I have a new Gibson SG that dives with a nylon strap. Your Gibson’s have tremolos that help with the weight distribution. Wide leather straps also help.
Every SG is not created equally... the necks on the 70's and 80's models like your SG Deluxe had regular neck joints without the space where the tenon cover sits between the rhythm pickup and the "pushed out neck" like the originals and later versions. The 70's and 80's SG bodies were also less carved, so they were thicker around the horns and edges (more wood). Most collectors hated them (and the Norlin era in general for thee most part) because they weren't authentic and it wasn't until recently that you could buy them cheap. Now all the posers like them. I played those SG's for decades... most were from the early to mid 80's and a couple were from the mid 70's. When I bought my first modern era SG Standard '61 I could definitely feel the difference. The bodies were/are very light compared to my old ones (mine was just over 6lbs) and have the "pushed left neck" with the tenon cover. They are definitely prone to diving but a wider 2.5" to 3" leather (or vegan leather type) strap is a big help. So are light vintage tuners (real Klusons) instead of Grovers and a heavier zinc stop bar tailpiece.
2021 SG Standard. Neck dive. I use a leather strap with unfinished back and it’s good to go. Also, I usually don’t run around with no hands on my guitar. 😮No tuning issues, but then again I know how to set up a guitar and maintain it.
Great point about running around with no hands. Thanks for the comment, and for watching! I'm with you on knowing how to set up a guitar. I've never really had any tuning issues with any of my Gibsons since learning a few simple things. And I learned those things a *very* long time ago, lol!
Oh PLEASE! You don't remember any neck-dive??? That is the most prominent feature of an SG, but It must be said that with all it's "kwirks and features" the most positive one I think is that it is an awesome guitar to solo with. Let me explain... because the neck is so far out of the body, the second half of the neck is pretty close to your body and it is a breeze to solo on it. At least that to me is the best feature of the SG. Other than that, I just have it as a wall ornament.
It's true, I never noticed any neck dive with my SGs until the experiment in this video using a nylon strap. And even then, I had to basically force it to happen. You're right, high fret access on an SG is awesome, and that's part of the reason I used mine on stage for so many years. Based on comments from other viewers, I'm guessing it is not an "across-the-board" issue, but more than likely something that happens on specific, individual guitars. Thanks for watching!
My 2005 SG Standard had zero neck dive and no notable tuning issues. It wasn't Les Paul heavy but some heft to the body. One of my favorite necks and guitars to play ever.
I had that theory for a while, but I've played some SGs belonging to friends that have the stop tailpiece, and they didn't neck dive. BUT - based on the comments here & discussions I've had in the real world since I did this vid, I think it is more about the type of wood the bodies & necks are made of. Heavy (or heavy-ish) body + lighter neck = no dive. Heavy-ish neck+lighter body= neck dive. It also seems like some versions have the strap buttons in a weird place, so overall it's a total crapshoot, lol. I got lucky, I think. Thank you for watching & commenting! I hope your SG is a good one!
29 year player here. Yes, some SG's have neck dive, no it's not an issue when your playing standing up with a decent strap, yes it might be an issue if you mostly play sitting at home which is what your colorful friend was probably doing as a 3.5 year know it all. Some guitars have neck dive but to a decent player it shouldn't be an issue. Necks aren't bricks, your arm isn't going to fall of from a slight downward pressure, we adapt
Also, I'm not surprised that a Bigsby equipped SG is balanced. Junior has the Maestro, that no doubt helps a bit, wasn't expecting it to be that good without the extra weight of the lyrebird as well, maybe the lack of neck pickup weighing that end down. I think the big killer is when someone swaps out to Grover tuners
Yeah, there are a bunch of factors that I either didn't include in order to keep the video short-ish, or I just didn't think about. Grovers could absolutely tip the scales! Or the SG, to be more accurate, lol! Thanks for watching & commenting!
Just bought my first SG. Been wanting one for a long time so, I treated myself with a 61 reissue standard. I never thought neck dive was a huge deal. Maybe I’ve never played one with extreme issues.
Cool, congrats on scoring your SG. I never neck dive was a thing with an SG, either. Maybe it's limited to a certain year of variation? I don't know. Thanks for watching!
The Bigsby counters neck dive. Lots of weight in the back compared to a non-Bigsby. I have an SGS3. 3 pickups and one of those side-trems. No neck dive. I also have an SG with two pickups and no trem and it dives like a penguin.
That may be a factor, but I think it's a combination of things. I have several friends who own SG standards that reached out after I made this video. I played a couple without any trems, and had no neck dive at all. A couple others, to use your great phrase, dove like penguins, lol! We saw some variation in strap button placement, and the ones that dove were noticeably lighter, so we are thinking the lack of quality control on the wood is also a major factor. So many folks have reached with their stories, & the only conclusion I can reach is that it is about a 50/50 chance that you will find one with no dive, and I just got lucky with my two, lol. Thanks for watching & for sharing your experience!
A 24 fret sg will have dive. I’ve had a few sg’s and while beautiful they all had dive. I also put locking tuners and string butler to help with tuning stability and quick string changes and that adds more weight to the headstock. I’ve tried all the dumb tricks- weights in the cavity, different straps, even moving the button to the horn. The only thing that really helps is a bigsby and a custom cut metal rear control cover. Gibson is run by idiots who won’t fix little things they’re known for. I’m a professional musician and I’ve owned close to 100 guitars over the years. You can’t beat Gibson sound but their are certainly better built out there. A prs 594 McCarty is a good alternative to a les Paul. If you can swap all the electronics from a lex Paul into a McCarty you got a beast. I’ve had all the knockoffs of Les Paul’s too and some are close; Eastman, Burny, etc but the wood is cheap, necks bend and warp easy… just not the same. I still haven’t found a good alternative to the sg though. Baum carve, ltd viper, etc… not the same
All good points. Interesting that all your SGs had dive & that neither of mine (nor the ones I've borrowed recently) do. You're right about Gibson shortcomings - I used to be a total Gibson snob, but when I was shopping for another guitar many years ago, I could not find a single Gibson I liked. I ended up with some other brands & my "snob" mindset left me. I don't have any real brand loyalty any more; I judge on a guitar-by-guitar basis. Thanks for watching & for your comment!
@@ClarkColborn The last sg I had was a 2016 supreme, the really nice red one with custom carves. It was beautiful and expensive. I couldn’t wait to get it. When I did get it, it was completely unplayable the dive was so bad. I kept it like a month and resold it. The 22 frets aren’t as bad with dive but I still had to move the button. Plus with a strap lock poking into it chest it’s almost a necessity to move it.
@@bryanp8010 don't you just hate when your anticipation is so high, then the guitar disappoints you? Back around 1980 I actually traded the SG Deluxe from this video in on a Les Paul branded SG from the early '60s. I was SO excited to get it back home. It played like a dream & sounded great through some little amp I had at the time. But when I got it to our first rehearsal, I discovered it would feedback horribly at anything approaching normal stage volume. It was stone stock & I couldn't bring myself to wax-pot the pickups or change them out, so I begged the retailer to work a deal with me to get my Deluxe back. Basically we just reversed the transaction at a minimal cost to me, but the experience left me disillusioned, but with a good story, lol.
Interesting! Does the Epi have the strap buttons in a slightly different position, I wonder? Or do you think it has more to do with the weight of the body? Thanks for watching, btw. :-)
Yeah, kind of, but I think it has more to do with body style. Maybe, lol. I think Firebirds are notorious for neck dive, and maybe some others. Based on the comments on this video I think with SGs it varies wildly from guitar to guitar. I wish I could get all the different SGs commenters have mentioned into the same room so I could check things like strap button location & a few other things so we could figure out why some are bad & others have no problem. Thanks for watching!
Sit with it put it on your leg in a normal sitting position. Remove your hands. If it doesnt dive then its different to most SGs I have played (granted not all)
Awesome. Thanks for sharing. I wonder why so many people seem to think it's a common thing. Based on the comments so far it seems to be fairly rare. Thanks for watching!
Just curious, do you think the position of the strap button is the culprit or is it something with the weight of the wood in the neck compared to the body? Thanks for watching!
The latter in this particular case. The strap button on this one is on the tip of the horn. It would be interesting to be able to go back to the production run and grab some examples from that particular batch to see if they have similar problems, or if that happens on a case by case basis.
I've seen so many responses with both NO neck dive & noticeable neck dive that I have to think it really varies from guitar to guitar. Thanks for watching & commenting!
It's so weird how many different results everyone gets, I kind of wish I could get all your guys' SGs in a room at the same time & see what differences we could find. Thanks for watching!
Dude, the reason for yours not having it, it's the model versions you have, the SG's do have in majority the neck dive and it is fucking annoying as hell. It's not related to each person's experience, it's the model you get, they make it with different woods depending on the decade and the brand you get. Why do you think there are tons of videos of this issue out there? It's a problem with the design of it and the model you get because they make it with different woods. My first when I bought, I also had to addapt and I never heard of that problem untill I bought mine, then guess what? went to the internet and found tons of people complaining of the same issue, went to a friend's house and he explained to me, then he goes "get this and see", I put his SG on, no extra weights added no change in the strap and guess what, NO NECK DIVE, I went WTF is this? He goes, "they make with different woods, therefore they got different weights", then he said never buy on the internet, always buy on a store so you can test the weight of it and see if it has neck dive or not, it's literally a luck thing, so I sold mine, but still wanted to have one of these to my collection, found a guy selling his on the internet, went to his house and guess what? The wood of his was TOTALLY different, a lot heavier, bought his and that's the one I got now, no neck dive at all, same as yours, but it is an issue of the design of it, they should have realized this when they invented it and made the neck not so long as it is, you just got lucky with your models, and their woods, test all the ones you see out there and eventually you will find one that has it, believe me
I have a new Gibson SG that dives with a nylon strap. Your Gibson’s have tremolos that help with the weight distribution. Wide leather straps also help.
Every SG is not created equally... the necks on the 70's and 80's models like your SG Deluxe had regular neck joints without the space where the tenon cover sits between the rhythm pickup and the "pushed out neck" like the originals and later versions. The 70's and 80's SG bodies were also less carved, so they were thicker around the horns and edges (more wood). Most collectors hated them (and the Norlin era in general for thee most part) because they weren't authentic and it wasn't until recently that you could buy them cheap. Now all the posers like them. I played those SG's for decades... most were from the early to mid 80's and a couple were from the mid 70's. When I bought my first modern era SG Standard '61 I could definitely feel the difference. The bodies were/are very light compared to my old ones (mine was just over 6lbs) and have the "pushed left neck" with the tenon cover. They are definitely prone to diving but a wider 2.5" to 3" leather (or vegan leather type) strap is a big help. So are light vintage tuners (real Klusons) instead of Grovers and a heavier zinc stop bar tailpiece.
Great insights! Thanks for sharing them, and also for watching & commenting!
2021 SG Standard. Neck dive. I use a leather strap with unfinished back and it’s good to go. Also, I usually don’t run around with no hands on my guitar. 😮No tuning issues, but then again I know how to set up a guitar and maintain it.
Great point about running around with no hands. Thanks for the comment, and for watching! I'm with you on knowing how to set up a guitar. I've never really had any tuning issues with any of my Gibsons since learning a few simple things. And I learned those things a *very* long time ago, lol!
Oh PLEASE! You don't remember any neck-dive??? That is the most prominent feature of an SG, but It must be said that with all it's "kwirks and features" the most positive one I think is that it is an awesome guitar to solo with. Let me explain... because the neck is so far out of the body, the second half of the neck is pretty close to your body and it is a breeze to solo on it. At least that to me is the best feature of the SG. Other than that, I just have it as a wall ornament.
It's true, I never noticed any neck dive with my SGs until the experiment in this video using a nylon strap. And even then, I had to basically force it to happen. You're right, high fret access on an SG is awesome, and that's part of the reason I used mine on stage for so many years. Based on comments from other viewers, I'm guessing it is not an "across-the-board" issue, but more than likely something that happens on specific, individual guitars. Thanks for watching!
Gibson SG neck dive is fn LEGENDARY. You're not crazy bro.
My 2005 SG Standard had zero neck dive and no notable tuning issues. It wasn't Les Paul heavy but some heft to the body. One of my favorite necks and guitars to play ever.
Awesome! And thank you for watching!
As a fellow SG owner, of course they aren't neck-diving, they've all got big honking tremolos
I had that theory for a while, but I've played some SGs belonging to friends that have the stop tailpiece, and they didn't neck dive. BUT - based on the comments here & discussions I've had in the real world since I did this vid, I think it is more about the type of wood the bodies & necks are made of. Heavy (or heavy-ish) body + lighter neck = no dive. Heavy-ish neck+lighter body= neck dive. It also seems like some versions have the strap buttons in a weird place, so overall it's a total crapshoot, lol. I got lucky, I think. Thank you for watching & commenting! I hope your SG is a good one!
29 year player here. Yes, some SG's have neck dive, no it's not an issue when your playing standing up with a decent strap, yes it might be an issue if you mostly play sitting at home which is what your colorful friend was probably doing as a 3.5 year know it all. Some guitars have neck dive but to a decent player it shouldn't be an issue. Necks aren't bricks, your arm isn't going to fall of from a slight downward pressure, we adapt
lol Absolutely true! Thanks for watching!
mine dives like hell
That's so wild, everyone has a different experience. Thanks for watching!
2:51 Wow, a Deluxe! Boy, those were such freaks
Also, I'm not surprised that a Bigsby equipped SG is balanced. Junior has the Maestro, that no doubt helps a bit, wasn't expecting it to be that good without the extra weight of the lyrebird as well, maybe the lack of neck pickup weighing that end down.
I think the big killer is when someone swaps out to Grover tuners
Yeah, there are a bunch of factors that I either didn't include in order to keep the video short-ish, or I just didn't think about. Grovers could absolutely tip the scales! Or the SG, to be more accurate, lol! Thanks for watching & commenting!
Just bought my first SG. Been wanting one for a long time so, I treated myself with a 61 reissue standard. I never thought neck dive was a huge deal. Maybe I’ve never played one with extreme issues.
Cool, congrats on scoring your SG. I never neck dive was a thing with an SG, either. Maybe it's limited to a certain year of variation? I don't know. Thanks for watching!
I have a 79 sg that I bought brand new...never noticed neck dive with it..I honestly wasn't aware of neck dive until the internet..😂
The Bigsby counters neck dive. Lots of weight in the back compared to a non-Bigsby. I have an SGS3. 3 pickups and one of those side-trems. No neck dive. I also have an SG with two pickups and no trem and it dives like a penguin.
That may be a factor, but I think it's a combination of things. I have several friends who own SG standards that reached out after I made this video. I played a couple without any trems, and had no neck dive at all. A couple others, to use your great phrase, dove like penguins, lol! We saw some variation in strap button placement, and the ones that dove were noticeably lighter, so we are thinking the lack of quality control on the wood is also a major factor. So many folks have reached with their stories, & the only conclusion I can reach is that it is about a 50/50 chance that you will find one with no dive, and I just got lucky with my two, lol. Thanks for watching & for sharing your experience!
@@ClarkColborn Thank you!
A 24 fret sg will have dive. I’ve had a few sg’s and while beautiful they all had dive. I also put locking tuners and string butler to help with tuning stability and quick string changes and that adds more weight to the headstock. I’ve tried all the dumb tricks- weights in the cavity, different straps, even moving the button to the horn. The only thing that really helps is a bigsby and a custom cut metal rear control cover. Gibson is run by idiots who won’t fix little things they’re known for. I’m a professional musician and I’ve owned close to 100 guitars over the years. You can’t beat Gibson sound but their are certainly better built out there. A prs 594 McCarty is a good alternative to a les Paul. If you can swap all the electronics from a lex Paul into a McCarty you got a beast. I’ve had all the knockoffs of Les Paul’s too and some are close; Eastman, Burny, etc but the wood is cheap, necks bend and warp easy… just not the same. I still haven’t found a good alternative to the sg though. Baum carve, ltd viper, etc… not the same
All good points. Interesting that all your SGs had dive & that neither of mine (nor the ones I've borrowed recently) do. You're right about Gibson shortcomings - I used to be a total Gibson snob, but when I was shopping for another guitar many years ago, I could not find a single Gibson I liked. I ended up with some other brands & my "snob" mindset left me. I don't have any real brand loyalty any more; I judge on a guitar-by-guitar basis. Thanks for watching & for your comment!
@@ClarkColborn The last sg I had was a 2016 supreme, the really nice red one with custom carves. It was beautiful and expensive. I couldn’t wait to get it. When I did get it, it was completely unplayable the dive was so bad. I kept it like a month and resold it. The 22 frets aren’t as bad with dive but I still had to move the button. Plus with a strap lock poking into it chest it’s almost a necessity to move it.
@@bryanp8010 don't you just hate when your anticipation is so high, then the guitar disappoints you? Back around 1980 I actually traded the SG Deluxe from this video in on a Les Paul branded SG from the early '60s. I was SO excited to get it back home. It played like a dream & sounded great through some little amp I had at the time. But when I got it to our first rehearsal, I discovered it would feedback horribly at anything approaching normal stage volume. It was stone stock & I couldn't bring myself to wax-pot the pickups or change them out, so I begged the retailer to work a deal with me to get my Deluxe back. Basically we just reversed the transaction at a minimal cost to me, but the experience left me disillusioned, but with a good story, lol.
I have a 2014 Gibson SG with no neck dive. I have a Epiphone SG that always has neck dive
Interesting! Does the Epi have the strap buttons in a slightly different position, I wonder? Or do you think it has more to do with the weight of the body? Thanks for watching, btw. :-)
@@ClarkColborn
They both have strap buttons. I use exactly the same strap for both guitars
Isn’t this a problem with other heavier weight guitars?
Yeah, kind of, but I think it has more to do with body style. Maybe, lol. I think Firebirds are notorious for neck dive, and maybe some others. Based on the comments on this video I think with SGs it varies wildly from guitar to guitar. I wish I could get all the different SGs commenters have mentioned into the same room so I could check things like strap button location & a few other things so we could figure out why some are bad & others have no problem. Thanks for watching!
Sit with it put it on your leg in a normal sitting position. Remove your hands. If it doesnt dive then its different to most SGs I have played (granted not all)
No neck dive
Awesome. Thanks for sharing. I wonder why so many people seem to think it's a common thing. Based on the comments so far it seems to be fairly rare. Thanks for watching!
I have an Iommi signature SG with neck dive from hell.
Just curious, do you think the position of the strap button is the culprit or is it something with the weight of the wood in the neck compared to the body? Thanks for watching!
The latter in this particular case. The strap button on this one is on the tip of the horn. It would be interesting to be able to go back to the production run and grab some examples from that particular batch to see if they have similar problems, or if that happens on a case by case basis.
@@Powerslave214 Yeah, that would be interesting. We need a Flux Capacitor!
No neck dive, 2007 sg standard
2008 Gibson SG Special - no neck dive
I've seen so many responses with both NO neck dive & noticeable neck dive that I have to think it really varies from guitar to guitar. Thanks for watching & commenting!
Oh there's neck dive on SG's, my tributes terrible
It's so weird how many different results everyone gets, I kind of wish I could get all your guys' SGs in a room at the same time & see what differences we could find. Thanks for watching!
Ah, no doubt he was referring to the Swedish Fireball. (es very nice)
That doesn't ring a bell, but maybe that's what he has. Thanks for watching!
He was talking about a Strandberg.
Dude, the reason for yours not having it, it's the model versions you have, the SG's do have in majority the neck dive and it is fucking annoying as hell.
It's not related to each person's experience, it's the model you get, they make it with different woods depending on the decade and the brand you get. Why do you think there are tons of videos of this issue out there? It's a problem with the design of it and the model you get because they make it with different woods. My first when I bought, I also had to addapt and I never heard of that problem untill I bought mine, then guess what? went to the internet and found tons of people complaining of the same issue, went to a friend's house and he explained to me, then he goes "get this and see", I put his SG on, no extra weights added no change in the strap and guess what, NO NECK DIVE, I went WTF is this? He goes, "they make with different woods, therefore they got different weights", then he said never buy on the internet, always buy on a store so you can test the weight of it and see if it has neck dive or not, it's literally a luck thing, so I sold mine, but still wanted to have one of these to my collection, found a guy selling his on the internet, went to his house and guess what? The wood of his was TOTALLY different, a lot heavier, bought his and that's the one I got now, no neck dive at all, same as yours, but it is an issue of the design of it, they should have realized this when they invented it and made the neck not so long as it is, you just got lucky with your models, and their woods, test all the ones you see out there and eventually you will find one that has it, believe me
69 serious neck dive no vibrola