energy in trying to perfect form on these.
I know alot of people swear by these and thats fine if it gives you massive back then by all means do not stop.
Peter Katcherian got me into barbell rows and really like barbell rows
Absolutely need to row. It's a game-changer for me. Wish I'd done them in my PLing days.
I do back twice a week so doing pull, push, leg, pull, push, leg and rest. I do inverted rows on one pull day and barbell rows the second pull day.. not sure if it's efficient but I'm happy with it.