EVERY* Steam Loco Wheel Arrangement (and why) in 20 minutes! | Railroad 101
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- Welcome back to Railroad 101 - the educational series where we look at all things that make up the railroad. This time we're looking at steam locomotive wheel arrangements - what they are, why they are, and probably 99% of the varieties that were in the USA back in the day.
Huge thanks to @DynamoProductions-trains for letting me use their footage, and to @guppybob and @WingsStrings for helping with the script, and to @WingsStrings especially for the great graphics!
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Hai Hyce, it's that comment you were looking for!
They did cut all the Duplexes up. Even the B&O's 4-4-4-4 didn't escape the torch.
Also
YOU FORGOT THE S2 6-8-6 DAMMIT
Jk love ya Mark
Great vid as always
Hopefully in the next decade we will have a T1 back, which will be exciting. Where she will run is another question entirely.
If you do some math on the S1, we have a 6-8*-6
the WHAT@@Hyce777
But were are building a new one! Hyce I sent you the images I have of the New T1 5550 under construction, she is 44% complete now
the 6-8-6 was different to the 6-4-4-6 on the pensy.@@Hyce777
The reason why steam engines ( and jackshaft electrics ) got leading trucks is mostly because power in those is delivered in pulses. Because of Newton's third, each pulse will be counteracted by reactive force which causes the locomotive to sway left and right. This is the reason why steam engines do so. The faster the locomotive goes, the more likely it is to derail because of this motion. Leading wheels, as name suggests, lead the locomotive onto curves.
Trailing wheels mostly support fireboxes, but in tank engines - for which the feature is that they can run the same both ways, the 'trailing' wheels become leading wheels when going forward.
Modern locomotives pretty much lost their leading/trailing wheels because electric motors are, in comparison, generating power smoothly.
Great add, my friend! Totally correct.
If the pulses of power being applied to the wheels are what causes swaying/instability, does that mean that geared locomotives are somewhat immune to that? Particularly Heislers, since the power is not only mechanically farther from the wheels, but is also centered in the locomotive and applied to the wheels on both sides at the same time?
Engines without leading trucks were also known as track spreaders without it being there to more gradually introduce the weight of the engine into the curve. Having a trailing wheel at the back meant the pull bar weight pulled down on to a non driving wheel and in the UK the Great Western in the UK used the 4-6-0 to the end whilst the more common Pacifics elsewhere were notorious slippers. The GWR had fine Welsh anthracite so a long narrow grate was fine. They tried out the Mallet articulation in South Africa and it fouled trackside infrastructure so the Garrett was chosen.
Isn't wheel profile something that can be taken into consideration to? Pivoting wheels can be fit more snugly and apply weight more directly downward, hence reducing the spreading affect when compared to the fixed wheels that have a more tapered/conical profile?
Trailing wheels on tank engines can also be needed to support the bunker. The BR Standard Class 2 had both tender and tank engine versions, the tender version were 2-6-0s but the tank engines required trailing wheels to support the bunker, so they had to be built as 2-6-2s.
I think the reason modern locomotives lost their leading/trailing wheels has more to do with moving the all the wheels on to trucks. The Whyte notation is never used for diesel and electric locomotives if they don't have the driving wheels mounted rigidly to the body.
I think it's easy to tell I like narrow gauge mountain railways because of my adoration of the 0-4-0 dance - I just think it's such a beautifully dynamic and quirky action to watch, it just screams "I'm working HARD" to me.
Read a quote from an engineer of 0-X-0 locos that "If she was hunting back and forth, that was fine- but if she started hunting up and down, you were in trouble."
That 0-3-0 from India was built in Patiala ( a monarch state in colonial India ). This is called Ewing system where a double flanged wheel bears most of the weight of the train and a supporting road wheel maintains the balance. It can take some stupidly sharp turns and it's relatively cheap to build.
Two of these systems were built, 1 was destroyed by flash flooding and the other one ( from Patiala ) still lives in the National Railway Museum in New Delhi and operates occasionally.
Great video as always, Hyce ❤
ERROR 4-0-4 SHAY not found
(Sorry dumb joke)
The shay technicly count as 0-4-4-0
@@FunAngelo2005wait 1 3-piston engine powers all the wheels. So it's an 0-X-0. Unless it's an articulated geared locomotive and God have mercy on your soul
Unless it's a 3 truck Shay then it would be a 0-4-4-4-0
It was good I liked it
I like how belpaire's B1A was mentioned in the thumbnail but also said it doesn't fit so he won't talk about it. I'm proud of the factory's we had in belgium just because of that.
It's an 0-4-2-2-0
@@datguymiller no, this would mean the unpowered axle is powered, it doesn't fit in that type of wheel arrangement system.
I wonder if parentheses could be worked into the Whyte system to denote unpowered wheels in the midst of powered ones.
@@oriontaylorI've seen people do that, calling it an 0-6(2)-0 but that doesn't tell you *where* the unpowered wheel goes. And you can't split the 6 up because it's about coupled drivers.
@@Hyce777 0-SI(2)X-0
Some fun facts from out east: the NYC Lines had several 0-8-8-0s they used as dedicated hump engines, which replaced some earlier 0-10-0s, while their Lake Shore & Michigan Southern subsidiary had a brief but torrid affair with 2-6-2s in the 1890s and 1900s for Prairies with extremely large drivers for their top passenger and mail trains. They tried out some high driver 4-6-0s but really didn’t like them and did not want to leave the Prairies.
Bob the Locomotive designer: Ahh yes 2-8-8-2 A pinnacle design.
Eric the Locomotive designer *AGGRESIVE SNORTING OF WHITE TALC* YESssssSSS!!!! 2-8-8-8-2 *SNORTS MORE TALC* EXCELLENT!
Hyce: why are you like this?
Eric: *Snorting in the afterlife* Wuh?
More like: ALL THE FUGGING POWER AND DRIVERS WE NEED!!!!!!!!!
And yet it was after the triplex that they learned they needed to stop. I don't know if it's just internet garbage of if they were really proposed, but I've seen designs/blueprints of a quadplex and a quinplex as far as how to arrange the drivers and they didn't look good. The fact the triplex failed means that Hyce got to keep his sanity that much more intact. I mean some of these designs I've seen have drive wheels on the tender (as in they realized the triplex was the most they could get on a chassis and that the only room left on what was technically the locomotive was the tender.)
More like the 2-8-8-8-8-2
Triplex has got absolutely awesome pulling power but its boiler is so small compared to it that it hardly runs 10 mph before losing pressure. Only good for shunting and it's too big to get into spur lines, thus sucks.
For a mainline locomotive you have to get a big firebox and for a shunter you need to be small enough to be flexible. Thus big boy is better for mainline and 0-4-0 0-6-0s are better for shunting.
@@steeljawX more like they learned to stop after the PRR and B&O duplex's stunts
Yooo the ultimate Hyce video of all time. If this doesn’t become Hyce’s most viewed video, I will make very loud cockatoo noises
Exactly my thoughts
Agreed
This.
15k views at only 8hrs in. I say it gonna do well lol
Is doing well but nowhere near most viewed yet. I hope you’re practicing! 😊
the "big chungus" but in russian had me lol
KOMRADE, HERE IN SOVETSKIY SOYUZ WE NOT SAY "big chungus", HERE IN SOVETSKIY SOYUZ WE SAY "БОЛЬШОЙ ПИЗДЕЦ (bol'shoy pizdets)"
Execute Order 66 likes.
So I wasnt the only one that saw that! harasho balshoy chungus!
I'll just note that there were a whole two classes of 2-10-10-2s. The ATSF ones were bad, but the Virginian Railway had a real good class of em for pulling Coal Drags.
"Darkness" from History in the Dark said that the Belgian Type 3 locomotive "clearly throws the Whyte notation completely out the window."
The *BELGIAN QUADRUPLEX LOCOMOTIVE*
5:10 love the transliteration of ‘chungus’ there. That made me laugh much louder than I should have at 1 am
Same
The 4-8-8-2: for when you don't wanna literally smoke your crews in tunnels
Yes but it's actually a 2-8-8-4 just spun on end.... Lol!
and oil fired to solve bringing the fuel lol@@Hyce777
Talking about the SP's cab-forwards? Something the Whyte notation doesn't cover is the location of the cylinders (or, if you prefer, the firebox). Very much a 2-8-8-4 running backwards :)
If I recall correctly, the 2-10-4 is one of the few wheel arrangements with a name specific to Canada. The Canadian Pacific called their T1s Selkirks, for a mountain range they operated over. Interestingly enough (at least to me) they were used in both freight and passenger service on the Laggan and Mountain subdivisions between Calgary and Revelstoke, and the later Selkirks - the T1bs and T1cs - were semi streamlined. I've been able to see all three preserved Selkirks and they're some of my favourite locomotives. I model the Canadian Pacific Laggan Sub in N Scale and would love to have a model of one, however I've only found brass Selkirks in HO scale that are far too expensive for a broke student like myself.
I won't say people are wrong for calling a 4-8-0 a Mastodon instead of a Twelve Wheeler, I'll just say there's a reason we call a 2-8-2 a Mikado/Mike and not a Calumet.
Also calling praries friend shaped is so true! My favorite Prarie at the moment is Argent Lumber Co. Number 5! She's not the most powerful but it looks like she could haul 2 cars at the CRRM and make the Onion Stack look good.
I feel you should have mentioned two things
1. There’s only two surviving operating Decopods in the US, Great Western (Strasburg) 90 and Frisco 1630
2. Baldwin’s 4-10-2 that was so overkill that no railroad wanted to keep it
I actually didn't realize that there were only the two decapods left. That's cool. 60000 was... Odd. This was not odd train video. Lol
@@Hyce777 yes 60000 was very odd
@@BaikieRyan The 60000 combined a 350 PSI water tube boiler with 3 cylinders, and a compound at that. The 3-cylinders at the front needed 4 wheels underneath because it was too much to put above a single axle. It was also too much innovation and it was a pain to service the thing, so nobody bought it.
Yes, the 4-10-2's were big and somewhat overkill. But they were also very effective suburban locomotives and actually helped many small towns grow and thrive because they brough main line freight volume that engines like the 2-8-2's couldn't deliver to lines that bigger engines like the cab-forwards, Northerns, or Texas locomotives couldn't run on. High plains and hilly towns like Prescott, AZ and San Luis Obispo, CA benefitted greatly from the 4-10-2's.
You forgot the SP and UP with their Overlanders for the UP and Southern Pacifics for the SP, Both were 4-10-2 classes, even a SP 4-10-2 is left!
Fs in chat for all the geared locos that got cut from the vid.
Completely understand why you had to, especially since Shay also couldn't put down the whiskey 😂
wait... aren't shays just 0-4-4-0s?
Or 0-4-4-4-0's. Remember there were 2 truck and 3 truck Shays, then you have the post-patent expiration Shays called the Willamette which were superheated Shay - Types
@@IAmAnonymyz Shay also made the 0-4-4-4-4-0's. A 4 truck engine that could pull the world
@@jameschase11 ah! The Western Maryland! hadnt seen THAT one until I looked it up. Bet that thing had ALL the Torque lol
Just wanted to say that I read somewhere that the NYC called the Mountains Mohawks because of the lines not being in the mountains, despite crossing the Appalachian chain (most prominently along the Mohawk River Valley between the Adirondacks and the Catskills)
Makes sense!
Yup, and also they advertised their line as the Water Level Route, so not having mountains was rather important to them. But they also gave most of their other locomotive classes unique names too.
Hey hey hey, you can't just skip the wheel arrangement made famous by the first mass-produced locomotive - the 4-2-0 or "Jervis", popularized by Norris of PA.
But I jest, fantastic video sir. Most informative, and to the point!
the utter madlads of a railway in london made a decapod tank loco to get a grant to them instead of an electric train co
I know the one; that's the Great Eastern Railway A55 class.
17:42. My FAVORITE wheel arrangement. Basically the ULTIMATE mixed traffic locomotive in my opinion. Not as big and strong as something like Big Boy or the Yellowstone's, or the GN R-2's and not as fast as something like a 4-8-4 or anything comparable. But it didn't need to be. The Challenger was THE locomotive that you turned to that when the load was inefficient for the bigger articulates, but was also too big for the Northerns, Texas's and anything else that would require double heading on the plateaus.
Edit: My favorite Challenger is the Northern Pacific Z-6 Class.
I swear a KSP-like game that let you play around with steam locomotive design would be a hit. All kinds of crazy configurations you can try, and almost as many explosions as rockets!
That would be so cool!
Kerbal Railroad Program when?
the T1 trust is in the process of building a brand new T1, the PRR madness will roll again!!
Just a bloke from Australia here to say we had 4-8-4 + 4-8-4 garrets down here.
One day, I'll fly over to see 6029...
One day...
In Czechia and Slovakia (formerly Czechoslovakia) we have a lovely system for creating the class of the loco based on the wheel arangement (although it cares only about live axles), max speed, axle loading called Kryšpín's system and it also contains a system for classing the tenders based on amount of water and coal it can haul (even though that's not translated to the English Wiki page). I think it's quite interesting system that tells you a lot about the Loco purely based on the class it is.
I feel like there's one wheel arrangement you didn't mention that deserves to be brought up: the 4-2-0. While no examples are particularly impressive looking and they were outdated by the 1860s, they were a key step in American locomotive designs. Prior designs were typically 2-2-0s or 0-4-0s based on British designs, but it was found that they had trouble navigating rough American track as opposed to the straighter and leveler track of Europe. The solution was to fit a 4-wheel truck in the place of the lead axle of a 2-2-0. Many American railroads would have at least one of them as their first engine.
Yes. The jervis type had an answer for the sharp curves.
I'm not sure how true this is, but I've been told that with Whyte notation, the suffix "t" specifically denotes the locomotive having side tanks, with other types of tanks having their own suffixes, such as saddle tanks being st, well tanks being wt, crane tanks being ct, rear/back tanks being rt, etc.
I've likewise seen st used for saddle tanks, this does track true with what I've read as well.
Whyte didn't address tank locomotives. The T, ST, WT are later affectations.
@@theimaginationstation1899 That makes sense
PT is also commonly used to denote pannier tanks.
@@oriontaylor And C is often used for camelbacks.
You forgot this: the Santa Fe railroad actually adored the 2-6-2 prairies, they really really loved 2-6-2s, in fact they have 15 surviving 2-6-2s today
Some fun facts about my home railroad, the Boston and Maine organized by wheel arrangement.
0-6-0s: 2 of the 4 B&M engines currently on display are old 0-6-0 switchers, restored after being bought back from a quarry in Westford Massachusetts.
2-6-0s: The B&M kept these in rural branch line service until the end of the steam era. In fact some parts of rural New Hampshire are called mogul country due to the use of these little engines for there local freights and commuter service. 1 has been preserved for display.
2-8-0s: The work horses of Boston & Maine freight. Despite their usefulness, many got scraped during the depression, a decision that lead the B&M to have a power shortage during the 2nd world war.
4-4-0s: The B&M kept these until the end of the steam era and modernized them as they saw fit. A common trend for the old B&M, they would start with an old bare bones locomotive and over time add on things like steel cabs, electric lights, piston valves, and even super heaters. 1 American has been preserved for display.
4-6-0s: They never really found their place on the B&M's rails. They were an awkward middle ground between light moguls, fast trailers (atlantics), and powerful consolidations. they didn't survive till the end of steam, all being scraped in by the late 30s.
2-8-2s: Huh, that's an odd wheel arrangement. The B&M never bought any of those, they leased some from the Erie railroad in the 40s, but when the lease expired they were returned and never seen again on B&M rails.
2-10-2s: The mudsuckers. The B&Ms first line of super powered steamers. The story goes that when under load they could generate so much suction in the boiler it would suck the mud out of the mud ring in the boiler and shoot it out the stack. Ok that may be a case of little engines, big lies (or big engines in this case) a more likely story is since they were the first stoker fired engines on the B&M, the name comes from the coal which would have to be small, dusty and lumpy, almost like mud in order to work with the stoker, though you have to admit the first story is funnier.
4-4-2s: Called trailers on the B&M as they were the first locomotives with trailing wheels to ply their rails. They were used to haul passenger trains, though there is some photographic evidence that when the Boston and Maine got desperate for power they were pressed into freight service as well.
4-6-2s: When these came around they displaced the older trailers in mainline passenger service, and became such a common sight in passenger service they were called the Budd cars of the steam era. Some of these engines had the distinction of being named by local school children, some examples are 3710 Peter Cooper, 3713 The Constitution, and my personal favorite 3718 Ye Salem Witch. Currently 3713 The Constitution is being restored to running condition in the Steamtown USA shops, though when that project will be completed, if ever, is unknown. Also another pacific, 3666, has the distinction of avoiding the B&M scraper by diving head first into a river. A wheel set that has since been dredged up has been preserved as a memorial to the incident and the rest of engine remains at the bottom of the river to this day.
4-8-2s: These were the last new steam locomotives bought by the Boston and Maine, and also had the distinction of being named by local school children. Again some examples 4100 Endurance, 4110 Calvin Coolidge, and 4115 Casey Jones.
2-8-4s: Ah the damn Limas, named after the company we got them all from. While by no means exclusive to the B&M limas, they are know for their massive externally mounted coffin feed water heaters, a look that some people hate, but I personally love, and it is a style that the B&M personally exported out west to the Santa Fe and Southern Pacific with the sale of many of their limas to those railroads. A common misconception about trailing trucks is that they are articulated independently from the rest of the locomotive, this, more often then not, is not the case. While at first glance this may seem like a good way to help negotiate curves, it causes more problems than it solves. Namely it causes the trailing truck to get pulled off the rails frequently, as well as putting a lot of extra stress on the firebox. Feel free to ask the Boston and Maine how we know.
2-6-6-2s: The B&M got these for helper service through the Hoosac tunnel. They were oil burners as it was thought that they would generate less fumes. They only lased a year however as the tunnel was electrified and last I checked no fumes is less the however much fumes an oil burner puts out. The 2-6-6-2s were sold to the Maine Central up north.
If you found this at all interesting please check out the Boston and Maine Historical Society for more information, you can find them right here on TH-cam. And if you found this overly long and boring well... blame Hyce thanks to watching his channel I got curious about my own area and found the B&M, learned about them, and felt the need to info dump all over you with the knowledge I gained about an old class 1 that tends to go under the radar. (Which considering its location is probably more of a blessing than a curse. Northeastern railroads that are noteworthy tend to get that way by failing epically.)
I freaking love your channel! Between you and Hyce, I get my choo-choo fix on the regular.
Always makes me happy to see the triplex get a mention/shoutout. It’s the “what if we took the idea even further just to see what it does” kind of energy that I thrive on.
The bit with the AA20 was true class. In Soviet Russia derailments find you!.
Learning how leading wheels function as an extra truck that moves the locomotive's pivot forwards and greatly improves stability was very cool!
Denver salt lake 2-6-6-0 gobbleeeesss!
This video was a fun one :)
The Riddles 2-10-0 Standards in the UK used non flanged wheels in the centre pair and reduced flanges on either side to allow them to cope with tight curves. The 9F was probably the best (and last) steam loco ever built in the UK. 1960, Evening Star.
theres also a 2-10-0 version of the austerity 8F.
Chinese class QJ (it's 2-10-2) also have blind (non flanged) wheel as the middle driving wheels.
There were a few 2-6-4 engines in America. They were tank engines used for suburban passenger service. The Reading had some. I think maybe Illinois Central did too
Hey, Mark! The Southern Pacific would like to know your location because they want to ask you why you didn't include the cab-forwards. I'm sure they just want to talk it out peacefully...
:P tell those guys that they're basically backwards 2-8-8-4's and that their lead and trailing trucks didn't fit the overall lesson I was teaching.... Lol!
I was about to say this, but then it occurred to me that most of the cab-forward AC's were basically a Yellowstone running in reverse.
@@Hyce777 The Whyte notation doesn't distinguish cylinder locations (or firebox) but maybe they should be called 2-8-8-4B's (for 'backwards' :)
So enjoyed this latest 101 episode Mark! Excellent descriptions of these wheel arrangements. I’ve been trying to figure out why some of these existed and, as always, you answered my questions. Thanks Professor for another fab class of learning and fun. As always looking forward to the next episode and cheers to you!
@Hyce: you of all damn people should know that separating railroaders from their alcohol is a really damn dangerous and downright suicidal task. Some people be like: "Don't tread on me." Railroaders be like: "don't touch my booze."
I was pretty excited about this video, and it was just as great as I’d hoped! Great video, Mark! Also, fun facts about wheel arrangements on the Illinois Central for anyone interested: The IC had Santa Fe’s that they called “Centrals” as well as having the only Hudson ever built for specifically freight. Lastly, the ICRR never upgraded to the northern types, but had some of the largest mountain types built on fast long distance freight.
18:46 they took it away from US ones but slept on Belgium; mad lads made a quadruplex over ther
Chicago Great Western: hello we'd like to haul the entire contents of our Olwein Iowa yard to Chicago in one train. We'd like use 10 or 12 F units but those aren't available yet what have you got?
Locomotive salesman slaps side of Texas class.
Loved the descriptions under the wheel arrangements but the triplex almost made me blow a mouthful of peach edition Red Bull through my nose.
Do you mean Oelwein? Iowa's German influence made spelling the names of some of our towns HELL.
My father worked UP and sometime in the 90s, either the Big Boy or the Challenger was coming through Poplar Bluff Mo. under its own steam. Dont know where it was going or where it had come from.
I was about 10 years old and dad had been working for UP for over a decade by the 90s and worked out of Poplar Bluff.
So he took me up to the see the Steam Engine and it was special. With dad working for UP we got to go up in the cab while it was stopped on the line and had a great tour of the engine inside and out.
Never ever forget that experience, the latter to the cab from a ten yearold's perspective was a mighty exciting climb.
I kind of wish you went into more detail on some of the arrangements, particularly the 4-12-2, and basically all the articulated and duplex drives
They're super neat, of course, but this was an overview, not a dive. :)
@@Hyce777 is there more of a deep dive planned at some point down the road? Maybe a 101 sort of video?
I respectfully request you take the time to discuss all "cursed" wheel arrangements you could find in the future when you get around to it, after seeing that weird example from Belgium I now wanna learn more about the wacky and weird classifications I've never seen or heard of before lol
It seems like in north America small articulated locomotives for curvy branchlines never really caught on. Saxony had class I TV in standard gauge and IV K in 750 mm gauge, both Meyer-type compound locomotives (B'B' or whyte 0-4-4-0) with the cylinders pointing to the middle. They were slow, had a limited size of firebox and kind of complex steam pipes to the cylinders, but were also very long living, some IV K (class built since 1892) are still in use at museum lines.
The motivation behind triplex-coupled locomotives, instead of just putting two or more locomotives in front of a train, was probably that they could be operated by one crew ... multiple traction with steam is a bit tricky but you can certainly say more about this.
There was one delightful little 2-4-4-2 used for west-coast logging, which managed to survive into preservation at the Niles Canyon Railway, but yeah, they really didn't catch on. Probably because our branchlines weren't that curvy; a small 2-8-0 was fine for almost all of them.
For what it's worth, I don't think either of the triplexes would have ever been on the front of a train; they were both intended as helpers in pusher service.
There is one example of a narrow gauge railroad of using an articulated locomotive to get around a curve. The Uintah railroad custom ordered a pair of 2-6-6-2 tank locomotives to get around a specific curve that was causing them trouble. Sadly neither were preserved.
Might have mentioned that the ALCO 4-6-4 Hudson's of the Milwaukee Road's "Hiawatha" were the fastest in-service steam locomotives ever built. They did daily runs, for years, keeping to a schedule that required an averaged speed of 100 mph between Chicago, IL and Saint Paul, MN.
13:33 close! They are pronounced "Berk-Shy-Er" and "Ka-Nah-Wah"
I've always pronounced it as Berk-Shur and Can-awh
There was one order of locomotives with no leading truck, but a trailing truck. The Union Railroad 0-10-2 A result of turntable restrictions. Had a tender booster too (which tender or trailing truck boosters didn't fit the Wyhte notation ether)
The Whyte notation is very limited system for describing steam locomotives. The UIC system can deal with oddball arrangements but is more complex. The Garretts are really easy to do in the Whyte notation, eg 4-6-2+2-6-4 (as I the photo you used), but what about Cramptons with a rigid frame with 2 or 3 carrying axles followed by single powered axle or the LNER's W1 with a 4-6-2-2 wheel arrangement with the last -2-2 being separate carrying axles?
When you have great educational items to talk about 15 min or 22 min eh we wouldn't have even noticed or did I care. Was very knowledgeable and fun to hear. You had me hooked from the beginning. Great job Hyce
The Whyte system is 124 years old, I did some quick math for that. Quick stupid fact, the P&R (Philadelphia & Reading) had 0-12-0's with tenders for pusher service that I believe were turned into 2-10-0's (don't quote me). Another fun thing about the 6-8-6 (the ONLY one that BLW(Baldwin Locomotive Works) made) was supposed to be a 4-8-4 but was turned into a 6-8-6 because of the heavy metals used to make the flipping thing
0:30 The Alls
Every time I hear Allegheny I recall the Allegheny railroad dispatcher that wanted a freight haul to tie down on an uphill grade because they were almost at their permitted hours of operation and what a cluster that entire conversation was.
Shay's locomotive is an 0-4-4-4-0 or 0-4-4-0
you forgot the class D 4 trucks, 0-4-4-4-4-0
Cries in 4-2-4 C.P. Huntington my beloved. Seriously though, awesome video as always
This is a tank locomotive. And since they were for shunting only 2 driving wheels ain't good. 2-4-2s or 0-6-0s are better.
I was sorta hoping to see a Garrett mention in this list. Felt a little sad to see those ones missed
They were mentioned! But you should understand what I said and why...
Hyce the T1 trust as I understand is bringing back a 4-4-4-4 with the replica that they are building of the Pennsylvania T1.
Another cool nugget of CPR steam history is they had the only articulated locomotives in Canada. 6 locomotives built in 3 different classes of a 0-6-6-0 wheel arrangement were tried in the rockies to handle the steep grades. the locomotives were built by Angus with their cylinders towards the middle of the loco, so the forward set would be running in reverse relative to the back one. Eventually, better road power and track realignment made these engines obsolete. They ended up being rebuilt as straight 2-10-0 switchers for transfer service.
For those not in the know, a transfer run in a big city like Montreal in the 30-40's they had smaller yards like Hochelaga near the port where basically whole trains would be filled with goods coming from ships or and other yard near the industrial district. That whole train would be pulled back to the main yard at Saint-Luc to be broken up and dispatched to various trains going different places. Conversely, you could get various grain car lots from various trains assembled into one consist heading for the port. None of these moves required speed, so a loco with lots of traction fit the bill!!
This is the reason you might see 0-10-4 or other weird wheel arrangements like that... They might just be the by-product of an old road locomotive being demoted to switching duties and the rebuild job ditched the lead truck.
The 0-6-6-0 in semi-officaly called the Angus.
We gonn' talk about 0-16-0?
I probably said this before but Belgium Quadraplex was so powerful it would sometimes break couplers on the freight cars.
Just a note that the Triplexes that got produced all made BUCKETS of tractive effort. I mean over 50k tons of tractive effort. But they were also limited to 10 to as little as 3 MPH. Pathetically pitifully slow. The Shay would beat it in a drag race light engine on flat ground. But they were unstoppable bank engines.
One UK locomotive that had 2-10-0 wheel configuration was No. 92220 _Evening Star_
8:25 - How does a 4 leading-wheel arrangement “inform” the frame about torque? I’m trying to wrap my head around it. Does this mean it transmits flex forces to the frame and can make the frame flex (ie “articulation via bending / flexing)?
Remember that there is a bit of tolerance in the gauge (both in the rails themselves and the spacing of the flanges ... and that's before we consider wear, curves, etc.).
A pony truck will help keep the front of the frame centered (and in turn, the drivers) on tangent tracks; and will likewise help pull the frame into curves.
Because the frame of the front truck is linked to the first set of driving wheels (with sideways movement) and has a virtual pivot point behind the first axle
@@ivovanzon164 I think you just described a Krauss-Helmholtz bogie which is found on locos with a 2-x-x (e.g. 2-6-4) wheel arrangement.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krauss-Helmholtz_bogie
A 4-wheel bogie at the front (e.g. on a 4-6-0) is usually a separate 4-wheel truck with no connection to the driving wheels. It transmits side load to the loco frame by various arrangements of springs or links hence helping to 'guide' the loco into curves.
The 2-8-4 was also the “Big Emma” on the L&N.
Skookum is probably my favorite articulated by far.
Mine are the Big Boys, Challengers, and 4-8-8-2 cab-forwards.
Thank you! I've been looking for this video for a couple of years now. I know a considerable amount about diesel, but found steam a bit overwhelming. This was a nice, concise resource.
I appreciated the inclusions of EBT #11 (Prairie) and #16 (Mikado).
I remember quite a while ago, I saw a magazine article about somebody who made an 0-2-0T engine for his model railroad.
How can it balance itself with only one axle?
15:08 Santa Fe called their first 8 Northerns, heavy mountains.
I also think with trailer wheels on the front and back will help balance for acelration or BRAKEING the front or back will flop forward or backwards to the ground
Regarding the 2-10-0's, the British Rail Standard 9F class were one of very few British locomotives to ever have 10 driven wheels (the only other design with 10 powered wheels was "Big Bertha", a unique locomotive whose solitary purpose in life was pushing trains up Lickey Incline, a long 1-in-37 gradient near Bromsgrove).
To get around the rigidity problems, there were no flanges on the centre driving wheels. Funnily enough, despite being designed for hauling freight, they were also exceptionally good at hauling expresses. They are regarded in the British trainspotting community as one of the best BR locomotives.
Also, for 4-6-2's, extremely common in British service. Flying Scotsman, Mallard, and Tornado all use this layout.
The weirdest steam locomotive I saw is a 2-2-2 OKa1-1 tank engine, which stands preserved at railroad museum in Warsaw, Poland. It's truly a weird looking one, with just one driving axle. These were manufactured for Latvian railways by Krupp as economical power for local trains and after the war two examples made their way to Poland, with the one bearing road number 1 being the only surviving example to date. The only use for this silly-looking tank engine was a non-revenue shuttle service for railroad workers between both ends of the Łazy marshalling yard until 1969. It's a miracle that this oddity wasn't immediately discarded after the war due to being such a unusual piece of equipment.
I know it's barely possible, but I wish I could see this "tonk engine" under its own power someday :D
More than 15 minutes? That's OK with mee as these presentations are always so interesting! Keep up the good work, pal😊
Some of these arrangments feel like they were generated by the same kind of AI that puts too many fingers on hands 😂
Tbh, I would say we classify these at 2:27 as 4_-2-_2, the underscores representing that they are connected
I was kinda hoping to see some singles in the video like the 2-2-0, 0-2-2, 4-2-0 and 6-2-0 Cramptons, 2-2-2, 4-2-2, 2-2-4, and 4-2-4 as they're some of my favorites (fan of early railroads)
What an excellent outline survey. The story in Europe was slightly different.
As someone that only knows (yet loves) US Steam from Train Simulator, this was not only very enlightening but also highly entertaining. subbed and will be checking out your other content. Greetz from the Netherlands
the PRR when NYC foamers complain about why there is a T1 new build but not a Niagara:
hello i live near the only narrow gauge railroad left in portugal (meter gauge)
and we have a 2-4-6-0t compound mallet
its unique and i love it
18:21 Forget where I read this, but it was either NP, WP, or GN (one of the ones in the Northwest) that actually considered building 4-8-8-4s after UP got the Big Boys.
I am going to admit I was not sure about you. And one day i watched this video and became a subscriber. You are the real deal. Nice work man!!!
This helped everything make way more sense. I feel way more informed.
Great video. As a Brit can you explain why the Pennsylvania railroad needed such large locomotives. I can understand why out west needed them, but Pennsylvania seems quite normal.
13:43 Beauuutiful Machine 😑👌*Edit* 16:12 Now those Pennsylvania ones were knarleyyy 🤘 LOVE to see *those* in HO Model RR
Hello, Mark (Hyce). I was introduced to your channel through one of my best friends, and I love seeing what you come up with (especially the 3/4 show). I was a restoration volunteer at the National Museum of Transportation in St. Louis, MO for several years. I hope that I might be able to meet you one day. Please let me know if you ever visit St. Louis. I'd thoroughly enjoy giving you a tour.
Anyway, there is one statement you stated in your video that isn't actually correct. The 2-8-0 Consolidation wasn't the most operated steam locomotive wheel arrangement in the U.S. That honor actually goes to the 4-4-0 American with over 25,000 locomotives built for the U.S. between 1836 and 1928. The 2-8-0 Consolidation does take 2nd place with over 23,000 built for the U.S. Now, I'm not sure which one (4-4-0 or 2-8-0) was built more worldwide. I haven't counted all of them.
Also, there were some wheel arrangement names you left out. 2-4-0 = Porter. 2-8-2 = Mike (in Canada). [Also, if my facts are right, not all railroads called the 2-8-2 "MacArthur" during WWII, but the B&O & UP most definitely did.] 2-10-2 = Central (IC). 4-10-2 = Overland (UP). 2-8-4 = Lima (IC & B&M). 2-10-4 = Colorado (CB&Q), Selkirk (CP). 4-8-4 = 1800 (ACL), General Service (SP during WWII), Statesman (RF&P), FEF (UP), Niágara (Mexico and maybe also Brazil). 2-6-6-6 = Blue Ridge (VGN). 2-8-8-2 = Chesapeake.
Lastly, there are 2 wheel arrangements you didn't comment on (excluding the 2-driver locomotives) that I would have liked to hear your commentary on. Those are: 0-10-2 Union & 0-8-8-0 Angus.
Hopefully, you'll see this and respond. I'd like to hear what you have to say. Keep doing what you are doing. You are fantastic and have great friends.
Very informative video! Not only did I learn about all these wheel configurations, but I also learned that some of the designers who made some of these probably had too much to drink….
You cannot talk about the Allegheny locomotive and metnion a class action labor lawsuit without explanation. It needs a video!
I think you should have mentioned the F suffix for fireless locomotives and the that the virginian had locomotives with two sets of ten coupled drive wheels that worked well. Also, Baltic refers specifically to the 4-6-4T in english rr jargon. Good video : )
I really wish one of the DMIR Yellowstone's would get restored to working order. I've gotten to see a couple of them here in MN (I think we have 3 or the 4 remaining locomotives in this state). Just like the Big Boy, they are amazing machines! Great video.
the european system is a bit more complicated, but which can indentify more different arrangments. can be used for steam, diesel and electric Locomotives
the British have/had some really weird locos too, case in point, the Beyer-Garratt 2-8-0+0-8-2, plus, it's also a narrow gauge engine too!
Honestly, I think the Beyer Garratt is one of our maddest designs, and it's one of my favourites. But it's interesting to note that while they were used across much of the empire to general success, especially in Africa and Australia, they didn't really take off in Britain itself.
I have an affinity for the look and era around the 2-4-2 Columbia. It was a transition look from the smaller 19th century engines to the the larger boilered ones of the 20th. The columbias & Atlantics had a different look. And they didn't stick around long.
oh, nice. I've been waiting very excitedly for a wheel and why.
Fun fact: the Canadian Pacific 4-4-4 F2-a Jubilee set the Canadian steam speed record of 112 mph. Uncommon wheel arrangement but they were fast, even faster than their own Hudsons which topped out around 100
13:32 Yeah, fwiw Kanawha is pronounced with accent on the second syllable (kə-NAW-ə) by people from where I've been in and around St Albans.
The need to balance weight distribution, operational costs, and maintenance costs led to many "interesting" development choices for steam locomotives and probably led to many of their designers finding comfort and inspiration in a bottle. Though with the Santa Fe they probably drank too much original formula Coca-Cola.
2-6-6-6s were awesome locomotives. As I recall, they had the highest per-axle torque of any steam locomotives built. If LIMA had built a 2-8-8-6 with the same torque per axle it would have been the most powerful locomotive ever built.
The Santa Fe definitely marched to the beat of their own drum. Those 3000 class 2-10-10-2s even had flexible boilers! Flexible. Boilers. 😞
However, the Virginian's Class AE 2-10-10-2s were power monsters that did their job quite well.
Interesting side note: The Sierra Railroad of California bought their 2-8-0 #28 the same time that the Yosemite Valley Railroad bought their 2-6-0 #29 in 1921. The #28 had 127,000 lbs. on the drivers and the #27 had 117,000 lbs. on the drivers, and their Tractive Effort was just about the same as well. The Sierra was built with too light of rail to support all that weight on just 6 drivers so they had to get an engine with 8 drivers.
Thanks hyce, now i know what wheel arrangements to use for the steam locos on my model railway 🚂
11:28 Interestingly enough, here in Indonesia's main railway museum in Ambarawa, They currently have two Esslingen 0-4-2RT for excursions and several more in static display like an 0-6-2 and 0-4-4-2T. Looking at old records, while not common, there were quite a few of them, and of that lot a fair number ar listed as rack locomotives.