Conlang Critic: Drsk
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ต.ค. 2024
- you probably thought the Artifexian collab was my big video this month, huh?
/ hbmmaster
seximal.net
/ hbmmaster
huge thanks to blootanery (@julia__child on Instagram) for providing the spoken sample for this episode quite literally last minute
A Case Against the Character:
isoraqathedh.gi...
![เปิดบ้าน พี่ตูน Bodyslam หลังใหม่คนแรก ที่ภูเก็ต l [Nickynachat]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/flFwcmyDQSk/mqdefault.jpg)
oof this poor guy personally sent you a whole reference grammar so you could make a video savagely dunking on his whole scene
what a world we live in
I would rather get this video, though. At least I know that my conlang is disliked.
To be fair, this conlang is very unrealistic for human, but not that bad. It's much easier to make a good naturalistic conlang. Unlike conlang critic, I'm actually hooked up with this conlang.
Users of this language obviously think in pairs, so they might have dual as their main personal pronoun. This could f.e. indicate unpaired speakers to be not considered equal to paired ones. This should be rather obviously noticed in their culture, some tattoo round the eyes or mouth? Some wedding band won't do, too easily removed.
Asjinga Akangka Drsk is an intelligent innovation, and its features make it express things in unique ways.
The thing is, it's publicity. I frequently don't agree with conlang critics judgements, but it's a nice way to see some stuff about conlangs I've often never heard of without trying to find and dive into reference grammars. Personally, I would love it if conlang critic reviewed my conlang.
Also, I thought this language sounded pretty cool even if it wasn't very realistic. (I'm still not convinced it isn't.) Realistic can be boring after a while, and pure enginlangs can't be embedded into a culture, unless your saying that's what they're engineered for. I call something like Drsk creative freedom.
The person who made Drsk has really nice handwriting.
1. what are you doing here of all places
2. im in a server with this guy and he does cool signs
Oh my god hi redapplefour. You have found me around one of my secondary interests. Congrats
Fellow dasher
TWOW, GD, SM63, and now Conlang Critic. Seems like you're everywhere.
What if _you're_ the one who's everwhere, weee?
Conlang Critic reading the consonant chart for Drsk sounds like a minecraft villager attempting to say the alphabet
Conlang Critic tërmi ti drečikansunant ru Drsk timäz giwa lifereči Minecrafti dinidemi lez ti alifabati.
Conlang Critic ankosatir fa fanchi refase Drske at'hasat as astiri Minecrafte farefat hasa fas ankonayesni
Criticus Conlinguarum tabulam consonantum Drski recitare auditur sicut paganus Minaecrafti alphabetum dicere conari.
Sivôrnêvô pavêllênsô nôssovin vendu gatige hôs Drsk imi, gellize şimmi stidisu dus Minecraftê, perissu şaêlla’ iglinsi.
Сritic (of) artificial-languages reads consonants' table for Drsk such-way, it sounds akin to vilager from Minecraft, trying to say alphabet.
XD
jan Misali when Artifexian chooses dozenal: yes of course its fine (but lets use something else)
jan Misali when Drsk uses dozenal: DISGUSTANG
"whats ya verdict?"
jan:
*electric chair*
I think what a language is *trying to be* influences jan’s critique more than anything
Conlang Critic you should make your own conlang and showcase it
^^
I believe he made this comment that he would in season 1, but no news on it since then. The hype is real!
^
BASE 6 NUMBER SYSTEM
Well from what I can gather it would be a 3 vowel i a o with 20 consonants that were arranged symmetrically, and it would of course be a OSV language that had Base 6 as a number system, it would be highly composite and generally pretty boring.
“This doesn’t have [insert linguistic feature here], except it actually has exactly that feature,” the language.
It's like a child's dream got beaten up by Georgians
isnt that all childrens dreams in georgia
Ah, so basically the dreams of a Georgian child
Woah you used the right it's
Gvprtskvni
As I lay my head on my pillow, I slept restfully until I heard a whispering in my ear: "gvprtskvni"
I'm morbidly curious how you would tear my language apart
Given that I'm drafting a language with no true vowels, only syllabic consonants (with tone!!), I agree.
@@melvinshaw7574 Damn, I'm just scared what he'll say about my spooky number system.
@@parmaxolotl Now I'm interested. I love unusual number systems.
@@TaiFerret I'll give you a taste of it without going into the whole logic behind it;
1-1
2-2
3-3
4-4
5-5
6-6
7-7
8-8
9-9
10-25
12-26
14-27
15-35
16-44
18-29/36
20-45
21-37
24-46
25-55
27-39
28-47
49-77
64-88
81-99
@@parmaxolotl that's pretty dank stuff right there.
Oh man, I recognize this guy! Isoraq used to hang out on the MSPA forums and talk about his worldbuilding stuff. Cool to see him again! I kind of missed this funky little weirdo and his extremely specific special interests and deeply quirky style.
Homestuck brother.
Aww that's kinda cute, it's always fun to run into someone you knew online in unexpected places like this
Yeah same
wait i'm sorry what is MSPA? i feel dumb xd and i looked it up and nothing i saw seems relevant
@@dankmemewannabe7692 ms paint adventures
Hmm. Have you heard of "role shift" in sign languages? That seems to be what Drsk is going for with its "totally not the first person" pronoun. When telling a story in most (all?) sign languages, you can shift role to inhabit a character; pronouns (indexing) shift with you.
TRiG (Ireland) that would make sense, like how in ASL you have to turn when talking about a different person
In my musing about conlang pronouns, I've wanted to use active/passive or, more accurately, actor/reactor, which would feel exactly like male and female pronouns except with no relationship to gender. So the person entering the scene and causing the action gets the actor pronoun, and the one responding to them gets the reactor pronoun, and there might be a third or background pronoun as someone less important than either of these roles.
What I've wondered is, if the actor/reactor roles somehow shifted during a scene, how would that play out in the pronouns? Like, suppose that it's more like who's being aggressive, and at first Bob is aggressive toward Jim, but then partway through the scene Jim smirks and points out a piece of info Bob didn't have, that puts Bob on the defensive, at which point Jim would get the aggressor pronouns. A bit like the "I am not left-handed" fight scene in The Princess Bride.
@@Arkylie Interesting concept, but it'll need workshopping to develop it in a way that's not confusing.
@@Arkylie i feel like that's almost the same as proximate-obviate systems, though probably extended onto first and second person
It's very similar to direct inverse systems as well, a type of alignment in which the most animate noun is the subject, while the object is always the least animate one
Mixing the two systems would probably give you exactly what you're describing (and it probably exists in some language)
Don't worry, we know that the real reason why you didn't like this language is because it uses base-12.
Yeah, i wish they'd just use decanbiheptatriquinary instead
"A Case Against the Character" is an interesting read. I can see some of what he is trying to say except I reject his notion of Worldstate Literature not having a main character. The difference is that instead of focusing on a person it focuses on the world as a whole or some subsection of it. The main character or rather the subject of a story is simply what the author has chosen to focus on. The reason why most stories focus on an individual is not because other forms of story aren't worth exploring but rather that is what we are, individuals. What I get the most from reading his case though is that he might be on the autism spectrum (or some similar thing) as some of it jives with what I have personally experienced in the past. This is especially true during the part about how character parameters are time dependent. He specifically writes
"Now the problem is that while most of the time "interaction" can be approximated by simple collisions and altering of parameters, I have been informed that with characters, this is not the case. This is frustrating, because now I have to work extra hard to understand the work, which is of course not very conducive to making enjoyment, especially when the individual character instance is not making it easy."
This feeling of not being able to understand how the character is developing and others just saying that it happens hits home quite hard. With something like Autism it is like everyone got a rulebook to life but your own has some pages ripped out of it. People just understand how to interact and why certain interactions cause certain things. This is very frustrating when you just don't have that innate knowledge. Of course I will state that is all speculation based on personal experience and is at best guesses with no grounding in actual facts beyond my having read the case. You don't have to 'have' something to get lost in human interaction and I was just comparing the feeling he described to my own personal experience.
big relate
Neat
Also as a side note that you probably know but some people reading this might not: Just because his problems with characters are likely the effect of autism, does not mean everyone with autism has these issues.
Like how my parents and help-persons(sorry English is not my native language) tried to convince me that I couldn't feel empathy, while I actually could. But of course I believed them, they're my parents, they can't lie.
@@Shashu_the_little_Voidling
I have autism & Im quite interested in characters, probably because Im interested in people
Oh! I'm really glad that I was not the only one who thought about it.
By the way, as someone who was able to reconstruct his pages and became hyper aware of these things as a result, I will tell you that a sizable majority of humans also do not know anything about their surroundings or trusted too much on their innate knowledge and didn't develop it so they are just bluffing their way through life, but society prizes confidence -- even though it's based on ignorance and not actually knowing a thing about their surroundings --. Of course there are actual socially intelligent people, but they're a minority.
TL;DR.: So, in short, don't worry...
... be happy!
So, these aliens are so unlike us, their literature is basically Victor Hugo's chapters of describing the sewers under Paris.
On languages not having vowels: The (natural) Salishan languages in northwestern USA have "phonemic vowels," but these vowels morphologically alternate with their respective consonants, a:ʔ, i:y, and u:w. They also have plenty of words without vowels, such as Nuxalk's famed xɬpʼχʷɬtʰɬpʰɬːskʷʰt͡sʼ. A friend of mine has actually done field research in Kwak'wala, and he supports/quite likes the no vowel analysis.
*i:j
The no vowel analysis reminds me of an analysis of Proto-Afroasiatic, and also makes me think of how PIE is analysed as only having *e, *ē, *o, *ō, with *a *i *u, as in Salishan, morphologically alternating with *h1, *y, *w.
hello mr critic i wanna say that i didnt know what a conlang is or anything about linguistics but i like this series a lot
idek how i found you but thanks
Conlangs are made up languages
I’ve figured that out at this point but thanks
Maybe you found him through his video "W"
you know what that mightve been it
@@Zenith2863 or "Hangman is a weird game"
The arguments raised with regards to character-driven stories baffle me for two reasons. Firstly, what struck me as the most obvious argument against character-driven stories seemingly wasn't even mentioned; namely that it usually ties in to "great man theory", the idea that change comes about solely due to the bespoke choices of specific individuals, which a lot of people have been critical of for various reasons. Secondly, the idea that there is no market for setting-driven stories is absurd - maybe it's not as big as character-driven stories, but books like Last and First Men are driven entirely by large-scale worldbuilding with little regard for individual characters.
I have never heard of “great man theory,” that sounds interesting. Edit: (sorry about formatting) I read a bit about it. Seems to be essentially a “nature or nurture” argument. Carlyle’s idea was basically that all of history was a series of great people, that were born (not made) to be great, that changed the world singlehandedly. Definitely not very scientifically accurate.
Honestly, the creator of Drsk’s dislike of character-focused stories doesn’t seem to be about characters at all, at least to me. It seems like he has trouble understanding people. This is most clear in the section where he discusses “representation.” It reads as if he doesn’t understand why people are drawn to characters (and characters that they relate to and identify with) in stories in the first place.
I totally understand the issues with this, but I still love this language! It's really unique and sounds super cool when spoken.
I can see everything wrong with it, and yet I can't help but love it. I almost want to go learn it, except for how difficult that would be.
You can learn Georgian as a base for Drsk if you want
Tbh I love how weird and unconventional Drsk is. It gives a sense of an ancient mountain nation combined with a lot of foreignity.
so georgian
That farmer+horse+stone story, kinda sounds like more of a description of rules and consequences, like a game design, than a more conventional linear story-telling format.
This channel got me into conlanging and it is my dream to have my language featured here
Yeah, but then he'll just shit all over it like he always does :(
I know, right? I gotta figure out most of my grammar and pretty much all of my lexicon but I hope I'll have the want to see it through and when I'm done, I hope Jan is still making videos. It would be a dream come true for him to review it.
Same. I was originally gonna do an artlang but after I sat down and started doing research so I could construct a convincing consonant inventory the practical side of me took over and it stopped being a mission to create a language for a fictional society and shifted to a mission to create the most accessible language not made with toki pona’s design philosophy.
Which I guess would theoretically make it theoretically as an interlang, but I’m doing it more for the fun of it rather than to provide a standard for international communication, so I’m still going to consider it an artlang.
what are your guys' conlangs called. do you chronicle them online anywhere . i must know
I think that the "worldstate fiction" is more supposed to be describing the state of a living or non living thing and it's implications, without them doing anything. It's just literature about the *state* of a thing. At least that's what the story in the end is like.
That basically sounds like journalism or textbooks, or maybe works like essays or even some poetry.
Like reading a wiki entry.
Also, as a toki pona learner, hearing that the name of the aliens are "kilis" made me imagine as if they were sentient plant beings.
sama
Dunno man, I liked this one. The guy tries to make something interesting.
I was going to sleep but I need to see your video first
I don't have a favorite conlang so you can't get facts wrong about my favorite conlang.
12:56
I don't quite understand his argument as to why the changes in characters over time is supposed to be harder to keep track of than the changes in places and societies over time.
I wish he'd do natlangs as well. Seeing Jan Misali's mind explode at what the fuck is going on in the Caucasus would blow my mind
It's a cool language! It's inspiring how much work he put into it.
They basically have a pronoun for OP, which might as well be a pronoun.
Lmao, true
Reminds me of role shift in sign languages.
lol
Original Poster is a title, but it also indirectly references a person, making it a pronoun
Oh man I never thought of OP as a pronoun!! That makes a lot of sense!!
It feels like Drsk was created after many, many calculated, man-made language reforms by a centralized authority which managed the impose it on the kilis
I recognize that name. Isoraķatheð has a track called “Maibasojen” on the Homestuck fan music compilation LOFAM. (Unlike other tracks on the album, it has no apparent connection to Homestuck even in the track art.) Isoraķatheð was probably on the MSPA Forums back in the day. Now that I think about it, Homestuck has enough fascinating world systems and weird devices that you could conceivably be a fan of it without really caring about the characters.
he's also responsible for the excellent A Beginner's Guide to Alternia ( isoraqathedh.github.io/Alternia/ ) which fully fleshes out the trolls' planet + moons! (i fully embrace the headcanon that the pink moon was spray-painted by the condesce to attract tourists :P)
Yep! I used to hang out on the MSPA forums a lot, back in the day, and Isoraq was absolutely a regular there. He's been on this particular style of weird worldbuilding and hyperfixation on alien street signage for years. I remember a fan-adventure he ran that was drawn entirely in a top-down schematic/blueprint style featuring weird lizardlike aliens; he helped contribute to a Lexicon game I ran once. It's super cool to run into him again!
Which begs the question why he didn't name the language prspt
I have to appreciate that despite Jan disliking a language, he still gives it the respect worthy of a work that had a significant amount of effort put into it.
It may be 11, but it's Drsk time!
This is absurd and amazing. This is one of the most technically impressive avant garde artistic works while also being supremely frustrating.
The spoken sample really changed my opinion... Drsk sounds so nice!
"...the word f, which is and, yes that's a verb"
_huh?_
This is definitely the video of your's I disagree with most, so pardon my lackluster vocab while I criticize your critique.
I don't get your point on the author/audience pronouns. I wouldn't say "I spoke to you all" if it were actually someone else speaking, and I wouldn't say it's a subject/object distinction either because the audience can still verb it up by *listening* to the author (by my understanding of the creator's description). Maybe if you had said that 'author' could be used for first or third person -and -*-also-*- used an agent/passive distinction- I would agree, but that still seems like something the creator might want to name as a trait if he's making a whole world that may have related languages with related traits.
It's weird to say that a more worldbuilding-centric culture is purely fanservice when it can be so useful to illustrate a much more collectivist culture, especially when the creator made the naming system reflect that as well. It's also weird that you criticize the creator for using a narrative story in a worldbuilding-centric culture, as if none of us use worldbuilding stories in a narrative-centric culture.
I'm not going to say that it wouldn't have been more interesting for him to have written worldbuilding-within-worldbuilding, but he doesn't seem to have defined *how* worldbuilding-centric it is. Why criticize him for using the less common type of story once other than to just point out a missed opportunity to showcase his culture's more common trends in literature?
I don't really see the point in discrediting a conlang for it's 'constructed-ness' when I haven't been given any info on how the aliens making it work and whether the in-universe history of the lang involves any purposeful construction.
Honestly it's just weird to me to bring up naturalism at all when a big advantage to writing languages for aliens is that you aren't as rescricted by the rules of human
Actually -as a suggestion for future videos- you should try to interview the conlangers you critique (maybe even have some as guests?) so you can directly ask them these questions and they can either make their case for why they want it that way or accept the critique. Obviously not easy if it's a conlang like Dothraki or Láadan, but for an episode like this it would've been pretty cool.
Séadhgha Val definetly true. And the author and audience distinction isn't just 1st and second person things. Someone else in the comments made the analogy of role shift in sign languages
The critique of worldstate literature isn't on the concept itself (as ConCrit said, it's literally worldbuilding), but that the author thinks a character-driven story is hard to follow, yet his prime example is a character-driven parable with a character who has to face things in the plot and whose motivations and actions shape the story and with whom very few will be able to identify with based on the author's rules.
breadspeak...
Breadspeak...
BreadSpeak...
BREADSPEAK
Hello yes I do speak bread
damn you know you're early for a conlang critic video when it's not captioned yet
when they said without vowels, I was expecting a ton of sylabic consonants
Tom Patterson I honestly want to make that now, but while also keeping a small simple inventory of common consonants.
I often see people creating something that they like to call new except it's the same concept of something that already exists, just trying to get a new label, not just in conlangs. I guess it's common to try to innovate, but it always looks like a rookie mistake.
Those terms aren't really vague. "Mary Sue" is a term for when a character is too perfect and boring, "realistic" is basically the anti-mary sue, which is not only relatable but makes it far easier to believe in the story (and therefore get invested) and 3 dimensional means not just having one personality trait.
You pulled up the consonant chart and my whole body felt exhausted
The thing I would find interesting about World State Literature is that it would basically just create a setting, and allow the reader/listener to imagine either themselves or others interacting with that world. It puts the onus of creating character, plot, and story on the consumer of the literature, or to just enjoy the imagined world for what it is.
Like you said, it is essentially just worldbuilding, but I don't think that's necessarily bad, I get a lot of enjoyment from reading about interesting world concepts, even without a particular plot or story
(5:00) Why not use diacritics?
sˢ > š, kᵏ > ǩ, tᵗ > ť, cᶜ > č, dᵈ > ď, gᵍ > ǧ, lˡ > ľ (the ˇ turns into ´ when combined with a tall letter)
the other superscript symbols can be other diacritics: mᵘ > m̈
, nᵘ > n̈
, ŋᵘ > ŋ̈
Looking at the chart, there are actually randomly two letters with diacritics: č and ć, so č would therefore have to be changed.
Ç?
I don't know why, but hearing you pronounce that laryngeal stop made my night.
I would love to see you critique Brithenig and/or Wenedyk, two conceptually similar and very interesting conlangs. Maybe something for season 4?
Wenedyk is very interesting in my eyes
Finally, a language that distinguishes /s/, /ts/, /θ/ and /tθ/ like one of my conlangs.
So many terminators you'd think Skynet took over.
Isoraķatheð Zorethan made up this very structured yet diverse and sublime language for his imagined universe so he legitimately gets a title [Epic] from me.
This really made me want to see you do any of M.A.R. Barker's languages (e.g. Tsolyáni).
It seems the argument against empathizing isn't actually about the enjoyment of the book itselef (which I'd say is really the most important, if not only important part) but that since morality is relative, how can you say which character is good or bad? *That's a problem that exists IRL too, not gonna change.*
How did you infer that? Isorak is clearly not talking about morality.
Could you do Newspeak from 1984 at some point? I'm not sure if there's enough information in the appendix to do a full episode, but if possible, I'd love to see it get onto the show.
Agreed
It's just controlled English though.
1:21 I seriously can’t get over how funny /v͡n/ sounds
1:03 When your printer jams
Maybe Ratsaw _was_ an abjab, when Drsk borrowed the writing system, and later in history they started writing the vowels explicitly.
Wow and I thought I made my languages and stuff unnecessarily complicated. I actually feel 100x better about mine. ALSO. Did anyone feel like that story was something from Soviet Russia?
Was that Dreams of A Generation in Votgil? Sang by Conlang Critic? My life is complete
DigiDragon i’m pretty sure he was singing in toki pona (although i could be wrong)
It's toki pona
It's in toki pona. I tried transcribing it:
tenpo mute la tu li wan poka
ni li nasin taso lon tenpo
sina olin pakala
mi tawa anpa taso sina awen pilin pona
And also translating:
Many times, we have been together
(I am not sure what the second line means)
You loved broken (possibly me)
I went down but you kept feeling good
Can somebody provide a better translation?
@@KSriram in the second line, it's lon, not wan, if u look at the original lyrics you can see he is trying to say lon poka, "side"
@@KSriram the second line is meant to say "that's how the sory goes" and the "anpa" part means "you're on your knees but you'll smile again"
Please review Thandian
^
thandian is worse than poliespo but poliespo is so much better than thandian that comparing the two at all is an insult to poliespo
Twocubes on tumblr has also expressed some “hey, wouldn’t fiction without individual characters be nice” stuff , which, while they combine that with treating math as a form of narrative literature (and I think they go too far in that. I think there are merely some analogies there), I have found somewhat sympathetic.
Treating math as a form of narrative litera--hey... wait, I've heard this before
Someone call 3blue1brown and the googology youtubers!
literally in tears at that number system
I see where the creator is coming from in terms of character. Sometimes authors get way too character-driven in their approach to stories, especially with a first person perspective and the character swallows the world.
9:37 That page actually details calculus as a noun declensions (or something). e.g. time-integral fast = far. space-derivative heavy = dense. Kinda neat!
Some examples I came up with:
population-derivative children = children per capita
person-integral infection = outbreak/pandemic
Although I guess it doesn't accomplish much that "per person" and "over time" couldn't.
As a disabled person, I kinda hate the implication that being disabled is somehow related to deteriorating.
Maybe disabled kilis literally deteriorate
That also caught my eye. It's possible that there's a real justification for that order, but either way I wish that it had been acknowledged by jan Misali, as he's usually quite perceptive of this type of issue.
since this is a conlang for a fictional alien species, the aliens could just be ableist as fuck
tbh, that bit passes pretty well as a natural language, they tend to be rather ableist more often than not
Well if part of a machine didn’t work people might describe it as “deteriorating” because well, it doesn’t perform its function anymore.
"...by a human-like species called kilis"
*laughs in toki pona*
i can feel the effort he puts in pronouncing all this stuff
Jeez man, do you actually _like_ any of these Conlangs?
He likes Toki pona
He likes toki pona and dothraki
He only likes Toki Pona (due to some bias it got the highest ranking for an Auxlang even though it's a philosophical language. He liked Dothraki too and fairly because it is very well thought out and planned
I was literally trying to think of a numbering system to troll/interest conlangers and it's *scary* how close it is to dursks numbering system
How about this: Name numbers based on their prime factorization. If prime, name based on which prime number they are
_Much better_
@@katakana1literally my idea
I cant understand how the digit is counted on base 2 but the numbering system is base 12
Pick a side dude
The Babylonians counted their digits according to base 10, but their numbering system was base 60.
thegreatbutterfly how do tho
@@thegreatbutterfly Yep, it's not that unusual. Most base 20 systems have sub base 10 or 5.
Indeed not that hard to understand.
What base are roman numerals in, for instance?
I
II
III
IV
V
VI
VII
IX
X
XII
....
XL
...
XC
...
CM...
I don't even strictly speaking know if this kind of numeric system can be said to have a 'base', since the whole point of a base is intertwined with positional numbering schemes.
10,000 has meaning only if you understand that it's in base 10.
But MDCXVI doesn't rely on knowing the 'base' of the numeric system, only what each of the symbols means, and how they interact.
In that regard the system described for this language is... Odd, to say the least.
But that can happen over time if you start with one system and then shift to using a different one, but maintain minor aspects of how the old system functioned around.
@@tonyhakston536 The numerals in Babylonian are constructed using 'rods" that mean "1" and "wedges" that mean "10." You place these together to make numerals up to 59. When you hit 60, you have to move over one unit, just like when you hit 10 in decimal.
You can see how even though the number base is 60, within each numeral there's a sub base of 10 that helps you figure out what numeral you're looking at.
And how can you feel an emotion in a book inherintly devoid of it?
i seriously struggle to comprehend how this guys bizarre 'g' looks so foreign to me, yet somehow absolutely legible and obvious. maybe because it looks like a mirrored cursive hebrew g (ג) but then it's just a cursive hebrew z (ז) !
I don't get why you'd go to sleep right now, it's just about 7 am :smrk:
*smrk
@@MikeTheMerc Ah, yes
I wonder what would he say if he was given a real language phonology table but was told it's a conlang. Would he say it's unrealistic?
Probably lol
Yeah
Someone just needs to copy a real language's documentations. Come up with a new funky name for a verb and for the language, then ask jan to review it :P
That representation part in that "Case against the character" essay is... telling.
Yeah, it's not very subtle what the author is really talking about. Yikes.
yeah, that part was a bit squicky for me personally. Big oof.
i might look like an idiot for saying this but i also don't pay attention very well. what were they talking about?
can someone explain
@@leveret9148
Probably referring to this section of the essay:
"There is one thing in particular where things come to a head, and that is the projection.
"More commonly called 'representation', the idea is that there are certain humans out there who would find life greatly improved if they see themselves, or something they can see being as themselves, in some story or another. Not only is that utterly pathetic - which isn't a problem as everyone's pathetic at some point in the phase space of life or another - it also sparks a surfeit of arguments over what groups should be included or not. This is a problem, because now there are arguments over things I have no time for. These kinds of arguments also go against my terminal value that life in real life should have a muted, if any, influence in life in fiction, which is commonly called separation between fiction and reality.
"So the solution therefore is that characters should be eliminated. This is sure to settle arguments about fairness in characters and bickering about which characters are good, bad, or disallowed."
"I have invented 'Drsk', a Language with no vocals!"
Poles and Georgians: "Meh..."
1:40 bro put every single consonant he could think of in the language
I would expect worldstate literature to be about events on a scale above individuals. For example, Country A attacked country B and conquered X territory and imposed evil laws there.
Then again I know nothing of drsk.
The auþor/audience distinction actually makes sense. I have no way of knowing whether *you* watch Dora the Explorer, now I could also say "one" instead, but it's not like everyone would learn a lot from Dora.
I feel like I FELL into this consonant table
Sometimes the things that happen in a book seem completely random, just to push the plot along. This isn't interesting. *But other times, things seem to happen like in real life, or the unlikely things that happen are grounded in how humans interact.* But books that have outlandish things happen are good too.
I don't even know if this true conlang but could you enochian
someone: says the words "base 12"
jan misali: how dare you!
jan misali: And I took that personally
To the last argument, there's nothing wrong with a book being interesting. Without that, in either a character or world book, it would be *boring by definition.* It's totally okay for a book to be outlandish, but some books (especially literary fiction) are also able to create realistic, interesting, grounded phenomenon!
This is the most interesting video I've seen from you, mostly just because of the language itself.
I’m a bit excited
it may be because im not a linguist, but i am ✨SO CONFUSED JESUS CHRIST ✨
Oh, you now how speek the palatalized phonems!
Oh, yes, here it is. The video including the person casing that got me thinking of a "first-and-a-half"-person case.
There are two common situations that arise which together would beget a person marking between first and second.
First, a writer, the true "I", writes things to a second person, "you".
Then, a reader reads the writing to a target audience.
The writer is the first person, the audience is the second person, but who is the reader?
In a situation where there is higher literacy, this situation probably will not arise, but imagine if it did. That's where Drsk's "author and audience are not necessary the first and second person pronouns" note comes from. And I think it's neat. I've been considering creating a 1.5-person case for my own language, though that would... heh... drastically increase the number of pronouns...
I'm curious about phonoruns as a concept, but they seem to me like they'd be better suited to paralinguistic vocables like singing or ululating
Ah, yes, Georgian on steroids.
i know this is an old video and i have absolutely no merit regarding languages whatsoever but WOW this language sounds SUPER COOL & the nuances seem super alien which is a good thing!!!! big ups to isorakathedh!!!!
Hmm. The spoken sample actually sounds neat, except almost every vowel is [i] XD
Advanced Greek
Phonoruns sound a lot like stress timing.
I love the way it sounds. Super alien.
Why does this language have an actual trillion consonants?
Would you ever consider doing a manufactured dialect which isn’t quite a full conlang? Specifically, I would absolutely love to see a video like this on Anthony Burgess’s Nadsat from A Clockwork Orange, which is a great, weird British slang that pulls from cockney rhyming slang and Russian, with built-in political implications about the world of its novel. I always thought it was incredibly convincing and interesting
When reading the excerpts on why the creator of this language doesn't like characters, it gives me the impression that he is either on the autism spectrum or some kind of Vulcan-like alien.
I know Conlang critic is dead, but it'd be so cool if you took a look at the Conlang Phyrexian, from the card game Magic: The Gathering
I received this in my recommendations. I have no idea what conlangs or any of this is. I’m so confused and lost I have no idea what’s going on