BART in May 2023: End of the C1 cars
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 ก.ค. 2024
- May 2023 is a historic month in the history of BART - the C1 cars exited service. The first to enter and the last to leave, of the C car design, they were in service for 35 years.
The C cars once numbered 230 cars, divided into the 150(#301-450) C1 cars (originally and often known as the C cars) built by Alsthom in the 1980s to 1990, and the 80 (#2501-2580) C2 cars built by Morrison Knudsen. The C2s were all scrapped from 2019 to 2021, leaving the C1s as the last C cars left in revenue service.
The C cars were designed to be used as mid cars (like a B car) or as lead or trail cars (like an A car), providing greater operational flexibility. Additionally, the C cars included some technical changes designed to increase reliability compared to the troubles experienced with the A/B cars in the 1970s.
The C1 cars were a bit of a reminder of BART’s past. Never rehabilitated (like the A2/B2 cars), the C1 cars retained the original faux-teak wood arm rests and DC propulsion like the original A/B cars. It was hard to mistake a C car in a train, buzzing away, while the rest of the consist would whine chromatically.
I last rode C1 cars on May 5th, including cars 432, 328, 339, 379, 380, 350, 361, and 343. Now, these cars are being scrapped/recycled, and one will be preserved at the Western Railway Museum in the near future.
C Car Consist log for 5/5/23:
Green line
339, 329, 1 Zoho One B2 - 1897
350, 343, 1 Zoho One B2 - 1692
449, 365
380, 379
Blue line:
376, 361 1501 behind 361
328, 394
More about the BART fleet at: www.BARTchives.com
More about BART C1 cars at: bartcars.weebly.com/c1-cars.html
0:00 C car collage - WRM, BART, and my pictures showing C1 cars from design to 2020s
0:14 311 leads a Green line train to Daly City at Fremont. Note missing number plates.
0:44 329 leads a Green line train to Berryessa at 16th St Mission. To be preserved by Western Railway Museum.
1:34 329 departs 16th St Mission, 339 trails
1:53 328 departs 24th St Mission. Blue line train
2:23 394 leads a Daly City train at Glen Park, 328 trails
2:55 376 leads, 361 trails, a Blue line train to Daly City at 16th St Mission
3:30 The blue side logos of the C1 cars
3:39 365 departs Glen Park, Green line train to Daly City, 449 trails
4:00 339 arrives at 24th St Mission, Green line train to Daly City
4:32 Riding 339
7:12 Train departs, with 329 trailing. Another C car departs on track 2
7:32 A2 car 1230 leads and 432 trails a Green line train to Daly City at Fremont
8:08 Inside 432. Car scrapped this week!
9:21 Riding 432 at San Leandro
11:14 Passing by 1234 with a C1 car trailing
11:35 380 leads and 379 trails on a Green line train at 16th St Mission
12:12 Inside 379
12:21 Riding 379
13:16 379 departs 24th St Mission
13:41 379 leads the same consist going back to Berryessa, with 380 trailing
14:22 Inside 380
14:28 Riding 380. Note the C2 car intercar closure doors
14:55 Riding 350
15:13 350 departs Balboa Park, 343 trail car
16:04 1230 toots into Bay Fair, 432 trails again
16:40 Final ride on 432
17:18 432 departs San Leandro
17:47 Ride on 343 departing Union City
21:30 343 at Fremont. My final ride for a C1 car in scheduled revenue service. - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
I thankfully have a picture if #315 before it retired
Here's a video of it: th-cam.com/video/9UrepH4Uzn8/w-d-xo.html
I like fact that these cars could be used as middle cars and they let you walk pass the operator’s cab and I love the buzzing sound they made
RIP BART Legacy C1 Cars. 1988-2023. We will miss you, C1 Cars.
8:37 RIP the Westinghouse amazing chopper sounds.
22:12 and this Godly sound on 343 🔥🔥🔥
Some of those old motors have been in use from when BART first went into service. When they refurbished the A and B cars, they retained the Westinghouse motors from those cars to be used as spare motors for the C cars.
I’m glad u rode 350. That one holds a special place in my heart because I rode it three times and it was the last one I ever saw. 😢
Rode it many times. Rode 145/150 C1s and 79/80 C2s
@@ATPTransitI last rode C car#314
Last C car I rode was 449
Wow, I didn't even realize the C cars would be all gone so quick. Luckily, I got my ride on them last year when I visited San Francisco mainly because BART suspended delivery of the new cars. I am just hoping the A and B cars stick around for a little while longer since I like their propulsion sounds. It would be boring seeing nothing but FOTF vehicles across the system, although their sounds are nice too. Soon, this buzzing sound would be a thing of the past.
Unfortunately that is inevitable. There are things I don’t like about the fotf as opposed to the legacy fleet; flipper doors especially to pass thru middle cars (this lacks in the FOTF), only one generic lead car that reminds me of the C’s…I would have been happy if there was a lead/trail car like the A car on the FOTF. Seats are fine but a little smaller and less wide than legacy cars
@@krishnanramakrishnan76 I do hope they do a slanted nose for the hypothetical F car. So we have one slanted nose and one flat nose since it’s a Bart tradition.
@@catvoncrimson666 Same here, otherwise it will just be like any generic subway I have ridden all over the world (they are all good but not the same shape and variety as bart)
Good you rode 343. This was one of the cars that at one point had the highest pitched chime. A few years ago it was the regular chime and more recently had a super high pitched chime like the late 2563
My boy C car😔
At least one of them will be in the western railway museum.
Damn, I remember seeing a lot of them when I was trainspotting but over the past few weeks I have seen none
time flies, some come, some go
I didn't even notice till now that the C's were surprisingly absent from most regular services. Gonna miss seeing them
I'm not. These cars had terrible reliability. Defective designs have no business clogging up operations on a hyper-busy high speed urban railroad. The point of BART is to carry people quickly and efficiently. Any piece of equipment that does not serve that goal is an impediment and should be removed.
@@TohaBgood2actually also the b cars did had issues that I encountered one side door of 3 cars didn’t open!
@@VOLTRONDEFENDER4440 Literally all equipment has issues. That's normal. Things do break and malfunction no matter how reliable a model might be overall.
To qualify as a lemon a model needs to have known issues that are either hard or impossible to fix. That usually comes from bad design. Bombardier just didn't do a good job on the C cars. And that era of Bombardier in general had a looooooot of lemons. Every other vehicle type they produced around then was lemon-adjacent. Thank god that Alstom bought them. Alstom has its issues (mostly that they're cheapskates), but they're nowhere near as dysfunctional as Bombardier.
@@TohaBgood2 did you mean D and E cars?
@@VOLTRONDEFENDER4440 No, the Ds and Es seem to be holding up fine. They're past the traditional teething phase with no outstanding issues now. And the oldest ones are going on five years in service now.
But then again, the Ds and Es are post-Alstom acquisition. The Alstom guys are not messing around. Bombardier's entire lineup has become a lot tighter and less problematic after the acquisition. Who knew that QC matters, lol
The cars I don't want to see go are the A/B Cars, I love the nice whine of that
Not only the whine but I just like the different shapes of different lead cars. It’s too bad the FOTF does not have that but it would be nice if some of their new ones did
@@krishnanramakrishnan76 i know that would be good if the fotf did
@@gerghhhttg2913 My hope is once the Legacy fleet retirement is out of the way (maybe September or even in 2025), that this is something BART could consider. That’s the only thing I liked about BART that stood out from other transit systems. Now it’s all the same.
@@krishnanramakrishnan76 I know thats one of many reasons I am not a fan of the FOTF.
@@krishnanramakrishnan76 I know that one of the criticisms of the new D cars (the FotF cars with the operator cabs) is that when the car is being used as a midtrain car, there's no way to move between cars through the operator cab end like you could with the C cars. There is a door that can be opened to allow one to walk through the cab end of the car into the next car, but it can only be opened by the train operator using a special tool. Many people including train operators have criticized this because it would make it more difficult to evacuate the train in an emergency, or for BART police to move through the train to respond to an incident. Not only that but the gap between the D cars when they're coupled together is larger and also uncovered, so even with the door open, moving between two D cars would be more difficult.
So it wouldn't surprise me if, at some point, they introduce an "F" car that would function more like the C cars in terms of being able to move between the cars, and therefore the D cars would be relegated to only being used as the lead or trail cars. The D cars aren't as distinctive-looking as the old A cars, but I think they'd still be recognizable when compared to the other car types.
Oh wow. I had noticed a lot more A cars recently. Didn't realize the Cs are basically out now.
Bittersweet. Even as a kid in the late-'90s and early-'00s, the Cs always seemed grungier, smellier, and darker than the As. I truly believed they were the older cars.
I'm mostly just sad that this means the As are soon gone as well. How many legacy train sets are left?
Well in a way you're right about the C1s being the older cars. The cars themselves are newer than the A and B cars, but the C1s quickly went from being the shiny new "modern" cars to the cars with the most dated features within less than a decade, due to the introduction of the C2 cars and the refurbishing of the A and B cars. You could tell you were in a C1 car (as opposed to a C2) due to them still having the faux wood paneling and the brown/tan color scheme from the 70s that the A and B cars also had prior to the refurbishments. And because they were never refurbished, the C1s definitely were a lot dirtier and grungier than the A, B, and C2 cars.
They did eventually replace the brown seats and carpeting in the C1 cars with the blue/green found in the other cars (and eventually removed the carpet and replaced it with spray-on composite flooring because it was so dirty), but that was it. You could still see the faux wood on the sides of the armrests on the seats; slowly peeling off because it's so old.
@@andrewfutterman3346 Yeah. I miss that form BART grunginess a bit. 😅 I even saw wood paneling in one late last or early this year, though. The only thing new about the car was the lack of carpeting.
Spot on Andrew. To add on, there were a few more differences between the C1s and C2s:
Cab - radio panels which had buttons switched around; satellite door control panel which initially had its own handset and controls (removed by the 2010s).
Interior - C2s also had a different intercar closure door, with vents and lower handles, and originally had flip down seats at the ADA spaces. The C1s also did not have ADA red lights near door windscreen, while C2s had them (and so do A2s and B2s).
Electrical/Mechanical - the C1s had Garret APSEs (since replaced) and the C2s had GE APSEs, and the C1 trucks were welded steel while the C2 trucks were cast steel. From a study, the average C1 required a bit more energy to operate compared to the C2s.
Financial - C1s had greater federal funding for the original purchase to mostly local funds for the C2s
By the late 2010s, C1s were assigned to all yards, but C2s were mainly assigned to Hayward and Concord yards - basically if you had a Green line/Blue line/Yellow line train with C cars from Hayward or Concord, there was a pretty good chance they were C2s.
Too many memories since the 90’s. Used to live at an apartment complex 2 blocks uphill from South Hayward and I remember the days where my dad would take me on a ride to Fremont in the Summer evenings and back.
This is sorta unrelated but since the C cars have retired, I’ve been noticing their bringing back PL1 on the Legacy trains when behind schedule again.
Just rode A car 1230 doing almost 80 on the tube today with a little bit of crappy footage.
Yep, Back to PL1 since the C cars aren't around. It's all AC propulsion and from what I've heard, it's less wear and tear with AC at 80 mph compared to DC at 80 mph.
It's been 1 year since the C1 were retired, still bummed BART pretty much retired them all without any fanfare or even telling the general public when they would leave in advance :/
There is one fully-complete C1 car left hiding in a yard - waiting for preservation in a couple months. That will have a little bit of fanfare soon. I inspected it a few weeks ago and it looks as good as it can (contrast to 311 or 343)
@@ATPTransit Just wished BART would've made some sort of announcement beforehand stating that this would be the last year for C1's. From my point of view the retirement of C1's came out of nowhere (especially since BART never gave the public a timeline for the C's retirement). I understand they were going down in numbers beforehand but to be pulled from service mid May of 2023 with no knowledge that it was going to happen, felt like a rug being pulled underneath me. Still happy at least one of them was saved tho, it just stinks because I would've genuinely tried to catch them before they left if BART let us know ahead of time instead of just keeping silent.
Was it always the plan to retire the C1's in mid 2023?
Any particular reason why BART never told the public about the C1's final days?
Nooooooooooo! They're gone! :(
Did all the C1 cars have the blue side logos as opposed to the black/blue? I seem to recall in one of your other videos there was a C car that had the black/blue side logo but also had a three digit number on the side (as opposed to four digits beginning with a 2 like the C2 cars).
The blue side logos are just the side logos with the black faded away. There were a few C1s with new logo decals that were both black and blue as they should all have been.
Is BART supposed to be blue?
@@shivamthewolf Normally the "b" in the logo is black and the "a" is blue. But on some of the cars, both letters were blue.
Farewell To Old BART Trains.
luckily, i got to take a pic of #328 on may 4th. that's the last time i'll ever see a c-car in service. btw, i wonder how it got so dirty.
i really missed thoa train i want to say goodbye to them but i couldn't it
The c cars did seam to have a voice for door close but only played when the lead train is a/b
The door closing chime is PA'ed from the lead car
@@ATPTransit yea that makes sense, since if it was the lead car it would just do a door closing BEEP
Oh no, we will miss the C cars, and i habe a question.
Does the A cars are going out this year too ??
Looking like late 2023 or into 2024
@@ATPTransit the next year will be gone all c cars ?
They are being scrapped this month. One will be preserved
@@ATPTransit and the A cars ??
Not yet being scrapped en masse. Maybe a year
All leaves now is 58 A2 Cars and some B2 cars
Correct me if I'm wrong with the current roster as of June 2023
55 A2 cars and about 300 B2 cars. Three A2 cars crashed in the prior year and even this month (1204, 1205, 1267). I've updated the BARTchvies outlining them - bartcars.weebly.com/all-a2-cars.html
@@ATPTransit okay, thanks
And I'll keep looking forward for more videos and any updates
I've plan to come to BART trains soon
Awesome, have fun
C1 are done like C2
RIP Bart C cars
Officially, last week
I hope they will keep a few of the Legacy cars (not just the C1s) in working condition, as opposed to converting them into a bar or something. Maybe restore them to how they looked when they first went into service.
Only one C car to be preserved for the sake of history, at Western Railway Museum
Do you know it car number?
@@hinstonhui4592 what car number?
230 C cars in total, all gone
RIP C Cars, the end of an era of DC propulsion on BART.
wow, that is sad. I love the legacy fleet more than the FOTF.
Lol, why?
@@TohaBgood2 just think about it, it has done good for many years the whine of the cars and buzzing of the cars is nice and many more things
@@gerghhhttg2913 Yes, but now these old cars being constantly defective creates ridiculous delays and cancelled trains. If BART doesn't address the service quality issues it will simply be closed down.
I say, good riddance. I don't mind seeing these in a museum, but in actual service I want the newest, cleanest, safest, most comfortable trains possible. The past is the past.
@@TohaBgood2 I still like the legacy fleet
@@gerghhhttg2913 If they end up killing BART because people think it's too unreliable to subsidized then they'll all go to the scrapyard anyway. Better for BART to use equipment that people actually like so that it has a fighting chance.