When everyone is ready to Jump Down on Jeff Bezos aka Lex Luther's Throat and sew or send him to Hell, I want Hasbro to jump in with em Class Actions as well for using their trademark for labeling Gods! Then if a Justice League crossover is to ever happen, I want to see Optimus Fight Lex 1 on 1 at some point where they make a mocking to Amazon!
The first The time traveler The keeper The blacksmith The Minicon The scientists The combiner The beast The shifter The progenitor The liar The fallen The 13th
I'd always thought that Prime was a title. I remember reading a story once that Optimus never wanted to be a"leader" of any kind. He was a librarian and happy... Until the matrix of leadership chose him. I always thought that was cool, like the mantal of leadership forced onto the unwilling hero. Optimus was humble.
Joshua Pratt I always enjoyed that angle too. The IDW COMICS from the early 2000s have Prime be gifted the Matrix after he nearly falls in battle trying to stop Megatron, I believe
in the Original G1 cartoon, Orion was a dockside worker as opposed to a file clerk. but yes, humble beginnings do seem to go hand in hand with Optimus.
You're probably thinking of Dreamwave's War Within, and he wasn't exactly kindly at first there, He didn't want a damn thing to do with the war, but he was humble
In Transformers Prime, Ratchet explains at some point that “on Cybertron no one isn't born for greatness, you have to earn it” in a context that involves Optimus backstory. I like that one the best , when it comes to the Prime title. That Primus has his eye out for someone special is a good idea too, but I imagine that special one still has to prove himself in some way. As in, he has to show he’s not only worthy, but that he is willing to take up on the responsibility being a Prime means.
1 problem I see with this. What does being a Prime mean? If Optimus is already the things you expect from a prime, why bother attaching the title? If you think about it, becoming the equivalent of a prime through your merit without being one rather then being made one because of your merit seems a lot more impressive to look up to, because it is easier to aspire becoming like your hero rather then earning the same title as your hero.
Justin Montana I agree with you! The primes should be a form of god (at least the original primes) I don’t personally consider sentinel and Optimus to be “ Gods”
i think im more in line with the story that there were the original 13 primes and after their age a prime was considered a rank appointed by the council as sort of an honour to the original primes until optimus became the true prime and the last one at that
I can see it working if say after the thirteen had their reign and fallen into history, the title of Prime just became a rank to the cybertronians, only for Prime to actually mean something again when Optimus was bestowed the Matrix
@@basedpota We will probably never see that explored, tho. I wish Bay became a producer 5 onwards so someone can tell the stories better, although I would miss his style of shooting action (nostalgia? idk).
Prime works well as both a military rank and title of messainic value. It makes sense that Cybertronians would take the esteemed title of their very first forbearers and bestow it on their shifting leaders. But then there would be the aspect of true Primes, chosen by the Matrix/All Spark itself like Optimus who are more than the coopted rank.
I’ve been a Transformers Fan since I was young, but to be honest, I only know the basic stuff of TF, not the bigger stuff. Now today, I’m now learning new stuff, things I never knew about TF and I’m glad I did now
In regards to whether the Thirteenth/Arisen is actually Optimus and the limited story potential it creates when restricting who can be a Prime, I prefer to split the difference by drawing from some other people's interpretations. So when the original Thirteen were creating the Well of All Sparks, each of them put a bit of their essence/power into it, giving the Allspark all the required coding/patterns to make pretty much any transformer with any combination of traits, like a female combiner beast minicon or whatever. But when it came for the Thirteenth to make his contribution, he realized it'd be incomplete/not what would be best, so he gave all of himself to the Allspark to make it truly infinite or living or perfect or whatever. This sacrifice did remove the uniting cornerstone of the Primes, causing them to fall to infighting, but it also imbued each new life created (so basically all transformers) with the potential/possibility to be a Prime. Thus, the Matrix of Leadership CAN work for any Cybertronian, but that bot will have to be emotionally/spiritually worthy to actually access its powers/wisdom. Optimus's only claim to fame is that Orion Pax's personality core/spark were the spitting image of the Thirteenth, so that's why the Matrix accepted him so readily and powered him up so much. So basically, the comic is correct that Primes are 'born, not made', but in the sense that it's a personal journey of self discovery and understanding that makes a Prime, not a magical gift of power. This also makes the other non-Thirteen Primes like Rodimus, Sentinel, and Nova as 'legitimate' Primes, since they all were accepted by the Matrix of Leadership in varying degrees. Their only issue is how their own faults, history, and coding limited their grasp/control of the Matrix, which weakened the power and wisdom it could provide. This also solves the issue of whether Optimus actually EARNED the title or not- since pretty much any Cybertronian can access the powers of the Matrix to some degree, Optimus is viewed as the last 'True Prime' because he can access all of it.
I think it would make more sense for the 13th to merge with the matrix. And whoever he viewed as worthy of being a Prime he would Transform them into one.
@@rahmalol3527 when he received the Matrix of Leadership, Optimus regained his original identity. I think the reason why he didn't reveal his true identity to anyone is because he wants his true identity to be kept secret.
@@tylergranger2159 No, in the Aligned Continuity for which the Thirteen Primes origin story was created, Orion lost the memories of his previous life as a Prime when he chose to be reborn as one of the ordinary Transformers. The original Primes who did not leave Cybertron, such as Alpha Trion, hid their true identities and pretended to be an ordinary Transformer, but only Orion is technically really one. The Matrix restored his form and power, but I'm not sure he regained the memories of his previous life.
"That's just Prime" "Or what's left of him, anyway." I'm not a fan of the idea that Optimus was the 13th Prime. I preferred the idea that a Prime could be forged. That the Matrix of Leadership could bestow a Cybertronian with the divine mandate of a Prime and that it could also be taken away.
I prefer this idea too In my Personal Canon Optimus is not the reincarnation of the Thirteenth Prime(Even because the thirteent Prime to be created in my Personal Canon was Liege Maximo the Prime Of Lies or the Great Betrayer) but he is The Arisen/The Choosen One/Whatever you wanna call it
I love the fact that Optimus is the 13th Prime and apparently he was nown as the Prime of Wisdom and Knowledge. I might be wrong but I like how it turns out.
Or the 14th prime as seen in Transformers one he was replaced as the 13th by Zeta Prime plus I like the worthiness thing better and Optimus originally being a simple humble bot
i like the idea of the primes being this mystical thing, but not optimus being this deified chosen one. primes or born not made is such a dumb concept to me. it can still be a cool mystical title of importance, it should just be that optimus EARNED that title. through his actions and leaderships, not because he's reincarnated robot jesus because hasbro thinks that's the only wya to make optimus cool. even though it's safe to say most people already optimus was cool int he first place.
I'd like a compromise like with the Nerevarine in The Elder Scrolls III For the uninitiated, it is heavily implied in Morrowind that the player was not born as Nerevar's reincarnation, but by actively fulfilling the prophecy through seemingly unrelated events (Such as becoming immortal by undergoing experimental treatment for a dangerous plague contracted whilst on a recon mission).
The best definition to optimus and megatron is: Both are descendents of the primes... and hot rod Both are "chosen ones" in their plots Hot Rod is the last prime like IDW put and there is no other question about that.
I for one like the idea of the Primes being nothing more than normal Cybertronians who were slowly revered and immortalized in mythology as history progressed.
"One is not simply born into greatness. Rather, one must earn it" - Ratchet This is why I like how TFP explained Prime-hood. It applied a certain set of characteristics amongst those chosen to be Primes - humility, patience, kindness, a mild temper, and the capacity to be peaceable as far as possible (which is surprisingly comparable to the Fruits of the Spirit mentioned in the Bible). That's what made Optimus the perfect candidate in comparison to the self appointed Primes before him. See, his beginning was as humble as he was. He didn't believe himself worthy of the honor, even after having already proved himself. Even Alpha Trion thought him worthy. But the same thing that made Optimus a good choice caused Megatron to fall short of it. While he had humble beginnings, he himself was far from humble and believed he was owed the right to be a Prime. He was a tragic character and his reasoning was solid, which is why many followed his words. But his pride caused him to slip through the cracks of his good intent and, as we all know, pride is before a fall.
@@basedpota I think he meant how despite being a true descendant of the original 13 Primes, his actions earned him the Prime title by the Council, though he officially gets it after Primus bestows the Matrix of Leadership onto him. Also if not mistaken, Optimus Prime told Hot Shot that he would be the next Prime and that the Matrix would choose him next when he nearly died, it's later confirmed when Optimus meets the 13th in the All Spark.
@@basedpota Its stated by Unicron that he's a descendant of Primus, so I guess you're right since the 13th would be Primus' descendent, not a descendant of the Primes. I do think that at some point he was stated to be descended from them but I can't remember so it probably didn't happen.
Yeah I know. I am a holy man when it comes to the Covenant of Primus. Though to be honest Optimus being one of the Thirteen is really stupid. Still wish they would reuse Omega Prime's name though.
yeah, I'd prefer if the 13th was autonomous maximus as the first titan. I mean, war for and fall of were both aligned continuity games. we've got the first minicon, first beastformer, first girl, and metroplex and trypticon both exist.
While I get why Hasbro wants to increase the significance of the "Prime" title, I have trouble swallowing the whole "Optimus Prime is the reincarnated Chosen One" thing that a lot of continuities play up, especially when he's a main character. I just feel like it's really hard to relate to him as a character when he's literal robot Jesus who can rarely do wrong. That said, I am interested in the "13 Tribes" angle that the comics seem to be heading into. To me, I think that lends itself to a level of storytelling and "realism" than the whole "13 Original Transformers" angle. I mean, I can understand wanting to know every single piece of lore about a universe and if it's true or not, but should we really know more about the mythical prehistory origins of Transformers than we know about our own human race? Should mythology in the Transformers universe fit the same role of our real-world mythology and religion, where cybertronians have a variety of religious mythologies with contradicting "origin stories?"
Yeah I feel the same for the Aligned Optimus Prime, Luckly that isn't the case with every Optimus and before the "Shroud" happened, His spot seemed to be filled by The Last Autobot/Autonomous Maximus. I wonder if they would ever do Primon or Guardian Prime as members of the Thirteen in newer stories.
In some continuities, Primon actually existed before The Thirteen and was suppose to be a leader of the Transformers but Liege Maximo killed him before the others could know of Primon's existence.
I agree. I just don't like the idea at all. I like the idea of Optimus Prime being a descendant but not directly one of the original. It's a hard pill to swallow. Probably as hard as Arcee's IDW origin, Galvatron not being Megatron, and Megatron becomming an Autobot.
TBH I think They tried pulling a superman or a cap america with him and I for one am perfectly fine with that. Optimus isn't supposed to be relate able. That's why they give you bumble bee. Optimus is just supposed to give you pure badass moments in my mind :D
I actually much prefer the title of Prime being a rank that's handed down to each leader/matrix bearer rather than some mystical role that only Optimus was destined to claim. I think it's more interesting that Optimus was just a regular bot who rose through the ranks to become a great leader rather than it was all destined through mysticism. Somewhat takes the choice out of Optimus hands and makes his heroic efforts seem lesser if it was destined no matter what. Like lazy fanfic writing.
The Transformers: War for Cybertron video game did (what I thought was) a good job of amalgamating the two, with the title of Prime (leader) being bestowed upon by the Autobot High Council but made definitive by Primus bestowing upon him the Matrix of Leadership.
rodster6 if you want a great version check war for cybertron. While the role is a rank like a captain, Optimus is notable for being bestowed the role by Primus himself for his bravery and heroics as opposed to being given due to military rank
There's one Primus almost never talks about... Prime-Prime, the first Transformer to leave Primus and the thirteen on his own accord... he's a bit weird.
The 13th prime actually was named Optimus prime and when Optimus(reborn as Orion) was elected to become the next prime by the council, it was Alpha Trion who gave him the name Optimus prime, in honor of who he was before he was reborn. Though he would understand the meaning behind the name until primus gave him the matrix of leadership which restored both him and his memories
@@uria3679 it all depends on the weight of the word and how it is earned and fought. Any Prime needs to be named and have a significance to the story. If they're a background character or elite moot then yeah it gets diluted in meaning.
He's a Prime (Rodimus), He's a Prime (Nemesis), You're a Prime (Optimus), I'm a Prime! (Primal) Are there anymore Primes I should know about?!? Sentinel Prime: *Energony Goodness!*
The concept of 13 Primes is similar to many parts of the Norse pantheon, with Leige Maximal looking and acting a lot like Loki. Digimon took a similar approach in it's Royal Knights, also having 13 members, but just like with the Primes, the 13th member was lost and obscured. This is because, if mirroring the Norse pantheon, the 13th member is "The Hermit" who appears to be an old man who travels, though his true identity is actually Odin himself. In this parallel, Optimus likely *IS* the 13th prime reborn and he *may even know it, but refuses to admit it.* Such is the way of the Hermit.
I don’t know if I really like Optimus being one of the original 13 primes or not and this is the order of primes I think 1.prima the original transformer created by primus 2.the other 12 original primes that make the 13 original primes 3.nova prime 4.sentinel prime 5.Optimus prime
I prefer it when the 13th Prime is just someone like Logos or Autonomous Maximus or something. I don’t like the idea of Optimus being some mythical being who’s just destined for greatness, as it reinforces the “divine right of kings.” I prefer when Optimus was always just ordinary Orion, who _earns_ the Matrix and rises up to lead his people in a time of crisis.
Fully agree with you on that one. I'm glad that the Transformers One movie goes with this approach. Without giving away too many spoilers on how he does this, Orion Pax isn't given the Matrix of Leadership from birthright, but rather from proving himself in the eyes of Primus through his actions.
@@ericm.8110 yeah, but this was back when the primes, primus and unicron were still considered multiversal singularities, meaning they were the same characters
While I do understand why people don't like the mystical Primes, I do think that idea works if only for Aligned (which was more mystical anyways) and on the 13th matter eh, Aligned can be resurrected Optimus but for everything else I would prefer it to be different and keep the 13/Optimus thing exclusive to Aligned, though I did really like Animated with the ranks (though imagine if TFA Sentinel Prime met Aligned Optimus Prime, it would be hilarious)
I don't see why the ideas necessarily have to be mutually exclusive. I've operated under the impression that there used to be multiple Primes, but their numbers began to dwindle with the end of Cybertron's Golden Age until there was only one left.
The Primes are such an interesting topic, I really enjoyed they’re portrayal in Prime and the IDW. I wouldn’t be opposed to a movie exploring their history somewhere down the road. Nice video👍
I like the entire concept of Prime as a whole, regardless of how it is interpreted. Do you think you can explore other characters that had Prime in their name like Nova Prime or Nominus Prime?
Absolutely love this series. I got back to Transformers after many events, especially the Bay's atrocities. I really hope you will make an episode on aligned continuity. I have a hard time understanding storyline within toyverse. For example why characters never having such abilities become Combiners (such as Optimus Prime in Combiner wars) or Headmaste... ehm Titanmasters, like Soundwave or Galvatron. Or maybe I'm just looking too deep into this and Hasbro just wants to force gimmicks into well-known characters instead of creating new ones.
Honestly, Optimus Prime shouldn't be apart of the Thirteen. It really cheapens Optimus as a character and some of the ideas that were being built up a while back of the term Autobot being something more then just "the good guy faction." There was a point when they tried to make the term Autobot mean something which was intended to be idealized by Optimus which is why he was a true Prime. Also, I don't know about anyone else, but I like that Prime is both a Military and somewhat "Mystical" position, With Dreamwave and early IDW taking a position that a Prime is a military leader, but also is a kind of religious leader if he's accepted by the Matrix. It also made it feel as if any bot could be a Prime... but making Optimus one of the Thirteen cheapens it because then he was always a Prime. Also the Aligned Continuity is the only timeline where Optimus, Quintus and Amalgolomos Prime are apart of the Thirteen. Namely they are replaced with Autonomous Maximus (or The Last Autobot), Logos Prime (or Soundblaster from Galaxy Force), and Epistemus. Which those are still apart of the Thirteen in all continuities outside of the Aligned Continuity.
I agree with you about how making optimus one of the thirteen cheapens his charecter. THere is more you can do with him being a prime outside of the thirteen. Like maybe he is a new generation of primes.
I have a question: I noticed there is a contradiction between series on the origin of Transformers as a race, with multiple sources saying different things. First, the Transformers were said to be created by Quintessons, but according to this story Quintus Prime, a Transformer himself, was the creator of Quintessons instead. And another source I heard says that Alpha Trion was actually an Autobot that was created by the Quintessons himself, which wouldn't be the case if he was part of the same generation as Quintus Prime. Kinda sounds like a very confusing case of chicken and egg paradoxes.
Actually, the reason why there are multiple characters with convoy in their name in the Japanese version of Cybertron, is because it signifies that they are the leaders of their own planets and transformers just like how Optimus prime is the leader of Cybertron. Though in the Japanese exclusive beast wars series, the reason they are convoy and look like him is so they could honor Optimus. It should also noted that in The Headmaster anime, after Cybertron was destroyed, Rodimus left into deep space in order to find a new home for Cybertron not before he appointed Cerebros/Fortress Maximus as the new leader of the Autobots, but not a Prime. Since, Rodimus said that the Age of his generation is over, there’s no need for a prime, making him the last prime. Since then, all leaders of the Autobots were called Supreme Commander by their subordinates.
@Nicholas Joseph more like Emperor of Destruction, as it is the Decepticon and Predacon equivalent to the Autobot’s rank of Supreme Commander. Though I believe Megatron(BW) lost that title to Galvatron (BW II) and later Magmatron (BW Neo) held the title of Emperor of Destruction.
Xeno the Wanderer that’s because it was Vector Prime’s first introduction as well as the concept of Primus being Unicron’s brother and before the concept of the 13 primes. Also before the concept of Primes that we know today, in the Japanese Continuities, Primes were called Convoy.
@@kevintran5901 I'm aware, I'm saying that one of the few if not only instances of a prime appearing in japanese media it's one of the original 13 making the name prime significantly more rare in japanese media
So the Prime title is like the Darth title in Star Wars. Started just as a name but changed into a title. I always thought it would have been cool if in some continuity Grimlock became Autobot leader and took the title "Tyranus Prime."
Plot twist The Uniter is actully Bumblebee who doesn't have his memories and Optimus is kinda trying to get him to gain his power and memories back so he can become a True Prime so Bumblebee can unite the Desepticon's and Autobots
I'm surprised you didn't talk about Maccadom. The fact that Fun Publications (whose list of 13 primes I much prefer), finally confirmed that he was one of the 13 was so satisfying.
Well, he's more of the "running gag" of the Thirteen. He was in that one panel from Fun Pub (seen in this video at 6:20), but he's not on their actual list of Thirteen names (Prima, Vector, Megatronus, Nexus, Logos, Micronus, Maximo, Solus, Epistimus, Autonomus, Solomus, Onyx, and Alchemist). "Ask Vector Prime" made the gag that it was rumoured he was Alchemist, but I was a contributor to AVP and I was the guy who actually came up with that, which was only intended to be a jokey furtheration of the rumours about Maccadam, not to be read as confirmation he actually was him.
I actually liked the idea of the Transformers Animated movie and the Bayverse version of Primes where whoever's worthy to hold the Matrix of Leadership shall grant the power/title of Prime.
Note however, that the primes from the aligned continuity are not the same as the multiversal-entity primes from all the other continuities. Overall though, nice video!👍
I do not believe Optimus Prime would see himself as a god of anything however many do look up to him as a mentor to all and a good friend of all now I have the guide book it covers many I'd like to have a guide book which explains all transformers even females that exist somewhere on another planet
Micronus... Is "good" idea but I'm still preffer to the original idea that Mini-cons were created by Unicron himself, unless Micronus has business with the great chaos bringer. PS: The 13nd is Takanuva.
In the Marvel continuity the minicons (or at least some of them) where creations of Autonamus Maximus. He even created a minicon leader named Modus Prime.
I quite like the idea of prime being a military rank, or at least a title that is earned. Not so keen on divine birthright chosen one stuff, just in general. Idk, I feel it is more interesting to earn that title, that status as a hero, because you chose to do the right thing, to work hard, to rise to the challenge of leadership, than earning the title because you were always destined to.
I remeber the good old of the Transaformers when being the Supreme Commander of the Autobots was all that matter to be the leader and main heroe of the Transformers, thats what allow the creation of such legendary characters as Fortress Maximus and Star Saber
So we got: Prima, Solus Prime, Sentinel/Zeta Prime, Vector Prime, Liege Maximo, Onyx Prime, Alpha Trion, Alchemist Prime, Megatronus, Optimus Prime, Nexus Prime, Logos Prime, Autonomous Prime (the 13) And the Newer ones such as Nominus, Nova, and Rodimus
Sentinel is not one of ogs . Prima,vector,alpha trion,solus,alchemist ,onyx,nexus,amalgumus,quintesse,leige maximo,megatronus and optimus are the og 13.
I don't mind Optimus being the reincarnated 13th prime. It really doesen't mean he's "Robot Jesus and can do no wrong". The Primes are more like Adam and Eve (and Steve, and Alan and Carl...) they are not really gods themselves, just the first cybertronians. Also, at least 3 of them screwed up big, one's a lying schemer, one a murderer, and one is at least fumbling enough to create the evil quintessons. So yes, the "13th" can still make mistakes. Being a Prime makes you stronger and more connected with Primus, not infallible.
They should have made the 13th prime literally be the Matrix with the idea that by supporting the current host by upgrading their body and being supportive in times of need being the 13ths will and legacy.
vector prime has always been my favorite of them all, his design,his vehicle mode, his abilities, everything. when i watched the episode of when he died trying to help the autobots go back in time, i cried my eyes out, he's been my favorite since the first time i saw him.
It's always kind of annoyed me that Hasbro just decided to dump the remaining members of the Thirteen on us during the Aligned continuity. I found it far more interesting seeing them slowly teased out over the years as they had been up to that point. Oh well, it's a fun concept either way.
Yeah I didn't really like IDW's incarnation, because it really felt like a slap in the face after all the build up across other continuities. If power of the primes actually delivered and gave us a story about the 13, I wouldn't feel the way I do about the IDW primes. It would've been an interesting subversion, but as it is it's just the 2nd part to the anti-climactic end of all the prime build.
@@emiliencorbillon187 Yeah in prime we got glimpses of what the primes looked like and even some of their names. Like it was all building up to power of the primes, but all we got was Megatronus and Solus. They didn't even mention the others. And here comes IDW to kick us while we're down.
I ended up making a headcanon for my Display Shelf based partially on the fact that Soundblaster got reused as a Prime in some cases. In short, Soundwave is a reincarnation of Micronus Prime, and that version of him is represented as the Titans Return figure, since it's a tiny robot that can power up bigger ones, and Soundwave's forehead without the helmet has a tiny Minicon port-esque gem. Logically he could not deny this upon realizing it, but at the same time he still *despised* the idea of bearing the title of something he swore to fight against. And so, he sought resolution. He forced someone's hand as they held the Star Saber, a weapon known for sundering Nexus Prime. He made it so their only option would be to attack him. To sunder him. And he put every ounce of his Spark on the line to keep the two ideas of himself separate in his head as he did it. In the end, Soundwave was no more. There was Micronus Prime, the progenitor of the Minicons. And Soundblaster, the truest distillation of the cold, calculating loyalist. And a bot who refused to be anyone but himself.
The way i interpret the whole Optimus was the 13th prime in another life is like this. So the 13th prime jumps into the well of All sparks igniting it and merging with it. None of the other primes did that one after another died and their consciousness returned to primus. That's why in certain instances you can still talk to them. However the 13th spark was in the well and got reborn. The way i see it the spark is equivalent to the heart and basically the inherent power of a transformer. On to my point who says orion was the first incarnation, for all intense und purposes there could have been the thousands. Yes he has the inherent power of the 13th but he doesn't know that, he was a fucking librarian. What qualified him for being a prime and embracing the legacy was his decision of fighting despite thinking that he was powerless and it was this noble action that unlocked his potential. I think even after becoming a prime he did not believe this. This is however what makes him worthy, fighting despite feeling like a nobody.
I really like the "Arisen" title for the 13th Prime since he's basically the opposite of the Fallen, as well as having been born twice. If it turns out to be Optimus he's also the most consistently slain and then resurrected Cybertronian of the whole bunch, it happens in every universe, like clockwork!
"The Thirteenth and final Prime is a figure of mystery, his name also forgotten like Megatronus's. In the Aligned continuity, he was the uniter who brought his brothers and sisters together as one.But when the Age of Prime's came to an end, the Thirteenth Prime chose to give up his life to ignite the Well of All Sparks, the font from which all Cybertronian life was subsequently birthed... only to emerge from the well reincarnated, without his memories of his pasty life as Orion Pax, who later become... Optimus Prime. IDW continuity is less clear on the matter; there, the Thirteenth is known only as 'The Arisen,' and while many have come to BELIEVE that Optimus Prime is this legendary figure, Optimus himself doesn't believe in such things." "And for the sake of completeness, alternate members featured in more obscure stories have included Logos Prime, also known as Soundblaster, from Transformers: Cybertron, Autonomous Maximus, aka the Last Autobot from the Marvel Comic, and various members of the Guiding Hand, the pantheon of gods introduced in IDW's comic. Just this week IDW even introduced Septimus Prime, a Fourteenth Prime who was slain by Megatronus during the consolidation of the Thirteen Tribes. But going forward, it seems unlikely that these extra characters will be revisited; Hasbro has their list of Thirteen, each about to be immortalized as 'Prime Master' action figures in the Power of the Primes' toyline... EXCEPT for that Mysterious Thirteenth Prime, who will be represented instead by the Matrix itself!" "Beyond that, exactly what spin the toyline and tie-in cartoon will choose to put on the Primes' story, we'll just have to wait and see! And you know what?" "That's just Prime." All this information that I tediously took the time to write down made me SMILE and SQUEAL cause in the past, I remember hearing that Optimus was some sort of reincarnation of SOMETHING, but never knew it was the Thirteenth Prime! And with the Matrix of Leadership being interpreted as the Thirteenth Prime instead of Optimus Prime being the reincarnated Thirteenth Prime somewhere also reminds me of what I think of the Matrix in some fan stories I made, making the Matrix a Transformer sort of character, like a sort of one of a kind Minicon or something, or even a little Predacon/Dragon that was a sort of creator to Primus, or something that aided Primus or comforted him, similar to other stories with him being born as a human, finding Orion, and, well, lots of other weird shenanigans that I thought up. Learned so much from this simple video!
The idea that Optimus is really the 13th reincarnation does make sense if you follow the Transformers: Prime continuity. At the end of the series Optimus sacrifices himself to reignite the well of allsparks which could show and give hint to him being the 13th as the 13th is told to have done the same.
i always assumed there were multiple maticies of leadership, and having one made you a prime. And maybe a spark could somehow create a new matrix, maybe. Nothing stops everyone from being a prime, but it's incredibly unlikely since you can't be a leader while acting as someone's subordinate.
So, it's through this video that I learn that the third part of the Combiner Wars/Titans Return toyline saga is Power of the Primes. I was excited to see that Hot Rod is getting a new toy, but... man, I'm let down: it's kinda ugly, just to accomodate the Matrix/Prime Master... This video was fascinating, though!
Could you please do a basics video on Megatronus/The Fallen. It seems like his story changes so much from telling to telling, and as a concept he really has only recently been introduced in to the lore. I think it would bee an interesting episode.
Personally I like to think that the 13th Prime is instead Alpha Trion and he was created by Primus to record their journeys for history and that one of the 13 is a triple changer with his descendants being the triple changers we all know and love today like Astrotrain, Blitzwing and Springer. Also for amalgamous Prime or whatever to instead be replaced by the ancestor of the "mother-bots" for lack of a better term lol such as Soundwave and Blaster and for the reason they can transform is because Primus foresaw the war on earth in a vision or something and gave them that ability while creating them
So, going off of what the term "prime" is as a concept, I want to try and list out all the contributions to the cybertronian race the primes have made, and a few that might not have been thought of before. First, there are the primes that contributed new species of transformer aside from typical cybertronians. There's Micronus with the minicons, Onyx with the beast-formers, and Quintus with the Quintessons. Then there are the primes that contributed to the abilities that all transformers have or can get. Amalgamous prime with the ability of transformation and Nexus prime with the ability to combine. I like to think that Megatronus gave cybertronians the ability to generate weapons from their body parts as he is the first warrior, though that's just a headcanon so take it for what you will. Then there are the primes who contributed to the intellectual parts of cybertronians. There's Alchemist prime, who may have inspired the first scientists of cybertron. Then there was Alpha Trion, who likely brought about scholars and historians to document the history and culture of cybertron's people. Then there's Liege Maximo, who sparked evil and deception among cybertronians. Then there's Prima, who likely gave cybertronians the power of leadership, either by beginning the legacy of the matrix, or by using that legacy to inspire leadership in others, or much more likely both. Then there's Solus prime, who gave the cybertronians female counterparts. Last but not least would be vector prime, who likely gave cybertronians the technology to space travel and possibly even time travel (though he may have kept the latter under a tighter lock and key than the former). Hopefully I didnt miss anything. If I did, let me know. Edited for a typo at the beginning, and for forgetting to add the time traveling prime.
I notice just now afterall these years an new animation error in the OG movie. When Optimus takes the matrix of leadership out of his chest, that there is an second not glowing one still in his chest. Look at 0:39 and you will see it to
I’ve always thought an animated show or movie about the Thirteen Primes would be great. Like, it would explore on the Thirteen Primes relationship with each other and showcase their battle against Unicron. The first movie/season would be going against Unicron and the second movie/season would show the falling out of the Thirteen Primes
Chris, love what you did with this episode, but I feel like I need to say something from what I read inn the book, "The Covenant of Primus". The 13th Prime was given the name but had Alpha Trion change it so that he would remain antonymous after he reincarnated himself with the late Onyx Prime and Micronus who didn't want to leave his best friend.
I wish there was this much complex lore for the shows and movies, give comic writers a say in the storylines and plots of the movies and shows and there will be a definite increase in quality
![PASULOL รามเกียรติ์ ตอนที่ 4 นนทกพบรัก [Ramakien Ep.4: Nonthok in love]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tMUQgmZzf_A/mqdefault.jpg)
![กี่หมื่นฟ้า | Your Sky Series EP.1 [1/4]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/vLGjxFL6U_I/mqdefault.jpg)
He may not be the wisest, the bravest, or the mightiest and far from the noblest. But Amazon Prime makes the most $$$ bar none
Lol good one
Hahahaha
Lmao, good one
When everyone is ready to Jump Down on Jeff Bezos aka Lex Luther's Throat and sew or send him to Hell, I want Hasbro to jump in with em Class Actions as well for using their trademark for labeling Gods! Then if a Justice League crossover is to ever happen, I want to see Optimus Fight Lex 1 on 1 at some point where they make a mocking to Amazon!
😂😂😂
The first
The time traveler
The keeper
The blacksmith
The Minicon
The scientists
The combiner
The beast
The shifter
The progenitor
The liar
The fallen
The 13th
The OP
heh, fallem.
heh, fist.
The minicon is funny because its like the girl what does that tell you about them thats just what it is just minicon
*First*
So you are telling me Optimus is basically robot Jesus?
Optimus Prime no your greater you he gave his life to forgive the worlds sins you gave your to give the world LIFE!
Guilhermo Martins hell yeah😄😄😄😄😎😎😎😎😊👍🏻!!!
No. Jesus is basically human Optimus Prime.
Batman Drinks Pepsi yep that too😄😄😄😄😎😎😎😎😊👍🏻!!!
I mean... Yeah that's basically it
I'd always thought that Prime was a title. I remember reading a story once that Optimus never wanted to be a"leader" of any kind. He was a librarian and happy... Until the matrix of leadership chose him.
I always thought that was cool, like the mantal of leadership forced onto the unwilling hero. Optimus was humble.
Joshua Pratt I always enjoyed that angle too. The IDW COMICS from the early 2000s have Prime be gifted the Matrix after he nearly falls in battle trying to stop Megatron, I believe
Oh yeah, I do really enjoy that view of the story as well. I like the thought of a humble leader!
in the Original G1 cartoon, Orion was a dockside worker as opposed to a file clerk. but yes, humble beginnings do seem to go hand in hand with Optimus.
You're probably thinking of Dreamwave's War Within, and he wasn't exactly kindly at first there, He didn't want a damn thing to do with the war, but he was humble
I love how Optimus disagrees that he’s the last prime, considering his look at Primus and Cybertronian religion, our humble leader. Till all are one
Orion Pax: "Are you certain I am worthy?"
Jack Darby: "You have no idea."
Imagine how disappointed Micronus must of been. The other 12 were masters of the cosmos while Micronus was basically the god of short people
God of short people, kicker of shins
Add microbus to any prime he also has mental abilities
I mean he did have a power to enhance another prime's powers if that's any consolation
Some gods have it better than others
@@morganpriest7726 every shins folly
In Transformers Prime, Ratchet explains at some point that “on Cybertron no one isn't born for greatness, you have to earn it” in a context that involves Optimus backstory. I like that one the best , when it comes to the Prime title. That Primus has his eye out for someone special is a good idea too, but I imagine that special one still has to prove himself in some way. As in, he has to show he’s not only worthy, but that he is willing to take up on the responsibility being a Prime means.
1 problem I see with this. What does being a Prime mean? If Optimus is already the things you expect from a prime, why bother attaching the title?
If you think about it, becoming the equivalent of a prime through your merit without being one rather then being made one because of your merit seems a lot more impressive to look up to, because it is easier to aspire becoming like your hero rather then earning the same title as your hero.
He was already a reincarnate of the 13th
I don't mind Prime being a rank, personally, although I do like the Primes being a form of God to the Cybertronians
Justin Montana I agree with you! The primes should be a form of god (at least the original primes) I don’t personally consider sentinel and Optimus to be “ Gods”
I (kinda) see the Primes as angels.
Justin Montana makes since he is the only author to fuck up every and any decipticon in existence
i think im more in line with the story that there were the original 13 primes and after their age a prime was considered a rank appointed by the council as sort of an honour to the original primes until optimus became the true prime and the last one at that
I can see it working if say after the thirteen had their reign and fallen into history, the title of Prime just became a rank to the cybertronians, only for Prime to actually mean something again when Optimus was bestowed the Matrix
So Optimus Prime is Robo Jesus?
Yes
@@kaelmckenzie4821 relax
technically no. he's just a reincarnation of a historical figure. jesus is... well, jesus.
@@maverickhunterstupidiocy7779 Ok so more like a Robo Dalai Lama. Got it.
britshell we already knew that
I always felt sorry for megatronus, he’s definitely one of the more tragic characters in tf lore
Imagine if Megatronus resisted Liege Maximo tricks and didn't kill Solus
@@dreademperor2094 Imagine if Anakin resisted Sheev Palpatine tricks and didn't kill Padmé -_-
@@ultraplayz785 sarcasm?
@@dreademperor2094 sorta kinda
@@ultraplayz785 ok
"You think you were born? You were built! And they want you back."
Keith Pillsbury Lockdown be like: "Miss me with that bullshit!" LMAO.
Lockdown, nice
Me when I heard that line: lock down shut the fuck up
What about the hatchlings in rotf when Megatron arrived at cybertron
@@basedpota We will probably never see that explored, tho. I wish Bay became a producer 5 onwards so someone can tell the stories better, although I would miss his style of shooting action (nostalgia? idk).
Quintus Prime: *I created Quintessons as allies of Cybertronians.*
Quintessons: *lol no*
Prime works well as both a military rank and title of messainic value. It makes sense that Cybertronians would take the esteemed title of their very first forbearers and bestow it on their shifting leaders. But then there would be the aspect of true Primes, chosen by the Matrix/All Spark itself like Optimus who are more than the coopted rank.
I’ve been a Transformers Fan since I was young, but to be honest, I only know the basic stuff of TF, not the bigger stuff. Now today, I’m now learning new stuff, things I never knew about TF and I’m glad I did now
In regards to whether the Thirteenth/Arisen is actually Optimus and the limited story potential it creates when restricting who can be a Prime, I prefer to split the difference by drawing from some other people's interpretations.
So when the original Thirteen were creating the Well of All Sparks, each of them put a bit of their essence/power into it, giving the Allspark all the required coding/patterns to make pretty much any transformer with any combination of traits, like a female combiner beast minicon or whatever. But when it came for the Thirteenth to make his contribution, he realized it'd be incomplete/not what would be best, so he gave all of himself to the Allspark to make it truly infinite or living or perfect or whatever. This sacrifice did remove the uniting cornerstone of the Primes, causing them to fall to infighting, but it also imbued each new life created (so basically all transformers) with the potential/possibility to be a Prime. Thus, the Matrix of Leadership CAN work for any Cybertronian, but that bot will have to be emotionally/spiritually worthy to actually access its powers/wisdom. Optimus's only claim to fame is that Orion Pax's personality core/spark were the spitting image of the Thirteenth, so that's why the Matrix accepted him so readily and powered him up so much.
So basically, the comic is correct that Primes are 'born, not made', but in the sense that it's a personal journey of self discovery and understanding that makes a Prime, not a magical gift of power. This also makes the other non-Thirteen Primes like Rodimus, Sentinel, and Nova as 'legitimate' Primes, since they all were accepted by the Matrix of Leadership in varying degrees. Their only issue is how their own faults, history, and coding limited their grasp/control of the Matrix, which weakened the power and wisdom it could provide. This also solves the issue of whether Optimus actually EARNED the title or not- since pretty much any Cybertronian can access the powers of the Matrix to some degree, Optimus is viewed as the last 'True Prime' because he can access all of it.
I think it would make more sense for the 13th to merge with the matrix. And whoever he viewed as worthy of being a Prime he would Transform them into one.
Optimus prime: the last prime
Basically, Optimus was the 13th prime who was reincarnated as Orian and then became Optimus Prime again.
desty yep
so it's
13th prime => orion => optimus prime.
hmm 2X reincarnation. does optimus aware his past life?
Orion Pax -> Optimus Prime
@@rahmalol3527 when he received the Matrix of Leadership, Optimus regained his original identity. I think the reason why he didn't reveal his true identity to anyone is because he wants his true identity to be kept secret.
@@tylergranger2159 No, in the Aligned Continuity for which the Thirteen Primes origin story was created, Orion lost the memories of his previous life as a Prime when he chose to be reborn as one of the ordinary Transformers. The original Primes who did not leave Cybertron, such as Alpha Trion, hid their true identities and pretended to be an ordinary Transformer, but only Orion is technically really one. The Matrix restored his form and power, but I'm not sure he regained the memories of his previous life.
"That's just Prime"
"Or what's left of him, anyway."
I'm not a fan of the idea that Optimus was the 13th Prime. I preferred the idea that a Prime could be forged. That the Matrix of Leadership could bestow a Cybertronian with the divine mandate of a Prime and that it could also be taken away.
NOVA PRIME HE IS REALLY WAY BETTER THEN OPTIMUS PRIME AND NEXUS PRIME
I like that idea better too
I prefer this idea too
In my Personal Canon Optimus is not the reincarnation of the Thirteenth Prime(Even because the thirteent Prime to be created in my Personal Canon was Liege Maximo the Prime Of Lies or the Great Betrayer) but he is The Arisen/The Choosen One/Whatever you wanna call it
@@fabianrocha9924 Liege Maximo is already one of the Primes in the Aligned continuity
@@PartigradeCannon I know that
I love the fact that Optimus is the 13th Prime and apparently he was nown as the Prime of Wisdom and Knowledge. I might be wrong but I like how it turns out.
Same
I agree
Or the 14th prime as seen in Transformers one he was replaced as the 13th by Zeta Prime plus I like the worthiness thing better and Optimus originally being a simple humble bot
i like the idea of the primes being this mystical thing, but not optimus being this deified chosen one. primes or born not made is such a dumb concept to me. it can still be a cool mystical title of importance, it should just be that optimus EARNED that title. through his actions and leaderships, not because he's reincarnated robot jesus because hasbro thinks that's the only wya to make optimus cool. even though it's safe to say most people already optimus was cool int he first place.
But in transformers prime, the story from the medic states that the council choose him because of his words
I'd like a compromise like with the Nerevarine in The Elder Scrolls III
For the uninitiated, it is heavily implied in Morrowind that the player was not born as Nerevar's reincarnation, but by actively fulfilling the prophecy through seemingly unrelated events (Such as becoming immortal by undergoing experimental treatment for a dangerous plague contracted whilst on a recon mission).
i agree with what you said 100 percent!
Well optimus isn't wrong, I mean cybertronians don't really change that much from the day they're born
The best definition to optimus and megatron is:
Both are descendents of the primes... and hot rod
Both are "chosen ones" in their plots
Hot Rod is the last prime like IDW put and there is no other question about that.
One question why does liege Maximo look like Loki the god of mischief.
I was thinking the same thing
Maximo is the Prime of lies.
Likely to fit with his nature as the Manipulator
both are known for deception and trickery so, yeah.
Loki does get around and is known to change forms, one might say transform.
I for one like the idea of the Primes being nothing more than normal Cybertronians who were slowly revered and immortalized in mythology as history progressed.
"One is not simply born into greatness. Rather, one must earn it" - Ratchet
This is why I like how TFP explained Prime-hood. It applied a certain set of characteristics amongst those chosen to be Primes - humility, patience, kindness, a mild temper, and the capacity to be peaceable as far as possible (which is surprisingly comparable to the Fruits of the Spirit mentioned in the Bible). That's what made Optimus the perfect candidate in comparison to the self appointed Primes before him. See, his beginning was as humble as he was. He didn't believe himself worthy of the honor, even after having already proved himself. Even Alpha Trion thought him worthy.
But the same thing that made Optimus a good choice caused Megatron to fall short of it. While he had humble beginnings, he himself was far from humble and believed he was owed the right to be a Prime. He was a tragic character and his reasoning was solid, which is why many followed his words. But his pride caused him to slip through the cracks of his good intent and, as we all know, pride is before a fall.
Brilliant summary
@@basedpota I think he meant how despite being a true descendant of the original 13 Primes, his actions earned him the Prime title by the Council, though he officially gets it after Primus bestows the Matrix of Leadership onto him.
Also if not mistaken, Optimus Prime told Hot Shot that he would be the next Prime and that the Matrix would choose him next when he nearly died, it's later confirmed when Optimus meets the 13th in the All Spark.
@@basedpota Its stated by Unicron that he's a descendant of Primus, so I guess you're right since the 13th would be Primus' descendent, not a descendant of the Primes.
I do think that at some point he was stated to be descended from them but I can't remember so it probably didn't happen.
It'd be cool if they reused the name Omega Prime for a member of the Thirteen who was like the very first Omega Sentinel or something like that.
Dehaxis95 the 13 prime was optimus prime actually
Yeah I know. I am a holy man when it comes to the Covenant of Primus. Though to be honest Optimus being one of the Thirteen is really stupid. Still wish they would reuse Omega Prime's name though.
yeah, I'd prefer if the 13th was autonomous maximus as the first titan. I mean, war for and fall of were both aligned continuity games. we've got the first minicon, first beastformer, first girl, and metroplex and trypticon both exist.
Actually, thatd be cool if there was a prime for the titans
Hey, if minicons can get a prime, then i see no reason to not give the titans their own distinct progenitor.
While I get why Hasbro wants to increase the significance of the "Prime" title, I have trouble swallowing the whole "Optimus Prime is the reincarnated Chosen One" thing that a lot of continuities play up, especially when he's a main character. I just feel like it's really hard to relate to him as a character when he's literal robot Jesus who can rarely do wrong.
That said, I am interested in the "13 Tribes" angle that the comics seem to be heading into. To me, I think that lends itself to a level of storytelling and "realism" than the whole "13 Original Transformers" angle. I mean, I can understand wanting to know every single piece of lore about a universe and if it's true or not, but should we really know more about the mythical prehistory origins of Transformers than we know about our own human race? Should mythology in the Transformers universe fit the same role of our real-world mythology and religion, where cybertronians have a variety of religious mythologies with contradicting "origin stories?"
Yeah I feel the same for the Aligned Optimus Prime, Luckly that isn't the case with every Optimus and before the "Shroud" happened, His spot seemed to be filled by The Last Autobot/Autonomous Maximus. I wonder if they would ever do Primon or Guardian Prime as members of the Thirteen in newer stories.
I prefer to think of it more as robot King Aurthur, but yeah, I agree. It makes him less relatable(if that's a word).
In some continuities, Primon actually existed before The Thirteen and was suppose to be a leader of the Transformers but Liege Maximo killed him before the others could know of Primon's existence.
I agree. I just don't like the idea at all. I like the idea of Optimus Prime being a descendant but not directly one of the original. It's a hard pill to swallow. Probably as hard as Arcee's IDW origin, Galvatron not being Megatron, and Megatron becomming an Autobot.
TBH I think They tried pulling a superman or a cap america with him and I for one am perfectly fine with that. Optimus isn't supposed to be relate able. That's why they give you bumble bee. Optimus is just supposed to give you pure badass moments in my mind :D
I actually much prefer the title of Prime being a rank that's handed down to each leader/matrix bearer rather than some mystical role that only Optimus was destined to claim. I think it's more interesting that Optimus was just a regular bot who rose through the ranks to become a great leader rather than it was all destined through mysticism. Somewhat takes the choice out of Optimus hands and makes his heroic efforts seem lesser if it was destined no matter what. Like lazy fanfic writing.
The Transformers: War for Cybertron video game did (what I thought was) a good job of amalgamating the two, with the title of Prime (leader) being bestowed upon by the Autobot High Council but made definitive by Primus bestowing upon him the Matrix of Leadership.
rodster6 if you want a great version check war for cybertron. While the role is a rank like a captain, Optimus is notable for being bestowed the role by Primus himself for his bravery and heroics as opposed to being given due to military rank
Phanto5692 trash
Mohamed Rooble lol wow much flame
rodster6 I agree.
As much as I loved the last three character-focused Basics, I'd also like to see more focused on general franchise concepts like this one. :)
Okay everyone here, hear me out on this:
Liege Maximo and Megatronus, teaming up and working together
Didn't they kinda already do that back before the primes split up or are you talking about now?
No didn't liege Maximo mind controll megatronas
2:15 that transformation was cleannn
There's one Primus almost never talks about... Prime-Prime, the first Transformer to leave Primus and the thirteen on his own accord... he's a bit weird.
Which continuity and which prime are you talking about
GaiaX5 Sounds like Moon Moon
“Oh god here comes prime prime”
“HAY GUUUUUUYS”
“Why is he even a prime??”
The penthouse penthouse
@@ThatGreyGentleman
Cut it out with the bullying they are talking about Prima
The 13th prime actually was named Optimus prime and when Optimus(reborn as Orion) was elected to become the next prime by the council, it was Alpha Trion who gave him the name Optimus prime, in honor of who he was before he was reborn. Though he would understand the meaning behind the name until primus gave him the matrix of leadership which restored both him and his memories
I like prime as a rank rather than some divine prophecy. Gives more to the military battle that transformers has always been.
Yes
But that would lose the value of the name
@@uria3679 it all depends on the weight of the word and how it is earned and fought. Any Prime needs to be named and have a significance to the story. If they're a background character or elite moot then yeah it gets diluted in meaning.
Haha no.
@@michaeltierney6649 yes
He's a Prime (Rodimus), He's a Prime (Nemesis), You're a Prime (Optimus), I'm a Prime! (Primal)
Are there anymore Primes I should know about?!?
Sentinel Prime: *Energony Goodness!*
Trion’s reaction
Alpha Trion: Sentinel is no prime!
I'm here to see this after I watched Transformers One
The concept of 13 Primes is similar to many parts of the Norse pantheon, with Leige Maximal looking and acting a lot like Loki. Digimon took a similar approach in it's Royal Knights, also having 13 members, but just like with the Primes, the 13th member was lost and obscured. This is because, if mirroring the Norse pantheon, the 13th member is "The Hermit" who appears to be an old man who travels, though his true identity is actually Odin himself. In this parallel, Optimus likely *IS* the 13th prime reborn and he *may even know it, but refuses to admit it.* Such is the way of the Hermit.
I like your profile picture.
@@mastershake2473 As old as the legends it speaks of.
I don’t know if I really like Optimus being one of the original 13 primes or not and this is the order of primes I think
1.prima the original transformer created by primus
2.the other 12 original primes that make the 13 original primes
3.nova prime
4.sentinel prime
5.Optimus prime
you forgot rodimus.
@@maverickhunterstupidiocy7779 rodimus after optimus
And in one continuity, Optimus is the second to hold the Matrix of Leadership.
I prefer it when the 13th Prime is just someone like Logos or Autonomous Maximus or something. I don’t like the idea of Optimus being some mythical being who’s just destined for greatness, as it reinforces the “divine right of kings.” I prefer when Optimus was always just ordinary Orion, who _earns_ the Matrix and rises up to lead his people in a time of crisis.
Yeah, I have also come to prefer it this.
Fully agree with you on that one. I'm glad that the Transformers One movie goes with this approach.
Without giving away too many spoilers on how he does this, Orion Pax isn't given the Matrix of Leadership from birthright, but rather from proving himself in the eyes of Primus through his actions.
Revenge of the fallen: “originally there were 7 Primes”
Me: “Michael Bay? Can you not count to 13?”
I mean, he's even said one of them is named rodimus, so hes just messed it all up in general😂
Another universe=different rules.
@@ericm.8110 yeah, but this was back when the primes, primus and unicron were still considered multiversal singularities, meaning they were the same characters
@DC Boy "I was the handsome one"
@@joshpvgvideogamesandanimer5054 Vector Prime was probably asked about that at some point, at least, I hope so.
While I do understand why people don't like the mystical Primes, I do think that idea works if only for Aligned (which was more mystical anyways) and on the 13th matter eh, Aligned can be resurrected Optimus but for everything else I would prefer it to be different and keep the 13/Optimus thing exclusive to Aligned, though I did really like Animated with the ranks (though imagine if TFA Sentinel Prime met Aligned Optimus Prime, it would be hilarious)
I am 13 and i love it
I don't see why the ideas necessarily have to be mutually exclusive. I've operated under the impression that there used to be multiple Primes, but their numbers began to dwindle with the end of Cybertron's Golden Age until there was only one left.
The Primes are such an interesting topic,
I really enjoyed they’re portrayal in Prime and the IDW.
I wouldn’t be opposed to a movie exploring their history somewhere down the road.
Nice video👍
I like the entire concept of Prime as a whole, regardless of how it is interpreted. Do you think you can explore other characters that had Prime in their name like Nova Prime or Nominus Prime?
Absolutely love this series. I got back to Transformers after many events, especially the Bay's atrocities. I really hope you will make an episode on aligned continuity. I have a hard time understanding storyline within toyverse. For example why characters never having such abilities become Combiners (such as Optimus Prime in Combiner wars) or Headmaste... ehm Titanmasters, like Soundwave or Galvatron. Or maybe I'm just looking too deep into this and Hasbro just wants to force gimmicks into well-known characters instead of creating new ones.
Honestly, Optimus Prime shouldn't be apart of the Thirteen. It really cheapens Optimus as a character and some of the ideas that were being built up a while back of the term Autobot being something more then just "the good guy faction." There was a point when they tried to make the term Autobot mean something which was intended to be idealized by Optimus which is why he was a true Prime.
Also, I don't know about anyone else, but I like that Prime is both a Military and somewhat "Mystical" position, With Dreamwave and early IDW taking a position that a Prime is a military leader, but also is a kind of religious leader if he's accepted by the Matrix. It also made it feel as if any bot could be a Prime... but making Optimus one of the Thirteen cheapens it because then he was always a Prime.
Also the Aligned Continuity is the only timeline where Optimus, Quintus and Amalgolomos Prime are apart of the Thirteen. Namely they are replaced with Autonomous Maximus (or The Last Autobot), Logos Prime (or Soundblaster from Galaxy Force), and Epistemus. Which those are still apart of the Thirteen in all continuities outside of the Aligned Continuity.
Megamanlanprime Well in some universes like the movieverse Optimus is a direct descendant of Prima.
I agree with you about how making optimus one of the thirteen cheapens his charecter. THere is more you can do with him being a prime outside of the thirteen. Like maybe he is a new generation of primes.
Optimus has no special strenght and is not that powerful to be one of the thirteen originals. (in the bayverse though)
So your judging a super giant robots past huh I'm guess you prefer the g1 prime
If I recall it was never actually confirmed so I think it's up for interpratation
I have a question: I noticed there is a contradiction between series on the origin of Transformers as a race, with multiple sources saying different things. First, the Transformers were said to be created by Quintessons, but according to this story Quintus Prime, a Transformer himself, was the creator of Quintessons instead. And another source I heard says that Alpha Trion was actually an Autobot that was created by the Quintessons himself, which wouldn't be the case if he was part of the same generation as Quintus Prime. Kinda sounds like a very confusing case of chicken and egg paradoxes.
Have a watch of the "Creation Myths" episode, which will hopefully help on this subject! th-cam.com/video/owPi1fq10bM/w-d-xo.html
Thanks.
Aaaah, you beening the Optimus Prime series... Carry on fellow IDW reader.
Actually, the reason why there are multiple characters with convoy in their name in the Japanese version of Cybertron, is because it signifies that they are the leaders of their own planets and transformers just like how Optimus prime is the leader of Cybertron. Though in the Japanese exclusive beast wars series, the reason they are convoy and look like him is so they could honor Optimus. It should also noted that in The Headmaster anime, after Cybertron was destroyed, Rodimus left into deep space in order to find a new home for Cybertron not before he appointed Cerebros/Fortress Maximus as the new leader of the Autobots, but not a Prime. Since, Rodimus said that the Age of his generation is over, there’s no need for a prime, making him the last prime. Since then, all leaders of the Autobots were called Supreme Commander by their subordinates.
Like Supreme Commander Megatron from Beast Wars?
@Nicholas Joseph more like Emperor of Destruction, as it is the Decepticon and Predacon equivalent to the Autobot’s rank of Supreme Commander. Though I believe Megatron(BW) lost that title to Galvatron (BW II) and later Magmatron (BW Neo) held the title of Emperor of Destruction.
and Prime's have appeared in japanese series since Vector Prime kept his name in Galaxy Force
Xeno the Wanderer that’s because it was Vector Prime’s first introduction as well as the concept of Primus being Unicron’s brother and before the concept of the 13 primes. Also before the concept of Primes that we know today, in the Japanese Continuities, Primes were called Convoy.
@@kevintran5901 I'm aware, I'm saying that one of the few if not only instances of a prime appearing in japanese media it's one of the original 13 making the name prime significantly more rare in japanese media
so... loki is a prime? 😆
Lokius Prime
Yup
So the Prime title is like the Darth title in Star Wars. Started just as a name but changed into a title. I always thought it would have been cool if in some continuity Grimlock became Autobot leader and took the title "Tyranus Prime."
Megatronus: You're with him! You brought him here to kill me!
Solus: No!
Megs: *fires requiem blaster*
Prima: Let her go Megatronus. Let. Her. Go!
Plot twist The Uniter is actully Bumblebee who doesn't have his memories and Optimus is kinda trying to get him to gain his power and memories back so he can become a True Prime so Bumblebee can unite the Desepticon's and Autobots
I like that
That's kinda dumb
Edit: fuck I spelt dumb wrong
That would have been original but now I just expect it.
I'm surprised you didn't talk about Maccadom. The fact that Fun Publications (whose list of 13 primes I much prefer), finally confirmed that he was one of the 13 was so satisfying.
Well, he's more of the "running gag" of the Thirteen. He was in that one panel from Fun Pub (seen in this video at 6:20), but he's not on their actual list of Thirteen names (Prima, Vector, Megatronus, Nexus, Logos, Micronus, Maximo, Solus, Epistimus, Autonomus, Solomus, Onyx, and Alchemist). "Ask Vector Prime" made the gag that it was rumoured he was Alchemist, but I was a contributor to AVP and I was the guy who actually came up with that, which was only intended to be a jokey furtheration of the rumours about Maccadam, not to be read as confirmation he actually was him.
@@ChrisMcFeely Wait, so you were the one who did it? AWESOME!
I actually liked the idea of the Transformers Animated movie and the Bayverse version of Primes where whoever's worthy to hold the Matrix of Leadership shall grant the power/title of Prime.
Note however, that the primes from the aligned continuity are not the same as the multiversal-entity primes from all the other continuities.
Overall though, nice video!👍
I do not believe Optimus Prime would see himself as a god of anything however many do look up to him as a mentor to all and a good friend of all now I have the guide book it covers many I'd like to have a guide book which explains all transformers even females that exist somewhere on another planet
I like Onyx Prime, he's my favorite and his design looks very scary and badass. :3
@Lord Mahaveer Maldonado don't start that 'shockwave is Onyx prime' shit.
@@ninjaformer5889 i agree with you on that one
Micronus... Is "good" idea but I'm still preffer to the original idea that Mini-cons were created by Unicron himself, unless Micronus has business with the great chaos bringer.
PS: The 13nd is Takanuva.
In the Marvel continuity the minicons (or at least some of them) where creations of Autonamus Maximus. He even created a minicon leader named Modus Prime.
Same, I like that just as Primus created the Transformers, Unicron spawned the mini-cons.
Love the Bionicle Reference
TheAutobotPower i thought the 13 was optimus prime
No he’s the seventh
Crazy that in 2024 they get another toyline named after them and a movie debut!
I quite like the idea of prime being a military rank, or at least a title that is earned. Not so keen on divine birthright chosen one stuff, just in general. Idk, I feel it is more interesting to earn that title, that status as a hero, because you chose to do the right thing, to work hard, to rise to the challenge of leadership, than earning the title because you were always destined to.
I remeber the good old of the Transaformers when being the Supreme Commander of the Autobots was all that matter to be the leader and main heroe of the Transformers, thats what allow the creation of such legendary characters as Fortress Maximus and Star Saber
I love Optimus prime thank you for tell me about the Primes
Thank you
I really want figures of all 13 of the primes, new ones based on how they looked in the idw comics
“Sentinel…is NO prime.”
Ong
So we got:
Prima, Solus Prime, Sentinel/Zeta Prime, Vector Prime, Liege Maximo, Onyx Prime, Alpha Trion, Alchemist Prime, Megatronus, Optimus Prime, Nexus Prime, Logos Prime, Autonomous Prime (the 13)
And the Newer ones such as Nominus, Nova, and Rodimus
Sentinel is not one of ogs . Prima,vector,alpha trion,solus,alchemist ,onyx,nexus,amalgumus,quintesse,leige maximo,megatronus and optimus are the og 13.
Optimus: you can't make yourself a prime, you born being a prime
Hot rod: ... ok
I don't mind Optimus being the reincarnated 13th prime. It really doesen't mean he's "Robot Jesus and can do no wrong". The Primes are more like Adam and Eve (and Steve, and Alan and Carl...) they are not really gods themselves, just the first cybertronians. Also, at least 3 of them screwed up big, one's a lying schemer, one a murderer, and one is at least fumbling enough to create the evil quintessons.
So yes, the "13th" can still make mistakes. Being a Prime makes you stronger and more connected with Primus, not infallible.
They should have made the 13th prime literally be the Matrix with the idea that by supporting the current host by upgrading their body and being supportive in times of need being the 13ths will and legacy.
vector prime has always been my favorite of them all, his design,his vehicle mode, his abilities, everything. when i watched the episode of when he died trying to help the autobots go back in time, i cried my eyes out, he's been my favorite since the first time i saw him.
I feel the blessings of the Primes upon this channel. Reaching 1 million views is a feat.
I like the idea of prime being a sorta mystical thing like something you have to earn by like a challenge or something like that. Thats my head cannon
It's always kind of annoyed me that Hasbro just decided to dump the remaining members of the Thirteen on us during the Aligned continuity. I found it far more interesting seeing them slowly teased out over the years as they had been up to that point. Oh well, it's a fun concept either way.
Hasbro Primes : we are the thirteen, slayer of Unicorn and son of Primus
IDW Primes: My tribes is bigger, no it's mine, I have four legs.
Yeah I didn't really like IDW's incarnation, because it really felt like a slap in the face after all the build up across other continuities. If power of the primes actually delivered and gave us a story about the 13, I wouldn't feel the way I do about the IDW primes. It would've been an interesting subversion, but as it is it's just the 2nd part to the anti-climactic end of all the prime build.
@@oliveragag8576 yes. Like in transformer prime, the prime are god like figure while in IDW they kinda bash the myths
@@emiliencorbillon187 Yeah in prime we got glimpses of what the primes looked like and even some of their names. Like it was all building up to power of the primes, but all we got was Megatronus and Solus. They didn't even mention the others. And here comes IDW to kick us while we're down.
@@oliveragag8576 yeah and even with Megatronus and soluce it's alway the same story.
@@emiliencorbillon187 Yeah. Damn, it's great to finally get that of my chest. Thanks.
lets hope vector prime gets a form similar to his cybertron version i liked the old clockwork starship that he was in that series.
I ended up making a headcanon for my Display Shelf based partially on the fact that Soundblaster got reused as a Prime in some cases.
In short, Soundwave is a reincarnation of Micronus Prime, and that version of him is represented as the Titans Return figure, since it's a tiny robot that can power up bigger ones, and Soundwave's forehead without the helmet has a tiny Minicon port-esque gem.
Logically he could not deny this upon realizing it, but at the same time he still *despised* the idea of bearing the title of something he swore to fight against.
And so, he sought resolution. He forced someone's hand as they held the Star Saber, a weapon known for sundering Nexus Prime. He made it so their only option would be to attack him. To sunder him. And he put every ounce of his Spark on the line to keep the two ideas of himself separate in his head as he did it.
In the end, Soundwave was no more. There was Micronus Prime, the progenitor of the Minicons.
And Soundblaster, the truest distillation of the cold, calculating loyalist. And a bot who refused to be anyone but himself.
The way i interpret the whole Optimus was the 13th prime in another life is like this.
So the 13th prime jumps into the well of All sparks igniting it and merging with it. None of the other primes did that one after another died and their consciousness returned to primus. That's why in certain instances you can still talk to them. However the 13th spark was in the well and got reborn. The way i see it the spark is equivalent to the heart and basically the inherent power of a transformer.
On to my point who says orion was the first incarnation, for all intense und purposes there could have been the thousands. Yes he has the inherent power of the 13th but he doesn't know that, he was a fucking librarian. What qualified him for being a prime and embracing the legacy was his decision of fighting despite thinking that he was powerless and it was this noble action that unlocked his potential. I think even after becoming a prime he did not believe this. This is however what makes him worthy, fighting despite feeling like a nobody.
I really like the "Arisen" title for the 13th Prime since he's basically the opposite of the Fallen, as well as having been born twice.
If it turns out to be Optimus he's also the most consistently slain and then resurrected Cybertronian of the whole bunch, it happens in every universe, like clockwork!
I somewhat hoped that the last Prime would have been the Matrix itself.
That would be a major plot twist
@swedichboy1000
Or at least the last remaining part of him after his sacrifice
Orion was born a prime in the bay verse and in comics and different shows
"The Thirteenth and final Prime is a figure of mystery, his name also forgotten like Megatronus's. In the Aligned continuity, he was the uniter who brought his brothers and sisters together as one.But when the Age of Prime's came to an end, the Thirteenth Prime chose to give up his life to ignite the Well of All Sparks, the font from which all Cybertronian life was subsequently birthed... only to emerge from the well reincarnated, without his memories of his pasty life as Orion Pax, who later become... Optimus Prime. IDW continuity is less clear on the matter; there, the Thirteenth is known only as 'The Arisen,' and while many have come to BELIEVE that Optimus Prime is this legendary figure, Optimus himself doesn't believe in such things."
"And for the sake of completeness, alternate members featured in more obscure stories have included Logos Prime, also known as Soundblaster, from Transformers: Cybertron, Autonomous Maximus, aka the Last Autobot from the Marvel Comic, and various members of the Guiding Hand, the pantheon of gods introduced in IDW's comic. Just this week IDW even introduced Septimus Prime, a Fourteenth Prime who was slain by Megatronus during the consolidation of the Thirteen Tribes. But going forward, it seems unlikely that these extra characters will be revisited; Hasbro has their list of Thirteen, each about to be immortalized as 'Prime Master' action figures in the Power of the Primes' toyline... EXCEPT for that Mysterious Thirteenth Prime, who will be represented instead by the Matrix itself!"
"Beyond that, exactly what spin the toyline and tie-in cartoon will choose to put on the Primes' story, we'll just have to wait and see! And you know what?"
"That's just Prime."
All this information that I tediously took the time to write down made me SMILE and SQUEAL cause in the past, I remember hearing that Optimus was some sort of reincarnation of SOMETHING, but never knew it was the Thirteenth Prime! And with the Matrix of Leadership being interpreted as the Thirteenth Prime instead of Optimus Prime being the reincarnated Thirteenth Prime somewhere also reminds me of what I think of the Matrix in some fan stories I made, making the Matrix a Transformer sort of character, like a sort of one of a kind Minicon or something, or even a little Predacon/Dragon that was a sort of creator to Primus, or something that aided Primus or comforted him, similar to other stories with him being born as a human, finding Orion, and, well, lots of other weird shenanigans that I thought up. Learned so much from this simple video!
The idea that Optimus is really the 13th reincarnation does make sense if you follow the Transformers: Prime continuity. At the end of the series Optimus sacrifices himself to reignite the well of allsparks which could show and give hint to him being the 13th as the 13th is told to have done the same.
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i always assumed there were multiple maticies of leadership, and having one made you a prime. And maybe a spark could somehow create a new matrix, maybe. Nothing stops everyone from being a prime, but it's incredibly unlikely since you can't be a leader while acting as someone's subordinate.
I like the divine aspect of the primes. Makes the live action 09 film the more legendary.
I like the version of the primes that are ancient LITERALLY DIVINE BEGINS. Idk why
Best expliantion of what exactly the 13 Primes were and are thanks mate 😄✌🖖👍
So, it's through this video that I learn that the third part of the Combiner Wars/Titans Return toyline saga is Power of the Primes. I was excited to see that Hot Rod is getting a new toy, but... man, I'm let down: it's kinda ugly, just to accomodate the Matrix/Prime Master...
This video was fascinating, though!
Alchemist Prime is my favorite. Mixmaster, here’s your role model.
This was so freaking cool! I’m so glad my roomie got me hooked on the Transformers series. I started watching because of my favourite: Arcee.
So watched a few of your episodes. I'm interested. You have now got a new subscriber
Could you please do a basics video on Megatronus/The Fallen. It seems like his story changes so much from telling to telling, and as a concept he really has only recently been introduced in to the lore. I think it would bee an interesting episode.
Personally I like to think that the 13th Prime is instead Alpha Trion and he was created by Primus to record their journeys for history and that one of the 13 is a triple changer with his descendants being the triple changers we all know and love today like Astrotrain, Blitzwing and Springer. Also for amalgamous Prime or whatever to instead be replaced by the ancestor of the "mother-bots" for lack of a better term lol such as Soundwave and Blaster and for the reason they can transform is because Primus foresaw the war on earth in a vision or something and gave them that ability while creating them
Also for combination to be another biological for lack of a better term trait passed down through generations instead of that enigma of combination bs
So, going off of what the term "prime" is as a concept, I want to try and list out all the contributions to the cybertronian race the primes have made, and a few that might not have been thought of before.
First, there are the primes that contributed new species of transformer aside from typical cybertronians. There's Micronus with the minicons, Onyx with the beast-formers, and Quintus with the Quintessons.
Then there are the primes that contributed to the abilities that all transformers have or can get. Amalgamous prime with the ability of transformation and Nexus prime with the ability to combine. I like to think that Megatronus gave cybertronians the ability to generate weapons from their body parts as he is the first warrior, though that's just a headcanon so take it for what you will.
Then there are the primes who contributed to the intellectual parts of cybertronians. There's Alchemist prime, who may have inspired the first scientists of cybertron. Then there was Alpha Trion, who likely brought about scholars and historians to document the history and culture of cybertron's people. Then there's Liege Maximo, who sparked evil and deception among cybertronians. Then there's Prima, who likely gave cybertronians the power of leadership, either by beginning the legacy of the matrix, or by using that legacy to inspire leadership in others, or much more likely both.
Then there's Solus prime, who gave the cybertronians female counterparts.
Last but not least would be vector prime, who likely gave cybertronians the technology to space travel and possibly even time travel (though he may have kept the latter under a tighter lock and key than the former).
Hopefully I didnt miss anything. If I did, let me know.
Edited for a typo at the beginning, and for forgetting to add the time traveling prime.
I LOVE IDW and the stuff they've done for the transformers lore
Fun fact: In french, Optimus was known as Optimus Primus (pron preemus) from the beginning.
Liege Maximo is Loki. just. just dont even argue. he's Loki. end of story.
I notice just now afterall these years an new animation error in the OG movie. When Optimus takes the matrix of leadership out of his chest, that there is an second not glowing one still in his chest. Look at 0:39 and you will see it to
Congrats on reaching 2,000 subscribers.
Cameron Moriarty how about 25k? 😄 not bad!
I’ve always thought an animated show or movie about the Thirteen Primes would be great. Like, it would explore on the Thirteen Primes relationship with each other and showcase their battle against Unicron. The first movie/season would be going against Unicron and the second movie/season would show the falling out of the Thirteen Primes
8:10, Megatronus in my continuity is The Lucifer of Transformers
Chris, love what you did with this episode, but I feel like I need to say something from what I read inn the book, "The Covenant of Primus". The 13th Prime was given the name but had Alpha Trion change it so that he would remain antonymous after he reincarnated himself with the late Onyx Prime and Micronus who didn't want to leave his best friend.
IDW Optimus Prime: Will you listen to me?! I'm not the Messiah!
Everyone: He is the Messiah!
The war began because he wasn’t the messiah, he was a very naughty boy.
I wish there was this much complex lore for the shows and movies, give comic writers a say in the storylines and plots of the movies and shows and there will be a definite increase in quality