Stewart Campbell went to senior school in Hertfordshire, but would return to his roots of Campbell Town every summer. He was a friend of mine and a thoroughly decent, nice, kind, caring, likeable person. I met up with him a few times after leaving school, but lost contact with him around the mid 1980's. I first found out about his death in the local paper and can remember the shock to this day. I'm glad I've found this although it's very sad because Stewart and his crew mates deserve the recognition. RIP James Russell, Billy Martindale, Dugald John Campbell and my friend Stewart Campbell.
I'm from Campbeltown, Argyll and Stewart Campbell(bottom left in the group of photos you showed) was my cousin. I was only 10 when this happened and we were living in Lanark at the time but still remember it clearly. Still have very fond memories of Stewart. He was 29 when he died. I used to love him visiting my grandparents in Peninver when we were there on hols. He was the only "adult" that didn't treat me like a kid, always had time for me, always laughing and joking and up for a kick about, patience of a saint. We moved back to C'town when I was 12 so went to CGS too.
Wow, I'm saddened for you, and the KIDS that lost their lives so tragically and quite unnecessarily. This is one story, for some reason, I do not recall ever hearing about. Thank you for sharing it with us Professor Simon.
What a sad and personal thing for you to witness happen and knowing that you went to school with people from this accident. What a shame RIP to all the crew. And hope that the families and friends ie you can be at ease after knowing what happened and will never be forgotten 👏👍. Thanks for sharing your story Simon another great video 🙏🇺🇦✌🏼
Well put together, Prof. I remember the news at the time. The Navy denied their involvement right up until the report was published. So sad for the fishing communities. Other similar but still denied incidents occurred in the Irish Sea. How many more world wide?
Great video and explanation of the sad event. Humans are always learning, usually the greatest lessons come from our mistakes, especially the fatal ones.
I remember going on a school trip to Irvine maritime museum and saw the trawler sitting beside a life boat that also had lost crew looking at the trawler it sent shivers down my back thinking about the lost crew I was about 13/14 when we saw it very eerie 😔
Thank you for brilliant video especially the facts on what happened...I remember this incident but as a young man in my early 20s I didn't give it much thought as I was bizzy looking after the needs of local girls... But now am a grandfather with teenage grandsons..I take them fishing on the clyde...I often point to old military pier in gourock and tell them story of how I seen a sunken fishing boat that had been recovered to this pier ...I had few facts wrong but ...1st was I thought it was American sub not British...2nd was I thought incident happened off gourock...and it was local to gourock boat involved... So I will now tell my grandsons correct details....and not what I thought I could remember....this video was a school day for me am 56yrs old now school days don't happen that often...my 15yr grandson...now that's different he dosnt have school days like most teenagers he no s it all (😅) or thinks he does 🤔 ...
I believe this has happened a few times (through the Cold War). Situations where fishing boats had to rapidly cut their net lines ..or get pulled under by a sub. Must be scary, boat suddenly tugged and pulled around ..and you have to think fast enough (and keep your feet under you) so you can get to cutting the lines. I bet this has alway been going on, around the world.
Hi Simon, thank you for doing the video on the MV Antares, I lost my cousin Billy, and some good friends, the whole situation destroyed the local community but was fated to happen, I was due to join her that night, but instead I went aboard the silver lining. Just to let you no we all had a big party, in the Parahandy the weekend before th we tradgedy. So that had a good send of. Kind regards John McVicar from CN.
One RN sub also on one of them training courses got too close to a Stena Line ferry on Cairnryan to Belfast route. Fortunately a sharp eyed lookout watchman on the ferry had seen the periscope ahead. And took evasive action . Was on a collision course submarine at fault , the person in command of the sub misjudged the speed distance of the ferry. One of the SSN nuclear deterrent submarines. Happened not too long ago .
Thats amazing You told it well ! Imagine what Has occurred and not reported When they are not training . When i had my 25 ft boat off shore in day time i was anchored and a black sub when under my boat and could see it and the water was displaced around it I was waiting for the tower to hit praying it would miss us as i had no time to react and never saw it which was bazar it was running high speed i was certain it was a sub moving straight and immensely long. This was in early 90s.
A US submarine demonstrating emergency surfacing came up under a Japanese fishing training vessel for high schoolers off Hawaii in 2001. It is amazing to think the first thing to do would be to confirm there are surface vessels nearby. People were killed.
Insane to be running these exercises in the Clyde, not a big body of water for vessels like that, which can cover huge areas of water very quickly. Great to hear this story from an educated and personal perspective.
Such a sad, sad story. It must have been terrifying. The fact that three of the crew were still on board must mean that the descent into the Ocean must have benn super rapid. And to know that you were connected to someone who has gone through all of this,? Well, they have stayed in your thpughts enough to make this film and long may it be viewed from now on and the story is not just remembered by the locals from where thet came...
middle of the night....i dont know what speed the sub was traveling at but...yes.. it was terrifying and fast....pulled backwards and down. i bet the fishing boat rolled over underwater...so sad.
I worked on a similar boat in the 80’s out of north shields and we heard a few stories back then of this happening in scotland, apparently a sub took down two boats at the same time who were pair trawling taking them down in seconds, when you are out at sea towing a net it does worry you a bit if there are any subs in your area after hearing stories like that.
I had a friend who was on a boat that was sunk by a submarine in the Chesapeake bay . When it passed by them it threw three waves. The first drowned the motor , the second filled the boat up with water, and the third pushed it under. No one died, they were all rescued. My friend said , “ it happened so fast all I had as a life jacket was my moms Tupperware bowl she had packed for his lunch.”
Those subs don't give a damn about civillian traffic in the Clyde. I was on a ferry from Brodick, Arran to Ardrossan on the mainland back in the early 2000's. All of a sudden the ferry listed heavilly and started turning to port. The engines were really ramped up in power as the ferry shuddered violently. People scrambled out of their seats and ran outside to see what was going on. Turns out it was a submarine travelling down the Clyde. The ferry had to make a 360 degree turn to avoid hitting the dam thing. Lots of us onboard got great photos of the sub, right up close and personal.
@@chickenpopper That's what ferries do. 360 degrees puts them back on their original heading but their turning circle allows them to avoid halfwit submarine captains
If it was travelling down the Clyde it was likely in the outbound traffic lane controlled by Clyde Estuary Control. The rule of the road applies to all vessels upon the high seas so if the Ferry altered to Port it was to pass Stbd to Stbd with the boat. The submarine would have remained on a steady course as not to embarrass the Ferry. The submarine did nothing wrong.
Prof. I was a lawyer representing the family of tha Antares skipper at the FAI in Paisley Sheriff Court under sheriff principal Hay ! The failings of the RN were far more egregious than you have represented. I still possess many of the court papers. I'm happy to communicate ?
Hi, Simon. Maybe you are not aware, but this unfortunate incident was mirrored - and mentioned - in the BBC TV drama 'Vigil' shown in August 2021? I must say that I am much reassured by your statement that new (foolproof?) procedures have been put in place to prevent further such tragedies!
Professor Simon. Thank You for a sad but informative video. The US Navy changes in procalls is usually done with blood. Other wise it is arrogant business business as usual in the good old boy's club. Kenneth.
Professor Simon. Look at the situation with the US Navy's, USS George Washington and the multiple suicides the Navy is down playing now. Senior enlisted person is saying that the lower enlisted personal they have to toughen up. Kenneth.
There is something broken in a system that can afford to harbour Trident but leaves the funding of it's lifeboats to 'kind donations'. The navy could not have said less about this when it happened, I remember it as clear as day. I live in a fishing community and have heard other stories of submarines snagging nets and boats being lost to no good explanation. Fishing is a dangerous vocation.
Such a sad accident. As with aviation accidents, probable cause is established, and changes are made. This reminds me of a scene from the movie Jaws. I'd think that breakaway connections to the nets would be used, as gasoline pumps have on the hoses, to prevent drive off damage.
Definitely macabre to talk-tech after such tragedy but here goes. After a day at sea on a trawler it occurred to me that if net gear is so costly to lose (wreck snags and subs) why not fit a new fangled cheap cable-stress-sensor connected to a loud horn, somewhere between winch-drum and net boom. Your average angler is his own line-stress-sensor (let it run or, cut the line).
hi prof. simon. thanks for the good video. one more question about your last video: isn't it the case that the navy has a network of highly sensitive underwater microphones that they can use to record and locate underwater noises? wasn't that how the sinking of the "kursk" was documented back then? wouldn't that be material for a good video? thank you for your good and always interesting work, greetings to mrs holland and to wallace the goat (I think he wants to be fed again, lol) I wish you a nice day, until the next video, I'm looking forward to it.
A sad story Professor Simon. I wonder if this story was used as the inspiration for the plot in the BBC Drama "Vigil" The opening scene is a Trawler being dragged down by a Nuclear Submarine somewhere around the Submarine Base you mentioned in Scotland. It had Suranne Jones and David Tennant in it.
yes it was the inspiration of the BBC Scotland drama Vigil. The relatives of the dead sailors thought is was a bit disrespectful and BBC didn't deal with their issues very well.
I seem to recall the Royal Navy adopting a very sinister denial campaign at first as they sought to conceal any involvement in the sinking of the Antares. I lived not far from Clyde estuary at the time. It was all very sad.
Don't forget the biggest casualties of submarine hunting in modern warfare, whales. There are several species of whales they thought should be able to survive but are going extinct. I wonder if it is because of no reporting of eliminated whales do to possible sub sonar contacts?
@@ProfSimonHolland yeah, quit a few get torpedoed to. If you get a contact in a sensitive area or possibly hostilities condition, you have to fire. I would bet most torpedoes fired since Ww2 have taken out whales. Ww2 probably depth charged a lot of whales. It also makes me wonder if any whales were taken out with a torpedo in ww2, but supposedly torpedoes didn't work like that in ww2. I am suspect of that because the one time they needed to take out a sub with another sub shooting a torpedo, they were able to.
Professor I hate hearing about your loss of a friend, real ones have about gone Exstenct -my spelling! -The way of the dinosaur! With cigarette smoking being band,I foolishly imagined less blowing smoke! Is this the way of the world?????
I'd love to hear your toughts on META!.. We will all be working in VR very very soon, there is Two Things About To Hit The World like a Ton of bricks. Home robot by Elon, VR By Zuck. I honestly think it's the correct path. Should we trust Elons Robot? Should We Trust Zucks VR? What ya think?
Please share this film on social media. 4 lads from my school died in this tragedy and their story needs your support. thank you, Prof Simon.
So sorry about our collective loss Professor.
I'm from Gourock myself so I'm glad I'm subscribed to you now.
Stewart Campbell went to senior school in Hertfordshire, but would return to his roots of Campbell Town every summer. He was a friend of mine and a thoroughly decent, nice, kind, caring, likeable person. I met up with him a few times after leaving school, but lost contact with him around the mid 1980's. I first found out about his death in the local paper and can remember the shock to this day. I'm glad I've found this although it's very sad because Stewart and his crew mates deserve the recognition. RIP James Russell, Billy Martindale, Dugald John Campbell and my friend Stewart Campbell.
Thank you Professor Simon. A powerful account of the incident and your own personal loss of your school friends.
I'm from Campbeltown, Argyll and Stewart Campbell(bottom left in the group of photos you showed) was my cousin. I was only 10 when this happened and we were living in Lanark at the time but still remember it clearly. Still have very fond memories of Stewart. He was 29 when he died. I used to love him visiting my grandparents in Peninver when we were there on hols. He was the only "adult" that didn't treat me like a kid, always had time for me, always laughing and joking and up for a kick about, patience of a saint.
We moved back to C'town when I was 12 so went to CGS too.
Brilliant video !
I remember this so clearly to say it was over 30 years ago.
Such a tragic and unnecessary loss of life.
so unbelievably sad. Thanks Prof. Simon, another excellent video.
Wow, I'm saddened for you, and the KIDS that lost their lives so tragically and quite unnecessarily. This is one story, for some reason, I do not recall ever hearing about. Thank you for sharing it with us Professor Simon.
What a sad and personal thing for you to witness happen and knowing that you went to school with people from this accident. What a shame RIP to all the crew. And hope that the families and friends ie you can be at ease after knowing what happened and will never be forgotten 👏👍. Thanks for sharing your story Simon another great video 🙏🇺🇦✌🏼
Well put together, Prof. I remember the news at the time. The Navy denied their involvement right up until the report was published. So sad for the fishing communities. Other similar but still denied incidents occurred in the Irish Sea. How many more world wide?
We all learn from our mistakes 👍
@@matthews931 do we? I’m not convinced.
@@roddymcniven8734 yeah maybe you’re right
Great video and explanation of the sad event.
Humans are always learning, usually the greatest lessons come from our mistakes, especially the fatal ones.
cheers
I remember going on a school trip to Irvine maritime museum and saw the trawler sitting beside a life boat that also had lost crew looking at the trawler it sent shivers down my back thinking about the lost crew I was about 13/14 when we saw it very eerie 😔
Thank you for brilliant video especially the facts on what happened...I remember this incident but as a young man in my early 20s I didn't give it much thought as I was bizzy looking after the needs of local girls...
But now am a grandfather with teenage grandsons..I take them fishing on the clyde...I often point to old military pier in gourock and tell them story of how I seen a sunken fishing boat that had been recovered to this pier ...I had few facts wrong but ...1st was I thought it was American sub not British...2nd was I thought incident happened off gourock...and it was local to gourock boat involved...
So I will now tell my grandsons correct details....and not what I thought I could remember....this video was a school day for me am 56yrs old now school days don't happen that often...my 15yr grandson...now that's different he dosnt have school days like most teenagers he no s it all (😅) or thinks he does 🤔 ...
I believe this has happened a few times (through the Cold War). Situations where fishing boats had to rapidly cut their net lines ..or get pulled under by a sub. Must be scary, boat suddenly tugged and pulled around ..and you have to think fast enough (and keep your feet under you) so you can get to cutting the lines.
I bet this has alway been going on, around the world.
Hi Simon, thank you for doing the video on the MV Antares, I lost my cousin Billy, and some good friends, the whole situation destroyed the local community but was fated to happen, I was due to join her that night, but instead I went aboard the silver lining. Just to let you no we all had a big party, in the Parahandy the weekend before th we tradgedy. So that had a good send of.
Kind regards John McVicar from CN.
best wishes John
Wow, what a film. Thanks prof
One RN sub also on one of them training courses got too close to a Stena Line ferry on Cairnryan to Belfast route. Fortunately a sharp eyed lookout watchman on the ferry had seen the periscope ahead. And took evasive action . Was on a collision course submarine at fault , the person in command of the sub misjudged the speed distance of the ferry. One of the SSN nuclear deterrent submarines. Happened not too long ago .
cheers Proff I think I may have mentioned this before my pal was a submariner he told me this story
very sad.
Such a tragic loss of life.
May they rest in peace.
I watched the old documentary on the Perisher training course just recently. It's quite brutal.
Thats amazing You told it well !
Imagine what
Has occurred and not reported
When they are not training . When i had my 25 ft boat off shore in day time i was anchored and a black sub when under my boat and could see it and the water was displaced around it
I was waiting for the tower to hit praying it would miss us as i had no time to react and never saw it which was bazar it was running high speed i was certain it was a sub moving straight and immensely long. This was in early 90s.
A US submarine demonstrating emergency surfacing came up under a Japanese fishing training vessel for high schoolers off Hawaii in 2001. It is amazing to think the first thing to do would be to confirm there are surface vessels nearby. People were killed.
that was so irresponsible
Wow! Thank you.
thanks for watching Joe
The Solway Harvester remains dubious 🤔💚
Insane to be running these exercises in the Clyde, not a big body of water for vessels like that, which can cover huge areas of water very quickly.
Great to hear this story from an educated and personal perspective.
cheers Gavin
Wow what a sad story bless their souls
Remember this well, my aunts sisters husband was involved 🙏
very sad
Sorry for spelling in last post.... must put reading glasses on!
thats fine.
What a very sad video
Very informative video 👏
Glad it was helpful!
Such a sad, sad story. It must have been terrifying. The fact that three of the crew were still on board must mean that the descent into the Ocean must have benn super rapid. And to know that you were connected to someone who has gone through all of this,? Well, they have stayed in your thpughts enough to make this film and long may it be viewed from now on and the story is not just remembered by the locals from where thet came...
middle of the night....i dont know what speed the sub was traveling at but...yes.. it was terrifying and fast....pulled backwards and down. i bet the fishing boat rolled over underwater...so sad.
I worked on a similar boat in the 80’s out of north shields and we heard a few stories back then of this happening in scotland, apparently a sub took down two boats at the same time who were pair trawling taking them down in seconds, when you are out at sea towing a net it does worry you a bit if there are any subs in your area after hearing stories like that.
sad and dangerous
I had a friend who was on a boat that was sunk by a submarine in the Chesapeake bay . When it passed by them it threw three waves. The first drowned the motor , the second filled the boat up with water, and the third pushed it under. No one died, they were all rescued. My friend said , “ it happened so fast all I had as a life jacket was my moms Tupperware bowl she had packed for his lunch.”
Very sad event.
sure was Richard
Those subs don't give a damn about civillian traffic in the Clyde. I was on a ferry from Brodick, Arran to Ardrossan on the mainland back in the early 2000's. All of a sudden the ferry listed heavilly and started turning to port. The engines were really ramped up in power as the ferry shuddered violently. People scrambled out of their seats and ran outside to see what was going on. Turns out it was a submarine travelling down the Clyde. The ferry had to make a 360 degree turn to avoid hitting the dam thing. Lots of us onboard got great photos of the sub, right up close and personal.
A 360 degree turn would result in the same heading as before the turn
@@chickenpopper lol
180 degree.....
@@chickenpopper That's what ferries do. 360 degrees puts them back on their original heading but their turning circle allows them to avoid halfwit submarine captains
If it was travelling down the Clyde it was likely in the outbound traffic lane controlled by Clyde Estuary Control.
The rule of the road applies to all vessels upon the high seas so if the Ferry altered to Port it was to pass Stbd to Stbd with the boat. The submarine would have remained on a steady course as not to embarrass the Ferry.
The submarine did nothing wrong.
thanks Prof, interesting as always 👍
Glad you liked it!
very sad incident indeed
Prof.
I was a lawyer representing the family of tha Antares skipper at the FAI in Paisley Sheriff Court
under sheriff principal Hay !
The failings of the RN were far more egregious than you have represented.
I still possess many of the court papers.
I'm happy to communicate ?
hi Gordon, more information would be fascinating. get in touch. simonhollandfilms@gmail.com
Hi, Simon. Maybe you are not aware, but this unfortunate incident was mirrored - and mentioned - in the BBC TV drama 'Vigil' shown in August 2021? I must say that I am much reassured by your statement that new (foolproof?) procedures have been put in place to prevent further such tragedies!
Professor Simon. Thank You for a sad but informative video. The US Navy changes in procalls is usually done with blood. Other wise it is arrogant business business as usual in the good old boy's club. Kenneth.
Professor Simon. Look at the situation with the US Navy's, USS George Washington and the multiple suicides the Navy is down playing now. Senior enlisted person is saying that the lower enlisted personal they have to toughen up. Kenneth.
My papa was friends with one of the boys on the boat and told me the story of what happened and nearly happened to him 2 years before that aswell
There is something broken in a system that can afford to harbour Trident but leaves the funding of it's lifeboats to 'kind donations'. The navy could not have said less about this when it happened, I remember it as clear as day. I live in a fishing community and have heard other stories of submarines snagging nets and boats being lost to no good explanation. Fishing is a dangerous vocation.
WOW!
You were Paul McCartneys neighbor!
yes...my parents house backed onto his farmland...bumped into Paul in the post office.
Such a sad accident. As with aviation accidents, probable cause is established, and changes are made. This reminds me of a scene from the movie Jaws. I'd think that breakaway connections to the nets would be used, as gasoline pumps have on the hoses, to prevent drive off damage.
do they? i thought people dragged the pump down the road! oh wow.
Definitely macabre to talk-tech after such tragedy but here goes. After a day at sea on a trawler it occurred to me that if net gear is so costly to lose (wreck snags and subs) why not fit a new fangled cheap cable-stress-sensor connected to a loud horn, somewhere between winch-drum and net boom. Your average angler is his own line-stress-sensor (let it run or, cut the line).
hi prof. simon. thanks for the good video.
one more question about your last video: isn't it the case that the navy has a network of highly sensitive underwater microphones that they can use to record and locate underwater noises? wasn't that how the sinking of the "kursk" was documented back then? wouldn't that be material for a good video? thank you for your good and always interesting work, greetings to mrs holland and to wallace the goat (I think he wants to be fed again, lol) I wish you a nice day, until the next video, I'm looking forward to it.
Wallace says hello and is enjoying his breakfast.
@@ProfSimonHolland määääääähhhhh! :)
I think the fishing nets should be designed to detach once enough force is applied to drag the boat underwater.
good idea
A sad story Professor Simon. I wonder if this story was used as the inspiration for the plot in the BBC Drama "Vigil"
The opening scene is a Trawler being dragged down by a Nuclear Submarine somewhere around the Submarine Base you mentioned in Scotland.
It had Suranne Jones and David Tennant in it.
yes it was the inspiration of the BBC Scotland drama Vigil. The relatives of the dead sailors thought is was a bit disrespectful and BBC didn't deal with their issues very well.
@@ProfSimonHolland it was disrespectful now that I know. A plot within a subplot about trying to steal a nuclear missile.
Professor Simon. Kenneth detected a subtle change in your video when you professor Simon talking about your neighbors and your classmate.. Kenneth.
I seem to recall the Royal Navy adopting a very sinister denial campaign at first as they sought to conceal any involvement in the sinking of the Antares.
I lived not far from Clyde estuary at the time. It was all very sad.
Professor Simon. A similar incident is happening with the USS George Washington with their suicides. Kenneth.
It must have been a Russian boat! LOL Sorry, just a joke, please don't go Willie Smithie on me with a nuke.
3:00 that’s an o boat not a t boat
Have you even tried a VR headset?
yes.....very cool
@@ProfSimonHolland well?
Don't forget the biggest casualties of submarine hunting in modern warfare, whales.
There are several species of whales they thought should be able to survive but are going extinct. I wonder if it is because of no reporting of eliminated whales do to possible sub sonar contacts?
i am sure whales are badly affected by submarines and all the sounds in the sea.
@@ProfSimonHolland yeah, quit a few get torpedoed to. If you get a contact in a sensitive area or possibly hostilities condition, you have to fire. I would bet most torpedoes fired since Ww2 have taken out whales. Ww2 probably depth charged a lot of whales.
It also makes me wonder if any whales were taken out with a torpedo in ww2, but supposedly torpedoes didn't work like that in ww2. I am suspect of that because the one time they needed to take out a sub with another sub shooting a torpedo, they were able to.
Professor I hate hearing about your loss of a friend, real ones have about gone Exstenct -my spelling! -The way of the dinosaur! With cigarette smoking being band,I foolishly imagined less blowing smoke! Is this the way of the world?????
I'd love to hear your toughts on META!.. We will all be working in VR very very soon, there is Two Things About To Hit The World like a Ton of bricks. Home robot by Elon, VR By Zuck. I honestly think it's the correct path. Should we trust Elons Robot? Should We Trust Zucks VR? What ya think?
I would still be more concerned with eating the fish caught during that time than a vessel mishap of any kind
🐿🤤