You’re correct - However, I recall either Patsy or Cockeye saying (to Max) that Noodles was going down to the Chinese Theaters, implying Noodles had frequented the Opium den. This is confirmed by the welcoming way the opium den owner welcomes and recognizes Noodles. The telephone/buzzing has always confused me too. What was that noise in Noodle’s head? Also - Max exits Noodles life just like he entered it - on a truck (horse-drawn carriage) - which also implies the dream restarting. At what point in Noodles life do you think the dream begins?
Could you please provide a link to an article or whatever the source where Sergio Leone actually said what you are saying. I researched extensively everything I could find about the film for my own article about the film and couldn't find the director's quote you are quoting.
When young Max and Noodles fall off the boat into the water of the harbor, Max plays a joke on Noodles by secretly climbing back onto the boat. For a moment Noodles believes Max drowned and disappeared. This is a foreshadowing of Max faking his own death.
@@jonathancarlson6127 The thing that kind of breaks the dream theory for me is that if it was just a massive cope and all about Noodles absolving himself for his crimes, why would he in the end when he faces down Max refuse to accept the idea that Max was the one who screwed everyone over? If it was about his self-denial over the acts that he committed, it would make more sense that he'd be quick to accept what Max did as a fact to absolve himself from his acts. The straight forward reading makes much more sense because the movie is ultimately about deconstructing the romantic ideas of honor, brotherhood and loyalty among criminals. So many crime films venerate the characters of criminals even when they acknowledge their immoral acts, while America specifically says that their characters suck just as much as their actions do. It makes so much more sense for Noodles to be facing the truth that it all meant nothing and not be able to accept it, instead pretending that Max isn't Max and he didn't do what he did. He lived a life of regret over the violence he carried and especially the hurt he caused to the ones that he actually cared about. If he hadn't had the nostalgia he couldn't cope with the emptiness of his life. I think the opium den scene at the end is simply a manifestation of his mental state after learning the truth about Max, not a literal scene of him never having left the den to begin. He went there in the 1930s to hide and escape from reality because his three friends died and he went there again in his mind as an old man to escape reality from learning the truth which made everything he believed in completely meaningless.
@@Tuosma I think refusing to accept what Max did occurs at a very crucial point- he rejects the absolution offered, essentially rejecting the dream, and that’s when he starts to wake up. He leaves, Max disappears behind the truck, which then turns into a 30s automobile, and then he wakes up. His rejection of the dream- and acceptance of reality- causes the vision to crumble. Maybe. Maybe you’re right. Maybe Leone intended for us all to be having these discussions and interpretations.
The movie runs much deeper. Its also a statement on the very foundation of the birth of America thru violence and crime. Ultimately, the movie is about friendship and betrayal. Let's not forget that Noodles called the cops to save his best friend Max not to have him killed. The killing was arranged by Max who double-crossed him in order to get rid of him. Noodles refusal at the end to ' acknowledge that Mr. Baily is in fact Max, is telling him that for him ( Noodles) his best friend died when he betrayed their friendship. While Noodles had put their friendship above everything, his commitment to it is 100% ("I go where you go"), Max keeps playing with it ( " I ought to damp you") and ultimately sacrificed their friendship in order to get to the top. Only, once Max is at the very top ( and even has Noodles girl) he realizes that the best thing he ever had was his friendship with Noodles. And that he lost forever, in spite of all the wealth in the world he's got now he's got nothing. That is the real tragedy and makes the movie timeless. Max realizes too late that the only thing that really ever meant something to him was, in fact, Noodles, their friendship and he threw it away., And no amount of wealth can buy it back. Max realizes he wasted his life on the wrong values. That's why Morricone's emotional score resonates so deeply with what we see and feel onscreen - it's the tragedy of loss. Loss of friendship, love, youth, unfulfilled dreams, and broken promises. And with that Once Upon A Time In America completely transcends the gangster movie. It's a cinematic masterpiece in a category all of its own and put Leone on a par with the other grande masters of cinema such as Kubrick and Kurosoawa.
Noodles snitched, thus making himself the perpetrator of betrayal of the worst kind against man. Noodles raped, making him the perpetrator of betrayal of the worst kind against woman. The rest is his post hoc rationalizations attempting to establish himself as an exclusive morally just betrayor of childhood bonds, friendship, and innocence
Yes exactly, a true magnum opus is almost like an allegory, it blends the real and surreal and runs deep in meaning in multiple lanes, it's a fairy tale and about American culture mythos, but is also exactly what you described, and more. It's kind of everything at once, like how you'd maybe think a movie about your life, or an event in your head would play out before you die. It's masterpiece that touches upon everything very tastefully and romantic
But Deborah does age. She just did it gracefully like a lot of dames who look after themselves. The reason why she's covered in greasepaint during that scene is to disguise her flaws for the audience.
@@seasonstudios Exactly! Also If they had applied aging makeup underneath, it would have wiped right off with the grease paint. They made her look older at the party though.
The soundtrack of the movie seets the mood for the audience. Yesterday song sets the nostalgic mood for the audience. The Yesteday song isn't necessarily experienced in the frame of the Noodles character
@@nowalubega1475 when Max opens the rear entrance of his library room you can hear the sounds of the big party going on in the mansion. And Yesterday was being played by the live band entertaining the party. It was not part of the soundtrack. So how can Noodles if he was dreaming in 1930 hear the Beatles song before the Beatles were even born? Your dream theory is total BS lol.
I believe the truck scene has to do with the phrase Max said to Noodles: "Maybe I should have dumped you" but Noodles dumps Max to get rid of feeling of guilt, in his fantasy
I always hated the dream idea when I first heard it , always kind of rooted for noodles to have some redemption as the phone call was although misguided for the right reasons but it's really grown on me and is the best ending , they were all criminals and it's either an early death or a life of regret for people in that life , Fantastic film , epic in every way
@@LeviAckerman-cb5ji but it wasn't all a dream it was just everything following that incident. His childhood formative years and the years when he first was released from prison are all real. It's just him imagining his old age.
I read somewhere before that when Leone was first asked about the dream theory, he replied with a surprised "Nnnnoooo". But soon after the idea of the alternative interpretation caught his fancy and he started to propagate that it is the secret meaning of the film that was hidden intentionally by him. Who knows? Anyway, this is one of the greatest movie ever made, a true classic what I can't get tired with. When it ends, I wish it lasted another 4 more hours.
The fact that you can logically interpret it in more than one way (plus the epic score) is what makes this movie a masterpiece and my all-time favorite.
The quote from Leone is crucial. Leone told the interviewer two years before he died that he fully meant the "future" (1968) parts of the film merely to be Noodles' opium dream. The source for this is not mentioned in "The Mind Blowing Secret of "Once Upon a Time..." That's unfortunate. But for those who want to know the source of the quote, it is: Conversations avec Sergio Leone, Noel Simsolo interviewer (1987, in French) chapter 15 on OUATIA.
Leone stayed ambitious about the dream interpretation . He touched upon it several times , both confirming or denying it. The point is that it was not Leone who came with the possible interpretation that Noodles had an opium induced dream. That was first launched by soms film critics . Possibly Leone just used that scenario to fool around a bit . Ultimately it’s not even relevant , but it would be weird that Noodles was able to dream the future so accurately ( how else do we explain “yesterday” being played ) as he did . Directors never explain their movies , and if they do , it’s always ambiguous. Good example … “The Shining “. Many interpretations have emerged but none withstands the check of simple logic . None of the stories makes 100% sense , so it does not really matter . Some directors love the fact that the meaning of their movies remains ambiguous … I know someone who thinks ET is a reference to Jesus . Doubt very much that Spielberg had that in mind .
@@Babygirl61868 the idea of the dream was launched before Leone ever spoke about it . Some critic interpreted it like that . Then Leone may have just made everyone confused . No artist , ( poet, director , painter - think Salvador Dali ) ever explain their work .
Debra did age, wrinkles are shown when she takes her make up off. She aged gracefully as expected in an actress. Also I don't think Noodles caused the death of his friends, he feels guilty of that, but in reality his life was spared by Max's fit of rage. Noodles was supposed to be killed too according to Max's scheme. The opium dream theory is good, though. That would mean Max died too, and Noodles would never have closure, forgiveness nor redemption. His life was spared to spend it in loneliness and regret. His curse.
@@emilal i was about halfway through it when i posted that. I still havent finished. I really wasnt liking it. I didnt think the acting was good. I was trying to like it. Especially the kids. I thought they were aweful
Opium dream theory has some holes in it too. His dream accurately envisions modern cars of the 60s, though he is having the dream in the mid/early 30s. He also is reflecting to the song "Yesterday" released in 1965. Wouldn't his dream of the 60's still reflect his knowledge of the 30s, rather than actually being set in an accurate 60's?
I've smoked opium and never felt likely to dream out the next 30 years. Maybe I didn't smoke enough but I don't like the dream theory. Why is he dreaming about his friend betraying him? Why is he dreaming this sequence of events rather than another? The details of his childhood are accurate aren't they? Why should the rest of his life not be? His quiet life, going to bed early, etc? It just all seems pointless in the end if the whole film is just the imaginings of a stoned man about to die. Surely the whole reveal is robbed of its power?
@@nickroyle4805 Listen. None of it is accurate. It’s a movie, none of it happened, it is a narrative viewed through the perspective of our main character. I doubt Leone would be comfortable with a single, comprehensive analysis, it’s an opaque and mysterious film, but the idea is that everything up until he betrays his friends is his actual perception, and everything after is his subconscious (a clumsy word here, but I can’t think of a better one) trying to rationalize and revise what happened. I’ve smoked some opium myself, and while I didn’t literally dream a new life for myself, it did allow me to detach from the world and look at painful things without feeling, through a cloud. I don’t think Leone was trying to say anything about opium abuse per se, just the way drugs and memory can be mingled to remove ourselves from the terrible things we’ve done and experienced. In short, what I mean to say is: quit being so literal, all art is a form of dreaming, and great artists don’t sit down with a rubric of symbolism before they start creating - the process is as much one of discovery and mystery for them as it is for the audience
I'm a huge fan of the film and strangely it popped up in my life at the same time as Mulholland Dr. which deals with quite similar subject matter of guilt and dream-themes. Now... I would take Sergio's interview with a pinch of salt. The theory dates back many years and back when iMDB forums still existed, there were loads of 50-50 arguments. Some hinted at the technology (like Nick Royle said, dreaming yourself 30 years into the future is a real stretch), some did point to the opium den scenes and finally the vintage car on the streets... As if there was a crack in time, finished off with the den again. But I still view the film as reality. Possibly somewhat demented reality, but reality still.
Damn they should’ve released the 6 hour version of the film... I would like to see more of the union and childhood parts of the movie... I read the script it was very interesting...
I've watched this masterpiece several times over the years and it never struck me that all of the 1960's era storyline could be nothing more than Noodle's opium dream. Your video has me convinced it was, so thank you for opening my eyes!
It is a dream. Noodles at the end is smiling at US. It's a knowing smile. He somehow knows somebody is watching, in 1984 (that's opium for ya) He's relying on us to hear The Beatles, to see the Mack truck, to fill in those details to make his dream of the future REAL, so that his absolution is complete and convincing. And in this way Noodles is Sergio Leone, smiling at us, knowing we know movies are dreams, and we're in on it, and we will play along.
Most accurate interpretation. The film is two poems in one as leone put it. A poem about a man consumed with guilt and regret. A poem about a director's storytelling and myth development through film making. Definitely leone's best film and his baby.
The dream theory makes perfect sense simply for the fact that Deborah has absolutely no reaction to Noodles suddenly showing up years later. By that I mean, anyone that's been raped suffers PTSD from the rape and the sudden reappearance of the rapist would be more than most rape victims could handle. The fact that they have a full-blown conversation just adds weight to the fact that this isn't really happening. Just my opinion.
I'm not sure I believe that rape victims would inherently have this kind of a reaction, considering there are varying ways victims act, which is why they often get scrutinized for their behavior since some people have an incorrect idea that a victim is supposed to act only in some specific kind of a way. If it was the case though that everyone would, Leone would be quit ahead of the curve knowing about that kind of psychology considering he started developing the movie over fifty years ago finishing it a little below forty years ago.
Her biggest concern at this point is protecting Max. She believes Noodles will inevitably kill him once he realises his deceit. Her actresses have good memories line has so much force behind it to convey her true feelings
@@DavidBrown-ps9gp I think it’s also possible that by the time of the conversation she doesn’t really care much anymore. It seemed to me in that scene that she was more apathetic towards the situation than anything.
I just watched the movie again for the first time in about 30 years or so and what a different experience I had. When I first watched it in my twenties I thought this was a pretty good gangster movie and then when I watched it last night I realized what a masterpiece it is because it has many different possibilities. I didn't think too much about the opium scenes until I watched this review of it, but what I did think was it also showed how in America you can ( or used to be able) change your identity and become a new person and start over again. I think that's why Max invited him to that party at his house so that people saw a Hitman come to the house and then he disappeared. Max screwed Noodles over again. Anyway , a very very interesting movie. It's back on my list of one of the greats.
That's an interesting point that you make. So Max was planning to betray Noodles right to the end. Yes, a great film. I love the way it's possible to watch it with fresh eyes each time and find more depth. Leone was an absolute master and made a masterpiece.
This is one of those movies I never get tired of watching. The soundtrack is just as powerful as the movie itself. Thank you for this video and presenting your take on it, I will go back with a new perspective of viewing it, maybe it won’t leave me with that unsettled feeling. Thank you
What's amazing is that the director hates this version his was 7 hours long. I do agree about the score. This and dancing with wolves have the best scores
The film is a dream. If you look at the gravestones of the three gangsters in the big tomb in the cemetery you can see two of them were born in 1907 and one in 1905 but they died 1933. That would make Max, the oldest, 28 years old. Not to mention at the party in the end, there's a silver Ferrari that I believe is a 330 gtc which wasn't made until 66. Max is supposed to have left the money with a note saying "one last job" and then asks Noodles to get revenge for him faking his death by killing him. But he doesn't and next scene is him back in the drug den when he was a younger man. My theory is that all his friends were killed in the federal reserve bank job in 33 and it caused him so much pain that he went and got high in a drug den and dreamed about what the rest of their lives would have been like.
It wasn't the Fed Bank - it was the liquor delivery run. The death scene with the corpses, has Fed Marshall cars, and broken liquor bottles all over the street. The gang was killed in a battle with the Feds - and those were their bodies - Noodles realizes his failure to reach the Police wound up allowing Max and the gang to go through with their liquor run - and get killed. Noodles guilt drives him to the Opium den - where he dreams of a future where Max is alive and Deborah hasn't aged a bit. One more thing - the Song "God Bless America" is playing in the beginning - but also at the end when the 3 old cars pass Noodles in the street - after the Garbage Trucks pass. That's to bookend his dream. He's back in 1933.
I've always liked not knowing if it was all an opium dream or not , the enigma ....... The 'once upon a time ' has always said to me that it is just a story or a fable , beautifully told , beautifully realized .....
Just watched this movie for the first time and I am blow away, it really felt like you were with this character through their whole life and now that this theory has been put into my head it makes some sense so now my brain is in even more of a spiral. Phenomenal film definitely going to take many viewings
You covered the dream theory very well indeed. If you look at the beginning in the opium den, the camera is panning across the room and we see the man preparing the pipe, there is a very quick glimpse of that Noodles smile we see at the end of the film, only it's a side glance. The beauty of the film is that a viewer can look at it in more than one way and still be very entertained. One small argument against the dream theory is the first dissolve into the 60's. A question is posed about McCartney's song, "Yesterday". Was that played just to let the audience know what time period it was because Noodles dream wouldn't know how to invent that which hadn't been written yet... or would it? A minor point.
There is nothing wrong with a long film, the only thing wrong is when a studio cuts a piece of art to please all audiences, Once Upon A Time In America is one of cinema's true pieces of art and Deniro and Woods finest performances.
Sometimes it is good to read the comments because they provide a lot of background opinions to help understand the complexity of the movie. I would send you more of these opinions, but this one seems to put everything in perspective. This movie is great not only because of the execution, but also how it makes you think about what happened and continues the movie in your head until you watch it again. Leonie, an Italian, depicts the gangster story with a Jewish interpretation. To me, it makes the movie even more interesting.
The SMILE at the end on Noodles face… always said to me that he was RELIEVED that his gangster life was over since his gangster family was dead. the scene when noodles and max were beaten by bugsy…. Because noodles wanted out, wanted to go straight and get his girl, Deborah because She wanted him to not be a punk. Also, the smile meant he got the money, which unbeknownst to noodles at that time, that max had already taken it… along with sending Deborah to Hollywood. that has always been my take.
It could be interpreted as either real or an opium dream. I think Leone wanted scenes ambiguous enough for it to go either way. My take on it is that it's real. It was a betrayal in which Max profited greatly but lost his soul. The heist was an inside job between Max, the mob and some corrupt cops. When the three bodies are laid out in the rain, only two of the bodies are recognizable because the face on the body that was supposed to be Max was intentionally mutilated. I think that Noodles knew right then what happened and that even though he called the cops on his three friends he didn't cause their deaths because the cops were in on the heist and it was Max that had Cockeye and Patsy killed so he could steal their shares of the four's ill-gotten gains up to that point along with Noodles' cut. At the end where Max is a U.S. Cabinet Secretary and is about to lose everything and go to prison because of corruption, he has nowhere to turn and Noodles tells him his best friend is dead. Max commits suicide by jumping into a garbage truck's trash compacter.
The artistry with which Leone created this ambiguity is impressive. While both interpretations are possible, I agree that it was real. Noodles was attempting to prevent Max being killed during an attempted bank robbery, and Max used the incident for his own purposes, totally hosing Noodles in the process, then subsequently stealing the love of his life. Max was a sociopath's sociopath.
While this was my original interpretation as well ( first saw this as a very young teenager), how then does one explain Leone's choice of ending on that scene with young Noodles at the opium den, and that mysterious final smile? ... Also, the 30s style cars and passengers driving by right after the garbage truck incident can't be a random coincidence, seems like a deliberate clue, no?
makes complete sense ! that’s why max says to noodles i think you should go home to eve tonight because he already knew the game plan and didn’t want noodles killed
I'd watched the movie twice and felt that I did not understand it. I then found in our local library the "Director's Cut" watched it, and all of a sudden understood the dream sequence, especially the garbage truck sequence etc. I'm going to watch it again because your explanation expanded my horizon about this undeniable Masterpiece. Thanks very much.
This is truly one of my favorite movies of all time. Since Leone left it to one's interpretation, I always viewed it as Max being thrown in by the two men in the garbage truck scene. It seems that Max achieved greatness, but lost everything in the end. His past caught up with him, and Noodles , who lost everything, maintained his dignity and soul...and absolution. The old, .."For what does it profit a man.." adage. Either way, a timeless masterpiece from the maestro Leone.
I agree, the intent is to make the film a dream. As I've learned more about the film through other interviews with actors and the stories of Deniro and Leone clashing over the art. Deniro seeking realism and authenticity and Leone more interested in creating an interpretation of the Era. Also, that Elizabeth McGovern wasn't sure she was right for the part due to her age and again Leone assuring her she was. All of this along with hints in the film makes the theory of a dream or altered state of mind creating its own reality makes complete sense. An absolutely beautiful film, one of my all time favorites!
Thanks for taking the time to produce this commentary. The more I watch and think about this film, the more I come to love it and appreciate the mastery of Leone. There is no doubt that the scenes set in the 1960s are all in Noodles' imagination as he dreams/hallucinates on opium in the den. In fact, until one experiences the film with that fact in mind the brilliance of Leone can't be fully understood. I don't want to bore anyone who reads this with a ton of explanation, but I'll answer a few questions that come to mind while viewing this film. First, what is with the frisbee? Second, what is the purpose of the garbage truck? Third, why show a car from the 1930s during a scene that takes place in the 1960s? The short answer is that the scenes in the 1960s show a visual depiction of what is going on in Noodles' dream. Keep in mind that in reality Noodles is still living in the 1930s. So Leone put in visuals as clues to the viewer, but the clue is in the audio and not the visual. The frisbee is visually bizarre, but as a sound it represents something that is happening in real time. Not in the 60s, but in the 30s while he is hallucinating on opium. It is the sound of the bullet (or punch) whizzing towards him as he is being attacked by the gangsters who come looking for him in the opium den. Noodles does not escape out the back door. He's too gacked out on opium, like the other zombies in the den, to run away or pull his gun or defend himself in any way. The garbage truck works visually in Noodles' dream as a means of death for Max, which of course is only in his mind. In reality the sound represents the actual garbage truck the gangsters throw him into right before he dies in the 30s. That's why the viewer doesn't see a body or any blood in the catch of the truck when the camera pans inside. The older car going by is again not for the visual. The sound of people celebrating is happening while he is in the truck dying. They are celebrating the end of prohibition in the 1930s. Noodles hears them right before he dies. Leone manages to tell two stories at the same time. Of course the viewer can't know on a first viewing. It isn't until one sees the final smile by Noodles back in the den in the 1930s that part of the film was a dream sequence. I know people dispute the dream concept. If anyone reads my explanation, they might want to argue with me. With all due respect, don't waste our time. Instead, watch this incredible film again and gain a deeper understanding. Think about each character and how they change from prior to the 1960s and then in Noodles' dream. Max made Noodles an equal partner and paid him his share when Noodles came out of the institution. Max gave Noodles his share of a big job the guys did when Noodles was off raping Deborah. Only in Noodles' demented mind did Max steal from him. Deborah comes from a tight and loving family. Only the scorned Noodles would believe that she would abandon Moe for decades. The best is how Noodles creates a son for Deborah in his dream. Why? Because his mind needs to know if his rape resulted in a child. That's why his mind makes the child look exactly like a young Max. Leone even used the same actor to play young Max and Deborah's son. I hope the creator of this video sees this comment and pins it for all others to read. Stay safe everybody!
To show the viewer the time period. While it wouldn't make sense that Noodles dreamed the future correctly that's not the point. The point is that you as a viewer know the time period being portrayed even though it's really a dream.
Noodles smiling at the end was the telling sign of his doublecross. He called in the heist to the cops knowing Max and the crew would be killed. Afterward he goes to the station to get their suitcase of money but Max has already taken it and split (re: Max finally reasoned he would be killed if he tried a federal reserve robbery). So, Max has now been living all these years in shame at having stole Noodles woman and his money (he admits this) but it was Noodles who set up his pals. His knowing smile at the end turns the film on its head. It's truly one of the great endings in moviedom. With that smile you see the whole film and Max and Noodles differently.
Il sorriso di Noodles alla fine, è un poster a casa mia appeso in fondo alle scale, che vedo la mattina quando esco dal reparto notte ed inizio la giornata
I don't think he wanted to doublecross Max, he was trying to save his life by tipping off the cops before the heist went down and to avoid a shootout. Later on, we learn that Max manipulated Noodles into doing this [by putting the idea in Carrol's head] and basically masterminded the whole thing to fake his own death and steal the money. Noodles never wanted to hurt Max and can't accept that Max betrayed him. His smile at the end is reflective of him choosing to escape from reality and focus only on the positive memories of his childhood friends, because that's all he has left.
All nonscene. Noodles tried to get his crew arrested and spent time in jail..thus save them getting shot and killed at federal reserve..noodles loved them all
All of Leoni's films have the same key theme of friendship. He explores many different types of bonds that may cause friendship or a kinship of some kind. Some friendships are like Manco and Colonel Douglas Mortimer, that show an equel respect for each other. Some frienships are comfortable casual acquaintances like Joe and Silvanito while at the same time Joe sharing a strange kinship with the villian Ramón Rojo, (who clearly has a respect for Joe, & Joe has for Ramón). Then there are deeper friendships like that of Juan Miranda and Sean H. Mallory with Juan Miranda's grieving is herd and slowly bought to a stand still by a patiently quiet Sean H. Mallory, (the deep friendship can be felt in the silence). Then there's the untrustworthy kinship of Blondie and Tuco. It kind of didn't matter weather it was a western or a gangster movie, the friendship themes was always at the heart of Leoni's films. Hollywood didn't get it, and only wanted westerns from Leoni, that is why they stopped funding him for 10 years or so. This is a tragic thing for film goers because his next film was going to be a war film, but Sergio died before he could make it. I can only dream of what that film would have been like.
The way noodles smiles at us in the end reminds me of Arthur Fleck (from Joker - 2019) who also laughs on the audience for misinterpreting the delusions of his mind as reality.
Meanwhile, who played talk show host Murray Franklin in JOKER? Yup, old Noodles himself, Robert DeNiro! Hell, can we even believe Bruce Wayne's parents were killed the same night Arthur gets to appear in his idol's show? Love the whole dream within a dream concept. For all we know, that might have been a younger Jack Napier in the alley way that fateful night...
I’ve always taken the story to be actually occurring as opposed to the drug induced dream theory. That Noodle’s grin at the close of the film is 1 - That he has money to live a better life and 2 - He’s amused with an idea that Max has pulled another fast one be disappearing before the law or his criminal friends can get their hands on him.
The garbage truck scene-- It was clear Max was about to be killed by his current compadres, and wanted Noodles to kill him instead. Noodles refused, then left. I always thought the garbage truck was disposing of Max's body, that he was killed right after Noodles left.
Yes I think that would be the prevailing theory if it were really happening and not a dream however in the short cut of the film there are two gunshots just before we see the garbage truck grinding wheel. I've often wondered if that was a sound edit flaw in the long version because the gunshots would make sense in either the dream theory or the actual happening theory. If it actually happened, then the hoods caught up with Max, shot him and threw him in the truck. If it were a dream, then Noodles dreams the hoods have shot Max when they are actually shooting Noodles in the opium den.
@@seasonstudios no the hoods don't throw max in the truck he throw himself in. What he felt he deserved. He really felt he deserved noodles to kill him but he wouldn't
@@mikemal4398 Yes, I understand what you are saying, I'm just making book on what might have happened if we add the gunshots that were in the shortened version. Some have argued that the hoods shoot Noodles in the opium den while he's dreaming all this stuff up (because if it is a dream, he never leaves the 1930's) and they have said that the sound of the Frisbee being caught is him getting shot but that happens and we aren't even through half of the movie so how could that be? If the 2 shots were left in at the end of the film then maybe we could really argue that it was all a dream.
The sustainability of the script did succeed in maintaining my interest in the movie from beginning to end. It did so for 38 years . They have passed and the movie has lingered in my mind as a acid trip of ongoing continuity! It never seizes to amaze me how well it was made! And YES! Its secret was p/u by me and struck home! A work of art! As for those who did not sustain their interest , It might of been a drop off along the way by their own combination of nominal intellect and vision. As Noodles portraits and leaves to an agile mind to p/u on! I did p/u but as all reviews you don't know until you compare notes on your findings with others and I was amazed on my agility! Thank you for all of it . It did rattle me and made me a better observant of the film arts! Sergio Leon was a Genius! A miracle in film making . A Davinci ,Mozart work of art! In that order! For someones last. An odd, odyssey of the extreme! He did it all! I might of failed to P/U on other things but the primary elements where there for all to see! By the way!....... Domenic's name gets mentioned only once if memory serves me right!. You have to be up and about to watch this one! It makes you work! Max was Machiavellic on overdrive! Non stop!I In Noodles ;and the mind is terra nonferma when dreaming ; is possible that that it all could of became reality as forseen! Its knowned to happen in some walks of life. Why not! To forsee is! to get ahead. Noodles might of been so! Aging is the unknown!
Been wrestling with how I interpret this film for 30 years. I was aware of all the options the whole time and still haven't come to a definitive conclusion as the facts all have issues. I suspect I will be thinking of this film till the day I die and I'm OK with that, It is a masterpiece in every sense of the word. As is Once upon a time in the west.
I love your review inspired by a true love of the great film. In my opinion, the best way to enjoy this film is to focus on the tenderness and despair of the musical score, the amazingly realistic acting, the impressive sets, the fluid camera movements and the dreamy but assured directing. Sergio Leone had a saying when asked questions about the ending of his masterpiece which, being translated roughly means: ‘I say it here, I deny it there’. Everything about that gangster world was built on deception false dreams etc. So the fact that we try to know but we really don’t know adds to the mesmerising quality of the film. Sergio Leone was fascinated with the gangster Noodles who was modelled on -Harry Grey who looked nothing like the brash, tough conventional image of the gangster, but was a quiet reserved man who had spent his post gangster life goin’ to bed early’. What an epic film!
@@jeyi4208 Yes of course! I have just seen the movie for the first time. I heard “yesterday” and thought to my self, that it was strange to pick such a piece of music for such a type of movie - aka gangster movie.
I saw this in 1984, and thought, "No, he isn't just tripping, because how could he have known the Beatles (or what a frisbee is)" ---but the film also ends with noodles smiling in the opium den.
Thank you! The "future" being an opium dream has been my interpretation since I first watched the film on VHS in the 1990s. I've been looking for someone else to corroborate this impression ever since then and now I've found it! When viewed in this light the story becomes even more tragic and the vision of his future informs your understanding of his emotional state. The future was simply too conveniently generous with his moral redemption. The very last shot of the film is what seals the analogy with film - that it is an insidiously erosive poison and awful surrogate for true character and true experience. I believe Leone was making a harsh criticism about the place of cinema in peoples lives. Noodles breaking the fourth wall with a smile drove that point home for me.
Agree. Could be a metaphor of the American Dream and its promise, morality, loses and costs. Power vers. true love. Debra also wanted success, as an artist, and ended up with the "other" gangster, maybe to compensate her lost love to Noodles. Strong ambiguity. The boy who eat's the cake for immediate setisfaction not resisting inorder to gain a better one is one of the strongest simbolic scenes that supports this narrative line. One of the greatest films of all time also thanks to Morricone's epich score that was precisely ready before shooting! Few scene were shot with the recordered music in the backround...
I always thought it was Noodles reconciling himself to the consequences of what he has done and that he is now a marked man. If, in the best case scenario where Max had manipulated him, Noodles would still end up in the back of the dumpster, then he accepts his death as inevitable. Plus, if the outcome remains the same, who’s to say that Max isn’t alive and Noodles can still be redeemed? It’s about the balance between hope and fate.
The dream sequence makes more sense to me than anything else I've heard about the plot. The fact that there's two cars full of people at the end that look like they just came out of the 1930s driving down the street in the 1960s tells me something is kind of strange about this scene. The dream sequence just makes more sense, to me anyway, and I think it also makes the film more interesting in that light.
@@kramalerav Exactly, and it is as unlikely that Noodles were written to be a all seeing Oracle that can see into the future in his dreams, which we all can see he clearly were not.
@@kramaleravyes the random frisbee when Noodles is walking down the desolated street never made sense to me. now that I heard about the opium dream theory it makes more sense. also, which jimmy hendrix refeeence are you talking about by the way?
I agree, at least the old noodles coming back I believe is from dreaming... There is an interesting moment too that he wakes up from his opium trip as soon as the phone is answered 11 minutes in.
I'm glad they replaced the working print footage especially how we finally see where and how he met his last girlfriend but you would think they could have made it look better the way they manipulated The Irishman. I would have thought the technology was there.
@tommy gunnor Where did it end up after Max's death? It wasn't taken by his girlfriend because she ended up in an old folks home. Did the cops take it or did the hoods from Detroit take it?
@@geofftaylor8627 Yes and that makes one think was that what happened when Frankie Minaldi (Pesci) saw them leaving the hospital. The boys did the big double cross with the diamonds so did Pesci make a deal with Max and then after the heist gone wrong, Pesci's hoods from Detroit tried to close in on Noodles.
Having just seen it on Amazon Prime I very much enjoyed it. I did like the ambiguous ending as it is left to us to decide what is going on. Personally, I prefer the non-dream explanation. The end scene with the 3 party cars from the 30s is not a problem for my viewing as I supposed Knuckles frame of mind was stuck in the 30s - his happy place - so seeing the cars was like an imaginary thought. For the dream sequence to be more successful the 60s should have had a lot of 30s elements spliced in like the music, some of the cars, posters, that sort of things as it is impossible to accurately dream of the future, especially one that is over 30 years hence. The suicide / non-suicide ending with Max is also good as, again, it is left to us to make up our own minds. The one thing I will say in its favour is that films like these hardly get made anymore. The set design of the Jewish neighbourhood is superb and the production values very much reminded me of the high quality of The Godfather. I would not go far as to classify it as a masterpiece as some aspects of it look dated like the ageing and the blood (the 70s / 80s really had terrible fake blood) but it is as close to a masterpiece in my books. This MUST be seen on high definition as the sets are just as much the characters as the people. I would very much be interested in seeing the 4.5 hour version or even the 6 hour version spliced into two 3 hour movies.
in response to a comment below about pronunciation. right about ending vowels being pronounced. leone: lay-own-AY. morricone: mor-rick-own-AY. mozzarella: moots-ah-rel-LAH. let's talk "sergio". americans call him sair-GEE-oh. alfabeto italiano has no J. that letter's pronunciation is also taken by the G. to differentiate between the soundings, a G followed by H is spoken Gah as in gorilla. G followed by I is spoken Jah as in jaguar. in both cases, the H and I are only designations. it is not heard. gianni is spoken jah-NEE. sergio is spoken sair-JO. well, that's how they say things in italy, anyway.
Just watched it really for the first time tonight and it is mind bender. Just when you think it makes sense your still left with questions. But beautifully directly and executed.
A long time ago ,my father, his brother, and I went to see the extended version. When it came to movies we never agreed 👍. For the only time we all agreed that this was a great 👍 movie. Miracles do happen.
Funny thing is I never considered this as a gangster film but more a coming of age story and the gangsterism being part of the story rather than the story. As in life then was like that. Wow. I have watched this film many times and this dream angle had never occurred to me. I’d have to watch it agin and see if I see what you mean.
I hate when something in a movie or tv ends up being just a dream. BUUUUUTT.... I would love to find out that godfsther part 3 was just a bad dream that michael corleone had after eating at a shitty restaurant.
Wonderful analysis, thank you. I have always thought that this movie was a masterpiece. I saw the original 3 hour version at the theatre and thought it was terrific. Later, when I saw the uncut version on DVD it raised my praise even more. No, I had not thought about the ‘dream’ explanation that you give but I think Sergio did. Good job.
Dream theory. No. Noodles dreamt max had son with Deborah. Remember he thought max was dead..too big a jump. Interesting theory but too contrived.he dreamt macs son as well no
My opinion is that everything in the future with Noodles coming back is a dream. The ending pretty much cements it with the smile towards the camera. It gives him an opportunity at resolution with Moe, Debra and Max.
The "pan flute" still haunts my reverie.....this movie remains as one of the top unsung period gangster masterpieces of the modern cinema era! I bought this once on one of my old "TH-cam" accounts for $3.99! I was that taken by it! 🎥🎞️❤️🎭
Your theory of the plot has its logic and I never considered it, so hats off to you. I saw this film when it came out and considered it on a par with " The Godfather" within the genre. What always has stayed with me was the metaphor of Max killing himself by jumping into the blades of a garbage truck.
It is opium that makes Noodles dream of the future; therefore, what is imagined to be the future, i.e., '68, is nothing but a dream, otherwise that scene in the smokehouse and the final smile always in the smokehouse would not make sense.
Sergio Leone used the Harry Grey book "The Hoods" as reference, and there are plenty of similarities, events, scenes, names, etc., but there are also major twists. Another scene I trip on is the ending scene - which looks much like Once Upon a Time in the West scene with Jill looking up from the bed, after she realizes that she's come out to The West all for naught. The camera shoots her from above through black fabric of the bed canopy, and Noodles is hot from above through a black fabric in the opium den.. Leone and Kubrick are my favorite directors and I love how they use similar "trademark"scenes in their films, and both were good still photographers - no coincidence.
The scene in the rain where Noodles sees his friends lying dead in the streets is similar looking to the one in Duck You Sucker where John Malory witnesses the firing squad execution of the revolutionaries in the rain also... Also the scene where young noodles and max get the shit kicked out of them is probably a reference to Leone’s dollar films where the main characters would get beaten up lol
The two ideas that really elevate this film: #1 Noodles is dreaming all the post-1933 scenes under the influence of opium and #2 Max is in love with Noodles. Notice the apathy towards any other character (male or female) in the film, along with the tension between the two characters and the desire for Noodles approval from Max. Viewing with these ideas makes them seem intentional.
I think with this view and the garbage truck scene, Max's disappearance behind the garbage truck would be Noodle's mind telling him to put the thoughts of guilt behind him, with the car full of partying young folks being his sign too move on to happier opportunity's freely.
Wow, I’ve always hated the "it’s all a dream" denouement as a hackneyed device used by bad directors and TV writers to get out of a corner they’ve painted themselves in. I’ve never watched this film in that light but your video makes a fascinating and compelling case.
Agreed. I've only watched this movie once and it didn't work for me because there's no stakes when most of the film is a dream. I guess DeNiro was supposed to be the protagonist, but he wasn't exactly someone to root for when he's all about rape.
I'm the same way. I hate dream endings. But the twist that Max faked his death also hits wrong, too hokey for an otherwise brutally real film. That this was wishful thinking makes it more compelling and reveals a lot about who Noodles really is, by who he really wants to be.
I like this interpretation. It’s been a long time since I’ve seen this movie so now I have to go back and look at it again. It makes a lot of sense in terms of washing away all the bad that you did, to make yourself not the bad guy when in reality you’re really a horrible person.
I believe the garbage truck and partying people in cabrios was a metaphor for how their life went down the drains.... The intention is to make you feel rather than answer questions.
The young fellow near the movie's end who played that ruddy-haired David also was the guy who played young Max, which makes it clear that Max did marry Deborah and she had his child...AKA the young fellow Noodles saw as he slipped out the back way after talking with Deborah about the invitation he had received.
The younger Deborah was so adorable. I was something like 12 when I first saw this movie, and it was insta-love for me once her character was introduced. 🥰 You can imagine how my opinion of Noodles shifted later on in the film...
Just watched this again after about 30yrs as originally 'certain' scenes disturbed me. There are lots of scenes I hadn't seen before and this theory is completely new...It gives the film alot more depth and to me (from a teenager to a 53yr old) completes Noodles arc. It is a shame that a movie with content such as this would never be made now with all the ideologies we have in the media these days.
Also adding on to the dream theory when Deborah introduces him to Max’s son looking JUST LIKE the young max that made noodles instantly reminisce on their childhood friendship!
I was going to contribute that myself. The fact that Leone chose to use Rusty Jacobs to play Max AND Max's son supports the notion that in Noodle's opium dream he sees the potential offspring of his former partner just as his memory dictated.
The Opium pipe scene gives us a strong clue that dreams and wishes form a strong part of the story: I think it is a blend, and interweaving of both reality and opium dream
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Genius
I thought that the girls son was Noodle's boy - I much watch this again
You’re correct - However, I recall either Patsy or Cockeye saying (to Max) that Noodles was going down to the Chinese Theaters, implying Noodles had frequented the Opium den. This is confirmed by the welcoming way the opium den owner welcomes and recognizes Noodles. The telephone/buzzing has always confused me too. What was that noise in Noodle’s head? Also - Max exits Noodles life just like he entered it - on a truck (horse-drawn carriage) - which also implies the dream restarting.
At what point in Noodles life do you think the dream begins?
*Nice theory but its only a theory Leone never said what really was. Actually kept it for himself after many many questions about it.*
Could you please provide a link to an article or whatever the source where Sergio Leone actually said what you are saying. I researched extensively everything I could find about the film for my own article about the film and couldn't find the director's quote you are quoting.
When young Max and Noodles fall off the boat into the water of the harbor, Max plays a joke on Noodles by secretly climbing back onto the boat. For a moment Noodles believes Max drowned and disappeared. This is a foreshadowing of Max faking his own death.
Or the seed planted in Noodles’ mind that grew into the opium dream.
😮🤯
@@jonathancarlson6127 exactly
@@jonathancarlson6127 The thing that kind of breaks the dream theory for me is that if it was just a massive cope and all about Noodles absolving himself for his crimes, why would he in the end when he faces down Max refuse to accept the idea that Max was the one who screwed everyone over? If it was about his self-denial over the acts that he committed, it would make more sense that he'd be quick to accept what Max did as a fact to absolve himself from his acts.
The straight forward reading makes much more sense because the movie is ultimately about deconstructing the romantic ideas of honor, brotherhood and loyalty among criminals. So many crime films venerate the characters of criminals even when they acknowledge their immoral acts, while America specifically says that their characters suck just as much as their actions do. It makes so much more sense for Noodles to be facing the truth that it all meant nothing and not be able to accept it, instead pretending that Max isn't Max and he didn't do what he did. He lived a life of regret over the violence he carried and especially the hurt he caused to the ones that he actually cared about. If he hadn't had the nostalgia he couldn't cope with the emptiness of his life.
I think the opium den scene at the end is simply a manifestation of his mental state after learning the truth about Max, not a literal scene of him never having left the den to begin. He went there in the 1930s to hide and escape from reality because his three friends died and he went there again in his mind as an old man to escape reality from learning the truth which made everything he believed in completely meaningless.
@@Tuosma I think refusing to accept what Max did occurs at a very crucial point- he rejects the absolution offered, essentially rejecting the dream, and that’s when he starts to wake up. He leaves, Max disappears behind the truck, which then turns into a 30s automobile, and then he wakes up. His rejection of the dream- and acceptance of reality- causes the vision to crumble.
Maybe. Maybe you’re right. Maybe Leone intended for us all to be having these discussions and interpretations.
Legend still has it that phone is still ringing...
You’re not even in the Mandalorian suit. The more I know about you, the less I like you
“You cannot pass through French Canada unless you take zat phone call!! (ring ring. Ring ring)”
that phone is my sleep paralysis demon since i saw this film
@@tuckercarlsonsmicropenis1283 🤣
Lmao
The movie runs much deeper. Its also a statement on the very foundation of the birth of America thru violence and crime. Ultimately, the movie is about friendship and betrayal. Let's not forget that Noodles called the cops to save his best friend Max not to have him killed. The killing was arranged by Max who double-crossed him in order to get rid of him. Noodles refusal at the end to ' acknowledge that Mr. Baily is in fact Max, is telling him that for him ( Noodles) his best friend died when he betrayed their friendship. While Noodles had put their friendship above everything, his commitment to it is 100% ("I go where you go"), Max keeps playing with it ( " I ought to damp you") and ultimately sacrificed their friendship in order to get to the top. Only, once Max is at the very top ( and even has Noodles girl) he realizes that the best thing he ever had was his friendship with Noodles. And that he lost forever, in spite of all the wealth in the world he's got now he's got nothing. That is the real tragedy and makes the movie timeless. Max realizes too late that the only thing that really ever meant something to him was, in fact, Noodles, their friendship and he threw it away., And no amount of wealth can buy it back. Max realizes he wasted his life on the wrong values. That's why Morricone's emotional score resonates so deeply with what we see and feel onscreen - it's the tragedy of loss. Loss of friendship, love, youth, unfulfilled dreams, and broken promises. And with that Once Upon A Time In America completely transcends the gangster movie. It's a cinematic masterpiece in a category all of its own and put Leone on a par with the other grande masters of cinema such as Kubrick and Kurosoawa.
Precisely (or, at least, that's the meaning I take from it). Friendship/love, betrayal.
Noodles snitched, thus making himself the perpetrator of betrayal of the worst kind against man. Noodles raped, making him the perpetrator of betrayal of the worst kind against woman. The rest is his post hoc rationalizations attempting to establish himself as an exclusive morally just betrayor of childhood bonds, friendship, and innocence
@@paulvallandigham6701 friendship, love and betrayal...u just described life....i loved this movie.
Yes exactly, a true magnum opus is almost like an allegory, it blends the real and surreal and runs deep in meaning in multiple lanes, it's a fairy tale and about American culture mythos, but is also exactly what you described, and more. It's kind of everything at once, like how you'd maybe think a movie about your life, or an event in your head would play out before you die. It's masterpiece that touches upon everything very tastefully and romantic
Well spoken!
Insanely undervalued film. As underrated as it is long
I love this movie
I had a vhs n mad tapes I got found at thrift stores. I had good movies
N this one I had one shitty copy with only half the movie. Then I found a mint vhs copy of tgis
Most critics rate the long version of the film as one of the best of all time.
My favorite movie.
Leone + Morricone = Perfection
Coen + Jeff bridges too❤️
The fact that Debra didn't age makes me think it was a dream, but I never heard that theory before.
But Deborah does age. She just did it gracefully like a lot of dames who look after themselves. The reason why she's covered in greasepaint during that scene is to disguise her flaws for the audience.
Its defo a dream.
@@seasonstudios Exactly! Also If they had applied aging makeup underneath, it would have wiped right off with the grease paint. They made her look older at the party though.
@@LeviAckerman-cb5ji It was also this actress, she had such a girly face, that didn't age like most women.
@@KootFloris Elizabeth McGovern's eternal Cherub face has always kind of freaked me out.
If Noodles heard Yesterday in his dream he should have released it before the Beatles and would have made millions.
The soundtrack of the movie seets the mood for the audience. Yesterday song sets the nostalgic mood for the audience. The Yesteday song isn't necessarily experienced in the frame of the Noodles character
@@nowalubega1475 When Noodles en Max meet near the end it is actually played in the background, not as part of the soundtrack
Cthu
Same can be said for, "Row, Row, Row your boat....."
@@nowalubega1475 when Max opens the rear entrance of his library room you can hear the sounds of the big party going on in the mansion. And Yesterday was being played by the live band entertaining the party. It was not part of the soundtrack. So how can Noodles if he was dreaming in 1930 hear the Beatles song before the Beatles were even born? Your dream theory is total BS lol.
I believe the truck scene has to do with the phrase Max said to Noodles: "Maybe I should have dumped you"
but Noodles dumps Max to get rid of feeling of guilt, in his fantasy
I always hated the dream idea when I first heard it , always kind of rooted for noodles to have some redemption as the phone call was although misguided for the right reasons but it's really grown on me and is the best ending , they were all criminals and it's either an early death or a life of regret for people in that life , Fantastic film , epic in every way
I hate when movies do the "it was all a dream" thing. Such a cop out.
@@LeviAckerman-cb5ji lol 🤡
@@LeviAckerman-cb5ji but it wasn't all a dream it was just everything following that incident. His childhood formative years and the years when he first was released from prison are all real. It's just him imagining his old age.
I read somewhere before that when Leone was first asked about the dream theory, he replied with a surprised "Nnnnoooo". But soon after the idea of the alternative interpretation caught his fancy and he started to propagate that it is the secret meaning of the film that was hidden intentionally by him.
Who knows?
Anyway, this is one of the greatest movie ever made, a true classic what I can't get tired with. When it ends, I wish it lasted another 4 more hours.
@@LeviAckerman-cb5ji . Like Jacob's Ladder.
The fact that you can logically interpret it in more than one way (plus the epic score) is what makes this movie a masterpiece and my all-time favorite.
The quote from Leone is crucial. Leone told the interviewer two years before he died that he fully meant the "future" (1968) parts of the film merely to be Noodles' opium dream. The source for this is not mentioned in "The Mind Blowing Secret of "Once Upon a Time..." That's unfortunate. But for those who want to know the source of the quote, it is: Conversations avec Sergio Leone, Noel Simsolo interviewer (1987, in French) chapter 15 on OUATIA.
The dream theory is an absolute idiotic even if he suggests it cause he dreamed exactly the future as it will be. Even Vietnam War.
I read that when Me. Leone was first asked about it being a dream and he said no. Then later he said it was.
Leone stayed ambitious about the dream interpretation . He touched upon it several times , both confirming or denying it. The point is that it was not Leone who came with the possible interpretation that Noodles had an opium induced dream. That was first launched by soms film critics . Possibly Leone just used that scenario to fool around a bit .
Ultimately it’s not even relevant , but it would be weird that Noodles was able to dream the future so accurately ( how else do we explain “yesterday” being played ) as he did .
Directors never explain their movies , and if they do , it’s always ambiguous.
Good example … “The Shining “. Many interpretations have emerged but none withstands the check of simple logic . None of the stories makes 100% sense , so it does not really matter .
Some directors love the fact that the meaning of their movies remains ambiguous …
I know someone who thinks ET is a reference to Jesus . Doubt very much that Spielberg had that in mind .
@@Babygirl61868 the idea of the dream was launched before Leone ever spoke about it . Some critic interpreted it like that . Then Leone may have just made everyone confused . No artist , ( poet, director , painter - think Salvador Dali ) ever explain their work .
I think that you mean "ambiguous" not "ambitious." @@wengelder9256
Debra did age, wrinkles are shown when she takes her make up off.
She aged gracefully as expected in an actress.
Also I don't think Noodles caused the death of his friends, he feels guilty of that, but in reality his life was spared by Max's fit of rage. Noodles was supposed to be killed too according to Max's scheme.
The opium dream theory is good, though.
That would mean Max died too, and Noodles would never have closure, forgiveness nor redemption.
His life was spared to spend it in loneliness and regret. His curse.
Now I’m more depressed about the movie lol....have a great day🙂
One of the greatest films ever made. This film transcends cinema.
I agree. A masterpiece.
It still seems that people are hesitant to call this movie a classics . I always hear “Gangster movie masterpiece” , no. This movie is A masterpiece
Im watching it for first time. My one criticism is the kids are terrible actors. Too over the top. Like they re doing high school play
@@Johnnyrocks34 You’re watching? So you haven’t seen it?
@@emilal i was about halfway through it when i posted that. I still havent finished. I really wasnt liking it. I didnt think the acting was good. I was trying to like it. Especially the kids. I thought they were aweful
@@Johnnyrocks34 did you watch the 2 hour movie or the full length?
@@maxfieldnuckels9075 full length. I didnt get through it. Im gonna try it again. Maybe if im in different mood.
This is the only movie I started watching again as soon as it ended. Many times in fact.
@Stella Hohenheim way more now actually
@Stellvia Hoenheim He must be unemployed
@@bradforddillman7671 Must be nice to have no job and so much free time. Jealous!
@@joshjnp8900 don’t be. Not as rosy as it sounds
@@bradforddillman7671 you’re getting paid though. It’s all good
Opium dream theory has some holes in it too. His dream accurately envisions modern cars of the 60s, though he is having the dream in the mid/early 30s. He also is reflecting to the song "Yesterday" released in 1965. Wouldn't his dream of the 60's still reflect his knowledge of the 30s, rather than actually being set in an accurate 60's?
It’s a movie.
I was aware of the opium-dream implications, but hadn’t considered that it was Noodles absolving himself of what he’d done - nice reading, nice work
I've smoked opium and never felt likely to dream out the next 30 years. Maybe I didn't smoke enough but I don't like the dream theory. Why is he dreaming about his friend betraying him? Why is he dreaming this sequence of events rather than another? The details of his childhood are accurate aren't they? Why should the rest of his life not be? His quiet life, going to bed early, etc? It just all seems pointless in the end if the whole film is just the imaginings of a stoned man about to die. Surely the whole reveal is robbed of its power?
It would kinda ruin the movie for me so I can't accept it. I'd rather continue loving the film.
@@nickroyle4805 Listen. None of it is accurate. It’s a movie, none of it happened, it is a narrative viewed through the perspective of our main character. I doubt Leone would be comfortable with a single, comprehensive analysis, it’s an opaque and mysterious film, but the idea is that everything up until he betrays his friends is his actual perception, and everything after is his subconscious (a clumsy word here, but I can’t think of a better one) trying to rationalize and revise what happened. I’ve smoked some opium myself, and while I didn’t literally dream a new life for myself, it did allow me to detach from the world and look at painful things without feeling, through a cloud. I don’t think Leone was trying to say anything about opium abuse per se, just the way drugs and memory can be mingled to remove ourselves from the terrible things we’ve done and experienced. In short, what I mean to say is: quit being so literal, all art is a form of dreaming, and great artists don’t sit down with a rubric of symbolism before they start creating - the process is as much one of discovery and mystery for them as it is for the audience
@@nickroyle4805 That’s cool man, don’t let anyone else’s interpretation fuck with your enjoyment of something. Analysis can be toxic
I'm a huge fan of the film and strangely it popped up in my life at the same time as Mulholland Dr. which deals with quite similar subject matter of guilt and dream-themes. Now... I would take Sergio's interview with a pinch of salt. The theory dates back many years and back when iMDB forums still existed, there were loads of 50-50 arguments. Some hinted at the technology (like Nick Royle said, dreaming yourself 30 years into the future is a real stretch), some did point to the opium den scenes and finally the vintage car on the streets... As if there was a crack in time, finished off with the den again. But I still view the film as reality. Possibly somewhat demented reality, but reality still.
Damn they should’ve released the 6 hour version of the film... I would like to see more of the union and childhood parts of the movie... I read the script it was very interesting...
Where do you found the script?
I searched for it because I also wanted to see the movie in its entirety.
One of the best movies ever. I place it in the same category as "The Godfather" . Very under-rated, and very rarely shown.
I've watched this masterpiece several times over the years and it never struck me that all of the 1960's era storyline could be nothing more than Noodle's opium dream. Your video has me convinced it was, so thank you for opening my eyes!
This and godfather part 2 , go along
It is a dream.
Noodles at the end is smiling at US. It's a knowing smile. He somehow knows somebody is watching, in 1984 (that's opium for ya) He's relying on us to hear The Beatles, to see the Mack truck, to fill in those details to make his dream of the future REAL, so that his absolution is complete and convincing.
And in this way Noodles is Sergio Leone, smiling at us, knowing we know movies are dreams, and we're in on it, and we will play along.
Most accurate interpretation. The film is two poems in one as leone put it. A poem about a man consumed with guilt and regret. A poem about a director's storytelling and myth development through film making. Definitely leone's best film and his baby.
The dream theory makes perfect sense simply for the fact that Deborah has absolutely no reaction to Noodles suddenly showing up years later. By that I mean, anyone that's been raped suffers PTSD from the rape and the sudden reappearance of the rapist would be more than most rape victims could handle. The fact that they have a full-blown conversation just adds weight to the fact that this isn't really happening. Just my opinion.
I'm not sure I believe that rape victims would inherently have this kind of a reaction, considering there are varying ways victims act, which is why they often get scrutinized for their behavior since some people have an incorrect idea that a victim is supposed to act only in some specific kind of a way. If it was the case though that everyone would, Leone would be quit ahead of the curve knowing about that kind of psychology considering he started developing the movie over fifty years ago finishing it a little below forty years ago.
You are right for the theatrical versions, though in extended versions she sees him in the audience at her performance beforehand
Her biggest concern at this point is protecting Max. She believes Noodles will inevitably kill him once he realises his deceit. Her actresses have good memories line has so much force behind it to convey her true feelings
@@DavidBrown-ps9gp I think it’s also possible that by the time of the conversation she doesn’t really care much anymore. It seemed to me in that scene that she was more apathetic towards the situation than anything.
I think it's written by a man in the 80s who has little knowledge of the mindset of female rape victims.
I love this film. didn't know Leone could go all Stanley Kubrick on us 🤯
great comment
This film has far more emotion than any Kubrick film.
Nicely put
@@Ballardian then you haven't seen Barry Lyndon
@@RedFlowas Yes I have, and my statement stands.
I just watched the movie again for the first time in about 30 years or so and what a different experience I had. When I first watched it in my twenties I thought this was a pretty good gangster movie and then when I watched it last night I realized what a masterpiece it is because it has many different possibilities. I didn't think too much about the opium scenes until I watched this review of it, but what I did think was it also showed how in America you can ( or used to be able) change your identity and become a new person and start over again. I think that's why Max invited him to that party at his house so that people saw a Hitman come to the house and then he disappeared. Max screwed Noodles over again. Anyway , a very very interesting movie. It's back on my list of one of the greats.
That's an interesting point that you make. So Max was planning to betray Noodles right to the end. Yes, a great film. I love the way it's possible to watch it with fresh eyes each time and find more depth. Leone was an absolute master and made a masterpiece.
Interesting point. Third time max faked it.
This is one of those movies I never get tired of watching. The soundtrack is just as powerful as the movie itself. Thank you for this video and presenting your take on it, I will go back with a new perspective of viewing it, maybe it won’t leave me with that unsettled feeling. Thank you
What's amazing is that the director hates this version his was 7 hours long.
I do agree about the score. This and dancing with wolves have the best scores
It is the greatest and most underrated gangster movie ever made. This movie will never be replicated.
That’s a bold statement
@@billybattsisafunnyguy2337 It's one I agree with
Most underrated yes, greatest no. That would be The Godfather
Great fuck** movie
I love The Godfather but Once upon a time film is iconic from the acting, directing to the score all around fantastic movie!
The film is a dream. If you look at the gravestones of the three gangsters in the big tomb in the cemetery you can see two of them were born in 1907 and one in 1905 but they died 1933. That would make Max, the oldest, 28 years old. Not to mention at the party in the end, there's a silver Ferrari that I believe is a 330 gtc which wasn't made until 66.
Max is supposed to have left the money with a note saying "one last job" and then asks Noodles to get revenge for him faking his death by killing him. But he doesn't and next scene is him back in the drug den when he was a younger man.
My theory is that all his friends were killed in the federal reserve bank job in 33 and it caused him so much pain that he went and got high in a drug den and dreamed about what the rest of their lives would have been like.
It wasn't the Fed Bank - it was the liquor delivery run. The death scene with the corpses, has Fed Marshall cars, and broken liquor bottles all over the street. The gang was killed in a battle with the Feds - and those were their bodies - Noodles realizes his failure to reach the Police wound up allowing Max and the gang to go through with their liquor run - and get killed. Noodles guilt drives him to the Opium den - where he dreams of a future where Max is alive and Deborah hasn't aged a bit. One more thing - the Song "God Bless America" is playing in the beginning - but also at the end when the 3 old cars pass Noodles in the street - after the Garbage Trucks pass. That's to bookend his dream. He's back in 1933.
Very interesting,, 😎✌
@@BabyBoomerChannel . Was Noodles going to Buffalo part of the dream?
@@rockyracoon3233 You never see him get on the bus. Maybe he went to the opium den after buying the ticket.
The gravestones dont rule out that Max could have faked his death.
Noodles had to decide between power or love...Max or Deborah ..he choose neither and lost them both...
That is one solid statement on this film, props 👌
I've always liked not knowing if it was all an opium dream or not , the enigma ....... The 'once upon a time ' has always said to me that it is just a story or a fable , beautifully told , beautifully realized .....
Metafiction, actually
Just watched this movie for the first time and I am blow away, it really felt like you were with this character through their whole life and now that this theory has been put into my head it makes some sense so now my brain is in even more of a spiral. Phenomenal film definitely going to take many viewings
You covered the dream theory very well indeed. If you look at the beginning in the opium den, the camera is panning across the room and we see the man preparing the pipe, there is a very quick glimpse of that Noodles smile we see at the end of the film, only it's a side glance. The beauty of the film is that a viewer can look at it in more than one way and still be very entertained. One small argument against the dream theory is the first dissolve into the 60's. A question is posed about McCartney's song, "Yesterday". Was that played just to let the audience know what time period it was because Noodles dream wouldn't know how to invent that which hadn't been written yet... or would it? A minor point.
There is nothing wrong with a long film, the only thing wrong is when a studio cuts a piece of art to please all audiences, Once Upon A Time In America is one of cinema's true pieces of art and Deniro and Woods finest performances.
The 4 hour director’s cut definitely does justice to this film. The director’s cut is a stone cold masterpiece.
Sometimes it is good to read the comments because they provide a lot of background opinions to help understand the complexity of the movie. I would send you more of these opinions, but this one seems to put everything in perspective.
This movie is great not only because of the execution, but also how it makes you think about what happened and continues the movie in your head until you watch it again. Leonie, an Italian, depicts the gangster story with a Jewish interpretation. To me, it makes the movie even more interesting.
The SMILE at the end on Noodles face… always said to me that he was RELIEVED that his gangster life was over since his gangster family was dead. the scene when noodles and max were beaten by bugsy…. Because noodles wanted out, wanted to go straight and get his girl, Deborah because She wanted him to not be a punk. Also, the smile meant he got the money, which unbeknownst to noodles at that time, that max had already taken it… along with sending Deborah to Hollywood. that has always been my take.
Tremendous movie, pity how it isn’t nearly as well known as it should be
It could be interpreted as either real or an opium dream. I think Leone wanted scenes ambiguous enough for it to go either way. My take on it is that it's real. It was a betrayal in which Max profited greatly but lost his soul. The heist was an inside job between Max, the mob and some corrupt cops. When the three bodies are laid out in the rain, only two of the bodies are recognizable because the face on the body that was supposed to be Max was intentionally mutilated. I think that Noodles knew right then what happened and that even though he called the cops on his three friends he didn't cause their deaths because the cops were in on the heist and it was Max that had Cockeye and Patsy killed so he could steal their shares of the four's ill-gotten gains up to that point along with Noodles' cut. At the end where Max is a U.S. Cabinet Secretary and is about to lose everything and go to prison because of corruption, he has nowhere to turn and Noodles tells him his best friend is dead. Max commits suicide by jumping into a garbage truck's trash compacter.
I look at it as both; he's dreaming about/reflecting on his life
The artistry with which Leone created this ambiguity is impressive. While both interpretations are possible, I agree that it was real. Noodles was attempting to prevent Max being killed during an attempted bank robbery, and Max used the incident for his own purposes, totally hosing Noodles in the process, then subsequently stealing the love of his life. Max was a sociopath's sociopath.
@@JackOstinato I look at the same way; however I feel almost certain Leone intentionally made it so it coukd be interpreted either way.
While this was my original interpretation as well ( first saw this as a very young teenager), how then does one explain Leone's choice of ending on that scene with young Noodles at the opium den, and that mysterious final smile? ... Also, the 30s style cars and passengers driving by right after the garbage truck incident can't be a random coincidence, seems like a deliberate clue, no?
makes complete sense ! that’s why max says to noodles i think you should go home to eve tonight because he already knew the game plan and didn’t want noodles killed
I'd watched the movie twice and felt that I did not understand it. I then found in our local library the "Director's Cut" watched it, and all of a sudden understood the dream sequence, especially the garbage truck sequence etc. I'm going to watch it again because your explanation expanded my horizon about this undeniable Masterpiece. Thanks very much.
This is truly one of my favorite movies of all time. Since Leone left it to one's interpretation, I always viewed it as Max being thrown in by the two men in the garbage truck scene. It seems that Max achieved greatness, but lost everything in the end. His past caught up with him, and Noodles , who lost everything, maintained his dignity and soul...and absolution. The old, .."For what does it profit a man.." adage. Either way, a timeless masterpiece from the maestro Leone.
I think the fact that the ending is left to our interpretation is the real genius in this movie
Yes killer and rapist maintain his dignity.
I agree, the intent is to make the film a dream. As I've learned more about the film through other interviews with actors and the stories of Deniro and Leone clashing over the art. Deniro seeking realism and authenticity and Leone more interested in creating an interpretation of the Era. Also, that Elizabeth McGovern wasn't sure she was right for the part due to her age and again Leone assuring her she was. All of this along with hints in the film makes the theory of a dream or altered state of mind creating its own reality makes complete sense.
An absolutely beautiful film, one of my all time favorites!
This theory makes the film feel so much more real and in my humble opinion, makes the film better.
Thanks for taking the time to produce this commentary. The more I watch and think about this film, the more I come to love it and appreciate the mastery of Leone. There is no doubt that the scenes set in the 1960s are all in Noodles' imagination as he dreams/hallucinates on opium in the den. In fact, until one experiences the film with that fact in mind the brilliance of Leone can't be fully understood.
I don't want to bore anyone who reads this with a ton of explanation, but I'll answer a few questions that come to mind while viewing this film. First, what is with the frisbee? Second, what is the purpose of the garbage truck? Third, why show a car from the 1930s during a scene that takes place in the 1960s? The short answer is that the scenes in the 1960s show a visual depiction of what is going on in Noodles' dream. Keep in mind that in reality Noodles is still living in the 1930s. So Leone put in visuals as clues to the viewer, but the clue is in the audio and not the visual.
The frisbee is visually bizarre, but as a sound it represents something that is happening in real time. Not in the 60s, but in the 30s while he is hallucinating on opium. It is the sound of the bullet (or punch) whizzing towards him as he is being attacked by the gangsters who come looking for him in the opium den. Noodles does not escape out the back door. He's too gacked out on opium, like the other zombies in the den, to run away or pull his gun or defend himself in any way.
The garbage truck works visually in Noodles' dream as a means of death for Max, which of course is only in his mind. In reality the sound represents the actual garbage truck the gangsters throw him into right before he dies in the 30s. That's why the viewer doesn't see a body or any blood in the catch of the truck when the camera pans inside.
The older car going by is again not for the visual. The sound of people celebrating is happening while he is in the truck dying. They are celebrating the end of prohibition in the 1930s. Noodles hears them right before he dies.
Leone manages to tell two stories at the same time. Of course the viewer can't know on a first viewing. It isn't until one sees the final smile by Noodles back in the den in the 1930s that part of the film was a dream sequence.
I know people dispute the dream concept. If anyone reads my explanation, they might want to argue with me. With all due respect, don't waste our time. Instead, watch this incredible film again and gain a deeper understanding. Think about each character and how they change from prior to the 1960s and then in Noodles' dream. Max made Noodles an equal partner and paid him his share when Noodles came out of the institution. Max gave Noodles his share of a big job the guys did when Noodles was off raping Deborah. Only in Noodles' demented mind did Max steal from him. Deborah comes from a tight and loving family. Only the scorned Noodles would believe that she would abandon Moe for decades. The best is how Noodles creates a son for Deborah in his dream. Why? Because his mind needs to know if his rape resulted in a child. That's why his mind makes the child look exactly like a young Max. Leone even used the same actor to play young Max and Deborah's son.
I hope the creator of this video sees this comment and pins it for all others to read. Stay safe everybody!
As the dude would say, “that’s just..like..your opinion man”
How do you explain him dreaming in 1930 about watching tv news show in the 1960s bar?
To show the viewer the time period. While it wouldn't make sense that Noodles dreamed the future correctly that's not the point. The point is that you as a viewer know the time period being portrayed even though it's really a dream.
Great comment. Did you like the recent 4h. version?
He raped Deborah in 1933 but her son wasn't in his mid 30s in 1968 so I don't think the son is the product of the rape.
Soundtrack edges the film, its beautiful
I always thought the garbage truck was waiting to kill Noodles after he had killed Max. When he refused to do this, Max called the truck off...
Noodles smiling at the end was the telling sign of his doublecross. He called in the heist to the cops knowing Max and the crew would be killed. Afterward he goes to the station to get their suitcase of money but Max has already taken it and split (re: Max finally reasoned he would be killed if he tried a federal reserve robbery). So, Max has now been living all these years in shame at having stole Noodles woman and his money (he admits this) but it was Noodles who set up his pals. His knowing smile at the end turns the film on its head. It's truly one of the great endings in moviedom. With that smile you see the whole film and Max and Noodles differently.
Il sorriso di Noodles alla fine, è un poster a casa mia appeso in fondo alle scale, che vedo la mattina quando esco dal reparto notte ed inizio la giornata
I don't think he wanted to doublecross Max, he was trying to save his life by tipping off the cops before the heist went down and to avoid a shootout. Later on, we learn that Max manipulated Noodles into doing this [by putting the idea in Carrol's head] and basically masterminded the whole thing to fake his own death and steal the money. Noodles never wanted to hurt Max and can't accept that Max betrayed him. His smile at the end is reflective of him choosing to escape from reality and focus only on the positive memories of his childhood friends, because that's all he has left.
All nonscene. Noodles tried to get his crew arrested and spent time in jail..thus save them getting shot and killed at federal reserve..noodles loved them all
One of the greatest films of all time...
All of Leoni's films have the same key theme of friendship. He explores many different types of bonds that may cause friendship or a kinship of some kind. Some friendships are like Manco and Colonel Douglas Mortimer, that show an equel respect for each other. Some frienships are comfortable casual acquaintances like Joe and Silvanito while at the same time Joe sharing a strange kinship with the villian Ramón Rojo, (who clearly has a respect for Joe, & Joe has for Ramón). Then there are deeper friendships like that of Juan Miranda and Sean H. Mallory with Juan Miranda's grieving is herd and slowly bought to a stand still by a patiently quiet Sean H. Mallory, (the deep friendship can be felt in the silence). Then there's the untrustworthy kinship of Blondie and Tuco. It kind of didn't matter weather it was a western or a gangster movie, the friendship themes was always at the heart of Leoni's films. Hollywood didn't get it, and only wanted westerns from Leoni, that is why they stopped funding him for 10 years or so. This is a tragic thing for film goers because his next film was going to be a war film, but Sergio died before he could make it. I can only dream of what that film would have been like.
The movie has nostalgia it creates it no other film gives off the feel of nostalgia more than this one as loving n as brutal as nostalgia can be
What a fantastic comment about the awesome power of nostalgia. Right on the money.
The way noodles smiles at us in the end reminds me of Arthur Fleck (from Joker - 2019) who also laughs on the audience for misinterpreting the delusions of his mind as reality.
Meanwhile, who played talk show host Murray Franklin in JOKER? Yup, old Noodles himself, Robert DeNiro! Hell, can we even believe Bruce Wayne's parents were killed the same night Arthur gets to appear in his idol's show? Love the whole dream within a dream concept. For all we know, that might have been a younger Jack Napier in the alley way that fateful night...
I watched this movie 30+ years ago and I refuse to watch it again because it was so good.
Maybe this wonderful masterpiece is the poetic expression of the fact that life can be seen as a movie in a movie...
I’ve always taken the story to be actually occurring as opposed to the drug induced dream theory. That Noodle’s grin at the close of the film is 1 - That he has money to live a better life and 2 - He’s amused with an idea that Max has pulled another fast one be disappearing before the law or his criminal friends can get their hands on him.
The garbage truck scene-- It was clear Max was about to be killed by his current compadres, and wanted Noodles to kill him instead. Noodles refused, then left. I always thought the garbage truck was disposing of Max's body, that he was killed right after Noodles left.
In the bad, short cut of the film there were 2 gun shots just before the truck goes by. Not sure what was meant by that.
Yeah max hops in the garbage truck when noodles won't kill him
Yes I think that would be the prevailing theory if it were really happening and not a dream however in the short cut of the film there are two gunshots just before we see the garbage truck grinding wheel. I've often wondered if that was a sound edit flaw in the long version because the gunshots would make sense in either the dream theory or the actual happening theory. If it actually happened, then the hoods caught up with Max, shot him and threw him in the truck. If it were a dream, then Noodles dreams the hoods have shot Max when they are actually shooting Noodles in the opium den.
@@seasonstudios no the hoods don't throw max in the truck he throw himself in. What he felt he deserved. He really felt he deserved noodles to kill him but he wouldn't
@@mikemal4398 Yes, I understand what you are saying, I'm just making book on what might have happened if we add the gunshots that were in the shortened version. Some have argued that the hoods shoot Noodles in the opium den while he's dreaming all this stuff up (because if it is a dream, he never leaves the 1930's) and they have said that the sound of the Frisbee being caught is him getting shot but that happens and we aren't even through half of the movie so how could that be? If the 2 shots were left in at the end of the film then maybe we could really argue that it was all a dream.
The sustainability of the script did succeed in maintaining my interest in the movie from beginning to end. It did so for 38 years . They have passed and the movie has lingered in my mind as a acid trip of ongoing continuity! It never seizes to amaze me how well it was made! And YES! Its secret was p/u by me and struck home! A work of art! As for those who did not sustain their interest , It might of been a drop off along the way by their own combination of nominal intellect and vision. As Noodles portraits and leaves to an agile mind to p/u on! I did p/u but as all reviews you don't know until you compare notes on your findings with others and I was amazed on my agility! Thank you for all of it . It did rattle me and made me a better observant of the film arts! Sergio Leon was a Genius! A miracle in film making . A Davinci ,Mozart work of art! In that order! For someones last. An odd, odyssey of the extreme! He did it all! I might of failed to P/U on other things but the primary elements where there for all to see! By the way!....... Domenic's name gets mentioned only once if memory serves me right!. You have to be up and about to watch this one! It makes you work! Max was Machiavellic on overdrive! Non stop!I In Noodles ;and the mind is terra nonferma when dreaming ; is possible that that it all could of became reality as forseen! Its knowned to happen in some walks of life. Why not! To forsee is! to get ahead. Noodles might of been so! Aging is the unknown!
If noodles knew what 1960s were going to be like that was one hell of a dream I don't buy that
Been wrestling with how I interpret this film for 30 years. I was aware of all the options the whole time and still haven't come to a definitive conclusion as the facts all have issues. I suspect I will be thinking of this film till the day I die and I'm OK with that, It is a masterpiece in every sense of the word. As is Once upon a time in the west.
One of my favorite films and I never thought of it this way. Mind blown.
Mind blown, yes but the beauty is that you can chose it either way.
I love your review inspired by a true love of the great film. In my opinion, the best way to enjoy this film is to focus on the tenderness and despair of the musical score, the amazingly realistic acting, the impressive sets, the fluid camera movements and the dreamy but assured directing. Sergio Leone had a saying when asked questions about the ending of his masterpiece which, being translated roughly means: ‘I say it here, I deny it there’. Everything about that gangster world was built on deception false dreams etc. So the fact that we try to know but we really don’t know adds to the mesmerising quality of the film. Sergio Leone was fascinated with the gangster Noodles who was modelled on -Harry Grey who looked nothing like the brash, tough conventional image of the gangster, but was a quiet reserved man who had spent his post gangster life goin’ to bed early’. What an epic film!
So I guess Noodles was able to predict Beatles’ “yesterday” in 1930s
Hahah hilarious joke!
@@JLyck you remember the scene where Noodles goes to the locker in the 60s and there’s ppl playing “yesterday”
@@jeyi4208 Yes of course! I have just seen the movie for the first time. I heard “yesterday” and thought to my self, that it was strange to pick such a piece of music for such a type of movie - aka gangster movie.
I saw this in 1984, and thought, "No, he isn't just tripping, because how could he have known the Beatles (or what a frisbee is)" ---but the film also ends with noodles smiling in the opium den.
Is's copied from a jazz piece from the 30s.
An untouchable classic!
Don't feel bad. I was in my forties when I first heard this theory and it is certainly a legitimate theory.
Thank you! The "future" being an opium dream has been my interpretation since I first watched the film on VHS in the 1990s. I've been looking for someone else to corroborate this impression ever since then and now I've found it! When viewed in this light the story becomes even more tragic and the vision of his future informs your understanding of his emotional state. The future was simply too conveniently generous with his moral redemption. The very last shot of the film is what seals the analogy with film - that it is an insidiously erosive poison and awful surrogate for true character and true experience. I believe Leone was making a harsh criticism about the place of cinema in peoples lives. Noodles breaking the fourth wall with a smile drove that point home for me.
A masterpiece.
Agree. Could be a metaphor of the American Dream and its promise, morality, loses and costs. Power vers. true love. Debra also wanted success, as an artist, and ended up with the "other" gangster, maybe to compensate her lost love to Noodles. Strong ambiguity. The boy who eat's the cake for immediate setisfaction not resisting inorder to gain a better one is one of the strongest simbolic scenes that supports this narrative line. One of the greatest films of all time also thanks to Morricone's epich score that was precisely ready before shooting! Few scene were shot with the recordered music in the backround...
I always thought it was Noodles reconciling himself to the consequences of what he has done and that he is now a marked man. If, in the best case scenario where Max had manipulated him, Noodles would still end up in the back of the dumpster, then he accepts his death as inevitable. Plus, if the outcome remains the same, who’s to say that Max isn’t alive and Noodles can still be redeemed? It’s about the balance between hope and fate.
The dream sequence makes more sense to me than anything else I've heard about the plot. The fact that there's two cars full of people at the end that look like they just came out of the 1930s driving down the street in the 1960s tells me something is kind of strange about this scene. The dream sequence just makes more sense, to me anyway, and I think it also makes the film more interesting in that light.
Nothing to do with future. Dream sequence was purely noodles remembering his childhood with his gang and deborah
Then explain the modern cars in the parking lot when Max looked out the window. He can't visualize things he never seen.
@@birdsteak9267
..to include a frisbee (not invented until 1937) and a Jimi Hendrix reference.
@@kramalerav Exactly, and it is as unlikely that Noodles were written to be a all seeing Oracle that can see into the future in his dreams, which we all can see he clearly were not.
@@kramaleravyes the random frisbee when Noodles is walking down the desolated street never made sense to me. now that I heard about the opium dream theory it makes more sense. also, which jimmy hendrix refeeence are you talking about by the way?
I agree, at least the old noodles coming back I believe is from dreaming... There is an interesting moment too that he wakes up from his opium trip as soon as the phone is answered 11 minutes in.
Imagine if the hasn’t butchered the film. What a masterpiece we might have got then. I wonder what we missed out on.
The 4 hour director’s cut is a masterpiece.
@@IvanLendl87 I agree but imagine all the stuff that was lost forever. They originally had much more filmed.
I'm glad they replaced the working print footage especially how we finally see where and how he met his last girlfriend but you would think they could have made it look better the way they manipulated The Irishman. I would have thought the technology was there.
I’ve just watched the Amazon version. It was 3hrs 49 including credits…. Have I watched the whole thing?
Agreed, imagine if the plot with Joe Pesci was truly fleshed out
I've got the full version, but haven't watched it for a while. Now I need to watch it again. Thanks.
If those future scenes are a dream then who took the money?
A junkie melanzane shimied it open with a pry bar!
Great point
@tommy gunnor Where did it end up after Max's death? It wasn't taken by his girlfriend because she ended up in an old folks home. Did the cops take it or did the hoods from Detroit take it?
Of course max took it.He even tells noodles it was a syndicate operation.
@@geofftaylor8627 Yes and that makes one think was that what happened when Frankie Minaldi (Pesci) saw them leaving the hospital. The boys did the big double cross with the diamonds so did Pesci make a deal with Max and then after the heist gone wrong, Pesci's hoods from Detroit tried to close in on Noodles.
Having just seen it on Amazon Prime I very much enjoyed it. I did like the ambiguous ending as it is left to us to decide what is going on. Personally, I prefer the non-dream explanation. The end scene with the 3 party cars from the 30s is not a problem for my viewing as I supposed Knuckles frame of mind was stuck in the 30s - his happy place - so seeing the cars was like an imaginary thought. For the dream sequence to be more successful the 60s should have had a lot of 30s elements spliced in like the music, some of the cars, posters, that sort of things as it is impossible to accurately dream of the future, especially one that is over 30 years hence. The suicide / non-suicide ending with Max is also good as, again, it is left to us to make up our own minds.
The one thing I will say in its favour is that films like these hardly get made anymore. The set design of the Jewish neighbourhood is superb and the production values very much reminded me of the high quality of The Godfather. I would not go far as to classify it as a masterpiece as some aspects of it look dated like the ageing and the blood (the 70s / 80s really had terrible fake blood) but it is as close to a masterpiece in my books. This MUST be seen on high definition as the sets are just as much the characters as the people.
I would very much be interested in seeing the 4.5 hour version or even the 6 hour version spliced into two 3 hour movies.
How can I find the longer versions
Yea the "everything is a dream" angle is really used up and to me is a huge cop out. It sucks the meaning out of the rest of the film for me.
The 3 party cars was letting us know maxs son was of to carry on his life that max had made..this was whole exercise of final 10 mins
in response to a comment below about pronunciation. right about ending vowels being pronounced. leone: lay-own-AY. morricone: mor-rick-own-AY. mozzarella: moots-ah-rel-LAH. let's talk "sergio". americans call him sair-GEE-oh. alfabeto italiano has no J. that letter's pronunciation is also taken by the G. to differentiate between the soundings, a G followed by H is spoken Gah as in gorilla. G followed by I is spoken Jah as in jaguar. in both cases, the H and I are only designations. it is not heard. gianni is spoken jah-NEE. sergio is spoken sair-JO. well, that's how they say things in italy, anyway.
Just watched it really for the first time tonight and it is mind bender. Just when you think it makes sense your still left with questions. But beautifully directly and executed.
A long time ago ,my father, his brother, and I went to see the extended version. When it came to movies we never agreed 👍. For the only time we all agreed that this was a great 👍 movie.
Miracles do happen.
One of my favorite movies of all time and no one that I know has ever seen it.
Cant understand why James wood is not up there with Hanks Deniro etc
Funny thing is I never considered this as a gangster film but more a coming of age story and the gangsterism being part of the story rather than the story. As in life then was like that. Wow. I have watched this film many times and this dream angle had never occurred to me. I’d have to watch it agin and see if I see what you mean.
The greatest movie ever made.
A cinematic masterpiece.
I wouldn’t go that far
@@Blank-km4qr I would
I never heard this theory. It makes me desperately want to watch the film again.
I hate when something in a movie or tv ends up being just a dream. BUUUUUTT....
I would love to find out that godfsther part 3 was just a bad dream that michael corleone had after eating at a shitty restaurant.
Same
Just when I was falling asleep, it pulled me back in, awokev to , yet more hand kissing scenes Aazrgh
@@bmac454 💀💀💀💀
Next time he should try the veal, best in the city.
@@eddie30991
" il have it" 😳
If max did jump into the truck surely we'd hear screams of pain & agony, plus we'd also see blood on the blades?
Wonderful analysis, thank you. I have always thought that this movie was a masterpiece. I saw the original 3 hour version at the theatre and thought it was terrific. Later, when I saw the uncut version on DVD it raised my praise even more. No, I had not thought about the ‘dream’ explanation that you give but I think Sergio did. Good job.
Dream theory. No. Noodles dreamt max had son with Deborah. Remember he thought max was dead..too big a jump. Interesting theory but too contrived.he dreamt macs son as well no
My opinion is that everything in the future with Noodles coming back is a dream. The ending pretty much cements it with the smile towards the camera. It gives him an opportunity at resolution with Moe, Debra and Max.
The "pan flute" still haunts my reverie.....this movie remains as one of the top unsung period gangster masterpieces of the modern cinema era! I bought this once on one of my old "TH-cam" accounts for $3.99! I was that taken by it! 🎥🎞️❤️🎭
Your theory of the plot has its logic and I never considered it, so hats off to you.
I saw this film when it came out and considered it on a par with " The Godfather" within the genre. What always has stayed with me was the metaphor of Max killing himself by jumping into the blades of a garbage truck.
Which funny enough dosent show any gore or blood even though throughout the movie it’s not shied away from 🤔
Never looked at it this way before, either way still for me the greatest movie I have seen
It is opium that makes Noodles dream of the future; therefore, what is imagined to be the future, i.e., '68, is nothing but a dream, otherwise that scene in the smokehouse and the final smile always in the smokehouse would not make sense.
Sergio Leone used the Harry Grey book "The Hoods" as reference, and there are plenty of similarities, events, scenes, names, etc., but there are also major twists. Another scene I trip on is the ending scene - which looks much like Once Upon a Time in the West scene with Jill looking up from the bed, after she realizes that she's come out to The West all for naught. The camera shoots her from above through black fabric of the bed canopy, and Noodles is hot from above through a black fabric in the opium den.. Leone and Kubrick are my favorite directors and I love how they use similar "trademark"scenes in their films, and both were good still photographers - no coincidence.
The scene in the rain where Noodles sees his friends lying dead in the streets is similar looking to the one in Duck You Sucker where John Malory witnesses the firing squad execution of the revolutionaries in the rain also...
Also the scene where young noodles and max get the shit kicked out of them is probably a reference to Leone’s dollar films where the main characters would get beaten up lol
Absolutley Classic! I agree it's only too long if it bores you. I watch it anytime I see it's showing..period!
The two ideas that really elevate this film: #1 Noodles is dreaming all the post-1933 scenes under the influence of opium and #2 Max is in love with Noodles. Notice the apathy towards any other character (male or female) in the film, along with the tension between the two characters and the desire for Noodles approval from Max. Viewing with these ideas makes them seem intentional.
You had to put the gay into it, didn't ya? Piss off.
Il sogno potrebbe essere anche ante-1933
I think with this view and the garbage truck scene, Max's disappearance behind the garbage truck would be Noodle's mind telling him to put the thoughts of guilt behind him, with the car full of partying young folks being his sign too move on to happier opportunity's freely.
Wow, I’ve always hated the "it’s all a dream" denouement as a hackneyed device used by bad directors and TV writers to get out of a corner they’ve painted themselves in. I’ve never watched this film in that light but your video makes a fascinating and compelling case.
Agreed. I've only watched this movie once and it didn't work for me because there's no stakes when most of the film is a dream. I guess DeNiro was supposed to be the protagonist, but he wasn't exactly someone to root for when he's all about rape.
FWIW: I have the same feelings for the "it was all a Dream" trope, but in this case it is put to good use, if the theory is correct.
I'm the same way. I hate dream endings. But the twist that Max faked his death also hits wrong, too hokey for an otherwise brutally real film. That this was wishful thinking makes it more compelling and reveals a lot about who Noodles really is, by who he really wants to be.
the monologe at the end by Robert De niro was one of the best ever. and the fact he call james woods mr baily instead of max was powerful stuff
I like this interpretation. It’s been a long time since I’ve seen this movie so now I have to go back and look at it again. It makes a lot of sense in terms of washing away all the bad that you did, to make yourself not the bad guy when in reality you’re really a horrible person.
I believe the garbage truck and partying people in cabrios was a metaphor for how their life went down the drains.... The intention is to make you feel rather than answer questions.
The young fellow near the movie's end who played that ruddy-haired David also was the guy who played young Max, which makes it clear that Max did marry Deborah and she had his child...AKA the young fellow Noodles saw as he slipped out the back way after talking with Deborah about the invitation he had received.
And Fat Moe doesnt know that his sister is marrx to Max( who is alive😅)... must be dream
The younger Deborah was so adorable.
I was something like 12 when I first saw this movie, and it was insta-love for me once her character was introduced. 🥰
You can imagine how my opinion of Noodles shifted later on in the film...
Just watched this again after about 30yrs as originally 'certain' scenes disturbed me. There are lots of scenes I hadn't seen before and this theory is completely new...It gives the film alot more depth and to me (from a teenager to a 53yr old) completes Noodles arc.
It is a shame that a movie with content such as this would never be made now with all the ideologies we have in the media these days.
Also adding on to the dream theory when Deborah introduces him to Max’s son looking JUST LIKE the young max that made noodles instantly reminisce on their childhood friendship!
I was going to contribute that myself. The fact that Leone chose to use Rusty Jacobs to play Max AND Max's son supports the notion that in Noodle's opium dream he sees the potential offspring of his former partner just as his memory dictated.
The Opium pipe scene gives us a strong clue that dreams and wishes form a strong part of the story: I think it is a blend, and interweaving of both reality and opium dream
My absolute, all-time favourite film.
David is not Deborah’s son. He is Max’s son and his mother died.
Amazing, beautiful film. And the score is quite incredible. Sheer beauty.